Early AT101s (salmon/black Alps) both old-logo Dells and unbranded, $25 each(?)

[jacobolus]

Over at Deskthority elecplus is selling some old Alps boards. There are supposedly several AT101s with salmon Alps (same FCC ID as the earliest Dell type, but apparently unbranded), plus several more with Dell logos (some of these have black Alps, not sure but others may have salmon switches). Both type should have nice sturdy cases similar to the SGI Granites or the Apple AEKs, and full 101-key ANSI sets of thick PBT dye-sub keycaps. Shoot the seller a private message on deskthority if interested, and pay via paypal.

She was selling other keyboards for $25/each plus shipping a couple weeks ago, so I’m guessing the same deal would still apply here.

http://deskthority.net/vendors-f52/wts-alps-keyboards-linear-and-clicky-t8690.html

[metalliqaz]

I have one with salmon alps.  Its a fantastic keyboard

[fohat.digs]

I went to the trouble to transplant orange Alps into a Dell AT101W and transformed it into a great keyboard.

[Heliosphere]

Is it possible to take the ALPS switches from these boards and put them on a custom ALPS/Matias compatible board?

[CPTBadAss]

Is it possible to take the ALPS switches from these boards and put them on a custom ALPS/Matias compatible board?

Yes

[Heliosphere]

Is it possible to take the ALPS switches from these boards and put them on a custom ALPS/Matias compatible board?

Yes

I remember seeing and trying out your Kingsaver with salmon alps. Was the process difficult?

[CPTBadAss]

You tried nuclearsandwich's board with Salmon Alps. Mine had Blue Alps. The process is the same as modding an MX board.

[geniekid]

I don't know if my experience applies to all Dell AT101s but my AT101W had the switch legs bent at a right angle before they were soldered which made desoldering slightly less straightforward.

Mrinterface has a good video that demonstrates desoldering an AT101W.

[CPTBadAss]

Many of my Alps boards had bent legs. It's annoying but nothing too bad.

[fohat.digs]

It's annoying but nothing too bad.

It's annoying as hell and makes it much more likely that you will rip up the pads.

I had one Dell in particular that was way worse than any other Alps board.

[jacobolus]

Wow, watching that Mr. Interface video, when he’s unbending leads he lifts pads like crazy. Also, his yank-switches-with-pliers method is guaranteed to break off the little plastic clips that hold switches to the plate, if the plate is tight. (Most old Apple keyboards have pretty loose plates, so just yanking the switches out probably won’t break the clips. But do that e.g. on a DC-2014 and you’ll break clips on 50% of those sweet blue Alps switches.)

I’ve mentioned this before, but with careful technique it’s possible to desolder bent-over legs without lifting pads. Here’s what I do:

For each of these steps, I do the whole board at once, and then come in with the next step across the whole board. This saves time.

(1) heat up the joint with a soldering iron and use a soldapullt to suck almost all of the solder away. bent-over leads will still have some solder sticking them to the pad, ignore that for now. make sure to also desolder all the leads of any LEDs mounted in the switches

(2) heat up the bent-over lead with a soldering iron, and simultaneously, using a dental pick or other similar tiny tool, gently pry upward on the lead. The heat should melt that last bit of solder, so the lead will “pop” free of the pad, and not stick to it again (since there’s really not much solder left after step 1).

(3) using a small pair of serrated-tooth snipe-nosed pliers, bend the bent-over lead into an upright position

(4) now once all the switches are unstuck from anything, remove any screws holding the pcb and plate together, and just lift the whole pcb off. there should be nothing holding it down at this point (usually I end up missing a couple of solder joints or bent-over leads in the previous steps, the first time around, so I just go back and fix them now)

(5) with the PCB removed, it's possible to push the switches out of the plate from the back while simultaneously pressing the little plastic clips inward so they don’t break off. Occasionally one is already weakened or broken, but in general I can get >95% of the switches out without any broken plastic clips

Overall, I’d say each bent-over lead takes about twice (maybe 2.5x) as long to desolder as each unbent lead, when you do the steps in batches. If you’re careful, you won’t lift any pads at all.

[jevvix]

I really wouldn't consider these 'great finds' in their condition. It was mentioned in the deskthority post a few times but I'll confirm that dirty ALPS tactile switches are the worst things ever. I have a few blacks and a salmon board that were cleaner than those, yet still quite dirty, and the switches feel terrible. On the other hand, my like-new AEK/M0115 with ALPS tactile oranges feels real nice - like night and day compared to dirty tactiles. I have heard similar things from NIB AT101W's with blacks. If you're looking to harvest switches do yourself a huge favor and buy one in better condition to save frustration down the road.

[Vanilla]

Is it possible to take the ALPS switches from these boards and put them on a custom ALPS/Matias compatible board?

Yes

That happens to be one of my vacation projects with the matias switches I got off of MD. 

[jacobolus]

I really wouldn't consider these 'great finds' in their condition. It was mentioned in the deskthority post a few times but I'll confirm that dirty ALPS tactile switches are the worst things ever.

(1) This is a full 101-key ANSI set of thick PBT Alps keycaps which could be used on some other keyboard. The keycaps alone are worth the price here, they’re dramatically nicer than the pad printed ABS caps used on many other Alps boards (such as the later Dell AT101s). (2) That unbranded board itself is very sturdy and nice, one of the most solid full-size Alps boards you can find, great for putting some other type of switch in; the Dell one is supposedly a bit less well constructed but is also pretty nice for a project. (3) The old-logo Dell would fetch quite a bit on eBay (some have gone for $100+? recently there were some in similar looking condition that got sold for $60 BIN) to some collector who feels nostalgic about the logo.

[geniekid]

Wow, watching that Mr. Interface video, when he’s unbending leads he lifts pads like crazy. Also, his yank-switches-with-pliers method is guaranteed to break off the little plastic clips that hold switches to the plate, if the plate is tight. (Most old Apple keyboards have pretty loose plates, so just yanking the switches out probably won’t break the clips. But do that e.g. on a DC-2014 and you’ll break clips on 50% of those sweet blue Alps switches.)

I’ve mentioned this before, but with careful technique it’s possible to desolder bent-over legs without lifting pads. Here’s what I do:

For each of these steps, I do the whole board at once, and then come in with the next step across the whole board. This saves time.

(1) heat up the joint with a soldering iron and use a soldapullt to suck almost all of the solder away. bent-over leads will still have some solder sticking them to the pad, ignore that for now. make sure to also desolder all the leads of any LEDs mounted in the switches

(2) heat up the bent-over lead with a soldering iron, and simultaneously, using a dental pick or other similar tiny tool, gently pry upward on the lead. The heat should melt that last bit of solder, so the lead will “pop” free of the pad, and not stick to it again (since there’s really not much solder left after step 1).

(3) using a small pair of serrated-tooth snipe-nosed pliers, bend the bent-over lead into an upright position

(4) now once all the switches are unstuck from anything, remove any screws holding the pcb and plate together, and just lift the whole pcb off. there should be nothing holding it down at this point (usually I end up missing a couple of solder joints or bent-over leads in the previous steps, the first time around, so I just go back and fix them now)

(5) with the PCB removed, it's possible to push the switches out of the plate from the back while simultaneously pressing the little plastic clips inward so they don’t break off. Occasionally one is already weakened or broken, but in general I can get >95% of the switches out without any broken plastic clips

Overall, I’d say each bent-over lead takes about twice (maybe 2.5x) as long to desolder as each unbent lead, when you do the steps in batches. If you’re careful, you won’t lift any pads at all.

I just used your method to desolder an entire Tektronix board and it worked really well.  Decoupling the plate from the PCB and pushing the switches out while holding down the wings made the switch removal a hundred times better than what I did with my Dell AT101W.

[dorkvader]

Overall, I’d say each bent-over lead takes about twice (maybe 2.5x) as long to desolder as each unbent lead, when you do the steps in batches. If you’re careful, you won’t lift any pads at all.

They take 5 or 6 times longer if you have a desoldering station and can desolder most leads in seconds. Any lead that's not sticking straight up for your desoldering gun to fit over are annoying.

I think these are great finds because you can replace the switches with new matias ones and call it good. One day I plan to do just that.

[False_Dmitry_II]

How can you tell which are PBT? The Dell logo one with black alps below the unbranded one looks shiny and thereby probably ABS. The unbranded one might be PBT, which is the only way I'd remotely care about one.

[jacobolus]

It would be easier to tell if they took a photo of the back of the keycap – PBT caps made by Alps are pretty distinctive. But from the close-up top pictures, these both seem like dye-subs to me. I could be wrong. The cap doesn’t look especially “shiny” (as in, loss of texture), it just has a bright light shining on it. Also, her camera’s white balance is terrible, which definitely doesn’t help anything.

[terrpn]

I went to the trouble to transplant orange Alps into a Dell AT101W and transformed it into a great keyboard.

so do they feel better in the at101 then the apple board?

just curious........

[fohat.digs]

so do they feel better in the at101 then the apple board?

Feel? I don't know.

I love the Dell AT101 because it is a very solid and reliable board.

Perhaps marginally lighter in weight than the Apples, but straight-ANSI-standard PS/2 and not prone to be yellowed. It is not a "pretty" keyboard by modern standards, and the footprint is 10%-15% bigger than it needs to be, but it is a good substantial keyboard.

If you want the top-shelf primo recipient keyboard for your chosen Alps flavor, that will be the the Northgate Omnikey 101, but, failing your ability to procure that gem, the AT101 is a very favorable 2nd choice.
 
Then put as many of the Apple keys (still the best Alps key caps available anywhere) on it as feasible.

[jacobolus]

so do they feel better in the at101 then the apple board?

No, the Apple M0115 is nicer IMO. Definitely nicer than the later Dells, but I also think nicer than the early ones.

The Dells have the advantage of being a standard IBM/ANSI layout, and working over PS/2 instead of ADB.

(Actually the keycaps on the Apple Extended Keyboard II are the nicest of all, extremely thick. I just don’t like the cream switches as much.)

[fohat.digs]

The Dells have the advantage of being a standard IBM/ANSI layout, and working over PS/2 instead of ADB.

This is the deal-killer for me. The Apples are exceptionally well-built, if they just didn't use that awful plastic that yellows so badly.

[terrpn]

The Dells have the advantage of being a standard IBM/ANSI layout, and working over PS/2 instead of ADB.

This is the deal-killer for me. The Apples are exceptionally well-built, if they just didn't use that awful plastic that yellows so badly.

after retrobiting once or twice they do come back pretty white though

agree and love the keycaps, i even put some alphas on my zenith with green alps- something different, but no beauty contest winner for sure

[Heliosphere]

I sent the user a pm, but have yet to get a response after a week. I guess they must be claimed already.

[jacobolus]

She mentioned on Deskthority that they were all claimed.

[fohat.digs]

She mentioned on Deskthority that they were all claimed.

After getting a price from her, I ordered and paid for one last week, and have not gotten any response at all since.

I think that she may just be busy and non-attentive. I am going to wait a few more days.

[dorkvader]

She mentioned on Deskthority that they were all claimed.

After getting a price from her, I ordered and paid for one last week, and have not gotten any response at all since.

I think that she may just be busy and non-attentive. I am going to wait a few more days.

They probably sold your stuff to other people after you ordered it.

I would advise against dealing with them at all. They threw me under a bus.

[jacobolus]

They probably sold your stuff to other people after you ordered it.

I would advise against dealing with them at all. They threw me under a bus.

It’s pretty clear that the lady is somewhat clueless and overworked, but she’s friendly and not acting maliciously. I was talking with her about buying an interesting keyboard a few weeks ago, and she mailed it before I even payed her.

[jevvix]

It’s pretty clear that the lady is somewhat clueless and overworked, but she’s friendly and not acting maliciously. I was talking with her about buying an interesting keyboard a few weeks ago, and she mailed it before I even payed her.

That's the exact same feeling I got from her when we were going back and forth via email.

I see her new post. It really sickens me that these vultures over at deskthority are trying to get the SSKs and IBM 4700's for pocket change. I'm glad see she's starting to get an idea of the value of those keyboards. Completed eBay auctions are your friend and can give you a great idea of what something is worth. If nothing else just a general range of where to start negotiations.

[fohat.digs]

I ordered one of these keyboards from her last week and have never heard a word.

Edit - The keyboard arrived today, and I must say that I am thoroughly disappointed.

I really mostly wanted it for the key caps, but they are thin ABS (acetone test) and many are moderately shiny.

The board itself is truly filthy and ugly with black Alps and coiled cable. Everything I dislike.

I am hoping that I can give it a thorough cleaning and sell it on ebay for a break-even price.

[jacobolus]

Boo. It's a Dell keyboard with the old-style logo? I’m pretty sure the one she took pictures of was dye-sub caps.

[fohat.digs]

It's a Dell keyboard with the old-style logo?

So hard to know about these things. I thought that the transitions went with time:

Old Logo / salmon Alps / PBT caps
Old Logo / black Alps / PBT caps
New Logo / black Alps / PBT caps / no Windows key
New Logo / black Alps / ABS caps / with Windows key

but apparently you cannot count on that holding true.

[False_Dmitry_II]

Was it one that had the logo? Or unbranded? Edit: Didn't see the second page

[terrpn]

It's a Dell keyboard with the old-style logo?

So hard to know about these things. I thought that the transitions went with time:

Old Logo / salmon Alps / PBT caps
Old Logo / black Alps / PBT caps
New Logo / black Alps / PBT caps / no Windows key
New Logo / black Alps / ABS caps / with Windows key

but apparently you cannot count on that holding true.

my dell old logo black and salmon alps are both pbt as well as my granite sgi