Author Topic: O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]  (Read 61982 times)

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Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #150 on: Wed, 15 February 2012, 23:28:43 »
Quote from: Glockateer;515152
I'm glad I paid the extra dollar to come early because I still haven't received my sample pack. : P
Wait, are you saying you just haven't received the sample pack yet? Or your main order? Because I shipped out your main order several weeks ago. You ordered 3 packs, so if USPS lost them, I'm not sure I'll have enough for replacements :/. If you're talking about sample packs, then no one has gotten them yet because I haven't received all the O-rings from the manufacturer yet.

I'll PM you the proof of shipment, and to straighten things out.

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #151 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 20:31:38 »
UPDATE: I came home to a nice surprise (I actually expected it lol). The rest of the shipment just got in. I'll be putting together the sample packs, and shipping out the remaining orders in the next few days.

I ordered extra pack A, and only a few extra of F and G. If there's enough of pack B, C, D, and H after the sample packs, I'll put those up for grabs as well. Pack E was too expensive, so I only ordered exact amount for that one.

Offline sordna

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #152 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 20:59:03 »
Great news! By the way, I could buy your D and H leftovers. But ideally I'd like to receive and try my initial order first :-)
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline jonnybastard

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #153 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 21:56:12 »
Thanks for the update!
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Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #154 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 22:45:48 »
Here are a few pics I took. O-rings A through H are the ones offered in this group buy. "X" is the 5mm x 1.5mm offered by kaiserreich, I bought a pack from him just to try out and compare. The two gimped ones you see on the left are the very first O-rings I ordered when I was a newb. Epic size mistake lol.


In order by packs



In order by size



Additional pics:
1 2 3 4 5 6
« Last Edit: Wed, 22 February 2012, 22:56:24 by WhiteFireDragon »

Offline sordna

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #155 on: Wed, 22 February 2012, 23:26:01 »
Woah great pics! I love my H already! Did you try them? How do they feel compared to A ?
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline transcend3nt

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #156 on: Thu, 23 February 2012, 07:11:33 »
oh no, i was eyeing on pack E.. so no extras for that :(

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #157 on: Thu, 23 February 2012, 23:41:18 »
Quote from: sordna;522692
Woah great pics! I love my H already! Did you try them? How do they feel compared to A ?
Didn't get to try them yet when you posted last night, but I just played with all of them this morning. H is a rather special case, I think you'll like this one :wink:. It has slightly different characteristics than A. I'll post a subjective review on all of them soon.


Quote from: transcend3nt;522964
oh no, i was eyeing on pack E.. so no extras for that :(
Yeah sorry no extras for pack E, they were too expensive for me to front my own pocket money to buy extras. They'll be available again in round 2.

Offline JSchool

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #158 on: Fri, 24 February 2012, 01:06:34 »
Bah, I missed this.  Start a new order, O-ring man!  :D

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #159 on: Fri, 24 February 2012, 05:45:02 »
I got the chance to play around with all of them, here are my comments for each of the packs:


pack A: Silicone or EPDM. The most ordered pack. It has a very small key travel reduction, so you may or may not notice it. It dampens the noise pretty well, and eliminates almost all of the “shock” you feel when the key hits the bottom. If you can’t decide which pack to get, try these ones first. Can’t go wrong with these ones, they’re good all around. I’ll be using pack A as a point of reference when comparing with other packs.


pack B: EPDM. These are nearly the same as pack A. Size is identical, but just a tad harder, which can only be felt if you pay very close attention. Otherwise if you mix and match the whole keyboard randomly with pack A and B, you most likely won’t be able to tell which is A or B. Noise dampening is the same as pack A, only difference is the hardness felt when keys hit the bottom. These should have been the same price as pack A, but only reason why it’s more expensive is because I asked for this option after I already got a quote for pack A. I don’t feel there is a large enough difference to justify this as another option based on price and characteristics, so these will be dropped in the next round. Just get pack A if you want something like this one.


pack C: EPDM. There is a noticeable key travel reduction with these, but that’s what it’s meant to do. Thickness is essentially in between pack A and E, so good if you want something thicker than A, but feel that E is too thick. I personally had a hard time deciding to use pack C or E. Otherwise, shock absorption and noise dampening is the same as pack A.


pack D: EPDM. I should rename this to “useless” pack. 1mm thickness is too thin. So although it did nothing to key travel reduction, it also didn’t do anything to noise dampening. The only time I can see this option being useful is if you bought some SP caps with short stems where these will make a difference. I don’t have a full set of SP caps, so I can’t comment on how useful it will be on those caps. However for stock caps and PBT caps from KBC, these had no effect. They will also be dropped in the next round.


pack E: Silicone or EPDM. This one is my personal favorite, but I know it’s not for everyone. It’s the max thickness you can have in an O-ring. It bottoms out just after the key’s registration point. This simulates scissor switches on laptops or thin membrane keyboard, but still retains the “mechanical” feel from MX switches. The main purpose of this pack is to reduce the key travel, but if this is not what you’re looking for, then get pack A.


pack F: Nitrile. Same size has pack A, but noticeable harder. These are only for people that think pack A is too soft or want to retain as much of the bottom out feeling as possible. It will still dampen most of the “clack” noise when the keys hit the bottom, but not as well as pack A. They feel great on PCB mounted switches since there is almost no change in the “natural” feel of bottoming out on the PCB.


pack G: Nitrile. These are the exact opposite from pack A, it’s different in size and softness. It’s essentially pack E, but harder.  They’re for those that want a max key travel reduction crips bottom outs, and some noise reduction.


pack H: Silicone. This pack is the most interesting of all of them. It’s the softest feel of all of them and only comes in silicone because the other materials can’t reach this level of softness. These are a tad thinner than A, B, or F, which is what gives it the unique characteristics. Under normal typing conditions, it will eliminate most noise and shocks. However, because of the exact thickness of it, combined with its extra softness, it will feel like there’s no O-ring at all if you hit the keys very hard. This sort of gives the whole keyboard a dampening “film” effect, where the shock and noise dampening properties are there, but thin enough so there are no key travel reduction.

Offline balanar

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #160 on: Fri, 24 February 2012, 06:23:50 »
Nice review of the o-rings, can't wait to try mine out! SHIP THEM ALREADY!! =P

Offline vax

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #161 on: Fri, 24 February 2012, 06:40:05 »
Any chance to grab some leftovers? Would be interested in 1x Pack A and 1x Pack E.

Offline AtL

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #162 on: Sat, 25 February 2012, 05:05:17 »
I'm enjoying right now my big fat ass o-rings (pack E). It really feels like scissor switches.
For the capslock keycap (pbt keycaps from KBC) it was too thick. I had to put back an o-ring from wasd keyboard. But it now feels exactly the same (no travel).
Thank you again.
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Offline Gascogne

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #163 on: Sat, 25 February 2012, 05:16:55 »
Quote from: AtL;525355
I'm enjoying right now my big fat ass o-rings (pack E). It really feels like scissor switches.

I also enjoy my pack-e rings. ^^

Offline dirge

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #164 on: Sat, 25 February 2012, 06:11:37 »
yeah get some up for sale please :)
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Offline thegunner100

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #165 on: Sat, 25 February 2012, 11:13:50 »
Question for those with full SP sets: How do you go about using the o-rings? Do you put multiple o-rings on a single key due to the longer stems(without the cross thing), or do you just put the o-ring slightly into the stem and then push the key in so that the o-ring doesn't go all the way to the end of the stem?
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Offline sordna

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #166 on: Sat, 25 February 2012, 11:35:33 »
Putting the o-ring half-way won't work, it will eventually move out of place. With irregular keys, the best way is to try different o-ring sizes (or stack multiple o-rings) till you reach the desired effect. It's rather tedious work compared to having stock keyboard keys that are more consistent, I don't really like how SP doubleshots don't have the consistent and level cross thing.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline devouringone3

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #167 on: Mon, 27 February 2012, 13:24:14 »
How about putting these o-rings to a Realforce?



The negligible key travel reduction Pack D could be helpful inserted there?:

I would only like to get some use out of my unfortunately discovered useless (no one knew that at the moment of ordering) pack E with negligible key travel reduction.

I understand, considering the geometry of a cherry switch, how a ring of such low thickness will simply go in and out of the switch without changing anything of its feel, because it won't make contact with it, but for a Topre switch it should establish contact against 100% of it's circumference. From there one would only pray for the + shaped structural edges to not cut through the tiny little pack D o-ring.

EPDM has higher wear, tear and abrasion resistance which is good... at least the Pack D is made out of that.



For reference (and Buna-N = Nitrile):


And this too: http://www.marcorubber.com/materialguide.htm

I believe that the higher temperature difference means the more and the higher qualities, which is also reflected in the price. The Nitriles, among the cheapest (with only poly-urethane doing worst), have low temperature range, then the EPDMs and then the Silicons.



I will test it as soon as I get my Filco Yellow + Pack D, E, G and H from WhiteFireDragon.

By the way WhiteFireDragon, did we have the choice of picking which of EPDM or Silicon material we wanted for our A and E Pack?

Also, was there a X pack? and what about the LOL sized ones?


*Edit, I kind of answered my own questions : LOL was just for the Lol, and X, I take it that it was only a EPDM or Nitrile version for testing purposes of harder, same sized as pack H, o-rings.

I say harder because the black nitriles have 70A and hardest bottom-out, and the EPDM, in between, also as higher durometers than silicon.
« Last Edit: Mon, 27 February 2012, 13:38:02 by devouringone3 »

Offline devouringone3

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #168 on: Mon, 27 February 2012, 13:40:03 »
Also if it turns out that I can't feel my Pack D under my Topre caps, I guess I will simply combo it with another Pack to get something even more refined and customized... and I'll tell you about it eventually.

Your o-rings really look awesome and high-quality, having just read all the post between my order and today. Thank you already even though I haven't receive mine yet, lol.

If you ever make another group buy, WhiteFirePhoenix, I will buy probably come back to buy all the packs I skipped in this first round.
« Last Edit: Mon, 27 February 2012, 13:52:34 by devouringone3 »

Offline sordna

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #169 on: Mon, 27 February 2012, 13:43:35 »
Yup, stacking o-rings is needed sometimes, I had a key that was somehow too deep and a regular o-ring didn't work, so I stacked a neoprene washer under it. These thin o-rings would work the same way.

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 41975[/ATTACH]
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline devouringone3

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #170 on: Mon, 27 February 2012, 13:54:30 »
Quote from: sordna;528258
Yup, stacking o-rings is needed sometimes, I had a key that was somehow too deep and a regular o-ring didn't work, so I stacked a neoprene washer under it. These thin o-rings would work the same way.

(Attachment Link) 41975[/ATTACH]

Sweet, good to know!

I realized just now that the morphology of the cherry MX key cap also had its importance. ty

Offline sordna

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #171 on: Mon, 27 February 2012, 14:03:28 »
It's not as simple as it seems. There are even 2 possible bottom-out points: the keycap hitting the top of the key, or the stem hitting the bottom of the switch housing, whichever comes first. With most keycaps it's the stem that bottoms out, that's why a thin o-ring makes no difference. A thick enough o-ring will make the keycap bottom out before the stem does.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline devouringone3

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #172 on: Mon, 27 February 2012, 14:15:48 »
Oh yeah I just removed a key from my Topre keyboard and noticed that effect.

I first thought that for Cherries it was only the caps and the casing of the switch making contact.


So this calls for a minimal thickness of the o-rings.

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #173 on: Tue, 28 February 2012, 21:05:37 »
Almost everything was shipped out this past weekend, Monday, or today. Check the OP for your order status. There were a lot of PMs and personal requests, so it slowed me down a lot.

I'll catch up with the rest of the posts in here later.

Offline badascii

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #174 on: Wed, 29 February 2012, 08:24:16 »
got my pack e plus sampler yesterday and immediately went through with the install. what a joy! I am glad I followed your advice regarding pack e being similar to a scissor switch keyboard (which I used previously for many years). it definitely feels a lot alike. they have seemingly already helped with my gaming. besides the familiarity factor, the reduced travel distance allows for quicker repeated key presses. I am really enjoying having less distance between a depressed key and one that is raised because it allows for my fingers to move around the keyboard more rapidly and stops my fingertips from catching on unpressed keys during the transition.

many thanks for all your help WhiteFire!

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #175 on: Wed, 29 February 2012, 18:35:03 »
^ Glad you like them. I'm using pack E for the very same reason. Good for my occasional gaming (starcraft2) as well since that game requires so many quick double-taps.

Btw,  :welcome: to GH

Offline aoya

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #176 on: Mon, 05 March 2012, 01:59:55 »
I have to thank WhiteFireDragon -- he included for me an extra set of pack As! If this was done in error, then I'll be happy to send them back. If this was done intentionally, everyone should know that he is a nice guy!

Offline bastii

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #177 on: Tue, 06 March 2012, 07:30:34 »
got my sample pack today, thanks

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #178 on: Fri, 09 March 2012, 00:34:38 »
*placeholder for next page* :p
« Last Edit: Fri, 09 March 2012, 00:55:41 by WhiteFireDragon »

Offline sordna

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #179 on: Fri, 09 March 2012, 00:42:34 »
For round 2 can you ask Piken what his supplier is? They seem to have good prices for the 5 x 1.5mm o-rings.
Kinesis Contoured Advantage & Advantage2 LF with Cherry MX Red switches / Extra keys mod / O-ring dampening mod / Dvorak layout. ErgoDox with buzzer and LED mod.
Also: Kinesis Advantage Classic, Kinesis Advantage2, Data911 TG3, Fingerworks Touchstream LP, IBM SSK (Buckling spring), Goldtouch GTU-0077 keyboard

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #180 on: Fri, 09 March 2012, 00:55:51 »
UPDATE: round 2 will start in a couple of weeks when I'm on spring break. Currently busy with finals and moving out for the next few weeks.



Quote from: vax;524160
Any chance to grab some leftovers? Would be interested in 1x Pack A and 1x Pack E.
Quote from: dirge;525376
yeah get some up for sale please :)
I also got PMs to grab the extras I ordered. If you didn't already see the leftover thread, here it is. I'll put it in the OP as well.

http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?27841-O-Rings-various-sotfness-and-thickness-GB-leftovers



Quote from: aoya;535495
I have to thank WhiteFireDragon -- he included for me an extra set of pack As! If this was done in error, then I'll be happy to send them back. If this was done intentionally, everyone should know that he is a nice guy!
It was not an error, I sent you an extra pack A at my cost. You only ordered pack D and when I tested them right when I got it, they were too thin to be effective for any of the caps I had at the time. Seeing how you're a new forum member, you probably didn't have any SP caps or thick PBT caps from imsto, so pack D is probably useless to you so I gave you a pack A as well.


Quote from: sordna;539868
For round 2 can you ask Piken what his supplier is? They seem to have good prices for the 5 x 1.5mm o-rings.
Will do. Prices will be better than this round, and if I can't get them that low, then I'll stick with this old company, although I'm not very interested in dealing with them again. And hopefully there can be new pack options as well.
« Last Edit: Fri, 09 March 2012, 00:58:13 by WhiteFireDragon »

Offline devouringone3

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O-Rings of various thickness and softness [Group Buy]
« Reply #181 on: Sat, 10 March 2012, 22:12:13 »
Is it me of the Pack E made out of EDPM is a little sticky? I don't know I've only tried one o-ring briefly but it was more sticky than Nitrile of the same size. Also it left a bit of a residue on the face of the Cherry Switch, but not on the roof of the key cap. The residue was very easy to remove with my finger.

They surely must get less sticky with use, but the residue is annoying :P.


By the way I LOVE my Pack G :P Thank you Whitefiredragon
« Last Edit: Sat, 10 March 2012, 22:18:06 by devouringone3 »