Author Topic: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (COMPLETED)  (Read 471997 times)

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Offline malu1989

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1700 on: Mon, 08 December 2014, 14:27:59 »
Have they tried dyesubbing the sample keys yet?
Can't wait to get my hands on them :)

Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1701 on: Mon, 08 December 2014, 15:35:35 »
Still waiting to find out.

Offline FingerPunch

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1702 on: Tue, 09 December 2014, 19:09:32 »
Synjin didn't take the set after all, so I still have a blank set available if someone wants in on this buy. sold  :thumb:
« Last Edit: Fri, 02 January 2015, 22:08:24 by FingerPunch »

Offline Psybin

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1703 on: Wed, 10 December 2014, 06:28:27 »
Really looking forward to thess, I've had a cap less board sitting unused all year.
Is there any rough estimate on ship dates?

Offline jalthi

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1704 on: Wed, 10 December 2014, 07:20:22 »
Is there any rough estimate on ship dates?



Only not really.

I have faith in Ivan and this GB, but I've long since stopped expecting to get these on any kind of reasonable time table.  Best to just be pleasantly surprised when they do ship rather than perpetually disappointed when they don't.

Offline frosty

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1705 on: Wed, 10 December 2014, 08:46:13 »
I have faith in Ivan and this GB, but I've long since stopped expecting to get these on any kind of reasonable time table.  Best to just be pleasantly surprised when they do ship rather than perpetually disappointed when they don't.

Well said.

Offline spookymikal

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1706 on: Wed, 10 December 2014, 09:01:17 »
Really looking forward to thess, I've had a cap less board sitting unused all year.
Is there any rough estimate on ship dates?

PLUM, the company who produces the keycaps, has made two sample batches that have been sent out. They technically made 3 batches but the first set was made from  plastic that wasn't up to quality so they scrapped it. The second batch came out too dark to dyesub.

Right now the third samples are being sent to the dyesub printer, Imsto. If he says they're light enough to accept the dyesub, then PLUM will finish up production and ship them to the printer to have their legends melted into them, then they go to ivan and get distributed to the rest of us.

If Imsto came back today and said "these are perfect" then it will still probably be 3 months + until we see the actual keycaps.

If they come back too dark still, then it's probably 3 months until he gets the next sample batch to test, and we can expect to receive keycaps at some point before 2017

Blank sets probably won't be sent out until dyesubbing is completed.

It's not clear if plum is sending the samples to Ivan who then sends them to the dyesub printer, or if they are being sent directly to the printer.

NOTE: This is all information gathered from the thread and I have no behind the scenes info on the GB.

Offline Psybin

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1707 on: Wed, 10 December 2014, 12:08:12 »
Good cliff notes, thanks.

I'm being patient, was just curious if any estimates were out after the samples dropped.
 (that and I got a matching BBV1 for the board that these caps are going on)


Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1708 on: Wed, 10 December 2014, 12:22:05 »
Yes thanks for the summary. I don't receive nothing, only get photo. PLUM send actual key to imsto, who is in charge of dyesublimation part anyway.
If they can't get the right color, I may consider going to plan B... which is just take the plain blanks and refunding the dyesub money. There is only so much, and perhaps getting to point where something generally satisfactory is better than continuing to wait indefinitely.

Offline lolkey

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1709 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 01:21:26 »
Yes thanks for the summary. I don't receive nothing, only get photo. PLUM send actual key to imsto, who is in charge of dyesublimation part anyway.
If they can't get the right color, I may consider going to plan B... which is just take the plain blanks and refunding the dyesub money. There is only so much, and perhaps getting to point where something generally satisfactory is better than continuing to wait indefinitely.

If this ends up being what happens, can we go back to the darker samples they had?
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Offline geniekid

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1710 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 08:35:47 »
Yes thanks for the summary. I don't receive nothing, only get photo. PLUM send actual key to imsto, who is in charge of dyesublimation part anyway.
If they can't get the right color, I may consider going to plan B... which is just take the plain blanks and refunding the dyesub money. There is only so much, and perhaps getting to point where something generally satisfactory is better than continuing to wait indefinitely.

I don't have a strong opinion on which choice to take but I'm glad you are thinking of alternatives to waiting :thumb:

Offline zippox

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1711 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 08:52:55 »
If this ends up being what happens, can we go back to the darker samples they had?

If I remember correctly the really dark ones were too soft for normal production so I don't think we will be getting those. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

Offline Oobly

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1712 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 08:53:24 »
Yes thanks for the summary. I don't receive nothing, only get photo. PLUM send actual key to imsto, who is in charge of dyesublimation part anyway.
If they can't get the right color, I may consider going to plan B... which is just take the plain blanks and refunding the dyesub money. There is only so much, and perhaps getting to point where something generally satisfactory is better than continuing to wait indefinitely.

If this ends up being what happens, can we go back to the darker samples they had?

^^This :D If we can't get the dyesubs then I'd like the blanks to be as black as black can be, please.

I still hope the dyesub works so we can get what we ordered, but in case that doesn't work out, I'd love to have dark black blanks.
Buying more keycaps,
it really hacks my wallet,
but I must have them.

Offline geniekid

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1713 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 09:12:12 »
If this ends up being what happens, can we go back to the darker samples they had?

If I remember correctly the really dark ones were too soft for normal production so I don't think we will be getting those. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

The softness issues were unrelated to the color issues I believe.

Offline strict

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1714 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 10:08:52 »
The softness issues were unrelated to the color issues I believe.

This was my understanding as well. I thought the first batch was too soft and the second batch was too dark.

In reference to what Ivan just posted, I would totally be fine with keys that were "too dark". To be honest, I would almost prefer keys that are darker than what comes on the black Realforce (that was the target contrast level, right?). Of course if it matches the level of contrast on the RF UB keyboards that's great but I would love keys with legends that are even more "invisible".

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Offline spookymikal

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1715 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 10:21:54 »
If this ends up being what happens, can we go back to the darker samples they had?

If I remember correctly the really dark ones were too soft for normal production so I don't think we will be getting those. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

Part of the problem is that the company printing on the keycaps is different from the one producing the caps. PLUM is pressing plastic pellets into molds to make the keys. Imsto is using a dyesub printer to put letters on the keys.

PLUM has created 3 sample batches:

Batch 1 was too soft, didn't even get shipped to Imsto. They changed plastic suppliers to fix the problems and that lead to...

Batch 2, which was of acceptable firmness, but Imsto determined they were too dark to accept dyesub.

Batch 3 is made of good plastic and it's a little lighter in color. Right now it's w/ Imsto where he will determine if it can accept dyesub legends.

If batch 3 is still too dark: Ivan is not sure what the next step is.

One options is to ship the blanks people who ordered blanks and give people who ordered printed keys refunds. This is expensive in the short term because the order from plum is for {X} sets, whereas only {Y} of those are for people who want blanks. So even though people only want {Y} keysets, PLUM has already been paid to produce {X} sets. Ivan would have to issue refunds to people who don't want to take blank keys instead of printed keys, and would then be stuck with dozens of blank black keycap sets that he doesn't want. I'm sure that they would eventually get sold off, but that's just a huge headache to deal with, and a hit to his pocket book at Christmas time.

Another option is to delay production for batch 4. There's no guarantee that batch 4 would be perfect, and it would probably be another 3-6 months of waiting before we know if they can be printed, and 3-6 more months to go through the printing and shipping process. This means more pitchforks and people *****ing, but it might be a smaller headache to deal with that than to issue refunds.

If batch 3 is perfect then PLUM will go into full production mode and complete the sets, ship them to Imsto, and they'll be printed on, shipped to Ivan and distributed to everyone. This process will take a minimum of 3 months to complete, and could take even longer.

So odds are very low that we'll end up with blank keys from batch 2, even if batch 3 is too dark to be printed and Ivan decides to go with the refund option.

Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1716 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 10:31:48 »
I should know for sure what will happen on next week sometime when the dyesub samples can be returned for evaluation.

Offline dante

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1717 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 11:21:29 »
I should know for sure what will happen on next week sometime when the dyesub samples can be returned for evaluation.


How about a Plan C?

If the Dyesub is impossible and you have to refund some money can PLUM turn those orders into blank POM sets?  If so, I'd like to snag some sets!

Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1718 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 11:38:52 »
No, still would have to do X number sets in PBT.

Offline Bromono

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1719 on: Thu, 11 December 2014, 19:28:23 »
If there are caps left over ill be more then happy to grab a set!

Offline Mooby

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1720 on: Sat, 13 December 2014, 05:18:12 »
The delay is nothing I'm excited about, but I'd rather wait some more, because I'm absolutely not interested in blanks. No dye sub would be a real bummer for me.

Offline pr0ximity

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1721 on: Sat, 13 December 2014, 08:08:20 »
The delay is nothing I'm excited about, but I'd rather wait some more, because I'm absolutely not interested in blanks. No dye sub would be a real bummer for me.

Have to say, I'm in the same boat. Keeping my fingers crossed.
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Offline LechnerDE

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1722 on: Sat, 13 December 2014, 08:42:46 »
Yeah, I agree. After waiting for so long it would feel wrong to give up!

I'd rather wait another year than getting no caps at all.


On the other hand I can see that it's getting too frustrating for Ivan...

Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1723 on: Sat, 13 December 2014, 11:21:32 »
Was just an idea for possible course of action... there are 60/40 in favor of blanks orders anyway since the order went in. I know some won't find it ideal if the dyesub can't get done. You're right... I mostly just want to wrap this up and move on at this point.

Offline Unknown01011010

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1724 on: Sat, 13 December 2014, 16:08:53 »
Since I ordered blanks, I would not mind that option. 

Offline edwardpark8

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1725 on: Sun, 14 December 2014, 02:41:24 »
i'm interested in taking over somebody's order for blanks. message me if you're willing to sell! hope these delays resolve soon!

EDIT: Forgot to say that atm I'm only willing to pay original price + shipping. I've gotten a few pms asking if I would be willing to pay more to take over their order.

EDIT2: Took over someone else's order! Not looking anymore.
« Last Edit: Sun, 14 December 2014, 20:51:57 by edwardpark8 »

Offline Synjin

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1726 on: Sun, 14 December 2014, 21:26:20 »
I was originally going to take over someone's order till I found out it was going to be 11 USD for shipping conus from the guy letting his go. I had to say no cuz I really don't want to have to bother Ivan for refunds especially with how many GB he is running currently. I am still shocked at 11usd conus from the other guy T_T

Offline Bromono

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1727 on: Sun, 14 December 2014, 21:57:01 »
If dye subs go through I wouldn't mind taking over someone's order.

Offline Keytrun

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1728 on: Sun, 14 December 2014, 22:09:56 »
I'm considering giving up my blanks order. Would anyone be interested?

Offline Keytrun

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1729 on: Mon, 15 December 2014, 12:00:08 »
Does anyone know what the shipping cost was for the blanks? Total invoice for 1 set? I may sell mine but I can't find how much I paid.

Offline j0hnny

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1730 on: Mon, 15 December 2014, 16:04:25 »
ill be interested in picking up more blanks but only if ivan has a surplus that he needs to get rid of.

I don't need the extra set of blanks, but if it will help out Ivan get rid of inventory then I don't mind.

Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1731 on: Mon, 15 December 2014, 16:17:15 »
There is no inventory, these still have not been made. I didn't order any extras either so the only way to pick anything additional up would be to buy someone else out.

Offline j0hnny

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1732 on: Mon, 15 December 2014, 17:50:42 »

One options is to ship the blanks people who ordered blanks and give people who ordered printed keys refunds. This is expensive in the short term because the order from plum is for {X} sets, whereas only {Y} of those are for people who want blanks. So even though people only want {Y} keysets, PLUM has already been paid to produce {X} sets. Ivan would have to issue refunds to people who don't want to take blank keys instead of printed keys, and would then be stuck with dozens of blank black keycap sets that he doesn't want. I'm sure that they would eventually get sold off, but that's just a huge headache to deal with, and a hit to his pocket book at Christmas time.


I meant it for this, should've quoted it. I know you don't have extra sets, Spooky was just saying there's a chance where you would be stuck with a bunch of blanks (the ones that couldn't be dyesubbed).

Offline Keytrun

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1733 on: Mon, 15 December 2014, 19:30:09 »
I'm still looking to sell my set of blanks.

Offline spookymikal

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1734 on: Mon, 15 December 2014, 22:18:32 »

One options is to ship the blanks people who ordered blanks and give people who ordered printed keys refunds. This is expensive in the short term because the order from plum is for {X} sets, whereas only {Y} of those are for people who want blanks. So even though people only want {Y} keysets, PLUM has already been paid to produce {X} sets. Ivan would have to issue refunds to people who don't want to take blank keys instead of printed keys, and would then be stuck with dozens of blank black keycap sets that he doesn't want. I'm sure that they would eventually get sold off, but that's just a huge headache to deal with, and a hit to his pocket book at Christmas time.


you're jumping the gun a bit.

we still don't know if these can take the dyesub or not.

i'm sure that we'll burn that bridge when we come to it.

I meant it for this, should've quoted it. I know you don't have extra sets, Spooky was just saying there's a chance where you would be stuck with a bunch of blanks (the ones that couldn't be dyesubbed).
« Last Edit: Tue, 16 December 2014, 08:25:52 by spookymikal »

Offline taylordcraig

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1735 on: Tue, 16 December 2014, 07:24:08 »
I think a lot of the printed people feel the darker color is acceptable, as the vocal minority of us seems to have wanted it darker than target anyway.

Offline Sergeant_Shart

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1736 on: Tue, 16 December 2014, 17:31:59 »
I'm still looking to sell my set of blanks.

What's your final asking price?

Offline eddie

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1737 on: Tue, 16 December 2014, 18:59:06 »
I think a lot of the printed people feel the darker color is acceptable, as the vocal minority of us seems to have wanted it darker than target anyway.
idk about that... i ordered hoping it would look like the realforce black/black that's just me tho
« Last Edit: Tue, 16 December 2014, 19:02:00 by eddie »

Offline Keytrun

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1738 on: Tue, 16 December 2014, 23:31:01 »
I'm still looking to sell my set of blanks.

What's your final asking price?

Its $64 total invoice price. I'd be fine with that. PM me if you're interested.

Offline Keytrun

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1739 on: Thu, 18 December 2014, 07:15:45 »
I guess no one is interested in getting my set? I'd get rid of it for $60. PM me if interested.

Offline FingerPunch

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1740 on: Thu, 18 December 2014, 16:50:24 »
edit: my set on offer was sold.
« Last Edit: Fri, 02 January 2015, 22:09:16 by FingerPunch »

Offline lolkey

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1741 on: Thu, 18 December 2014, 17:53:25 »
Bad time to sell. Probably have better luck after Christmas.
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varmilo va87mr tkl · gateron red · black case · dye sub pbt ❤
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Offline FingerPunch

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1742 on: Thu, 18 December 2014, 19:10:51 »
Yeah, I'll probably have to be patient until the week they're shipping... :shrug:

Offline Al3xG

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1743 on: Fri, 19 December 2014, 00:57:15 »
Hi to all! I would like to sell my set of blanks. Shipping to Europe included. PM me for details. Thanks ;)

Offline catbuster

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1744 on: Fri, 19 December 2014, 03:22:45 »
People started to drop out of this  :( I really hoped to get these this year.
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Offline spookymikal

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1745 on: Fri, 19 December 2014, 09:20:15 »
People started to drop out of this  :( I really hoped to get these this year.

People selling their place in the GB has no impact on the delivery date. Everyone paid up front already.


Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1746 on: Fri, 19 December 2014, 11:03:33 »
Yes, it's all paid to the manufacture long, long, long ago. If everything goes smoothly from now I am hoping for delivery at least in Q1 2015.

Offline strict

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1747 on: Fri, 19 December 2014, 14:46:24 »
I should know for sure what will happen on next week sometime when the dyesub samples can be returned for evaluation.

Any word on the dye sub results with the new keys?

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Offline catbuster

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1748 on: Sun, 21 December 2014, 05:17:01 »
I know we paid long ago, but many ppl started selling their orders because they lost hope to get these caps...
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Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PBT 104/105 set ROUND 3 (production)
« Reply #1749 on: Sun, 21 December 2014, 09:05:45 »
There hasn't been that many order transfers.

Everything should be good to go I'm told. Tentative delivery date mid February.