Help a n00b choose a new keyboard

[Special K]

Hello everyone, I discovered this forum while browsing Anandtech and thought I'd ask for a new keyboard recommendation here.

For as long as I have owned a computer (1997 or so), I have always used the basic, plain keyboards that come packaged with pre-built systems such as Dell, Gateway, etc.  Right now I am using a basic 4-year old Dell PS/2 keyboard that came with my system.  I use my PC for gaming, and the one aspect of this keyboard that bugs me the most is that some of the keys get stuck unless you hit them dead-center.  Do all keyboards behave this way, or just the cheap ones?  I believe the technical term for the type of keyboard I have is "bubble-dome"?  I took it apart for cleaning once and saw a rubber mat with domes in it.  Also, it seems to take an unnecessarily high amount of pressure to press the keys.  I feel like there should be something with "faster" keys out there.

I also used a Dell "clackey key" keyboard at a job once, although the noise was kind of irritating, plus I'm not sure if these would be a good choice for gaming.

Here is a summary of what I am looking for in a keyboard:

1. ability to hit keys slightly off-center without them sticking
2. quick key response for gaming
3. some tactile feedback without being overly noisy
4. n-key rollover (I'm not sure what number to substitute for 'n'; I mainly play FPS games if it helps any)
5. a "standard" layout - no "ergonomic" alterations or drastically re-arranged key layouts
6. I am indifferent toward backlighting - if the keyboard has it, then great; if not, it's not a big deal to me; I don't need to look at the keyboard to type, and I live alone, so I can't think of any situation in which I would have to type in the dark anyway
7. I'd rather not have one of the loud clackey keyboards, as I think that would get annoying after awhile.  Plus, wouldn't these have a relatively slow response, and not be ideal for gaming?
8. I don't think I would use lots of macro/multimedia keys, but they would always be nice to have if possible

Initially I was considering the following 2 choices:

Logitech Illuminated Keyboard
Microsoft Sidewinder X6

However, after reading around these forums for awhile, I found a few that I had never even heard of before that might meet my requirements:

Steelseries 7G
Deck Legend
ABS M1
Das Keyboard

Would any of these be good choices for me?  Are there any other good keyboards for me that I didn't list?

Thanks

[Alpha Omicron]

No "clack"!? Away, heathen!

[ozar]

Welcome to the forums!

The ABS M1 was on sale for $44.99 at both ChiefValue.com and NewEgg.com last week, but I'm not sure if the sale is still going on.  I'd personally recommend against the Logitech and Microsoft boards that you mention above, but others might disagree.

[Special K]

No "clack"!? Away, heathen!

Well if any gamers on the forum want to speak up and say that the clack keyboards are in fact fast enough for FPS, then maybe I might change my mind.  I'm just going from memory and my limited experience using one several years ago.

[ozar]

Here you go... you can check this thread regarding the sale on the ABS M1:

http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?t=5842

[Viett]

Out of personal experience, I would NOT recommend an ABS. Many people, including myself, have gotten boads with serious rollover issues. Even hitting three keys at once would lock it up. Also, if that Dell you once used was a Dell AT101W, it would be very similar, as they have the same switches.

You might be interested in "gamer grade" black cherry keyboard. The Deck, Steelseries 7G, Gigabyte GK-K8000, and the Filco (*M (tactile) or *ML model) are all great choices. The Das has a click to it, so it may not be the 'board for you.

Personally, I use a Dell AT101W for gaming, and it doesn't bother me so much. The tactility is extremely nice for typing, though.

[ozar]

I like the switches in the Dell AT101W a little better than those in the ABS M1, but several others here seem to prefer the switches in the M1.

[itlnstln]

While I was a completely avid Nostromo user in my FPS days, if I had to chose a keyboard for gaming, I would go for the Filco with Cherry browns and NKRO.  They have some tactility, but nothing that would be prohibitive to a little button mashing.  That, and it is very nice to type on.  I think I would find something like a Steelseries or a Deck a little tiring as the black switches are much heavier than the browns, and I also prefer tactility when I type.

[o2dazone]

I'm currently gaming on a brown cherry Filco. It's not bad at all. Maybe my senses aren't fined tuned enough, but I hardly feel any tactility in the brown switches, just a very light bump half way through. Which is fine, I don't come from a "tactile-driven" background anyways, as my first mechanical were Cherrys. That said, they're great to mash, and great to type on.

[iMav]

Cherry browns and the Topre capacitive switches would be my top two choices for gaming.

[wellington1869]

I think with your points 1 thru 7 you basically described a Topre.

You might like the Das though.

[ozar]

Special K, in the end it's hard for anyone to know what you'll like the best, so your best bet is to try as many different types of switches as you can to see what feels best to you.  Not always so easy to do though, as all of us here know from experience.

The Topre switches are great, but could be a costly mistake if you don't like them.  Chances are that you could sell the board here, though.

[MANISH7]

I suggest Cherry Brown switches. Light so it's not tiring when you're mashing keys, not too noisy as you wanted, and you can acquire it for relatively cheap price.

Buy the Compaq MX-11800 in the forum marketplace for $15+shipping (I'm not seller btw). Try it and if the keyboard works for your needs then keep a watch on Ebay for a NIB Compaq. They come every now and then. Last week I just brought some BNIB for $20 (although I got real lucky). When the deal shows up, buy it, and then sell your used one back here at the forum (you'll easily get your money back within a few months). Or, if you don't like the keyboard because of N key rollover issues, at least you get to try Brown Cherries. If you like the brown cherries, order a Filco (+$100 though, this is why I recommended Compaq at 1/5 price). If you don't - then at least you didn't lose money.

I play COD4 with the Compaq and so far N key rollover has never restricted me. YMMV but you can't lose with the Compaq IMO.

[IBI]

The off-center thing is just the nasty behavior of your current keyboard, most keyboards (rubber dome or mechanical) don't do it (unless you're talking about extreme angles of course).

Dell clackity keyboard. Hmm, that was probably either a dell-branded model M or a Dell AT101/AT102. I believe the latter is much more common (and is the quieter of the two) so I'll assume it was that one.

The AT101/AT102 uses black alps switches, which is what the switches in the ABS M1 are based on so if you didn't like that then the M1 might not be the best choice for you.

Full n-key rollover is nice to have, but unless you're noticing major problems with certain combinations of keys not registering on your current keyboard then I'd make it a minor issue as it'll severly restrict your choice.

Virtually all mechanical keyboards are fairly loud, although some are more clackity than others (I believe the AT101/AT102 is actually one of the least clackity since mine has a fairly clean sound compare to my Model M and K1). So the may be all out for you.


Mostly though, as ozar said, it's really just up to you to find a type of keyboard that you like. I'm a keen gamer but responsiveness means nothing to me. I've gamed on everything from cheap rubber dome keyboards to good rubber dome keyboards to black alps to black cherries to a Model M and they're all the same to me - as long as the keys go down reliably I don't notice any difference. (Typing is a different matter)

Do you type a lot? A lot of the recommendations here are for people who want something that's very nice to type on. If that's not an issue then something a lot cheaper might well do.

p.s. Which country as you in? A lot of the more niche keyboards tend to be only sold by vendors in one or two countries so you might want to try ones you can get locally first before you go to the expense of importing.

[cmr]

in my opinion the perfect keyboard for you would be an apple extended keyboard ii, as long as you can find one of the quieter ones.

[MANISH7]

but it definitely won't help you attract members of the opposite sex

for that i have two NIB vintage model Ms :lol: :lol:

[MANISH7]

rofl...:lol:

reminds me of that john hughes movie weird science...

two geeks create the perfect woman...classic teen movie :lol:

[bigpook]

Why do women do whatever it is they do to their lips? They don't look right, and its so obvious that something was done to them.

[ozar]

Why do women do whatever it is they do to their lips? They don't look right, and its so obvious that something was done to them.

Maybe it's silicone implants.

[ozar]

Webwit, I liked the one you posted the other day that was wearing the glasses and she had that hypnotic vision thing going for her.

[Manyak]

[ozar]

That girl does have nice genes, but still not sure why my wife thinks I'm looking at porn when I'm on at GeekHack.  :typing:

[wellington1869]

Pah! Another thread hijacked!

seems like all it takes is boobs

[Special K]

Wow, I never would have guessed my thread would get so many replies.  Although thanks to the pics I will probably have to refrain from checking this thread from work from now on :laugh:

I read through everyone's recommendations and here is a list of what I saw, along with prices and some questions and comments:

ABS M1 - $59.99 right now @ Newegg
Deck Legend - $159 - can backlighting be disabled/turned down? (EDIT: a review claimed there are 7 different backlight intensity settings, including off)
Steel Series 7G - $123.85 @ Amazon - giant palm rest
Filco *ML model - $115 - n-key rollover only when used w/ PS/2 adapter (not USB)
Filco *M Tactile - $129
Das Keyboard Pro - 12-key rollover - $129
Compaq MX-11800 - wow, that is one ugly keyboard; I think it also violates my "standard layout" requirement
Scorpius M10 - $50 on Amazon, but poor reviews complaining about poor quality

From doing an informal survey of the results, it seems a brown cherry keyboard such as the Filco models recommended above would be a good place to start?  I do like the look of the Das Keyboard Pro and the Deck Legend the best though.

Oh yeah, I'm in the US.  Surely I can find something sold here so I don't have to resort to overseas ordering and shipping?

[Special K]

While I was a completely avid Nostromo user in my FPS days, if I had to chose a keyboard for gaming, I would go for the Filco with Cherry browns and NKRO.  They have some tactility, but nothing that would be prohibitive to a little button mashing.  That, and it is very nice to type on.  I think I would find something like a Steelseries or a Deck a little tiring as the black switches are much heavier than the browns, and I also prefer tactility when I type.

Is this the keyboard you are recommending:

http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=filco_keyboards,majestouch_104key&pid=fkbn104meb

[Special K]

Cherry browns and the Topre capacitive switches would be my top two choices for gaming.

Can you recommend any specific models?

[wbopal7]

For cherry browns there would be the filco, and for Topre switches there is the Topre realforce 86u and 87u. The HHKB has similar switches. The link for the filco you pasted above is the correct one; it is the only filco that has n-key rollover and tactile switches

[Special K]

Do you type a lot? A lot of the recommendations here are for people who want something that's very nice to type on. If that's not an issue then something a lot cheaper might well do.

I'd say my typing is pretty "typical" - emails, web browsing, chat, basic MS office docs, etc.  I don't type long papers or anything.  Is there something much cheaper out there, or are these recommended keyboards worth the money?

[Special K]

For cherry browns there would be the filco, and for Topre switches there is the Topre realforce 86u and 87u. The HHKB has similar switches. The link for the filco you pasted above is the correct one; it is the only filco that has n-key rollover and tactile switches

Actually both of the Filco's linked in this thread claim to have n-key rollover:

http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=filco_keyboards,majestouch_104key&pid=fkbn104meb
http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=filco_keyboards,majestouch_87key&pid=fkbn87mleb

[wbopal7]

Personally, I would go for the Filco. The Topre is probably too expensive for most people to justify. While I have never typed on a Filco, I do own a compaq mx11800 which has the same switches, as mentioned earlier. If you do end up buying the Filco then it should last quite a while. If it really has to be cheaper, I think the abs m1 would be fine for your purposes, just no nkro, which may or may not impact your gaming.