[GB] 16ga metal ergodox cases -- Shipping R2 recommencing

[JustCallMeCrash]

Shoot... I just found this.  I'll try to keep an eye open for round 2!

[SpAmRaY]

Shoot... I just found this.  I'll try to keep an eye open for round 2!

Hey now I pm'd you about this almost a month ago

[AKmalamute]

On the bright side, folks, the parts are in my car.

I'm at work so it'll be a few hours yet, maybe ten, before I can introduce parts to mister camera, upload everything to Imgur, make an album, and show you guys the link.

But I really expect I'll have this shipped out before my weekend is over, and then I'll open it up to round two once I know how to handle international shipping -- for which impetus, I guess we all get to thank oystein.krog all the way out in Norway.

[AKmalamute]

http://imgur.com/a/ZiMPE

So, taking pictures isn't something I'm great at.

They're collated. Not surprisingly, my SS kit weighs about 3 lbs. Osten.Krog's whole package weighs less than two.

There's two small problems. First, is the second RH isn't here -- so the SS-minimalist is lonesome. The other is, despite asking for JD's spacer, it isn't here AND isn't listed on the box.

So -- I'm hoping there's a second box, or something. Hopefully it won't take much to sort this out.

Also, and this is quite a bit more true if the spacer pieces aren't somewhere waiting for me -- this was more expensive than quoted.

I think what's going on, is the quote for whole-kits, all 10 layers, was right, but the rest wasn't really by sheer surface area, because the laser time on the switchplate (the most critical piece) probably equals the laser usage for all other eight layers combined -- so minimalist cases are more.

 Can't tell for sure, and as you've heard by now, communication isn't the project manager's strong suit. He wasn't there today it was the secretary and the floor worker who found the box. I don't remember seeing a second box by it, but that might not mean as much.

[effnish]

Looks great! Thanks all of your hard work in getting these produced.

[dorkvader]

There's two small problems. First, is the second RH isn't here -- so the SS-minimalist is lonesome.

It's cool. I wasnt planning to install it until later anyway.

On an awesome note: this picture is SIIIICK!


Gonna be legit.


Edit: I probably should order bolts. Holes are 3mm (M3) diameter, right? Gonna get some pan head machine screws and a bagfulla nuts

[tjcaustin]

I think I might be in for round 2 based on these picks.  Get it powder coated local and maybe be done with keyboards until the novatouch.

[tbc]

will stainless steel for r2 be more polished?  or does that not happen really?

the way i'm reading it:

cost of 10 layers: material cost for 10 layer + cutting time cost for 10 layers

cost of 4 layers: material cost for 4 layers + cutting time for 10 layers

where cutting time is the much larger cost.

the only benefit for getting 4 layers is: save 6 layers of cost + cheaper shipping + not having to find room for 6 layers at the buyers home.


can we get a quote for shipping to Canada please?

also, what is going on for fullhand cases?

[AKmalamute]

will stainless steel for r2 be more polished?  or does that not happen really?

the way i'm reading it:

cost of 10 layers: material cost for 10 layer + cutting time cost for 10 layers

cost of 4 layers: material cost for 4 layers + cutting time for 10 layers

[...]

can we get a quote for shipping to Canada please?

also, what is going on for fullhand cases?

I'll tell you, I honestly could not tell the SS from the aluminum for the first ten minutes I was sorting parts. I thought it odd, but my rare earth magnet didn't stick to anything so, well. But then I realized first with the base plate, that some were REALLY HEAVY and many were not.

 If you hold the edges to the light, the stainless steel is a little darker. But polish / shine is roughly the same for both metals, yes.

I never received any quotes that were specifically for the minimalist cases, and getting quotes for the complete cases took months of haranguing so I took him at his word that it would be strictly by surface area. Now, looking at the receipt (which doesn't break anything down so I have to talk to him anyway) I think that's not true -- the laser time is a contributor, and it's more complex / time consuming on the switchplate layer.

 It should still, after adjustment, be quite noticeably cheaper to choose the minimalist case -- but I suggested it for alternate reasons, namely it seemed appropriate to match "thin" metal with "thin" cases.

 I have not gotten quotes for the full-hand. I will, again, ask for that information when I speak to the manager on Monday.

Shipping: Canada. Got it. Don't know, but I'll find out for you. Which end of Canada are you in, if that ends up making a difference?

[tbc]

west coast canada .  specifically, vancouver, bc

thanks for the answers!

[oystein.krog]

This looks awesome, can't wait:P
I can only speak for myself but for this kind of GB/first round I don't have a big problem with changes in price, the risk is something I accept.
If your expenses are higher than expected just let me/us know so we can work things out.
Thanks for your work and persistence with the shop;P

[MOZ]

From my experience on acrylic, both material and laser time count, plate layers are generally 2-3x the price of other layers. Even the base layer is slightly more, sicne there is no wastage that the shop can later sell off.

[jdcarpe]

I recently found that shipping to Canada is a little cheaper using UPS. You may be able to ship a set of these to Canada for around $20 or so.

[AKmalamute]

This looks awesome, can't wait:P
I can only speak for myself but for this kind of GB/first round I don't have a big problem with changes in price, the risk is something I accept.
If your expenses are higher than expected just let me/us know so we can work things out.
Thanks for your work and persistence with the shop;P

okay, thanks.

So, guys: if it turns out that JD's spacer's really weren't a part of this order, then collecting about eleven dollars per minimalist kit, would bring me back to parity -- minus shipping costs that aren't going to Norway. If I can get oystein.krog's order into an envelope and feel good about it, that actually would save most of the lost shipping costs, too.

 So I'm going to hold off asking for anything until I get both to the shop, and the post office tomorrow. Right now I've got everyone's orders in a stack and secured via twist ties or aluminum fence wire when I couldn't find twist ties. I'll repackage that if envelopes (cheaper) look suitable but otherwise will need boxes and whatnot.

Could we tentatively plan on splitting the difference, and everyone who's on post 3 as getting a minimalst, or extended minimalist, send $6 per kit? Full kits are, I'm pretty sure, the cost I was quoted it's just, as MOZ pointed out, the minimalst is made of the most expensive part.

I'll be back in a day with news, and Lord-willin' and the creek don't rise, have tracking numbers for the five orders by tomorrow night.

I'm still excited, btw. They look super cool, and weigh a ton (compared to acrylic). Steel the moreso, which is why I got that for myself.

...now I just need some switches...

[SeeThruHead]

This looks awesome, can't wait:P
I can only speak for myself but for this kind of GB/first round I don't have a big problem with changes in price, the risk is something I accept.
If your expenses are higher than expected just let me/us know so we can work things out.
Thanks for your work and persistence with the shop;P

okay, thanks.

So, guys: if it turns out that JD's spacer's really weren't a part of this order, then collecting about eleven dollars per minimalist kit, would bring me back to parity -- minus shipping costs that aren't going to Norway. If I can get oystein.krog's order into an envelope and feel good about it, that actually would save most of the lost shipping costs, too.

 So I'm going to hold off asking for anything until I get both to the shop, and the post office tomorrow. Right now I've got everyone's orders in a stack and secured via twist ties or aluminum fence wire when I couldn't find twist ties. I'll repackage that if envelopes (cheaper) look suitable but otherwise will need boxes and whatnot.

Could we tentatively plan on splitting the difference, and everyone who's on post 3 as getting a minimalst, or extended minimalist, send $6 per kit? Full kits are, I'm pretty sure, the cost I was quoted it's just, as MOZ pointed out, the minimalst is made of the most expensive part.

I'll be back in a day with news, and Lord-willin' and the creek don't rise, have tracking numbers for the five orders by tomorrow night.

I'm still excited, btw. They look super cool, and weigh a ton (compared to acrylic). Steel the moreso, which is why I got that for myself.

...now I just need some switches...

UPS shipping to from the US to Canada is something I think most canadians avoid at all costs. UPS brokerage fees are incredibly ridiculous.

[dorkvader]

This looks awesome, can't wait:P
I can only speak for myself but for this kind of GB/first round I don't have a big problem with changes in price, the risk is something I accept.
If your expenses are higher than expected just let me/us know so we can work things out.
Thanks for your work and persistence with the shop;P

okay, thanks.

So, guys: if it turns out that JD's spacer's really weren't a part of this order, then collecting about eleven dollars per minimalist kit, would bring me back to parity -- minus shipping costs that aren't going to Norway. If I can get oystein.krog's order into an envelope and feel good about it, that actually would save most of the lost shipping costs, too.

 So I'm going to hold off asking for anything until I get both to the shop, and the post office tomorrow. Right now I've got everyone's orders in a stack and secured via twist ties or aluminum fence wire when I couldn't find twist ties. I'll repackage that if envelopes (cheaper) look suitable but otherwise will need boxes and whatnot.

Could we tentatively plan on splitting the difference, and everyone who's on post 3 as getting a minimalst, or extended minimalist, send $6 per kit? Full kits are, I'm pretty sure, the cost I was quoted it's just, as MOZ pointed out, the minimalst is made of the most expensive part.

I'll be back in a day with news, and Lord-willin' and the creek don't rise, have tracking numbers for the five orders by tomorrow night.

I'm still excited, btw. They look super cool, and weigh a ton (compared to acrylic). Steel the moreso, which is why I got that for myself.

...now I just need some switches...

Wait.

They charged your eleven dollars per kit more than they quoted you? You should go back there (or call) and talk to a manager about this. The definition of a "quote" is that you can quote them on it, not that it's an estimate or whatever.

Secondly, By "envelope" do you mean bubble mailer? I think that would be acceptable for most domestic orders, but shipping these completely unprotected will lead to some damage. I will pay more for a box or proper packaging if need be.

Thirdly, It's very generous of you to split the difference.

Finally: Thanks for the really quick packing! This GB has gone by so fast, and it's really commendable your dedication. I eagerly await receiving stuff and resoldering. It's gonna be sweet.

...now I just need some switches...

I can pay in switches if you like.

[oystein.krog]

Please don't take too much risk with the packaging, I'd rather pay extra too. Having it arrive damaged would really suck:P

[AKmalamute]

Please don't take too much risk with the packaging, I'd rather pay extra too. Having it arrive damaged would really suck:P

Having received a keyboard that traveled from India, I certainly understand your concern.

EDIT: yeah ... looked at the mailing bubble envelopes. Not gonna cut it internationally, and I'm not real sure I could get it in, even.

[...]
Wait.

They charged you eleven dollars per kit more than they quoted you? You should go back there (or call) and talk to a manager about this. The definition of a "quote" is that you can quote them on it, not that it's an estimate or whatever.

 I never received a quote for the minimalist cases.  I tried quite a few times and never received a number. But I when I got the quote for the whole kits, I asked for a quote for the minimalist cases and was told it would probably be close enough to guess by surface area. So, just a rule of thumb, and it didn't occur to me that the lasering time would be disproportionate until I was billing folks.

 Also I think it's more than eleven because at eleven for each mini-case, that brings be down to where I'd expect to be after mailing domestic orders.

[...] I can pay in switches if you like. [...]

Hmm ... Clears? That'd be ... about enough for a thumb cluster 

EDIT: I went out, but the manager was out. No one to talk to who knew anything. I'll go back out this afternoon. Kinda have to because ostein.krog 's order was in a suitable box but I forgot the tape -- and the customs form -- and his address.

So, here's where I see that we are: I'm out something, and I'd like some help with that but I don't mind splitting the loss because this first round was intended as a learning experience for me.
JD's order is complete as paid, but there's a fair chance (I HOPE) that his spacer is in, in which case I'll give him the option to add that to his order -- if it's not in I suppose I'll ship what I have.
Dorkvader's order is 2/3rds here ... and once the shop guys find the two missing pieces or recut them so they dont get lost this time, or whatever, then I can ship his.

TheChemist: yes I'd like something from you because yours was just a minimalst order but I'm not worried enough about it to hold your order ransom. Shipped.

Effinish: pretty sure the whole cases cost me what I was told they cost me, and that's all you ordered. Shipped.

[oystein.krog]

I sent you a little extra, I guess you don't know yet what shipping for my package will be so I hope it covers the extra expenses you've had on my order.
I think I speak for all non-conus members here on the boards; we appreciate GB's who are willing to handle the extra hassle of international shipping:)

[Latin00032]

Wow! Ok. You converted me.

How do I get into round two??

[AKmalamute]

I think I speak for all non-conus members here on the boards; we appreciate GB's who are willing to handle the extra hassle of international shipping:)

 Thank you. And yes, I guess I'm getting that. It surprises me overall because the US has the profile of a 3rd world country: most of what we export is raw grains, and most of what we import is finished goods. ::shrug::

Wow! Ok. You converted me.

How do I get into round two??

 Now that I have real-world experience in this type'o'stuff, I'm going to rework my price sheet on page one and sometime soon will open the door to new orders.

[Thechemist]

Let me know how much I owe you.

[AKmalamute]

Further good news, folks -- I've spoken with the project manager, who is going to work up proper quotes for all the kits we requested.

The spacer that JD drew up, is going to be about $20 to me, in aluminum and $42 in stainless -- So, tax / PP / shipping on top of that.

JD I've PM'd you for some clarification; TheChemist I've replied to PM.

Dorkvader the rework order has been placed -- so, by next weekend yours should be en route.

[Thechemist]

Paid for the difference; now waiting for the spacers. 

[dorkvader]

Further good news, folks -- I've spoken with the project manager, who is going to work up proper quotes for all the kits we requested.

The spacer that JD drew up, is going to be about $20 to me, in aluminum and $42 in stainless -- So, tax / PP / shipping on top of that.

JD I've PM'd you for some clarification; TheChemist I've replied to PM.

Dorkvader the rework order has been placed -- so, by next weekend yours should be en route.

Excellent! Thanks so much for this. You are all kinds of awesome.

[AKmalamute]

Excellent! Thanks so much for this. You are all kinds of awesome.

Thank you, and you're welcome.

Obviously the spacer is going to be popular, so I've ordered three sets in aluminum, and one in stainless steel. In addition to filling out everyone's orders to date, it will give me a chance to find out what the real-world to-me price is. So I'm not going to invoice anybody until I know what the "correct" number is.

Meanwhile I'll try to find time to research shipping logistics, and probably next weekend start collecting orders for round two. Folks that submitted an order, I already have pertinent information but as you can see, the price will go up a bit, the moreso if you want the spacers for a "solid block of metal" look -- which I have to admit, sounds sexy.

[Loligagger]

What sort of thickness/plate options could be available for round 2? Things like the full 21mm case thickness or the universal design (with the full hand adapter) would be quite nice.

[Latin00032]

My body is ready for round two.

Can holes at the bottom of these cases be counter sunk so the screw doesn't hang out as far?

[jdcarpe]

My body is ready for round two.

Can holes at the bottom of these cases be counter sunk so the screw doesn't hang out as far?

You can quite probably countersink the holes by hand with a drill.

[Glod]

My body is ready for round two.

Can holes at the bottom of these cases be counter sunk so the screw doesn't hang out as far?

You can quite probably countersink the holes by hand with a drill.

also can try this as long as there are 3mm holes
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42772.msg1249174#msg1249174

hint: look halfway down my topic

[Latin00032]

My body is ready for round two.

Can holes at the bottom of these cases be counter sunk so the screw doesn't hang out as far?

You can quite probably countersink the holes by hand with a drill.

also can try this as long as there are 3mm holes
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42772.msg1249174#msg1249174

hint: look halfway down my topic

I may very well seriously consider doing one of these.

[effnish]

When the pricing settles out let me know what I owe you. There's no need for you to cover any additional costs on my order. I expected a few surprises with this being a first round group-buy and I'm just happy to have a case for my 'Dox.

[AKmalamute]

Thanks effinish; currently I'm assuming / hoping the problem is primarily with the minimalist cases, and yours were full cases (for which I got a quote)

So ... Dorkvader your rework is done, will try to get that out tomorrow, but otherwise Monday it is. Also, miscommunication is the order of the day. When I emailed the request for JD's spacer to be produced, I couched it in wording to the effect of "can you double check the price is really close to what you said it was? Because I want 21 of these and 7 of those"

And he understood it to be primarily just a price-check email, so nothing's been sent anywhere.

As it's Friday afternoon I said to go ahead and put the order off -- the full spreadsheet of prices will (/should) come to me Monday and I can update my OP then, and order the spacers, etc.

"Over time, and over budget"

in the 'everything, everywhere' category ...

How about 'what is a geek hack group buy', Alex?

[Thechemist]

Everything came in undamaged, thanks. Now I just need the spacers.

[AKmalamute]

Meanwhile, I've heard nothing from the manager. I even texted him. I'll drive out there tomorrow at lunch break, see what I can find out.

Two delivered, I believe? Dorkvader's is en route -- maybe somebody with a nonbroken camera can provide some better pictures.

[Thechemist]

I will post some pics in the morning if it doesn't rain.

[effnish]

Mine came in undamaged as well. I spent quite a bit of time playing with different configurations and I think I like the minimalist case the best. The other option I like is discarding the top layer for a 8-layer (4/side) case. That layout provides nice symmetry and I like having the port expander and teensy exposed as well as the sides of the PCB.

I probably won't have time to post any pictures until this weekend but I'll try and get some up of different configurations of the 10 plates. If anyone's interested, I could probably mock up a fully-enclosed case.

[oystein.krog]

Got my package today, superb packaging!
Here are some quick phone snaps of the unpacking:
https://plus.google.com/photos/113252364984901542714/albums/6002590458757933985

Sorry for the bad quality.

Minimalist:


Classic:


IMO it looks really good
I would love to see more pictures, especially fully mounted!

Edit:  fixed pictures to prevent confusion, I got the spacer mixed up, the classic is ofcourse 5 layers, not 4

[AKmalamute]

So, I have spoken with the manager, and he _did_ get my text message but was out sick yesterday, thus no quotes.

I've gone ahead and ordered the spacers, but as before haven't heard any confirmation. Nevertheless I've submitted an order, and hope they'll be in maybe friday but more likely Monday. Also I asked for a full workup quote wise so I'll know what to expect and can, I hope next week, update the OP and throw open the flood gates for round two.

 Thanks for the photos oystein.krog its a lot better than my camera could have done. FWIW the shop manager asked for photos too, of what it looks like fully assembled, so we've piqued his interest.

[tbc]

I'd hate to be more difficult, but how customizable will R2 be?

my planned purchase as of now:
2x plate
2x spacers
10x bottom plates

all SS

why?

I want to keep the stock acrylic plate from my MD ergodox, put a spacer under it, and then stack 3-5 plates with no cutouts (maximum density).  I would have to find my own bolt/screws of course.  the pates would be just in case.  I am really confused about pricing, so that will obviously affect what I want.

[AKmalamute]

I'd hate to be more difficult, but how customizable will R2 be?
[...]

 I mentioned that something like this might be brought up, and the project manager chuckled and suggested I let you buy, in this case, five full-kits "And if they don't want the extra pieces, they don't have to use them"

Which of course would, in stainless steel, be upwards of $325 or more.

But I did mention that there would be requests like this, so my next step is to wait for the quote sheet to come in and try to make sense of where your requests and their prices can meet each other.

On the plus side, five SS kits would well exceed MOQ for the shop so I could make a special run for you

[yuiop]

case looks awesome from pics.  Can't wait for Round 2

How many layers of spacers do we need to complete a 5 layer case?  Are the spacers the same thickness as the main layers, 1.5mm?
iirc typical acrylic ergodox case consists of 3-5-5-5-3 layers = 21mm total.
I'm just trying to wrap my head around how this would look with spacers....

[jdcarpe]

case looks awesome from pics.  Can't wait for Round 2

How many layers of spacers do we need to complete a 5 layer case?  Are the spacers the same thickness as the main layers, 1.5mm?
iirc typical acrylic ergodox case consists of 3-5-5-5-3 layers = 21mm total.
I'm just trying to wrap my head around how this would look with spacers....

It would have 7 spacer layers and 3 layers from the original, all in 1.5mm SS. So 15mm total.


P.S. I love your GotP avatar!

[Latin00032]

Mine came in undamaged as well. I spent quite a bit of time playing with different configurations and I think I like the minimalist case the best. The other option I like is discarding the top layer for a 8-layer (4/side) case. That layout provides nice symmetry and I like having the port expander and teensy exposed as well as the sides of the PCB.

I probably won't have time to post any pictures until this weekend but I'll try and get some up of different configurations of the 10 plates. If anyone's interested, I could probably mock up a fully-enclosed case.

I'd like to see pics of how well it can be put together.

[yuiop]

case looks awesome from pics.  Can't wait for Round 2

How many layers of spacers do we need to complete a 5 layer case?  Are the spacers the same thickness as the main layers, 1.5mm?
iirc typical acrylic ergodox case consists of 3-5-5-5-3 layers = 21mm total.
I'm just trying to wrap my head around how this would look with spacers....

It would have 7 spacer layers and 3 layers from the original, all in 1.5mm SS. So 15mm total.


P.S. I love your GotP avatar!

Thanks! I've had this avatar forever I just need to post more often lol.

I think I get it now. I might use the top and bottom layers from my acrylic case to add more thickness.

[Lugoues]

Thanks for running this AKmalamute even though I missed it!
If there are any dropouts I'd be happy to jump in!

[AKmalamute]

Thanks for running this AKmalamute even though I missed it!
If there are any dropouts I'd be happy to jump in!

No dropouts -- in fact, there's only one left to ship.

So, here's today's update: the project manager says he's about half finished with the quote writeup. And the spacer parts should be in Tuesday ... or maybe Wednesday.

So, I expect to have updated the OP with "correct" prices by next weekend, and will be able to accept R2 orders before May is here.

[Latin00032]

Thanks for running this AKmalamute even though I missed it!
If there are any dropouts I'd be happy to jump in!

No dropouts -- in fact, there's only one left to ship.

So, here's today's update: the project manager says he's about half finished with the quote writeup. And the spacer parts should be in Tuesday ... or maybe Wednesday.

So, I expect to have updated the OP with "correct" prices by next weekend, and will be able to accept R2 orders before May is here.

How can I get on R2?

[AKmalamute]

How can I get on R2?

Once I can comfortably update the pricelist in the OP I'll officially accept orders, and will probably cut that off with no more than a week of ordering. Although if I have to jump through hoops to up my Paypal xfer limit I may leave it open a bit longer. Can anybody speak to that? Like, how evil PP is? I'll look into it over the weekend.

Also the link in OP is still "live" and those folks already entered will get 1st dibs. Just watch this thread and you'll get warning enough as I can provide it.
if you guys entered your name/etc already, I still have that, and will create an invoice when I know the correct $$ amount so don't worry about falling off the map; I want to respond to everyone's enthusiasm by getting metal into the mail.

[Latin00032]

How can I get on R2?

Once I can comfortably update the pricelist in the OP I'll officially accept orders, and will probably cut that off with no more than a week of ordering. Although if I have to jump through hoops to up my Paypal xfer limit I may leave it open a bit longer. Can anybody speak to that? Like, how evil PP is? I'll look into it over the weekend.

Also the link in OP is still "live" and those folks already entered will get 1st dibs. Just watch this thread and you'll get warning enough as I can provide it.
if you guys entered your name/etc already, I still have that, and will create an invoice when I know the correct $$ amount so don't worry about falling off the map; I want to respond to everyone's enthusiasm by getting metal into the mail.

Shoot!

I didn't know I can put my order in now.

I just did.

Thanks.