What is wrong with this world? (Should ALL the kids be WINNERS?)

[SpAmRaY]

LAWRENCEVILLE, GA (CBS46) - It turned out to be the pee wee football player's first touchdown and the first fine for the 8-year-old.
The Lawrenceville Black Knights were beating another team, 32-0, in the fourth quarter. No. 2 intercepted a pass and in the excitement of the moment forgot about the leagues mercy rule.
That touchdown passed the 33-point rule and cost the coach a week long suspension and the team $500.
"We were all super excited,he was beyond excited and we were fined for it," Brooke Burdett said.  It was Burdett's son, Elijah Burrell, who caught the pass.
"He had no idea.   This is his first year.  This was his first touchdown.  He is an 8-year-old boy making a pick-six."
Burdett said running up the score was not intentional.  On the next play they even tried to let the other team score but Burdett said they refused to catch the ball.
"For the league to think we intentionally went out there to run the score up is absurd," football mom Chando John said. 
John said she has been with the team for three years and wants the mercy rule changed.
"How do I explain to an eight year old kid that your coach has been suspended because your teammate unintentionally scored?" Chando asked. "It is hard having an 8-year-old in flight to think of everything everybody has said, other than I need to make a touchdown."
Burdett said they would have accepted a $100 fine, but said a $500 fine and the coach's suspension is excessive.

http://www.cbs46.com/story/26879563/8-year-old-scores-touchdown-team-fined-500?


I know every kid needs a trophy and to be a winner but come on, kids also need to learn losing is real and if you grow up always being given a pass it probably isn't going to turn out well when you are an adult.

As is mentioned further down for young kids yes it's good to play on a team to learn cooperation and teamwork.

And like jd said, if they want to have a mercy rule then just call the game at that point.

[heedpantsnow]

I know dude I'm with you.

[azhdar]

Suspended because your team is too good ?
americans be crazy

Now the scrubs who lost 0-33 be all like "yeah they got fined "

Loosing is a valuable lessons , kids gotta cry to learn life .

[Lurch]

Wow.

The world is a scary place...


...oh, and money is the root of all evil...


 

[esoomenona]

Wow.

The world is a scary place...


...oh, and money is the root of all evil...


 

Actually, I believe a wise man once said, "NOT having money is the root of all evil."

[Telephasic]

They could prevent the other team getting stomped by adding leg and wrist weights to the winning team and maybe some dope dark sunglasses to boot.

[SpAmRaY]

I get the idea they are going for of not wanting some poor team to get completely buried but if that's all they are worried about then maybe they should just say first team to 30 points and call it a game at that point.

[esoomenona]

I get the idea they are going for of not wanting some poor team to get completely buried but if that's all they are worried about then maybe they should just say first team to 30 points and call it a game at that point.

Maybe they should teach their kids to try harder. Or maybe these pussies should quit putting their kids in competitive sports, and take them out back to hug a tree and sing We Are The World.

[Lurch]

Wow.

The world is a scary place...


...oh, and money is the root of all evil...


 

Actually, I believe a wise man once said, "NOT having money is the root of all evil."

I don't agree with that quote entirely, but I see your point. Money sucks, especially when you don't have any.

I was pointing out the greed of the "league" for charging a kids football team $500  essentially over a bunch of broken dreams. That's ****ing criminal.

Dreams don't come true, kids.

[nubbinator]

Guise, don't you know, the kids are all unique little butterflies.  If you're not careful and don't carefully nurture their uniqueness and constantly tell them they're winners, that they deserve everything in life to be given to them, and that, as long as you try, there are no losers in life, they will literally die.

I'm not even that old, but god, we need to stop with this bull**** already.  We didn't have this when I was a kid.  And if there was a mercy rule, the game ended with the other team losing, it wasn't this "let the other team score and stop playing the game" bull****.  Kids need to learn how to lose with grace, even if it's a total ass whooping.  They need to learn that sometimes trying your hardest isn't good enough and you'll lose or someone will be better than you.  That's life and this BS just makes a bunch of entitled kids who think they deserve everything handed to them on a silver platter.

[baldgye]

Whats wrong with this world is that 1% of the population controls like 50% of the planets wealth.

[esoomenona]

Whats wrong with this world is that 1% of the population controls like 50% of the planets wealth.

And their mission is simple: to kill competition among the low levels, such that they have no desire to fight for anything more in life, therefore will not come for their money. But they must start at a young age.

[azhdar]

Sadly nowadays kiddies are threated like a gift from heaven .
Some parents are raising them like that thinking "I want to give the best to my child" , they're just putting him in a protected environment he'll never grew out off !
Kids gotta success and fall on their own , with parents monitoring it .

[Xowie]

I get the idea, but this is terrible execution of it.

I coach a basketball team in a similar age range and in this league they do not keep score. It is pretty nice, the kids have fun and the parents do not get as worked up. 

[jdcarpe]

Yeah, if there is a mercy rule at 33 points, and the one team was up 32-0, the game should have been over at that point. Why were they still playing?

[azhdar]

I get the idea, but this is terrible execution of it.

I coach a basketball team in a similar age range and in this league they do not keep score. It is pretty nice, the kids have fun and the parents do not get as worked up. 

I heard of this , isn't there people still counting though ? I knew 8-yo me would have counted .

[ConscienceDrop]

Wtf is mercy rule? Smh

Real life mercy rule = there is no mercy

[SpAmRaY]

My oldest kid is in first grade and they don't even get grades anymore.

A couple teachers were telling my wife they are probably going to be taking the 'no grades' to the whole school next year, personally I think its the dumbest thing in the world. :facepalm:

[esoomenona]

My oldest kid is in first grade and they don't even get grades anymore.

A couple teachers were telling my wife they are probably going to be taking the 'no grades' to the whole school next year, personally I think its the dumbest thing in the world. :facepalm:

Yes. Smartest thing ever. Remove their knowledge of what grades are, and then throw grades at them in middle school, and punish them for not understanding what you haven't taught them yet.

Seriously, consider putting your kid in a school that you think is better for him/her.

[Xowie]

I get the idea, but this is terrible execution of it.

I coach a basketball team in a similar age range and in this league they do not keep score. It is pretty nice, the kids have fun and the parents do not get as worked up. 

I heard of this , isn't there people still counting though ? I knew 8-yo me would have counted .

There are definitely a couple of kids who consistently ask what the score is. My usual response: "It is [random number] to [random number]. Good job! Keep playing!".

[baldgye]

Also, whats the point in teaching children sports if you don't let them loose?

[SpAmRaY]

Seriously, consider putting your kid in a school that you think is better for him/her.

Sad reality is that was one of the larger factors in our decision for staying where we are and not moving elsewhere, we thought this school system was one of the better ones. 

[baldgye]

Being from the UK my perspective is different, but I wouldn't dream of trying to make out I want the best for my children and there education and not then having them privately educated.

[Xowie]

Also, whats the point in teaching children sports if you don't let them loose?

I think with this age group sports are seen as more of a social interaction. Also usually (although perhaps not this young) there are 'social' and competitive leagues.

[SpAmRaY]

Being from the UK my perspective is different, but I wouldn't dream of trying to make out I want the best for my children and there education and not then having them privately educated.

Another option we did look into, in our area there were only two viable 'private' options but in reality the only main difference between them and the public offerings was the 'private' schools are just religious.

And to all you private school kids out there, I do not want my kids being snobby little brats either.  )

[baldgye]

Being from the UK my perspective is different, but I wouldn't dream of trying to make out I want the best for my children and there education and not then having them privately educated.

Another option we did look into, in our area there were only two viable 'private' options but in reality the only main difference between them and the public offerings was the 'private' schools are just religious.

Not going to lie that can be a problem, my school had a reverend that lived on site and (the whole building was an old Edwardian public school) a huge church that held all our assemblies, yet I still turned out a happy atheist. I went to both state and private school at all levels (bar college and uni) and the difference in teaching and environment is huge and if you raise your kids right and make sure they never stop asking questions religion wouldn't be a problem, though I guess it could be different in the US, idk lol

[The Mad Professor]

I HATE trophies, medals, and ribbons for participation.

It's like saying "Yay for mediocrity!"

The world does not work like that. You want trophies, awards, etc? Do something exceptional. Your boss is not going to say "Oh, you showed up on time? Here's a raise!" No, you get rewarded based on the merits of your work.

[saturnotaku]

Guise, don't you know, the kids are all unique little butterflies.  If you're not careful and don't carefully nurture their uniqueness and constantly tell them they're winners, that they deserve everything in life to be given to them, and that, as long as you try, there are no losers in life, they will literally die.

I'm not even that old, but god, we need to stop with this bull**** already.  We didn't have this when I was a kid.  And if there was a mercy rule, the game ended with the other team losing, it wasn't this "let the other team score and stop playing the game" bull****.  Kids need to learn how to lose with grace, even if it's a total ass whooping.  They need to learn that sometimes trying your hardest isn't good enough and you'll lose or someone will be better than you.  That's life and this BS just makes a bunch of entitled kids who think they deserve everything handed to them on a silver platter.

^ This times eleventy billion.

You can thank the Marxists who have overrun the education system.

"Give me just one generation of youth, and I'll transform the whole world." - Vlad Lenin

[SpAmRaY]

Being from the UK my perspective is different, but I wouldn't dream of trying to make out I want the best for my children and there education and not then having them privately educated.

Another option we did look into, in our area there were only two viable 'private' options but in reality the only main difference between them and the public offerings was the 'private' schools are just religious.

Not going to lie that can be a problem, my school had a reverend that lived on site and (the whole building was an old Edwardian public school) a huge church that held all our assemblies, yet I still turned out a happy atheist. I went to both state and private school at all levels (bar college and uni) and the difference in teaching and environment is huge and if you raise your kids right and make sure they never stop asking questions religion wouldn't be a problem, though I guess it could be different in the US, idk lol

Oh I didn't mind the religious part but that's a whole other issue.

Anyways, back on topic here.

I HATE trophies, medals, and ribbons for participation.

It's like saying "Yay for mediocrity!"

The world does not work like that. You want trophies, awards, etc? Do something exceptional. Your boss is not going to say "Oh, you showed up on time? Here's a raise!" No, you get rewarded based on the merits of your work.

^^ This so much. 

[inanis]

I HATE trophies, medals, and ribbons for participation.

I agree with this for older children. But for young kids (and I mean like Kindergarten and 1st grade) who are just learning how to participate in an activity, the actual learning to participate in a group activity often is the main goal. Someone else mentioned this, but just learning to socialize properly, and work towards a common goal is important for young kids. They absolutely should be allowed to lose once they get past an introductory stage. Learning to lose - and learning to be a gracious winner, are very important skills to learn early on. You are absolutely right that teaching kids that just being "okay" isn't enough to set them up for a successful future.

[ConscienceDrop]

I HATE trophies, medals, and ribbons for participation.

It's like saying "Yay for mediocrity!"

The world does not work like that. You want trophies, awards, etc? Do something exceptional. Your boss is not going to say "Oh, you showed up on time? Here's a raise!" No, you get rewarded based on the merits of your work.

One of the leagues i was in as a kid gave a small metal trophy to everyone at the end, but they also gave medals to the teams that won and medals to the highest score-er or best defence , and also the 'most improved' I though that was sick. My first year I only got a trophy, but the year after that I got most improved and highest score. It feels good to have a physical thing that represents commitment. But an award should be something on top of that


My view is that praising good effort is positive, winning is not everything. But making everyone equal no matter what is not positive.

A good boss 'should' notice you always do come in on time, that should count for something because it does take effort. You are right just coming in on time does not get you a medal.

I think there is a positive middle ground that compels Kids to try harder but still shows them that hard work counts even when you don't win

[Tarzan]

I think you're off base with this one, SpamRay.  You noted the one team was beating the other 32-0, and somehow they got so excited they forgot they were so far ahead?  Bullcrap.  That's a team/coach/parents who were just demolishing the losing team, and enjoying it.  That's not winning, a game score that lop-sided is just abuse.  Why were those teams even in the same league?If my kid was on the losing side of that fracas, and there were no repercussions for the coach who ignored the league rule, I'd pull my kid out of the league altogether. 

The point that I'm making is that football, soccer, baseball, hockey, lacrosse, cricket or whatever at this level is just a game.  Kids should be encouraged to play, not just play to win.  There are far too few opportunities for physical activity for American school-kids, so any chance they get to play, they should be encouraged to play.  Humiliating a team of little kids so one group can drive up the score even more egregiously is not doing that.

The broader point I've seen explicated by a few responses is that kids need to learn to win, so they are better prepared for life in general.  Sure, if you want kids to be sociopathic little monsters that have zero empathy or ability to work cooperatively.  I want my son to learn how a team operates, how players with strong skills in one or another area share the load, communicate and work together so the whole team wins.  And realize as well that next season they could be the ones on the "other" team, so play fair and enjoy the game.
 
The quote I like that best exemplifies my point of view is from Martina Navratilova;  "What matters isn't how well you play when you're playing well. What matters is how well you play when you're playing badly."

[Krogenar]

My oldest kid is in first grade and they don't even get grades anymore.

A couple teachers were telling my wife they are probably going to be taking the 'no grades' to the whole school next year, personally I think its the dumbest thing in the world. :facepalm:

The 'no grades' rule is good for teachers' unions. With no meaningful metric to gauge a teacher's effectiveness, life will be so much easier. As for a 'mercy' rule in sports, I'm not against it -- teaching children mercy isn't a bad thing. Showing the other team some mercy is okay -- they still lost, so, I don't see the problem with showing them some mercy. I know that isn't how the real world works, but children don't inhabit the real world, that's why they call it 'childhood'.

I think a fine for not obeying the mercy rule to the letter is ridiculous, in the same way that banning bake sales and policing lemonade stands for their permits are ridiculous.

[iri]

The broader point I've seen explicated by a few responses is that kids need to learn to win, so they are better prepared for life in general.  Sure, if you want kids to be sociopathic little monsters that have zero empathy or ability to work cooperatively.  I want my son to learn how a team operates, how players with strong skills in one or another area share the load, communicate and work together so the whole team wins.

to learn to win a team game, kids surely need to know "how a team operates, how players with strong skills in one or another area share the load, communicate and work together so the whole team wins".

[Tarzan]

The 'no grades' rule is good for teachers' unions. With no meaningful metric to gauge a teacher's effectiveness, life will be so much easier.

Bullcrap.

Whenever I see anyone ranking on teacher's unions (never firefighter's unions or police unions...) I can guarantee they're motivated by right-wing hatred of public education paid for by taxes.  Enforcing  random metrics for "teacher performance" is the thin wedge issue to try to cut school funding.  You ever notice how performance metrics are never used to justify increased school funding?  Or raise taxes so we can actually have smaller class sizes, more teachers?

The Republican wet dream is a world where the peons are marginally literate (so they can be easily bamboozled), and only the ones with money can afford to pay for education for their kids.

Go peddle that crap somewhere else.

[IPT]

I think you're off base with this one, SpamRay.  You noted the one team was beating the other 32-0, and somehow they got so excited they forgot they were so far ahead?  Bullcrap.  That's a team/coach/parents who were just demolishing the losing team, and enjoying it.  That's not winning, a game score that lop-sided is just abuse.  Why were those teams even in the same league?If my kid was on the losing side of that fracas, and there were no repercussions for the coach who ignored the league rule, I'd pull my kid out of the league altogether. 

The point that I'm making is that football, soccer, baseball, hockey, lacrosse, cricket or whatever at this level is just a game.  Kids should be encouraged to play, not just play to win.  There are far too few opportunities for physical activity for American school-kids, so any chance they get to play, they should be encouraged to play.  Humiliating a team of little kids so one group can drive up the score even more egregiously is not doing that.

The broader point I've seen explicated by a few responses is that kids need to learn to win, so they are better prepared for life in general.  Sure, if you want kids to be sociopathic little monsters that have zero empathy or ability to work cooperatively.  I want my son to learn how a team operates, how players with strong skills in one or another area share the load, communicate and work together so the whole team wins.  And realize as well that next season they could be the ones on the "other" team, so play fair and enjoy the game.
 
The quote I like that best exemplifies my point of view is from Martina Navratilova;  "What matters isn't how well you play when you're playing well. What matters is how well you play when you're playing badly."

so what you're saying is the coach should've screamed at the kid and his team mates should've tackled him b4 he ran for the TD?

[IPT]

The 'no grades' rule is good for teachers' unions. With no meaningful metric to gauge a teacher's effectiveness, life will be so much easier.

Bullcrap.

Whenever I see anyone ranking on teacher's unions (never firefighter's unions or police unions...) I can guarantee they're motivated by right-wing hatred of public education paid for by taxes.  Enforcing  random metrics for "teacher performance" is the thin wedge issue to try to cut school funding.  You ever notice how performance metrics are never used to justify increased school funding?  Or raise taxes so we can actually have smaller class sizes, more teachers?

The Republican wet dream is a world where the peons are marginally literate (so they can be easily bamboozled), and only the ones with money can afford to pay for education for their kids.

Go peddle that crap somewhere else.

um where do you live?  My old school district parrots their SAT & AP scores every year to increase that school budget.

[Krogenar]

I think you're off base with this one, SpamRay.  You noted the one team was beating the other 32-0, and somehow they got so excited they forgot they were so far ahead?  Bullcrap.  That's a team/coach/parents who were just demolishing the losing team, and enjoying it.  That's not winning, a game score that lop-sided is just abuse.

Do we really know that's how it happened? We don't. I support a mercy rule on the basis that they are children, and this is a game that's supposed to be fun, not spirit-crushing. There's got to be a 'loser' in every game, in every sport, that's fine -- that's life -- but to be mercilessly crushed (while a part of real life) doesn't have to be a part of 'childhood'.

Why were those teams even in the same league?If my kid was on the losing side of that fracas, and there were no repercussions for the coach who ignored the league rule, I'd pull my kid out of the league altogether. 

I think what SpamRay is offended by is the attitude you've expressed -- if things don't go my way, I'm out. "My child's self-confidence is a delicate flower, and if you dare to crinkle so much as a single petal, I will remove myself from your presence, and then you'll be sorry." No, we won't. I think the league rule is fine, it's just the heavy-handed application of the rule that's offensive.

The broader point I've seen explicated by a few responses is that kids need to learn to win, so they are better prepared for life in general.  Sure, if you want kids to be sociopathic little monsters that have zero empathy or ability to work cooperatively.

Yeah, so tired of this argument. Life is not one big non-competitive drum circle. Neither is it (nor should it be) a bloodsport requiring adults to be 'sociopaths'. There's a group of people (of which you must be a member) that find the concept of 'winning' to be so very gauche. Isn't it possible that the winning team won because they displayed the non-sociopathic skill set you desire?

[The Mad Professor]

The 'no grades' rule is good for teachers' unions. With no meaningful metric to gauge a teacher's effectiveness, life will be so much easier.

You want to make teacher's lives and jobs easier? Get rid of the goddamned No Child Left Behind and stop basing a teacher's effectiveness (not to mention whether or not they keep their jobs) on whether or not their students pass the standardized tests. Teachers are there to help a student LEARN, not memorize. Unfortunately, so much emphasis is based on these goddamned standardized tests that teachers are forced to forgo traditional lessons in order to prepare students for the exams, and as a result, students are actually learning LESS than they should be. It's bull****, it's wrong, and it's making the next generation dumber by the test.

[IPT]

The 'no grades' rule is good for teachers' unions. With no meaningful metric to gauge a teacher's effectiveness, life will be so much easier.

You want to make teacher's lives and jobs easier? Get rid of the goddamned No Child Left Behind and stop basing a teacher's effectiveness (not to mention whether or not they keep their jobs) on whether or not their students pass the standardized tests. Teachers are there to help a student LEARN, not memorize. Unfortunately, so much emphasis is based on these goddamned standardized tests that teachers are forced to forgo traditional lessons in order to prepare students for the exams, and as a result, students are actually learning LESS than they should be. It's bull****, it's wrong, and it's making the next generation dumber by the test.

so why is it the rest of the world doesn't seem to have this problem?
I can only give examples from southeast asia, but kids in southeast asia have been on the testing curve for a long time.  I don't see the big problem with them being considered dumber by the test.

[iri]

In Finland, children may not get grades for up to 7th year.

Finland ranks consistently among the top countries in school education.

[Krogenar]

Whenever I see anyone ranking on teacher's unions (never firefighter's unions or police unions...) I can guarantee they're motivated by right-wing hatred of public education paid for by taxes.  Enforcing  random metrics for "teacher performance" is the thin wedge issue to try to cut school funding.  You ever notice how performance metrics are never used to justify increased school funding?  Or raise taxes so we can actually have smaller class sizes, more teachers?

I can criticize police and firefighter's unions, too, if you want.

How you can 'guarantee' what my motives are, Tarzan?

I have friends and family members who are in these unions, and make a distinction between the unions and their members. A lot of good people are trapped in these foul, foul organizations. What I notice about education in America is this: we reward failure and punish success -- which is precisely the opposite of how the real world works. If you run a business poorly, you don't get additional funding, you get less. Poorly-run schools, however, they get more money. They're the public sector equivalent of 'too-big-to-fail', and that policy should end in both spheres.

Teacher's unions only ever have one solution for their every shortcoming -- more money. And if you don't agree, you must hate children. Nice racket.

The Republican wet dream is a world where the peons are marginally literate (so they can be easily bamboozled), and only the ones with money can afford to pay for education for their kids.

We already have that! Why would Republicans want to fix the education system by destroying teacher's unions if they already have what you describe? Public education isn't about educating children any more, it's a public works project for teachers. And as a businessperson, I want the public to have a good education -- so I can find someone to hire! I've had so many barely literate candidates fail the most basic math test. I mean it from the bottom of my tarry, black conservative heart -- the world must be a terrifying place when you can barely add fractions, and I feel for these people.

Go peddle that crap somewhere else.

Back at ya, Tarzan. 

[Tarzan]

<snip>
I mean it from the bottom of my tarry, black conservative heart...
<snip>

FTFY

[SpAmRaY]

Perhaps we should start a thread about the merits of common core education. #hottopics2014

[demik]

baby boomers are whats wrong with this world.  and helicopter parenting.

[Krogenar]

The 'no grades' rule is good for teachers' unions. With no meaningful metric to gauge a teacher's effectiveness, life will be so much easier.

You want to make teacher's lives and jobs easier? Get rid of the goddamned No Child Left Behind and stop basing a teacher's effectiveness (not to mention whether or not they keep their jobs) on whether or not their students pass the standardized tests. Teachers are there to help a student LEARN, not memorize. Unfortunately, so much emphasis is based on these goddamned standardized tests that teachers are forced to forgo traditional lessons in order to prepare students for the exams, and as a result, students are actually learning LESS than they should be. It's bull****, it's wrong, and it's making the next generation dumber by the test.

I would go far further. I would institute a national educational voucher program. How much are we going to spend per pupil for their education? Let's say $5000 per child? Okay, every parent gets a voucher for that amount. Then you can find a school of your choice for your child, and $5000 towards the tuition. If the tuition is $6000, then find the extra $1000 on your own. Existing public schools will accept the voucher along with your child, however -- the parent would retain the right to decide where their child goes. So, if your local school is ****ty, pull your kid, pull the funding, and put the money towards a school that does work.

Then the successful public schools would get more money, more kids, and hopefully grow. Bad schools would wither and die if they couldn't improve. And private sector schools (religious or not) would get funding if they were effective. This would put the parents in the driver's seat, instead of the unions. The answer is more choices, more power, for parents -- and less for the unions.

[Krogenar]

<snip>
I mean it from the bottom of my tarry, black conservative heart...
<snip>

FTFY

It's fine, I think you're evil too. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_voucher

[Xowie]

The 'no grades' rule is good for teachers' unions. With no meaningful metric to gauge a teacher's effectiveness, life will be so much easier.

You want to make teacher's lives and jobs easier? Get rid of the goddamned No Child Left Behind and stop basing a teacher's effectiveness (not to mention whether or not they keep their jobs) on whether or not their students pass the standardized tests. Teachers are there to help a student LEARN, not memorize. Unfortunately, so much emphasis is based on these goddamned standardized tests that teachers are forced to forgo traditional lessons in order to prepare students for the exams, and as a result, students are actually learning LESS than they should be. It's bull****, it's wrong, and it's making the next generation dumber by the test.

I would go far further. I would institute a national educational voucher program. How much are we going to spend per pupil for their education? Let's say $5000 per child? Okay, every parent gets a voucher for that amount. Then you can find a school of your choice for your child, and $5000 towards the tuition. If the tuition is $6000, then find the extra $1000 on your own. Existing public schools will accept the voucher along with your child, however -- the parent would retain the right to decide where their child goes. So, if your local school is ****ty, pull your kid, pull the funding, and put the money towards a school that does work.

Then the successful public schools would get more money, more kids, and hopefully grow. Bad schools would wither and die if they couldn't improve. And private sector schools (religious or not) would get funding if they were effective. This would put the parents in the driver's seat, instead of the unions. The answer is more choices, more power, for parents -- and less for the unions.

And for families that can not afford the $1000/yr/child? Or families that do not value education to pay the $1000/yr/child? Seems like you will still have some of the same problems we have now. Children from more well off families will go to better schools while children from less fortunate families will go to worse schools.

[IvanIvanovich]

Up through elementary ages, having no score keeping is fine. It's about an activity, learning how things work, it's rules, socialization and so on. I don't agree with the all are same/equal there though as it only breeds bad ideas and sense of entitlement at a young age. But it needs to shift over to competitive basis eventually once a certain age is reached. Then it's time to learn life isn't fair, that you have to actually work at something to improve skills, learn from failure and more.
As far as the US education system, it's been declining by design. It's all about controlling the population. If people get too intelligent it becomes a huge problem for those in power. They also want to keep that massive disparity in the income divide going.

The biggest problem with education in my view is the idea of grade levels. It's why I hated traditional school so much. If it wasn't for alternative school where I was able to complete courses on my own very quick pace I wouldn't have even graduated.
People learn things in different ways, at different paces. It would be much better to have classes based on aptitude than age group... at least for those of us that would operate better that way.

[Tarzan]

And for families that can not afford the $1000/yr/child? Or families that do not value education to pay the $1000/yr/child? Seems like you will still have some of the same problems we have now. Children from more well off families will go to better schools while children from less fortunate families will go to worse schools.

You've hit the nail on the head.  Voucher programs are just another effort by "business folks" to cut their taxes that go towards education, while leaving the door wide open to spend anything they want on private schools.

My son goes to public school, even though we can afford private school.  He's had a mix of good-to-great teachers, and looks forward every day to new challenges in his classroom.  Overall I think our school is rated middle/upper for our area, but that hasn't prevented the state from cutting educational budgets so they've had to eliminate teaching positions and increase class sizes.  I never expected growing up that my government would be so focused on cutting education funding, the concept is so at odds with our image as a great nation.