Author Topic: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues  (Read 20262 times)

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Offline CPTBadAss

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Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« on: Sun, 31 August 2014, 23:08:14 »
Special thanks to 00zerO and mechanicalkeyboards.com for making this review possible. They loaned me a Keycool K5 keyboard, a test unit of the Keycool 87, which they had at their shop. I’ve wanted to try out some Kailh switches and I’m thankful they hooked me up.


If you don’t know already the Keycool 87 has the new MX clone switches, also known as MX compatible switches. They are made by the Kaihua Electronics Corporation who are based in Dongguan City in China. According to the Deskthority Wiki, they’ve been making MX clone switches since 2007, starting with their Kailh Yellow switches. One of the main differences between the Kailh and Cherry switches are the gold cross-point contacts. The Kailh switches don’t have these contacts.

Review Conditions
 
I typed on this keyboard for two weeks and I did not play any video games with them. I also regret to say I forgot to take a typing video with this board.
 
Case and Aesthetics
 
This board had black on white keycaps with a white case. The lock switches have LED windows in them. The feet are very solid and snap out with authority. They also are tipped with rubber.


The case is the standard block and thin bezel layout. If you’ve seen a QFR or FC700R or Filco, think that style of case. The distinctive feature on this case though is that the bezel underneath the spacebar is thicker and angled. So that edge has a nice fat chamfer on it. It’s a nice place to rest your thumbs.
 
A Keycool 87 weighs 775g or 1.709 lbs. In comparison to my Leopold FC700R, it’s much much lighter. The Leopold 700Rs weighs in at 946 g or 2.086 lbs. I really noticed a difference in typing feel when I was using this keyboard and I believe that weight is part of the reason. I didn’t get a chance to take off all the caps or take the board apart, nor do I think I should have since it was a loaner. I believe the case is a different material from the FC700R and the plate is as well. I have in my notes that I wasn’t even sure if the plate was metal. The lock switches have LEDs which are a pleasant blue. They’re the same tint of blue as the Filco indicator LEDs but not nearly as bright.

Overall, the case isn’t bad but it felt a little lighter and hollow. I prefer the cases of the Leopold FC700R or Filcos.
 
Keycaps
 
They’re medium thickness PBT, reminscient of the keycap thickness on the FC700R. I forgot to take a picture of the keycaps so you’ll have to take my word on it :(. The texture is like the SP DSA PBT keycaps: very rough and sandy. I’ve seen another reviewer describe the feeling as “pumice”. I really don’t know why you want to type on pumice and needless to say, the PBT caps aren’t for me. They’re nice quality though. Legends on the keycaps are lasered but the legends are a bit blurry. I guess that this is supposed to be the internet explorer symbol?
 

Closeup shot of the font

The Internet Explorer symbol was a little hard to see; a bit blurry

 
And the font is very odd. I couldn’t find the name of the font but I’ve seen it a lot. If you install the Chinese language pack for Windows XP or 7, your English text will look like this font. It’s thin and squished from the sides so the letters are taller than they are wide. It’s very distinctive to me. It’s not my favorite font, but it’s not the Vortex italic font so that’s a plus. I will say that the keycaps got dirty very quickly.

Switches

The Kailh Blues are modeled after Cherry MX Blues. For me I really wanted to see how closely the Kailh Blues felt to MX Blues. In terms of typing sound, the board sounded exactly like MX Blues. It was so similar that I felt that making a video might have been superfluous. However I’m still disappointed that I didn’t make one.

For those who love stats, here are the two switches compared:

More


Top picture is from the Keycool company and the bottom pictures are from the Cherry Corporation.


In terms of how the switches feel, at first touch, it felt a lot like MX Blues. The click and actuation force felt similar. However, after further typing, the switches felt a little like modified Clears; MX Clear stems paired with aftermarket springs with lighter actuation weights have a tendency to stick. A few of the caps, especially the modifier keys and insert, felt a little sticky. As if the reset point on the switches spring back at the same rate it was pressed down at. It’s not extremely apparent but it is there. The other thing that was odd to me was that the stabilizers were modeled after Cherry stabilizers/leveling kits as well. The Keycool modifiers felt mushy and sluggish, much more than the Cherry ones. I think that the switches aren’t a bad change from Cherry but the stabilizers aren’t as good as the original Cherry stabilizers.

The issue I’m having is the Keycool 87’s pricing. It’s priced slightly higher than some competing boards such as Cooler Master Storm Quick Fire Rapid, Ducky Zero DK2108 and Ducky DK1087. I don’t know if the keyboard is so good that it justifies the extra cost. I thought it was a solid keyboard but the switches were slightly lacking when compared to the Cherry MX switches. It the keyboard was priced a little lower, I think it would make more sense.

Final Thoughts

Overall, the Kailh Blues aren’t bad but I did have a few complaints with them. If they can fix the stabilizers on the modifiers and the sticky return feeling, I think they might be competitive.
« Last Edit: Sat, 01 November 2014, 02:09:44 by CPTBadAss »

Offline rowdy

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #1 on: Sun, 31 August 2014, 23:20:05 »
Thanks for the review!

I thought a major point in using Kailh switches was to lower the cost of the board.  Perhaps not.

My older KeyCool with MX reds has Costar stabilisers.  Interesting that they changed to Cherry-like ones.

I'm guessing from the photos that the case and keycaps are still whiter than white i.e. not an off-white or beige colour.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

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Offline hcry4

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #2 on: Sun, 31 August 2014, 23:51:06 »
Nice, helpful review. The MX Clear comparison and stickiness is very interesting to me. Thanks for the info.

Offline LechnerDE

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #3 on: Sun, 31 August 2014, 23:52:32 »
Thanks for doing this detailed review  :thumb:

I agree with Rowdy here:

Why settle for a copy if you could get the original for the same price?

Sounds like the Kalih switches are not total crap, but not quite the same in the end...

Offline PadawanGeek

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #4 on: Mon, 01 September 2014, 02:02:33 »
The pricing sort of reminds me of the Razer/Kailh switches on the BWU 2014 models selling for the same, or higher price than the 2013 models with Cherry switches (depending on where you're from, or where you can get them). KC 87 with Kailh switch at the same price as the original KC 87 with Cherry switch is a step back imo. So glad I'd snagged a KC 87 with Cherry Brown a while back....

Offline katushkin

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #5 on: Mon, 01 September 2014, 18:23:15 »
Thanks for this review man. I am glad KC haven't gone completely down the toilet, and the switches aren't complete trash, but as Rowdy has said, it is interesting that they have gone from costar to cherry esq stabs.

I think the price stems from the original Cherry boards, where the build quality was king and the switches were awesome. The switch to Kalih was for switch availability and to prevent them raising the price more AFAIK.

My KC22 should arrive some time this month, so I should be able to do a review of the Kalih Browns at some point.
Can we get them to build the Alps ten feet higher and get Cherry to pay for it?
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Offline sunshine

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 25 September 2014, 01:51:35 »
thanks for the detailed review~
cool~

Offline vivalarevolución

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #7 on: Tue, 30 September 2014, 14:52:57 »
Just saw this in your sig.  The long term reliability is definitely something I wonder about Cherry clones compared to Cherry switches.  We need to lock somebody in a room with some keyboards and just have them press the F key until it stops working to test this stuff.
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #8 on: Tue, 30 September 2014, 14:53:54 »
I think it's QWER who has the tester that will mechanically actuate keys to test lifespan. I wonder if we could get them to test out a board with Kalih switches. I've got one that I could put towards this cause.

Offline vivalarevolución

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kalih Blues
« Reply #9 on: Tue, 30 September 2014, 15:45:09 »
I think it's QWER who has the tester that will mechanically actuate keys to test lifespan. I wonder if we could get them to test out a board with Kalih switches. I've got one that I could put towards this cause.

I wonder how difficult it would be to make one of the testers...
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Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #10 on: Fri, 31 October 2014, 17:02:59 »
****. Just realized I spelled Kailh incorrectly. Updated the OP.

Offline jacobolus

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #11 on: Sat, 01 November 2014, 01:51:59 »
One of your imgur pictures broke. :/

Offline dante

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #12 on: Fri, 05 December 2014, 08:13:25 »
hey got a question for you - and I'm surprised I haven't seen it asked already ...

If Keycool and boards like it that use cloned Cherry stabilizers feel mushy ... could you just replace them with the real deal?

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 05 December 2014, 08:18:18 »
If Keycool and boards like it that use cloned Cherry stabilizers feel mushy ... could you just replace them with the real deal?

It wasn't my keyboard to take apart so I'm not 100% sure. I think so though. The stabilizers sure looked like Cherry stabilizers. I was actually wondering if I could just clip the stabilizers like someone could do with Cherry stabilizers. But like I said before, it wasn't my keyboard, so I couldn't take it apart.
« Last Edit: Fri, 05 December 2014, 08:21:46 by CPTBadAss »

Offline duzeyao

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 05 December 2014, 11:05:51 »
Hey CPT thanks for the nice review! :P
The IE icon flaw is fun lol.

P.S. The price of KC keyboards in China is low enough to maintain competitive though. (This KC87 with Kailh blue is 400RMB, or 65$ shipped)
« Last Edit: Fri, 05 December 2014, 11:11:30 by duzeyao »
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Offline rowdy

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #15 on: Sun, 07 December 2014, 02:47:14 »
Hey CPT thanks for the nice review! :P
The IE icon flaw is fun lol.

P.S. The price of KC keyboards in China is low enough to maintain competitive though. (This KC87 with Kailh blue is 400RMB, or 65$ shipped)

$65 shipped is a very good price for a mechanical keyboard!

Are they ever sold on special, at an even lower price?
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

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Offline duzeyao

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 08 December 2014, 01:30:58 »
Hey CPT thanks for the nice review! :P
The IE icon flaw is fun lol.

P.S. The price of KC keyboards in China is low enough to maintain competitive though. (This KC87 with Kailh blue is 400RMB, or 65$ shipped)

$65 shipped is a very good price for a mechanical keyboard!

Are they ever sold on special, at an even lower price?
After some search work, this is the lowest price on Taobao as far as I can see atm.
The price is not free shipping but usually you can negotiate with the seller to get an easy free shipping service (in China though).

http://t.cn/RzpuT3n
backlit version(mixed color) of Keycool 87 is 400RMB or 65$
http://t.cn/RzpuBi2
non-backlit version 350RMB or 56$

50-ish $ is the beginner price for mechanical keyboards in China now. It's also the best selling price in Chinese market. :P
« Last Edit: Mon, 08 December 2014, 01:32:36 by duzeyao »
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Offline LinkPro

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #17 on: Tue, 16 December 2014, 02:13:31 »
$65 for a mechanical keyboard with media keys is not bad at all. Cheapest widely available mech in the US is probably the poseidon Z which retails for $80.

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #18 on: Tue, 16 December 2014, 06:03:29 »
QFRs used to regularly go for $50-60 during sales. But I haven't seen that price lately.

I also refuse to buy from Taobao. As far as I know, Mk.com is the only dealer stateside that carries this board.
« Last Edit: Tue, 16 December 2014, 06:05:46 by CPTBadAss »

Offline Paspie

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #19 on: Wed, 17 December 2014, 15:54:06 »
I hate to ask but...how is this thing meant to be disassembled? I have one from about a year and a half ago that I want to bathe without the PCB getting destroyed. I've removed all 3 screws but the case isn't budging, anything I'm missing?

Offline CPTBadAss

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #20 on: Wed, 17 December 2014, 15:57:27 »
I hate to ask but...how is this thing meant to be disassembled? I have one from about a year and a half ago that I want to bathe without the PCB getting destroyed. I've removed all 3 screws but the case isn't budging, anything I'm missing?

There's probably snap fits underneath the top half of the case. Get a credit card or something similar and pry around the case halves at the seam. You should feel some latches. Unlatch them apart.

Offline Paspie

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #21 on: Thu, 18 December 2014, 17:25:15 »
Yep, worked, though the seams are a little too stiff for a credit card...a thin sheet of steel will do. :)

'Course, mine is the version with the Costar stabilizers (one of which I took the opportunity to replace), if those are now out of production then it must be fairly rare. The manufacture date is early '12 but I bought it in mid '13.
« Last Edit: Thu, 18 December 2014, 17:27:42 by Paspie »

Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #22 on: Fri, 19 December 2014, 14:38:37 »
Quote
hey got a question for you - and I'm surprised I haven't seen it asked already ...

If Keycool and boards like it that use cloned Cherry stabilizers feel mushy ... could you just replace them with the real deal?

I am new to this stuff, but if you wanted to replace the kailh switches, I believe you can? They are MX compatible, which means the PCBs should be compatible... It would require a lot of de-soldering and re-soldering though. In which case, you might be better off just buying something with actual Cherry MX switches? I like to tinker though, so if you like to go through the trouble, I am pretty sure you could do it!

nub though, so i might be wrong.

Offline rowdy

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 20 December 2014, 18:51:47 »
Quote
hey got a question for you - and I'm surprised I haven't seen it asked already ...

If Keycool and boards like it that use cloned Cherry stabilizers feel mushy ... could you just replace them with the real deal?

I am new to this stuff, but if you wanted to replace the kailh switches, I believe you can? They are MX compatible, which means the PCBs should be compatible... It would require a lot of de-soldering and re-soldering though. In which case, you might be better off just buying something with actual Cherry MX switches? I like to tinker though, so if you like to go through the trouble, I am pretty sure you could do it!

nub though, so i might be wrong.

That would be a lot of trouble to go to to get an MX-based keyboard.  For most people it would be simpler and much, much quicker just to buy an MX-based keyboard in the first place.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #24 on: Mon, 22 December 2014, 15:23:41 »
That would be a lot of trouble to go to to get an MX-based keyboard.  For most people it would be simpler and much, much quicker just to buy an MX-based keyboard in the first place.

Oh, most definitely. No question of that, I was just pointing out that its technically possible. Certainly not really the easiest or even best route, unless you already have the tools, time, and skills. (or want to tinker with it indefinitely without the guarantee that it will turn out functional).

Offline Johan

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Re: Keycool 87 with Kailh Blues
« Reply #25 on: Sat, 27 December 2014, 14:13:54 »
I'm getting a keycool 84 key, but I haven't decided on the switches yet. I'm torn between blue kalihs and brown. Do you have any recommendations regarding the switches? I read the Moda review and it seems like you really liked the browns, would you take that path if you could decide
 I've tried razer greens at a Ecafe but it seemed like those boards were worn to hell so they might not be a fair representation of how the switches feel.
Uh, stuff.