Ergonomic mechanical keyboard

[Jcooper01]

I think that the Maltron will have some of the same issues as the Kinesis (unless I'm not looking at the one you meant).  Anyone have any feedback on the Northgate Evolution?

[itlnstln]

Anyone have any feedback on the Northgate Evolution?

Why yes, I do.
 
Great keyboard.  It's worth every penny you spend on it.  It should last you the rest of your natural life and can be used as a weapon on anyone or anything that should want to end your life prematurely.  The only downside is that it is incredibly loud.  I would highly suggest that you buy one along with an AEKII or SGI 'board (a broken, "parts only" keyboards would be perfect for this).  Both of those have sliders with dampers which are very quiet.  Replace the siders in the Northgate with the dampened ones from the donor keyboard.  There are detailed instructions how to modify Alps switches in the Mods forum.

[Jcooper01]

Do you have wrist problems?  Does the flatness of the Northgate bother you at all?

[itlnstln]

The flatness of the Northgate is perfect.  I never raise the back of my keyboards.  I don't use the Northgate much anymore sue to noise, though.  I used to have wrist problems, but I found out it mainly due to my mouse not my keyboard.

[Jcooper01]

So what mouse are you using?

[itlnstln]

So what mouse are you using?

The MS Natural Wireless Laser Mouse 6000.

[keyb_gr]

The MS Natural Wireless Laser Mouse 6000.

That's quite a mouse-, err, mouthful. Don't these have a super sensitive scroll wheel? I know someone with one of the higher-end wireless MS KB/mouse sets (should be the 6000), and this still bothers him even at sensitivity all the way down.

[itlnstln]

That's quite a mouse-, err, mouthful. Don't these have a super sensitive scroll wheel? I know someone with one of the higher-end wireless MS KB/mouse sets (should be the 6000), and this still bothers him even at sensitivity all the way down.

No. As a matter of fact, I love the scroll-wheel on this thing. I do data analysis, so I scroll through lots of spreadheets, datasets, etc., so the smooth scroll-wheel is very nice (I love the side-to-side scrolling, too). I don't find it any more sensitive than any of the Logitechs I have owned. I have always set my sensitivity to three lines.
 
Now that I think about it, I did have one instance where the scroll-wheel was hyper-sensitive, but a quick rest of the mouse fixed it.

[lowpoly]

Let's make one? Who wants to be the first to post the mod?

This would require custom keycaps and a custom switch pcb.

[keyb_gr]

This would require custom keycaps and a custom switch pcb.

Or make that custom keycaps and two custom switch PCBs with ribbon cable interconnect. Seems like the connection between the two halves (a membrane "ribbon cable") is the weak point in the 4000.

[Jcooper01]

Well, I bought the Northgate OmniKey Evolution and I'll report back.

[itlnstln]

Well, I bought the Northgate OmniKey Evolution and I'll report back.

Good choice.  You will be happy.

[Jcooper01]

So I've been using the Northgate Omnikey Evolution for a few days now and I love it for the most part.  The keys are very tactile (but loud) and have a very solid feel to them.  My coworkers haven't killed me yet, so that's another plus.

The arrow keys are in a non-standard location, but that doesn't bother me as much as I though it would.  I use pipes a lot while typing and, for whatever reason, my hands naturally use the left Shift key, which poses a problem on this keyboard.  I'll just have to unlearn that habit.  

I opted for the version with the Glidepoint trackpad because I figured that having a trackpad would be better than having an empty spot.  It turns out that using the trackpad really helps my RSI.  My only wish is that it were a bit larger in area and that the buttons were on the bottom.  

Does anyone know how difficult it would be to swap this trackpad for a more modern one?

[itlnstln]

So I've been using the Northgate Omnikey Evolution for a few days now and I love it for the most part. The keys are very tactile (but loud) and have a very solid feel to them. My coworkers haven't killed me yet, so that's another plus.
 
The arrow keys are in a non-standard location, but that doesn't bother me as much as I though it would. I use pipes a lot while typing and, for whatever reason, my hands naturally use the left Shift key, which poses a problem on this keyboard. I'll just have to unlearn that habit.
 
I opted for the version with the Glidepoint trackpad because I figured that having a trackpad would be better than having an empty spot. It turns out that using the trackpad really helps my RSI. My only wish is that it were a bit larger in area and that the buttons were on the bottom.
 
Does anyone know how difficult it would be to swap this trackpad for a more modern one?

As long as it fits in the case, I don't think it should be too hard.  You might have to cut the wires on the original and attach them to the new, but other than that, you should be able to make a direct swap.

[iMav]

Has anyone gotten their hands on a SmartBoard from Data Desk Tech?  (and/or is their "SmartBoard 2" shipping at all?)

[wellington1869]

is that the smartboard? how much? looks neat.
looks a bit like the typematrix keyb which puts keys on inside fingers too, tho i think this one is better.

[Rajagra]

I'm considering one of these. I think the layout is utterly brilliant btw. Look how it achieves big reductions in hand travel by moving important stuff to the inside fingers and thumbs. Visually it makes me drool. It is a very interesting design and device.

They SO stole my idea from the which fingers go where thread! :lol:


Seriously though, that looks pretty good.

[rdjack21]

I've been eying that keyboard ever since I saw it in another thread. Thanks for those pictures as well that really helped in finding the manufacture. What just blew me away is that thing has Topre switches (all 45g) in it Wow! But man it is sure not cheap. 52,500 yen + another 9,450 yen for the wrist rest. That makes it what around $576 just for the keyboard. I think I will have to hold off on it for a bit.

webwit are you going to get one? If it really works out as well as it should it just may be worth it.

[wellington1869]

I've been eying that keyboard ever since I saw it in another thread. Thanks for those pictures as well that really helped in finding the manufacture. What just blew me away is that thing has Topre switches in it! Wow. But man it is sure not cheap. 52,500 yen + another 9,450 yen for the wrist rest. That makes it what around $576 just for the keyboard. I think I will have to hold off on it for a bit.

webwit are you going to get one? If it really works out as well as it should it just may be worth it.

this is one of those things where if i had a full time job i'd probably buy it cuz one can always justify these things if one is spending 10 hours a day in front of the keyboard (and have some spare cash). Some employers would subsidize it too cuz its ergo.

[rdjack21]

http://www.personal-media.co.jp/webshop/others/utronkb.html
( links to http://www.personal-media.co.jp/utronkb/ and
http://www.uctec.com/index.html )

I may or may not buy it depending on availability and quotes from japanese buyer services.

And yeah, it's the only ergonomic Topre keyboard in existence.

Wouldn't it be nice if you could go for a walk and buy this in a shop? ...

Show Image

Ah I see you found the thread. And yes it would be nice to take a walk find it in a shop and see if I liked it before droping that kind of money on it. But still it should be a really nice board even if you left if you left flat on the desk.

[lal]

For not even *half* a thousand dollars?  You disappoint me, webwit

[o2dazone]

you're a madman
grats!

[rdh]

Topre switches, a symmetric split key layout, no shortage of modifier keys to play with, no Windows key...  what's not to like?

Well, the price, yeah.

Still, really tempting.  We'll be expecting a full report when you get it, webwit.  :-)

[rdh]

Apparently this keyboard is based on one from 1991:



More info here.  

As usual, the Google translation is amusing: "TRON keyboard has a unique shape of a mound, electronic pen tablet in the center foreground, TRON is a unique and quite unique keyboard sequences."

Unique and quite unique.


EDIT: Oops, meant to use this link.

[rdjack21]

Yes I agree we need a review of it when you get it. And please some good pictures of those keys. The ones on there site give the impression that the keys are sloped differently and have a deferent shape on the top as well. I'm really interested in that board. But I will have to wait a bit before I can get my hands on one.

[rdjack21]

For not even *half* a thousand dollars?  You disappoint me, webwit

Why? I know you dislike Topre switches but still. Besides he already has a few boards that are even more expensive.

[rdjack21]

Apparently this keyboard is based on one from 1991:

Show Image

More info here.  

As usual, the Google translation is amusing: "TRON keyboard has a unique shape of a mound, electronic pen tablet in the center foreground, TRON is a unique and quite unique keyboard sequences."

Unique and quite unique.


EDIT: Oops, meant to use this link.

That is actually kind of interesting as well.

Check this out

○ good typing feel comfortable to use

  Price of PC keyboards are much cheaper and popular. Now find the keyboard difficult to use even for a bad touch. "ΜTRON keyboard" is good and reliability of touch, the keyboard is used for operations that require durability, using a noncontact capacitive switches. 押SHI付KENAKU it is possible to enter the key to the bottom, allowing light to enter in less shock to the finger touch. The keyboard is a price fall into the category of high prices, the products you use something like永KU favorite pen.

So they used Topre switches on this one as well. But I have to say I like the new one better. Oh and the last part is just great. "The Keyboard is a price fall into the category of high prices" that just cracks me up.

[lal]

Why? I know you dislike Topre switches but still. Besides he already has a few boards that are even more expensive.

That was exactly the joke.  This board is not webwit's class.

BTW, I don't know if I would like Topre switches or not.  Probably not, but that doesn't matter.  My point is that I consider them as relatives of oxygen free cables and other audiophile stuff in that they cost a fortune while not providing a real advantage over standard products.

[wellington1869]

BTW, I don't know if I would like Topre switches or not.  .

lal, as a fellow bs fan, my guess is you wouldnt like them. I mean look what happened to me. when I first got them i was intrigued, for about 2 weeks. I'm back on the endurapro now, pretty much full time (to my own surprise, i thought the infatuation with topres would last longer).

I mean dont get me wrong, for the class of switch that topres are, they are probably the best in their class (ie, fairly light and relatively silent). But those who like bs switches are, i think, of another genre altogether. Its harder to just switch genres. I've always liked 'meaty' and clicky.  ANd in that class I'd say bs's are the best, for me anyway.

(Esp with minor mods that have made them usable for me -- unicomp's slighlty lighter spring (I still think taht is the case anyway), a spot of silicon dry spray on the stems (I'm pretty sure my key resistance on the endurapro is around 60g now, which seems fine to me, I may not even need them to be 55), and a spot of silicon grease to take just a slight touch of the sound off (making them useable with my roommates around, they havent complained anymore). Perfection.

Like webwit, if I hang on to my topres, it'll be to use when I'm working in mixed company, or at work, or with people who are studying or sleeping. I do still think in their class the topres are the best, and thats maybe a reason for keeping it if I already have it, but I think it wouldnt be a reason to buy it if I didnt have it.

[rdjack21]

My point is that I consider them as relatives of oxygen free cables and other audiophile stuff in that they cost a fortune while not providing a real advantage over standard products.

Oh man I'm in trouble now. While I agree with you on the oxygen free cables I would not agree that all audiophile stuff is not worth while. And yes I do happen to own some audiophile stuff as well. And I do have to agree that the Topre switch is not for everyone and you may be right with your comparison of the Topre with audiophile stuff. In that in both cases it is the search for perfection in a particular category. Even though we can't quite reach perfection it is pretty darn close. And it is also true that most people are just fine with the consumer level junk. But here on this board we are about moving up the food chain to something a little more refined. And even in this more refined category there are levels of refinement and the associated costs that are inherent in moving further up the chain. So you have the consumer level junk (cheap) then you have the standard mechanical boards (more expensive and more refined) then you have various categories of even more refined boards that cost more. Some want that refinement others are just fine where they are. Then their are those that just had to see was that next step up the ladder really worth it or not. Of those some found it not worth the asciated cost to move up the ladder and there are those that decided that it was worth it for what ever reason (that's me).

I have also stated many times if you are happy with what you have then there is really no reason to try a Topre board. But if on the other hand you have tried all the switches and feel that there is still something missing then you should at least give it a try. True you may not like it but then again you may.