HHKB Pro 2 Type "S" (printed) back in stock at EK

[jmolino]

FYI - for anybody that was waiting... I just received a message from Tiffany at Elite Keyboards... they just received stock on the HHKB Pro2 Type "S".. I picked mine up!

Now I'll be able to compare first hand if the Dental Band mod really does affect the key feel (travel) against the real thing.....  will report back when I get it Monday.

Best Regards,
John

[Signature]

FYI - for anybody that was waiting... I just received a message from Tiffany at Elite Keyboards... they just received stock on the HHKB Pro2 Type "S".. I picked mine up!

Now I'll be able to compare first hand if the Dental Band mod really does affect the key feel (travel) against the real thing.....  will report back when I get it Monday.

Best Regards,
John

Move to great finds @mods

[MJ45]

FYI - for anybody that was waiting... I just received a message from Tiffany at Elite Keyboards... they just received stock on the HHKB Pro2 Type "S".. I picked mine up!

Now I'll be able to compare first hand if the Dental Band mod really does affect the key feel (travel) against the real thing.....  will report back when I get it Monday.

Best Regards,
John

You will defiantly be able to tell, even without trying just look at PFU's website the HHKB Type S features silencing rings are thinner than any dental bands could be.http://www.pfu.fujitsu.com/hhkeyboard/hhkbpro2_types/feature.html

 I find that dental bands are an unacceptable silencing method that ruins the Topre switches tactility, feel and limits the key travel. From my experience the factory stems with the foam washers or custom cut silicone or synth. rubber washers as thin as posible (0.5mm-0.021in or less) is the only to proper way to silence them without losing the Topre feel.

[Hypersphere]

FYI - for anybody that was waiting... I just received a message from Tiffany at Elite Keyboards... they just received stock on the HHKB Pro2 Type "S".. I picked mine up!

Now I'll be able to compare first hand if the Dental Band mod really does affect the key feel (travel) against the real thing.....  will report back when I get it Monday.

Best Regards,
John

Thanks for the heads up. Now excuse me while I apply for a government grant to purchase this major piece of equipment.

Please do let us know your findings regarding Type-S vs dental band silencing mod.

[epzy]

"I'm not personally aware of the thinness of the foam silencers vs dental bands, but I do know that the stems make a difference in that regard, because the area where the bands would be placed on the stem has been thinned when compared to regular stems. This allows for less, if any, change in the travel distance when the silencer is installed."

-esoomenona

[Hypersphere]

FYI - for anybody that was waiting... I just received a message from Tiffany at Elite Keyboards... they just received stock on the HHKB Pro2 Type "S".. I picked mine up!

Now I'll be able to compare first hand if the Dental Band mod really does affect the key feel (travel) against the real thing.....  will report back when I get it Monday.

Best Regards,
John

You will defiantly be able to tell, even without trying just look at PFU's website the HHKB Type S features silencing rings are thinner than any dental bands could be.http://www.pfu.fujitsu.com/hhkeyboard/hhkbpro2_types/feature.html

 I find that dental bands are an unacceptable silencing method that ruins the Topre switches tactility, feel and limits the key travel. From my experience the factory stems with the foam washers or custom cut silicone or synth. rubber washers as thin as posible (0.5mm-0.021in or less) is the only to proper way to silence them without losing the Topre feel.

Yes, not only does the Type-S use thin silencing pads, but it is my understanding that the Type-S uses switches that are different from the standard Topre switch. The Type-S plungers are slightly longer and they fit into the switch housing with a tighter tolerance than the normal switches. Is this in fact the case?

[Hypersphere]

FYI - for anybody that was waiting... I just received a message from Tiffany at Elite Keyboards... they just received stock on the HHKB Pro2 Type "S".. I picked mine up!

Now I'll be able to compare first hand if the Dental Band mod really does affect the key feel (travel) against the real thing.....  will report back when I get it Monday.

Best Regards,
John

Does anyone know if PFU has addressed the problem of "whistling" in the recent production of the Type-S HHKB Pro 2? I would like to know if this is still a problem before plunking down $356 plus shipping.

[jmolino]

Yes, not only does the Type-S use thin silencing pads, but it is my understanding that the Type-S uses switches that are different from the standard Topre switch. The Type-S plungers are slightly longer and they fit into the switch housing with a tighter tolerance than the normal switches. Is this in fact the case?

Does anyone know if PFU has addressed the problem of "whistling" in the recent production of the Type-S HHKB Pro 2? I would like to know if this is still a problem before plunking down $356 plus shipping.

I'll update about both these questions on Monday.  However, please explain this "whistling" issue as I am unfamiliar with it....

[Hypersphere]

@jmolino: If you google terms such as "hhkb type-s whistle" you will get hits to a number of posts and some videos about this issue.

Looking forward to your updates....

[Sniping]

The only logical answer for the whistling is scratchiness from stem friction. Ripster had some ridiculous "Topre fart" explanation, but it doesn't explain why it only occurs on Type-S.

You only hear the "whistling" sound on the Type-S because the stems are different from that of any other Topre keyboard's (different color, extended stem to compensate for the silencing ring).

[Aidenknives]

The control/esc caps are also back in stock. Are they really worth $34?

[Hypersphere]

I've heard that the tolerance (distance between the stem and switch housing) is tighter (smaller) for Type-S switches compared to normal Topre switches. However, even if this is so, I do not know if the smaller opening around the stem is correlated with the whistling phenomenon.

[AKIMbO]

The only logical answer for the whistling is scratchiness from stem friction. Ripster had some ridiculous "Topre fart" explanation, but it doesn't explain why it only occurs on Type-S.

You only hear the "whistling" sound on the Type-S because the stems are different from that of any other Topre keyboard's (different color, extended stem to compensate for the silencing ring).

Only the realforce uses different color stems.  Hhkb type s uses the same color stem as the unsilenced hhkb.

[epzy]

The control/esc caps are also back in stock. Are they really worth $34?

If it's worth it is totally up to you.

In terms of bang for buck, definitely not.

[Sniping]

The only logical answer for the whistling is scratchiness from stem friction. Ripster had some ridiculous "Topre fart" explanation, but it doesn't explain why it only occurs on Type-S.

You only hear the "whistling" sound on the Type-S because the stems are different from that of any other Topre keyboard's (different color, extended stem to compensate for the silencing ring).

Only the realforce uses different color stems.  Hhkb type s uses the same color stem as the unsilenced hhkb.

But they're different stems since the silenced ones are longer, so there's something wrong with the silenced HHKB  stems in specific.

[jmolino]

Well - I received my Type-S today and here is my report:  first a little background.  Here are the following keyboards I have owned and the modifications I have performed on them.  A few of these I still own, and will be selling, but I'll save that for another post.
(This is in no particular order)

1) HHKB Pro 2 (black model, printed)
2) FC660C (grey die sublimated model)
3) RF87U 55g
4) IBM Model M #42H1292
5) Matias Secure Pro
6) Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000
7) Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic
Leopold FC660M (MX Clears)
9) Northgate Omnikey Evolution Keyboard
10) Logitech K350
11) WASD Code TKL (MX Green)
12) Corsair Vengeance K70
13) CM Storm QuickFire TK
14) Ergodox (still not built)

....and finally... the HHKB Pro 2 Type "S"

Holy Cripe!  When I list that out it appears as though I have a problem!  Thanks Geekhack! LOL

So the mods I have performed (not including simple keycap swaps) are:
- Dental Band Silencing mod 1/8" light neon ones super thin when streched ~ 1mm on the HHKB and the FC660C
- prior to that I tried the landing pads (the grey ones that I ironed out flat as can be - probably to 1mm.)
- Hasu's teensy alternative controller for HHKB (Kicks ass!)
- 55g Dome Swap from the RF to the HHKB Pro 2 (with leftovers given to the FC660C on the "primary finger" keys), and now moved over to the Type "S".

So after all this I can say one thing... you've probably read it before many times on the forums and brushed it aside, but I'll say it again.  Save your self the time, and money and just get the HHKB Pro 2 Type "S" from the get-go and be done with it LOL!

No - really that is just a personal statement, and can't be applied to everybody since this entire hobby and what makes a "good" keyboard good, and the "Best" keyboard the "Best" is so subjective and personal. ..

But for me.... I absolutely love the layout of the HHKB Pro2.  I love the Control key and the Delete (converted to BS) key.   These 2 simple changes allow me to keep my fingers on the home row and type more comfortably.

(I'm a typer , not a gamer so much... I like ergonmic keyboards, but i LOVE Topre key switches.... to me there is no comparison against Cherry MX or any other.  And as far as Silencing goes... none of the mod methods produce an acceptable result for me.... the loss of key travel ruins the Topre feel - so whats the point... I don't care if you had 1/2mm silicon, it still would reduce the travel and change the feel of the typing experience... your better off just leaving your HHKB, FC660M, or RF alone and deal with the clack.  If you don't want the clack, then get the Type "S" (which is what I finally did and am so thankful I did it).

The 2 other critical mods for me are the 55G dome swap....and switching the controller to a teensy so you have programmability.  Yes it is an expensive keyboard... you are talking $350 for the Type "S", ~ $200 for the donor board to get the 55G domes (but you can recoup alot of that by selling it as an inexpensive 45g RF. and a few bucks and time to do the controller mod.  But the end result?  for me... a NEAR PERFECT KEYBOARD!  I'm as close to "the one"as I can get...

Could I come up with some things that would improve it   Yes.  For 1 - I think the solidness of the FC660 is more desireable than the HHKB... that keyboard just oozes quality. and the way the switches are mounted I think provide a slightly better feel (and Thunk).  If you are the kind of person that likes the layout of the FC660 (with the arrow keys and the dedicated delete key), then you apply the same things I did to my HHKB and put them on the FC660 - the only thing you lose is the "Type S" lack of clack!   (I wonder if they'll ever make a Type-S FC660???)

(Oh yeah - you GOTTA flip your spacebar! It's so much better for typing - that was a surprise to me when I learned about that on GH... never would have thought!)

Anyway sorry for the long drawn out post, but I'm actually enjoying typing on my new tricked out Type "S"!   - Oh I'll throw in a potato pic from my phone....maybe tomorrow I'll bust out my good camera

If anyone has any questions.... shoot!  Happy Keyboarding!

-John

[Aidenknives]

Well - I received my Type-S today and here is my report:  first a little background.  Here are the following keyboards I have owned and the modifications I have performed on them.  A few of these I still own, and will be selling, but I'll save that for another post.
(This is in no particular order)

1) HHKB Pro 2 (black model, printed)
2) FC660C (grey die sublimated model)
3) RF87U 55g
4) IBM Model M #42H1292
5) Matias Secure Pro
6) Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000
7) Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic
Leopold FC660M (MX Clears)
9) Northgate Omnikey Evolution Keyboard
10) Logitech K350
11) WASD Code TKL (MX Green)
12) Corsair Vengeance K70
13) CM Storm QuickFire TK
14) Ergodox (still not built)

....and finally... the HHKB Pro 2 Type "S"

Holy Cripe!  When I list that out it appears as though I have a problem!  Thanks Geekhack! LOL

So the mods I have performed (not including simple keycap swaps) are:
- Dental Band Silencing mod 1/8" light neon ones super thin when streched ~ 1mm on the HHKB and the FC660C
- prior to that I tried the landing pads (the grey ones that I ironed out flat as can be - probably to 1mm.)
- Hasu's teensy alternative controller for HHKB (Kicks ass!)
- 55g Dome Swap from the RF to the HHKB Pro 2 (with leftovers given to the FC660C on the "primary finger" keys), and now moved over to the Type "S".

So after all this I can say one thing... you've probably read it before many times on the forums and brushed it aside, but I'll say it again.  Save your self the time, and money and just get the HHKB Pro 2 Type "S" from the get-go and be done with it LOL!

No - really that is just a personal statement, and can't be applied to everybody since this entire hobby and what makes a "good" keyboard good, and the "Best" keyboard the "Best" is so subjective and personal. ..

But for me.... I absolutely love the layout of the HHKB Pro2.  I love the Control key and the Delete (converted to BS) key.   These 2 simple changes allow me to keep my fingers on the home row and type more comfortably.

(I'm a typer , not a gamer so much... I like ergonmic keyboards, but i LOVE Topre key switches.... to me there is no comparison against Cherry MX or any other.  And as far as Silencing goes... none of the mod methods produce an acceptable result for me.... the loss of key travel ruins the Topre feel - so whats the point... I don't care if you had 1/2mm silicon, it still would reduce the travel and change the feel of the typing experience... your better off just leaving your HHKB, FC660M, or RF alone and deal with the clack.  If you don't want the clack, then get the Type "S" (which is what I finally did and am so thankful I did it).

The 2 other critical mods for me are the 55G dome swap....and switching the controller to a teensy so you have programmability.  Yes it is an expensive keyboard... you are talking $350 for the Type "S", ~ $200 for the donor board to get the 55G domes (but you can recoup alot of that by selling it as an inexpensive 45g RF. and a few bucks and time to do the controller mod.  But the end result?  for me... a NEAR PERFECT KEYBOARD!  I'm as close to "the one"as I can get...

Could I come up with some things that would improve it   Yes.  For 1 - I think the solidness of the FC660 is more desireable than the HHKB... that keyboard just oozes quality. and the way the switches are mounted I think provide a slightly better feel (and Thunk).  If you are the kind of person that likes the layout of the FC660 (with the arrow keys and the dedicated delete key), then you apply the same things I did to my HHKB and put them on the FC660 - the only thing you lose is the "Type S" lack of clack!   (I wonder if they'll ever make a Type-S FC660???)

(Oh yeah - you GOTTA flip your spacebar! It's so much better for typing - that was a surprise to me when I learned about that on GH... never would have thought!)

Anyway sorry for the long drawn out post, but I'm actually enjoying typing on my new tricked out Type "S"!   - Oh I'll throw in a potato pic from my phone....maybe tomorrow I'll bust out my good camera

If anyone has any questions.... shoot!  Happy Keyboarding!

-John

(Attachment Link)
-

Awesome review! Glad I got one coming in the mail. That pic at the bottom says invalid though.

[jmolino]

Awesome review! Glad I got one coming in the mail. That pic at the bottom says invalid though.

Fixed.... oh yeah... none of this whistling problem thing...

[sunshine]

dear,thanks for sharing,I love it a lot

[rowdy]

Congratulations!

I like the layout with the black Fn and black "arrow keys"!

[Hypersphere]

You've convinced me! Now to scrape together the money. Need to sell some boards and keycap sets....

[dorkvader]

(Oh yeah - you GOTTA flip your spacebar! It's so much better for typing - that was a surprise to me when I learned about that on GH... never would have thought!)

I recommend flipping the whole mod row if possible. You want to make any key your thumb hits to be lower angle.

[Michael]

I recommend flipping the whole mod row

(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻︵ ┻━┻

[HipsterPunks]

Figures im in the market for a blank one and OOS 

[Tiramisuu]

If only it had a symmetrical fn on both sides.  The teensy mod makes it almost perfect.
It's less expensive than a custom programmable and the torpre is tempting.   It's a shame the market is so small for really good keyboards.

[dorkvader]

It's less expensive than a custom programmable

Custom programmable keyboards are significantly cheaper than this.

[saturnotaku]

Custom programmable keyboards are significantly cheaper than this.

If you have the time, know-how, and skill to put it together yourself that's true. While lots of folks here possess those traits, I would wager the overwhelming majority of GH users do not. Once you factor those costs, including the time necessary to complete the work, it ends up being a wash at best and notably more expensive at worst.

[jmolino]

Figures im in the market for a blank one and OOS 

I have a blank set of hhkb keys I'd be willing to part with... I'm on a fishing trip for a few days so when I get back I'll touch base with you..

[dorkvader]

Custom programmable keyboards are significantly cheaper than this.

If you have the time, know-how, and skill to put it together yourself that's true. While lots of folks here possess those traits, I would wager the overwhelming majority of GH users do not. Once you factor those costs, including the time necessary to complete the work, it ends up being a wash at best and notably more expensive at worst.

Even with paying someone else to make it for you it's still a lot cheaper, but the cheapest way is to get a model M and an arduino pro micro to make it programmable, but even other solutions like a QFR + controller or plate + 2 wood blocks for a case & direct wire are still inexpensive. The main reason why all these custom keyboards are expensive is that they use expensive (usually CNC'd metal) cases.

[deci]

QFR + Frosty Flake is around like a little over $100?
Poker 2 + custom case is $150 - $200?

There's a lot of cheap programmable options out there.

Plus adding a Teensy to HHKB takes just as much know-how (if not more) than putting together most custom keyboard kits.
(If you're lucky enough to get a Hasu controller that's a different story)

Still... that HHKB topre feel is magical.

[Hypersphere]

Thus far, I have only installed a Teensy and Soarer's Converter in my IBM XT that I have remapped to the extent possible to a hybrid Mac/HHKB layout. This was fun and relatively inexpensive, and I am looking forward to converting more of my keyboards using converters or controllers by Soarer, Hasu, or Xwhatsit, depending upon the type of keyboard.

Until I get around to installing more converters or controllers, because my primary platform is Mac OS X, I use Karabiner software to remap them to something as close to a Mac/HHKB configuration as I can get.

As for my HHKB Pro 2, I am glad that it already has a perfect layout for me with no need to remap or reprogram it!

[MJ45]

Thus far, I have only installed a Teensy and Soarer's Converter in my IBM XT that I have remapped to the extent possible to a hybrid Mac/HHKB layout. This was fun and relatively inexpensive, and I am looking forward to converting more of my keyboards using converters or controllers by Soarer, Hasu, or Xwhatsit, depending upon the type of keyboard.

Until I get around to installing more converters or controllers, because my primary platform is Mac OS X, I use Karabiner software to remap them to something as close to a Mac/HHKB configuration as I can get.

As for my HHKB Pro 2, I am glad that it already has a perfect layout for me with no need to remap or reprogram it!

Yes I agree 100% as you my primary platform is Mac OS X and the HHKB Pro 2 is second to none. The true beauty of the HHKB is it works with any computer platform you care to plug in to, even less desirable systems.

[Sneaky Potato]

FYI - for anybody that was waiting... I just received a message from Tiffany at Elite Keyboards... they just received stock on the HHKB Pro2 Type "S".. I picked mine up!

Now I'll be able to compare first hand if the Dental Band mod really does affect the key feel (travel) against the real thing.....  will report back when I get it Monday.

Best Regards,
John

You will defiantly be able to tell, even without trying just look at PFU's website the HHKB Type S features silencing rings are thinner than any dental bands could be.http://www.pfu.fujitsu.com/hhkeyboard/hhkbpro2_types/feature.html

 I find that dental bands are an unacceptable silencing method that ruins the Topre switches tactility, feel and limits the key travel. From my experience the factory stems with the foam washers or custom cut silicone or synth. rubber washers as thin as posible (0.5mm-0.021in or less) is the only to proper way to silence them without losing the Topre feel.

I feel the same way, after owning both a HHKB Pro II and the Type-S. I tried the dental band mod before buying the Type-S, and I was disappointed. I didn't like the way it felt or sounded. The Type-S feels great and I don't regret it in the slightest. I'd pay the extra money over the dental band mod any day.

As far as the "whistling" goes, I don't think that ripster was correct in his "Topre Fart" theory. Personally it just feels like friction. There's a definite feel of friction if you slowly push down the swtiches, and it isn't present in my regular Pro II.

My board does the whistling occasionally and I don't mind it at all and hardly notice it. The board is still really new, so I imagine that it will fade over time. People are making too big of a fuss over it, in my opinion.

[Hypersphere]

The observations about the "whistling" effect being reported by some in the Type-S is consistent with reports that the tolerance (space between the switch housing and slider) is tighter (smaller space) in the Type-S than it is in a normal HHKB switch. EK got back to me about the whistling issue, saying that there have been very few reports of this, and when the problem exists it seems to disappear after using the keyboard for a while.

[Sneaky Potato]

The observations about the "whistling" effect being reported by some in the Type-S is consistent with reports that the tolerance (space between the switch housing and slider) is tighter (smaller space) in the Type-S than it is in a normal HHKB switch. EK got back to me about the whistling issue, saying that there have been very few reports of this, and when the problem exists it seems to disappear after using the keyboard for a while.

What advantages are there to having a tighter tolerance? My keys feel much more stable than on my Pro II, but I can't tell if that's just the feeling from the pads.