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geekhack Community => Other Geeky Stuff => Topic started by: hyperlinked on Sat, 03 April 2010, 00:02:31

Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Sat, 03 April 2010, 00:02:31
I'm surely going to get flamed for thinking this, but I'm coming off the fence. One of Think Geek's April Fool's jokes just connected some dots that I've pondered and repondered for many of the past 10 years. I will be getting one eventually not because I really want one, but because I think it'll be important for my career and business to be an early adopter.

I was an early adopter of the Internet in the mid 80's, but other than that I've rarely cared to own anything along the first wave of owners. I've been building a pretty good career for just happening to own a modem before most people knew what one was.

The iPad might be something along the lines of an AOL that introduced an existing technology in a simply packaged format to a wider audience than ever before. It's not the device. It's everything else and it doesn't matter if you think it's the best device of its class or if it's even innovative in the least. It didn't matter that AOL was a dumber version of the Internet, though that fact that eventually caught up to it. It mattered more that AOL had content... cheap second rate content and users.

You hated AOL. I hated AOL. We laughed at AOL users and all types of Internet for dummies type of services out there, but the AOLs had a huge role to play in creating a popular market for what was then only an alter reality for the outsiders of society.

The iPad will have apps and with the impressive mobilization of developers working on staking a spot as an early landmark developer, it's going to hold an advantage in Apps for a while. People are going to come up with novel apps and uses for this thing that really will introduce a new category of computing. It's not going to cause a seismic change in how people use computers... that's silly Apple hype, but it will open a door that has been swinging open and shut for quite a few years. This category of computer has been viable for some time already. It just lacked a carrier capable of hyping it enough to change perceptions of how you use a computer and it lacked developers and apps. It has all of those now.

Ok, the keyboard sucks. Big deal. Did you see the Think Geek april fool's joke in which they made an iPad arcade (http://www.thinkgeek.com/stuff/41/iCade.shtml)?  The damn iPad is a mobile screen. Everyone jeering at the one button interface may not be laughing for long. The lack of features and the plainness might make the economics of producing peripherals for this more agreeable. It's a blank slate.

Check out this prototype mod to make an iPhone a dPad controlled mobile gaming device.
http://icontrolpad.com/

A problem of a lot of tablet devices is that they are really laptops and suffer from some of the same problems that laptops have when you try to use them on the go. They want to behave like laptops. They're too large. For a device of this nature, a lack of extra features may not be a bad thing so long as you can add on to it as you wish without ruining the form factor.

Mobile phone apps for all types of phones have been getting more and more interesting. It reflects a genuine acceptance that there is a place for truly mobile computing... not the kind where you tote a laptop around because that's just desktop computing on the go. All of the newly mobile computing to date has been done on mobile phone like devices and in a lot of ways is nothing more than adapted Web surfing. You do not need a fully fledged computer to do this, but you do need the right form factor to make it easier. The mobile phone will never get there. They're simply too small and the fact that there is such a movement to turn mobile phones into mini workstations speaks to the emerging viability of a different kind of mobile computer.

Now, before I get banned, I'll put on my asbestos suit. While I think this will really go somewhere. I don't know if Apple will be at the head of the pack of it in 5 years. Once a new class of device such as the iPad has been branded into popular culture, the barrier of entry to this new market will fall dramatically for anyone else who wants to do it better without the pain in the ass that Apple's legal department will pose for a lot of their initial partners. The huge lead they have in apps will be important and pivotal for a few years, but you don't need to match it app for app to form a viable rival platform. You just need enough comparable offerings where it counts and ironically, Apple is alive today because a lot of people could overlook that they could live with their limited selection of software so long as Photoshop, DreamWeaver, an older version of MS Office and some other stuff could be had.

I'm going to get one of these probably sometime later this year because  the kind of websites I often find myself working on have been on a collision course with mobile computing. I was in no hurry to really bone up on my understanding of mobile computing because it seemed to be way off in the distance.

The horizon just moved up on me. It's time to rethink ways that people might use a viable computer while going about town.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: iMav on Sat, 03 April 2010, 00:28:27
A ginormous iPod touch just seems silly to me.  It seems awkward to hold, doesn't give you want you really need to fully enjoy web content (java and flash), and doesn't really bring anything remarkable to the table.

I am typically pretty quick to drink the Apple koolaid...but I just can't get on board with the ipad.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Sat, 03 April 2010, 00:50:55
Quote from: iMav;169164
A ginormous iPod touch just seems silly to me.  It seems awkward to hold, doesn't give you want you really need to fully enjoy web content (java and flash), and doesn't really bring anything remarkable to the table.

I am typically pretty quick to drink the Apple koolaid...but I just can't get on board with the ipad.

And I agree with you completely, but it's (sorry to be cliche'd) inside the box thinking. I'm not planning on getting one because I really want one. I'm getting one as a homework assignment. I hope they release one with an outward pointing camera because the possibilities of augmented reality apps on something like this would be really intriguing.

My wife is a composer and a non-tech geek. She uses our laptop constantly, but not in any tech savvy way. Tech gadgets don't excite her. She caught a glimpse of an iPad app online that puts out sheet music and it instantly captivated her because it never occurred to her that a computing device of the right form factor could solve every musician's dilemma of having to carry around books of sheet music and turning it while you're trying to play.

This is nothing truly new. Surely high end studios have digital devices to do this already, but the form factor unlocks this way of using a device to a whole new population. The app is not something glamorous. It's pretty simple actually, but it was all in the form factor.

And this isn't really Apple's Kool Aid anyway. This Kool Aid's been getting passed around for a while. Apple's just spiking the punch bowl. A lot of things needed to have happened already to make an iPad-like computer truly useful. The biggest thing Apple's doing here is bringing together an army of developers with their marketing machine and a decade of intrigue.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Sat, 03 April 2010, 01:47:25
Quote from: hyperlinked;169160
developers working on staking a spot as an early landmark developer

Will they? Why bother? Developers can't sell direct to the users. The users can't choose freely what apps they can buy. Because there's this damned company sitting between them controlling everything (and skimming off profit to boot.)

What use is gaining a reputation as an early developer, when the only opinion that determines if your app can sell is Apple's?

By the same argument, how can there be innovative development of apps when everything is so tightly controlled by a company whose interest is their own profit, not improving people's lives?

General-purpose computing devices were a fabulous invention that sparked innovation that changed the world. But every time manufacturers (and laws) start stripping away that general-purpose ability and freedom and crippling the abilities of the things we the customers pay for, the more we become slaves to these devices instead of the other way around.

The public feels they should buy these devices to keep up with the times. Developers like you feel they should cater to them to get a foothold. Both sides are in the same boat, having their strings pulled by the same puppeteers.

I'm not angry because this product exists. I'm angry because it could be so much better if it didn't have limitations built in due to the contemptuous attitude its makers have towards us.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Sat, 03 April 2010, 01:58:45
It sounds like it will find it's niche, and/or will be adopted because its new-tech. I believe more capable devices came before it and most certainly will come after, but because apple threw this down this type of device will finally get some actual meaningful attention.

I wouldn't get one, nor could I ever imagine getting/wanting one, and for one reason and one reason only-
It does not utilize a stylus, and those aftermarket "sticks" that are meant to be a stylus substitute are inaccurate and have no pressure sensitivity.

What I can't understand is why most companies fail on this particular matter in such an epic way. Could it be a problem with copyrighted technology? I don't know or care.

I realize this could just be the "artist" in me complaining, but really c'mon, it's an intuitive part of our lives to use an accurate writing instrument. We basically can all use them and use them very, very well. The technology not only exists but its DAMN GOOD (well it can be atleast)!

I was so upset when I found out it lacked this capability I shouted some garbled explitives and chucked my keyboard!

I don't get how apple can be so very seemingly creative yet pursue narrow minded proprietary products.

With the exception of my Cintiq 21ux (and that's debatable to some) my old intuous tablet now nearing ten (yes 10) years old KICKS THE LIVING CRAP out of all these new "intuitive" input devices.

I don't doubt it will be great for some if not many things but I hope its shortcommings spark a major pursuit in better input tech. Atleast it has finally put this old "slate" technology back on the map, and for that I am greatful.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Sat, 03 April 2010, 02:32:46
Quote from: Rajagra;169171
Will they? Why bother? Developers can't sell direct to the users. The users can't choose freely what apps they can buy. Because there's this damned company sitting between them controlling everything (and skimming off profit to boot.)

Doesn't appear to be stopping developer interest to me (http://blog.flurry.com/bid/31825/iPad-Developer-Support-Continues-to-Soar).

Quote from: Rajagra;169171
The public feels they should buy these devices to keep up with the times. Developers like you feel they should cater to them to get a foothold. Both sides are in the same boat, having their strings pulled by the same puppeteers.

That's what I was feeling before... great it's another device or service that friends and clients will ask me about and like every other time, it's just going to be a retread of something else, but shinier. Well, in some ways it is indeed a retread, but conditions are different this time and I don't know if any other company other than Apple has the right qualities to bring this forward.

They may "own it" for a while, but if it catches on, they can no more own it than they can wave a wand and send us back in time to the days in which most people owned either an Apple II or a branded IBM PC. I'm not intrigued about this one device. I'm intrigued that this may finally be what unlocks a lot of creative energy and efforts around making social use of computers more fluid.

There can [not] be only one.

Quote from: clickclack;169172
It sounds like it will find it's niche, and/or will be adopted because its new-tech. I believe more capable devices came before it and most certainly will come after, but because apple threw this down this type of device will finally get some actual meaningful attention.

And this is what I'm starting to believe. Some company with a powerful halo has to take the risk to go all in on this and I think the only company that can do that right now is Apple and I do think their window of opportunity is limited. They're not an underdog anymore and the more commonplace they become, the more that halo will lose its luster.

Quote from: Rajagra;169171
I'm not angry because this product exists. I'm angry because it could be so much better if it didn't have limitations built in due to the contemptuous attitude its makers have towards us.
Don't let perfect be the enemy of the good.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Sat, 03 April 2010, 03:27:13
Quote from: hyperlinked;169176

And this is what I'm starting to believe. Some company with a powerful halo has to take the risk to go all in on this and I think the only company that can do that right now is Apple and I do think their window of opportunity is limited. They're not an underdog anymore and the more commonplace they become, the more that halo will lose its luster.


It's a catch 22 that is further complicated by marketing and timing. However, Apple is wearing the target now (and wears it well). For a long time critics thought a slate was stooopid and it had little to do with speed.
In a way I am scared of its success initiating a complacency in the industry regarding interface.
I am with you on the "halo" reference but I also think that many times when things become more commonplace they by default set a standard. And standards seem to go in one of two ways, either all new things need to constantly exceed this "standard"(atleast attempt) or they need to meet it. If it's the latter then a distinct paradigm shift happens and when that happens I think things become perpetually more narrow in their focus.

k, need to sleep now before my head hits the keybnmbvjhiiiiiiiiiiiiykkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 04:54:34
iTL;DR

The only good thing about the iPad is if it makes someone come up with a more sane equivalent.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 07:37:24
Quote from: webwit;169187
You know, before mobile phones when people traveled home from work and they arrived home, they said, Hi honey, I'm home, what's on tv tonight? Now they call and say Hi honey, I'll be home in 10 minutes, what's on tv tonight?


This. I've found that the sort of constant communication afforded by things like mobile phones, instant messaging and [shudders] facebook has probably done more damage to people's social skills than it has to facilitate them.

In my college, there's a computer lab dedicated to Computer Science students. People come in, have a chat with the others, do whatever work needs to be done and head off. If you go into some of the computer labs for arts students, you find these immaculately dressed people, sitting in dead silence in front of their computers... using facebook. Volumes could be filled describing the irony of internet "communication".
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Sat, 03 April 2010, 08:05:57
Quote from: ch_123;169191
This. I've found that the sort of constant communication afforded by things like mobile phones, instant messaging and [shudders] facebook has probably done more damage to people's social skills than it has to facilitate them.

This is another reason why I think a hybrid device like this could be different. There may be ways of using it that is less socially isolating in that you are not having to hunch into a tiny mobile device to read tiny text and tap out messages on tiny keys. People have always multi-tasked and rude people will always be rude no matter what. If you have to interact with a device while you're around other people something with a large form factor might work better.

Then again, I might be smoking crack. I have no idea and that's why I think I need to try it in earnest to better understand the potential or lack thereof. We're all coming to this with a lot of assumptions of what will ultimately be useful, how it can be used, and where its strengths are and where its weaknesses are.

There are a lot of smart people, but I don't think any of them really know where this will go and for what reason and for the sole reason that I'm having difficulty fitting this type of usage into a box, I see something I haven't seen before in a mobile device. I doubt that does anything to change the world in any meaningful way, but if you're looking to exercise your imagination, it's a good opportunity.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: didjamatic on Sat, 03 April 2010, 08:18:15
For now, it's just a device that is cool but we don't need because doesn't replace or outperform existing devices.  The iphone had/has the ability to replace your iPod, PDA, cell phone, home phone and take on many functions of your computer while being in your pocket.  The Ipad doesn't do this and won't fit in your pocket.  It has no proper input device, onscreen input is "lived with" on a phone but is not ideal and certainly no replacement for a keyboard and mouse.  But you say "you can use a keyboard with an ipad" but the moment you do that, it loses it's cool "pad-ness" and becomes a very wimpy competitor to a tablet or netbook... and with apple's refusal to let you add storage via memory card slot or install apps that YOU want, it's very big brother, very hyped and though cool is not what iSteve says it is.

It may open the door so iPad v.3 or v.5 or v.25 could do more of what they say it will, time will tell.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Phaedrus2129 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 09:55:06
I see no future in this device. It does nothing well. At all.

eReader - Fail. LCD screen is terrible for reading, that's the whole point of eReaders, they have those passive eInk eScreens eOk?
Music player - Fail. It's bulky and huge and can't fit in a pocket.
Phone - Fail, doesn't even have the capability
Laptop - Fail, the iPhone OS doesn't support multitasking, a fatal oversight for something wanting to compete with conventional netbooks. They should have had it run OSX or something
Skillet - Fail, doesn't run quite hot enough to cook an egg
Self defense - Fail. Come on, it weighs a quarter as much as my Model M.



So as you can see, it's just a mediocre product. It isn't "the next big thing"; it's Apple trying to drum up hype over something that tries to do everything and thus does nothing well.

I saw an article in the USA Today... I wonder how much Apple paid them? The writer was sucking Apple's **** so hard he must have passed out from asphyxiation and fell on his keyboard in just the right way to make his computer puke out the massive pile of brown-nosing **** that somehow got into the paper during printing.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Sat, 03 April 2010, 10:32:39
Quote from: Phaedrus2129;169211
I see no future in this device.


Doesn't matter. Apple created it...it has a future.

Apple is a company which has built itself on telling you the other way is for losers rather than making a product that actually attracts you.

Quote from: Phaedrus2129;169211
It does nothing well. At all.


This remains to be seen, but I suspect that is correct. If someone gets Windows 98 onto it, it'll become useful, because that OS is substantially more sophisticated than what's on it.

Quote from: Phaedrus2129;169211
So as you can see, it's just a mediocre product.


That is correct.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 11:03:11
Given the amount of **** software around these days, I really find it hard to blame Apple for making a closed down platform. A fully open platform where everyone can make whatever they want causes all sorts of nonsense - take a look at Windows Vista. On the year Vista came out, early adopters were confronted with lots of blue screens and said "Oh, Vista is ****". In fact, something like a third of all fatal Vista crashes that year were caused by nVidia's drivers. Remember the way people whinged about UAC? That was designed to be completely non-intrusive when operating with correctly designed software. The fact that it bugged everyone every half minute says a lot about the stuff running on it.

At the end of the day, there is a lot of badly designed software out there, I'd go as far as saying that it comprises the majority of software out there. People are idiots, so when the software doesn't work, they blame either a) the hardware vendor or b) the operating system vendor. Apple is both, so they design their platform such that the amount of **** that runs on it is minimized. Combine this with a very limited set of hardware and you have something where very little can go wrong because there are so few variables, and hey, who cares if there isn't a gajillion things that do the same thing? Only a handful of them are worth using anyway. It's a very good way of giving the illusion that your system is better than the competition, the reality is that if Windows was subjected to the same restrictions, it would be just as good.

The alternative to this is an open source model. I hate to sound like an RMS freetard ***, but open source software tends to be very high quality, and this is down to the fact that you have community review, and that you have a bunch of people from different parts of the globe with different ideas and experiences working on something for the love of it, rather than some disheveled code monkey who ****s something together so that he can get paid and move on to the next boring episode of his life. The problem here is that it's difficult for companies to make a profitable open sourced based product for the consumer market. It's simple with enterprise because you can charge obscene amounts of money for support (a lá Red Hat) but that's not something you can do with average Joe Soap.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Sat, 03 April 2010, 11:11:45
Well said, CH. Well said.

That does not, however, address the fact that the iPad is absolutely crippled (and this is considered a selling point, which indicates a problem with the consumer as well). But you're completely right.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: maclover on Sat, 03 April 2010, 11:16:44
I'll probably wait for their next iteration of it before I buy it.

posted from my iPhone
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 11:44:10
I think it'll sell like gangbusters (for the usual reasons apple "appliances" sell).  The question for me is, should it?  For me this is one of those products that ought not to sell, cuz its bad for the computing industry on just about every level (http://www.boingboing.net/2010/04/02/why-i-wont-buy-an-ipad-and-think-you-shouldnt-either.html). (Its great for Apple Corp, but Apple Corp isnt the entire computing industry (yet)). But yea, it'll sell.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mercen_505 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 12:11:14
I'm not drinking the kool-aid on this one. It has a limited market in the form of people who want something around the house that functions like a netbook, but isn't. These folks want to plop on the couch, check their email, watch a vid, or update their social networking whatever. If they can do all that without having to manage a complicated OS and a keyboard/mouse, they will gravitate toward it.

Business use is out. That virtual keyboard isn't going to cut it, for anything other than light messaging, and anyone who thinks the keyboard add-on is going to fly is nuts.

Portable use is limited. It's too large to ride in a pocket, and without a clamshell design it will be exposed to damage during transit without a case. That glass pane is gonna look ugly when it breaks in your iPouch or whatever you'll be using to protect it.

Developers like it because there is a low barrier of entry, and as proven by the iPhone retards will buy anything in the way of apps.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 12:39:58
It boils down to simple 'product line rationalization'. If the iPad could multitask, have more CPU power, have an inbuilt keyboard (etc) then it's popularity would eat into the sales of the more expensive machines, on which Apple makes more profit. So Apple either has to make something that is good but expensive, or something that is relatively cheap but limited.

Apple's main strategy is appeal to snobbery. They don't do 'cheap' or 'low end', which is why there's no Apple netbook (after all, the primary defining feature of the netbook is that they're small and cheap, and everything else is superfluous). It's a rather cynical strategy, but it works for them, and their experimentation in the 90s with cheap machines and licensed clones didn't exactly end well for them. I can't say that what they are doing is a bad thing, I just wouldn't buy into that whole culture myself.

Then again, the people who get all high and mighty about accusing Apple of being a snob product probably also subscribe to the "No one gets fired for buying IBM" school of thought. Snobbery is snobbery no matter how you market it.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Sat, 03 April 2010, 13:22:41
FYI:
I've been putting an iPad through it's paces for over an hour. The product is without question very, very tight. Easy and enjoyable to use, much more convenient than my net/lap. The real sales question is if it suits a users need functionally, basically less than a net/laptop, more than an iPhone. That's a pretty big gap for many (like us, working in-field a couple hours a day while being mobile). Obviously it's not a desktop/road warrior laptop replacement by any means. We have a use for it (3G model). But, it's not a perfect fit either. I think the second gen. of these will be really something.

EDIT---Add a few more things and lower the price of the upper end models $100 to hit the sweet spot.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mercen_505 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 14:27:40
Oh lawd, is dat sum MOE? (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/travis-moe-no-more/24902)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Sat, 03 April 2010, 15:23:42
Quote from: ripster;169230
iBeer App Developer has made over half a million dollars to date. (http://www.benjitao.com/2009/04/all-time-top-iphone-paid-apps-april-2009/)

OK, I wavered a bit. After following the link to Apple's original list of top sellers* I noted that the downloads are dirt cheap. 60p for an interactive London Underground map and journey planner? Has to be a bargain right? Maybe Apple has made progress towards that micropayment concept that never happened on the Internet. That would be a good thing.

But then I read the reviews. Many comments that it gives information that is just plain wrong. Some good reviews too, admittedly.

So here's the thing. How good does an iPhone/iPad app need to be? It needs to be good enough to make you part with a trivial amount of money then not have to worry about it when it turns out to be of limited use. And 99% of what you get will be precisely of that quality. You will get iFart, iPint, Tetris, and a multitude of other apps that nearly do something useful but don't quite hit the mark.

As Fox Mulder might say about the Apple vision, I want to believe. But the truth is out there.


* It's ironic that you have to load iTunes to view that list. Wait, it's not irony it's just a pain in the ass. I often get them mixed up.

P.S. WTF? I can't use a scroll wheel in iTunes? WTF? Seriously, Apple, are you trying to make me hate you???
(Specifically, it blocks Logitech's Universal Scroll function.)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mercen_505 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 15:31:54
Quote

Why are there so many French Maids in Japan? Must be a country of perverts.


Well, it's full of perverts, for sure. Tentacles, man. Tentacles. I've been told that the concept of "service" is baked into their society on a fundamental level, so the idea of having women cruise around in maid uniforms doing things for you (depending on the situation, possibly unspeakable things) is highly desirable.



As for the iPad and its bevvy of cheap apps, I must remain on this side of the fence for now.

(http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b81/_Sirocco/LMAG/coj5Q.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Sat, 03 April 2010, 15:55:53
Quote from: ripster;169262
CONGRATS!  I was getting worried about the Geek in Geekhack.

  The other niche market that it addresses is photographers.  In the field photo backup and preview.  At least that's my excuse if I ever get one.  I'm still gonna wait for more on-hands reviews by the DPReview folks.


I have been contemplating the photographer relavance aspect but I get stuck more on portable portfolio and preview than backup, and it would be elegant for that too.

 I don't know a photographer that likes the amount of equipment they have to carry now (including myself and I'm not talking about the 2-3 cameras around my neck) This is then one more thing to carry, because as far as I can tell it doesn't replace anything. If it replaces the portable backup viewers then the photographer has a major choice to make. And that would be portability, convenience and safety vs  impressiveness and convenience. Bigger portable operations will just use laptops but will "showoff" the ipad to the clients. Do they even have a wireless compatibility with proprietary camera transmitters? As I certainly can't imagine it being compatible with a tethered setup.
I always thought tablet pc's were a great compromise in this regard, but I still see more photographers with laptops and portable backup vewiers. And yet I am still a big fan of dual memory slot cameras.

I could see it in the field like at a studio shoot, but not outside on a shoot. When have you seen an outdoor shoot (daytime) using a glossy screen especially without a vewing hood?

I am curious to see what other unique uses will be found, and I hope it will spark more dedication to electromagnetic solutions as opposed to capacitance by other companies.

Or maybe they will just make an app for it called "lick a toad" and then the little amphibian turns into someone hot. Or the screen turns to something psycheedelic =P
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Sat, 03 April 2010, 18:57:34
150,000 apps. I have 300, that's .002% of which, many aren't ready for prime time, or never will be. That's why they are free or a buck. Some that are free are really good AND surprisingly useful and I would pay more for. I use a few in the $20-$90 range as well. Then again, there are many fine apps (paid/unpaid) that are just of no use to me. The app idea is still in its infancy and has already improved, fortunately.

I've always had more cost in software over hardware. (desktop/laptop)

Wow. I sound like such a fan.  :)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mercen_505 on Sat, 03 April 2010, 19:22:17
Quote
So nobody here watches movies or TV?

Yes, but I have a HTPC and a projector for that ;)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Sat, 03 April 2010, 19:36:22
Quote from: input nirvana;169349
150,000 apps. I have 300, that's .002%


Does it have a calculator? :smile:
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: sethstorm on Sat, 03 April 2010, 20:01:05
Quote from: ripster;169299

Plus if I get bored I'll just take it apart.
Show Image
(http://s1.guide-images.ifixit.com/igi/aTiq1EubJofTjtN1.large)



Me? I'd just be interested in the LCD, touchscreen, inverter pinout, touchscreen pinout and rigging that up in in a more standardized package.

At least they had the sanity to use a standard LVDS connector.  Knowing Apple, they'll throw the pinout all over the place.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Sat, 03 April 2010, 20:04:33
Quote from: Rajagra;169355
Does it have a calculator? :smile:


Touche'
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Sat, 03 April 2010, 20:09:56
So it seems like a lot of people think the iPad will sell is because zombies will buy anything that Apple says is "magical." Oh come on, have more imagination than that. They put out tons of stuff that never made it anywhere like the Apple TV, the Mac Mini, the Mac Cube, and Mac Air. There are plenty of people out there who will buy a certain product just because it has the right label or because they think it makes them fit a certain image. That attitude includes plenty of people here, but those people are a tiny fraction of a market.

If the iPad succeeds, everyone will jump off a cliff because this device released 4 years ago was far more visionary and that device that never made it out of prototype had more creativity than the entire Apple corporation. Perhaps, but all would be missing the point that it's far more than the device itself.

The critical mass of users and developers for a device is more important than the device itself. The device just has to not utterly suck. Timing is important too. When Microsoft made a half hearted effort to open up the age of the tablet PC almost ten years ago everyone's idea of a mobile app was running Solitaire on their Nokia phone and the up and coming digital industry was 99 cent cell phone rings.

What have we seen in the past few years? The Web started to encroach the desktop. APIs proliferated like mad. All sorts of mobile apps started popping up to give people access to newly available online streams of information and services and many of these apps were underpowered or difficult to use because it's impossible to design for a tiny interface.

If the Web had not gone 2.0, we might still be trying to one up each other at cell phone solitaire and buying 99 cent ring tones. Each little step unlocks an opportunity for the next outfit to come along to build upon it. Services inform the design of devices and in turn devices influence the design of services and this is why I'm so intrigued by the form factor of the iPad. We really don't know what will happen because it really is a new crossroads. Its predecessors didn't have the advantage of a mountain of services that the iPad has access to and had to be more than a device could possibly be in order to survive.

And please stop with the Apple will kill innovation complaint. That's like saying we're all going to have to be resigned to learning Palm Graffiti because Palm OS has conquered the PDA world. If the iPad succeeds, it will open up quality competition and in the long run, it might just be a stepping stone for another company. Already its opened up opportunities for little known devices that bear some resemblance to it. Who the hell would have ever heard of a JooJoo?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Sat, 03 April 2010, 20:29:22
I want one of these (http://www.koreaittimes.com/story/8080/counterfeit-ipad-china-vs-genuine-ipad-america).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Sat, 03 April 2010, 21:33:25
Quote from: kishy;169366
I want one of these (http://www.koreaittimes.com/story/8080/counterfeit-ipad-china-vs-genuine-ipad-america).


LOL, it looks like some actually did make the MacBook Wheel (http://www.theonion.com/articles/onion-news-network,14299/)!
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Sat, 03 April 2010, 21:55:52
Quote from: hyperlinked;169382
LOL, it looks like some actually did make the MacBook Wheel (http://www.theonion.com/articles/onion-news-network,14299/)!


Lol wow I didn't even think of that, and I did see the Onion's piece on that way back when too.

Ultimately...that's pretty much what it is, unless the counterfeit ones are equally as trimmed down as real iPads. I know the counterfeit iPhones, at least the good ones, were substantially more feature-rich than the real thing.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 04 April 2010, 05:11:49
Quote from: hyperlinked;169363
They put out tons of stuff that never made it anywhere like the Apple TV, the Mac Mini,


I must confess, I actually want a Mac Mini... They're a very nice little unit.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: iMav on Sun, 04 April 2010, 06:11:10
Mac minis are nice.  I've owned several of them (currently have one hooked up to my TV in my home office).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Sun, 04 April 2010, 06:35:39
Ok, LOL, wrong piece of hardware to throw into the "meh" side of the list. ;)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Manyak on Sun, 04 April 2010, 09:55:39
Quote from: iMav;169438
Mac minis are nice.  I've owned several of them (currently have one hooked up to my TV in my home office).

I agree, they're pretty slick. Except they still sacrifice functionality for form, just like pretty much every piece of apple hardware except the Mac Pro. And possibly the iPhone/iPod touch (even though they skimp on some basic functionality like codec support and flash, the 3rd party apps add a lot to them).

1: One thing you always want from an HTPC is for it to be as quiet as possible - meaning that completely eliminating the hard drive is definitely a good thing. But SSDs are really expensive. So what you can do is get a real NIC with TOE and iSCSI offloading and have it boot over iSCSI from a hard drive in a different PC in your house. Mac Minis can't do this, so you're forced to buy an SSD to make it silent.

2: Instead of chalking up $300 for an Xbox, you can spend under $100 on a decent video card and controller for a PC. And since most of the great Xbox games are ported to the PC, it can pretty much completely replace one. Sure, you can still install Windows on a Mac Mini, but it doesn't have anywhere near enough graphics power to handle these games.

3: It only fits slot-load laptop drives, and good luck finding a Bluray player in that form factor. Sure you can get an external one, but that kind of defeats the purpose - you might as well get a standalone player at that point.

4: It's limited in the number of audio formats it can send over it's optical output. It can't output TrueHD or DTS-HD, so you're limited to the lossy AC3 codec for your movies.


So as you can see, hooked up to a TV it's still really not that functional compared to what you can get for the same price.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Mon, 05 April 2010, 01:56:43
I think the reason for no multi-tasking on the iPad has been discovered... and probably the real reason for no Flash too.

It powers itself off once the internal temperature hits 95 degrees. People who were using their iPad in direct sunlight in hot places had their devices auto shut down on them.
Want to use your iPad in the sun? You might have to rethink that. (http://thenextweb.com/apple/2010/04/03/ipad-sun-rethink/?awesm=tnw.to_15tqf&utm_medium=tnw.to-other&utm_source=direct-tnw.to&utm_content=twitter-publisher-other)

Sorry ItlnStln, no iPad for you unless you want to move out of Texas. ;)

Hmm... I guess that's why everything has these damn annoyingly loud fans.

Apparently, this can happen on the iPhone too, but few people manage to trigger the safety shutdown.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 05 April 2010, 02:48:20
The reason why it has no flash is because of a deliberate decision to eschew it in favor of HTML5. Hardware reasons are invalid, because devices using relatively similar hardware such as the Nokia N900 can do it.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: iMav on Mon, 05 April 2010, 03:56:09
Quote from: Manyak;169456
So as you can see, hooked up to a TV it's still really not that functional compared to what you can get for the same price.

I have yet to find something as powerful in such a small form factor (core2duo, able to take 8GB of ram).  They are little power houses.

I use my tv as a display for the mini...doing computing tasks primarily. I couldn't care less what outputs the audio supports, it works with my cheap 32" LCD tv's audio input. :)

The real Mac mini HTPC freaks are over at 123Macmini (http://www.123macmini.com/forums).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 05 April 2010, 07:41:03
Quote from: hyperlinked;169595
Sorry ItlnStln, no iPad for you unless you want to move out of Texas. ;)

Damn.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Mon, 05 April 2010, 09:38:54
Quote from: ripster;169659
Show Image
(http://www.jokeemail.com/pictures/cowboy.jpg)

Aaarrgghhh! That photo looks painful. What a prick!
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mercen_505 on Mon, 05 April 2010, 11:58:28
Multitasking is a bit complicated, really. (http://blog.rlove.org/2010/04/why-ipad-and-iphone-dont-support.html) Besides, it gives Apple room to announce Product X, Revision Y, wherein along with one or two other largely forgettable features... you get multitasking. People want that. Insert wav of cash register here.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: didjamatic on Mon, 05 April 2010, 12:07:18
At least it has expandable memory with those SD card slots.  Oh, wait.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mercen_505 on Mon, 05 April 2010, 12:40:09
Things can multitask, but in order to do so they need to be designed for it from the ground up. For instance, multitasking under DOS was a mother****er. Possible? Yup, just ask a Desqview-X user. From a programming standpoint, it was a nightmare. DOS was never meant to multitask, so the architecture was never put in place to facilitate it.

Controlling the "user experience" and forcing certain outcomes is infinitely easier when you don't allow programs to run concurrently. When you allow anyone to open any combination of applications and services, things become murky. I don't fault Apple for approaching this situation with caution. They are jealously protective of their "user experience."
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 05 April 2010, 13:44:54
I'm starting to take Ars' Apple comments with a little salt these days.  They're better than Engadget, to be sure, but they have been imbibing on the Kool-Aid an awful lot the past couple of years.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mercen_505 on Mon, 05 April 2010, 15:34:17
Ars was better in terms of their coverage and general lack of bias before they were acquired by Condé Nast. They haven't fallen off a cliff or anything apocalyptic, but like others, I place significantly less stock in their opinions these days.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 05 April 2010, 15:44:59
The core group of writers have also gotten older, too, and they don't seem to be as interested in "hardcore" computing anymore.  I haven't seen a computer buying guide in awhile, let alone the less frequent component (video card, mobo, etc.) reviews.  They still do platform and higher-level processor articles, but they seem to have moved on to a more "bird's-eye-view" look at tech.  I suppose, though, there are about a billion other magazines that do the hardware deep-dive stuff these days.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 05 April 2010, 16:35:01
When third-party multitasking is available in OS 1.4 (IIRC), it will make the iPad look a lot more attractive.  I want to listen to Pandora while I do stuff, goddammit.  A "regular user" co-worker of mine played with one this weekend, and said that without multitasking, it was sort of awkward to use.  Single applications were OK, but it was hard to do "productive" things.  He also said there were quite a few apps that looked stupid on the iPad as they were developed for the iPhone/iPod Touch (mainly games).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Mon, 05 April 2010, 16:54:39
I'm surprised we haven't seen any photos of it with photoshopped blood on it.

You know why there'd be blood on an iPad.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Mon, 05 April 2010, 16:58:07
Quote from: ripster;169844
I told my wife I can't buy one yet until I irritate everyone at Geekhack for a few more months.

This is infinitely better than DIP switches.


Or foam.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Mon, 05 April 2010, 17:50:37
Only read this if you want to hear a positive review of the iPad!

Just got home with my day using an iPad. Pretty happy, it has made working considerably faster and much more convenient.

Today: Driving to 3 locations, 5 hours, 2 informal meetings. 60 degrees and sunny, a beautiful day.
-Sending/receiving a couple short emails. Fine, no big deal. iPhone can do that. No time saving.
-Wrote one 700 word email detailing a problem, cause/effect, solution and cost. Was able to do much more easily and discretely than with laptop at location. Not using laptop was FANTASTIC! Saved about 10 mins and was easier to do.
-Accessed emailed photos to show obscure details while standing in an office meeting after walking 20 mins. Saved time and hassle. IPhone pics would be too small, carrying a laptop and jamming it into someones face to show the issue will cost them extra, not a good option. Settled issue immediately and stopped argument. Got increased cost approval while everyone was present and avoided 2 days of emails/finger-pointing.
-Received and reviewed 7 page insurance fax and then made phone call for on-the-spot approval (while standing!!). Not using laptop was FANTASTIC! Saved 10 mins and hassle.  
-Used calendar, extremely nice visually, no biggie. It's a calendar. No time saving, not easier or harder.

My results were:
Time saving
Easier and more convenient
Much faster and easier access to information

For me, I consider this a business tool. I don't need it in office or at home, or when "working" at a static location. But, when mobile, it is very valuable, and fills a gap. I think using it today actually made me money. That's all it needs to get my vote. It may be lacking this or that, but I'm looking for what it DOES, not what it doesn't do.

I give this unit up in about 10 days. It will be missed. :(
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Mon, 05 April 2010, 18:19:39
What are you, an attorney?????

:)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Manyak on Mon, 05 April 2010, 19:18:14
Quote from: ch_123;169601
The reason why it has no flash is because of a deliberate decision to eschew it in favor of HTML5. Hardware reasons are invalid, because devices using relatively similar hardware such as the Nokia N900 can do it.


That's just total bull**** from them and you know it. They didn't put flash on the iphone when it came out YEARS ago, and there was no such thing as HTML5 then. It's because they know that flash based webapps (and games) can completely eat into their itunes sales.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Mon, 05 April 2010, 19:33:26
Apple (actually, most companies I guess) doesn't do anything in the interest of customers...they do everything to improve their image and margins, and put a positive spin on it for the customer in the end.

I have no belief, nor will I ever have any belief, that Apple put Flash out of the picture because they're trying to encourage the adoption of HTML5 far and wide (though their goal may be to diminish the popularity of Flash in the process, I doubt there is any intention to actually popularize HTML5). That's just the convenient spin they can throw on it, nothing more and nothing less I am sure.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Mon, 05 April 2010, 19:55:56
Somewhat mildly interesting side note...

6 people in room
1 didn't utter a single word, as far as I could tell, she had no vocal chords,
1 person knew what it was and had no interest, absolutely zero,
1 person didn't know what it was and had no interest...flatline,
1 person knew what it was and was very interested (a screamer!) "Look...at...THAT!!" (Webwit and Ripster got that dead on right),
1 person did not know what it was and was very interested (he might be at an Apple store right now),
I was the 6th person.

The 2 peeps that had a lot of interest, also could potentially have a LOT of use for it (they do in/out of office mobile work). As for the other 3, I have no idea if they might have that same need, but the non-talker is definitely full-time office. Maybe we mostly get excited when it's something we actually need or can use?

I probably only would "need" it 3-6 days a month max, depending on time of year, type of projects, number of employees, many variables. I doubt I will buy my own unit in the near future, but that pretty much depends on my need more than my want.

I want to see how it functions as an e-reader.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: datamonger128 on Mon, 05 April 2010, 20:37:56
iPad is dumb.  It's just a giant iPod touch with the ability to have a custom background without the use of jailbreaking.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Mon, 05 April 2010, 21:55:04
I'm following this thread because I have a possible interest in the iPad and I have the use of one for a week or so to see if I want to buy one (3G model). I'll actually only "use" this unit maybe for 2 days for work in the next week. I'm wondering how many people that have posted here have tried it? I was hoping for some "non-magazine-writer reviews" or insight for something (good/bad) I may not know. That's why I gave my silly, amateur, touchy-feely opinions.

Another observation I neglected to mention earlier. The touchscreen allows for very rapid input and is highly responsive. Using photos or itunes is a different and improved experience. (more pluses!). Crazy Apple didn't add a camera and iChat. (negatives!!) The iPad is pretty small.

Geekhack Note:  The iPad keypad has no tactile feedback, and I don't think the layout can be changed. :)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Tue, 06 April 2010, 00:58:12
Quote from: input nirvana;169867
-Accessed emailed photos to show obscure details while standing in an office meeting after walking 20 mins. Saved time and hassle. IPhone pics would be too small, carrying a laptop and jamming it into someones face to show the issue will cost them extra, not a good option. Settled issue immediately and stopped argument. Got increased cost approval while everyone was present and avoided 2 days of emails/finger-pointing.

That's interesting. What do you think it was about having a tablet computer that affected the situation? I'm very interested in how tablet computers can possibly affect social dynamics with associates and acquaintances.

I started to become really interested in the iPad a few days ago when I started to think about given that I'm a total tech head, I rarely carry a laptop around with me and I try to not use my Blackberry when someone else is around me. The weight of the laptop is surely a factor, but so are social dynamics. I feel that both devices are disruptive to social interaction, but for different reasons. A laptop makes me feel like I just put a wall up between me and another person I'm meeting with and a PDA makes me feel like I just entered a tunnel in which the only thing that exists for the moment is me and the device I'm focusing all my attention on.

There's a physical barrier in one and a psychological barrier in the other, yet arguably concentrating on jotting notes on a notepad when I'm talking to someone doesn't feel as disruptive though it's arguably just as attention intensive to write, talk, and listen at the same time. I wonder if the form factor of a device either affects how you focus your attention or your body language and how others perceive your actions.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Tue, 06 April 2010, 01:13:47
You hit the nail on the head. Form factor is an issue. When someone is looking at their phone, it's sort of personal, room just for one. People understand that. The laptop creates a wall, and is a headache if you are moving around, it's prohibitive. The iPad is actually pretty small, but it's ALL screen. Even the thin-ness helps. Weird, I know. Also, with body language, I included the others in the office without the need to do the "laptop huddle" which no one cares for. It was a real surprise benefit and success, I'm still thinking about it.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Tue, 06 April 2010, 01:22:57
Also, in this instance, which was looking at time stamped photos to prove what was/wasn't done on a particular date, I was able to hand over the tablet across the desk like a photo or sheet of paper. No keyboard for the person to be careful of, easy to show a 3rd person down the line.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Tue, 06 April 2010, 01:36:08
Quote from: input nirvana;169966
You hit the nail on the head. Form factor is an issue. When someone is looking at their phone, it's sort of personal, room just for one. People understand that. The laptop creates a wall, and is a headache if you are moving around, it's prohibitive. The iPad is actually pretty small, but it's ALL screen. Even the thin-ness helps. Weird, I know. Also, with body language, I included the others in the office without the need to do the "laptop huddle" which no one cares for. It was a real surprise benefit and success, I'm still thinking about it.

I think the laptop huddle is less of an issue when you're around people you know well or have "permission" to enter someone's personal space. With people you know, it's still a little awkward, but it doesn't setup a loaded social situation. You just find it difficult to switch your attention between the monitor and your friend so you can be fully attentive.

With acquaintances and business contacts, it creates some interesting situations. A number of time I've met with new clients and there comes a sometimes awkward moment (especially if the other person is female) in which we need to look at something together on a computer, but the other person is sitting across from me so I need to invite that person over to my side of the table to look at something or I put the laptop sideways between us.

It's obvious what the challenges are with putting the laptop sideways. Now you're all distracted and fudging with something that's very hard to use.

Bringing the person across the table to your side seems like the ideal thing to do, but then you're done looking at what you're looking at and you find yourself sitting side by side. When you're around an acquaintance or someone you need to have a business conversation with that can be awkward. The conversation usually doesn't end the second you're done with the laptop so what does the other person do? Immediately scurry back to the other side like you're radioactive and risk offending you. Do you both stay there and crane your necks so you can talk without getting into each other's personal space? Does the other person eventually slink away only to have to come back over again later?

Of course I'm saying all of this as an American and I'm completely aware that social conventions may dictate completely different behavior elsewhere, but I suspect that the potential presence of a barrier or the splitting of one's attention will still cause friction. (Totally random tidbit from some study I did of hospital design in my past life... in some cultures, doctors exam rooms are built intentionally smaller because it's considered rude to be not almost in the face of your patient.)

I remember hearing some social researcher some years ago on the radio talk about his study of how people perceive public cell phone use. A lot of people perceive it to be rude or annoying when a total stranger is using a cell phone in public, but yet don't feel at all slighted when that person is with someone else and having a conversation. I forgot what the rationale was. I think it was something to the effect that he thought we're hard wired to shun people who have their attention focused outside of our shared space even when there's no relationship between you and the other person or very little potential for interaction. Someone talking to a friend is still part of your shared space. Someone on the phone is walking around in a sealed bubble and wants nothing to do with you or anyone else.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: jimsage85 on Tue, 06 April 2010, 15:03:08
Hmmmm..Wifi connectivity issues anyone?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 06 April 2010, 15:14:35
SPAMbot with a Yahoo account, hmmm...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Tue, 06 April 2010, 17:51:13
Quote from: ripster;170124
Hey, now we have APPLE HATE spambots!


There's an app for that.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Tue, 06 April 2010, 19:14:59
Earlier I mentioned (in this thread) that I could see it being used as a portable portfolio and the more I think about it, I really like that idea! I don't think "I" would get an "ipad" for it (probably just a slate from someone or a tablet) but I am kinda digging that idea. However I think if you brandish an ipad to show a client/boss or potential one some work it would be more elegant and slick than a normal portfolio (even fancy ones).

I just looked up current tablet and slate pc's (not old or used ones), and I noticed the price difference between them and the ipad. Now I think the ipad is 1/2 the price for 1/2 the functionality? Which is not that bad of a thing.

I also just read a review from someone who acutally used the aftermarket pogo stylus for/from the iphone (the one I shunnnnned earlier for being horrid to use). Due to the larger screen it was nicer/easier to use, I thought that was good. But it was not ideal or even good, but it was more useable than on the iphone.

I also noticed how many other companies will be selling similar "slates" soon. I did find that to be reasurring =)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Wed, 07 April 2010, 01:26:45
Whooops! Silly me I guess I didn't really look up enough stuff when I did that tablet/slate search. There are a few that are about the same price as the ipad. The lenovo s10 3t seems very capable and costs about the same as the low end ipad. Each will do things the other may not do as well but really lenovo's idea pad looks impressive when you compare them. Wish it had pressure sensitivity though, oh well...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Wed, 07 April 2010, 01:53:28
Mmm, the Lenovo s10 3t looks good, but I'll want more than a 1.6Ghz Atom processor before I'd consider it. I already have a netbook with thsoe specs and it is SLOW.

I'm starting to be more aware of all the other tablet like devices out there. If software makers get off their arses and start to churn out quality Windows based tablet apps optimized for tablet devices, I think the biggest effect of the iPad will be its stimulus of the non-Apple tablet market.

I brought up the AOL phenomena earlier in this thread without realizing the total parallels it had with the Apple app store way of doing things. For a number of years, these closed systems were where all the action happened. Internet history has a funny way of following a pattern. I wonder if iPad = AOL 2010.

We don't have to look all the way back for that parallel though. Facebook kinda went through it too. Up until last year, it was intended to be a mostly closed system.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Wed, 07 April 2010, 07:38:11
In an NPR piece, the commentator noted that there was a lot of interest from Realtors and photographers around using the iPad as a way to show pictures.  I thought that was a great use for the iPad, but other than just viewing a slide show of pics already on the device, I noted a major problem.  Through my experience buying/trying to sell a house, and looking for a photographer for the wedding I never had, most of those sites use Flash to display the pictures.  Well, you can see where the problem might be with that.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Wed, 07 April 2010, 09:33:25
Quote from: ripster;170295
Realtors know how to show JPEG pictures.  At 6% commission they aren't THAT dumb.

For their own listings, sure.  Not for others, though.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Wed, 07 April 2010, 09:37:39
Quote from: ripster;170295
And you CAN author with Adobe Flash Professional CS5 for the iPad. (http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flash/articles/authoring_for_multiple_screen_sizes.html)  April 12th.  This means Photoshop CS5 should be here soon.  Upgrade time for me even though I despise Photoshop's UI.

THAT is the April launch that I'm totally drooling over. Someone hand me a bib and a napkin!

From the features they previewed, it looks like CS5 is one of those releases that actually has useful new features as opposed to just an improved UI of the previous version. I just hope they didn't jack up the price 200%.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Wed, 07 April 2010, 09:57:55
I'm glad my e-mail address still points to a university domain.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Thu, 08 April 2010, 18:12:50
Quote from: ripster;170655

Apple Aperature included iPad support in their latest release (http://www.imaging-resource.com/NEWS/1269634367.html).  Unforturnately I'm on Adobe Lightroom.  Wish these guys could just get along.


Adobe is the "new enemy" of Apple. First IBM, then microsoft, now the dreaded adobe. Although I think macromedia made flash a lot better (Adobe is just muddling it all up).

The iPad is nothing revolutionary. It's really dull, but the common mind is entertained by the media. It doesn't help that they're all meant to be thrown out when the battery dies: it's not built to last, to be repaired, or anything of the sort! I wouldn't buy a computer that was glued shut (http://www.appledefects.com/wiki/images/e/e9/Explodingbattery2.jpg), restricted the OS, or disallowed me to explore its internals.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Fri, 09 April 2010, 01:49:51
Quote from: ripster;170742
> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344">[/youtube]

Amazing how that kid was able to use the interface so well without any prior training. It's that intuitive.

Ignore the bit where she kept tapping to get a response and it failed. Doesn't prove it's a setup at all. Nosiree, she had no previous experience of this kind of interface at all, I totally believe that! :rolleyes:

EDIT> BS Confirmed. In true Apple advertising style, some steps were omitted, namely: "My daughter likes playing with my iPhone, but this was her very first encounter with an iPad"

EDIT2> Note the title: "A 2.5 Year-Old Has A First Encounter with An iPad". It's his daughter. He described her as an anomyous 2.5 year old. But he tells us the new toy is an iPad. He's more proud of his iPad than his daughter. Disturbing.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Fri, 09 April 2010, 02:26:12
Bah! What happened to the good old days when kids were left in front of the TV as a substitute parent?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 09 April 2010, 03:16:07
Quote from: Rajagra;170801
EDIT> BS Confirmed. In true Apple advertising style, some steps were omitted, namely: "My daughter likes playing with my iPhone, but this was her very first encounter with an iPad"

EDIT2> Note the title: "A 2.5 Year-Old Has A First Encounter with An iPad". It's his daughter. He described her as an anomyous 2.5 year old. But he tells us the new toy is an iPad. He's more proud of his iPad than his daughter. Disturbing.

LOL, not splitting hairs now are we? It's totally obvious the kid knew her way around an iPhone, but still impressive nonetheless.

It's a dirty secret, but putting your Apple device above your kids is something Apple asks its customers to do. Just play an Apple commercial backwards. It might be annoying played forward, but backwards it's just downright scary. Plus, the guy shooting the video is a Californian. We're barbarians. Especially those of us up north.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 09 April 2010, 03:19:55
Quote from: ripster;170804
BTW they didn't show the part where she tried the ALPS keyboard.  

She started crying uncontrollably at that point.


"WTF is this dad? Your promised me a TOPRE!"
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: didjamatic on Fri, 09 April 2010, 08:43:11
Hmmm...

My 3 year old can connect RGB cables, power on a hacked Xbox, navigate menus to launch XBMC, navigate our network to load My Little Pony or any of hundreds of movie titles.  She is a whiz at countless Windows apps and games... and she can use paint.

My 5 year olds are on their second windows system, can use countless applications and if most adults saw them, they would be amazed.  Their latest game is Cargo Bridge (http://www.limexgames.com/) from Limexgames - if you haven't tried Cargo Bridge, you will seriously love it.  It's addicting to see how inexpensive you can make a bridge.  And it teaches kids mechanics, physics and problem solving through trial and error, cause and effect.

Should I credit Microsoft for their being able to efficiently do what many adults can't?  Not on your life.  They pwn windows just as easily as an Ipad

Mac has done some clever marketing here.  They are user friendly, I don't doubt that.  But if the girl has spent countless hours on her mother's lap watching her work on the computer, it woudln't matter what OS she was using, she would be able to do the same in paint or gimp.

Now go try Cargo Bridge... unless you're on an ipad, they don't support flash do they? :)

(http://www.atannergames.com/Game%20Photos/cargo%20bridge.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Fri, 09 April 2010, 09:05:21
I'm an Apple/PC guy.   So I'm not a fanboy exclusively one way or the other.   Yesterday, we went by the Apple store to purchase an IPad (sold out in Paramus, NJ) and hand some hands on fun with board.   My 10 yr. son (who has a MacBook Pro) immediately loved the IPad.  Then again, he loves his ITouch so I'm not surprised.  

It's a niche product and I think mainly for surfing the web and sharing photos and stuff.   It's very user friendly and I'm sure that Apple will get richer simply from the tons of Apps that can be downloaded for the device.   It's fast for most users and it's easy to pass around.  Not so with a laptop.....

I asked the salesperson there (usually quite knowledgeable at the Apple stores) and he said that they've had only one return out of all of the units sold??!!??   That's pretty good.  I figured a lot of people would find that it doesn't replace their IPhones and laptops and would return them.

My only real beef is with the super glossy screen.  In any sort of bright light, the reflections can be really distracting.  

Other than that, I'm happy with the product.   With 3G, it will be the ultimate brief case accessory.   Internet anywhere for only $14.99/mo.

skc
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 09:15:33
Quote from: didjamatic;170852
Hmmm...

My 3 year old can connect RGB cables, power on a hacked Xbox, navigate menus to launch XBMC, navigate our network to load My Little Pony or any of hundreds of movie titles.


my neice at 3 years old could load her baby einstein dvd's into the player and turn on everything needed with the multifunction remote (something her 38 year old mother couldnt do).

No one taught her to do this, she just picked it up from watching us at some point.  Cute little monkey.  (Meanwhile my mom still doesnt know how to work the dvd player).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 09:18:08
Quote from: didjamatic;170852
Hmmm...

Mac has done some clever marketing here.


have they though? I actually wonder about the wisdom of trying to get adults to be "proud" that they can do something a 3 year old can do. Is that really a source of pride?

yea, i know what point they're trying to get across with these ads, but I actually question the way apple "infantilizes adults".
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 09:21:43
Quote from: skcheng;170854


It's a niche product and I think mainly for surfing the web and sharing photos and stuff.   It's very user friendly and I'm sure that Apple will get richer simply from the tons of Apps that can be downloaded for the device.   It's fast for most users and it's easy to pass around.  Not so with a laptop.....


i do agree with that, btw. There's a lot about the way apple does things that bothers me, but to be honest my mom would love it too. For taht matter, like i said elsewhere, i wouldnt mind it as a bedside device. I rationalize this by saying its a niche product (which I think it is; in my view not a substitute for a laptop).

Of course part of the problem here is that I dont want to put in the time and effort to educate my mom on laptops. Handing her an ipad is a far easier solution for me. ;)  (So i guess i'm complicit in infantilizing her).

Quote

With 3G, it will be the ultimate brief case accessory. Internet anywhere for only $14.99/mo.

this is something i hope MS emulates -- the 3g prices for the ipad are actually affordable (even if the device itself isnt). As I understand it, you can actually have a "per use" 3g plan with it - no monthly, pay a small fee (like a a buck or two) "per use" if you want.  I could be wrong but my ipad-owning friend told me something along these lines. I thought a "per use" plan was a brilliant idea for the 3g model, for those who dont want an on going monthly (or those who expect to mostly use its wifi).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 09 April 2010, 10:10:19
Quote from: wellington1869;170859
I rationalize this by saying its a niche product (which I think it is; in my view not a substitute for a laptop).
I think Steve Jobs himself has even said so much... that it's not supposed to replace a laptop.

Here's something to remember. It's easy to look at the iPad or anything that Apple makes as tech for dummies. They sure like to promote that image (though in more glamorous terms), but a lot of stuff run on Apple hardware is anything but simple.

It's all about the apps. The number of buttons on your computer may be one, a thousand, or none, but the second you're running a complex program on it, how much you love or hate the OS is irrelevant.

I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of us here had kids or were related to kids who really knew their way around a desktop. Most of us here are gear heads and our genes are no doubt partly responsible for that. That doesn't mean every kid will be like that nor should it mean that every kid should be like that. Your brain is a finite resource. A lot of people are going to be far better off focusing all their energies on making music, developing world champion athletic skills, or shaping iron rather than keeping their PC maintenance skills up to date.

Besides, simplicity doesn't always make the world smaller. If simplicity gives someone the confidence to explore a little farther than he or she would otherwise, you can't really say it's a constraint.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Fri, 09 April 2010, 10:29:08
Quote from: hyperlinked;170869
I think Steve Jobs himself has even said so much... that it's not supposed to replace a laptop.

Here's something to remember. It's easy to look at the iPad or anything that Apple makes as tech for dummies. They sure like to promote that image (though in more glamorous terms), but a lot of stuff run on Apple hardware is anything but simple.

It's all about the apps. The number of buttons on your computer may be one, a thousand, or none, but the second you're running a complex program on it, how much you love or hate the OS is irrelevant.

I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of us here had kids or were related to kids who really knew their way around a desktop. Most of us here are gear heads and our genes are no doubt partly responsible for that. That doesn't mean every kid will be like that nor should it mean that every kid should be like that. Your brain is a finite resource. A lot of people are going to be far better off focusing all their energies on making music, developing world champion athletic skills, or shaping iron rather than keeping their PC maintenance skills up to date.

It takes all types.



Yes, and I think that's the beauty of Apple.   While I don't disagree with Welly, I do think that Apple lets you forget about the hardware and concentrate instead on the software.   Turn the thing on and it works.    Setting up two IMacs at my office were simplicity itself.   An ultra cool power cord and one power button.  That's all anyone needs to do to get up and running.  

So what if Apple doesn't play well with printers or non-Apple software.   So what if the warranty sucks without purchasing additional Apple Care.   They aren't prone to viruses and they've proven themselves to be reliable.   And the screens are really excellent ....   You win some and you lose some.  

skc
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 09 April 2010, 10:49:29
That's what Palm thought.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 11:11:57
well at some point in the 90's apple whole heartedly embraced the "appliance model", which wont suit old-timer geeks very well but will definitely capture the non-geek market (which is the much, much bigger market out there.)
Something cory doctorow, an old time apple geek, laments here (http://www.boingboing.net/2010/04/02/why-i-wont-buy-an-ipad-and-think-you-shouldnt-either.html).
But as a result, yea apple is going to crush MS going forward. For better or worse. I agree that simplicity isnt all bad even for geeks, but what I worry about is the fate of geeky tinkerers like me. I hope there will always be someone out there making open hw and sw for people to mod at will. I guess I keep hoping for some kind of utopian happy medium between open moddability and security and ease of use. Reality is far messier though.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 09 April 2010, 11:32:44
Quote from: wellington1869;170890
For better or worse. I agree that simplicity isnt all bad even for geeks, but what I worry about is the fate of geeky tinkerers like me. I hope there will always be someone out there making open hw and sw for people to mod at will.

Woo hooo! I really don't think you have anything to worry about.  Windows based PCs rule the world and that probably won't change anytime soon. If a hole is torn in the fabric of the universe and Apple-style hardware/software becomes the norm, either they'll allow for more tinkering or someone else will make a mint by being the anti-Apple.

If there was no massive Wintel juggernaut, a marketing department in Cupertino, CA that wants you to believe its products will simplify your tech life would have little leverage. If the roles were reversed, Microsoft might be the one settling into the one size fits all illusion. The simplicity value proposition has little value if there's nothing to compare it against.

I don't think tinkerers have anything to be worried about. Even if your worst nightmare comes true, people find ways to mod anything, a jailbroken version of everything exists, and entropy does not lose cage matches.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 11:50:17
well maybe i'm looking too far ahead. But for instance, the new win7 phone doesnt have user-replaceable batteries. Something that MS clearly took from the apple model. In other ways I've read MS executives saying that apple got it right in pursuing the appliance model. I'd rather that MS tried to create its own market than try to beat apple at its own game (there's no way MS can do that; no one can).

Similarly i wonder how long the corporate world can remain immune to appliances. At my school faculty are switching in droves to apples (for better or worse). Can corporations be that far behind? There's talk  (http://www.electronista.com/articles/10/03/15/study.shows.blackberry.has.no.loyalty/)about the iphone being a viable replacement for blackberries as blackberry contracts begin to expire. There were some stories on huffingtonpost.com along these lines.

but yea, i'm probably worrying about nothing; if MS destroys itself by trying to ape apple, android/google OS will probably try to take its place.  I always thought MS at least tried to find a middle ground between apple and linux (closed and open). I hope it doesnt abandon that attempt, but market forces may decide this for them.

btw, i own both an ibook and a dell, just fyi.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 09 April 2010, 12:16:36
Quote from: wellington1869;170908
well maybe i'm looking too far ahead. But for instance, the new win7 phone doesnt have user-replaceable batteries. Something that MS clearly took from the apple model.

That was a prototype.  The WinMo7 specs don't specify one way or the other how manufacturers can implement battery installations.  Sure the proto used did not have a user-replaceable battery, but when HTC, Motorola, etc. begin releasing phones, they may or may not have a user-replaceable battery; it's up to the manufacturers' discretion.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 12:20:34
Quote from: itlnstln;170921
That was a prototype.  The WinMo7 specs don't specify one way or the other how manufacturers can implement battery installations.  Sure the proto used did not have a user-replaceable battery, but when HTC, Motorola, etc. begin releasing phones, they may or may not have a user-replaceable battery; it's up to the manufacturers' discretion.


i see what you mean. but then i hope all those manufacturers dont ape the appliance model. I like being able to change my own batteries; i dont think as an adult i should be forced to pay $100 at the genius bar for some 16 year old kid to do it for me ;)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 09 April 2010, 12:24:22
I'm looking for big things from WinMo7.  I really like WebOS on my Palm, but the hardware is underpowered, and I don't think they will be around when I get my new phone later this year.  I am not very impressed with the iPhone OS.  That, and the iPhone is not an option on Sprint.  Android will be nice, too, but we'll have to see what hardware Sprint offers later this year.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 12:41:40
Quote from: itlnstln;170928
I'm looking for big things from WinMo7.  I really like WebOS on my Palm, but the hardware is underpowered, and I don't think they will be around when I get my new phone later this year.  I am not very impressed with the iPhone OS.  That, and the iPhone is not an option on Sprint.  Android will be nice, too, but we'll have to see what hardware Sprint offers later this year.


if i were in the market for a smartphone today i'd seriously consider the android i guess. Palm on verizon by the way has an amazing deal right now  (http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/01/verizon-mobile-hotspot-on-webos-devices-now-free/) but prolly they're going out of business soon (at least the rumors in the business press keep saying that, if they dont find a buyer soon). Fantastic price and features though.

yea winmo7 is getting good reviews for a change. nice to see MS get off their asses.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 09 April 2010, 12:57:46
Quote from: wellington1869;170925
i dont think as an adult i should be forced to pay $100 at the genius bar for some 16 year old kid to do it for me ;)

I don't think the visit to the Genius bar is the problem. Of course you can change your own batteries, but you just can't swap in a new battery if you're out on the trail and need about 4 hours of juice.

I don't think the no removable batteries thing is some evil trick to make you subservient to 16 yo's at the Genius bar. Take a look at how they managed to jam a 10+ hour battery into the iPad:

iPad Test Notes: Battery Life (Gizmodo) (http://gizmodo.com/5510095/ipad-test-notes-battery-life)
(http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/4/2010/04/500x_500x_ipad-teardown-04-fcc_01.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 13:00:17
as much as i like my sony e-ink reader and its features...  and even tho i'm sure i wont like the glossy screen and 1.5lb weight of the ipad-as-reader... I cant deny ipad-as-reader is something to marvel at.  Its liquid.

My favorite feature is the way you can hold the page as you turn it (and see the text on the reverse side):

> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385">[/youtube]
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Fri, 09 April 2010, 13:11:05
I'm no tree hugger, but even I can see there's a huge problem looming with the 'appliance' model of pumping out gadgets that become obsolete within months and aren't designed for continuous use (read: able to be repaired for less than it costs to replace.) We have this situation already with mobile phones, and it's spreading to, well just about everything we buy.
 
My generation (people 40+) has been constantly browbeaten for wasting the world's resources, but consumerism is rising exponentially. Young people don't need to worry about the world we leave behind for them. They are going to do an infinitely better job of ruining the planet than we ever could.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 15:20:22
Quote from: Rajagra;170953
I'm no tree hugger, but even I can see there's a huge problem looming with the 'appliance' model of pumping out gadgets that become obsolete within months


This is a good point... whatever trees are saved with ebooks, that benefit is  offset with more e-waste in the landfills. E-books are the future though, even with the pollution and censorship concerns and licensing battles. It'll all come to a head at some point with a rash of lawsuits probably.

Quote

Young people don't need to worry about the world we leave behind for them. They are going to do an infinitely better job of ruining the planet than we ever could.

i have a theory that the human species basically peaked between 1950 and 2000 in terms of quality of life. Its all downhill from here on so many levels.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 15:31:35
Quote from: ripster;170995
You guys are real downers.


hey, rejoice, you were one of the lucky few humans to have caught some part of that peak :)  Thats the way i see it...;) When I die on my deathbed i'll be like "good luck, suckas!!!" ;-D  haha.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 09 April 2010, 15:52:53
Quote from: ripster;170995
You guys are real downers.

I don't know about the US, but over here if you called someone a downer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Down's_Syndrome), you'd probably get a rather hard thump.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Mon, 12 April 2010, 11:20:04
The G-Pad?

> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385">
[/youtube]

article: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/12/google-tablet-pc-details_n_533860.html (http://"http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/12/google-tablet-pc-details_n_533860.html)

Also MS's upcoming courier looks neater and neater:

> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385">
[/youtube]
article: http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/05/microsofts-courier-digital-journal-exclusive-pictures-and-de/ (http://"http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/05/microsofts-courier-digital-journal-exclusive-pictures-and-de/)

The more competition, the merrier, i say.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Mon, 12 April 2010, 12:08:45
Quote from: ripster;171605

Of course this is all concept junk.  By the time it ships Apple will be onto Rev 3 of their product.


true, but by then i might be ready to buy something ;-)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Mon, 12 April 2010, 12:10:41
Quote from: wellington1869;171603
Also MS's upcoming courier looks neater and neater:

article: http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/05/microsofts-courier-digital-journal-exclusive-pictures-and-de/ (http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/05/microsofts-courier-digital-journal-exclusive-pictures-and-de/)

Yep. The Courier sure looks slick! Looks like Microsoft may have finally gotten all their internal politics sorted out and people stopped sabotaging other people's projects.

The only thing against the Courier that I started to realize as I pondered the entire iPad world is that the split screen could be a detriment. If the Courier is as solid as it looks in that demo, I'd be willing to bet that it'll end up being a one piece solid tablet within three product cycles. I think what's making the iPad so compelling is that it's basically formless. Whatever app is made for it can more or less become the device.

The form factor of the Courier locks it to a certain category of usage. While it's added portability will certainly be a plus to a lot of people, it also puts some constraints into what it'd be ideal for. The name and the form factor suggest it's primary function is to be the ultimate digital organizer, but I don't think the world of users who really want a better digital organizer is really that large and even more complicated is that it's hard to get people to adopt new ways of organizing themselves. If it's primary strength is something that requires some time for the adoption curve to swing in its favor, it'll be in for a rocky start.

Let the competition roll. It'll be interesting to see what everyone comes up with in response. It'll be interesting to see where the tablet industry is in three years when companies that either do not have the marketing reach, the halo, or the money of Apple may find it possible to enter the market after Apple and other big companies have proven (or failed to prove) that there is a new market to play for.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: wellington1869 on Mon, 12 April 2010, 16:08:16
yea it'll be interesting to see if the different form factor of the courier finds a sustainable audience/market.  

Other than the form factor, the other interesting thing is the focus on pen-based input rather than on-screen keyboard. Its focus seems to be as a kind of pocketable "universal clipper" (into the "infinite journal"). You get data into it (photos, voice, web, writing) and organize those clippings into folders. This makes it focus on being a creation/clipping tool, rather than a consuming/viewing tool which the ipad mainly is (as my ipad-owning-friend put it).

Of course those lines will blur as both add more features over time.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Thu, 15 April 2010, 16:27:15
Well, I finally got my hands on an iPad. There were no big surprises or revelations. It was neither a relgious moment nor a disappointment. It mostly confirmed for me what I thought about it already. As a device, it's a device. It's all about the apps and the form factor does indeed affect how you experience some of the apps.  

I found the size of the on screen keyboard a non issue. Some hay was made over that you couldn't quite fit your fingers over it in landscape mode. The typing experience is only a problem if you're trying to use it like a laptop, which I wouldn't expect to try. I was probably doing around 40wpm typing with a one handed method or 50wpm doing a two hand hunt and peck.

I think this will indeed harm the netbook market as many have thought. My netbook is my fun PC, but it's not in a very practical form factor for impulsive use. If I carry it around, I have to find some spot to sit down so I can check my email or compose a quick note on it. If I try to use it for serious work, I spend all day either waiting for it to catch up or all my time goes into scrolling through the tiny screen. Now that I've tried it, I'd much rather have one of these than a netbook.

There was one app on there that was particularly intriguing. It was "MLB At Bat" an app that's clearly meant while you're doing something else. Baseball junkies can use it to get stats and info on players while they're watching a game. Yes, you could easily do that on a laptop, but for psychological reasons, it just felt far less cumbersome to be doing this with a tablet than on a laptop. Even a small netbook feels like it's in the way.

The MLB At Bat app is the kind of cross-over app that makes me think the iPad/table hype is worth keeping an eye on. They're apps that aren't really just for people who want to consume content, but who want to consume content in a way that affects their experience of other things in real time. It's low tech augmented reality. Not as sexy as those apps that let you use a mobile phone to view your landscape with all sorts of special embedded messages overlaying a picture of what's in front of you, but with greater practical application.

Edit: I didn't buy one yet. I just waited out the long line at my favorite deli by dropping by the Apple store today. I still don't feel a strong personal desire to have one, but plan to follow through later this year on getting one as first hand research for work.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: zerocool on Mon, 19 April 2010, 10:01:59
if it lowers prices of netbooks then i wont cry over it, i need a new one and dont fancy the iPad, i am waiting for an iPhone (belated graduation present and waiting to see what happens with a possible new one).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: maclover on Sun, 25 April 2010, 14:24:10
You can hook up a regular usb keyboard (http://www.macrumors.com/2010/04/24/ipad-camera-connection-kit-notes-and-demo-video/) to the iPad if you get an Apple iPad Camera Connection Kit. So when can we expect a picture of the iPad being used with a real keyboard?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Sun, 25 April 2010, 17:56:48
Quote from: maclover;175875
You can hook up a regular usb keyboard (http://www.macrumors.com/2010/04/24/ipad-camera-connection-kit-notes-and-demo-video/) to the iPad if you get an Apple iPad Camera Connection Kit. So when can we expect a picture of the iPad being used with a real keyboard?


Yeah, hook up a model F AT to that sucker: you'll need a AT to PS/2 and PS/2 to USB adapter though.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Mon, 26 April 2010, 17:51:06
Quote from: wellington1869;171603
The G-Pad?


Complete with G Spot (http://fleshbot.com/5514751/the-ipad-gets-sexy-with-ryan-keely/gallery/) NSFW!!!!

The only 'tame' pic.

(http://cache.fleshbot.com/assets/images/2/2010/04/500x_img_5919.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 26 April 2010, 18:00:06
OMG, that is epic.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Mon, 26 April 2010, 22:35:11
I'm shocked. In fact...

Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Input Nirvana on Mon, 26 April 2010, 22:44:34
I really, really liked my 2 week iPad test cruise. Convenience, comfort, a nice "inbetween" iPhone and Mac Book Pro...but what I really should have used it for is THAT!
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Tue, 27 April 2010, 03:40:20
I just got to test an Ipad at a local Pestbuy and and well...

1) It was a tad smaller than I thought it would be and that's a good thing for portability.

2) Felt nice and sturdy and constructed well.

3)Was a bit heavier than I thought it would be. I expect one would get used to the weight but for some reason I kept thinking my had would get sore while my other hand was trying to type.

4)That glossy screen is just that, WAAAAAAY glossy. In the store I kept getting really distracting sharp reflections. Finger smudges and general oils from the hands make it look greasy than the pizza I just had...ewww, but YUM! =P
Outside of the glare the screen has a good vewing angle

5)I tried all three that were on display and they all downloaded web material pretty slowly. I thought it important to mention I have a really slow connection at home that I am comparing this with.

6)Geekhack looks nice on it, and I left each one at the store on Geekhack when I left.

7)It was pretty responsive only the slightest of delays with finger motions. It opened and closed things slightly slower than I expected. I don't know if there is an option to change its sensitivity but it seemed a bit too sensitive and would make mistakes a bit.

8)I went to youtube on it and it played the videos, which I found odd since I thought It couldn't use Flash. Was I wrong? The interface was a bit off for youtube but I don't know if anyone would care.

9)Still really wish it used a competent stylus.

10) Using the keybaord was a joke, although I really liked the ".com" button. Haahaa I thougth that was fantastic. I was not able to use both hands even when I set it down and I certianly couldn't touch type on it. But the thing I found the most odd about it was since I had to hunt and peck with one finger I never looked at what I was typing until I was done. and I really disliked that disconnect.

Over all I can see how some may really like it, I found It fun to use. I can even see how it could prove to be usefull for a bunch of different things. I could possibly use it for very light emailing (mostly just checking the emails) and quick web surfing. Perhaps even the occasional quick portfolio viewer. But I don't see one on my shopping list.

crap! I just noticed how long that was, sorry :S
I guess I quick summary from me is... meh, a good stepping stone to something better to come.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Tue, 27 April 2010, 03:51:05
Youtube supports HTML5, which is the thing that Apple is pushing to replace Flash.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Tue, 27 April 2010, 04:01:20
Quote from: ch_123;176506
Youtube supports HTML5, which is the thing that Apple is pushing to replace Flash.


Oh I see, thanks for clearing that up. From the way I hear HTML5 talked about I thought it was yet to become available. So me and my program neewbness is going to hide behind my chair now XD
haahaa
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Tue, 27 April 2010, 04:10:14
Quote from: clickclack;176509
Oh I see, thanks for clearing that up. From the way I hear HTML5 talked about I thought it was yet to become available. So me and my program neewbness is going to hide behind my chair now XD
haahaa


Well, you're sort of right. It's not finalized yet, but a lot of people are getting really impatient. Even if it were to be finalized tomorrow, you might still get the feeling that it hadn't arrived yet as HTML4 is so entrenched that a lot of designers won't update for a while.

Besides... IE won't ever disappoint in its ability to be a drag on progress.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Tue, 27 April 2010, 04:13:17
Quote from: clickclack;176509
Oh I see, thanks for clearing that up. From the way I hear HTML5 talked about I thought it was yet to become available. So me and my program neewbness is going to hide behind my chair now XD
haahaa


The last I checked youtube had it as an experimental feature. I was surprised by your post because I didn't know that youtube would handle the iPad transparently (or is it the other way around? hehe)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: clickclack on Tue, 27 April 2010, 04:24:22
Quote from: ch_123;176514
The last I checked youtube had it as an experimental feature. I was surprised by your post because I didn't know that youtube would handle the iPad transparently (or is it the other way around? hehe)


Interesting, I checked a bunch of different random videos and all worked as they always had.

The only reall different things to note revolved around the layout of youtube and that that vids would start playing in their thumbnail sizes while still in list format, so you had to enlarge them (unless your living room can fit into a thimble).

Oh, that reminds me I forgot to list another one of my observations-

11) since the speaker is inside when audio is played your hand feels the vibrations of the speakers. I must say I was not terribly fond of that, especially since the speaker is relatively weak when it's turned up the vibrations kinda got on my nerves. Headphones would counter that annoyance though if you felt inclined to use them.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ironcoder on Sun, 02 May 2010, 14:47:01
Quote from: didjamatic;169194
For now, it's just a device that is cool but we don't need because doesn't replace or outperform existing devices.  The iphone had/has the ability to replace your iPod, PDA, cell phone, home phone and take on many functions of your computer while being in your pocket.  The Ipad doesn't do this and won't fit in your pocket.  It has no proper input device, onscreen input is "lived with" on a phone but is not ideal and certainly no replacement for a keyboard and mouse.  But you say "you can use a keyboard with an ipad" but the moment you do that, it loses it's cool "pad-ness" and becomes a very wimpy competitor to a tablet or netbook... and with apple's refusal to let you add storage via memory card slot or install apps that YOU want, it's very big brother, very hyped and though cool is not what iSteve says it is.

It may open the door so iPad v.3 or v.5 or v.25 could do more of what they say it will, time will tell.

The iPhone doesn't really replace anything but an iPod. It's painful to use any touch device for anything you really need- to be prodctive you need a physical keyboard. It can't replace a PDA because it can't multitask (and OS 4.0 doesn't bring real multitasking). It can't replace a cellphone because it's a bad cellphone, it drops calls and has short battery life. It doesn't have a user-replaceable battery. It's too big for a phone (and has low resolution for its screen size) and too small to browse as well as a small tablet. It's locked to the App Store. It doesn't support Flash, so you're locked out of many e-commerce and other sites. It doesn't have memory card support, so you're tied to a PC.

It and the iPad are just fashion accessories for the technology-impaired. At the end of the day they're both just overpriced toys.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Sun, 02 May 2010, 15:07:19
Quote from: ironcoder;178197
The iPhone doesn't really replace anything but an iPod. It's painful to use any touch device for anything you really need- to be prodctive you need a physical keyboard. It can't replace a PDA because it can't multitask (and OS 4.0 doesn't bring real multitasking). It can't replace a cellphone because it's a bad cellphone, it drops calls and has short battery life. It doesn't have a user-replaceable battery. It's too big for a phone (and has low resolution for its screen size) and too small to browse as well as a small tablet. It's locked to the App Store. It doesn't support Flash, so you're locked out of many e-commerce and other sites. It doesn't have memory card support, so you're tied to a PC.

It and the iPad are just fashion accessories for the technology-impaired. At the end of the day they're both just overpriced toys.


I wouldn't use an iPhone or anything of the sort for real work, but a lot of people say they're good and like them (Apple did do something right to control so much of the market in that area). Although I guess the Commodore 64 will always remain as the best selling computer of all time.
Apple computers I must decline, they are impossible to work with and give me headaches. Poor quality too.

I agree; a keyboard can't really be replaced in terms of speed an functionality; nor can a mouse.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Sun, 02 May 2010, 21:26:11
"iPad uses Typing on an iPad" ??? Is that some kind of recursive procedure, or doesn't that keyboard have punctuation?

I preferred this video. Here's a Yank who gets irony. :smile:
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Sun, 02 May 2010, 21:29:40
RESPONSIVE?!?

I don't think that's even possible...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Sun, 02 May 2010, 21:35:57
If you could type 200 words per minute on the iPad, you'd still have to stop after 600 words or so, when your neck started hurting from looking down all the time.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Mon, 03 May 2010, 02:09:00
Quote
And the techies are right about another thing: the iPad is not a laptop. It’s not nearly as good for creating stuff. On the other hand, it’s infinitely more convenient for consuming it — books, music, video, photos, Web, e-mail and so on.

So it's good for limited tasks and looking pretty. That's reasonable. [strike]Women[/strike] Apple, know your limits!

Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ironcoder on Mon, 03 May 2010, 06:55:22
Quote from: ripster;178339
David Pogue.  NY Times review.  When the PC first came out you guys would still be holding onto your punch cards.


I still am, buddy. And that's "punched cards" as long as we're doing the "couldn't care less v. could care less" thing LOL
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: JBert on Mon, 03 May 2010, 14:33:46
Quote from: Rajagra;178334
I preferred this video. Here's a Yank who gets irony. :smile:
Well, there's irony and there's too much of it.

Watching the second part is worth it.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Thu, 13 May 2010, 06:19:12
My 64GB unit just shipped.   Should be here in a few days.   It's a HUGE success for many reasons imho.   Art, education, music, controlling other home/work PCs etc..   I soon hope to adapt the Ipad into an office greeting device for inputing personal information and having it transfer directly into my computer system.   And I'll be able to use my IPad to VNC into my other computers along the network.   Watch any of my 12 TBs worth of HD-DVD and Blu-ray movies from anywhere inside/outside of my house.  

So many Apps too.  That's the future...

Imagine a wall of IPads?  Or how about an IPad table top??  

I personally think this device is everything that a netbook, tablet, mobile handheld should have been.  

Add a phone  (built in capability already) and it's the ultimate Geektoy.

Yeah, it's expensive, but the price will drop.   And it can't be too expensive if it's selling out still.   I ordered mine and waited 2 weeks for it.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Thu, 13 May 2010, 13:48:46
Quote from: webwit;182035
It's a computing device. It can do stuff other devices can, but not as good and it's locked down. Get over it.


Do you have one?   My buddy from the Netherlands bought one in Vegas to bring home.  He loves it!!   It's great for wasting time  :)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Thu, 13 May 2010, 13:50:21
Quote from: skcheng;182044
It's great for wasting time  :)

That's what work is for.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Thu, 13 May 2010, 14:00:14
Idea: attempt to obtain iPad from Apple claiming it is an engineering sample for compatibility testing.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: didjamatic on Thu, 13 May 2010, 14:15:22
This (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAl28d6tbko#t=35s) will be skc when he's unable to play cargo bridge on his ipad.  :)

(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x240/pawnipt/CargoBridge-level16.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Thu, 13 May 2010, 15:11:12
Quote from: ripster;182059
Have the proper attitude when you enter the store.

> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344">[/youtube]

The store clerks will all start shouting.  ACKKKK! It's a UNIX BEARD!!!



That's pretty bad  ......
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Thu, 13 May 2010, 15:12:21
Quote from: didjamatic;182063
This (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAl28d6tbko#t=35s) will be skc when he's unable to play cargo bridge on his ipad.  :)

Show Image
(http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x240/pawnipt/CargoBridge-level16.jpg)



I like playing pinball on the IPad.   Try that on your laptop you non-Apple-fanboy losers!!
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Thu, 13 May 2010, 15:24:34
Quote from: skcheng;182079
I like playing pinball on the IPad.   Try that on your laptop you non-Apple-fanboy losers!!

You mean the one that comes standard with Windows?  Yeah, I play that on my laptop.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Thu, 13 May 2010, 16:22:42
I want to see a Model M go through the blender. I suspect the steel plate is more than they can deal with.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: didjamatic on Thu, 13 May 2010, 16:25:58
Quote from: skcheng;182079
I like playing pinball on the IPad.   Try that on your laptop you non-Apple-fanboy losers!!


LMAO!!!


Quote from: ricercar;182121
I want to see a Model M go through the blender. I suspect the steel plate is more than they can deal with.


Agreed.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: iMav on Sat, 15 May 2010, 22:00:57
Where's xsphat with his fancy new iPad?  :)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Sun, 16 May 2010, 01:03:35
Quote from: itlnstln;182090
You mean the one that comes standard with Windows?  Yeah, I play that on my laptop.

Actually, I have all three of those pinball tables (as how the whole game was released), they were created by cinematronics or what have you. My favourite is the dragon one, it has three pinball arms.

As for REAL pinball machines, probably the williams "funhouse" pinball would be the coolest:
(http://www.byrnerobotics.com/forum/uploads/DonaldMiller/2009-06-05_145244_funhouse_pf.jpg)
> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385">[/youtube]

Also, the "black knight" pinball table would be cool to play:
(http://www.shootagainpinball.com/pinball/images/Black%20Knight.JPG)
I remember seeing one of these beside an adam's family themed table, darn! If only I knew how good it was.

And my friend is getting an iPad. I'll be able to see how good it is. Maybe take some pictures of it with a bunch of IBM stuff just to annoy people. "ewww IBM is so ugly" <-- yeah whatever, IBM stuff looks way better than Apple.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Sun, 16 May 2010, 09:26:44
Quote from: ripster;182917
I still don't get why all the SW developers here aren't jumping on the bandwagon.

Money talks.

Hauppauge shares up 60% after announcing iPad app to stream TV signals directly to iPad. (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE64D4X820100514)


I think there are PLENTY of people developing Apps for Apple.   I've lost track of how much I've paid so that my son can have everything he wants on his ITouch.  

Here he is on our recent trip to Vegas.   I wonder if he was stealing some glances over to his right  :))

(http://fototime.com/0983BC47EB96FF1/standard.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Sun, 16 May 2010, 09:34:07
You need to take that iPod Touch away from him so he can focus on the world around him.  He is missing out on some nature to his right.






Unless that's his sister or something.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 16 May 2010, 10:14:22
Quote from: kishy;182056
Idea: attempt to obtain iPad from Apple claiming it is an engineering sample for compatibility testing.


Just get an Apple employee drunk and wait till he drops his. Same effect.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: skcheng on Sun, 16 May 2010, 10:21:27
Quote from: ripster;182933
Gotta see Hangover!  Don't let your son see it though.  I let my 15 year old get through it but stopped it before the ending credits.
Show Image
(http://brewblog.ca/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/the_hangover.jpg)



I saw the Hangover.  Twice actually.   And I let my son watch everything other than the credits.  He does a great impersonation of Mr. Chow.  

This was classic:

> type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385">[/youtube]

It was another waste of the talents of Heather Graham.  But I'm not complaining.....
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Sun, 16 May 2010, 22:55:15
Quote from: skcheng;182925
I wonder if he was stealing some glances over to his right  :))

He was. The angle of incidence is the angle of reflection.

(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=10041&stc=1&d=1274068472) :faint:
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Mon, 17 May 2010, 00:18:24
Quote from: skcheng;182925
I think there are PLENTY of people developing Apps for Apple.   I've lost track of how much I've paid so that my son can have everything he wants on his ITouch.  


Apple apps... blah! who needs those when you have a stash of IBM keyboards.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Mon, 17 May 2010, 12:35:19
iTouch is a logitech keyboard trademark. iPod Touch is an Apple trademark for the device in that boy's hand.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Mon, 17 May 2010, 12:41:13
Quick, everyone register trademarks for every word in the English language with an i added to the beginning.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Mon, 17 May 2010, 13:20:30
ItlnStln.  Done.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Wed, 19 May 2010, 23:00:11
Quote from: webwit;183057
Now you're talking. Also, if he had some IBM keyboards with him instead of the iTouch, he would have made a real impression.


Ahhh, so that's how you impress the girls webwit, you show off your M15s. Got it!

Webwit's dating tip #285: always carry M15s to impress someone.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Thu, 20 May 2010, 04:02:57
Quote from: EverythingIBM;184509
dating tip #285: always carry M15s to impress someone.

I'd be impressed.

(http://www.sportscarcup.com/cars/noble-m15.jpg)

(http://rhapsodyinbooks.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/m15_hstheritage.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Wed, 26 May 2010, 15:09:42
Apple the behemoth (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/27/technology/27apple.html?partner=rss&emc=rss)

Off that fence, mortal!
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Wed, 26 May 2010, 15:47:52
Completely unconnected story linked on that page:
"String of Suicides Continues at Electronics Supplier in China. Foxconn, which produces electronics and computer components for Apple... (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/26/technology/26suicide.html?src=me&ref=technology)"
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Wed, 26 May 2010, 16:07:14
It's not like Foxconn was the place where the first iPhone leak occurred (http://gizmodo.com/5319275/report-iphone-leak-interrogations-drive-foxconn-employee-to-suicide). Nope.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Wed, 26 May 2010, 16:31:47
Unless they're coming out with an iPad server and iPad workstation, I think Intel is quite safe for the foreseeable future.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: elbowglue on Fri, 28 May 2010, 21:17:51
The iPhone will use bing.com as it's default search engine. (http://news.cnet.com/8301-31021_3-20006354-260.html)

This is awesome, everyone knows bing.com pwns google.com in search.  In fact I never use google.com unless I want to get relevant search results without hassle or crap.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Tue, 01 June 2010, 21:05:34
HaaTa, you've left Japan a little too soon. You missed the show.

Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Wed, 02 June 2010, 15:14:39
Well this is interesting... apparently the iPad got its start before the iPhone did (http://www.macrumors.com/2010/06/01/steve-jobs-in-opening-interview-session-at-d8-conference/) which means that all those times Steve Jobs was telling people that there's no future for the tablet computer, they were either working on one or had plans to resume working on one.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Wed, 02 June 2010, 16:11:25
Quote from: hyperlinked;188950
Well this is interesting... apparently the iPad got its start before the iPhone did (http://www.macrumors.com/2010/06/01/steve-jobs-in-opening-interview-session-at-d8-conference/)


From that link:
"On AT&T's network: "iPhone is the first phone where we separated the carrier from the hardware. They worry about the network, while we worry about the phone."

So let me get this right. They tie the iPhone to a single carrier - AT&T - and they call that separation. Riiiiiight...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: vyshane on Wed, 02 June 2010, 22:16:34
Quote from: Rajagra;188959
From that link:
"On AT&T's network: "iPhone is the first phone where we separated the carrier from the hardware. They worry about the network, while we worry about the phone."

So let me get this right. They tie the iPhone to a single carrier - AT&T - and they call that separation. Riiiiiight...


Sucks to be in the US ;)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Thu, 03 June 2010, 10:14:36
Quote from: ripster;189189
AT&T announces the end of unlimited data because people actually used it. (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6513H120100602)

Fixed. Beat me to that story by seconds. :smile:

Seems AT&T define unlimited the same way Apple defines separation.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 04 June 2010, 05:26:32
Quote from: Rajagra;189190
Seems AT&T define unlimited the same way Apple defines separation.


They're actually continuing to honor the unlimited data plans for people who are already on them, but the plan is being discontinued for any new customers. I'm all for it. I'm not an AT&T customer, but if I were, I really don't care to be subsidizing the overuse of some clueless guy who can't figure out that maybe it's better for everyone if he could download his movies over WiFi. Besides that, it's just plain wasteful to encourage people to use a more resource intensive medium when a much more efficient one is readily available most of the time.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Fri, 04 June 2010, 05:32:59
I've never understood why they make this out to be a problem. All they have to do is give priority to users who are using the least bandwidth at that moment. Problem solved, while allowing optimum use of the existing infrastructure.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 04 June 2010, 16:34:48
Quote from: Rajagra;189493
I've never understood why they make this out to be a problem. All they have to do is give priority to users who are using the least bandwidth at that moment. Problem solved, while allowing optimum use of the existing infrastructure.

I'm no superfly network engineer, but from my experiences in the Web hosting world and all the not so effective technologies that are supposed to give you a guaranteed share of CPU and bandwidth, I think this is a lot harder to pull off in practice than it sounds. Besides that, offsetting the high bandwidth users may not necessarily decrease network congestion as it just means that those guys will continue making requests for a response over the network.

I can't profess to really know what I'm talking about here, but it just seems that while these smart usage schemes are useful under standard usage patterns, they don't stand up against abuse quite so well as the bottleneck moves somewhere else.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Sat, 05 June 2010, 06:20:23
Quote from: webwit;189873
Steve Ballmer (http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-20006832-64.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20) being right for once?


Quote
Nothing that people do on a PC today is going to get less relevant tomorrow.


Key point there. People are going to carry on doing the same things, just in different ways. For example people used to use word processors to prepare letters which were posted. Now they compose emails and send them over the Internet. How we do things is changing, and the rate of change is always accelerating.

Now what kind of equipment is best able to cater to those changing needs? A general purpose computer that can be freely modified in both hardware and software? Or a closed 'consumer device'?

iPad lovers will argue that new apps will be downloadable. That only goes some way to compensate for the limitations of the concept. The bottom line is you are buying a throwaway* product and throwaway software. If that serves your purpose, that's great. But don't use "There's an app for that" as a trite excuse for the designed-in limitations.

(*) Throwaway in the sense of being designed for specific types of use, and useless once your needs go beyond that.

I'm reminded of the Fight Club quote about single-serving friends. The iPad is your single-serving gadget.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sat, 05 June 2010, 09:34:19
Quote from: webwit;189873
Does anyone remember when Apple was dying end of last millennium, and MS saved them?


Wasn't this because they didn't have Steve Jobs and his Reality Distortion Field generator?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: chimera15 on Mon, 07 June 2010, 00:32:34
THe ipad's a giant iphone/ipod, which I already own. I don't get it. I don't see using any the apps I have on my ipod in a bigger format.  The only reason I tolerate the os/crappy programs on the ipod is it's tiny thin format.  I'll wait for oqo or someone to come up with a super flat tablet pc that runs full windows, that isn't limited by not having flash, and having a crappy capacitive touchscreen.  It shouldn't be that hard, there are already slates that are almost there.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: vyshane on Mon, 07 June 2010, 00:51:19
Quote from: chimera15;190444
THe ipad's a giant iphone/ipod, which I already own. I don't get it. I don't see using any the apps I have on my ipod in a bigger format.  The only reason I tolerate the os/crappy programs on the ipod is it's tiny thin format.  I'll wait for oqo or someone to come up with a super flat tablet pc that runs full windows, that isn't limited by not having flash, and having a crappy capacitive touchscreen.  It shouldn't be that hard, there are already slates that are almost there.


Different form factors make different things possible. My PC is just a bigger version of my laptop. I still rather use the PC for some things.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: chimera15 on Mon, 07 June 2010, 00:56:10
This looks like it's far more useful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOQNTySZhZU&playnext_from=TL&videos=f6kyWH-crjk&feature=sub

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jwzdy6ETEmU&feature=player_embedded (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jwzdy6ETEmU&feature=player_embedded)

If I want to use something with a larger form factor, I'll use one of my tabletpcs which are the same size, and actually run useful non handicapped programs.

The only difference between my hp tx2500z, and the ipad is that the hp is thicker, less heat efficient, and has a shorter single batter life in every functional way, it's 1000 times better.  It also cost about the same.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Mon, 07 June 2010, 01:41:22
Quote from: chimera15;190462
The only difference between my hp tx2500z, and the ipad is that the hp is thicker, less heat efficient, and has a shorter single batter life in every functional way, it's 1000 times better.  It also cost about the same.

You already have a great setup that works for you and its shortcomings are more tolerable to you than the iPad and similar devices' shortcomings.  Perfect. iPad and similar devices suck... for you. Nothing wrong with that.

We really don't need to go through this pointless exercise of identifying why it's ridiculous to have anything besides a full fledged laptop style tablet running a full OS. That horse is as dead as a horse on the moon.

Now whether Ballmer's prediction is correct? It'll be wait and see won't it? Conventional strategy is always about repeating what worked last time which is the MS and Google approach. Steve Jobs seems to think that what didn't work last time around will work this time around. That sounds equally dubious, but the value proposition of a controlled platform may have more appeal than it used to. So much of what the average non-geek wants is Web based anyway and apps are more readily available for all significant platforms than was the case twenty years ago when the consumer software industry was merely getting started.

The world has changed. We just don't know how much. I personally think Ballmer has as much of a chance of being right as Steve Jobs does, but I don't give his view more weight simply because it was the last winning strategy used.

Don't hand out crowns to Android just yet because it had a few very good cycles. They're still a feel good story and haven't yet been subjected to the treatment reserved for front runners. The lead Apple has in Apps? It's huge, but I wouldn't overvalue that either. For the same reason why a closed system might not be such a bad idea this time around makes the lead in application count less relevant than it did 20 years ago.

Chill out, buy what works for you, and enjoy the race. Apple won't destroy the software industry nor own the world. Neither will Microsoft. Google just might own far more of the world than anyone is comfortable with, which would then really pose a problem to their core value because they wouldn't be Google if people everywhere started treating them like they're indeed very evil and go through pains to withhold personal data from them. Their future is not a foregone conclusion either. They make a lot of money, but they spend a lot of money too.

Yahoo has been that way before and Yahoo started spending money left and right on all sorts of things it wasn't known for and then they were hit really hard by AdSense and a drop in display advertising.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: vyshane on Mon, 07 June 2010, 07:03:34
I'll put it this way. I reach for my iPad the way I reach for the keys to my two seater convertible. With anticipation that it will be a fun experience.

Do I need a sports car? It's not very practical. It can't seat five adults like my other car. Boot space is laughable. It gets less MPG. But if I have to go somewhere, and either car would do the job, guess which key I reach for. The iPad is fun to use. It is not always about what a device can do. How it does it matters too.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Tue, 08 June 2010, 23:17:40
Quote from: vyshane;190510
It is not always about what a device can do. How it does it matters too.

Bingo. This is how Steve Jobs makes money. This is why the common Windows user will never understand the advantages of the MacOS, and it's the same reason Porsche succeeds in a world with the Miata and MR2. It's why rubber domes outsell mechanicals, despite few people returning to domes after trying a mechanical: Once you test drive "better," you find it hard to go back to acceptable. And people who are satisfied by acceptable are fearful of admitting to Better, because it invalidates accepting the acceptable.

"But I can do all that on my Miata/Logitech/Windows machine, why should I pay more for a Boxster/Filco/MacOS?"

"I can surf the net without Flash on my $10 Windows CE tablet. I can do all that. Why buy an iPad?"

Because it's better.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Tue, 08 June 2010, 23:43:06
According to what you've said ricercar, where do the people who have used and recognize the superiority of the Boxster but prefer the Miata fit in?

What if the Miata driver prefers his car because Mazda is a Ford subsidiary (something totally irrelevant to the product itself)?

What if, putting this more into iPad-class stuff, we're talking about a Chevy Chevette vs. a Ford Tempo? Sure, the Chevette has all that "world car" stuff going for it, but due to some failure on the part of the designers my winter boots happen to press both brake and accelerator pedals simultaneously whereas the same problem doesn't exist in the Tempo because the designers didn't put tiny pedals immediately beside each other?

(http://thevinylvillage.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/82chevette.jpg)
A pretty Chevy Chevette is still a Chevy Chevette...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Wed, 09 June 2010, 00:19:18
Quote from: ricercar;191167
Bingo. This is how Steve Jobs makes money. This is why the common Windows user will never understand the advantages of the MacOS, and it's the same reason Porsche succeeds in a world with the Miata and MR2. It's why rubber domes outsell mechanicals, despite few people returning to domes after trying a mechanical: Once you test drive "better," you find it hard to go back to acceptable. And people who are satisfied by acceptable are fearful of admitting to Better, because it invalidates accepting the acceptable.

"But I can do all that on my Miata/Logitech/Windows machine, why should I pay more for a Boxster/Filco/MacOS?"

"I can surf the net without Flash on my $10 Windows CE tablet. I can do all that. Why buy an iPad?"

Because it's better.

The iPad's touch screen keyboard is actually better than you'd think. Some may think I'm crazy when I say this, but it wasn't all that bad. I'd use it over a mushy rubber dome any day (you can type fairly fast too).

Sorry but I think windows is better than OSX. Windows is way more versatile and backwards compatible (which is why it's more bloated). If microsoft completely redesigned windows from scratch like Apple did for OSX, then obviously it would be faster. I guess some people don't realize that.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: vyshane on Wed, 09 June 2010, 04:05:08
Quote from: kishy;191173
According to what you've said ricercar, where do the people who have used and recognize the superiority of the Boxster but prefer the Miata fit in?

What if the Miata driver prefers his car because Mazda is a Ford subsidiary (something totally irrelevant to the product itself)?

What if, putting this more into iPad-class stuff, we're talking about a Chevy Chevette vs. a Ford Tempo? Sure, the Chevette has all that "world car" stuff going for it, but due to some failure on the part of the designers my winter boots happen to press both brake and accelerator pedals simultaneously whereas the same problem doesn't exist in the Tempo because the designers didn't put tiny pedals immediately beside each other?

A pretty Chevy Chevette is still a Chevy Chevette...

I was afraid that we'd get bogged down arguing about the analogies. I'm guilty of starting this, and I appologise. The point that I was trying to make is this:

Any given object has many different attributes. Some of these can easily be listed, quantified and compared. As geeks, we like to compare Processor speeds, amount of RAM, etc. We love our feature lists. But objects also have other qualities that are less quantifiable. How the product feels in your hand, how the interface reacts to your actions, etc. These hard to quantify qualities can have a huge impact on our enjoyment of a product. And some people do in fact place a high value on these qualities. Just ask those mechanical keyboard geeks. They think that "tactility" is more important than real, listable features such as backlighting, media buttons, and built in LCD.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Wed, 09 June 2010, 04:06:45
Quote from: EverythingIBM;191180
If microsoft completely redesigned windows from scratch like Apple did for OSX, then obviously it would be faster. I guess some people don't realize that.


That's largely self evident. Backwards compatibility and trying to keep a familiar interface design is what holds Windows back... the underlying Window NT design is relatively decent.

Versatile? Not really. Mac OS X has a lot of useful stuff (particularly in regards to the command line) that Windows either hides from the user, implements very badly, or does not implement at all. Windows 7 is a good OS if you're doing basic stuff, or only using applications that only work on Windows, but for any sort of technical or development stuff, it fails pretty hard compared with Unix systems.

Quote
Bingo. This is how Steve Jobs makes money. This is why the common Windows user will never understand the advantages of the MacOS, and it's the same reason Porsche succeeds in a world with the Miata and MR2. It's why rubber domes outsell mechanicals, despite few people returning to domes after trying a mechanical: Once you test drive "better," you find it hard to go back to acceptable. And people who are satisfied by acceptable are fearful of admitting to Better, because it invalidates accepting the acceptable.


I used to be a regular hurf-durfer in regards to Mac OS X, but now that I've had time to make proper use of the latest version I'm quite impressed by it... so much so that I intend to triple boot it on my Thinkpad =]
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Wed, 16 June 2010, 20:22:44
Quote from: ripster;193831
Miley has one.  Ya GOTTA get one now.


Great photo. Lightweight excuse for a coffee. Lightweight excuse for an actress. Lightweight excuse for a computer. A prime example of the vapid nature of modern society. I wonder how much she got paid for that advertising?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Wed, 16 June 2010, 20:24:59
She's a zealot; they do it for free.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Wed, 16 June 2010, 20:28:01
I was going to say attention seeking ****. But it would be rude to talk about ripster that way! :drum:
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Wed, 16 June 2010, 22:48:40
Go AAPL! Go AAPL!
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Thu, 17 June 2010, 10:41:30
Quote from: ripster;193990

For photo/video backup on the road I decided the iPad is not ready for primetime. (http://www.bythom.com/2010%20Nikon%20News.htm)

I think for stuff this heavy duty it'll be more practical to be going with a full featured laptop for the forseeable future. I'm sure tablets will be able to do it not too long from now, but it probably wouldn't be very practical to expect it as a primary function.

My Atom based ASUS Netbook is leaving me a little grumpy these days. It's light, it's easy on the hands as far as the keyboard goes, but it doesn't do anything else well. It sucks power, overheats, and takes forever to do anything.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Thu, 17 June 2010, 10:43:20
...who the hell lets a broken power connector decide when the device life is over?

Send the thing to me, I'll have it working in 3 1/2 minutes :)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Fri, 18 June 2010, 05:38:26
Quote from: Apple
Yesterday Apple and its carrier partners took pre-orders for more than 600,000 of Apple’s new iPhone 4. It was the largest number of pre-orders Apple has ever taken in a single day and was far higher than we anticipated ...


Wow. This is fantastic news for Android! webwit says Android outsells the iPhone.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Sat, 19 June 2010, 10:55:19
I haven't seen sales figures but Android runs on a whole bunch of different products...it's possible that collectively all Android-running products outsell iPhones.

And so they should, it's a platform that can actually do stuff...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: vyshane on Sun, 20 June 2010, 03:58:10
Quote from: kishy;194681
I haven't seen sales figures but Android runs on a whole bunch of different products...it's possible that collectively all Android-running products outsell iPhones.

And so they should, it's a platform that can actually do stuff...


The iPhone market share is currently around 3 times bigger than Android. And that's not counting other iOS devices like the iPod Touch and the iPad.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Sun, 20 June 2010, 05:49:27
Quote from: kishy;194681
And so they should, it's a platform that can actually do stuff...


I've heard otherwise from people who've actually tried to develop proper stuff for it.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Mon, 21 June 2010, 21:09:56
Quote from: kishy;194681

And so they should, it's a platform that can actually do stuff...


Nonsense! What about BROWSING THE WEB [strike]on youtube [/strike], playing GAMES [strike]that suck and aren't even worth the $5[/strike], or doing SOCIAL THINGS like phoning, texting, or posting junk on facebook [strike] which is a serious waste of time [/strike].
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: muchadoaboutnothing on Tue, 22 June 2010, 10:19:39
Apple did a good job of leveraging iOS to get a serious first mover's advantage, then locking down the terms so devs have to put a significant investment in and are limited in how well they can port apps to other platforms.

If accepted competitors that function well come out, Apple's restrictive policies may come back to bite them in the rear. On the other hand, it could pay off in spades as people become very invested in iOS apps which raises the cost of switching (not only do you have to learn something new but you have to buy it).

I'll wait. For now I'm getting a Wi-Fi only nook. I can wait for the "do everything" content consumption devices to have more space, better battery life, etc. for cheaper.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Tue, 22 June 2010, 14:10:08
Quote from: EverythingIBM;195338
Nonsense! What about BROWSING THE WEB [strike]on youtube [/strike], playing GAMES [strike]that suck and aren't even worth the $5[/strike], or doing SOCIAL THINGS like phoning, texting, or posting junk on facebook [strike] which is a serious waste of time [/strike].


Things could be worse. You could spend your days on a keyboard forum demonstrating your own stupidity at every step.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 22 June 2010, 14:16:43
Quote from: EverythingIBM;195338
or doing SOCIAL THINGS like phoning, texting, or posting junk on facebook [strike] which is a serious waste of time [/strike].


'Cause actually having friends might suck.  It's good that you haven't seemed to make many here.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Tue, 22 June 2010, 14:20:05
Nonsense, this is a serious playah we're dealing with. (http://geekhack.org/showpost.php?p=194574&postcount=46)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: didjamatic on Tue, 22 June 2010, 14:27:23
Quote from: EverythingIBM;194574
Physical activities aren't nearly as fun as computer games.


You're doin it wrong.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 22 June 2010, 14:30:42
Ha!  I need to change my nick right now.  There's no way I can compete with that.  Next time a hot, young woman asks me for a drink, I'll know to just kick the ***** in the shins and toss her the pretzel bowl.  That's how you get the ladies.

Women are great; I like women. Computers, not nearly as much.  That's why I don't hang around here on the weekends.  Being nice to women is a good idea, too.  It's not just for getting laid (although, it doesn't hurt).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 22 June 2010, 14:31:34
Quote from: didjamatic;195518
You're doin it wrong.


He's not doing it all, apparently.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Tue, 22 June 2010, 14:37:35
Quote from: itlnstln;195519
Ha!  I need to change my nick right now.  There's no way I can compete with that.  Next time a hot, young woman asks me for a drink, I'll know to just kick the ***** in the shins and toss her the pretzel bowl.  That's how you get the ladies.


Let me guess, 'High standards' =P
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: vyshane on Tue, 22 June 2010, 21:58:56
I just watched a demo of a pre-alpha version of Meego (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqeeQd-YNL0). It's looking pretty slick, but I see lots of usability problems and poor UI decisions.

I will have to try this at some point.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: gr1m on Fri, 25 June 2010, 01:34:29
You never know, Intel has enough money to pull virtually anything off. Except Larrabee for some reason.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 25 June 2010, 10:44:13
I wonder why it's taking so long for there to be an iMac Touch... Perhaps there are technical and/or cost issues with large touchscreens? Then again, everyone and their mother is making touchscreen PCs, even Dell is offering them.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 25 June 2010, 12:20:05
Is that not an iPad?  I mean, I guess it wouldn't have as much functionality, but I don't think I would want to do "real" computing with a touchscreen.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 25 June 2010, 12:25:28
It would make a useful complement to the keyboard and mouse... I've tried out some touchscreen computers and they are pretty nifty for lightweight tasks.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 25 June 2010, 13:17:19
Quote from: ch_123;196278
Perhaps there are technical and/or cost issues with large touchscreens?

This article that was published the other day in CNET talks about this very topic you brought up:
How Microsoft foresaw--and still missed--the iPad (http://news.cnet.com/8301-13860_3-20008369-56.html)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 25 June 2010, 13:23:21
That's the thing about Apple - it's not that they came up with the idea, or make the best implementation, it's that they know how to make it sell...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: kishy on Fri, 25 June 2010, 16:46:25
Quote from: ripster;196343
Also their touch screen implementation beats all the Androids.


Having played with both an iPod Touch and an HTC Dream, I disagree quite a bit.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: hyperlinked on Fri, 25 June 2010, 16:50:52
I still mourn for losing the simplicity of the BlackBerry click wheel.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Fri, 25 June 2010, 16:51:53
While not Android, Palm's WebOS has Apple beat, too.  That might be why Apple hired one of their designers.  Then again, the guy who headed up WebOS was from Apple.  It's a shame that Palm's hardware sucked; the OS is awesome.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Fri, 25 June 2010, 17:42:37
Quote from: itlnstln;196391
Palm's WebOS has Apple beat, too.  That might be why Apple hired one of their designers.  Then again, the guy who headed up WebOS was from Apple.


Programmer inbreeding. You know it's going to end up ugly.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ricercar on Fri, 25 June 2010, 17:43:17
Xerox -> Apple -> BeOS -> WebOS
Xerox -> Apple -> NeXT -> Apple

What goes around comes around. Or something like that.

A click wheel really helps any OS. I loved a click wheel on Windows Mobile.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: microsoft windows on Fri, 25 June 2010, 19:35:07
Quote from: ripster;195617
Intel doing software?

I trust Apple to do a better job.
Show Image
(http://labs.pcw.co.uk/photos/uncategorized/viiv.jpg)


But Intel made much better processors than Crapple. Compare a Pentium III with a G3 and Crapple's just beat into the dirt.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 25 June 2010, 19:39:59
Quote from: microsoft windows;196485
But Intel made much better processors than Crapple. Compare a Pentium III with a G3 and Crapple's just beat into the dirt.


G3

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b8/DCB_Shooting_G3_pictures.jpg)

?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: EverythingIBM on Fri, 25 June 2010, 19:43:32
Quote from: microsoft windows;196485
But Intel made much better processors than Crapple. Compare a Pentium III with a G3 and Crapple's just beat into the dirt.


IBM made the POWER chips. They're OK, but, most programs are just made to be ran on intel chips. And the ones used in macs were highly crippled and stunted; jobs can't let his consumers buy something good! Has to be cheapened and crippled.

But most companies do that, intel would cripple some of their high-end CPUs, and sell them for less (when they manufactured them as high-end ones).
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 25 June 2010, 19:48:23
The real POWER chips were designed for use in high end servers. PowerPC was dumbed in comparison,  but that's like saying Intel Core chips are dumbed down Xeons...
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: microsoft windows on Fri, 25 June 2010, 19:50:00
PowerPC's were garbage compared to anything. I'd take my old Pentium machine over a Crapple.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: ch_123 on Fri, 25 June 2010, 19:56:31
(http://www.omgwtfimages.com/uploads/thumb/thumb_185.jpg)
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 June 2010, 06:51:25
I was really thinking about leaving Sprint and getting an iPhone.  Now that they don't have unlimited data and with Sprint I basically get unlimited calling, I think I'll be staying.  I'm getting the HTC Evo 4G on Thursday.  I can't wait.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: zerocool on Tue, 29 June 2010, 08:40:40
i really annoyed about no-more unlimited data.
but i like how the multitasking is on the new iPhone
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 June 2010, 08:44:59
My GF got all excited about multitasking coming to the iPhone.  Then I told her how I have had for it for a year now on my Pre.  At least Apple has it, finally.  It was the one thing that made the iPhone a no-go in my book.  I need to be able to listen to Pandora and do other **** at the same time.  It pissed my GF off that she couldn't do that on her iPhone.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 June 2010, 08:54:05
At least I can hold it anyway I want and still make a phone call.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 June 2010, 08:58:31
What a boob.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Rajagra on Tue, 29 June 2010, 10:43:34
Quote from: ripster;197526
There's an easy fix for that.
Show Image
(http://artflutter.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/handsfree3.jpg)

She's chattering while enjoying oneness with cup rubber!

Quote from: itlnstln;197518
My GF got all excited about multitasking coming to the iPhone.

Multitasking? Like making calls and holding it at the same time? :evil:
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 June 2010, 11:04:48
Quote from: Rajagra;197572
Multitasking? Like making calls and holding it at the same time? :evil:


It looks like they took a step backwards on this one with the 4G.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 June 2010, 11:26:43
Actually, you have it backwards.  Most righties hold their phones in their left hands, so they can write, eat, rub one out, whatever.  Thus, only lefties hold their phones in their right hands, so it's am evil plot from the devil himself.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: itlnstln on Tue, 29 June 2010, 11:32:02
Wow.  There's a cause and a club for everything.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: TexasFlood on Tue, 29 June 2010, 11:53:57
Quote from: ripster;197592
As I always tell Welly, "The Customer Is NOT Always Right".

Sure they are, but there is usually opportunity to make them more right.  Guess it depends on how much your job requires you to pucker up.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mazora on Wed, 20 July 2011, 09:06:40
I love my iPad, the GoodReader app just had a nice update and now it ROCKS.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: keyboardlover on Wed, 10 August 2011, 06:13:15
No one cares about your stock portfolio. You're already rich.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: sordna on Sat, 13 August 2011, 02:14:05
The iPad is nice but iSSH sucks. The connection freezes, or it suddenly darkens and needs a total restart to fix, or it goes crazy if you tip the iPad / change orientation. Is there any decent ssh / terminal app out there ?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: vyshane on Sun, 14 August 2011, 19:50:28
Quote from: sordna;398077
The iPad is nice but iSSH sucks. The connection freezes, or it suddenly darkens and needs a total restart to fix, or it goes crazy if you tip the iPad / change orientation. Is there any decent ssh / terminal app out there ?

Maybe give Prompt (http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/prompt/id421507115?mt=8) a whirl?
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: microsoft windows on Thu, 18 August 2011, 10:03:43
I'd rather use my more powerful 10-year-old computer with a bigger display and superior input technology than an Ipad.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Mazora on Thu, 18 August 2011, 15:39:38
portability
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: microsoft windows on Sat, 20 August 2011, 07:20:27
Who gives a darn about Windows 8? It'll be the next Vista. In 10 years, everybody will still be using Windows 7 just like they use XP today.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: sordna on Sat, 20 August 2011, 10:50:02
I use Linux, but as far as Microsoft OS's are concerned, I liked Windows 2000 the best. Solid, and not so many annoying popups from the OS.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: keyboardlover on Sat, 20 August 2011, 10:56:28
Windows 7 is pretty rock solid IMHO.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Barn on Tue, 24 January 2012, 20:33:25
Quote from: ripster;498063
$13B in PROFITS this Quarter.

I'd say the OP was right.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203806504577181193691941660.html

My AAPL thanks all of you that bought iPads for Xmas.


AAPL is the way to go.
Title: I'm Coming Off the Fence. The iPad Will Be Huge
Post by: Wildcard on Tue, 24 January 2012, 21:29:45
Quote from: vyshane;398967
Maybe give Prompt (http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/prompt/id421507115?mt=8) a whirl?


second that, I use PROMPT all the the time.

works great for me