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Author Topic: Dim KBC Poker LED's  (Read 2046 times)

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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 15:44:46 »
I've tried rebooting, a different USB port as well as different cables but still the LED's for the FN layer arrow keys function are half as bright as the other LEDs. This problem just started occurring months after I took delivery of my Poker, seems like it's not getting enough voltage? There was also a period when the LEDs would flash or not even turn on.

Brendan
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Offline net2522

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #1 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 15:49:02 »
Might be LED itself that has a problem.
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #2 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 16:33:34 »
All 5? The Esc and Cap Locks keys are fine though.
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Offline mkawa

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #3 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 16:36:09 »
that's pretty odd. do you have a multimeter?
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Offline Brendan

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« Reply #4 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 16:45:37 »
Yeah I was going to probe them when I have time. Left a message with Vortex as well, see what they say.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #5 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 17:23:53 »
Quote from: Brendan;563766
Yeah I was going to probe them when I have time. Left a message with Vortex as well, see what they say.

Do they just appear dim from certain angles, supply pics.
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Offline Brendan

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« Reply #6 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 17:40:31 »
No, I took the caps off and compared, they are maybe 50% of  the brightness of the other LEDs. Will take pics after a reboot, as they are completely off right now.
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Offline net2522

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #7 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 17:44:25 »
similar to this pic. this was from race 75%  someone said about the led quality.
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #8 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 18:26:49 »
Overall pic:

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 46838[/ATTACH]

Escape and Caps Lock:

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 46839[/ATTACH]

FN Arrows (Dim):

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 46840[/ATTACH]

FN Arrows (Half brightness):

[ Attachment Invalid Or Does Not Exist ] 46841[/ATTACH]

The lighting isn't consistent and keeps on flickering or worse, turns off.

Brendan
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Offline tp4tissue

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #9 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 21:36:27 »
Quote from: Brendan;563856
Overall pic:

(Attachment Link) 46838[/ATTACH]

Escape and Caps Lock:

(Attachment Link) 46839[/ATTACH]

FN Arrows (Dim):

(Attachment Link) 46840[/ATTACH]

FN Arrows (Half brightness):

(Attachment Link) 46841[/ATTACH]

The lighting isn't consistent and keeps on flickering or worse, turns off.

Brendan

Ah, definitly check with the multimeter..

if the voltage is lower than the brighter led, look for a resistor, and see if a replacement would help

Unless they don't bother setting up resistors for these keyboards leds anymore.
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #10 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 21:53:19 »
Confirmed with multimeter (voltages across LEDs):

ESC Key = ~2.823 V
Caps Lock = ~2.822 V
Space Bar = ~2.666 V
Left Arrow = ~2.662 V
Down Arrow = ~2.663 V
Right Arrow = ~2.666 V
Up Arrow = ~2.666 V

Bear in mind I have NO idea what the specs are for the LEDs, but there is enough of a drop to be significant.

Brendan
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #11 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 21:58:30 »
Just measured a drop to 2.496V, I'd say the brightness level is similar to my 'dim' ref pic. One more thing, I used a Fluke 87 to measure the voltages, while not as accurate as bench meters, I'd say its more than enough for this task. Looks like I'm SOL, board is multilayered, can't check traces, nor can I replace any one component.
« Last Edit: Sun, 01 April 2012, 22:02:17 by Brendan »
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Offline mkawa

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« Reply #12 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 21:59:33 »
the flickering is what worries me. can you follow the traces back from the affected LEDs to the controller and check for cold joints along the way?
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Offline Brendan

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« Reply #13 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 22:06:52 »
I can't even do that, the PCB is multilayered, there are no naked traces, nor are the traces silkscreened on.
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Offline tp4tissue

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« Reply #14 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 22:12:38 »
Quote from: Brendan;564137
I can't even do that, the PCB is multilayered, there are no naked traces, nor are the traces silkscreened on.

I think they probably daisy chained a bunch of the leds to a single resistor.  so they won't have a single resistor for each LED

You PROBABLY have to only replace a single or maybe 2 resistors..

can you find ANY of the resistors??


Because it is unlikely that so many leds are bad together. so there is likely a single root cause..

You could actually replace ALL the resistors if you like, since then you could be sure that takes them out of the equation..
but, this is only possible if they're NOT doing one resistor per led, .
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Offline mkawa

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« Reply #15 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 22:15:49 »
ok. my guess is that there is a cold joint either between that bank of LEDs and ground or that bank of LEDs and the keyboard controller. i think the only other possibility is that the keyboard controller is plain bad (but that seems less likely). if it were mine, i'd try to reflow everything i could find between these points. hopefully vortex can help you though.
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #16 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 22:18:59 »
I could only trace these two resistors directly connected to the LEDs, unless I can find a schematic or more infor, that is all I have (see the third pic for what I mean):

R15 (ESC) = 2.184V (voltage drop for the resistor?)
R13 (Space Bar) = 1.742V (voltage drop for the resistor?)







Brendan
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Offline Brendan

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« Reply #17 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 22:22:22 »
I am going to  try and see if I can get a reply from Vortex before and reflowing.
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Offline mkawa

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« Reply #18 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 22:36:47 »
good call, and good luck!
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #19 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:00:39 »
Quote from: Vortex Keyboard
yes, If you want change Res(R13) , maybe now is 1.5K ohm , you can change to 330 Ohm (0603 size)

Hmm?
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #20 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:06:53 »
Yep, confirmed again. I guess I will try that and void my warranty in the name of flickering LEDs.
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #21 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:47:56 »
Well fvck. That's just great, seems like I'll be a pro at replacing LEDs and SMF's on my Poker throughout its lifetime. ()%*@&(%@*.
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Offline limmy

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #22 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:49:43 »
My poker also had a LED problem in that cluster -- a single LED failure affected all four LEDs in the cluster (space bar and arrows).

Shortly after I swapped stems on a right shift key, the LEDs in the cluster didn't light up. I replaced the right shift key LED with working LED and it worked fine. It was an easy fix because I knew which of the four may have gone wrong.

I don't know much about resistor and how led brightness are controlled, but I know the cluster is bound together from my experience. If it worked fine and suddenly didn't work, then it may be possible some of the LEDs have gone bad.

I hope it helped.
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Offline metafour

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #23 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:54:31 »
I just took some of those keys off my Poker and my LEDs seem to follow the same pattern of dimness. My Poker is pretty new. Design flaw?
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Offline Brendan

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #24 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:56:43 »
Looks like I have to pick one LED to try out of the 5, which one shall it be?



They are incredibly dim now, almost off. I'm going to talk to Vortex again, I recommend you tell them about it on their Facebook page (Vortex Keyboard).
« Last Edit: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:59:50 by Brendan »
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Offline limmy

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #25 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:57:34 »
Quote from: ripster;564261
Another reason not to do that  crazy lubing of MX stems.

Breaks stuff limmy!

I think it was static discharge that fried the LED.. Cheap synthetic carpet + dry environment = ESD danger!

The stem swap was well before I tried to lube MX stuff. Thanks for the concern though. I have to admit. Modding is not recommended for everyone.
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Offline Awful

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #26 on: Sun, 01 April 2012, 23:59:08 »
mine are the same way, my poker is like 2 weeks old. Good thing I dont EVER have any of the led locks on.
« Last Edit: Mon, 02 April 2012, 00:01:52 by Awful »
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Offline Brendan

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« Reply #27 on: Mon, 02 April 2012, 00:03:34 »
I mostly have them off, but arrow keys are fairly useful in Excel, so...

Post on their Facebook page and get them to change the design. poor LED binning/quality and crappy resistors are ruining the keyboards.
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Offline metafour

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« Reply #28 on: Mon, 02 April 2012, 00:05:25 »
Quote from: Brendan;564278
I mostly have them off, but arrow keys are fairly useful in Excel, so...

I don't use them in spreadsheets. Universal vim movement keys FTW! ;)
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Offline limmy

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Dim KBC Poker LED's
« Reply #29 on: Mon, 02 April 2012, 00:07:54 »
Is the keyboard attached to a USB hub? I think under powered keyboard is one thing to rule out before doing anything with soldering iron.
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