Author Topic: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide  (Read 441891 times)

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Offline mellohello

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #350 on: Wed, 14 August 2013, 22:23:48 »
Another question: I want to lube the stabilizers at least. My brother seems to have some bike cleaning kit:
http://muc-off.com/en/stage-3-shine/22-wet-lube.html?category=bicycle
http://muc-off.com/en/stage-3-shine/21-dry-ptfe-chain-lube.html?category=bicycle

Do either of those seem OK to use? The wet lube at least says "no solvents". Sound OK?

Offline VesperSAINT

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #351 on: Wed, 14 August 2013, 22:25:55 »
Another question: I want to lube the stabilizers at least. My brother seems to have some bike cleaning kit:
http://muc-off.com/en/stage-3-shine/22-wet-lube.html?category=bicycle
http://muc-off.com/en/stage-3-shine/21-dry-ptfe-chain-lube.html?category=bicycle

Do either of those seem OK to use? The wet lube at least says "no solvents". Sound OK?

This is cheap and works wonders for stabilizers:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B000XBH9HI/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new&qid=1376537130&sr=8-1

Offline mellohello

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #352 on: Wed, 14 August 2013, 23:00:44 »
i just want to know if "no solvents" means safe, because if so i might as well just use the stuff i have

edit: nvm, i opened it and it's really watery which seems unsafe. i also just found some lithium grease but it's 50/50 that it could be mineral based, so not taking chances.

i'm in the uk so i can't find the stuff you've linked but i'll buy some stuff that says plastic safe on it.

thanks.
« Last Edit: Wed, 14 August 2013, 23:58:20 by mellohello »

Offline deazncy

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #353 on: Thu, 15 August 2013, 14:56:54 »
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Offline The_Ed

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #354 on: Thu, 15 August 2013, 15:37:37 »
Looks like MMB deleted them, which likely means that a mod would have to restore them seeing as MMB's account has been semi-deleted.
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Offline rknize

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #355 on: Wed, 21 August 2013, 13:31:53 »
I just wanted to post here that I finally gave my first set of switches (clear stems with Originative 55g springs) the full Krytox/Victorinox lubrication treatment.  This was for the freshly-built grey LZ-GH that you might have seen at KeyCon 2013 (it had R4 sphericals on it).  On previous ergo-clear boards, I had just used DuPont Teflon Silicone Lubricant to prevent sticking.

I went through the full process just so that I could make a good comparison between the DuPont and Krytox/Victorinox methods.  While is it very time consuming, it does make a difference and I do like the results.  The DuPont treatment takes the edge off of the scratchiness and prevents sticky or slow return on ergo-clears.  The Krytox further smooths the scratchy nature of the Cherry design and dampens the switch a bit, which gives the illusion that is it not as sloppy as it really is.  Can some steps be skipped?  Probably.  I don't think that lubricating both the base and the stem is needed and I am not sure that oiling the springs actually does anything.  I will probably skip one or both of these on the next set I do.

The keyboard does feel a bit like the 45g Topre.  Less mushy (good) but more sloppy (bad) than a real Topre.

I haven't read through this entire topic, but I did follow most of the steps of the OP and what WFD has shown in his videos.  I used a 50/50 mix of Krytox GPL 205 and 103.  The resulting goo seems to be just the right viscosity for a lot of uses, including stabilizers.  I stole a small watercolor paint brush from my kids and used it to apply small amounts of the goo to the side lateral guides in the base, the front/back lateral guides in the top, and the sides of the slider (probably not needed).

I used Victorinox on the springs.  After some trial and error, I found that the best way to apply it is to simply slide the spring over the tip of the applicator (I have the small bottle with the long stem), apply a tiny drop inside the spring, and then slide the spring fully onto the applicator and compress the spring.  This does a good job of spreading the oil all over the spring without wasting it on soaking Q-tips and small cups.  I didn't lubricate the bottom tip of the stem, but some Victorinox inevitably got on there when I put it over the spring.
Russ

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #356 on: Wed, 21 August 2013, 13:48:07 »
That's what I didn't like about Ergo Clears -- they felt "sloppy".  As in somehow wobbly (but not truly wobbly)--just overall not "solid" like other Cherry switches or stock Clears.
---

P.S.: Since this questions was raised recently and not really answered, and I don't see the answer in the first post of the Simple Questions Simple Answers thread, as indicated: MX Whites vs. MX Greens / Blues.

Some argue that the click is reduced due to lubrication of MX Whites and lack thereof in MX Blues and Greens.  But surely that can be tested by anyone who owns both Whites and Blues / Greens to compare lubricated Blues / Greens with stock Whites?  And vice versa, cleaned up MX Whites with stock Blues / Greens.  If it were down to lubrication, would many people here be after MX White switches when they could just lubricate easily available Blues and swap in heavier springs?

I'm just asking because I see that reasoning periodically, and I myself am interested in a board with MX Whites with a lighter spring, as I love Blues, but hate the loud click.  I don't have an MX White switch myself to compare and resolve this issue, or I would experiment myself.
« Last Edit: Wed, 21 August 2013, 13:53:04 by Photoelectric »
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Offline rknize

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #357 on: Wed, 21 August 2013, 14:23:29 »
There is a thread somewhere about this.  I have done exactly this.  I swapped sliders between white and blue stems.  The click followed the slider, not the stem.  I then cleaned the silicon grease out of the black slider (the white stem has a black slider and the blue/green stem has a white slider).  This made them both clicky.  Others have done this as well and at least one person felt that the white stem still sounded different even without the grease.  I'm not sure, given the amount of variance between any two blue switches.  However, it is possible that the slider is made out of different materials.  I could find no dimensional difference between the two (Ripster claims that the white stem has longer rails on the slider...they don't).
Russ

Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #358 on: Wed, 21 August 2013, 14:27:07 »
There is a thread somewhere about this.  I have done exactly this.  I swapped sliders between white and blue stems.  The click followed the slider, not the stem.  I then cleaned the silicon grease out of the black slider (the white stem has a black slider and the blue/green stem has a white slider).  This made them both clicky.  Others have done this as well and at least one person felt that the white stem still sounded different even without the grease.  I'm not sure, given the amount of variance between any two blue switches.  However, it is possible that the slider is made out of different materials.  I could find no dimensional difference between the two (Ripster claims that the white stem has longer rails on the slider...they don't).

I'd wondered if it wasn't a slightly different material also.

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #359 on: Wed, 21 August 2013, 14:34:45 »
There is a thread somewhere about this.  I have done exactly this.  I swapped sliders between white and blue stems.  The click followed the slider, not the stem.  I then cleaned the silicon grease out of the black slider (the white stem has a black slider and the blue/green stem has a white slider).  This made them both clicky.  Others have done this as well and at least one person felt that the white stem still sounded different even without the grease.  I'm not sure, given the amount of variance between any two blue switches.  However, it is possible that the slider is made out of different materials.  I could find no dimensional difference between the two (Ripster claims that the white stem has longer rails on the slider...they don't).

So basically if I get MX Whites... I should be extremely careful with lubricating them, if doing any lubrication at all?  I'd worry about changing the sound when adding different type of grease / oil (Krytox mixture).
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Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #360 on: Wed, 21 August 2013, 14:40:30 »
There is a thread somewhere about this.  I have done exactly this.  I swapped sliders between white and blue stems.  The click followed the slider, not the stem.  I then cleaned the silicon grease out of the black slider (the white stem has a black slider and the blue/green stem has a white slider).  This made them both clicky.  Others have done this as well and at least one person felt that the white stem still sounded different even without the grease.  I'm not sure, given the amount of variance between any two blue switches.  However, it is possible that the slider is made out of different materials.  I could find no dimensional difference between the two (Ripster claims that the white stem has longer rails on the slider...they don't).

So basically if I get MX Whites... I should be extremely careful with lubricating them, if doing any lubrication at all?  I'd worry about changing the sound when adding different type of grease / oil (Krytox mixture).

I'm not sure what would happen if you lube whites as they come lubed already...

Offline rknize

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #361 on: Wed, 21 August 2013, 14:43:37 »
I would not lubricate them.  I did a few MX whites with Dupont and even that thin oil was enough to kill the already-subtle click.  I like them just how they are, as far as clicky MX switches go.  I find blues/greens to be irritating, but ergo-whites are just right.
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Offline mkawa

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #362 on: Sun, 25 August 2013, 11:44:56 »
note that you can easily clean off the silicone lube that is used on the crosspoint switch (NOT on the slider) from the factory and then experiment with lubing different parts of the switch with your favorite lube. rule of thumb is not to mix dissimilar lubes. krytoxes can be mixed, silicone-based lubes can usually be mixed, mineral lubes can usually be mixed, but never cross base materials.

this is, by the way, why i actively discourage the use of krytox on the sides of sliders and victorinox (mineral oil) on the bottom.

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Offline sprit

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #363 on: Mon, 07 October 2013, 20:47:29 »
Thx for this good info!   Here is my personal Lub. Points   
38620-0     KryTox 103~ 105 applicable.  point-Lube tech with toothpick
« Last Edit: Fri, 11 October 2013, 09:20:06 by sprit »

Offline sprit

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #364 on: Fri, 11 October 2013, 07:40:43 »
So basically if I get MX Whites... I should be extremely careful with lubricating them, if doing any lubrication at all?  I'd worry about changing the sound when adding different type of grease / oil (Krytox mixture).

You may try to use them as they are,  when you feel something wrong, it will be the time to change. IMHO
« Last Edit: Fri, 11 October 2013, 09:19:18 by sprit »

Offline Photoelectric

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #365 on: Fri, 18 October 2013, 23:33:54 »
Does anyone know what common lubricant can produce such residue?  Does it look like it might be too much Superlube?  It seems sticker than Krytox 103 and 201 that I'm used to.  Less sticky than Victorinox oil.  You can see the white residue as well as the oil-slick shiny surface all around the bottom housing.

39842-0

And this appetizing photograph is of MX Black stems soaking in detergent.

39844-1

I'm cleaning the switch tops, the stems, and the springs, but not sure what to do about the bottoms. <-- Looks like cotton swabs soaked in alcohol work well on the slider channels in the bottom housing!
« Last Edit: Sat, 21 December 2013, 21:57:34 by Photoelectric »
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Offline Larken

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #366 on: Fri, 18 October 2013, 23:57:51 »
Does anyone know what common lubricant can produce such residue?  Does it look like it might be too much Superlube?  It seems sticker than Krytox 103 and 201 that I'm used to.  Less sticky than Victorinox oil.  You can see the white residue as well as the oil-slick shiny surface all around the bottom housing.


probably not superlube, though it possible. superlube grease doesn't run like that, and to get it on the bottom of the housing, the builder would have to purposely apply it there. There is however, superlube oil. It is less sticky than victorinox oil, but I haven't heard of anyone using it on its own for keyboard. I do mix it with the grease for a few of my earlier boards.

Superlube grease yellows after a period of time, if it helps.

It's however, hard to tell from a glance. Could be anything from singer oil to a mixture of krytox, (could happen depending on the ratio the oil and grease). Best to check with the person who built the board instead. Or it might still be victorinox, thinned out.

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Offline Photoelectric

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #367 on: Sat, 19 October 2013, 00:07:32 »
Thanks :)  I figured I'd ask here just in case, as I don't want to mix incompatible lubes.  I've been able to clean the housing bottoms fairly well (except on the very "floor" and deep in the openings where the stem go into).  Hopefully that's sufficient.  I didn't like how these vintage Blacks felt at all vs. other vintage Blacks I have, so I'm hoping it was just the overgreasing.

The grease/lube on the bottom is likely due to a small brush.  It even looks like there are brush strokes.
« Last Edit: Sat, 21 December 2013, 21:56:53 by Photoelectric »
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Offline Larken

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #368 on: Sat, 19 October 2013, 00:21:01 »
If its brushed on, it might very well be a teflon grease, though not superlube (guessing due to the white residue).

The grease on the bottom wouldn't really affect things much, as only a small part of the spring comes in contact with it. Similarly for the housing hole for the stem.

Cleaning the slider channels would probably be sufficient, along with the stems (done the same thing before when I swapped superlube out in favor of krytox) :D
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Offline Photoelectric

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #369 on: Sat, 19 October 2013, 00:24:26 »
Thank you again!  I'll have a look at the housing again in better light tomorrow, but it looks now like I got most of the lube off with alcohol-soaked cotton swabs.  I like my Krytox mix too, so I'll be using that :)

Update: I've learned that the lubricant is also a Krytox mixture!  So no compatibility issues  :thumb:
« Last Edit: Mon, 21 October 2013, 21:10:04 by Photoelectric »
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Offline catnipz0098

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #370 on: Mon, 04 November 2013, 19:20:20 »
How long can one bottle of lube last?

Offline phoenix1234

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #371 on: Mon, 04 November 2013, 20:14:32 »
In my opinion and experience, I faced more troubles with over-lubed switches than benefits.
Therefore, when we lube Cherry MX Clear, Brown, especially Blue and Green, we should be very careful to use very small amount of grease to lube. On the other hand, Cherry Black and Red (linear) tend to be easy to lube due to their linear behaviour.
I like linear switches

Offline 1pq

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #372 on: Sat, 21 December 2013, 18:37:41 »
This thread is amazing. I think this bump might give noobs (like myself) a lot more knowledge.
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Offline riotonthebay

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #373 on: Thu, 26 December 2013, 15:21:21 »
Lubing Whites

First off, I just want to say that this thread has been immensely helpful. I had a great time reading through all of it, and learned a ton.

One thing that I noticed is that no one has had much success lubing whites. I spent some time this morning creating about thirty 62g, lubed ergo whites. It took quite a while because I was moving slowly and trying to develop a repeatably process, but I think I found one and wanted to share it here. (Note that none of this is really new, but I had to cobble it together from 4 or 5 pages of this thread. I figured it would be useful to have it all in one place.)

Preparation

To get it out of the way, springs were lubed with Victorinox multi-tool oil. Everything else was done with Krytox GPL 103 or 103/205 mix.

To start, it's important to acknowledge that whites are not all the same, and that means they can't all be lubed the same way. The bag of 100 whites I had contained 46 with a hard click, 40 with the proper soft click, and 14 that didn't click at all. The first thing to do is to separate them.

As for the difference between the hard-clicking and soft-clicking whites: I have no clue. One popular belief is that whites come pre-lubed, but that's almost certainly not the case with these. I also couldn't detect any physical differences between the soft-clicking, hard-clicking, or not-clicking whites. If anyone can actually figure this out, that would be great. For now, I'm okay with it being black magic.

For making ergo whites, I only considered those with a hard click or soft click; I didn't have much luck bringing the click back on the 14 that didn't click in the first place. I've been told that replacing the housing can sometimes work, but I didn't have any luck.

Lubing soft-clicking whites

For soft-clicking whites, I lube the stems and nibs with 103 oil using a very small brush:



It is incredibly easy to kill the click on whites by over lubing or lubing the wrong spots. For the already soft-clicking whites, I found that any lube in these areas killed the click entirely:



Putting the stock springs back in to compare, I found that this resulted in no change in the click but a noticeably smoother press.

Lubing hard-clicking whites

There's an additional goal when lubing hard-clicking whites, which is to turn a hard click into a soft click. This can be done by carefully inhibiting the click by adding about a 70/30 mix of 103/205 to the very top of the slider tracks:



A very, very small amount of this mix is needed to dampen the click. Using a large amount, or lubing any lower than I've shown above, will kill the click. The reason the 103/205 mix favors the 103 is because the 205 is just there for adhesion. Too much 205 will cause the slider to be sluggish and kill the click. This time though, you can bring it back by cleaning off the lube with isopropyl alcohol and trying again.

The stems should be lubed the same as the soft-clicking ones.

Results

The end result, especially with lubed 62g springs, seems to be a very nice and buttery smooth soft-clicking white. So far I've only been able to test them in a 6-switch tester, but I'll hopefully have a board filled with them come this weekend.

I hope this helps someone. Happy lubing. :)
« Last Edit: Mon, 13 January 2014, 21:08:23 by riotonthebay »

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #374 on: Thu, 26 December 2013, 17:11:23 »
Thanks for the detailed write up!

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #375 on: Thu, 26 December 2013, 19:35:11 »
Hoping I don't get flamed off the forums with this questions, but here goes...

I have some KryTox 104 Oil coming and I have a crap ton of SuperLube grease.  I have heard that SuperLube will start to yellow over time, but does it actually change its properties when it yellows?  Without opening my filco switches, I did a very thin layer of SuperLube on the sliders with a fine paint brush and it has made a world of difference.  They still feel great even though I am sure it is more yellow then when I applied it.

Next, if I want a consistency between oil and grease, can I mix the KryTox and the SuperLube?  Any issues with this?

Thx...


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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #376 on: Thu, 26 December 2013, 19:36:42 »
I think I read somewhere to only mix krytox with krytox but I'm not sure.

Offline riotonthebay

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #377 on: Thu, 26 December 2013, 19:49:04 »
Hoping I don't get flamed off the forums with this questions, but here goes...

I have some KryTox 104 Oil coming and I have a crap ton of SuperLube grease.  I have heard that SuperLube will start to yellow over time, but does it actually change its properties when it yellows?  Without opening my filco switches, I did a very thin layer of SuperLube on the sliders with a fine paint brush and it has made a world of difference.  They still feel great even though I am sure it is more yellow then when I applied it.

Next, if I want a consistency between oil and grease, can I mix the KryTox and the SuperLube?  Any issues with this?

Thx...

rule of thumb is not to mix dissimilar lubes. krytoxes can be mixed, silicone-based lubes can usually be mixed, mineral lubes can usually be mixed, but never cross base materials.

I wouldn't risk it, personally. Especially if it was going on those 300 switches you mentioned to me in a PM ;). At that volume, I think you should go the safe route with a Krytox mix. GPL 205 can be easily had on eBay and shipping to Canada ain't bad.

Offline swill

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #378 on: Thu, 26 December 2013, 21:44:26 »
Hoping I don't get flamed off the forums with this questions, but here goes...

I have some KryTox 104 Oil coming and I have a crap ton of SuperLube grease.  I have heard that SuperLube will start to yellow over time, but does it actually change its properties when it yellows?  Without opening my filco switches, I did a very thin layer of SuperLube on the sliders with a fine paint brush and it has made a world of difference.  They still feel great even though I am sure it is more yellow then when I applied it.

Next, if I want a consistency between oil and grease, can I mix the KryTox and the SuperLube?  Any issues with this?

Thx...

rule of thumb is not to mix dissimilar lubes. krytoxes can be mixed, silicone-based lubes can usually be mixed, mineral lubes can usually be mixed, but never cross base materials.

I wouldn't risk it, personally. Especially if it was going on those 300 switches you mentioned to me in a PM ;). At that volume, I think you should go the safe route with a Krytox mix. GPL 205 can be easily had on eBay and shipping to Canada ain't bad.

Ya, fair enough...  I am guessing that 104 + 205 will be a pretty good mix?  Can anyone confirm that? 

Now what do I do with this huge can of SuperLube?  haha...

Offline tuxsavvy

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #379 on: Fri, 27 December 2013, 00:29:49 »
Any of you guys tried the "Dirt & Dust Resistant Dry Lube PTFE Spray" by WD-40?
I have tried this on my APC Clicker F-21 there doesn't seem to be any damages done to the keyboard. Specifically my board has membrane components and any excess lube needs to be wiped off or they will cause interference which little did I know I thought I killed my keyboard but she's working fine again.

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Offline datagrok

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #380 on: Sun, 29 December 2013, 01:29:12 »
Any of you guys tried the "Dirt & Dust Resistant Dry Lube PTFE Spray" by WD-40? I have tried this on my APC Clicker F-21 there doesn't seem to be any damages done to the keyboard. Specifically my board has membrane components and any excess lube needs to be wiped off or they will cause interference which little did I know I thought I killed my keyboard but she's working fine again.

I just tried something similar, "WD-40 specialist water resistant silicone lubricant."

I wanted to see what the effect would be on an easy task, the stems of my old HHKB Lite 2, before trying it in the Cherry MX switches in my ErgoDox. Result: massive fail, the keys are stickier than when they were dry and dirty. T_T

I bought it because the only local shop that the Internet said carried the DuPont Teflon Silicone Lubricant as mentioned on page one of this thread... didn't carry it. This seemed to be closest thing they had. That's what I get for being impatient and not just going home and ordering online.

Offline tuxsavvy

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #381 on: Sun, 29 December 2013, 09:46:58 »
Any of you guys tried the "Dirt & Dust Resistant Dry Lube PTFE Spray" by WD-40? I have tried this on my APC Clicker F-21 there doesn't seem to be any damages done to the keyboard. Specifically my board has membrane components and any excess lube needs to be wiped off or they will cause interference which little did I know I thought I killed my keyboard but she's working fine again.

I just tried something similar, "WD-40 specialist water resistant silicone lubricant."
Show Image


I wanted to see what the effect would be on an easy task, the stems of my old HHKB Lite 2, before trying it in the Cherry MX switches in my ErgoDox. Result: massive fail, the keys are stickier than when they were dry and dirty. T_T

I bought it because the only local shop that the Internet said carried the DuPont Teflon Silicone Lubricant as mentioned on page one of this thread... didn't carry it. This seemed to be closest thing they had. That's what I get for being impatient and not just going home and ordering online.
Hi, welcome to geekhack!

For HHKB I think the best idea is to go for Ro-59. It has been tested fine with HHKB Pro in the very least, not too sure for Lite2 though.

There seems to be a bit of a divide on the lubrication, I think probably the safest ones would be the PTFE based lubricant, ones without any silicone compound in it. I was quite skeptical when I first bought the bottle, thinking that Ro-59 would have been much more superior type of lube instead but because APC Clicker F-21 is such an old keyboard I thought I might as well make it my "lab rat".

Initial tests shows that the keyboard was dead (some letters would appear on the screen, the Lock LED were sort of going off in some weird pattern. Pressing Lock keys to turn them off failed to do anything along with any other keys on the keyboard). After letting the keyboard sit awhile (being disconnected and without lube being cleared out) I decided to fire up the keyboard again and it started showing some signs of life (still it was not working perfectly until I realised that my keyboard wasn't dead. The only reason was that there were too much film accrued on the membrane sheet which probably caused some short circuit. After a bit of constant cleaning and retrying with the board I managed to get the keyboard back into a more functional state.

To this day I still do not know if this PTFE dry lubricant is still suitable for use on keyboards or not. One thing for sure is that I would not be using it on my HHKB because the lack of tests done with the lube in question as well as in general seems to be a concern for me. I think the best way is to just get Ro-59 for when dealing with Topre switches. Safest bet, considering there were many "lab rats" before us.

Thanks again for your input! I didn't think anyone would have responded to my use of some more common lube that can be sort of found in some local hardware store. I actually went and bought mine (the lube) physically from the store. After looking at the (small) range of lube available I thought I might as well gamble with this PTFE Dry lubricant when the bottle had the words "Compatible with all metals, vinyls, plastics and rubber".
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Offline Zeal

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #382 on: Sun, 29 December 2013, 20:40:03 »
Has anyone tried the GH Lubekit on Originative and compared it to the regular 103/205 Krytox mixture for Ergo-Clears?
What are the differences between Krytox GPL 206/1506 vs 103/205?
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Offline ninjadoc

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #383 on: Tue, 28 January 2014, 05:49:46 »
Does anyone know what common lubricant can produce such residue?  Does it look like it might be too much Superlube?  It seems sticker than Krytox 103 and 201 that I'm used to.  Less sticky than Victorinox oil.  You can see the white residue as well as the oil-slick shiny surface all around the bottom housing.

(Attachment Link)

And this appetizing photograph is of MX Black stems soaking in detergent.

(Attachment Link)

I'm cleaning the switch tops, the stems, and the springs, but not sure what to do about the bottoms. <-- Looks like cotton swabs soaked in alcohol work well on the slider channels in the bottom housing!


Is LZ soaking these switches in detergent?

http://lzlife.tistory.com/category/LZ%20Histroy

If so, what kind do you clean your switches with?

Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #384 on: Tue, 28 January 2014, 06:34:21 »
Does anyone know what common lubricant can produce such residue?  Does it look like it might be too much Superlube?  It seems sticker than Krytox 103 and 201 that I'm used to.  Less sticky than Victorinox oil.  You can see the white residue as well as the oil-slick shiny surface all around the bottom housing.

(Attachment Link)

And this appetizing photograph is of MX Black stems soaking in detergent.

(Attachment Link)

I'm cleaning the switch tops, the stems, and the springs, but not sure what to do about the bottoms. <-- Looks like cotton swabs soaked in alcohol work well on the slider channels in the bottom housing!


Is LZ soaking these switches in detergent?

http://lzlife.tistory.com/category/LZ%20Histroy

If so, what kind do you clean your switches with?

Is that cleaner or lube??

If cleaner I wonder if they are using 'vintage' (used, grubby, dirty switches) that need a deep cleaning.

Offline ninjadoc

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #385 on: Tue, 28 January 2014, 14:21:33 »
So what type of cleaner do you use on these old, dirty switches?

Offline phoenix1234

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #386 on: Wed, 29 January 2014, 12:12:01 »
Does anyone know what common lubricant can produce such residue?  Does it look like it might be too much Superlube?  It seems sticker than Krytox 103 and 201 that I'm used to.  Less sticky than Victorinox oil.  You can see the white residue as well as the oil-slick shiny surface all around the bottom housing.

(Attachment Link)

And this appetizing photograph is of MX Black stems soaking in detergent.

(Attachment Link)

I'm cleaning the switch tops, the stems, and the springs, but not sure what to do about the bottoms. <-- Looks like cotton swabs soaked in alcohol work well on the slider channels in the bottom housing!


Is LZ soaking these switches in detergent?

http://lzlife.tistory.com/category/LZ%20Histroy

If so, what kind do you clean your switches with?

I had a very bad experience with washing the switches (~100 broken oxidized switch housings).
Therefore, I would like to share with anyone who is attempting to wash their switch in water.
Please be very careful, the brass contact points will get oxidized quickly and easily when they contact H20.

Actually, IMO, I think we only need to wash the stem but do not wash the switch housing.
In order to clean the switch housing, we can use a clean toothbrush to clean it.

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Offline Photekq

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #387 on: Wed, 29 January 2014, 12:13:45 »
I think LZ was likely using IPA in order to remove any factory applied grease/possibly dirt.
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Offline ninjadoc

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #388 on: Wed, 29 January 2014, 18:32:28 »
I think LZ was likely using IPA in order to remove any factory applied grease/possibly dirt.

I'm ignorant - what's IPA?


Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #389 on: Wed, 29 January 2014, 18:39:36 »
I think LZ was likely using IPA in order to remove any factory applied grease/possibly dirt.

I'm ignorant - what's IPA?

Isopropyl Alcohol

Offline nubbinator

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #390 on: Thu, 30 January 2014, 09:14:51 »
I think LZ was likely using IPA in order to remove any factory applied grease/possibly dirt.

I'm ignorant - what's IPA?

India Pale Ale.

Offline ninjadoc

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #391 on: Thu, 30 January 2014, 14:30:03 »
I think LZ was likely using IPA in order to remove any factory applied grease/possibly dirt.

I'm ignorant - what's IPA?

India Pale Ale.

I like your answer better! :)

Offline kmiller8

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #392 on: Mon, 03 February 2014, 07:51:45 »
Ming's Unofficial Guide to Lubing.

Preface: There are only two parts on a MX switch worth lubing, the gold crosspoint contact with the slider, and the channels in the bottom switch housing.

What do you want out of lubing?

What kind of feel do you want out of switches?

Lubing can either decrease or increase friction inside the switch.

To decrease friction for a smoother switch, use a thin lube on the slider arms and in the channels.
To increase friction, and enhance tactility, use a thick lube in the channels, and a very thick lube on the slider arms.

Some Notes: Be careful with the slider arms on a tactile switch, too much lube can kill the click, and the thick formulation is not thick enough to actually increase tactility.

OG Chatlog
More
Quote
[2/2/2014 10:10:12 PM] ming: i think it really depends on what kind of feel you want out of the switch
[2/2/2014 10:10:56 PM] ming: use a tiny bit of the right consistency of lube in the right place and you can almost any feel out of any switch
[2/2/2014 10:10:59 PM] ming: well
[2/2/2014 10:11:11 PM] ming: as long as that feel involves less friction somewhere
[2/2/2014 10:11:14 PM] ming: or more stiction
[2/2/2014 10:12:07 PM] ming: but any lubricant not on surfaces with dynamic friction is wasted lube that's going to get all over the place the second you start using the switches
[2/2/2014 10:12:22 PM] ming: if you look at a cherry switch
[2/2/2014 10:12:31 PM] ming: there's the slider, the bottom housing, top housing right
[2/2/2014 10:12:43 PM] ming: slider has back, front and sides
[2/2/2014 10:12:58 PM] ming: sides slide into two gussets in the bottom housing
[2/2/2014 10:13:12 PM] ming: top housing has very little contact with slide, pretty much irrelevant
[2/2/2014 10:13:16 PM] ming: so you have slider and bottom housing
[2/2/2014 10:13:41 PM] ming: there are two points that are lubricated from the factory on any cherry switch. the furthest two points on the gold crosspoint contact
[2/2/2014 10:14:20 PM] ming: if you want a smoother less tactile switch, put a thin lube there
[2/2/2014 10:14:47 PM] ming: if that's not smooth enough for you, also lube the two gussets
[2/2/2014 10:16:14 PM] ming: all the stems have two little arms
[2/2/2014 10:16:17 PM] ming: that connect to those
[2/2/2014 10:16:21 PM] ming: those are the factory lube points
[2/2/2014 10:16:36 PM] ming: they use a silicone based lube
[2/2/2014 10:16:41 PM] ming: fairly viscous
[2/2/2014 10:17:16 PM] ming: if you want a more tactile switch, put thick stuff on the gussets
[2/2/2014 10:17:29 PM] ming: but you have to be careful about the slider face with tactile switches
[2/2/2014 10:17:41 PM] ming: hence the formulation of VERY THICK
[2/2/2014 10:17:53 PM] ming: thick is not thick enough for more tactility on slider face
[2/2/2014 10:18:20 PM] ming: same problem as topre sliders


I will be updating this with more info as I bug ming.
« Last Edit: Mon, 03 February 2014, 09:09:01 by kmiller8 »

Offline riotonthebay

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #393 on: Mon, 03 February 2014, 10:46:42 »
Thanks for posting this, Kirk. I've not thought about using very thick lube on the slider arms to increase tactility. I want to see how this affects browns now…

Offline kmiller8

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #394 on: Wed, 12 February 2014, 14:25:09 »
Talked with him some more about lubing clicky switches

More
[2/11/2014 10:40:37 PM] ming: only lube the back of the housing
[2/11/2014 10:40:49 PM] ming: never lube the face of the stem
[2/11/2014 10:40:55 PM] ming: even with very thick
[2/11/2014 10:41:22 PM] ming: it's complicated, but you want to increase the stiction when the switch stops or changes direction
[2/11/2014 10:41:33 PM] ming: the front of it
[2/11/2014 10:41:39 PM] ming: what i do is i take taht little brush
[2/11/2014 10:42:05 PM] ming: and i just put a tiny bit of lube on the interior of the housings where the sliders contact the sides of the housing
[2/11/2014 10:42:24 PM] ming: it smooths the action out and gives you that extra stiction with very thick
[2/11/2014 10:43:02 PM] ming: it's a tricky bit of physics because it's non-newtonian
[2/11/2014 10:43:19 PM] ming: but static friction is completely different from sliding or dynamic friction right
[2/11/2014 10:43:50 PM] ming: like when two objects are touching and fixed, the force of static friction is what acts on them
[2/11/2014 10:44:04 PM] ming: when they're sliding against each other, it's a different coefficient
[2/11/2014 10:44:19 PM] ming: this is still a linear approximation of what's actually going on, but it's a second order
[2/11/2014 10:44:41 PM] ming: with clicky switches you want to increase the holding force when the two surfaces are stopped
[2/11/2014 10:44:55 PM] ming: but decrease the force that opposes the stem sliding
[2/11/2014 10:45:10 PM] ming: so it's smooth but tactile

Offline Veteranos

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #395 on: Wed, 19 February 2014, 16:07:04 »
Amazing topic!
But i need someone to clarify the landscape ... i've got a filco with red mx and id like to do some lubing on the switches.

If i use only the oil on the springs will that be ok ? i kinda need to eliminate the spring sound, will that be enough or i should lube the other parts too?

Can someone provide me with a small guide to that because i'm a new to this "lube thing" :P

I'd appreciate it :)

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Offline 1pq

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #396 on: Wed, 19 February 2014, 16:26:02 »
Did you see the vid in the op? That should answer your questions.
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Offline Veteranos

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #397 on: Wed, 19 February 2014, 17:01:37 »
yes i did :)

but i was wondering if i would apply only the oil on the springs and not the mixture of grease and oil in the other parts...will that eliminate the spring sound some keys do?

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Offline 1pq

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #398 on: Wed, 19 February 2014, 17:10:30 »
I'm not exactly sure what you mean. Are you asking which lube mixture to put on the springs? Or whether to lube the springs at all? Stock cherry springs are prelubed, but if you don't lube korean springs (like the ones from originative) you can sometimes hear some grindy metal-on-metal noises. Lubing the springs would get rid of this noise. The most common lube for springs is victorinox multi-tool oil.

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Offline Veteranos

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Re: Cherry MX Switch Lubrication Guide
« Reply #399 on: Wed, 19 February 2014, 19:43:35 »
yes this is what i exactly want..to get rid that metal-on-metal grindy noises that some keys do. So applying for example the victorinox oil on springs is going to vanish that noise? Or do i have to apply grease on the stems and housing etc etc?

Sorry for my english being kinda goofy :P

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