Author Topic: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X  (Read 6578 times)

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Offline ShivaYash

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Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« on: Thu, 30 October 2014, 10:03:48 »
Dear all,

I picked up a very cheap FILCO NUMPAD for use with my iMac 27. The model number is FKB22MB, serial number 28110496. Does this mean it was manufactured 28th week of 2011?

It was rather dirty and I cleaned it up nicely, it looks very good now, but it does not work with my iMac! I have just read two long threads about this issue, and wish I had done before.

Is there a nice fix via Karabiner to get this thing working? The issue I'm having is this: I plug it in and it works for about 80 key presses and then dies. Is this due to the wrong codes going to the computer?

If not, then I have a very nice and clean FILCO numpad for sale ;-)
Of course, I'll post a sale ad properly but would ideally like to keep this.

With best,
SY
IBM Model M SSK, HHKB Pro 2 BT and Realforce 104U HiPro

Offline saturnotaku

  • Posts: 680
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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #1 on: Thu, 30 October 2014, 10:40:21 »
While I don't have a fix for your issue, I can point you to a mechanical keypad that works properly with OS X. Link. It has MX Blue switches, but they offer them with Browns. I'm sure they would be happy to sell you one if you asked. I made a quick video about it.


Offline ShivaYash

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #2 on: Thu, 30 October 2014, 10:42:32 »
While I don't have a fix for your issue, I can point you to a mechanical keypad that works properly with OS X. Link. It has MX Blue switches, but they offer them with Browns. I'm sure they would be happy to sell you one if you asked. I made a quick video about it.


Thanks.
IBM Model M SSK, HHKB Pro 2 BT and Realforce 104U HiPro

Offline osi

  • Posts: 964
Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 30 October 2014, 10:43:53 »
There was a thread earlier about a similar situation. Diatec states that the filco numpad is only compatible with windows.

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=64919.msg1519714#msg1519714

Offline ShivaYash

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 30 October 2014, 11:18:09 »
What I don't understand is why the keypad works for a while and then 'switches OFF'...!

123456789/*

These numbers above were typed with the numpad.

And then the BLUE LED light stays on and it 'freezes up'.

ANNOYING.
IBM Model M SSK, HHKB Pro 2 BT and Realforce 104U HiPro

Offline saturnotaku

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 30 October 2014, 11:24:08 »
Do you have a Windows machine you can plug the pad into just to rule out the possibility of it being a hardware defect?

Offline ShivaYash

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 30 October 2014, 17:04:56 »
Interesting, a quick phone call with The Keyboard Company based in Gloucester has given me the answer, and I hope it helps fellow Mac users who wish to employ a FILCO NUMPAD. It is the EQUAL KEY that causes the unit to effective crash and renders it useless until 'rebooted', but un and re plugging the USB cable.

ALL other keys work as they should bar the 00 key and the EQUAL key, pressing the latter does not work and it does not 'de-press' according to the computer, hence the freeze.

I did not realise the profile of the numpad is rather unique, but for the time being have placed a RED FILCO KEY CAP where the EQUAL key goes, as a subtle reminder, not to press. Otherwise of the sake of £16.50 and free delivery, I am delighted. I gave the whole thing a jolly good clean but testament to FILCO's robust build quality, it shined up, almost as key. The keycaps are a different story, but I use a tiny about of 'Bar Keeper's Friend' - cleaner and polish on them, and the whole unit body in fact, hence it's almost as new looks now. This polish looks to have given all the keys an almost factory like finish, it has a very gentle cutting compound and I've been using it for so many things around the house - from my Dualit toaster to my newly acquired secondhand KBs! Always test a small patch first and only use the smallest amount.

In conclusion, I think this unit, the FILCO NUMPAD is terribly overpriced at nearly £50, but I did bag a bargain after all. Also have contacted the developer of KARABINER to see if he can work his magic for me and re-pgraomme the EQUAL key to avoid this crash - perhaps impossible but worth trying.
IBM Model M SSK, HHKB Pro 2 BT and Realforce 104U HiPro

Offline Wonko73

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #7 on: Fri, 31 October 2014, 08:24:23 »
Hi there,

please sit down, take a deep breath and read this - YOU WILL LOVE ME ;)


I was really not pleased because of my not working TenKeyPad.... and I said something to myself like "damn digital crap" and "a few years ago analog signals would have worked". Well ... and than I did an experiment:

Doing this: TenKeyPad-USB --> old Filco Adapter to PS2 --> new Lindy converter to USB again.

Well - it works like a charm now!

There are a few things to mention:
1. the " 00 " key (double zero) does not work most of the time and when it is working, it  gives a normal 0
2. Sometimes you can write numbers with NumLock off (!!!) and with NumLock on you can use arrow keys; next time it is the other way round.
3. The " = " causes no freeze any more, but it is backspace, too (?!)
4. The TKP nay take some time before working, on my desktop more or less 30 seconds after machine is bootet

I have to try this with my Macbook Air later, but one of my Linux-Thinkpads works fine with it (Running Crunchhbang).



EDIT: I just tried it with my Macbook Air: It is the same like above with one big problem: NumLock is on and you can't switch it off. This means: Only numbers, no arrow-functions. Well ... but it does work ... somewho ... 
« Last Edit: Fri, 31 October 2014, 09:03:56 by Wonko73 »
Filco TKL MX Blue | Filco TKP brown | HHKB2 Type S | Realforce 23U

Offline ShivaYash

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #8 on: Fri, 31 October 2014, 13:43:34 »
Elegant solution!
IBM Model M SSK, HHKB Pro 2 BT and Realforce 104U HiPro

Offline ShivaYash

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #9 on: Wed, 05 November 2014, 09:54:22 »
To bring this matter to a close, I have been in touch with the developer behind KARABINER - an incredibly nice and kind man who solved the issue. Apparently on my FILCO NUMPAD, the vendor ID was strange, and not the usual ID for such a device. He wrote a personalised XML file and now it all works via USB plugged into a powered hub - exactly what I wanted.

So if you have a FILCO NUMPAD and its not working with a Mac, its an idea to check, and I have permission from Takayama Fumihiko to distribute the file.

But this post is just a jolly well deserved thank you to him.

With best wishes,
SY
IBM Model M SSK, HHKB Pro 2 BT and Realforce 104U HiPro

Offline planet36

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 29 January 2015, 12:49:51 »
.... He wrote a personalised XML file and now it all works via USB plugged into a powered hub - exactly what I wanted.

So if you have a FILCO NUMPAD and its not working with a Mac, its an idea to check, and I have permission from Takayama Fumihiko to distribute the file.

Where can we find this XML file?

Does the numpad have to be plugged into a hub to work correctly?

Offline ShivaYash

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 29 January 2015, 12:50:31 »
Send me your email address.
IBM Model M SSK, HHKB Pro 2 BT and Realforce 104U HiPro

Offline Valen

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #12 on: Sun, 22 March 2015, 21:42:37 »
I bought this number pad without realizing it was not designed for Mac. Can someone send me the XML file? Thanks a lot.

Offline spiceBar

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #13 on: Mon, 23 March 2015, 08:04:27 »
I have the exact same numpad and noticed the problem with the Mac as soon as I tried it.

I also noticed that it did not hang after some time, but when you pressed some keys. My solution has been to purchase Filco key locks and to lock the faulty keys.

Can you just post the Karabiner XML file here? People looking for a solution to this problem will be able to find it even in 3 years from now.

Offline ATXTider

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #14 on: Mon, 23 March 2015, 16:08:11 »
Or post it on Github

Offline Valen

  • Posts: 80
Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #15 on: Tue, 24 March 2015, 21:32:21 »
First I want to thank the developer, planet36 and ShivaYash for sharing the file.

Now the bad news; this private.xml does not work on my Tenkeypad. To make things short, the 1st and 2nd layers work but my "8"does not which is a big let down.

I contacted Mr Takayama and the response from him was "Filco has released several keypads and they have different behavior on
OS X, one works fine with Karabiner, other does not." and recommended other apps which might solve this issue: USB Overdrive and ControllerMate. I tried them both but could not figure out how to use them. I would like to hear from you if you find out a solution.

 I am selecting the following two options in Karabiner to solve my problem (Only the first layer works but it is good enough):
* Logitech N305 hack / FILCO FKBT22MB hack (Enable equal, parentheses) (Disable NumLock key)
* FILCO Number Pad Hack Force turn NumLock on at FILCO keyboards.
Note: "00" does not work, Number lock and equal keys freezes up.

Since the developer and ShivaYash said that it is fine to distribute the file, I am posting the private.xml below. It may work on yours, who knows...

Quote
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<root>

  <item>
    <name>FILCO Number Pad Hack</name>
    <appendix>Force turn NumLock on at FILCO keyboards.</appendix>
    <identifier>private.cypress_hack</identifier>
    <autogen>
      __ForceNumLockOn__
      DeviceVendor::RawValue::0x04b4,
      DeviceProduct::RawValue::0x0101,
    </autogen>
  </item>

  <item>
    <name>1 Key Hack</name>
    <identifier>private.1keyhack</identifier>
    <device_only>
      DeviceVendor::RawValue::0x04b4,
      DeviceProduct::RawValue::0x0101,
    </device_only>

    <autogen>__KeyToKey__ KeyCode::COMMAND_L, KeyCode::KEYPAD_1</autogen>
    <autogen>__KeyToKey__ KeyCode::CURSOR_RIGHT, KeyCode::VK_NONE</autogen>
  </item>

</root>

Offline vivalarevolución

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Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #16 on: Thu, 26 March 2015, 09:30:31 »
Buy a Leopold numpad.  It works great with Mac, and I can use the navigation layer.
Wish I had some gif or quote for this space, but I got nothing

Offline Valen

  • Posts: 80
Re: Filco NUMPAD - does not work with Mac OS X
« Reply #17 on: Fri, 27 March 2015, 21:59:47 »
Buy a Leopold numpad.  It works great with Mac, and I can use the navigation layer.
I rarely use it and don't I need the navigation layer so I will keep it until I see a good deal on a Leopold or Realforce. By the way this is how I locked the keys that freezes the keypad. That's foam tape and it serves the purpose. Don't feel like buying key stoppers.