Linux, vim, and the Poker's escape/tilde combination

[hashbaz]

I need a portable keyboard, and so far I'm loving my Poker.  However, the combination of the escape key with tilde is unfortunate because I use both tilde and escape a lot.  I want escape to be a single keystroke because vim is my text editor of choice.  I also need frequent access to tilde since I'm on Linux (and because tilde and backtick are useful commands inside vim).

Turning on the Poker's escape lock mode plus an alternate vim mapping for tilde/backtick works inside vim, but screws me in a terminal when I need to type ~/foo/bar/whatever.

Remapping caps lock to escape seems promising, but at work I already have caps lock mapped to the Windows key (which I use for shortcuts for my window manager, xmonad).

Any ideas, geekhackers?  Do you just get used to fn+escape eventually?

[fossala]

emacs? :nerd:

[Dali]

inb4 vim vs. emacs holy war.

[hashbaz]

emacs? :nerd:

You kid, but I've actually considered it as a solution when using the Poker.  In fact I've given emacs a couple of serious tries over the years.  I always come home though to my true love.

[theferenc]

You could use xmodmap to remap those keys system wide (assuming you're using an X environment, anyway). You said you remap `~ within vim, so that should be a viable option.

I can help with xmodmap, if you need it. Basically, just use xev to find the scancode of the key you want to become backtick and tilde, and then run something like

Code: [Select]

xmodmap -e "keycode  22 = grave asciitilde"

[dorkvader]

theferenc,thanks for the xmodmap thought, I had been poking around for a good solution for my keyboards, and that might be it. I think it may be better than editing my xkb symbols folder

[hashbaz]

You could use xmodmap to remap those keys system wide (assuming you're using an X environment, anyway). You said you remap `~ within vim, so that should be a viable option.

I can help with xmodmap, if you need it. Basically, just use xev to find the scancode of the key you want to become backtick and tilde, and then run something like

Code: [Select]

xmodmap -e "keycode  22 = grave asciitilde"

Thanks for this.  I'm using xmodmap already to map caps lock to mod4.  But I don't currently have a good idea for which key(s) to remap to tilde/backtick, inside vim or otherwise.  I suppose I could also remap escape to something else (other than caps lock)  Any thoughts?

[daerid]

Just remap caps to escape. It will make your life as a vimmer much better, believe me.

[theferenc]

The only key that looks even remotely usable is the Application key, honestly. This is one of the primary reasons that I prefer the HHKB layout: it gives me an extra key along the top row, relative to the poker.

But yeah, that application is basically useless, so you can easily map it to that. Just use xev to find out what its keycode is, and sub it in for the 22 in the command I gave you.

[daerid]

Idunno man, I couldn't do without my context menu key. I'd give up capslock any day of the week before I'd let go of that apps key.

[hashbaz]

Just remap caps to escape. It will make your life as a vimmer much better, believe me.

I had caps lock mapped to escape for years, but now I use it for xmonad.  I could of course move the xmonad key, but that doesn't solve the problem.

[willi]

However, the combination of the escape key with tilde is unfortunate because I use both tilde and escape a lot.  I want escape to be a single keystroke because vim is my text editor of choice.  I also need frequent access to tilde since I'm on Linux (and because tilde and backtick are useful commands inside vim).

Remapping caps lock to escape seems promising, but at work I already have caps lock mapped to the Windows key (which I use for shortcuts for my window manager, xmonad).

 
Looking at poker layout I could say the same. Missing escape key is omission. Also, one more function key is necessary. I use HH lite 2 and find it as it should be, regarding layout. If it would be blank kb, nothing could stop user from tweaking with .xmodmaprc.
At the moment, I'd just use it as it is. Press function and tilde. Or wait for blank version, if it ever come.
Best regards all.

[pyro]

It should be possible to remap shift+esc to ~, why not just do that?

[komar007]

It should be possible to remap shift+esc to ~, why not just do that?

That's exactly how I did this, but I remapped it on the hardware side (my own keyboard project).
It works very well, because you still have esc and tilde as usual, but on the same key, and backtick can always go to the second layer.
But I don't know how to do this with xmodmap.

[mR_fRag`]

A init script in VIM. You can remap caps lock to Esc in VIM and to windows key in the desktop. Do you try that solution?

[daerid]

I also rocked Ctrl+[ for a while, that worked pretty well since I hated reaching for the esc key

Sent from my HD7 using Board Express

[hashbaz]

I also rocked Ctrl+[ for a while, that worked pretty well since I hated reaching for the esc key

This is probably what I'll end up doing.  Shame though, since on the Poker escape is so close (and yet so far)!

[hashbaz]

It should be possible to remap shift+esc to ~, why not just do that?

This is actually the first thing I tried, but I quickly realized that it's not sufficient, even just for vim, because it doesn't work while editing commands (e.g., ":e ~/path/to/file.cpp" is basically untypeable because you have to go out of esc lock mode, type tilde, then go back into esc lock).

And besides that, I also need tilde and backtick outside of vim, so I'd need to do this remapping at the OS level, and I'm not sure that xmodmap can do that.  (Maybe theferenc knows?)

A init script in VIM. You can remap caps lock to Esc in VIM and to windows key in the desktop. Do you try that solution?

I still need the caps/windows remapping even inside vim.  And since I used xmodmap to do the mapping, as far as vim is concerned the caps lock key is the Windows key, and I don't think vim can map the Windows key at all (this is a bizarre oversight given vim's emphasis on customization).

[hashbaz]

I wish that in escape lock mode fn+esc would give you tilde/backtick.  That would make this much easier.

I also tried mapping `` to escape inside vim.  This is OK, but means I still have to hit fn-tilde to escape out of prompts and :commands.

[sordna]

Why don't you remap the often useless Menu key to tilde/underscore ? That's what I'm doing:
xmodmap -e 'keycode 135 = grave asciitilde'

[hashbaz]

Why don't you remap the often useless Menu key to tilde/underscore ? That's what I'm doing:
xmodmap -e 'keycode 135 = grave asciitilde'

theferenc also suggested this, and I'm giving it a try now.  I think it might be the solution -- thank you!

[theferenc]

xmodmap is definitely your friend. I'm going to try and see what I can do with Fn layer remapping tomorrow with a HHKB, which might also be useful for this problem.

I know the function layer sends keycodes, so they *should* be remappable. What I don't know is if the "empty" keys on the function layer send anything. If they send some random unmapped value, that would also be very useful, I would think. Admittedly, there are likely differences between the HHKB controller and the Poker's controller. Unfortunately, while I do have the HHKB to play with, I don't have access to a Poker at the moment. I'll ask around, maybe one of the students in my department has one.

[mSSM]

I have my CTRL key remapped to CapsLock, and in turn Escape is mapped to L-CTRL. There, problem solved!

[hashbaz]

So what's tilde/backtick?  Left ctrl?

[mSSM]

Nope, that one is just going to be at the same old position.

So, I technically have:
+ Esc mapped to L-CTRL
+ CTRL mapped to CapsLock
+ Tilde/Backtick at the standard location (Esc is no longer in the top left)

[Xuan]

why don't you remap the "real" windows key to tilde, capslock to mod4, and tilde to esc? all with xmodmap

[hashbaz]

Nope, that one is just going to be at the same old position.

So, I technically have:
+ Esc mapped to L-CTRL
+ CTRL mapped to CapsLock
+ Tilde/Backtick at the standard location (Esc is no longer in the top left)

Ah, got it.  I misread your first post.  Cool.

[hashbaz]

why don't you remap the "real" windows key to tilde, capslock to mod4, and tilde to esc? all with xmodmap

That would work.  What I ended up with is capslock as mod4 and Menu key as tilde, and I put the Poker in escape mode.

[mSSM]

Yeah, the Mod4 works too, of course. For me, I am using Mod4 heavily for my Window Manager (such as spawning terminals, moving around windows, etc).

[hashbaz]

Yeah, the Mod4 works too, of course. For me, I am using Mod4 heavily for my Window Manager (such as spawning terminals, moving around windows, etc).

Me too.  Xmonad?

[mSSM]

Me too.  Xmonad?

Haha, indeed! How could you tell?

[sordna]

That would work.  What I ended up with is capslock as mod4 and Menu key as tilde, and I put the Poker in escape mode.

+1

[mSSM]

I don't seem to be able to turn off my Caps_Lock key. I have tried putting "clear Lock" in a file and sourcing it with xmodmap. I have also tried executing "$ setxkbmap -option caps:none". Running "$ xmodmap" actually tells me that there is nothing mapped to Caps_Lock, but when I hit it the LED still lights up and all my characters are in Caps out of a sudden.

What did you guys do to solve this?

[hashbaz]

This is what I have in my .Xmodmap to turn my Caps Lock into another Windows key:

Code: [Select]

remove Lock = Caps_Lock
clear mod4
add mod4 = Caps_Lock

[alaricljs]

As long as you're not removing/inserting keyboards then here's what I did:

Code: [Select]

clear Lock
keysym Caps_Lock = Mode_switch

No more capslock for me... and now I have an extra modifier.

[mSSM]

Ok, deactivating CapsLock works now. Next step is to map Escape to CTRL_L. Any ideas how this could be achieved?

[Trueno86]

My KBC Poker is coming in the mail, so I've been doing some research.  I'm a heavy vi/vim user on OSX, and to get used to it I have this setting:

Map tilde key -> Escape if no modifier and ~ if you use shift tilde
Caps Lock -> back tick / tilde (still experimenting)
Escape -> to NOTHING - to force myself to use the new keys on the Macbook Pro's keyboard.

This small app lets you do this:

pqrs.org/macosx/keyremap4macbook/list.html

Here is the setting:
i.imgur.com/JA8N0.png

(Can't have http or link in images for some reason)

So far so good in vim today.  Hope it works out for me or else I might have to sell the Poker and get a tenkeyless (Can't go noppoo choc mini because of OSX issues (although I am pretty confident that if I got my hands on one I could build a driver...)) We'll see how the poker goes.

[mSSM]

I have actually found a solution to my mapping problem from 33:

So the following removes Caps_Lock, maps CTRL to it, and also maps ESC to left CTRL:

Code: [Select]

clear Lock
clear Control
! This would usually be Caps_Lock; on Thinkpads, however, for some reason the Caps Lock key is always recognized as VoidSymbol
! add Control = Caps_Lock
add Control = VoidSymbol
keysym Control_L = Escape

I am pretty happy with this combination. Sometimes I am getting confused where all my keys are at, but that's partially due to the reason that I have used a German-Layout keyboard for a couple of months, and I am missing the muscle memory.

[7bit]

I need a portable keyboard, and so far I'm loving my Poker.  However, the combination of the escape key with tilde is unfortunate because I use both tilde and escape a lot.  I want escape to be a single keystroke because vim is my text editor of choice.  I also need frequent access to tilde since I'm on Linux (and because tilde and backtick are useful commands inside vim).

Turning on the Poker's escape lock mode plus an alternate vim mapping for tilde/backtick works inside vim, but screws me in a terminal when I need to type ~/foo/bar/whatever.

Remapping caps lock to escape seems promising, but at work I already have caps lock mapped to the Windows key (which I use for shortcuts for my window manager, xmonad).

Any ideas, geekhackers?  Do you just get used to fn+escape eventually?

You need a terminal emulator, or a Tipro!
To be serious:<---- this is where your Escape/~ key is
You never need a Windows key in X11!
Some people use Caps Lock as Escape.
If you had a keyboard with the backspace split up and moved down (where \| is on the Poker) you could move ~ to the right.

I can't help it, but your keyboard simple as too few keys!

Consider getting a Phantom.

[zzspectrez]

I wish there was a modern space saving equivalent of the Northgate Omnikey series with dip switches to do all the remapping of  tilde/esc caps/control/alt keys in hardware. Then I wouldn't have to mess with all this crappy software key remapping every time I switch computers.

[fossala]

I wish there was a modern space saving equivalent of the Northgate Omnikey series with dip switches to do all the remapping of  tilde/esc caps/control/alt keys in hardware. Then I wouldn't have to mess with all this crappy software key remapping every time I switch computers.

Teensy and get your hack on?

[sordna]

I wish there was a modern space saving equivalent of the Northgate Omnikey series with dip switches to do all the remapping of  tilde/esc caps/control/alt keys in hardware. Then I wouldn't have to mess with all this crappy software key remapping every time I switch computers.

The Kinesis Advantage, as well as some keyboards by Comfort Keyboard Systems (rubber dome though) are remappable without software. I could be wrong, but I think the only mechanical keyboard in production today with this feature is the Kinesis Advantage. It has 2 independent fully programmable layers, and you can program macros too, all from the keyboard itself. I love it.

[fossala]

The Kinesis Advantage, as well as some keyboards by Comfort Keyboard Systems (rubber dome though) are remappable without software. I could be wrong, but I think the only mechanical keyboard in production today with this feature is the Kinesis Advantage. It has 2 independent fully programmable layers, and you can program macros too, all from the keyboard itself. I love it.

Never owned a Kinesis but I have heard that making certain macros or key swaps with the board can produce unexpected results.
http://www.sixproducts.com/2008/01/27/kinesis-advantage-keyboard-and-learning-dvorak/
I didn't originally read it there it is just what came up when I searched for it.

[sordna]

Never owned a Kinesis but I have heard that making certain macros or key swaps with the board can produce unexpected results.
http://www.sixproducts.com/2008/01/27/kinesis-advantage-keyboard-and-learning-dvorak/
I didn't originally read it there it is just what came up when I searched for it.

I've only done 2-3 macros, and didn't notice any problem, if there is a way to reproduce a problem I'd be interested to know.
I do use the key remapping heavily for years now, and I can say that key remapping is easy and flawless.

[theferenc]

That feature of the kinesis is one of my absolute favorites. If only we could replicate that functionality ourselves. It seems like it should be easy, but...

[flyball]

You never need a Windows key in X11!

citation needed

[hashbaz]

Yeah I use Win all the time for my window manager (xmonad).

[captain]

I think we need to design a new keyboard based on the MacBook Air keyboard.  If it weren't for the damn scissor switches, I think the layout is perfect!  The little arrow keys are fine, the ~ and ESC are where they are supposed to be.  The half-height ESC and F-keys really is not big deal.  The only problem is maybe that space-bar still wastes to much keyboard real estate.  We really ought to be able to toss in several keys in that loooooong spot.  Then again, doing so would probably mess up gaming.  So, maybe Apple's amazing industrial designers really have the perfect layout!  Now, let's just implement it in a Cherry MX Blue keyboard!  :-)

[keebler64]

You kid, but I've actually considered it as a solution when using the Poker.  In fact I've given emacs a couple of serious tries over the years.  I always come home though to my true love.

Hurray! Another VI(M) Lover! I wrote my College English 1 Final on VI... "My VI is Better Than Your WYSIWYG."

Only thing going on with emacs is it's use of LISP. (By that I mean, LISP is the language of our future Robotic Overlords, I welcome them with open arms.... Thank you John McCarthy!)

emacs has it's place and usage for those who enjoy it.

But for me, I take solace in the fact that VI is on every *nix I've ever used. I cannot say the same about emacs.

[rknize]

Wow...old thread.  This is the main reason I don't use my Poker (keyboard) much.  I get why they did it and it's nice that the Poker has all standard keycaps as a result.  I don't use vi much, but I still use Esc often enough to want to lock it on.

Waiting for my Race....