King's Assembly: It's a mouse! It's a split keyboard! It's packing Cherry MLs!

[NamelessPFG]

Kickstarter page

I didn't find any threads on this here, so I might as well start one here...in the Input Devices subforum, because it's kinda category-defying, really.

It's like someone split up one of those Kinesis/Maltron sculpted ergonomic boards, put mouse sensors under them, and put some analog thumbsticks on the side ala the Logitech G13 (and if you'll count digital D-pads instead, the Nostromo lineup and the Orbweaver).

I doubt they'll outright displace my Model M and G500, but I'd sure like to give it a shot because I certainly need the extra desk space.

[yasuo]

inspiring the split keyboard
where the backspace,space,enter,etc?
the improvement of this is i think
http://deskthority.net/workshop-f7/an-other-diy-keyboard-project-t4560.html

[Findecanor]

I'm not a big fan of Cherry ML. They feel like scratchy scissor switches. They were probably chosen because it was easier to prototype with them.
I'm not a big fan of matrix layout either, which this is - it is not adapted for different fingers being different like the Kinesis, symmetric stagger (yes it is) and in some way the ErgoDox.
Still, the concept of having two separate keyboards with built-in joystick, wrist rest and pointing device is a great one. I have also made prototypes on similar lines.

[yasuo]

I'm not a big fan of Cherry ML. They feel like scratchy scissor switches. They were probably chosen because it was easier to prototype with them.
I'm not a big fan of matrix layout either, which this is - it is not adapted for different fingers being different like the Kinesis, symmetric stagger (yes it is) and in some way the ErgoDox.
Still, the concept of having two separate keyboards with built-in joystick, wrist rest and pointing device is a great one. I have also made prototypes on similar lines.

i think so,symm sgg still better

[thesentinel]

Personally, it wouldn't work for my desk because that thing is too.. tall

[NamelessPFG]

I don't recall ever saying this inspired the split keyboard, but I honestly haven't seen many options in that field that weren't rare IBM Model M15s or ErgoDoxes, not counting custom-modded products like split Kinesis boards.

Cherry MLs don't have a good reputation here, but since I haven't tried them out like most switches, I'm willing to give it a chance. Can't be any worse than a linear MX or ALPS switch for my tastes, I'm sure. (But I will admit, one of the big draws of the ErgoDox to me, price be damned, is that it's one of the few boards you can order with Cherry MX Clears. Figures that the MX switch type I like best is also by far the rarest.)

[PointyFox]

That looks horrendously unergonomic. 

[bueller]

Ewwww. No way.

[Pacifist]

I don't recall ever saying this inspired the split keyboard, but I honestly haven't seen many options in that field that weren't rare IBM Model M15s or ErgoDoxes, not counting custom-modded products like split Kinesis boards.

Cherry MLs don't have a good reputation here, but since I haven't tried them out like most switches, I'm willing to give it a chance. Can't be any worse than a linear MX or ALPS switch for my tastes, I'm sure. (But I will admit, one of the big draws of the ErgoDox to me, price be damned, is that it's one of the few boards you can order with Cherry MX Clears. Figures that the MX switch type I like best is also by far the rarest.)

Where are you going to source the switches?

[kod]

Man, those things are WAY too tall.  Even in the kickstarter video you can see him angling his forearms upward and bending his wrists at a weird angle.

[daerid]

Who am I kidding, this thing looks f**king fantastic. I love out of the box ideas like this.

[Nzen]

Man, those things are WAY too tall.  Even in the kickstarter video you can see him angling his forearms upward and bending his wrists at a weird angle.

To be fair, a desk for this device should be lowered. A glass pane just above his knees would about do it. Unless you have an adjustable standing desk.

Unfortunately for them, I've blown my budget for an Ergodox (and if I'd been a bit more patient I'd be waiting for Acidfire's variant). Nevertheless, kicked in to watch the show.

[Gid]

That looks horrendously unergonomic. 

I thought the same thing.  I don't know where to begin with this thing...

[fuzzybaffy]

That looks like absolute dog ****e for gaming.

[NamelessPFG]

I don't recall ever saying this inspired the split keyboard, but I honestly haven't seen many options in that field that weren't rare IBM Model M15s or ErgoDoxes, not counting custom-modded products like split Kinesis boards.

Cherry MLs don't have a good reputation here, but since I haven't tried them out like most switches, I'm willing to give it a chance. Can't be any worse than a linear MX or ALPS switch for my tastes, I'm sure. (But I will admit, one of the big draws of the ErgoDox to me, price be damned, is that it's one of the few boards you can order with Cherry MX Clears. Figures that the MX switch type I like best is also by far the rarest.)

Where are you going to source the switches?

I recall the ErgoDox kits on Massdrop having MX Clears as an option for the switches the first time I saw it there. That was months ago, though.

Speaking of which, updates on the Kickstarter page suggest that the MLs might get replaced with MXs, which would be a most welcome change.

It did set in, however, that only 30 keys for your fingers per device will be severely crippling for most keyboard layouts. 40 keys, an extra column's worth for the pinky finger side, would help greatly. Sure, you could shift/layer/etc., but that'll make the learning curve more difficult when coming from conventional keyboards.

[Oobly]

Sigh... another unergonomic badly thought out novelty.... The "mouse" will be slow to move around, considering it's also half your keyboard. The halves will move around as you "type". Key positions are unnatural and most likely uncomfortable. It's too high and not tented so your wrists and shoulders will suffer. The "palm" rest extends onto the wrist area, so you'll get compressed veins and tendons. The thumb controls are in a very awkward position. The keys are not staggered or at different heights for each finger. Key switches are ML - yuck.... I could go on.

....

Unfortunately for them, I've blown my budget for an Ergodox (and if I'd been a bit more patient I'd be waiting for Acidfire's variant). Nevertheless, kicked in to watch the show.

You've done the right thing. An ErgoDox or Nexus and decent mouse would trump this setup by FAR. If you want a mouse with a bunch of keys, get a Logitech G600. If you don't need so many, find one with a decent sensor that suits your hand shape and grip.

[gameaholic]

Anyone check this out yet?  I like the idea but I don't think it would do well in a FPS since it seems like it would be too heavy. 

http://www.maximumpc.com/kings_assembly_peripheral_consolidates_mouse_keyboard_and_joystick_2014

Mod Edit: Merged 

[johndavis33]

Looks neat. If they make it with mx switches, I'd get one with greens or whites. Seems like they'd need to mess with the design to fit full mx switches in there, though.

[jwaz]

Looks neat. If they make it with mx switches, I'd get one with greens or whites. Seems like they'd need to mess with the design to fit full mx switches in there, though.

All keys use Cherry ML mechanical keyboard switches (we are investigating using Cherry MX switches - see comments)

I initially wanted to use Cherry MX switches, but they wouldn't quite fit on the smaller finger keyboard that we designed, and they were a little heavier, which I thought would reduce the speed and accuracy of moving it as a mouse. So I went with the MLs, which are lighter and smaller than the MX's but still have better characteristics over rubber-domes and the like, in terms of tactile feedback, stability, longevity, etc. We re-measured our finger board PCBs, and it seems like we might be able to fit Cherry MX's, although it's a really tight fit. The MX switches are also taller (18.5mm vs ML's 9.6mm), which will raise the devices up a smidge more off the table. However, something really great happened recently. The palm rest contour turned out so good that I had way more control than I thought I would. With teflon feet on the bottom of the devices, I have no trouble moving them around quickly and accurately on pretty much any surface, and weight is not an issue at all. Therefore, I think it's time to revisit using Cherry MXs! Especially considering how enthusiastic people are about the MXs (me included), and how much support this project has received in such a short time (You guys are AWESOME!!!)! No promises, but it's worth a shot! I'll keep you posted on results or snags.

I'm intrigued... not sure if I'm $220 intrigued though. I really want to try this out in person.

I wonder if pointing him in the direction of SP for keycaps would prove helpful?

[Vibex]

I would buy one of these for $120 maybe, but I probably wouldn't use it. It would just be cool to own. If it had a trackball instead of a joystick and got rid of the mouse functionality I would like it a lot more though.

[wetto]

I'm also concerned about the AVAGO 9800... It's not really a choice that makes enthusiasts happy and I'm also concerned about how they'll tweak it, the lens used, if there will be firmware updates to enhance it over time (since I bet the first firmware won't be all that good)... There are some companies that managed to screw it up quite badly (CM on CM Storm Mizar, Logitech on GXXXs mice with the old firmware) and I wish they won't be one of those.

I know probably the main reason for using laser sensors is just because this thing won't be used with a mousepad, but anyways, I hope they can manage not to screw it up because of it.

[daerid]

This would be much more compelling if it used an IR optical sensor instead of a laser.

[keymaster]

I just want to note that Cherry MLs become smooth ('scratchy' when new) after a break-in period of ~1-2 months. They're good switches, at the very least, better than people give them credit for here. I like to think of them as short-throw Brown switches. This is an interesting project and certainly helps bring about more awareness and interest in ergonomic keyboards. Hopefully more ergonomic projects like this will come about in the near future.

[blackbox]

Man, those things are WAY too tall.  Even in the kickstarter video you can see him angling his forearms upward and bending his wrists at a weird angle.

Cool concept but I think that the height is the biggest problem of this device(as stated in the quote)

[wasabah]

I really like the idea, but as you guys said: it's just too tall.

Btw, they upgraded to Cherry MX now.

Still, I'll wait until after the Kickstarter.
If it's a success, they'll hopefully sell more or make a business out of it.
Then I can still get one if it's worth it.

[blackbox]

I really like the idea, but as you guys said: it's just too tall.

Btw, they upgraded to Cherry MX now.

Still, I'll wait until after the Kickstarter.
If it's a success, they'll hopefully sell more or make a business out of it.
Then I can still get one if it's worth it.

Good that they upgraded to cherry mx. thats a sign that they listen to the community. I hope they will listen to the community and do something about that height too.

[Latin00032]

Yea the height makes new think I will have to raise the height on my chair or lower my desk so my arms aren't raised so high.

They really need to take some Nostromo cues.

[vatin]

Done... now I'm officially a backer for one pair.

[Lanx]

these ppl are dumb, why didn't they just take a nostromo and stick a mouse sensor on the bottom? would be 100x better than this ungodly unergonomic ****ty device.

[CK Briefs]

The device's shape does look ungodly, yet they've updated it with MX switches and apparently wireless function and ergonomic updates. Sounds interesting, at the least.

[Doyniish]

Very interesting. I would love to get the chance to use one!