Anybody use 3M Vertical Mouse or Pen Mouse?

[vivalarevolución]

I'm in the market for a new mouse and I'm considering a vertical mouse or pen mouse, along with some other options:

1.  http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/ergonomics/home/products/ergonomicmouse/



2.  http://www.fentek-ind.com/penclic.htm#wireless_penclic.  Something like that, but maybe not that particular model.



My concerns with a pen mouse is that switching from typing to picking up and using the pen mouse would getting annoying.

With the vertical mouse, my concern there is desk space as compared to a trackball, which I don't have to move around my desk. Also it does not seem to be ambidextrous, which is a must if I am buying a mouse.

Can anybody that has used these items describe their experiences?

[vun]

Have you considered a small tablet? Seems like a better alternative to option 2, although with the pen mouse you can reduce desk space used by cranking up the dpi/sensitivity whereas a tablet requires a fixed amount of space.

[vivalarevolución]

Have you considered a small tablet? Seems like a better alternative to option 2, although with the pen mouse you can reduce desk space used by cranking up the dpi/sensitivity whereas a tablet requires a fixed amount of space.

Do you mean using a tablet instead of a laptop, or using a pen mouse on a tablet surface? Is there such a thing?

[inteli722]

I believe he means something like a Wacom Graphics Tablet. They can be used as a mouse with a pen on a surface, rather than a traditional mouse.

[vun]

Have you considered a small tablet? Seems like a better alternative to option 2, although with the pen mouse you can reduce desk space used by cranking up the dpi/sensitivity whereas a tablet requires a fixed amount of space.

Do you mean using a tablet instead of a laptop, or using a pen mouse on a tablet surface? Is there such a thing?

As in a graphic tablet, like the Wacom Bamboo.

[vivalarevolución]

I believe he means something like a Wacom Graphics Tablet. They can be used as a mouse with a pen on a surface, rather than a traditional mouse.

I never have used something like that.  My main purpose of a different mouse is to relieve hand pain during mouse use.  I already have a Rollermouse for work, but I'm looking at a different option for home.  Those Wacom tablets seem more appropriate for a person working with photos and graphics.  Thanks for the suggestion.

[vun]

I believe he means something like a Wacom Graphics Tablet. They can be used as a mouse with a pen on a surface, rather than a traditional mouse.

I never have used something like that.  My main purpose of a different mouse is to relieve hand pain during mouse use.  I already have a Rollermouse for work, but I'm looking at a different option for home.  Those Wacom tablets seem more appropriate for a person working with photos and graphics.  Thanks for the suggestion.

They can just as well be used as a mouse if you have problems with hand pain, RSI and whatnot. The Bamboo Pen & Touch also doubles as a touchpad.
Considering that several ergonomic mice mimic pens I see no reason why you wouldn't just get a tablet that has a proper pen instead of a mouse that's trying to be a pen.

[fohat.digs]

I absolutely love my Wow Joy Pen, and REALLY wish that they made a left-hand version.

I got a Chinese knock-off for under $20 delivered.

They have stiff switches, which I switched out with replacements from an old Logitech ball mouse, and it was a big improvement.

I had an Evoluent and hated it, everything about it was all wrong, the biggest problem was that it was too upright. Neither vertical nor horizontal is best, in my opinion, I would estimate that the Joy Pen is a little more than 45 degrees upright.

[vivalarevolución]

They can just as well be used as a mouse if you have problems with hand pain, RSI and whatnot. The Bamboo Pen & Touch also doubles as a touchpad.
Considering that several ergonomic mice mimic pens I see no reason why you wouldn't just get a tablet that has a proper pen instead of a mouse that's trying to be a pen.

I agree with your logic, and having the tablet would be useful if I ever get interested in the other uses of the device (I can feel a photography phase on the horizon).

Do these tablets integrate functions like scrolling and right click with the use of the pen?  If I have to use multi-touch gestures on the tablet surface, I would not prefer that because I have found the use of touchpad is a source of my pain and not comfortable on the wrist.

[vivalarevolución]

I absolutely love my Wow Joy Pen, and REALLY wish that they made a left-hand version.

I got a Chinese knock-off for under $20 delivered.

They have stiff switches, which I switched out with replacements from an old Logitech ball mouse, and it was a big improvement.

I had an Evoluent and hated it, everything about it was all wrong, the biggest problem was that it was too upright. Neither vertical nor horizontal is best, in my opinion, I would estimate that the Joy Pen is a little more than 45 degrees upright.

Yea, the lack of ambidextrous use is what turns me off about most vertical mice. If I use one hand for the mouse for too long, I start to have pain. I've seen setups in which people have a different mouse of either side of the keyboard, and that might be something I should consider.

[fohat.digs]

That's what I do. When I got the Joy Pen (about October of last year) I set it on the right, and kept my ambidextrous Microsoft Wheel Mouse on the left.

Later, I got a left-hand Evoluent and tried hard to use it for several weeks, but just couldn't make it happen.

Having mice on both sides is great! Give it a try, everybody has several old mice in a drawer somewhere.

[vivalarevolución]

That's what I do. When I got the Joy Pen (about October of last year) I set it on the right, and kept my ambidextrous Microsoft Wheel Mouse on the left.

Later, I got a left-hand Evoluent and tried hard to use it for several weeks, but just couldn't make it happen.

Having mice on both sides is great! Give it a try, everybody has several old mice in a drawer somewhere.

Having two mice sounds tempting, but I try to prevent myself from becoming a hoarder.  I'm going down that path with all these keyboards.

[vun]

They can just as well be used as a mouse if you have problems with hand pain, RSI and whatnot. The Bamboo Pen & Touch also doubles as a touchpad.
Considering that several ergonomic mice mimic pens I see no reason why you wouldn't just get a tablet that has a proper pen instead of a mouse that's trying to be a pen.

I agree with your logic, and having the tablet would be useful if I ever get interested in the other uses of the device (I can feel a photography phase on the horizon).

Do these tablets integrate functions like scrolling and right click with the use of the pen?  If I have to use multi-touch gestures on the tablet surface, I would not prefer that because I have found the use of touchpad is a source of my pain and not comfortable on the wrist.

There are two buttons on the pen that you can bind to whatever you want, for instance right click and middle click(for scrolling), and you can also bind the eraser on the top.
The tablet also has a few physical buttons that you can bind.

Also, I don't think having several pointer devices and rotating between them is a bad thing if you have pains, since using differently shaped input devices means the strain isn't always on the same parts. At least by my logic. Personally I switch between mice fairly regularly, and I have a trackball on the left side of my board.

[islisis]

Need more time to write a review, but I just received a wireless penclic and it definitely performs the business. If you have thought well about implications of using a pen form factor mouse then I can say it will probably match your expectations. I hope the maker can listen to some feedback on it, some simple ergonomic ideas would enhance it greatly I feel - button placement, and most importantly adjustable height. You don't have to pick it up everytime as it leans on its base, which I would argue is its main feature. However, like other vertical mice there is still the issue of how do you move your hand around it when switching from the keyboard, and its unnecessary height gets in the way. Will definitely mod it, and replace the microswitches too.

[berserkfan]

Speaking of which, I really want some brave folks to try this out:
http://list.qoo10.sg/item/SUPER-PRICE-ANAPA-EROGNOMIC-VERTICAL/405673642

It's not expensive for me to get it, but obviously I want to be the  evil person who waits until somebody else tries this vertical mouse and produces a review.

[fohat.digs]

Speaking of which, I really want some brave folks to try this out:
http://list.qoo10.sg/item/SUPER-PRICE-ANAPA-EROGNOMIC-VERTICAL/405673642

It's not expensive for me to get it, but obviously I want to be the  evil person who waits until somebody else tries this vertical mouse and produces a review.

This looks very similar to the Evoluent mouse, which I hated.

Being so upright, pressing a button tended to move the mouse sideways, requiring an opposing force from the thumb. So, instead of involving one finger with a simple tap, it is more of a "pinching" action requiring both finger and thumb.

The Joy Pen leans at about 45 degrees toward the thumb, so the weight of the hand and thumb are working for you again.

[berserkfan]

you mean it leans towards you?

I am such a moron. I assumed 3M would want its logo to be facing you - the way it is with my logitech and Kensington mice.

[fohat.digs]

This is not the exact one I bought, but it looks the same. Great price, too, if you can wait a couple of weeks.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Ergonomic-Design-WOWPEN-Vertical-USB-Optical-Mouse-JOY-Wrist-Pain-hot-USB-/171013447452?pt=Mice&hash=item27d1321f1c

[islisis]

Speaking of which, I really want some brave folks to try this out:
http://list.qoo10.sg/item/SUPER-PRICE-ANAPA-EROGNOMIC-VERTICAL/405673642

It's not expensive for me to get it, but obviously I want to be the  evil person who waits until somebody else tries this vertical mouse and produces a review.

no need to wait

It's a good mouse, best (true, non 45deg) vertical mouse after evoluent, dxt and penclic for claw grip users imho. I have the wireless version. I had to open up one of the microswitches due to contact problems. Great performing wheel and battery life (2xaaa) too.

[islisis]

ah just to add... the thumbwell is shaped similarly to the evoluent making the mouse too broad, so that problem is still not solved. I have also seen extremely marked up oem versions with a thumb button (the generic versions just have an indent).

[blueSmoke]

I second the wowpen joy. The link from the japanese site also looks similar and I think I have seen similar chinese copies on ebay.

One issue with the wowpen that I have found so far is flimsy construction, feels empty inside but nothing is broken till date. Putting a piece of plastic/rubber inside may fix this. There are two forward|back buttons at the bottom left side that are not in correct position ergonomically and sometimes get clicked by hitting with keyboard edges. The last one is probably me, the palm angle is around 60 degrees (?) from horizontal and my palm drops flat at that angle if I take the mouse out, but holds steady at about 70 degrees. So need some mouse angle adjustment. Can be fixed by modding the case, but after I get another one.

Bottomline is this is a better one than the evoluent. Evoluent is too upright and bulky even though the newer ones have a nice pinky lip.

The 3M mouse is a weird one. cant believe a company like 3M forgot to put a scroll wheel on it! On second thought there is not much space to put a scroll wheel in the current design. I modded mine by putting a thumb operated scroll wheel at the top edge. With this mod this is an excellent mouse, but looks ugly. Use both while switching every couple of days.

I saw a different vertical mouse somewhere in the interweb, exact copy but had scroll wheels and may be few extra buttons, but did not save the link as it was pretty pricey. Look around.

[Findecanor]

I tried the Penclick at a trade show a couple of weeks ago. It felt flimsy and imprecise and it was difficult to align the fingers to the mouse buttons.

I use a WowPen Joy as my primary mouse. I don't think that it feels flimsy. The shape may look weird, but feels like any other mouse to me, just a bit more slanted. The buttons are too hard, so I replaced them with lighter switches from an old Logitech wheel mouse.
I used to use an Evoluent VerticalMouse at work. I found it to be OK for office work, albeit a big big. The "prediction" where it auto-aligns the movement of the mouse pointer to the X and Y axes is something that I found annoying.

[fohat.digs]

It took a while to fall into the right way to "drape" my hand across the diagonal-leaning mouse.

Once I realized that the last 2 fingers could be off the mouse, I discovered that to be an advantage for precise positioning.

And yes, those forward/back thumb buttons on the bottom are annoying. I disconnected them when I upgraded the switches.

[berserkfan]

AHA!!!!!

You mentioned maintenance problems!

Please elaborate!

(I am simply not tech savvy enough to open up microswitches or whatever.)

Speaking of which, I really want some brave folks to try this out:
http://list.qoo10.sg/item/SUPER-PRICE-ANAPA-EROGNOMIC-VERTICAL/405673642

It's not expensive for me to get it, but obviously I want to be the  evil person who waits until somebody else tries this vertical mouse and produces a review.

no need to wait

It's a good mouse, best non-evoluent vertical mouse imho. I have the wireless version. I had to open up one of the microswitches due to contact problems. Great performing wheel and battery life (2xaaa) too.

[islisis]

Please elaborate!

(I am simply not tech savvy enough to open up microswitches or whatever.)

well, they are cheap microswitches, though nice and light feeling. chances are they will work without issue, but for one button the action did not feel right to me so I popped off the cover and bent the contact slightly

[berserkfan]

OK, this is enough tech for me not to buy!

If I popped off the cover I would have absolutely no idea what to do. How you even managed to identify the right switch, is something beyond me!

Please elaborate!

(I am simply not tech savvy enough to open up microswitches or whatever.)

well, they are cheap microswitches, though nice and light feeling. chances are they will work without issue, but for one button the action did not feel right to me so I popped off the cover and bent the contact slightly

[fohat.digs]

The only hard part is removing existing solder to change out switches.

A mouse only has a very few moving parts. If you look at the plastic surfaces that you bend with your fingers, there can only be one area where they press down each little switch.

Wheel carriages are more complicated and tricky - I just leave them alone if possible.

[islisis]

I tried the Penclick at a trade show a couple of weeks ago. It felt flimsy and imprecise and it was difficult to align the fingers to the mouse buttons.

while the thumb buttons are accessible, the middle click definitely is not, so if this was to be your primary mouse remapping would be a must. unfortunately i'm using three mice together now so independent mapping becomes a bit of a project to accomplish :/

i do hope this company comes out with a second revision with bigger and lighter buttons. Even the current model is quite useful, I'm quite impressed how well it tracks, you can perform gestures like lightning. Rail flicking in games is even interesting If only the price could reflect its build quality more.