Center Stemmed Stepped Capslock discussion

[i3oilermaker]

Ok so I know this is a bit of a longshot...but after having my hopes and dreams crushed by SP in the moogle/creamcheese buy, I wanted to get a discussion going on how we could make this happen.

It seems like a chronic caps lock bumper has a few options:

1) Mod an off center stepped caps lock to be center stem.  It sounds like this is a bit messy and and doesn't always quite sit at the right height
2) Put a R3 1x1 key on the caps lock switch.  This is my current solution that I was hoping would be temporary.  It is ugly but effective.
3) Design and Mold a center stemmed stepped caps lock key that has a smaller step to allow for the key to be properly pressed.  My understanding is the mold fees can be around $4000-$5000 making this very expensive, but if we make 1000 of them, that could take the cost down to  5-6 bucks each.  I don't know if we have that kind of interest, but I would donate a few hundred to make it happen for now and all future sets.

Thoughts?  Other options? Criticism?

[jdcarpe]

We should commission someone (ClickClack?, boost?) to design a GeekHack custom stepped caps lock with a centered stem. Someone could mod an off-center stemmed, stepped caps lock to a centered stem, getting it to the correct height by trial and error (shaving a bit off the stem and re-gluing it). Then a mold could be made, and a custom design could be applied to create a custom key. We could then have a GeekHack custom (skull?, SuperHero?) design on a center stemmed stepped caps lock, instead of only on the escape row profile. Would anyone else be interested in something like that?

[i3oilermaker]

We should commission someone (ClickClack?, boost?) to design a GeekHack custom stepped caps lock with a centered stem. Someone could mod an off-center stemmed, stepped caps lock to a centered stem, getting it to the correct height by trial and error (shaving a bit off the stem and re-gluing it). Then a mold could be made, and a custom design could be applied to create a custom key. We could then have a GeekHack custom (skull?, SuperHero?) design on a center stemmed stepped caps lock, instead of only on the escape row profile. Would anyone else be interested in something like that?

I would pay big bucks for such a key if it was done correctly.

[boost]

Sounds like a PITA...but if someone is willing to donate a stepped cap lock with a center stem that is in the perfect spot we can try it.

[shawn o]

You would want to find a 1/3 stepped caps lock off something like a cheap HP rubberdome and use that for a mold.

Something like this (from google search). Seems like a waste to me when you can get genuine Cherry flat ones easily.

[jdcarpe]

Seems like a waste to me when you can get genuine Cherry flat ones easily.

The problem is with people who accidentally bump the caps lock key on when trying to type an 'a' character. Which is why the stepped caps exists in the first place.

[i3oilermaker]

You would want to find a 1/3 stepped caps lock off something like a cheap HP rubberdome and use that for a mold.

Something like this (from google search). Seems like a waste to me when you can get genuine Cherry flat ones easily.[/IMG]

The problem with that approach is the rubber dome key is not going to be cherry profile. We basically need to take a center stem caps lock key mold it and the modify the mold the be stepped down just past where it would clear the switch.

[The_Ed]

Seems like a waste to me when you can get genuine Cherry flat ones easily.

Easy - yes. Expensive - also yes. Especially when they're brand new like I like them. I'll have 1 new cherry un-stepped capslock, along with 3 new cherry bottom rows to sell soon. I don't understand how people accidentally hit the capslock key. I would think it would be easier to learn how to NOT hit the capslock than to pay a few thousand dollars to get a special capslock made. The owner of that HP keyboard needs to learn how to wash their hands.

[Maarten]

1) Mod an off center stepped caps lock to be center stem.  It sounds like this is a bit messy and and doesn't always quite sit at the right height

You just need a tiny little bit of skill to do any stem swap/mod. Its not rocket science really.... And the height issue can be addressed, to quote myself;

The higher placement is because you are not able to bottom out all the way, so the cap's sleeve will not slide down as far over the switches stem as its supposed to cuz the caps shoulder bottoms out on the switch housing before the switch does. You either have to mod the cap so it can bottom out properly (remove dangerous amounts of plastic from the inside of the shoulder), remove plastic from the top of the switch housing (weakening the housing so it could break when pulling caps off) OR you could use my patented center-stem-modded-stepped-caps-mounting-trick (tm)!

This trick actually involves dis-assembly of the board in question and modification of the actual capslock switch so it is not for the faint of heart. Basically what you do is when looking at the back of the PCB use the pointiest hobby/x-acto knife you can find and drill a tiny little hole in the mounting base of the switch (the plastic round thing you should be able to see sticking out of the back of the PCB). Put a little toohpick through the hole to prevent the switches stem from moving to the actuating position and press down your modded capslock cap, it will now slide all the way over the switches stem like you want it to. When doing this, be very careful that you dont get any plastic inside the housing as it could mess up the switch functionality very very easy.

[shawn o]

Easy to find a brand new Cherry keyboard for $100 or so with a center stemmed, flat, caps lock. $100 = a complete set plus a full keyboard of switches to harvest.

[The_Ed]

A "complete set"? Relegendables make it an INCOMPLETE set...

Basically what you do is when looking at the back of the PCB use the pointiest hobby/x-acto knife you can find and drill a tiny little hole in the mounting base of the switch (the plastic round thing you should be able to see sticking out of the back of the PCB). Put a little toohpick through the hole to prevent the switches stem from moving to the actuating position and press down your modded capslock cap, it will now slide all the way over the switches stem like you want it to. When doing this, be very careful that you dont get any plastic inside the housing as it could mess up the switch functionality very very easy.

I thought of that ages ago, but am too lazy to type that much except in PMs. That fixes height, but still doesn't give you full depression.

[IvanIvanovich]

If a new one was to be made, it would need a larger 'top' 1.5 as shown in shawn o example instead of the 1.25 that Cherry used. You would end up with a much smaller step that way, but it would work much better for clearance.
Best solution for a constant accidental caps hitter... disable it with switch lock or via software and quit worrying about keycaps.

[AKIMbO]

Ok so I know this is a bit of a longshot...but after having my hopes and dreams crushed by SP in the moogle/creamcheese buy, I wanted to get a discussion going on how we could make this happen.

It seems like a chronic caps lock bumper has a few options:

1) Mod an off center stepped caps lock to be center stem.  It sounds like this is a bit messy and and doesn't always quite sit at the right height
2) Put a R3 1x1 key on the caps lock switch.  This is my current solution that I was hoping would be temporary.  It is ugly but effective.
3) Design and Mold a center stemmed stepped caps lock key that has a smaller step to allow for the key to be properly pressed.  My understanding is the mold fees can be around $4000-$5000 making this very expensive, but if we make 1000 of them, that could take the cost down to  5-6 bucks each.  I don't know if we have that kind of interest, but I would donate a few hundred to make it happen for now and all future sets.

Thoughts?  Other options? Criticism?

I'll do off-center to center stemmed mods for $6 a key (1 week turn around time) for any Geekhack member.

Option #3 (getting a new mold) would be the best...although prohibitively expensive. We would have to have a massive geekhack community group buy to fund it.

[Maarten]

That fixes height, but still doesn't give you full depression.

True, true.... For that there's also a solution but that involves quite a bit of board modding (aka placing the switch sideways, led hole under the caps shoulder).

Still, a keycap that sits at the correct height but cant be fully pressed still beats one that sits too high AND cant be fully pressed

[The_Ed]

True, true.... For that there's also a solution but that involves quite a bit of board modding (aka placing the switch sideways, led hole under the caps shoulder).

Still, a keycap that sits at the correct height but cant be fully pressed still beats one that sits too high AND cant be fully pressed

Hadn't thought about turning the switch... That's simple, but brilliant. And all you would need is a few wires to restore connectivity. I Had thought about moving the switch to the center to just use flat caps. But that wouldn't be too easy for platemount boards. Turning the switch in platemount boards could become the next great mod that everyone does.

[Maarten]

That's simple, but brilliant.

Oh plenty more where that came from If you have a really really tight fit on the caps-shoulder you can even remove the two ribs (look at the switch and you'll know what i mean). If you do that then you need as good as no space at all between the cap stem and the shoulder (just about 1mm would do almost to bottoming out all the way).

[thurst0n]

Sorry to bump an old thread I hope this is kosher 

Did this idea die? I would be very interested, Probably would want more than one..


@The_Ed I can only speak for myself, I do not hit caps Key inadvertently during typing but during gaming sessions I kinda use it to find the keys. Starcraft is my main game and it does.t even matter if caps lock is On or off but when my pinky hits both keys it throws my rhythm off. Stepped key for me is much preferred for gaming.

[i3oilermaker]

Nope, you can buy one here: www.techkeys.us/custom-keys.php

[TheBinary]

Nope, you can buy one here: www.techkeys.us/custom-keys.php

Just ordered mine 2 days ago 
However it looks like the USPS has decided to take an extra 2 days on this package 
In any case I look forward to trying it out soon!

[thurst0n]

Nope, you can buy one here: www.techkeys.us/custom-keys.php

yah I saw that but wasn't 100% Sure it was center stem. I'll take your post as That confirmation..please stop me if I'm wrong.

just sayin I'd still be interested in a geekhack version

[Melvang]

Can someone post a pic of the bottom of the center stem stepped key  from techkeys?

[i3oilermaker]

http://imgur.com/a/xN0LN#0

This is the Ripster guide.

[Melvang]

if these are available from SP why are they not offered with GB's like Sanc or did the set i bought just not have one?

[i3oilermaker]

They came with the Raindrop set.  They are relatively new, and somewhat costly.

[Melvang]

Gotcha thanx for the quick info i3oilermaker.  I don't doubt they are pricey due to the new mold.  I was actually wondering if you could mold a cherry stem into the bottom of the cap at both the center and the offset position and have the stem be removable.  This way it would work on both types of keyboard.  Also could be done to the reg flat caps lock key.  Which I would have come up with that idea before this thread got started.  Not to change what you had done, I think it is wonderful.  I prefer the look of the stepped but have a center stemmed Das.  But either way thanks a ton for the work you have done here.

Melvang

PS is your avatar name in reference to the drink or your job? 

[i3oilermaker]

I don't think this would work for several reasons, first if you look at ripsters picture comparing the center to the off center, they stems overlap.  Secondly, the additional stem would not clear the switch housing.

My avatar is of my first custom key, but my name refers to the Purdue Boilermakers of which I am an Alum.  I do like the drink as well

[Melvang]

The method i was thinking of trying wasn't to have 2 key cap stems but have 2 switch stems in the bottom of the cap.  The cap stem would then have the reg "+" mount hole on top and bottom.  If you want to move your cap from an offset board to a center stem board just pull the cap, pull the stem off the cap, replace on the other location.

[i3oilermaker]

Something like that would require a new mold, possibly 2 and would cost well over $7,000 for SP to do.