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geekhack Marketplace => Vendor Forums => KeyClack => Topic started by: Hyde on Sun, 01 April 2018, 21:31:21

Title: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Sun, 01 April 2018, 21:31:21
Hello I'm just wondering if there's any update regarding the V2 version Topre Silence Rings?

For those who don't know I'm referring to this:  https://www.instagram.com/p/Bfe9T7MFuv1/?hl=en&taken-by=keyclack

Thanks!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Thu, 05 April 2018, 12:53:27
*bird chirping*
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Velvet_Crowe on Thu, 05 April 2018, 13:27:22
FYI, jchan said he'll be away until 14th so you probably won't get an update until then
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Mon, 09 April 2018, 13:45:32
lol cool thanks for the heads up!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: jchan94 on Wed, 11 April 2018, 15:17:28
Hi,

So the proposed finalized fix, is because the of the tolerance of rubber rings, we have to change up the design.

Instead of having a design which goes around the rings, I'm currently working on one that goes in the housing. This will achieve the same silencing result, without the nuance of ring installation.

My current timeline is to finalize  the design and have samples by end of April ~

edit:

This is because applying the adhesive to such a thin piece is not possible due to the the thinness. We've tried a few manufacturing methods, but none yielded a satisfactory result.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Fri, 13 April 2018, 17:02:28
Awesome, thanks for the update!  :D

I'll go fiddle with my Cherry keyboards in the meantime lol.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Tyson on Tue, 24 April 2018, 12:15:45
Any update?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: jchan94 on Tue, 24 April 2018, 16:12:33
Any update?

I'm waiting for the mold to be updated for production currently.

I'm expecting a production sample by 4/30, if not early May.

--

If you'd otherwise like a refund, just email support@keyclack.com ; to note, it will be a full refund, and you opt out of a v2.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Koatl on Wed, 09 May 2018, 23:25:33
Excited for these. Hoping to pick up another bag of 110 Heavy domes and a set of these rings when available.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Tue, 15 May 2018, 05:55:17
Any news on this? I'm curious how they would work compared to Hypersphere's silencing rings, which I've been happy with on a HHKB Pro 2 and an ANSI Novatouch.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Thu, 17 May 2018, 12:58:16
Any news on this? I'm curious how they would work compared to Hypersphere's silencing rings, which I've been happy with on a HHKB Pro 2 and an ANSI Novatouch.

I'm in the same boat, it's like all the existing solutions have their flaws so I'm hoping this would be the perfect middle ground.

KBDFans Rings = too thin, not enough dampen, but doesn't effect switch travel.
Hypersphere Rings = too thick, but dampen really well, but also effect switch travel.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Thu, 17 May 2018, 13:11:30
It probably depends on the hands typing. I donít really feel any difference between my HHKB Type-S and my HHKB Pro 2 with Hypersphereís rings installed to be honest. Iím still curious about these though.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: bizzy11 on Thu, 17 May 2018, 13:24:55
I felt like the KBDfans rings are perfect, but I didn't swap to BKE domes or use any lube.

Worst part about it was the install though, so if these are easier to install without any reduced tactility then definitely interested...
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Sun, 20 May 2018, 11:35:18
It probably depends on the hands typing. I donít really feel any difference between my HHKB Type-S and my HHKB Pro 2 with Hypersphereís rings installed to be honest. Iím still curious about these though.

I used Hypersphere first then switch to KBDFans right after (same keyboard, Realforce 104UW), and there is definitely a noticeable difference in turns of tactility and travel reduction.

I felt like the KBDfans rings are perfect, but I didn't swap to BKE domes or use any lube.

Worst part about it was the install though, so if these are easier to install without any reduced tactility then definitely interested...

Yeah I agree KBDFans for the most part is not bad, once in a while you'll get 1 or 2 switch that's "sticky".  Sometimes the ring got stuck to the ceiling and when you type on it it goes out of align then the switch won't reset fully.

Hypersphere's dampining portion glued to a plastic ring (non sticky, but stiff) which prevent the ring from mis-alignment, drawback is that since it's 2 layers so it's thicker.

lol I guess silencing properly without the purple slider is pretty hard.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Mon, 04 June 2018, 07:22:14
Have we heard an update regarding these? I bought these and the heavy domes back in Febuary, and I sent an email him back in mid April and he said it would be finished at the end of April.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Fri, 08 June 2018, 09:15:51
Have we heard an update regarding these? I bought these and the heavy domes back in Febuary, and I sent an email him back in mid April and he said it would be finished at the end of April.

I havenít seen any updates.  Same boat as you
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Fri, 08 June 2018, 09:38:51
I havenít seen any updates.  Same boat as you

Quite unfortunate for sure.. I see the domes posted in /r/mechmarket all the time and at this point I'm ready to just cancel my order.

Also coulnd't help but notice.. Tennessee, I haven't met many of us from TN but glad to know they are out there haha.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Gacct on Sat, 09 June 2018, 09:50:29
He just put an update out yesterday showing the render of the new pads on instagram. Still seems like it's going to be a while before they're ready to ship.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Mon, 11 June 2018, 08:00:52
He just put an update out yesterday showing the render of the new pads on instagram. Still seems like it's going to be a while before they're ready to ship.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Here is the post from June 9

Quote
Many have wondered what's up with the Silencing Rings, but have no fear, we're nearly finished with them. Here are some renders of what you can expect soon!
💛
Our supplier is slated to finish the v6 mold update in 10 days, and we'll have the production 10 days after that.
🍃
The silencing rings come with an pre applied adhesive to stick to the housing of topre keyboards. We have not verified compatibility with other electrocapacitive keyboards. A provided tool will be used to install the rubber dampener onto the housings. The dampeners can be easily removed, but shouldn't be reused. Because of this, we will be providing 130 pcs to allow for error.

So looks like another 3 weeks until they are completed, then shipping. So looks like about a month wait.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Mon, 11 June 2018, 15:55:55
The thickness seems to sit in the middle between Hypersphere and KBDFans rings, this looks promising so far since I find Hypersphere too thick and KBDFans too thin.

Hypersphere = 0.5 mm
KeyClack = 0.35 mm
KBDFans = 0.25 mm

Hopefullyl this would be a good middle ground.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Tue, 12 June 2018, 03:48:00
Hmm. I took out a slider from my HHKB Pro 2 (with one of Hypersphere's rings installed), and my HHKB Type-S.

I measured the thickness of the rings using a digital vernier caliper. They both measured very close to 0.4 mm. Another thing I noticed is that the material used for the silencing ring in the Type-S is much(!) softer than that of the Hypersphere ring.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Tue, 12 June 2018, 16:31:09
LOL ok maybe I was a bit generalizing on the numbers but here is where I found the number from.

https://imgur.com/a/32HBk

But yes I also heard the silicone ring from HHKB Type-S is much softer, probably explain why it dampen better, the purple slider also offset 0.2 mm, so 0.4 mm would realistically be only 0.2 mm difference (which explains the minimal impact on travel distance).
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Wed, 13 June 2018, 02:54:09
That looks a bit funny. Maybe the guy who took the photo forgot to zero the vernier caliper? Anyway, I also took measurements using a regular (analog) vernier caliper, and it definitely looks to be less than 0.5 mm thick.

Also, remember that whatever silencing ring is used, the material will compress when the sliders are pressed up by the domes. So the travel distance will not be affected by the thickness of the ring when it is uncompressed...
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: jchan94 on Tue, 19 June 2018, 17:31:23
I should have the production update today, as I'm told by the manufacturer. They are still finalizing the mold change to allow the 3M tape to be installed properly. The issue is with the thinness of some points, where the center circle (the hole where the slider goes through), making it difficult to manufacture.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: h9n9n3 on Sat, 30 June 2018, 06:00:45
Looking forward to this!!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: knaack on Wed, 04 July 2018, 10:59:33
Will these work on the Realforce RGB without doing a mod like mentioned in this post?  https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86901.0
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Koatl on Tue, 10 July 2018, 13:57:41
Glad I haven't missed out on this. Looking forward to any updates!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: h9n9n3 on Thu, 12 July 2018, 10:14:03
Any news for this? I need this!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Thu, 19 July 2018, 07:18:55
I sent an email a couple days ago and got an update. My 6 month paypal dispute window is closing in so I wanted to see how to proceed. He said that the silencing rings would be shipping from production on Monday and then he hopes to have them shipped out to us by Friday.

Also if you do not have a previous order of silencing rings, the new rings will be $5 more than the original.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: h9n9n3 on Thu, 19 July 2018, 14:15:37
I sent an email a couple days ago and got an update. My 6 month paypal dispute window is closing in so I wanted to see how to proceed. He said that the silencing rings would be shipping from production on Monday and then he hopes to have them shipped out to us by Friday.

Also if you do not have a previous order of silencing rings, the new rings will be $5 more than the original.

Thanks for sharing this!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Gacct on Fri, 27 July 2018, 09:54:31
I sent an email a couple days ago and got an update. My 6 month paypal dispute window is closing in so I wanted to see how to proceed. He said that the silencing rings would be shipping from production on Monday and then he hopes to have them shipped out to us by Friday.

Also if you do not have a previous order of silencing rings, the new rings will be $5 more than the original.

Doesn't seem like they're going to be shipped out today, wonder if he has even received them.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Fri, 27 July 2018, 13:44:24
I know.. Shocker.. If I wasn't so active on /r/mm I would be upset. Its been 6 months and the only communication I have had is because I reached out to him.. Hopefully he posts on here or his instagram or something so we know whats up.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Wed, 01 August 2018, 04:38:04
So... Any updates on this?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Koatl on Wed, 01 August 2018, 23:01:08
Just got in my FC980C. Looking to silence this bad boy. Hoping to get these rings when and if available!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Thu, 02 August 2018, 07:58:54
So... Any updates on this?

I haven't seen anything. Come tomorrow I have to go for a refund. I'm down to the last couple days of my 6 months paypal window. Was really hoping to have heard something.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Gacct on Thu, 09 August 2018, 10:03:14
So... Any updates on this?

I haven't seen anything. Come tomorrow I have to go for a refund. I'm down to the last couple days of my 6 months paypal window. Was really hoping to have heard something.

Latest update from an email from Jchan stated he has all of the rings on hand and is now printing the installation tool. No update on timeline however.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Wed, 15 August 2018, 08:37:51
https://www.instagram.com/p/BmfUUcYFcy1/?hl=en&taken-by=keyclack

"The Topre silencing v2 rings are finally finished. We'll be shipping them out to everyone who got a v1 this week.
⛰️
The package will come with 150 pcs, as sometimes, installation isn't perfect. They also come with a 3D printed tool for installation onto the top housing.
🚚
If you've moved addresses, please let us know via support@keyclack.com. If we shipped it, with the incorrect address, just let us know and we'll reship one to you. You'll get an email when your package has shipped as well."

My paypal dispute is remaining open until I get them though.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Wed, 15 August 2018, 10:15:46
Thanks for the update, BHuber09.

Good to hear we're (hopefully) finally getting what we paid for in the first place.  :thumb:
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Wed, 15 August 2018, 10:32:23
Thanks for the update, BHuber09.

Good to hear we're (hopefully) finally getting what we paid for in the first place.  :thumb:

Hopefully lol. Only thing is that picture still very much looks like a render.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Wed, 15 August 2018, 10:37:20
Hopefully lol. Only thing is that picture still very much looks like a render.

I was just thinking the same thing, lol. We'll see... Hopefully he pulls through this time.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Koatl on Wed, 15 August 2018, 23:40:13
Apparently they're in: https://www.instagram.com/p/BmfUUcYFcy1/?taken-by=keyclack

Hope I get a chance to buy some soon.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: sybase on Thu, 23 August 2018, 19:59:16
I emailed KeyClack and they said the rings would be back in the stock by the end of this week. Tomorrow is Friday, so hopefully we see something???
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Fri, 24 August 2018, 07:28:06
They also said that they would have the rings done in March. And April. And June. And 3 weeks ago. I'm not holding my breath.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Fri, 31 August 2018, 03:15:26
I just received an email from Keyclack telling me that the new rings have been shipped.

Quote
Hi!

First of all, thank you for your patience, in letting me fix the Topre Silencing Rings. I know you've had high expectations for this ring.

Secondly, your package has shipped. This is confirmation that your TOPRE SILENCING RINGS are on the way to you.

They will be in a small envelope, and come with the following contents:
150 pcs silencing rings
Here is a small guide, and they do require 2 tools
Tweezers ! Any type will do.
Pencil or another set of tweezers.
Guide: https://imgur.com/a/e4tQUWu
Originally, the plans were to include an installation tool, but turns out that the tool didn't help as much as I had hoped. With self alignment, it was much more easy.

Again, sorry for the inconvenience in this. I hope you enjoy the dampening rings.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Fri, 31 August 2018, 04:22:17
Since it's pretty easy to miss, I just thought I'd mention that JChan wrote this in the imgur instructions:

Quote
If you've previously purchased this set of rings in our V1, I apologize for the delay. It took a while to get this right, on top of fulfilling.  If you are interested in purchasing another Topre product, such as Rings, or BKE domes, we'd like to offer you a discount for the inconvenience. The discount is 20% off any Topre-related products. Please confirm your order number for the rings, and we'll help you out.

Again, sorry for the inconvenience.

Please email us at support@keyclack.com for any questions.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Fri, 31 August 2018, 11:08:10
Oh heck yeah! You'll have to let us know how they are man. I just had to escalate my case just to keep it open but really hope they get shipped out before long!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Sat, 01 September 2018, 16:28:05
Maybe it is unlikely, but I am quite looking forward to when I'll be able to buy these on the store, and hope it is soon :D
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Sat, 01 September 2018, 20:18:36
Got a notification for something shipping.  I think itís these bc I donít have anything else coming
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: sybase on Wed, 05 September 2018, 20:46:04
They're back in stock on KeyClack!!!  :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Thu, 06 September 2018, 05:39:39
So the V1 rings were about half as thick as Hypersphere's rings (according to https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/7y2vr5/keyclack_topre_silencing_rings/). V2 is about twice as thick as V1 (according to https://www.instagram.com/p/Bfe9T7MFuv1/?hl=en&taken-by=keyclack)

So what's the advantage compared to using Hypersphere's rings then? They seem to be much more difficult to mount.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Thu, 06 September 2018, 08:25:44
So the V1 rings were about half as thick as Hypersphere's rings (according to https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/7y2vr5/keyclack_topre_silencing_rings/). V2 is about twice as thick as V1 (according to https://www.instagram.com/p/Bfe9T7MFuv1/?hl=en&taken-by=keyclack)

So what's the advantage compared to using Hypersphere's rings then? They seem to be much more difficult to mount.

I can compare the thickness of a Hypersphere ring and a V2 ring when I get them.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Thu, 06 September 2018, 08:27:26
That'd be great - thanks!
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Thu, 06 September 2018, 14:41:54
Just got my shipping notification. I'll keep everyone updated.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Thu, 06 September 2018, 15:16:12
Just got my shipping notification. I'll keep everyone updated.

I got mine too
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Gacct on Thu, 06 September 2018, 15:27:49
did you guys get tracking or just the email confirming that the rings are on the way?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Thu, 06 September 2018, 15:32:09
did you guys get tracking or just the email confirming that the rings are on the way?

I got tracking
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Thu, 06 September 2018, 16:41:22
did you guys get tracking or just the email confirming that the rings are on the way?

I didn't get tracking, just an email saying that they have been shipped. Į\_(ツ)_/Į
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Fri, 07 September 2018, 07:07:04
I received tracking. And it's even a real number according to usps lol.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Fri, 07 September 2018, 08:06:19
Sucks to me be then, I guess.  :-[ :D

Maybe it's because I'm located in Europe or something.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Gacct on Fri, 07 September 2018, 19:28:44
Sucks to me be then, I guess.  :-[ :D

Maybe it's because I'm located in Europe or something.

Guessing international orders just got the email notification. Basing this off a sample size of 2 (you and me).
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Sat, 08 September 2018, 04:26:08
Sucks to me be then, I guess.  :-[ :D

Maybe it's because I'm located in Europe or something.

Guessing international orders just got the email notification. Basing this off a sample size of 2 (you and me).

I emailed him yesterday and asked about it. He replied a few hours later and gave me the tracking information. You should probably do the same.  :)
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Sat, 08 September 2018, 11:19:07
I got my order today!!! Lets go boys. 204 days later. Gonna cancel my paypal dispute and start putting them together.

I got rings and domes so I'll give my opinions on it all afterwards.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Sat, 08 September 2018, 11:42:35
I just got mine too.  I already had installed the ultralight domes a while back.  So we put 2 on each slider?  And this is a permanent mod, I guess. Since they have a sticky backing.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: BHuber09 on Sat, 08 September 2018, 15:06:25
Wow these are awesome... Substantially quieter. I bought the heavy domes as well as the rings and besides the stabs, the 1x keys are only thock, there is no upstroke sound.

I bought 1 order of rings, I got 2 packages, of which I opened 1 and only used about half of them (fc660c).

So the rings themselves, they are so much nicer, this really is a huge difference. I wasn't sure how much I was actually expecting but these are incredible. However there is a noticeable difference in travel space. While it's really not that bad, it is going to take me a moment to get use to.

I left my 'insert' key without a ring, because that slot isn't a standard slot and comparing the two sounds is like night and day. I highly suggest. Worth the wait.. and I was raising hell about the wait.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Sat, 08 September 2018, 20:38:25
Now my question is: When I can buy these on the site? :D
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Sun, 09 September 2018, 15:36:46
lol that's good to know, I was in the V1 batch so hopefully I'll get my V2 soon.

I started with Hypersphere rings (too thick) then later on swap them to KBDFans rings (slightly too thin).  If anyone beat me to it please let me know if it's an upgrade over the other 2.

Otherwise I'll evaluate them when I get it.  :P
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Fri, 14 September 2018, 08:33:04
If you guys could post some reviews or what you guys think of these I would be really thankful, if possible of course. Really indecise here  :D

Best Regards,
Kawabata.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Fri, 14 September 2018, 09:11:13
I'm probably not the best person to review these since I only have 2 topre boards, and I don't use them daily.

I tried installing the rings.  It was very difficult to get them precisely in place.  It was harder than in the instructional photos b/c the realforce slider housings are black, not white.  So you're putting black on black and it's really hard to see if you have it aligned properly.  One dampening ring maybe cut the noise down by 50%.  So, I proceeded to put another on it as suggested by jchan.  This helped to silence the return, but I measured, and 2 rings changed the key travel by a full millimeter.

So, here's what I did.  I tore them out, used some isopropyl and reinstalled my factory domes that are not loud as hell on the return. 

All fixed.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Fri, 14 September 2018, 16:31:08
Interesting, you were using bke ultra lights right? Did the single layered rings affect the tactility? Or you didin't even test it with one layer?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Fri, 14 September 2018, 19:33:12
It was still close to the same tactility with one as with none. It was reduced with two a noticeable amount.  With two, Inwas pretty much into the bump
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Sat, 15 September 2018, 15:39:45
Then would you say it would be a viable option then to go with 1 layer?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Gacct on Sat, 15 September 2018, 15:42:35
Then would you say it would be a viable option then to go with 1 layer?
Interested in your take on these rings as you went from hypershperes and then to the silence x rings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Sat, 15 September 2018, 16:49:31
Then would you say it would be a viable option then to go with 1 layer?

Yes I think one layer is the best option but itís not dead silent
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Sun, 16 September 2018, 21:48:59
Then would you say it would be a viable option then to go with 1 layer?
Interested in your take on these rings as you went from hypershperes and then to the silence x rings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah I think Hypersphere is best for silencing but it reduce travel too much so you start losing tactility.  Then I decide to try KBDFans rings and they're really thin so tactility is almost unaffected, but it doesn't silence as well also you don't get that super refined luxurious feeling on a properly silenced topre.

Hypersphere is about 0.57 mm and KBDFans is about 0.22 mm.  From older spec I think Keyclack rings are around 0.35 mm.  So I was hoping the Keyclack rings would be the best middle ground where it doesn't affect tactility but also silence more.

Though I haven't got mine yet so I don't really know.  I'll find out later.  :P
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Mon, 17 September 2018, 06:33:58
I recently installed ironed soft-landing pads in my Novatouch. So far it might be my favourite. It's as quiet as Hypersphere's rings, but can be made slimmer. Takes a while though... But the rings easy to obtain, and doesn't cost much.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Mon, 17 September 2018, 09:29:57
I recently installed ironed soft-landing pads in my Novatouch. So far it might be my favourite. It's as quiet as Hypersphere's rings, but can be made slimmer. Takes a while though... But the rings easy to obtain, and doesn't cost much.

That's really nice, can you compare with other silencing methods? Just found out the existence of this ironed soft-landing pads, got me interested.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Mon, 17 September 2018, 09:56:44
Well, yes. I have also used Hypersphere's rings in the Novatouch. I have a HHKB Pro 2 with purple sliders (from a factory silenced Realforce), before that I had Hypersphere's rings in that also.

As I said, the soft-landing pads can be made very thin (0.2 mm according to the thread below). However, it requires more work. I have not tried Keyclack's rings, or the KBDfans silence-x. However, in my opinion, it's really important to have silencing material which is as thin as possible, to avoid loss of tactility.

You can read more about the soft-landing pad mod here: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=49046.0
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: MajorKoos on Mon, 17 September 2018, 12:10:36
Well, yes. I have also used Hypersphere's rings in the Novatouch. I have a HHKB Pro 2 with purple sliders (from a factory silenced Realforce), before that I had Hypersphere's rings in that also.

As I said, the soft-landing pads can be made very thin (0.2 mm according to the thread below). However, it requires more work. I have not tried Keyclack's rings, or the KBDfans silence-x. However, in my opinion, it's really important to have silencing material which is as thin as possible, to avoid loss of tactility.

You can read more about the soft-landing pad mod here: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=49046.0

I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Mon, 17 September 2018, 13:15:06
However, in my opinion, it's really important to have silencing material which is as thin as possible, to avoid loss of tactility.

You can read more about the soft-landing pad mod here: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=49046.0

I also agree, that is exactly why I am a bit concerned with a few silencing options. Been reading this thread you linked for a while now, thinking on trying this option.


I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.


I definitely accept the challenge, but the decompression disappoints me a little. Did you feel any difference? And what do you mean with reinventing this wheel? Your advice is to stick with the others not that much DIY solutions out there? Like the v2 and silence-x?

Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: MajorKoos on Mon, 17 September 2018, 19:12:04


I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.


I definitely accept the challenge, but the decompression disappoints me a little. Did you feel any difference? And what do you mean with reinventing this wheel? Your advice is to stick with the others not that much DIY solutions out there? Like the v2 and silence-x?


I can definitely notice the difference now they've decompressed somewhat.  The keyboard has lost most of it's tactility (not that there was much to begin with on 45g Topre).

Silence-X and Hypershpere both work well (I think I prefer silence-x though).
v1 also worked really well if one installed them right and could get past the horrendous failure rate. 

I haven't installed the v2 to compare, but I'd leave them stock rather than messing around with an iron.
I don't believe it's worth the effort if they're going to expand unevenly over time.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Mon, 17 September 2018, 21:00:52

I can definitely notice the difference now they've decompressed somewhat.  The keyboard has lost most of it's tactility (not that there was much to begin with on 45g Topre).

Nice, I'm quite on the opposite end, I love the BKE extreme domes. I'll do some more research on the long term for these soft-landing pads before I make my choice. But also, I always can try something different if this doesn't work out, right? :D

I haven't installed the v2 to compare, but I'd leave them stock rather than messing around with an iron.
I don't believe it's worth the effort if they're going to expand unevenly over time.

Just to be sure, I think you meant the soft-landing pads with the iron stuff. As far as I understood, the v2 don't need iron to work as intended. But I also agree that if it will expand with time, it may not be worth it.

Anyway, thanks for the insights. When I finally choose something and have an opinion, I'll post it somewhere :D
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Tue, 18 September 2018, 07:56:51
Well, yes. I have also used Hypersphere's rings in the Novatouch. I have a HHKB Pro 2 with purple sliders (from a factory silenced Realforce), before that I had Hypersphere's rings in that also.

As I said, the soft-landing pads can be made very thin (0.2 mm according to the thread below). However, it requires more work. I have not tried Keyclack's rings, or the KBDfans silence-x. However, in my opinion, it's really important to have silencing material which is as thin as possible, to avoid loss of tactility.

You can read more about the soft-landing pad mod here: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=49046.0

I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.

Please post some proof of this decompression that you're talking about. The landing pads basically melt, so they should not decompress in any way. They still work great in my Novatouch. One of the sliders has a Hypersphere ring installed, and it sits lower than the ones with landing pads, i.e., the ironed landing pads are significantly thinner.

I agree that they are more difficult to modify, but it's not impossible. They are also cheaper. And readily available (also in Europe).
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Lansky on Tue, 18 September 2018, 08:56:04
Here's a comparison of the V2 ring and a Hypersphere ring thickness. Sorry for the shotty image quality, unfortunately I don't own a macro lens.

(https://i.imgur.com/MfvTvob.jpg)
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hypersphere on Tue, 18 September 2018, 10:19:39
Thanks for the comparisons. I haven't tried the v2 rings as yet.

When I was developing my silencing rings, I did extensive testing of materials to achieve what I considered the best balance of sound and feel, but of course personal preferences vary.

I also had durability in mind. I've had my rings in all my Topre boards (several each of HHKB Pro 2, RF87U, and Novatouch) for over 3 years with no signs of degradation thus far.

In any event, it is good to see that there are now a number of choices for Topre silencing to suit various personal preferences regarding sound, feel, and longevity.



Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: MajorKoos on Tue, 18 September 2018, 10:30:35

...

Please post some proof of this decompression that you're talking about. The landing pads basically melt, so they should not decompress in any way. They still work great in my Novatouch. On of the sliders has a Hypersphere ring installed, and it sits lower than the ones with landing pads, i.e., they are significantly thinner.

I agree that they are more difficult to modify, but it's not impossible. They are also cheaper. And readily available (also in Europe).

Don't feel like taking it apart for a photo, but you're on point - I don't think I melted them enough.

Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: spiceBar on Wed, 19 September 2018, 22:27:25


I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.


I definitely accept the challenge, but the decompression disappoints me a little. Did you feel any difference? And what do you mean with reinventing this wheel? Your advice is to stick with the others not that much DIY solutions out there? Like the v2 and silence-x?


I can definitely notice the difference now they've decompressed somewhat.  The keyboard has lost most of it's tactility (not that there was much to begin with on 45g Topre).

Silence-X and Hypershpere both work well (I think I prefer silence-x though).
v1 also worked really well if one installed them right and could get past the horrendous failure rate. 

I haven't installed the v2 to compare, but I'd leave them stock rather than messing around with an iron.
I don't believe it's worth the effort if they're going to expand unevenly over time.

If you notice any decompression of the ironed landing pads, it's because your clothing iron was not hot enough, or maybe you did not iron them for long enough. I takes a few seconds at relatively high temperature and relatively strong pressure for a pads to be flattened in a permanent way.

I have several keyboards that I have modded with the ironed landing pads technique several years ago. I think I modded them in 2013. There is absolutely no decompression.

Too hot would be if the pads melted completely. This has never happened with the clothing irons I have used, even when they were set to the maximum temperature, so I suspect that some clothing irons can't even get hot enough.

Some irons also require a long time to reach their operating temperature, and sometimes we start ironing too early. It happened to me.

I understand the ironed landing pad method can be a little tricky. It works, but it's not super easy.

I have ordered KBDFans silencing rings and I will report on their effectiveness, and compare them to my ironed landing pad method.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Thu, 20 September 2018, 07:04:52


I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.


I definitely accept the challenge, but the decompression disappoints me a little. Did you feel any difference? And what do you mean with reinventing this wheel? Your advice is to stick with the others not that much DIY solutions out there? Like the v2 and silence-x?


I can definitely notice the difference now they've decompressed somewhat.  The keyboard has lost most of it's tactility (not that there was much to begin with on 45g Topre).

Silence-X and Hypershpere both work well (I think I prefer silence-x though).
v1 also worked really well if one installed them right and could get past the horrendous failure rate. 

I haven't installed the v2 to compare, but I'd leave them stock rather than messing around with an iron.
I don't believe it's worth the effort if they're going to expand unevenly over time.

If you notice any decompression of the ironed landing pads, it's because your clothing iron was not hot enough, or maybe you did not iron them for long enough. I takes a few seconds at relatively high temperature and relatively strong pressure for a pads to be flattened in a permanent way.

I have several keyboards that I have modded with the ironed landing pads technique several years ago. I think I modded them in 2013. There is absolutely no decompression.

Too hot would be if the pads melted completely. This has never happened with the clothing irons I have used, even when they were set to the maximum temperature, so I suspect that some clothing irons can't even get hot enough.

Some irons also require a long time to reach their operating temperature, and sometimes we start ironing too early. It happened to me.

I understand the ironed landing pad method can be a little tricky. It works, but it's not super easy.

I have ordered KBDFans silencing rings and I will report on their effectiveness, and compare them to my ironed landing pad method.

Looking forward for the comparison.
You also said that is possible to over melt them. When you did the mod did you set a thickness target? Or went by the temperature + time pressuring?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: the_marsbar on Thu, 20 September 2018, 07:06:27
It's best to aim for a specific thickness. I actually had to remove some of the pads in my Novatouch and give them another go.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: spiceBar on Sat, 22 September 2018, 20:11:34


I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.


I definitely accept the challenge, but the decompression disappoints me a little. Did you feel any difference? And what do you mean with reinventing this wheel? Your advice is to stick with the others not that much DIY solutions out there? Like the v2 and silence-x?


I can definitely notice the difference now they've decompressed somewhat.  The keyboard has lost most of it's tactility (not that there was much to begin with on 45g Topre).

Silence-X and Hypershpere both work well (I think I prefer silence-x though).
v1 also worked really well if one installed them right and could get past the horrendous failure rate. 

I haven't installed the v2 to compare, but I'd leave them stock rather than messing around with an iron.
I don't believe it's worth the effort if they're going to expand unevenly over time.

If you notice any decompression of the ironed landing pads, it's because your clothing iron was not hot enough, or maybe you did not iron them for long enough. I takes a few seconds at relatively high temperature and relatively strong pressure for a pads to be flattened in a permanent way.

I have several keyboards that I have modded with the ironed landing pads technique several years ago. I think I modded them in 2013. There is absolutely no decompression.

Too hot would be if the pads melted completely. This has never happened with the clothing irons I have used, even when they were set to the maximum temperature, so I suspect that some clothing irons can't even get hot enough.

Some irons also require a long time to reach their operating temperature, and sometimes we start ironing too early. It happened to me.

I understand the ironed landing pad method can be a little tricky. It works, but it's not super easy.

I have ordered KBDFans silencing rings and I will report on their effectiveness, and compare them to my ironed landing pad method.

Looking forward for the comparison.
You also said that is possible to over melt them. When you did the mod did you set a thickness target? Or went by the temperature + time pressuring?

I think one could melt them with a clothing iron, because I have approached this point. I warned about it, but it did not actually happen to me, even with the iron set at the max temp (hey, it's a clothing iron, after all).

After experimenting with the procedure, my target is the thickness. You should aim for a sixth to a quarter of a millimeter (~0.006 to 0.010 inch), because it's possible and the result is both good silencing and no loss of tactile feedback. You get this by using the highest temperature you can, without melting them, and good pressure. So even if you do not have any tool to measure the resulting thickness, this simple rule of thumb is all you need. You make one and you try to make it as thin as possible. Then you can use this one to compare to the other ones you make, and they should not feel thicker when you hold them between your fingers.

It's really unscientific, but you don't need more than that.

With more experience, I have noticed that a third of a millimeter is acceptable (~0.013 inch). I mention it because I know it's difficult to get to a quarter or a sixth.

At this point the landing pad looks more like a thin sheet of rubber than a foam pad.

Reduced tactility starts when the landing pad is half a millimeter thick (0.02 inch) or more, approximately. It's still OK, but you start noticing it. It's good to know because half a millimeter (0.02 inch) is not that hard to measure, and when you reach that point you know that you did not iron them hard enough.

Some silencing methods claim a reduction of travel of "only" half a millimeter (0.02 inch), but unfortunately it's already too much and some tactility is lost. It may actually be OK, but if you really want to keep the original tactility you should avoid them.
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: KawabataLuis on Mon, 24 September 2018, 17:22:15


I did this mod on my first NT.
Getting the landing pads as thin as possible AND making sure they're all the same thickness can be a challenge.
They've also decompressed quite a bit since then.
I would not recommend reinventing this wheel.


I definitely accept the challenge, but the decompression disappoints me a little. Did you feel any difference? And what do you mean with reinventing this wheel? Your advice is to stick with the others not that much DIY solutions out there? Like the v2 and silence-x?


I can definitely notice the difference now they've decompressed somewhat.  The keyboard has lost most of it's tactility (not that there was much to begin with on 45g Topre).

Silence-X and Hypershpere both work well (I think I prefer silence-x though).
v1 also worked really well if one installed them right and could get past the horrendous failure rate. 

I haven't installed the v2 to compare, but I'd leave them stock rather than messing around with an iron.
I don't believe it's worth the effort if they're going to expand unevenly over time.

If you notice any decompression of the ironed landing pads, it's because your clothing iron was not hot enough, or maybe you did not iron them for long enough. I takes a few seconds at relatively high temperature and relatively strong pressure for a pads to be flattened in a permanent way.

I have several keyboards that I have modded with the ironed landing pads technique several years ago. I think I modded them in 2013. There is absolutely no decompression.

Too hot would be if the pads melted completely. This has never happened with the clothing irons I have used, even when they were set to the maximum temperature, so I suspect that some clothing irons can't even get hot enough.

Some irons also require a long time to reach their operating temperature, and sometimes we start ironing too early. It happened to me.

I understand the ironed landing pad method can be a little tricky. It works, but it's not super easy.

I have ordered KBDFans silencing rings and I will report on their effectiveness, and compare them to my ironed landing pad method.

Looking forward for the comparison.
You also said that is possible to over melt them. When you did the mod did you set a thickness target? Or went by the temperature + time pressuring?

I think one could melt them with a clothing iron, because I have approached this point. I warned about it, but it did not actually happen to me, even with the iron set at the max temp (hey, it's a clothing iron, after all).

After experimenting with the procedure, my target is the thickness. You should aim for a sixth to a quarter of a millimeter (~0.006 to 0.010 inch), because it's possible and the result is both good silencing and no loss of tactile feedback. You get this by using the highest temperature you can, without melting them, and good pressure. So even if you do not have any tool to measure the resulting thickness, this simple rule of thumb is all you need. You make one and you try to make it as thin as possible. Then you can use this one to compare to the other ones you make, and they should not feel thicker when you hold them between your fingers.

It's really unscientific, but you don't need more than that.

With more experience, I have noticed that a third of a millimeter is acceptable (~0.013 inch). I mention it because I know it's difficult to get to a quarter or a sixth.

At this point the landing pad looks more like a thin sheet of rubber than a foam pad.

Reduced tactility starts when the landing pad is half a millimeter thick (0.02 inch) or more, approximately. It's still OK, but you start noticing it. It's good to know because half a millimeter (0.02 inch) is not that hard to measure, and when you reach that point you know that you did not iron them hard enough.

Some silencing methods claim a reduction of travel of "only" half a millimeter (0.02 inch), but unfortunately it's already too much and some tactility is lost. It may actually be OK, but if you really want to keep the original tactility you should avoid them.

Nice, I don't know how hard it will be, but I'll try to aim for the sixth of a millimeter. I just ordered my foam pads, when I get them and try to iron them, I'll give some feedback as well  :)
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Wed, 17 October 2018, 16:26:49
Anyone else got their silence ring yet?  I haven't got mine also would be interested to hear more reviews.

:)
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Gacct on Wed, 17 October 2018, 16:33:12
Anyone else got their silence ring yet?  I haven't got mine also would be interested to hear more reviews.

:)

I tried the new V2's on one of my keys before trying them on the entire keyboard. I didn't like how much it reduced the travel (you could visibly see the amount that the key was depressed due to the ring) so I didn't bother putting them on the rest of the board. I ended up just using some double sided 3M to attach the V1 rings onto the slider. Time consuming and a pain in the butt but I'm happy with the results (except for some rattling on the stabilizers - but that isn't the rings fault).
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Koatl on Tue, 13 November 2018, 17:56:03
So what's the overall view on these? Too thick? Reducing too much of the tactility?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: Hyde on Wed, 28 November 2018, 14:24:17
Also is it normal that I still haven't got my V2 rings yet?  Should I contact jchan to find out what's going on?
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: pixelpusher on Wed, 28 November 2018, 17:27:10
Also is it normal that I still haven't got my V2 rings yet?  Should I contact jchan to find out what's going on?

Pretty sure the original gb all shipped.  I got mine a a few months ago.  Better contact
Title: Re: V2 version Topre Silence Ring
Post by: swedishpiehole on Wed, 17 April 2019, 12:48:21
Here's a comparison of the V2 ring and a Hypersphere ring thickness. Sorry for the shotty image quality, unfortunately I don't own a macro lens.

Show Image
(https://i.imgur.com/MfvTvob.jpg)


Sorry to necro, but I'm really curious about the thickness of the Keyclack V2 rings, and it's hard to tell from this pic how they compare to Hyperspheres. It looks like the Keyclack ring has a layer of adhesive or something? Does that add to the thickness?

I silenced my HHKB using rubber o-rings that are roughly 0.5mm thick and although I'm happy with the feel and sound, I'm worried about long term loss of tactility due to the slight compression of the domes. Would I be better off swapping for the Keyclack rings? Or the Silence-X ones?