[IC] Cospar SA (GB DEC 1st! - NEW GB FORMAT!)

[MiTo]

Wonder how Elrick is going to cope since seems to support these SA keysets from MiTo with a fervor.

Elrick doesn't support my SA designs. Elrick supports good SA designs. My design getting his attention is just a consequence, of a deep thinked combination of colors, legends, icons, texture and profile - as always.

Elrick and every other supporter will be just fine. After all, this is the Internet.

People can't ban anyone from anywhere.

[BunnyLake]

Wonder how Elrick is going to cope since seems to support these SA keysets from MiTo with a fervor.

Elrick doesn't support my SA designs. Elrick supports good SA designs. My design getting his attention is just a consequence, of a deep thinked combination of colors, legends, icons, texture and profile - as always.

Elrick and every other supporter will be just fine. After all, this is the Internet.

People can't ban anyone from anywhere.

oh how wrong you are on that one

i can and will ban anyone associated with you in any way, they will be IP banned on ctrlalt, and added to my ignore list here among other measures we have in place

[MiTo]

Another thing that I want to mention is that I finally got a color ring.

It will be here in a couple of weeks, so we don't have those problems with color accuracy we had with PuLSE. You know, the blue barbecue.

Since I don't have any plans on working with PBT anytime soon, the ABS one with the color samples is going to work fine.

[BunnyLake]

mito, you are the scum of the ****ing earth, keep running around the net posting **** about me, see how it goes for you

to everyone else, no i do not intend to track everyone down who buys the set, but i will be watching any thread mito starts, and anyone who posts anything in it showing any signs of interest and support, will be banned from ctrl alt

see this post

so you piece of ****, you wanna run around the internet calling me bumlake, thats fine, we can play this game if you like

im just gonna draw a line in the sand here

anyone seen to be supporting/buying anything mito does from now, is banned from ctrlalt, that means banned from the store, giveaways, gbs and bro caps sales

you can say im being petty, but i dont want to deal with anyone who is either gullible enough to fall for this guys bull****, or complacent enough to deal with him anyway

if you wanna get an idea for who the person you are dealing with or defending is, just flick through his posts, every post will be one of 2 things, either him being a **** to people, or him blowing himself

if you wanna support the guy that made pulse a success, follow jd, if you want cospar, leave raindrop out in the sun for a few hours

[MiTo]

As I mentioned later on, the keypuller child deal is going to be included on Cospar's group buy.

It will be the same featured on their keycap store:

I spoke to PMK and she (Melissa) confirmed that they can totally include the pullers on the group buy for only $1.50 each.

[Moralless]

As I mentioned later on, the keypuller child deal is going to be included on Cospar's group buy.

It will be the same featured on their keycap store:

Show Image

I spoke to PMK and she (Melissa) confirmed that they can totally include the pullers on the group buy for only $1.50 each.

Those keycap pullers are cheap and horrible to work with. But I'm not surprised you'd want something like that in your group buys.

[HoffmanMyster]

I've been very lenient in this thread letting it go for as long as it has, but the personal attacks from both sides need to stop.  Any further posts in this thread that are not directly related to feedback in the IC phase of this keyset will be removed and the poster will be warned.  All further off-topic posts must be contained to their relevant threads, or PMs.  Even the ones that are instigated from non-geekhack locations.  No exceptions.  If you take issue to this, I'm happy to discuss via PM, as always.

Alright, I'm going to give a final reminder to take off-topic posts elsewhere.  I know we all have strong feelings towards this situation, but this IC is not the place.  The word is out for anyone considering joining this, and that's all that needs to be done in this thread.  Please take any further discussion to their relevant threads or to PMs.

[MiTo]

Those keycap pullers are cheap and horrible to work with. But I'm not surprised you'd want something like that in your group buys.

Oh, thanks for the warning.

In this case, we'll stick to the wired ones.

They are a little bit more expensive than the plastic ones ($5) but as you are suggesting, they'll work better.

[MiTo]

OP is updated, including more precise infos. Check it out!

[Grendel]

Very nice, I like it ! Looks like this will become my 1st SA set.

[DzyDzyDino]

.

[MiTo]

Very nice, I like it ! Looks like this will become my 1st SA set.

We are scheduled to launch on December 1st!

Also, as mentioned on OP, I'm redesigning Colemak and Dvorak packages.

If my Internet is working when I get home, I'll update OP again with better images.

[MiTo]

Yes. I'm so in on this.

I'm glad you like it, I'm trying my best to bring you a very nice new keyset.

Make sure to check OP in order to get updates about the group buy format we're going with.

[MiTo]

Hey guys, long time!

I need your help, Colemak and Dvorak users.

Could you please provide me a picture of these layouts, so I can properly look into the add-ons?

[agbockus]

Hey guys, long time!

I need your help, Colemak and Dvorak users.

Could you please provide me a picture of these layouts, so I can properly look into the add-ons?

I'm not a Colemak or Dvorak user - but I found some images that could probably be helpful:

Colemak:


Dvorak:

[MiTo]

Hey guys, long time!

I need your help, Colemak and Dvorak users.

Could you please provide me a picture of these layouts, so I can properly look into the add-ons?

I'm not a Colemak or Dvorak user - but I found some images that could probably be helpful:

Colemak:

Show Image

Dvorak:

Show Image

I was using these two, actually.

But I'm afraid I'm missing something since I've never used Dvorak or Colemak.

[agbockus]

Hey guys, long time!

I need your help, Colemak and Dvorak users.

Could you please provide me a picture of these layouts, so I can properly look into the add-ons?

I'm not a Colemak or Dvorak user - but I found some images that could probably be helpful:

Colemak:

Show Image

Dvorak:

Show Image

I was using these two, actually.

But I'm afraid I'm missing something since I've never used Dvorak or Colemak.

I tried learning Dvorak. Honestly, I've seen "adapter" sets what just have replacement deep dish keys for the home keys (like F and J on qwerty).  I think it was available for Granite R2?

Yeah, is the package that they offered on MD.
It covers T & N for Colemak, and then the U & H for Dvorak.

[MiTo]

I tried learning Dvorak. Honestly, I've seen "adapter" sets what just have replacement deep dish keys for the home keys (like F and J on qwerty).  I think it was available for Granite R2?

Yeah,

Show Image

is the package that they offered on MD.
It covers T & N for Colemak, and then the U & H for Dvorak.

I never tried, actually.

This image you linked is the extra-homing package from Granite and we can't use that as an idea because Granite was DSA and DSA is completely flat.

Since we are going SA (2-1-2-3-4-3) with Cospar, the keys are angled, and can't be swapped just to fit these layouts positioning.

[agbockus]

I tried learning Dvorak. Honestly, I've seen "adapter" sets what just have replacement deep dish keys for the home keys (like F and J on qwerty).  I think it was available for Granite R2?

Yeah,

Show Image

is the package that they offered on MD.
It covers T & N for Colemak, and then the U & H for Dvorak.

I never tried, actually.

This image you linked is the extra-homing package from Granite and we can't use that as an idea because Granite was DSA and DSA is completely flat.

Since we are going SA (2-1-2-3-4-3) with Cospar, the keys are angled, and can't be swapped just to fit these layouts positioning.

Right, I got that.

Basically, the only way to keep the SA and make sure that Colemak and Dvorak is covered (it seems to me anyway), would be to make entire Alpha sets for each of them.

For example:
Dvorak would have
Row 1:  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 [ ]
Row 2:  ' , . p y f g c r l ? + \
Row 3: a u e o i d h t n s -
Row 4: ; q j k x b m w v z

All the other keys would be the same - such as backspace, tab, enter, shift, etc.

This would then all change for Colemak.

Right?

[MiTo]

Right, I got that.

Basically, the only way to keep the SA and make sure that Colemak and Dvorak is covered (it seems to me anyway), would be to make entire Alpha sets for each of them.

For example:
Dvorak would have
Row 1:  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 [ ]
Row 2:  ' , . p y f g c r l ? + \
Row 3: a u e o i d h t n s -
Row 4: ; q j k x b m w v z

All the other keys would be the same - such as backspace, tab, enter, shift, etc.

This would then all change for Colemak.

Right?

Exactly, I think that we can trust these both images.

The Alphas are indeed the only difference.

[cjhard]

Colemak has Backspace in place of Caps Lock per the picture. Your Colepak from PuLSE should have covered all the necessary addins for that layout to pair with a base Alpha set as I've mentioned on /r/mk. I came up with that list doing a linear scan through my own keyboard to identify keys that changed only row profile, as position can be swapped among the same row no problem. A similar pack for Dvorak would be as such:
1 { }
2 " < > F G C L ? +
3 O E U I T N _
4 : Q J K W
total 23 keys

If you end up doing a 60% stripe, Dvorak would be needing '[' & ']' on that row as well to not feel left out.

Some keys of Dvorak are also produced in Colemak in case you feel fusing them is wise

[MiTo]

1 { }
2 " < > F G C L ? +
3 O E U I T N _
4 : Q J K W

So, this is everything we need to cover Dvorak?

I don't think a 60% stripe is needed, let's see what others think. Also, I'm not sure about those two backspaces at Colemak, that seems weird.

[cjhard]

Also, I'm not sure about those two backspaces at Colemak, that seems weird.

Aye, and it just hit me the mods are all spacetalk anyway. Hard Over could just as easily be Control, Fn, Space, Backspace, Shift+F5, or anything else.
Also, I suggest somebody doublecheck my row-swap checks, for Dvorak and Colemak both, as I am drunk and likely to miss something.

[MiTo]

Aye, and it just hit me the mods are all spacetalk anyway. Hard Over could just as easily be Control, Fn, Space, Backspace, Shift+F5, or anything else.
Also, I suggest somebody doublecheck my row-swap checks, for Dvorak and Colemak both, as I am drunk and likely to miss something.

I'll bring the Dvorak and Colemak all-alpha add-ons tomorrow, hopefully they'll be correct.

We've got plenty of time to current them though, and then move to double check details.

[MiTo]

UPDATED OP, DECEMBER 1st CONFIRMED!

[Leimi]

Looks great, good job

Any chance of having a blanks set (at least for alphas)?

[MiTo]

Looks great, good job

Any chance of having a blanks set (at least for alphas)?

Commands, which are Row 3 blanks, are included!

Check OP!

[Mc_Masta_Hompus]

Are the prices going to be confirmed today?

[MiTo]

Are the prices going to be confirmed today?

Yes, stand by!

[renne]

Hi MiTo! When will you schedule a group buy for row4 shift? I'm looking forward to it!

[MiTo]

Hi MiTo! When will you schedule a group buy for row4 shift? I'm looking forward to it!

Hey Renne!

Will let you guys know as soon as Signature Plastics have the tooling to produce these keycaps up and running, ok? I'm really looking into that too, and I'm sure they're doing their best to bring these keycaps as soon as they can to us.

OP updated everybody.

What do you think about the price table?

[renne]

Hi MiTo! When will you schedule a group buy for row4 shift? I'm looking forward to it!

Hey Renne!

Will let you guys know as soon as Signature Plastics have the tooling to produce these keycaps up and running, ok? I'm really looking into that too, and I'm sure they're doing their best to bring these keycaps as soon as they can to us.

OP updated everybody.

What do you think about the price table?

Thanks! Also, why don't you try a 1-2-3-3-3-4 SA profile? Since people always want something different, right?

[MiTo]

Hi MiTo! When will you schedule a group buy for row4 shift? I'm looking forward to it!

Hey Renne!

Will let you guys know as soon as Signature Plastics have the tooling to produce these keycaps up and running, ok? I'm really looking into that too, and I'm sure they're doing their best to bring these keycaps as soon as they can to us.

OP updated everybody.

What do you think about the price table?

Thanks! Also, why don't you try a 1-2-3-3-3-4 SA profile? Since people always want something different, right?

I'm not absolutely sure, but I believe that Commando SA was 1-2-3-3-3-4. I know it's not sculptured, but I believe that it was the first SA keyset to feature Row 1 on the F-Row.

In the other hand, I don't think that Cospar's 2-1-2-3-4-3 was ever tried before!

[renne]

Hi MiTo! When will you schedule a group buy for row4 shift? I'm looking forward to it!

Hey Renne!

Will let you guys know as soon as Signature Plastics have the tooling to produce these keycaps up and running, ok? I'm really looking into that too, and I'm sure they're doing their best to bring these keycaps as soon as they can to us.

OP updated everybody.

What do you think about the price table?

Thanks! Also, why don't you try a 1-2-3-3-3-4 SA profile? Since people always want something different, right?

I'm not absolutely sure, but I believe that Commando SA was 1-2-3-3-3-4. I know it's not sculptured, but I believe that it was the first SA keyset to feature Row 1 on the F-Row.

In the other hand, I don't think that Cospar's 2-1-2-3-4-3 was ever tried before!

I mean, comparing to Pulse SA, their profiles are the same except F-Row.

[MiTo]

I mean, comparing to Pulse SA, their profiles are the same except F-Row.

Absolutely, I see your point.

We are choosing a sculptured profile again because some people totally hated the recently made "all flat Row 3"  SA keysets. They mentioned that the lack of ergonomics was a huge issue.

If we really go 2-1-2-3-4-3 with Cospar, and we probably will, I'll look into flatter profiles on my next projects, because aesthetically, at least, they look very good.

[renne]

I mean, comparing to Pulse SA, their profiles are the same except F-Row.

Absolutely, I see your point.

We are choosing a sculptured profile again because some people totally hated the recently made "all flat Row 3"  SA keysets. They mentioned that the lack of ergonomics was a huge issue.

If we really go 2-1-2-3-4-3 with Cospar, and we probably will, I'll look into flatter profiles on my next projects, because aesthetically, at least, they look very good.

Agree. I'd rather choose DSA than "all flat row3". Also, you said Cospar will be launched at the beginning of Dec, right? After you finish this GB, will you have some free time? I wanna talk about my ideas with you.

[Leimi]

Looks great, good job

Any chance of having a blanks set (at least for alphas)?

Commands, which are Row 3 blanks, are included!

Check OP!

Row 3 only sadly. I was talking about alphas

[MiTo]

Agree. I'd rather choose DSA than "all flat row3". Also, you said Cospar will be launched at the beginning of Dec, right? After you finish this GB, will you have some free time? I wanna talk about my ideas with you.

Yes, December 1st confirmed!

Absolutely, I'm willing to help and we can talk whenever you want to.

That's for you and everybody else, feel free to PM whenever you guys need a hand.

[renne]

Agree. I'd rather choose DSA than "all flat row3". Also, you said Cospar will be launched at the beginning of Dec, right? After you finish this GB, will you have some free time? I wanna talk about my ideas with you.

Yes, December 1st confirmed!

Absolutely, I'm willing to help and we can talk whenever you want to.

That's for you and everybody else, feel free to PM whenever you guys need a hand.

Great! Thanks!

[renne]

the modifiers kit seems very expensive...

[Puddsy]

that looks normal to me

[MiTo]

that looks normal to me

the modifiers kit seems very expensive...

Mostly because their legends are completely customized and therefore new molds are needed.

One way to chop down these costs by a margin is to use the same legend on both Alts and the same legend on both Controls.

But I believe that if we chose to do that, the set would become a little bit boring...

What do you guys think?

[bickle]

COOL!
I have always interested in your design.
Can you add blue enter(launch)?
Because I want to match the color of modifiers. 

Sure, will add to the Cospars.

Was it decided not to include blue Enter key? 

[MiTo]

COOL!
I have always interested in your design.
Can you add blue enter(launch)?
Because I want to match the color of modifiers. 

Sure, will add to the Cospars.

Was it decided not to include blue Enter key? 

Totally forgot about that, I'm so sorry.

The pictures featuring such key were probably lost somewhere, I'll fix that.

[renne]

that looks normal to me

the modifiers kit seems very expensive...

Mostly because their legends are completely customized and therefore new molds are needed.

One way to chop down these costs by a margin is to use the same legend on both Alts and the same legend on both Controls.

But I believe that if we chose to do that, the set would become a little bit boring...

What do you guys think?

Maybe normal alt, ctrl, shift, esc and enter in the modifier kit, and then create a novelties kit?

[cjhard]

Keep in mind at least hopefully there will be one modifier kit bought per alpha kit, of which there are three to buy. Alpha's will be split making it harder to achieve the tiers, but the mods will quickly climb the tiers if this proves to be a popular set.

[renne]

If you change the profile of qwerty row, asd row, and zxc row into the same, then you don't have to create 3 different alpha kits. And that might help the whole set to be tipped.

[cjhard]

But then you wouldn't have the sculpted profile, you'd have just another row 3 SA kit.

[MiTo]

Maybe normal alt, ctrl, shift, esc and enter in the modifier kit, and then create a novelties kit?

It is an option, but the Novelties would then be extremely expensive and sincerely they would never tip.

Also, if we decided to go with normal legends, Cospar would completely lose it's appeal.

I'm thinking about doing regular legends on Hoccard, which is another project I've got that share some details with Cospar.

[MiTo]

Keep in mind at least hopefully there will be one modifier kit bought per alpha kit, of which there are three to buy. Alpha's will be split making it harder to achieve the tiers, but the mods will quickly climb the tiers if this proves to be a popular set.

I see what you're talking about. Do you believe it was a good idea to split the Alphas?

Sincerely, I believe it was. 15 Dvos and 15 Colemakers is not too much and 25 QWERTYers neither. Because of that, 50 Modifiers would easily sell, but again, if Cospar proves to be popular enough.