geekhack

geekhack Community => Reviews => Topic started by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 12 February 2013, 20:19:20

Title: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 12 February 2013, 20:19:20
One fine day I was surfing the free stuff thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=34585.0) and Mr. Sifo was giving out some o-rings and dampeners. And I was lucky enough to score them! Thank you Sifo!! I thought Iíd write a review on my thoughts of these bad boys now that Iíve finally gotten them.
 
The o-rings are from the WASDKeyboards sampler pack. I have the black rubber (50A-R), red rubber (40A-L), and pink rubber (40A-R) (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/cherry-mx-rubber-switch-dampeners.html). The pink thick rubber o-rings are the same as the blue o-rings from WASDKeyboards. The dampeners or soft-landing pads are the same ones found on EliteKeyboards (http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=access,slpads). The black ones are soft and the grey ones are hard.

As pointed out in the comments, I initially used SP caps which donít have the cross-bracing. I then installed my o-rings and dampeners into my Leopold FC700R with stock caps to retest them and give my new thoughts.  However, I didnít want  to lose my first impressions just in case anyone was curious. Those thoughts will be bumped to the end.

TABLE OF CONTENTS
1) Old Article (#post_Old)
2) New Article (#post_New)
3) Videos (#post_VOD)


New Article (ToC) (#post_TOC)

(http://i.imgur.com/vTT4O2E.png)
The newly sorted o-rings and dampeners from left to right: Red rubber 40A-L, pink rubber 40A-R (marked with black dots), black rubber 50A-R, black soft-landing pads (hard), and grey rubber soft-landing pads (soft).

For some keyboard science, 50A means a material hardness of 50 on the Shore durometer A scale. R is the size. According to the WASD site, R reduces key actuation travel by 0.4mm and L reduces by 0.2mm; this means thats how thick these rings are. However, I measured the o-ring and dampener in regards to this question (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=38945.msg820191#msg820191) and realized that R = 0.4 cm = 4 mm and L = 0.2 cm = 2 mm. The soft-landing pads measure in at 1 mm  or 0.1 cm.



(http://i.imgur.com/Jz6GUX2.jpg)
I then installed them into the following keys:
And yes, rkinze and Leslieann were right. The cross-bracing in the Leo caps make the o-rings and dampeners feel way different.

40A-L Red O-Rings
These still feel really nice. Thereís now less cushion-y-ness but still feel squishy. The travel reduction really feels different now. These o-rings now really feel like they stop actuation sooner. It seems like they stop the travel right after the click. I still really like these.

40A-R Pink O-Rings
These are the same as the blue o-rings sold at WASDKeyboards. They really stop actuation quickly; it feels like they stop at the click - almost mid click. They feel the same as the red o-rings when you bottom out. They feel nice but I really dislike how much actuation is cutoff.

50A-R Black O-Rings
These donít hit as hard as they do when theyíre installed on the SP caps. But they still feel really hard when you bottom out. The bottom out doesnít feel like hitting the board but itís still hard. And again, the travel stops right at the click. My least favorite.

Black Dampeners
This time I feel the dampeners way more. They definitely reduce a travel a bit; seems like a little less than the red o-rings but it definitely stops travel. These are cushiony and squishy. Definitely way softer than the red o-rings. I really like these.

Grey Dampeners
These are the harder version of the greys. A smidge less of travel distance but the bottom out still feels hard, almost like the black o-rings. They feel like they stop actuation very close to the bottom. But I kinda like them. They still have a touch of give which is kind of pleasant to the touch.



So I think that with my stock Leopold caps, the black dampeners feel the best to me. And with the SP caps installed, the red o-rings (40A-L) o-rings feel the best.

 
Videos (ToC) (#post_TOC)
So I talked a lot about how everything sounds right but what if you didnít believe me. Itís ok, check these videos out.
This has grey dampeners installed on a QPad MK-80 with Cherry MX Blues.

This video is from WASDKeyboards Info (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/videos) section. It has sound comparisons of boards with MX Blues, Browns, and Blacks with and without o-rings installed.


Old Article (ToC) (#post_TOC)
I installed them onto the function row on my Filco MJ2. I have blues as youíll see.
(http://i.imgur.com/dbcf6dC.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/4rpd1o5.jpg)

For some keyboard shinfo, 50A means a material hardness of 50 on the Shore durometer A scale. R is the size. According to the WASD site, R reduces key actuation travel by 0.4mm and L reduces by 0.2mm. See the correction in the new article.

So here are my thoughts on each set:

Grey Dampeners
They donít really dampen/soften the bottoming out. They seem only to negligibly change the travel in the switch. I guess the only thing that feels different to me is that the impact when the key is completely depressed feels slightly less abrupt and the travel distance was negligibly shorter.  And the sound was a bit muffled. Anyways, I didnít really care for them. When I think dampener, I think of something cushiony. Like the black ones!

Black Dampeners
These felt really nice when I bottomed out. There was no jarring stop, just a touch of squishy and softness. Plus they made the board a little quieter. However I didnít think that they really changed the actuation distance at all. They just made it feel nice to type. These are what I expected when I first heard of them.

Black O-Rings
These bad boys hit HARD. It feels like you hit a plate when you bottom out and it sounds almost the same. These rings feel like the switch is jammed as well which is really frustrating to me. They also really reduce the travel. They pretty much stop the travel right after the blue switches actuate and click, which felt very very weird. However, I learned to kind of like it. I felt like there was some kind of change going on after I put them in. Plus? They really made my board way quieter. Unlike the greys dampenersÖ

Red O-Rings
I think these are my favorites. They reduce the travel just a touch so it feels nice and they also soften the impact. Since theyíre not as hard, they have a bit more give and when you type the feel like a little cushion. They REALLY made things quieter; probably most quiet out of the four o-rings/dampeners types I tried. If I were recommend something, these would be it.
Title: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Tue, 12 February 2013, 20:49:24
I bought the WASD sampler pack and tried out all three o-rings. The red ones are definitely the best and only ones I'd use. I have the full keyboard in red o-rings now and it feels and sounds amazing to type on.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 12 February 2013, 21:08:56
I bought the WASD sampler pack and tried out all three o-rings. The red ones are definitely the best and only ones I'd use. I have the full keyboard in red o-rings now and it feels and sounds amazing to type on.

You got the blue o-rings? Can you give me some feedback on those? I was a bit bummed when I realized I didn't have them.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: noisyturtle on Tue, 12 February 2013, 21:12:15
40A-L on lubed reds = fingergasm. Got 'em on my YotD and it's quickly become my favorite feeling board.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Leslieann on Tue, 12 February 2013, 22:14:48
Those key caps don't properly support the o-rings and will never give you good/consistent results, you need some sort of structure for them to push against.
Title: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Wed, 13 February 2013, 00:19:17
I bought the WASD sampler pack and tried out all three o-rings. The red ones are definitely the best and only ones I'd use. I have the full keyboard in red o-rings now and it feels and sounds amazing to type on.

You got the blue o-rings? Can you give me some feedback on those? I was a bit bummed when I realized I didn't have them.

From what I can remember, blues are just stiffer reds. However, the blues, just like the blacks, were too stiff for me and just ruined the flow of a key press. The reds are perfect and make the bottoming out feel softer and more silent.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Turbo Slaab on Wed, 13 February 2013, 00:20:53
Don't forget imsto's BIG orings!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Sifo on Wed, 13 February 2013, 00:26:15
The blue o rings are the same as the thicker red/pink ones I gave you, I got the sampler kit before WASD officially made their own and switched colors to make it less confusing. It's the same size, different color.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Reomero on Wed, 13 February 2013, 03:41:45
With a reduction in travel set aside, is the feeling when bottoming out with Cherry stabilizers similar to having an o-ring/dampener under the switch? I know I can order a sampler kit from WASD but it's a bit expensive for me just to try out some o-rings (and international shipping practically doubles the price).. :-X
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: fohat.digs on Wed, 13 February 2013, 10:21:05
I have only used the pads with blue switches, and I did not particularly like the effect.

For me, smaller and softer rings are best, and of those 2 characteristics, I think that smaller (thinner) is more important.

I have some rubber bands left over from my daughter's braces that are really quite nice.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Wed, 13 February 2013, 15:48:40
I also came across these on reddit: http://www.ebay.com/itm/METRIC-NITRILE-RUBBER-O-RINGS-CROSS-SECTION-1MM-VARIOUS-SIZES-AVAILABLE-/221096113455?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var&hash=item337a5af52f&_uhb=1

They're REALLY inexpensive compared to what WASD Keyboards is offering.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: rknize on Wed, 13 February 2013, 15:59:58
Those key caps don't properly support the o-rings and will never give you good/consistent results, you need some sort of structure for them to push against.

^ This, guys.  O-rings on SP caps do not work very well or consistently.  Cherry caps and the "OEM" style caps that come standard on so many boards (and from WASD) have a cross brace whose depth various across the key profiles.  This makes the length of the stem on the cap consistent relative to the cross brace so that the o-rings provide the same reduction in travel across all rows.  This is probably why you didn't notice the EK landing pads.

With SP keys, you have to stack o-rings or take other creative measures.  Even that won't be perfect due to imperfections in the shape of the back of the key cap.  SP's process can leave weird burrs in the areas where the two shots meet.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 13 February 2013, 16:15:21
Those key caps don't properly support the o-rings and will never give you good/consistent results, you need some sort of structure for them to push against.

^ This, guys.  O-rings on SP caps do not work very well or consistently.  Cherry caps and the "OEM" style caps that come standard on so many boards (and from WASD) have a cross brace whose depth various across the key profiles.  This makes the length of the stem on the cap consistent relative to the cross brace so that the o-rings provide the same reduction in travel across all rows.  This is probably why you didn't notice the EK landing pads.

With SP keys, you have to stack o-rings or take other creative measures.  Even that won't be perfect due to imperfections in the shape of the back of the key cap.  SP's process can leave weird burrs in the areas where the two shots meet.

CPTBadAss grumbles about how he spent a bit of time on this...

Fine...I'll add them to my Leopold and add some thoughts about them here.


The blue o rings are the same as the thicker red/pink ones I gave you, I got the sampler kit before WASD officially made their own and switched colors to make it less confusing. It's the same size, different color.


I'm a bit confused by this statement. I thought that the blues were the same thickness as the blacks but the same softness as the reds. See here (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/cherry-mx-rubber-switch-dampeners.html). The blues are 40A-R. So 40A is the hardness  and R is the thickness. Black rings have the R thickness and Red rings have the 40A hardness.

With a reduction in travel set aside, is the feeling when bottoming out with Cherry stabilizers similar to having an o-ring/dampener under the switch? I know I can order a sampler kit from WASD but it's a bit expensive for me just to try out some o-rings (and international shipping practically doubles the price).. :-X

I don't think it's the same as Cherry stabilizers. The black o-rings feel like the actuation has a shorter travel distance and bottoms out the same. The red o-rings also reduce the travel distance but feel squishy or pillowy when you bottom out. They also muffle the sound way more. The Cherry stabilizers can feel a but mushy or bouncy sometimes but I don't think they anything like the o-rings. Like fohat.digs said, you could ask your orthodontist or  someone who has braces to give you a pack of orthodontist rubberbands which might simulate them well enough for you to judge.

I bought the WASD sampler pack and tried out all three o-rings. The red ones are definitely the best and only ones I'd use. I have the full keyboard in red o-rings now and it feels and sounds amazing to type on.

You got the blue o-rings? Can you give me some feedback on those? I was a bit bummed when I realized I didn't have them.

From what I can remember, blues are just stiffer reds. However, the blues, just like the blacks, were too stiff for me and just ruined the flow of a key press. The reds are perfect and make the bottoming out feel softer and more silent.

Thanks for the input!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Sifo on Wed, 13 February 2013, 16:18:59
^

You see the thicker pink ones that I gave you? Those are the exact same o-rings, size, softness, everything about them are identical to the blue ones that WASD offers atm except for the color. WASD recently changed them to blue to differentiate them from the thinner pink ones. So, just letting you know that you did in fact get the blue o-rings (referring to:)

Quote
You got the blue o-rings? Can you give me some feedback on those? I was a bit bummed when I realized I didn't have them.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: rknize on Wed, 13 February 2013, 16:19:12
Those key caps don't properly support the o-rings and will never give you good/consistent results, you need some sort of structure for them to push against.

^ This, guys.  O-rings on SP caps do not work very well or consistently.  Cherry caps and the "OEM" style caps that come standard on so many boards (and from WASD) have a cross brace whose depth various across the key profiles.  This makes the length of the stem on the cap consistent relative to the cross brace so that the o-rings provide the same reduction in travel across all rows.  This is probably why you didn't notice the EK landing pads.

With SP keys, you have to stack o-rings or take other creative measures.  Even that won't be perfect due to imperfections in the shape of the back of the key cap.  SP's process can leave weird burrs in the areas where the two shots meet.

CPTBadAss grumbles about how he spent a bit of time on this...

Fine...I'll add them to my Leopold and add some thoughts about them here.

I wasn't knocking your efforts.  Just wanted to make sure that folks curious about o-rings knew this bit of unfortunate circumstance.  I learned the hard way.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 13 February 2013, 16:23:21
^

You see the thicker pink ones that I gave you? Those are the exact same o-rings, size, softness, everything about them are identical to the blue ones that WASD offers atm except for the color. WASD recently changed them to blue to differentiate them from the thinner pink ones. So, just letting you know that you did in fact get the blue o-rings (referring to:)

Quote
You got the blue o-rings? Can you give me some feedback on those? I was a bit bummed when I realized I didn't have them.

Got it, took me a sec to sort em out. Thank you.

And rkinze, thanks. I'll put these on the Leo later and add some thoughts in the OP.
I updated the OP with my new thoughts. Hope this helps clarify some things ^_^
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Leslieann on Wed, 13 February 2013, 20:38:48
CPTBadAss grumbles about how he spent a bit of time on this...

Fine...I'll add them to my Leopold and add some thoughts about them here.

I wasn't knocking your efforts.  Just wanted to make sure that folks curious about o-rings knew this bit of unfortunate circumstance.  I learned the hard way.
Sorry CPTBadAss, it was a good review, just something was missed.

I'm using short throw switches, which means I almost require the o-rings to limit travel, unfortunately my keycaps lack the bracing to do it. Like Rknize, I too learned the hard way.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 13 February 2013, 20:51:22
Haha I wasn't mad guys, I was just joking  :p. Thanks for reading it  ;D

Leslieann, can you explain a little more about short throw switches and why you need o-rings?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: rknize on Wed, 13 February 2013, 21:16:53
Maybe prefers Alps?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Leslieann on Wed, 13 February 2013, 23:38:31
Leslieann, can you explain a little more about short throw switches and why you need o-rings?
I call them Jailhouse Blues.
Start with MX Blues, you extend the bottom of the switch, and wrap a wire around it. This locks it in the extended position. This creates a short travel clear with very stiff springs, which you have to trim to bring back down in pressure. Mine feel like short travel, ergo-clears, which I love.

Here is a link to the how-to.
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=38091.0
Be sure to read the entire thread (it's short) as I document spring rates at the end and how to get the rate you want.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Reomero on Thu, 14 February 2013, 02:49:23
With a reduction in travel set aside, is the feeling when bottoming out with Cherry stabilizers similar to having an o-ring/dampener under the switch? I know I can order a sampler kit from WASD but it's a bit expensive for me just to try out some o-rings (and international shipping practically doubles the price).. :-X

I don't think it's the same as Cherry stabilizers. The black o-rings feel like the actuation has a shorter travel distance and bottoms out the same. The red o-rings also reduce the travel distance but feel squishy or pillowy when you bottom out. They also muffle the sound way more. The Cherry stabilizers can feel a but mushy or bouncy sometimes but I don't think they anything like the o-rings. Like fohat.digs said, you could ask your orthodontist or  someone who has braces to give you a pack of orthodontist rubberbands which might simulate them well enough for you to judge.
I see... thanks. :)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: fohat.digs on Thu, 14 February 2013, 09:07:43
It was my experience that the dental rubber bands were smaller (thinner) and softer than any of the commercial O-rings.

People are looking for different effects, such as shorter travel. All I ever really wanted was a cushion at the final moment of bottoming-out.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 14 February 2013, 09:20:04
It was my experience that the dental rubber bands were smaller (thinner) and softer than any of the commercial O-rings.

People are looking for different effects, such as shorter travel. All I ever really wanted was a cushion at the final moment of bottoming-out.

I feel like black soft landing pads are the best for this but they still reduce travel.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Fri, 15 February 2013, 21:54:01
I just ordered these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KBC-Black-Engraved-PBT-Cherry-MX-Key-Caps-104-keys-included-/330753334171?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item4d026f5b9b

KBC PBTs should have the brace to properly support the red O-Rings, correct?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Fri, 15 February 2013, 21:55:23
I just ordered these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KBC-Black-Engraved-PBT-Cherry-MX-Key-Caps-104-keys-included-/330753334171?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item4d026f5b9b

KBC PBTs should have the brace to properly support the red O-Rings, correct?

I don't see why not. I have these (http://www.ebay.com/itm/KBC-Blue-Dyesub-Thick-PBT-Cherry-MX-Key-Caps-105-keys-included-/330758846871?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item4d02c37997) from KBC and I've got WASD's red o-rings on them.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Fri, 15 February 2013, 21:59:46
I just ordered these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/KBC-Black-Engraved-PBT-Cherry-MX-Key-Caps-104-keys-included-/330753334171?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item4d026f5b9b

KBC PBTs should have the brace to properly support the red O-Rings, correct?

I don't see why not. I have these (http://www.ebay.com/itm/KBC-Blue-Dyesub-Thick-PBT-Cherry-MX-Key-Caps-105-keys-included-/330758846871?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item4d02c37997) from KBC and I've got WASD's red o-rings on them.

The seller is now kind of confusing me. Can you explain to me what this means:

Quote
The blank red WASD cluster are KBC thick PBT, these black-engraved ones are regular PBT, not thick PBT.

The black set is OEM profile, and the red WASD cluster is Cherry profile.

Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:03:25
OEM profile = the profile which comes standard on most keyboards such as QFR, Ducky, Leopold, Filco, etc...

Cherry profile is a shorter than OEM, read about it more in this thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35285.0).

Thick PBT is thicker than standard and supposedly feels more "solid".
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:08:35
OEM profile = the profile which comes standard on most keyboards such as QFR, Ducky, Leopold, Filco, etc...

Cherry profile is a shorter than OEM, read about it more in this thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35285.0).

Thick PBT is thicker than standard and supposedly feels more "solid".

Hmm, then maybe I should wait until I can get a black with engraved in a thick version. However, if I get these and the WASD cluster as Cherry profile, will the feeling be off? I kind of like having the cluster a bit different but I don't want the keyboard to feel awkward.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:09:52
OEM profile = the profile which comes standard on most keyboards such as QFR, Ducky, Leopold, Filco, etc...

Cherry profile is a shorter than OEM, read about it more in this thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35285.0).

Thick PBT is thicker than standard and supposedly feels more "solid".

Hmm, then maybe I should wait until I can get a black with engraved in a thick version. However, if I get these and the WASD cluster as Cherry profile, will the feeling be off? I kind of like having the cluster a bit different but I don't want the keyboard to feel awkward.

If you get the WASD keys in a different profile than the rest of your keys, then yes, it will be very awkward due to the height difference.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:14:06
OEM profile = the profile which comes standard on most keyboards such as QFR, Ducky, Leopold, Filco, etc...

Cherry profile is a shorter than OEM, read about it more in this thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35285.0).

Thick PBT is thicker than standard and supposedly feels more "solid".

Hmm, then maybe I should wait until I can get a black with engraved in a thick version. However, if I get these and the WASD cluster as Cherry profile, will the feeling be off? I kind of like having the cluster a bit different but I don't want the keyboard to feel awkward.

If you get the WASD keys in a different profile than the rest of your keys, then yes, it will be very awkward due to the height difference.

Okay, thanks for your help. It seems that the thick keys are twice the price as well, so I think I will purchase these engraved ones and try to get just the WASD cluster as thick but OEM and not Cherry.

Unless of course you recommend Cherry profile over OEM?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:25:39
OEM profile = the profile which comes standard on most keyboards such as QFR, Ducky, Leopold, Filco, etc...

Cherry profile is a shorter than OEM, read about it more in this thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35285.0).

Thick PBT is thicker than standard and supposedly feels more "solid".

Hmm, then maybe I should wait until I can get a black with engraved in a thick version. However, if I get these and the WASD cluster as Cherry profile, will the feeling be off? I kind of like having the cluster a bit different but I don't want the keyboard to feel awkward.

If you get the WASD keys in a different profile than the rest of your keys, then yes, it will be very awkward due to the height difference.

Okay, thanks for your help. It seems that the thick keys are twice the price as well, so I think I will purchase these engraved ones and try to get just the WASD cluster as thick but OEM and not Cherry.

Unless of course you recommend Cherry profile over OEM?

That's more of a preference, I believe. Many on this forum prefer Cherry profile due to it being the smaller profile. OEM, however, seems to be more abundant so it would be a safer choice in the long run in terms of compatibility with other future keycap sets.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:29:45
OEM profile = the profile which comes standard on most keyboards such as QFR, Ducky, Leopold, Filco, etc...

Cherry profile is a shorter than OEM, read about it more in this thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=35285.0).

Thick PBT is thicker than standard and supposedly feels more "solid".

Hmm, then maybe I should wait until I can get a black with engraved in a thick version. However, if I get these and the WASD cluster as Cherry profile, will the feeling be off? I kind of like having the cluster a bit different but I don't want the keyboard to feel awkward.

If you get the WASD keys in a different profile than the rest of your keys, then yes, it will be very awkward due to the height difference.

Okay, thanks for your help. It seems that the thick keys are twice the price as well, so I think I will purchase these engraved ones and try to get just the WASD cluster as thick but OEM and not Cherry.

Unless of course you recommend Cherry profile over OEM?

That's more of a preference, I believe. Many on this forum prefer Cherry profile due to it being the smaller profile. OEM, however, seems to be more abundant so it would be a safer choice in the long run in terms of compatibility with other future keycap sets.

It seems a lot of the cluster stuff like arrows and WASD seem to be cherry however. But trying to find the opposite (full sets, black engraved etc...) OEM is more abundant. I am guessing Cherry Profile is preferred among gamers?

Do you know if these are KBC/Cherry profile?

http://www.vendio.com/stores/E-sports-Gaming-equipments/item/pbt-key-caps/87-set-pbt-black-engraved-keyc/lid=18974429
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: keymaster on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:34:21
I think the sets on that site are all OEM profile unless stated otherwise. That's pretty much the case on most sites I've seen entire sets up for sale.

EDIT: as is the case with those KBC Red Dyesub PBT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/KBC-Red-Dyesub-Thick-PBT-WASD-Key-Set-Cherry-MX-Keycaps-/330840341013?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item4d079efa15) keys. The Cherry profile is specifically mentioned.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: The_Beast on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:37:31
My old roommate was a buttplug about noise at night, which is when I'm still pretty active. So I ordered my first keyboard a WASD with o-rings pre-installed. I loved mech boards, but once I goot the o-rings off, I loved them even more


RAAAAWWW DOGGGIN IT ALL DAY BOYS
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:37:43
Profile is all about preference. However, the o-rings will feel different if there is no cross bracing on the underside on the caps. Look at the picture of my Leopold in the above OP. I don't know if the KBC caps have that X on the underside.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:38:55
I think the sets on that site are all OEM profile unless stated otherwise. That's pretty much the case on most sites I've seen entire sets up for sale.

EDIT: as is the case with those KBC Red Dyesub PBT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/KBC-Red-Dyesub-Thick-PBT-WASD-Key-Set-Cherry-MX-Keycaps-/330840341013?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item4d079efa15) keys. The Cherry profile is specifically mentioned.

I really want to get those black engraved. Thick keys are going to run twice the price for a set correct?

Also, do you know where I can get a WASD cluster in OEM? Now that I thought it over a bit, I think my best bet is to get OEM considering if I ever want to get any custom keys from WASD, they will be able to match.

EDIT: Or maybe I will even get my cluster in red but with one of those custom textures WASD offers. I would rather PBT however. But I can't find red WASD KBC PBT OEM.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 15 February 2013, 22:42:32
Btw, OEM isn't always the same. My filco ninja OEM caps are a different profile from my Leopold caps.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Sat, 16 February 2013, 16:26:39
Btw, OEM isn't always the same. My filco ninja OEM caps are a different profile from my Leopold caps.

I took the plunge and got the KBC PBT Black engraved. I am pretty sure I am going to go ahead and purchase the red O-ring modifiers now.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sun, 17 February 2013, 09:05:04
Let us know how you like them!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: OnTheBrink on Sun, 17 February 2013, 14:24:58
Let us know how you like them!

Hey, are the keys on the TKL picture Cherry profile or OEM?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 18 February 2013, 21:33:41
Let us know how you like them!

Hey, are the keys on the TKL picture Cherry profile or OEM?

They're Leopold OEM. Very flat.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: DrakeMegrim on Tue, 05 March 2013, 19:13:59
For someone that bottoms out blues all the time is it getting dampers or o rings?  If so, what kind?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 05 March 2013, 19:40:41
For someone that bottoms out blues all the time is it getting dampers or o rings?  If so, what kind?

I prefer dampeners. I find that o-rings limit the travel too much. I'm typing on blues right now and I bottom out most of the time. For o-rings, I recommend the red 40A ones from WASD. For dampeners, I'd get the black soft-landing pads from Elitekeyboards.com
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Tue, 12 March 2013, 22:41:44
WASDkeyboards' thinner o-rings (40A-L) reduce travel less than dampeners.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 16 March 2013, 01:16:59
WASDkeyboards' thinner o-rings (40A-L) reduce travel less than dampeners.

It doesn't feel that way to me. 
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: DrakeMegrim on Wed, 20 March 2013, 15:15:57
Well now I'm undecided. Hah. Okay I have one more question then before I buy one or the other. Should I change what I'm using depending on the type of keycap (Cherry vs. OEM profile)? The OEM seem to be much higher and the crossbrace is a little higher on OEM but I have a set of stock Cherries I could use as well if they'd work better with either.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Wed, 20 March 2013, 16:25:13
The longer the free length of the keycap stem is, the thicker o-rings you need (ie thin o-rings may have no effect on some OEM keycaps). For Cherry keycaps I think you need to go with the thinner o-rings. SP keycaps tend to be all over the place, sometimes there are no crossbraces meaning you have to stack 2 o-rings sometimes.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: nubbinator on Wed, 20 March 2013, 18:55:13
I prefer dampeners. I find that o-rings limit the travel too much. I'm typing on blues right now and I bottom out most of the time. For o-rings, I recommend the red 40A ones from WASD. For dampeners, I'd get the black soft-landing pads from Elitekeyboards.com

For me it's not so much that they limit the travel, but all the o-rings I tried (I got a bunch with the WASD kit) ended up making the keys feel squishy.  If they made a rock hard o-ring in that size, it would probably be fine, but the current ones tend to ruin the feel for me as someone who bottoms out frequently.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 20 March 2013, 19:25:02
They make 70A o-rings which should be hard enough. Apparently ppl bought them on Amazon
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: WhiteFireDragon on Thu, 21 March 2013, 03:48:49
There is actually 90A. I think I have a set of those around somewhere.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: DrakeMegrim on Thu, 21 March 2013, 07:19:14
Let me know if you want to sell them!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Thu, 21 March 2013, 09:37:24
I prefer dampeners. I find that o-rings limit the travel too much. I'm typing on blues right now and I bottom out most of the time. For o-rings, I recommend the red 40A ones from WASD. For dampeners, I'd get the black soft-landing pads from Elitekeyboards.com

For me it's not so much that they limit the travel, but all the o-rings I tried (I got a bunch with the WASD kit) ended up making the keys feel squishy.  If they made a rock hard o-ring in that size, it would probably be fine, but the current ones tend to ruin the feel for me as someone who bottoms out frequently.

So what do you need rock-hard o-rings for?  The only effect they would have would be: limit the key travel.
They would have minimal sound dampening and no shock absorption. My friend I think in your case you would be better off without any o-rings or dampeners.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: deazncy on Fri, 22 March 2013, 00:58:21
I got the Buna o-rings off amazon (125 pack). Do they feel the same as o-rings that wasd sells?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:25:24
You probably got 70A durometer, so they would be harder than WASD's (they sell 40A and 50A durometer). I've tried all these durometers and my favorite is 40A since it has the most sound dampening and shock absorption while still allowing you to feel when you are bottoming out.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: deazncy on Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:27:03
I wouldn't get a shock absorbing o-ring, it takes away from the mechanical feel IMO...
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:34:58
It all depends on what you are looking for. I'm looking for maximum comfort, and 40A does it, without being squishy at all.  Whoever finds o-rings squishy probably hasn't installed them properly. You need to seat them all the way on the keycap stem, and also press down on each keycap HARD when you place it on the switch.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: deazncy on Fri, 22 March 2013, 01:37:41
Ah, thanks for the advice.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: nubbinator on Fri, 22 March 2013, 20:01:56
So what do you need rock-hard o-rings for?  The only effect they would have would be: limit the key travel.
They would have minimal sound dampening and no shock absorption. My friend I think in your case you would be better off without any o-rings or dampeners.

I shouldn't say rock hard, but harder ones than I've tried.

And limiting the travel would be perfectly fine.  A majority of the noise from bottoming out is the keys hitting the plate,  if there was a big enough gap to prevent that, that'd be good.

It all depends on what you are looking for. I'm looking for maximum comfort, and 40A does it, without being squishy at all.  Whoever finds o-rings squishy probably hasn't installed them properly. You need to seat them all the way on the keycap stem, and also press down on each keycap HARD when you place it on the switch.

I know for a fact that I pushed mine all the way to the top of the key cap stem and gave a good couple of hard presses.  Even with that, there was a noticeable squish that ruined the feel of the switch.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Fri, 22 March 2013, 21:20:51
Keys do not hit the plate. The bottoming out occurs when the switch stem bottoms out inside the switch housing bottom, or most commonly when the keycap bottoms out on the switch housing top. Whether or not you have a plate doesn't really matter, because the keycap skirt never quite reaches it.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: flizz on Mon, 25 March 2013, 20:32:01
which would you say is best for brown switches? I tried the red on browns but i just don't like what they do to them..
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 26 March 2013, 08:19:54
Flizz, I really liked the red o-rings and soft landing pads. I disliked the hard black o-rings so I wouldn't recommend those at all.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: drdoooom on Sun, 31 March 2013, 12:37:45
awesome detailed review!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 06 April 2013, 22:11:31
awesome detailed review!

Thanks for reading :D. I'm glad it helped you out
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: DrakeMegrim on Mon, 15 April 2013, 09:11:46
Just curious but how often are there group buys or people selling o-rings on here?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 15 April 2013, 09:14:15
Just curious but how often are there group buys or people selling o-rings on here?

There's apparently leftovers from WFD's last GB going on now. But I'm not 100% sure. Otherwise, I don't see o-rings for sale very often. WASDKeyboards seems to be the main place to get o-rings.

Edit: The GB (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=27841.0) is apparently over but there's interest in having another one opened. The o-rings WFD was offering had more variety versus the ones that are offered at WASD.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: DrakeMegrim on Mon, 15 April 2013, 09:21:31
Thanks!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: SpAmRaY on Tue, 07 May 2013, 08:57:03
Posting to say thanks for being thorough and having so much info, also good info in a lot of the other posts in this thread...
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 09 May 2013, 05:10:20
Posting to say thanks for being thorough and having so much info, also good info in a lot of the other posts in this thread...

Thanks! If you ever seen any other info you'd like added to this in regards to o-rings/dampeners, just let me know. I think I'm missing info on WFD's last buy and imsto's o-rings.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 07 June 2013, 11:15:36
Updated 6/8/13

To add my impressions to your wonderful write-up:

I received red silicone O-rings from IMSTO today in two sizes.  Prior to that, I had only tried black 50A O-rings from Amazon and OEM keycaps.

The large silicone red O-rings from IMSTO are surprisingly large in person, but I found they work very well for those keys that don't have a cross-bar support, and the stem goes all the way up to the top of the cap.  Keys such as zink keycaps and aluminum spacebar.  They are just a bit too large for Ducky Shine II keycaps and reduce key travel dramatically.  I can see these O-rings be very good for MX Black switches, where you don't need to push down much farther than the actuation point for any enhanced feel, resulting in less finger strain. (In my subjective opinion, I like the full travel distance for MX Browns, but MX Black with reduced travel distance is a benefit).

One thing to note about these O-rings is that they read their full thickness farther from their inner diameter, and thus farther from where they hit the switch bottom.  It means that in some cases, they can actually do nothing as far as dampening the bottoming out sound goes.  But they can be used in combination with a skinny O-ring following them, as substitutions for cross-bar support.

The skinny red silicone O-rings from IMSTO do close to nothing in terms of feel or sound for OEM keys that are not double-shots.  They are noticeably thinner than the 50A O-rings from Amazon.  Hitting a key with that O-ring hard still results in a harsh bottoming out sound, with a very slightly dampened tone.  Very slightly.  These O-rings may be best for Cherry-profile caps or DSA (I have a set of spherical DSA keycaps incoming and will test them soon).  But I'm still surprised just how little these O-rings do for the bottoming out sound.  ETA: just tried them on some double-shot keycaps with MX Blacks, and the dampening was better.  So it depends highly on what kind of keycaps you have for these thin O-rings.

The black rubber 50A O-rings from Amazon: are my favorite so far.  They don't result in a very significant travel reduction that impedes with my enjoyment of MX Browns, but they have VERY good bottom-out damping regardless of what kind of keycaps I tried.  And even without bottoming out (I don't bottom out much), they dampen the key sound overall.  I really like them for  MX Browns.

ETA:

(http://i.imgur.com/Btq7GlP.jpg)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 07 June 2013, 12:50:07
Ooo, could you possibly take pics of the Imsto o-rings? I know people have asked about them but I never had any to play with. Thanks for the input on them ^-^.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 07 June 2013, 13:01:02
Sure :)  Added a photo to my review above.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 07 June 2013, 13:31:15
Thank you. And thanks for taking the time to read my review ^__^
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Sifo on Fri, 07 June 2013, 14:20:08
I wish I had o-rings.

Nah.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Photoelectric on Fri, 07 June 2013, 14:24:38
I wish I had o-rings.

Nah.

I'm using my Ducky with Browns without O-rings :) Something about how the switches are mounted and these particular Browns makes them sound and feel very pleasant without any O-rings :)  I only put thick O-rings under a aluminum / zinc keys, of which there are 6 on this keyboard.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Input Nirvana on Fri, 07 June 2013, 16:40:11
Thank you. And thanks for taking the time to read my review ^__^

Thanks for the review...very helpful to give peeps a relative idea of what they will/won't do.
Back in the day, when we first started the O-ring idea, I got the 50A black nitril Buno rings (that's what we all started with, some kept them, some changed), which I still have on my Kinesis(es). I'm so used to it and like it so much, I typed on another Kinesis a couple months ago and was bummed it didn't have the o-rings. So spoiled!!!!

I'd like to get my hand on a couple 40A to try them out someday. Of course it depends on the key caps you are using as well.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 07 June 2013, 16:49:18
Yeah I had to rewrite the review after realizing the caps mattered so much. Learned first hand that the cross-bars underneath matter a lot! What switches do you have on your Kinesis by the way Input Nirvana?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: ImperfectLink on Fri, 14 June 2013, 04:09:40
I'm new to the mechanical scene and wanted to get a better idea how the O rings will feel and found this interesting reference on a site:

Duro 20A = Rubber Band
Duro 40A = Pencil Eraser
Duro 60A = Car Tire Tread
Duro 70A* = Running Shoe Sole
Duro 80A = Leather Belt
Duro 100A = Shopping Cart Wheel

Edit: Better yet, here's a chart:

http://www.allsealsinc.com/durometer.gif
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 14 June 2013, 08:17:37
THAT'S a cool comparison. Thanks for adding that :D. And welcome to Geekhack! Great first post :P
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: TimIsABat on Wed, 26 June 2013, 00:21:52
Still waiting on my red o-rings from IMSTO. Gonna see how they fair with MX reds.

Might buy me some black 50 from amazon though since I tried the ones from WASD and liked them...
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Input Nirvana on Wed, 26 June 2013, 00:25:03
I'm new to the mechanical scene and wanted to get a better idea how the O rings will feel and found this interesting reference on a site:

Duro 20A = Rubber Band
Duro 40A = Pencil Eraser
Duro 60A = Car Tire Tread
Duro 70A* = Running Shoe Sole
Duro 80A = Leather Belt
Duro 100A = Shopping Cart Wheel

Edit: Better yet, here's a chart:

http://www.allsealsinc.com/durometer.gif (http://www.allsealsinc.com/durometer.gif)

Let me help you with that:

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: TimIsABat on Wed, 26 June 2013, 01:01:56
So I just tried out the o-ring sampler with my poker which has mx reds and pbt caps...

CPTbadass's review is quite accurate IMO...

I'm trying to get an o-ring set that reduces the amount of key travel and provides cushion as I have bad wrists and even though I switched from membrane to mechanical, the key travel on reds still hurts my hand.

The black ones weren't hard but more so made my keys feel kinda stuck. Almost like a RD board. The blue 40a-r were nice band reduced the travel but still felt stuck. The 40a-l rings were quite nice. They had a good cushion feel and travel, but the travel might not be far enough.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Input Nirvana on Sat, 29 June 2013, 17:10:06
Yeah I had to rewrite the review after realizing the caps mattered so much. Learned first hand that the cross-bars underneath matter a lot! What switches do you have on your Kinesis by the way Input Nirvana?

I have brown switches and red switches. I like them both, but I have not typed on the red switches for a year (I'm settling down and will start using that board again). I may decide one day on one of the switches over the other, but I don't know. O-rings definitely change the game with reds (makes the reds better for me because of bottoming out without tactile feel). I don't have RSI. Keycaps will change the feel/performance, but I don't think keycaps would change how I like browns or reds.

I've seen a couple Kinesis that had blues installed. And Lanx retrofitted ergo clears into his. I would like to type on blues and ergo clears for a day to see how it is, but I like the light touch of the browns and reds. Someone spoke of putting blacks in their Kinesis, but I don't remember who and I don't believe they actually did it.



These silicone 40A-R I'm typing on are very pimp, I like them a lot.Depending how I'm typing, it varies from no difference to a noticeable and pleasant difference.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Galaxy on Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:42:48
I recently ordered the red 40A-L O rings from WASD for my work keyboard; this is my first experience with O-rings. Here are my thoughts:

A little background:
I recently purchased a Ducky Zero DK2108 (w/ browns) as a work keyboard. I have been using a Filco MJ2 (w/ browns) at home for over a year and after acquiring the Ducky Zero I noticed that it was louder than my Filco despite having the same switches. Although it seems like all the keys on my Ducky Zero are slightly louder than my Filco, the stabilized keys in particular (spacebar, enter, shift, etc) seem to be twice as loud as what I am used to hearing from my MJ2.

It seems that the Cherry stabilizers on the Ducky Zero are significantly louder than the Costar stabilizers that come with the Filco MJ2. I don't know if Cherry stabilizers are inherently louder than Costar, or if this is specific to the Ducky Zero's implementation of them. I can hear the wire rattle softly when I hit the spacebar on my Filco but the spacebar on my Ducky Zero made a loud THUNK every time I pressed it. It was really annoying me.

My impression:
So I purchased a set of 40A-L O-rings from WASD. Initially I put them on every key because I loved how much they dampened the sound. They really do seem to cut the decibels by a third to half. However throughout the day I became uncomfortable with the (admittedly very slight) reduced travel distance and the (again, very slight) squish when bottoming out. Bottoming out keys felt too similar to the membrane keyboard I had just upgraded from, and with the reduced travel distance I found myself bottoming out more than normal.

So I ended up removing the O-rings from all but the Cherry stabilized keys, this has successfully eliminated the loud THUNK sound that I was getting every time I hit the spacebar or enter. The slight change in travel distance and squishyness is almost imperceptible on the stabilized keys but the O-rings eliminate the THUNK sound and bring the decibels down to the same level as the rest of the keys.

To sum up:
I loved the difference that they made in sound, but I was unhappy with the change in feeling. However my biggest problem with sound was from the Cherry stabilized keys and the O-rings didn't change the feeling hardly at all on these keys while significantly quieting them.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 03 July 2013, 11:55:55
Do your Ducky caps have the same crossbarring as the caps in my review? The cross-bars will greatly affect how the o-rings feel. The space-bar probably doesn't have as much support underneath so it feels different.

I also didn't think the o-rings quieted my board that much. And I think that costars are louder than the cherry stabilizers.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Galaxy on Wed, 03 July 2013, 12:16:04
Do your Ducky caps have the same crossbarring as the caps in my review? The cross-bars will greatly affect how the o-rings feel. The space-bar probably doesn't have as much support underneath so it feels different.

I also didn't think the o-rings quieted my board that much. And I think that costars are louder than the cherry stabilizers.

Here's a couple photos:

(http://i.imgur.com/VVb1Tz8.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/fpe1AWe.jpg)

That would be interesting if Costars are generally louder than Cherry, because my Filco's spacebar is a whisper compared to the "KERTHUNK" sound my Ducky was making.

It's occurred to me that the Cherry stabilizers may not be the cause of the THUNK sound I was getting from the stabilized keys, it could have something to do with the Zero's design or the materials they use, or the mounting plate, or a defect in my specific board, god knows. All I know is the 40A-L's fixed the issue for me.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 03 July 2013, 12:34:59
Hm. Well I don't have a Ducky so I have no idea. Thanks for the pictures.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 03 July 2013, 12:44:08
I found that both of my Filcos' Costar stabilized spacebars are definitely louder than my Ducky Shine's Cherry stabilized spacebar.  Tried multiple spacebars: ABS and aluminum.  Cherry is more muted.  No problems with grinding spacebars, only if placed incorrectly.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Galaxy on Wed, 03 July 2013, 13:28:05
I found that both of my Filcos' Costar stabilized spacebars are definitely louder than my Ducky Shine's Cherry stabilized spacebar.  Tried multiple spacebars: ABS and aluminum.  Cherry is more muted.  No problems with grinding spacebars, only if placed incorrectly.

Curiouser and curiouser..... I wonder why my Ducky Zero spacebar is so damn loud
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 03 July 2013, 13:41:24
Possibly case design + plate (material, thickness, etc)+ distribution of empty space.   Could be greater resonance.  Some setups are more "solid" and less prone to vibration (effectively dampened).  That's my best guess. 
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Galaxy on Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:05:14
Yeah that must be it. My Filco has the same switches but is far far quieter. I guess it has little to do with the stabilizers and everything to do with the things you mention.

These 2 keyboards are proving to be excellent examples of the difference build quality makes. Same switches and size, but my MJ2 is superior to my Zero in every way. Even if Cherry stabilizers are generally superior to Costar it clearly makes little difference compared to what board the stabilizers are going into.

In other words: I will never buy/judge a board based on whether it has Cherry or Costar stabilizers because apparently this point is moot compared to the overall design and build quality of the board.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Photoelectric on Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:12:22
My Ducky Shine II TKL is every bit as good as my Filcos as far as I can tell, down to nice and neat PCB.  I believe Zero is the budget line, but I don't know if there are any significant differences.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:13:40
Can we migrate this discussion on stabilizers elsewhere? Thank you!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Grim Fandango on Wed, 03 July 2013, 14:25:09
40A-L Red O-Rings
These still feel really nice. There’s now less cushion-y-ness but still feel squishy. The travel reduction really feels different now. These o-rings now really feel like they stop actuation sooner. It seems like they stop the travel right after the click. I still really like these.


These are the ones I ended up going with on my browns. I had to adjust at first, and was convinced that I did not like them. But now that I am used to them, I actually appreciate the slightly smaller travel of the keys.  One thing to take into account when you just put them on , is that they still move a little and are not yet in the right position unless you hit the key few times.

I actually like them a lot better than I had anticipated, since they reduce a little of the noise, they shorten the travel, and they give a softer impact but without feeling "mushy". Some people warned me that o-rings would destroy the feel of a mechanical switch, but I kind of disagree. Or at least, it does not for me. I still get the same tactile feedback when pressin the key, and it all generally feels the same. The only real difference is the feel when bottoming out.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Mainian on Fri, 05 July 2013, 01:13:44
40A-L Red O-Rings
These still feel really nice. Thereís now less cushion-y-ness but still feel squishy. The travel reduction really feels different now. These o-rings now really feel like they stop actuation sooner. It seems like they stop the travel right after the click. I still really like these.


These are the ones I ended up going with on my browns. I had to adjust at first, and was convinced that I did not like them. But now that I am used to them, I actually appreciate the slightly smaller travel of the keys.  One thing to take into account when you just put them on , is that they still move a little and are not yet in the right position unless you hit the key few times.

I actually like them a lot better than I had anticipated, since they reduce a little of the noise, they shorten the travel, and they give a softer impact but without feeling "mushy". Some people warned me that o-rings would destroy the feel of a mechanical switch, but I kind of disagree. Or at least, it does not for me. I still get the same tactile feedback when pressin the key, and it all generally feels the same. The only real difference is the feel when bottoming out.

Sweet, I was just about to ask about these. I actually LOVE the way the black o-rings feel or reds and blacks, but they honestly make me want to destroy my keyboard when they are on my blues.

Going to order these NOW.

Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: UniClown on Fri, 05 July 2013, 01:21:35
I got the WASD sampler kit, and I agree with CPT and some others here that my favorite are the red o-rings.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: fohat.digs on Fri, 05 July 2013, 21:12:42
they honestly make me want to destroy my keyboard when they are on my blues.

Landing pads are best for blues.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 05 July 2013, 21:15:40
Yup, I had landing pads on my Blues as well
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 22 August 2013, 13:28:59
Yup, I had landing pads on my Blues as well

Have you done any experimenting with any sound dampening on your green switches?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 22 August 2013, 13:33:06
No. I never thought of it since I didn't want to dampen the sound anymore. I also don't have o-rings anymore so the only experiment I could do is with soft landing pads.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 22 August 2013, 13:37:53
No. I never thought of it since I didn't want to dampen the sound anymore. I also don't have o-rings anymore so the only experiment I could do is with soft landing pads.

Ok just curious! I just received a board with greens now so maybe I just need to do my own experimenting!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: dustinhxc on Sat, 02 November 2013, 15:10:18
One fine day I was surfing the free stuff thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=34585.0) and Mr. Sifo was giving out some o-rings and dampeners. And I was lucky enough to score them! Thank you Sifo!! I thought Iíd write a review on my thoughts of these bad boys now that Iíve finally gotten them.
 
The o-rings are from the WASDKeyboards sampler pack. I have the black rubber (50A-R), red rubber (40A-L), and pink rubber (40A-R) (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/cherry-mx-rubber-switch-dampeners.html). The pink thick rubber o-rings are the same as the blue o-rings from WASDKeyboards. The dampeners or soft-landing pads are the same ones found on EliteKeyboards (http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=access,slpads). The black ones are soft and the grey ones are hard.

As pointed out in the comments, I initially used SP caps which donít have the cross-bracing. I then installed my o-rings and dampeners into my Leopold FC700R with stock caps to retest them and give my new thoughts.  However, I didnít want  to lose my first impressions just in case anyone was curious. Those thoughts will be bumped to the end.

TABLE OF CONTENTS
1) Old Article (#post_Old)
2) New Article (#post_New)
3) Videos (#post_VOD)


New Article (ToC) (#post_TOC)

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/vTT4O2E.png)
The newly sorted o-rings and dampeners from left to right: Red rubber 40A-L, pink rubber 40A-R (marked with black dots), black rubber 50A-R, black soft-landing pads (hard), and grey rubber soft-landing pads (soft).

For some keyboard science, 50A means a material hardness of 50 on the Shore durometer A scale. R is the size. According to the WASD site, R reduces key actuation travel by 0.4mm and L reduces by 0.2mm; this means thats how thick these rings are. However, I measured the o-ring and dampener in regards to this question (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=38945.msg820191#msg820191) and realized that R = 0.4 cm = 4 mm and L = 0.2 cm = 2 mm. The soft-landing pads measure in at 1 mm  or 0.1 cm.



Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/Jz6GUX2.jpg)
I then installed them into the following keys:
  • F1 and F2 have the thin red o-rings (40A-L) which are advertised as soft.
  • F3 and F4 have the thick pink o-rings z (40A-R) which are advertised as soft.
  • F5 and F6 have the black o-rings (50A-R) which are advertised as hard.
  • F7 and F8 have the black soft-landing pads which are advertised as harder.
  • F9 and F10 have the grey hard-landing pads which are advertised as softer.
And yes, rkinze and Leslieann were right. The cross-bracing in the Leo caps make the o-rings and dampeners feel way different.

40A-L Red O-Rings
These still feel really nice. Thereís now less cushion-y-ness but still feel squishy. The travel reduction really feels different now. These o-rings now really feel like they stop actuation sooner. It seems like they stop the travel right after the click. I still really like these.

40A-R Pink O-Rings
These are the same as the blue o-rings sold at WASDKeyboards. They really stop actuation quickly; it feels like they stop at the click - almost mid click. They feel the same as the red o-rings when you bottom out. They feel nice but I really dislike how much actuation is cutoff.

50A-R Black O-Rings
These donít hit as hard as they do when theyíre installed on the SP caps. But they still feel really hard when you bottom out. The bottom out doesnít feel like hitting the board but itís still hard. And again, the travel stops right at the click. My least favorite.

Black Dampeners
This time I feel the dampeners way more. They definitely reduce a travel a bit; seems like a little less than the red o-rings but it definitely stops travel. These are cushiony and squishy. Definitely way softer than the red o-rings. I really like these.

Grey Dampeners
These are the harder version of the greys. A smidge less of travel distance but the bottom out still feels hard, almost like the black o-rings. They feel like they stop actuation very close to the bottom. But I kinda like them. They still have a touch of give which is kind of pleasant to the touch.



So I think that with my stock Leopold caps, the black dampeners feel the best to me. And with the SP caps installed, the red o-rings (40A-L) o-rings feel the best.

 
Videos (ToC) (#post_TOC)
So I talked a lot about how everything sounds right but what if you didnít believe me. Itís ok, check these videos out.
This has grey dampeners installed on a QPad MK-80 with Cherry MX Blues.

This video is from WASDKeyboards Info (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/videos) section. It has sound comparisons of boards with MX Blues, Browns, and Blacks with and without o-rings installed.


Old Article (ToC) (#post_TOC)
I installed them onto the function row on my Filco MJ2. I have blues as youíll see.
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/dbcf6dC.jpg)
  • F1 through F4 had the grey dampeners which are advertised as hard/firm
  • F5 through F8 had the black dampeners which are advertised as soft
Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/4rpd1o5.jpg)
  • F9 through F12 had the black o-rings which are called 50A-R.
  • Print Screen through Pasuse have the red o-rings which are called 40A-L

For some keyboard shinfo, 50A means a material hardness of 50 on the Shore durometer A scale. R is the size. According to the WASD site, R reduces key actuation travel by 0.4mm and L reduces by 0.2mm. See the correction in the new article.

So here are my thoughts on each set:

Grey Dampeners
They donít really dampen/soften the bottoming out. They seem only to negligibly change the travel in the switch. I guess the only thing that feels different to me is that the impact when the key is completely depressed feels slightly less abrupt and the travel distance was negligibly shorter.  And the sound was a bit muffled. Anyways, I didnít really care for them. When I think dampener, I think of something cushiony. Like the black ones!

Black Dampeners
These felt really nice when I bottomed out. There was no jarring stop, just a touch of squishy and softness. Plus they made the board a little quieter. However I didnít think that they really changed the actuation distance at all. They just made it feel nice to type. These are what I expected when I first heard of them.

Black O-Rings
These bad boys hit HARD. It feels like you hit a plate when you bottom out and it sounds almost the same. These rings feel like the switch is jammed as well which is really frustrating to me. They also really reduce the travel. They pretty much stop the travel right after the blue switches actuate and click, which felt very very weird. However, I learned to kind of like it. I felt like there was some kind of change going on after I put them in. Plus? They really made my board way quieter. Unlike the greys dampenersÖ

Red O-Rings
I think these are my favorites. They reduce the travel just a touch so it feels nice and they also soften the impact. Since theyíre not as hard, they have a bit more give and when you type the feel like a little cushion. They REALLY made things quieter; probably most quiet out of the four o-rings/dampeners types I tried. If I were recommend something, these would be it.

This review was excellent thanks once again for the great information :) I ordered red orings!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Wed, 06 November 2013, 00:32:41
oh come on, nobody has any opinion on double red?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 06 November 2013, 07:48:15
oh come on, nobody has any opinion on double red?

I no longer have o-rings so I can't experiment with this myself.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Binge on Thu, 07 November 2013, 13:25:17
oh come on, nobody has any opinion on double red?

I do.  It sucks.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: SpAmRaY on Thu, 07 November 2013, 13:26:31
oh come on, nobody has any opinion on double red?

I no longer have o-rings so I can't experiment with this myself.

70A are like ~$2 shipped from amazon (IF you have amazon prime)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: osi on Thu, 07 November 2013, 20:20:43
Red o rings on my tkl and tenkeypad. Keyboard has MX blacks, keypad has mx blues.

Got a sampler set to determine what I liked best. The blue o rings reduced the key travel too much for my tastes.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Fri, 08 November 2013, 10:41:54
oh come on, nobody has any opinion on double red?

I do.  It sucks.

what do you use it for and how long have you tried it? what switch and what keyboard?

also which red o ring did you buy
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: frvrngn on Fri, 08 November 2013, 11:45:58
I tried the Amazon black o-rings on my QFR with Reds.  At first I liked the reduced travel and sound.  What I didnt like was the bottom out feel.  I actually just took them off yesterday and what I have learned is that with the o-rings on and reduced travel it has taught me to not bottom out.  I used to bottom all the time on that board due to how light the switches are and no feedback.  Now I know the travel needed and can type at near full speed but not bottom or just very lightly bottom out.  I really like how it feels now without them. 
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: badugi on Thu, 14 November 2013, 18:10:52
for 50A-R O-rings, if you put them on Cherry MX Reds, would they feel very similar to laptop keyboards in terms of travel distance?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Pacifist on Thu, 14 November 2013, 18:14:15
for 50A-R O-rings, if you put them on Cherry MX Reds, would they feel very similar to laptop keyboards in terms of travel distance?

Not at all. Scissor switches don't have much distance
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: badugi on Thu, 14 November 2013, 18:56:51
for 50A-R O-rings, if you put them on Cherry MX Reds, would they feel very similar to laptop keyboards in terms of travel distance?

Not at all. Scissor switches don't have much distance


No, what I mean is, would the travel distance be similar to the scissor switches when you put the 50A-R O-rings on a normal cherry mx red keyboard?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 15 November 2013, 08:10:53
I agree with Pacifist, the travel distance on scissor switches is very small and o-rings + red switches won't feel like that. Maybe two o-rings but apparently that feels like garbage.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: badugi on Fri, 15 November 2013, 10:04:57
I agree with Pacifist, the travel distance on scissor switches is very small and o-rings + red switches won't feel like that. Maybe two o-rings but apparently that feels like garbage.

ok thank you.  My first time buying orings but they are 50A-R.  I bought them for reduced travel distance to put into my cherry red keyboard.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Sat, 16 November 2013, 08:12:37
I agree with Pacifist, the travel distance on scissor switches is very small and o-rings + red switches won't feel like that. Maybe two o-rings but apparently that feels like garbage.

ok thank you.  My first time buying orings but they are 50A-R.  I bought them for reduced travel distance to put into my cherry red keyboard.

look i see u everywhre on the forum and i respect your presence, but you and the other guys here clearly has bias towards 2 red o rings. regardless of whether you have tried it or not actually, they do work magic and they are far from 50%50% middle of the road coming from any scizor robber dome to straight bare mechanical cherry switches.


for simple task like typing it's all a matter of getting used to, i am no expert in typing stuff and i don't type all day long but i know that using these my tping experience has not been hampered as much as calling it ****.

as for gaming these things are pure gold.

i don't want to say any more on that and want to hear no more of the ignorant comments on  double red o rings. i saw someone recommend it on reddit mechanicalkeyboard,not sure if anyone of you visit that place, there are some veteran geeks there for sure. But I have done my research and tried a lot of o rings. the reds are the only ones that work. and I think I am using wasd reds.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Sat, 16 November 2013, 14:19:59
Are you always this aggressive or what lyrill?

I literally said I've never tried it so I used the word "apparently". No need to be so passive aggressive. My opinion is just that. Ignorant? Ignorant is you not being able to present your opinion without throwing a fit like a 5 year old.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Sun, 17 November 2013, 16:21:44
Are you always this aggressive or what lyrill?

I literally said I've never tried it so I used the word "apparently". No need to be so passive aggressive. My opinion is just that. Ignorant? Ignorant is you not being able to present your opinion without throwing a fit like a 5 year old.

all in the eye of the beholder
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jeffgran on Sun, 17 November 2013, 16:51:32
I have a Kinesis Advantage with browns switches, and I got the sampler pack of O-rings from WASD, and tried a lot of different combinations. You can definitely put 2 O-rings on the same key and it reduces the travel.

Here's my memory of things I've tried:
- Black O-rings give you a hard landing. I actually thought that was what I wanted at first, but after typing on them for a while they kinda hurt your fingers from bottoming out on that hard surface, so I switched to the blue ones, and then to the red ones.
- I wanted short-travel at first, and so i tried putting 2 black O-rings on each key, and it worked but again, I didn't end up liking it in practice.
- I actually even put 3 black o-rings on some keys, and it worked too, but it reduced the travel so much that sometimes the key wouldn't even actuate, depending on how hard I bottomed out.

- like @badugi, at first I was naively trying to recreate the feel of the apple laptop keyboard, with the short throw (~1mm!) and hard landing. But in practice, I think that's a waste of effort and my new clear switches feel so nice that I've mostly given up on that pursuit now. But if you want short throw, the best way to do it is Jailhouse Blues. I've tried that on a few keys on another board and like it, but haven't done a whole board to try the real day-long typing experience on it.
- the only exception to the above is that I left the double-black o-rings on a few of the thumb keys, like my "enter" key and I think maybe the space key too, because I tend to really pound down on that enter with my thumb and it feels better to have it have a hard landing than a squishy one.



- between the red and the blue o-ring, my experience is exactly how WASD advertises them -- The blue ones are a little bit more squishy and reduce the travel a little more, and the reds are a little bit less squishy and reduce the travel a little less. Both feel nice, much nicer than the stock switch/cap when you bottom out.
- I ended up using blue o-rings on most keys, and red ones on some of the pinky keys so they have a little longer travel. not sure why but it felt better to me for the pinky keys.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: catnipz0098 on Sun, 17 November 2013, 17:31:14
I have a Kinesis Advantage with browns switches, and I got the sampler pack of O-rings from WASD, and tried a lot of different combinations. You can definitely put 2 O-rings on the same key and it reduces the travel.

Here's my memory of things I've tried:
- Black O-rings give you a hard landing. I actually thought that was what I wanted at first, but after typing on them for a while they kinda hurt your fingers from bottoming out on that hard surface, so I switched to the blue ones, and then to the red ones.
- I wanted short-travel at first, and so i tried putting 2 black O-rings on each key, and it worked but again, I didn't end up liking it in practice.
- I actually even put 3 black o-rings on some keys, and it worked too, but it reduced the travel so much that sometimes the key wouldn't even actuate, depending on how hard I bottomed out.

- like @badugi, at first I was naively trying to recreate the feel of the apple laptop keyboard, with the short throw (~1mm!) and hard landing. But in practice, I think that's a waste of effort and my new clear switches feel so nice that I've mostly given up on that pursuit now. But if you want short throw, the best way to do it is Jailhouse Blues. I've tried that on a few keys on another board and like it, but haven't done a whole board to try the real day-long typing experience on it.
- the only exception to the above is that I left the double-black o-rings on a few of the thumb keys, like my "enter" key and I think maybe the space key too, because I tend to really pound down on that enter with my thumb and it feels better to have it have a hard landing than a squishy one.



- between the red and the blue o-ring, my experience is exactly how WASD advertises them -- The blue ones are a little bit more squishy and reduce the travel a little more, and the reds are a little bit less squishy and reduce the travel a little less. Both feel nice, much nicer than the stock switch/cap when you bottom out.
- I ended up using blue o-rings on most keys, and red ones on some of the pinky keys so they have a little longer travel. not sure why but it felt better to me for the pinky keys.

Doesn't WASD only have red and blue O-rings?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Sun, 17 November 2013, 19:18:05
I have a Kinesis Advantage with browns switches, and I got the sampler pack of O-rings from WASD, and tried a lot of different combinations. You can definitely put 2 O-rings on the same key and it reduces the travel.

Here's my memory of things I've tried:
- Black O-rings give you a hard landing. I actually thought that was what I wanted at first, but after typing on them for a while they kinda hurt your fingers from bottoming out on that hard surface, so I switched to the blue ones, and then to the red ones.
- I wanted short-travel at first, and so i tried putting 2 black O-rings on each key, and it worked but again, I didn't end up liking it in practice.
- I actually even put 3 black o-rings on some keys, and it worked too, but it reduced the travel so much that sometimes the key wouldn't even actuate, depending on how hard I bottomed out.

- like @badugi, at first I was naively trying to recreate the feel of the apple laptop keyboard, with the short throw (~1mm!) and hard landing. But in practice, I think that's a waste of effort and my new clear switches feel so nice that I've mostly given up on that pursuit now. But if you want short throw, the best way to do it is Jailhouse Blues. I've tried that on a few keys on another board and like it, but haven't done a whole board to try the real day-long typing experience on it.
- the only exception to the above is that I left the double-black o-rings on a few of the thumb keys, like my "enter" key and I think maybe the space key too, because I tend to really pound down on that enter with my thumb and it feels better to have it have a hard landing than a squishy one.



- between the red and the blue o-ring, my experience is exactly how WASD advertises them -- The blue ones are a little bit more squishy and reduce the travel a little more, and the reds are a little bit less squishy and reduce the travel a little less. Both feel nice, much nicer than the stock switch/cap when you bottom out.
- I ended up using blue o-rings on most keys, and red ones on some of the pinky keys so they have a little longer travel. not sure why but it felt better to me for the pinky keys.

Doesn't WASD only have red and blue O-rings?

also curious where he got black ones.
they do have black ones. just not available everywhere
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jeffgran on Sun, 17 November 2013, 22:45:03
Yeah, they must have discontinued them. They used to have them maybe a year ago when I ordered them. When I went and looked now, they don't have them any more. IIRC, they were 70A hardness, as opposed to the 50A hardness of the red and blue. Maybe so many people liked the red and blue better they discontinued them? Don't know.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Mon, 18 November 2013, 00:43:13
lolol, people who bothered to get o rings are in and of themselves not the popular crowd., talking about popular and unpopular sects inside a cult that is o rings inside a cult that is mechanical keyboard enthusiasts,
NEXT LEVEL MLG NO SCOPE
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Mon, 18 November 2013, 00:48:57
Are you always this aggressive or what lyrill?

I literally said I've never tried it so I used the word "apparently". No need to be so passive aggressive. My opinion is just that. Ignorant? Ignorant is you not being able to present your opinion without throwing a fit like a 5 year old.

u ignored the opinion outlined by me and chose to go with a one liner from someone that care less to explain his one liner, did you simply take it from the one liner cus it's eye catchy?

and did I not already explained my points?how are you then still validating your post by standing behind his one liner? you literally never tried it, like you more than once admit, yet while you admit it you stand by a one liner opinion coming out of nowhere.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jeffgran on Mon, 18 November 2013, 09:06:54
BTW I think these are the same as the black ones WASD used to sell (70A Durometer): http://www.amazon.com/109-Buna-N-O-Ring-Durometer-Black/dp/B000FMYR9S/ref=pd_sim_indust_8
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Mon, 18 November 2013, 12:34:15
BTW I think these are the same as the black ones WASD used to sell (70A Durometer): http://www.amazon.com/109-Buna-N-O-Ring-Durometer-Black/dp/B000FMYR9S/ref=pd_sim_indust_8

people have been reporting that wasd stuff is different from amazon stuff
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jwaz on Mon, 18 November 2013, 14:57:25
Clearly o-rings do nothing for accuracy.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jeffgran on Mon, 18 November 2013, 20:16:25
BTW I think these are the same as the black ones WASD used to sell (70A Durometer): http://www.amazon.com/109-Buna-N-O-Ring-Durometer-Black/dp/B000FMYR9S/ref=pd_sim_indust_8

people have been reporting that wasd stuff is different from amazon stuff

Yeah I think you're right, actually... the WASD ones are made from EPDM and those amazon ones are "Buna"/nitrile rubber. I would imagine the shore hardness is what really matters though...
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 18 November 2013, 20:19:37
The difference in material still might make a difference in feel. I wouldn't be able to judge until I actually tried it myself though.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Larken on Mon, 18 November 2013, 23:10:12
I think these are closer to what WASD used to sell in terms of hardness - http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051XWXCE/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'd bought these and tried it for a period of time. Didn't like it much as it reduced travel distance too drastically for my taste. Can't compare to those from WASD red/blues as I'd never had the chance to try those.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lemontwist on Tue, 19 November 2013, 07:21:42
@CPTBadAss, Thanks for such a detailed review. I need some advice and hope you can help. I have only just bought my first mechanical keyboard - Keycool 87II blue switch. But I have found that I tend to bottom out rather a lot on it and think maybe rings might work better for me.
I have found these rings on eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120pcs-Keycap-Rubber-O-Ring-Switch-Dampeners-RED-For-CHERRY-MX-Free-Shipping-/261268631414?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cd4d2ef76), are these the same as the ones you mention in your last paragraph?
Quote
Red O-Rings
I think these are my favorites. They reduce the travel just a touch so it feels nice and they also soften the impact. Since theyíre not as hard, they have a bit more give and when you type the feel like a little cushion. They REALLY made things quieter; probably most quiet out of the four o-rings/dampeners types I tried. If I were recommend something, these would be it.
I ask because try as I might I cannot understand the measurement system but your explanation sounds like ^these^ reds are exactly what I'm looking for. Thanks again. Lemons.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 19 November 2013, 07:37:26
@CPTBadAss, Thanks for such a detailed review. I need some advice and hope you can help. I have only just bought my first mechanical keyboard - Keycool 87II blue switch. But I have found that I tend to bottom out rather a lot on it and think maybe rings might work better for me.
I have found these rings on eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120pcs-Keycap-Rubber-O-Ring-Switch-Dampeners-RED-For-CHERRY-MX-Free-Shipping-/261268631414?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cd4d2ef76), are these the same as the ones you mention in your last paragraph?
Quote
Red O-Rings
I think these are my favorites. They reduce the travel just a touch so it feels nice and they also soften the impact. Since theyíre not as hard, they have a bit more give and when you type the feel like a little cushion. They REALLY made things quieter; probably most quiet out of the four o-rings/dampeners types I tried. If I were recommend something, these would be it.
I ask because try as I might I cannot understand the measurement system but your explanation sounds like ^these^ reds are exactly what I'm looking for. Thanks again. Lemons.

The o-rings you linked look like they're almost 3 times thicker than what WASD has. The -L thickness rings provide a 0.2mm reduction in travel so they're 0.2mm thick. The -R thickness rings provide a 0.4mm reduction in travel so they're 0.4mm thick. The ones in the eBay link are 1.5mm thick. I also don't see a material or hardness rating on the eBay rings. I would say that they're not the same as the ones from WASD.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Wed, 20 November 2013, 09:11:15
I think these are closer to what WASD used to sell in terms of hardness - http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051XWXCE/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'd bought these and tried it for a period of time. Didn't like it much as it reduced travel distance too drastically for my taste. Can't compare to those from WASD red/blues as I'd never had the chance to try those.

yep that's the black one i got
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Wed, 20 November 2013, 09:13:02
@CPTBadAss, Thanks for such a detailed review. I need some advice and hope you can help. I have only just bought my first mechanical keyboard - Keycool 87II blue switch. But I have found that I tend to bottom out rather a lot on it and think maybe rings might work better for me.
I have found these rings on eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120pcs-Keycap-Rubber-O-Ring-Switch-Dampeners-RED-For-CHERRY-MX-Free-Shipping-/261268631414?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cd4d2ef76), are these the same as the ones you mention in your last paragraph?
Quote
Red O-Rings
I think these are my favorites. They reduce the travel just a touch so it feels nice and they also soften the impact. Since theyíre not as hard, they have a bit more give and when you type the feel like a little cushion. They REALLY made things quieter; probably most quiet out of the four o-rings/dampeners types I tried. If I were recommend something, these would be it.
I ask because try as I might I cannot understand the measurement system but your explanation sounds like ^these^ reds are exactly what I'm looking for. Thanks again. Lemons.

if you bottom out a  lot and that actually gets IN the way of typing then cherry red is your best bet as opposed to using o rings, just sayin--or you should try green/white, not sure if i understand you correctly--cus, if you cannot change the fact you just want to use slamming force to type and that's your thing, then you have to go with heavier switches, except maybe those heavy switches will instead encourage you to use more force, depending on how much you already use--which is already more than obviously the blue, but there is a slight chance it's smaller than the 85g switches HAHA
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: badugi on Wed, 20 November 2013, 14:35:05
I have a Kinesis Advantage with browns switches, and I got the sampler pack of O-rings from WASD, and tried a lot of different combinations. You can definitely put 2 O-rings on the same key and it reduces the travel.

Here's my memory of things I've tried:
- Black O-rings give you a hard landing. I actually thought that was what I wanted at first, but after typing on them for a while they kinda hurt your fingers from bottoming out on that hard surface, so I switched to the blue ones, and then to the red ones.
- I wanted short-travel at first, and so i tried putting 2 black O-rings on each key, and it worked but again, I didn't end up liking it in practice.
- I actually even put 3 black o-rings on some keys, and it worked too, but it reduced the travel so much that sometimes the key wouldn't even actuate, depending on how hard I bottomed out.

- like @badugi, at first I was naively trying to recreate the feel of the apple laptop keyboard, with the short throw (~1mm!) and hard landing. But in practice, I think that's a waste of effort and my new clear switches feel so nice that I've mostly given up on that pursuit now. But if you want short throw, the best way to do it is Jailhouse Blues. I've tried that on a few keys on another board and like it, but haven't done a whole board to try the real day-long typing experience on it.
- the only exception to the above is that I left the double-black o-rings on a few of the thumb keys, like my "enter" key and I think maybe the space key too, because I tend to really pound down on that enter with my thumb and it feels better to have it have a hard landing than a squishy one.



- between the red and the blue o-ring, my experience is exactly how WASD advertises them -- The blue ones are a little bit more squishy and reduce the travel a little more, and the reds are a little bit less squishy and reduce the travel a little less. Both feel nice, much nicer than the stock switch/cap when you bottom out.
- I ended up using blue o-rings on most keys, and red ones on some of the pinky keys so they have a little longer travel. not sure why but it felt better to me for the pinky keys.

I totally agree with you.  I just received the rings and they feel good with only one ring for each keycap.  I tried to put two, but in practice, it really doesn't feel that great. =\
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: midnight2903 on Thu, 21 November 2013, 02:40:05
IIRC, IMSTO also have black ones that are quite small.
How does those compare to the ones in WASD or the red ones at IMSTO?

http://www.imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=50
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lemontwist on Thu, 21 November 2013, 13:16:45
if you bottom out a  lot and that actually gets IN the way of typing then cherry red is your best bet as opposed to using o rings, just sayin--or you should try green/white, not sure if i understand you correctly--cus, if you cannot change the fact you just want to use slamming force to type and that's your thing, then you have to go with heavier switches, except maybe those heavy switches will instead encourage you to use more force, depending on how much you already use--which is already more than obviously the blue, but there is a slight chance it's smaller than the 85g switches HAHA

Lyrill, I'm sure you are correct. I need to work on my technique, mechanicals are new to me and I'm obviously a little heavy handed. That's why I'm thinking the 40LA's will be good for me. I think that, because the 40L-A's are so small they will have less effect on the actuation but dampen the clack. Sometimes, not often, I hear the echo of metal. Can't say I like that either. I intend to place a soft rubber mat under the pcb in the hopes that helps a little too. But at this stage there is no way I can swap switches as I bought the board from China and sending it back from the UK just isn't worth it. That's why I thought to ask to CPTBadAss=btw thanks for your help.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: riotonthebay on Mon, 02 December 2013, 10:09:33
Thanks for the great review on these various options!

I just installed the black dampeners on top of browns, under thick PBT caps. I've only been typing on it for a few hours, but these are my initial impressions:

- Sound reduction: I don't tend to bottom out much and browns are already relatively quiet, but there is still a noticeable reduction in sound – likely the lack of periodic clacks from bottoming out.

- Travel: There's a small but noticeable reduction in key travel. I'm not sure how I feel about this yet. As I mentioned, I didn't feel like I bottomed out much before, but now it almost feels like I do it more often. I likely just need time to get used to the new travel distance.

- Feel: Bottoming out is definitely softer, but I don't love the change quite yet. The keys feel a bit mushy, which was definitely not a feeling I had before and not one that I particularly enjoy.

I'll post again if these opinions change after using the board with these for a few days. :)

Edit: Day 2 and I'm definitely more positive on these. I've gotten used to the softer landing and the reduced travel, and I no longer feel that they're overly mushy.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lammie on Wed, 25 December 2013, 06:13:53
No. I never thought of it since I didn't want to dampen the sound anymore. I also don't have o-rings anymore so the only experiment I could do is with soft landing pads.

Ok just curious! I just received a board with greens now so maybe I just need to do my own experimenting!


Hi, I'm new here. Great discussion! Just bought a new CMStorm XT with Green switches. I find the travel is a bit too long and the bottoming out sound is a bit annoying. Wonder what customization will be best for Greens. Can't decide between the red or blue o-rings. Many seem to favor the red o-rings. Cause the Greens are very similar to the Blue's, maybe no O-ring at all and go for a dampener? What is your advise on the Greens? tnx
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: terran5992 on Wed, 25 December 2013, 07:58:04
No. I never thought of it since I didn't want to dampen the sound anymore. I also don't have o-rings anymore so the only experiment I could do is with soft landing pads.

Ok just curious! I just received a board with greens now so maybe I just need to do my own experimenting!


Hi, I'm new here. Great discussion! Just bought a new CMStorm XT with Green switches. I find the travel is a bit too long and the bottoming out sound is a bit annoying. Wonder what customization will be best for Greens. Can't decide between the red or blue o-rings. Many seem to favor the red o-rings. Cause the Greens are very similar to the Blue's, maybe no O-ring at all and go for a dampener? What is your advise on the Greens? tnx

I would say go with red o-rings if you absolutely have to
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 07 January 2014, 08:22:23
Lammie, I'd suggest the dampeners/soft landing pads. At this point, I really dislike the travel reduction that o-rings give. I think it's too much. But maybe that's what you're looking for.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Sifo on Tue, 07 January 2014, 20:59:59
Man I remember when I gave these to you and you were just some random scrub looking for free stuff... not much has changed. Who are you again?

<3
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 07 January 2014, 21:00:50
Sifo can I have a free keyboard to go with my dampeners and o-rings? <3
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Sifo on Tue, 07 January 2014, 21:03:25
wow sure thing here's a legendary 1 of a kind korean custom tenkeyless dt-35

(http://cfile26.uf.tistory.com/image/112D61414E05EFD131C3C2)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 07 January 2014, 21:04:02
Wait, but I really do want a DT-35 T_T
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 10 January 2014, 10:14:47
Swill has posted (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53174.msg1186392#msg1186392) some numbers on travel distance and keycaps. It's great info and I think might help compliment this review. Shoutouts to swill for that keyboard science :D.

Hope you don't mind me referencing your post swill ^__^.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: luminor on Mon, 20 January 2014, 08:43:56
just ordered 40A-L from WASD for my brown
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: geniekid on Wed, 19 February 2014, 22:03:45
I've tried all 5 dampeners mentioned in the review and I agree completely with CPTBadAss.  Red O-rings and grey landing pads are the most comfortable.  Even on MX Red keys where there isn't tactile feedback during actuation the blue rings still felt too large.  However, one thing I recommend is using a heavier dampener (blue O-ring or black landing pad) for the space bar since 1) it tends to be hit harder and 2) hitting the key from the side with your thumbs makes the loss in actuation distance much less noticeable.  For reference, I've tested all 5 dampeners on a QFR MX Red with OEM profile caps from WASD.

FYI, I still prefer the sound and feel of my HHKB Type-S as far as typing is concerned.  I don't know about noise in terms of volume, but the muffled thock of a silenced Topre switch is just less jarring than a dampened MX Red.  I'm not sure if there's a difference between the quiet versions of the HHKB vs the RealForce.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Melvang on Wed, 19 February 2014, 22:12:13
CPT, have you thought about trying out the sorbothane dampers that mkawa is working on?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jacobolus on Thu, 20 February 2014, 00:41:30
Also, has anyone tried any various types of dampeners on Alps switches (other than the ones built in to dampened switches)? Iím curious how well some sorbothane cut to the right shape would work there, too.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Thu, 20 February 2014, 08:09:31
Also, has anyone tried any various types of dampeners on Alps switches (other than the ones built in to dampened switches)? Iím curious how well some sorbothane cut to the right shape would work there, too.

I haven't but I still have some soft landing pads I can test on some of the Alps boards I have.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: ideus on Tue, 25 February 2014, 20:57:43
just ordered 40A-L from WASD for my brown

I am going to try mines on my Leo 66 with browns as well.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Hordak on Tue, 11 March 2014, 15:27:25
Anyone know which kind these Filco o-rings are?

http://www.keyboardco.com/product/o-ring-switch-dampeners-for-filco-keyboards.asp
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Thu, 13 March 2014, 08:25:52
I've tried all 5 dampeners mentioned in the review and I agree completely with CPTBadAss.  Red O-rings and grey landing pads are the most comfortable.  Even on MX Red keys where there isn't tactile feedback during actuation the blue rings still felt too large.  However, one thing I recommend is using a heavier dampener (blue O-ring or black landing pad) for the space bar since 1) it tends to be hit harder and 2) hitting the key from the side with your thumbs makes the loss in actuation distance much less noticeable.  For reference, I've tested all 5 dampeners on a QFR MX Red with OEM profile caps from WASD.

FYI, I still prefer the sound and feel of my HHKB Type-S as far as typing is concerned.  I don't know about noise in terms of volume, but the muffled thock of a silenced Topre switch is just less jarring than a dampened MX Red.  I'm not sure if there's a difference between the quiet versions of the HHKB vs the RealForce.

ya u tried all 5 but how about double red?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: lyrill on Thu, 13 March 2014, 08:32:32
cptbadass, that link,

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53174.msg1186392#msg1186392

i don't get it.

did he use wasd stuff? the red and white looks like they are obviously not wasd, so I don't know why he would exclude the obvious best o ring choice and conclude about what to use as far as whatever keycap you have for anyone wanting to get orings

as far as I am concerned, I have abs and pbt keycaps, and I find the wobby to be a bit too much on the pbt, but almost the same as abs anyways. I am using double red and I have been since I bought orings. blues and blacks remain collector items, just like my keyboards that aren't cherry red, but not saying I will never change.

it's interesting cus his conclusiion is suggesting that maybe I should use red on pbt and blue/black on abs, but my experience says the opposite. Yeah I am using double, but I don't feel wobby on abs.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Txduck on Tue, 18 March 2014, 04:54:52
I'm new to the forum and fairly new to mechanical kbs. I have a new Ducky 9008S3 coming in a couple days and I'm wondering if being backlit will interfere with O-rings.....anybody know if the position of the LED's will present a problem?
I hope it won't be a problem. I ordered the red o-rings from WASD.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 18 March 2014, 07:42:09
Anyone know which kind these Filco o-rings are?

http://www.keyboardco.com/product/o-ring-switch-dampeners-for-filco-keyboards.asp

I'm not sure what you're asking, could you clarify?

cptbadass, that link,

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53174.msg1186392#msg1186392

i don't get it.

did he use wasd stuff? the red and white looks like they are obviously not wasd, so I don't know why he would exclude the obvious best o ring choice and conclude about what to use as far as whatever keycap you have for anyone wanting to get orings

as far as I am concerned, I have abs and pbt keycaps, and I find the wobby to be a bit too much on the pbt, but almost the same as abs anyways. I am using double red and I have been since I bought orings. blues and blacks remain collector items, just like my keyboards that aren't cherry red, but not saying I will never change.

it's interesting cus his conclusiion is suggesting that maybe I should use red on pbt and blue/black on abs, but my experience says the opposite. Yeah I am using double, but I don't feel wobby on abs.

Why don't you ask him? I'm not the one that made the post. Also he states where he got his o-rings from. And if you're happy with your experience and the o-rings you have, there's no need to change. Trust your own findings since that will work best for you.

I'm new to the forum and fairly new to mechanical kbs. I have a new Ducky 9008S3 coming in a couple days and I'm wondering if being backlit will interfere with O-rings.....anybody know if the position of the LED's will present a problem?
I hope it won't be a problem. I ordered the red o-rings from WASD.

It won't be a problem.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Txduck on Wed, 19 March 2014, 00:54:58
Thank you very much CPTBadAss, that's a relief. I've been searching for a post that would deal specifically with that and I couldn't find one. I really want to try O-rings, mostly for the cushion.
Thanks again.   :D

BTW, really great thread/review on the O-rings!  :thumb:
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Wed, 19 March 2014, 08:14:43
You're welcome and thanks for the kind words.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Txduck on Thu, 20 March 2014, 06:47:17
You're welcome and thanks for the kind words.


Well CPT I installed the red 40A O-rings from WASD and all I can say is What a difference! First, they really quieted the clack from bottoming out. I have mx blues and I like the little click from them, but the clack from bottoming out was kind of obnoxious, and the O-rings got rid of that.
What's equally important to me is the O-rings provide an effective cushion from bottoming out, makes it easier on the fingers.
I'm impressed. I'll be using O-rings from now on.
Thanks again CPT.  :thumb:
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: ideus on Thu, 20 March 2014, 10:10:43
You're welcome and thanks for the kind words.


Well CPT I installed the red 40A O-rings from WASD and all I can say is What a difference! First, they really quieted the clack from bottoming out. I have mx blues and I like the little click from them, but the clack from bottoming out was kind of obnoxious, and the O-rings got rid of that.
What's equally important to me is the O-rings provide a very effective cushion from bottoming out.
I'm impressed. I'll be using O-rings from now on.
Thanks again CPT.  :thumb:


I have some o-rings like these also, I have tried them but I prefer the un-moded keyboard. I may give them a try this weekend again.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: davkol on Sat, 22 March 2014, 06:17:25
I thought I had posted here... apparently not in actuality though.

First of all, there are plenty of industrial o-rings. Most of them are too hard and don't fit Cherry MX keycaps properly. Don't bother with those.

Second, I tried WASD o-rings with Cherry MX Red and Cherry keycaps, but didn't like shorter travel of their black 50A o-rings, nor the mushy landing of red/blue 40A o-rings (I couldn't tell the difference between these two types either).

Finally, EK's black soft-landing pads do fit ALPS and they make MX Blue and complicated white ALPS tolerable for me, because I hate harsh bottoming out, but can't stop the key stroke right after the sharp force peak of those switches.

BTW dampening Cherry ML is kinda hopeless, due to their short travel (dampeners would have to be very thin).
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jacobolus on Mon, 24 March 2014, 19:07:32
Does anyone know what material is used in EKís landing pads?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 24 March 2014, 19:10:24
Does anyone know what material is used in EKís landing pads?

I think it's some sort of foam, not a rubber. But I couldn't tell you for sure what it is.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: swill on Mon, 24 March 2014, 22:36:13
Swill has posted (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53174.msg1186392#msg1186392) some numbers on travel distance and keycaps. It's great info and I think might help compliment this review. Shoutouts to swill for that keyboard science :D.

Hope you don't mind me referencing your post swill ^__^.

Not at all. That info is hard to find on here so it makes sense to link it. I have a few posts in that thread which should help people who are in the dampener market.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Razor Lotus on Tue, 01 April 2014, 12:50:47
So i ordered a bunch of thick O-rings from Imsto: http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

I just got them today and tried them on. I'm somewhat disappointed. They do feel a little hard, not as squishy as the WASD O-rings. There is still that slight sharpness of sound when you bottom out.

But the major downside is the reduction in travel distance. They reduce travel distance by abit too much I think. Some of my keys don't actuate properly after having them.

I did a test by putting about 10 keys with the O-rings on the board and opened up a blank document and pressed each key 10 times with vs without O rings. And without O rings were much more consistent. Having the O rings reduced the consistency of actuation by 2-3 actuations every 10 presses.

I tried different types of presses as well, like hard pressing when I'm gaming, or just lightly pressing when we type some letters that our fingers don't emphasize so much on. Both were rather inconsistent but pressing harder did give abit more consistency when the contact points start to touch abit.

I made sure the O-rings were put properly and I used a guitar pick to press them all the way in. They do stand out a noticable bit higher than the other keys without the O-rings, which is expected considering how thick they are.

I am rather disappointed with this purchase. Or maybe I'm not using them correctly. I'm using a non backlit KBT pure with stock keycaps

Mod Edit: please do not try to sell things outside of the Marketplace section.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: swill on Tue, 01 April 2014, 16:20:29
So i ordered a bunch of thick O-rings from Imsto: http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78

I just got them today and tried them on. I'm somewhat disappointed. They do feel a little hard, not as squishy as the WASD O-rings. There is still that slight sharpness of sound when you bottom out.

But the major downside is the reduction in travel distance. They reduce travel distance by abit too much I think. Some of my keys don't actuate properly after having them.

I did a test by putting about 10 keys with the O-rings on the board and opened up a blank document and pressed each key 10 times with vs without O rings. And without O rings were much more consistent. Having the O rings reduced the consistency of actuation by 2-3 actuations every 10 presses.

I tried different types of presses as well, like hard pressing when I'm gaming, or just lightly pressing when we type some letters that our fingers don't emphasize so much on. Both were rather inconsistent but pressing harder did give abit more consistency when the contact points start to touch abit.

I made sure the O-rings were put properly and I used a guitar pick to press them all the way in. They do stand out a noticable bit higher than the other keys without the O-rings, which is expected considering how thick they are.

I am rather disappointed with this purchase. Or maybe I'm not using them correctly. I'm using a non backlit KBT pure with stock keycaps

[snip]

If you have a caliper, could you measure the thickness of them for me?

I think his thick o-rings are designed for OEM caps. Are you using oem or cherry profile caps? If you are using cherry profile, this is probably an expected result. I have his small o-rings and they are great for cherry profile caps.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Razor Lotus on Tue, 01 April 2014, 19:38:54
If you have a caliper, could you measure the thickness of them for me?

I think his thick o-rings are designed for OEM caps. Are you using oem or cherry profile caps? If you are using cherry profile, this is probably an expected result. I have his small o-rings and they are great for cherry profile caps.

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=33413.0

they're the big ones used here. At the bottom of the thread there's a picture showing. I think they're about 2.5mm thick as mentioned in the thread.

Is there a way to tell if the KBT pure (Non-pro) comes with the cherry or OEM profile?

Does this happen often?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 01 April 2014, 19:40:31
they're the big ones used here. At the bottom of the thread there's a picture showing. I think they're about 2.5mm thick as mentioned in the thread.

Is there a way to tell if the KBT pure (Non-pro) comes with the cherry or OEM profile?

Does this happen often?

Not sure if I've ever heard of anyone having your problem. It comes with OEM profile. I have that board.

Don't advertise selling things outside of the Classifieds.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: ideus on Tue, 01 April 2014, 19:57:57
So i ordered a bunch of thick O-rings from Imsto: http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78 (http://imsto.cn/index.php?route=product/product&path=61&product_id=78)

I just got them today and tried them on. I'm somewhat disappointed. They do feel a little hard, not as squishy as the WASD O-rings. There is still that slight sharpness of sound when you bottom out.

But the major downside is the reduction in travel distance. They reduce travel distance by abit too much I think. Some of my keys don't actuate properly after having them.

I did a test by putting about 10 keys with the O-rings on the board and opened up a blank document and pressed each key 10 times with vs without O rings. And without O rings were much more consistent. Having the O rings reduced the consistency of actuation by 2-3 actuations every 10 presses.

I tried different types of presses as well, like hard pressing when I'm gaming, or just lightly pressing when we type some letters that our fingers don't emphasize so much on. Both were rather inconsistent but pressing harder did give abit more consistency when the contact points start to touch abit.

I made sure the O-rings were put properly and I used a guitar pick to press them all the way in. They do stand out a noticable bit higher than the other keys without the O-rings, which is expected considering how thick they are.

I am rather disappointed with this purchase. Or maybe I'm not using them correctly. I'm using a non backlit KBT pure with stock keycaps
[snip]

If you have a caliper, could you measure the thickness of them for me?

I think his thick o-rings are designed for OEM caps. Are you using oem or cherry profile caps? If you are using cherry profile, this is probably an expected result. I have his small o-rings and they are great for cherry profile caps.


I think I read somewhere that these fat o-rings cannot be used with DSA or thick cherry caps. Is that true?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Tue, 01 April 2014, 19:59:44
I think I read somewhere that these fat o-rings cannot be used with DSA or thick cherry caps. Is that true?

I've heard people having issues with the thick cherry caps. I haven't had any issue myself. And I don't know about DSA.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: swill on Tue, 01 April 2014, 20:43:56
Those things are huge. By my calculations you need an o-ring that is <=2.1mm thick to not interfere with the switch functionality with OEM caps. With cherry the o-rings need to be <=1.75mm to not interfere with the switch functionality. I personally use 1.45mm (imsto small) o-rings with thick cherry profile caps and it is pretty much perfect.

Sorry you got o-rings that are not going to work for you. :(
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Razor Lotus on Wed, 02 April 2014, 08:12:21

Don't advertise selling things outside of the Classifieds.

???????????????????????????????
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: O-Ring on Mon, 28 April 2014, 08:55:31
What O-Ring i need for a CM Storm QuickFire XT - CHERRY MX Brown (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EQV0W02) and Corsair Vengeance K70 - Cherry MX Red (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CD1FC6G)?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 28 April 2014, 08:59:34
What O-Ring i need for a CM Storm QuickFire XT - CHERRY MX Brown (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EQV0W02) and Corsair Vengeance K70 - Cherry MX Red (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CD1FC6G)?

What are you looking for in your o-rings?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: O-Ring on Mon, 28 April 2014, 09:09:49
I do not know, that you can recommend me the best, since you have more experience.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 28 April 2014, 09:13:34
There's no "best" one. If there was, all o-ring users would use the same one right?

Again, it depends on what you're looking for. Do you like a soft landing? A hard landing? Do you want a shortened travel distance? Or minimal travel distance reduction? Do you have a budget? Your location can play a factor in what you can get.

I can't make a recommendation until you have an idea as to what you'd like from your o-rings.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: davkol on Mon, 28 April 2014, 09:33:11
What O-Ring i need for a CM Storm QuickFire XT - CHERRY MX Brown (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00EQV0W02) and Corsair Vengeance K70 - Cherry MX Red (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CD1FC6G)?
I do not know, that you can recommend me the best, since you have more experience.
Hmmm, RTFA?

Apart from this review, swill's measurements (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53174) are particularly helpful.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: O-Ring on Mon, 28 April 2014, 09:40:29
1. Soft/Hard landing (i don't care, that feels best for you, since you tested the 2)
2. Minimal travel distance reduction (I do not want to feel like a laptop keyboard)
3. Reduce sound
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 28 April 2014, 09:44:12
I cover the landing feelings in the OP. Please reread that. I prefer the 40A .2cm thick o-rings. However, since you don't want any travel reduction, you won't like o-rings so I'd go for the soft-landing pads/dampeners from EliteKeyboards. Again, I cover how the soft landing pads feel in the OP. To further reduce sound, put shelf liner in both keyboards and place the keyboards on something like a mousepad or a towel.

Question: Soft is same to Membrane landing and Hard is same to Mechanical landing?

1. Soft/Hard landing (i don't care, that feels best for you, since you tested the 2)

If you don't care, why ask about it then?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: O-Ring on Mon, 28 April 2014, 09:52:23
I never said don't want any travel reduction. Only that I do not want to feel like a laptop keyboard.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 28 April 2014, 10:03:35
I stand by my recommendation I posted above. With o-rings installed, the switches feel closer to scissor switches in terms of travel to me. Landing pads have the least amount of travel reduction.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: iLLucionist on Mon, 28 April 2014, 10:17:49
Anyone know which kind these Filco o-rings are?

http://www.keyboardco.com/product/o-ring-switch-dampeners-for-filco-keyboards.asp

I actually just bought a pair on these and put them on my caps this weekend. I am also wondering what the exact specs are but on the site it says "height: 2mm" and 5mm for the rest. So if what reduces the travel, is the height, it would be 0.2cm or "L". But I'm not sure.

These are my first o-rings, so I have no idea how to tell you how stiff they are. It feels like the actuation force increased a little bit, but not much (I have Browns). They dampen the bottoming out a lot and also the mechanical higher pitches sounds a lot. They make my keycaps sound a lot lower than without o-rings.

Overall, I quite like them. But if they are indeed 0.2, I am wondering how 0.4 feels.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: iLLucionist on Mon, 28 April 2014, 10:18:56
Is it able to use both o-rings and pad dampeners? And where can I (in the EU) buy pad dampeners? Would it make a noticeable difference in feel and sound?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: O-Ring on Mon, 28 April 2014, 10:51:21
I like O-Ring ;)

Which of these do you recommend?: 40A-L - 2 mm (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AZQ3966) or 40A-R - 4 mm (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AZQ2OF8) or 50A - 4 mm (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00E4MYDTY) or other.

I'm new to the mechanical scene and wanted to get a better idea how the O rings will feel and found this interesting reference on a site:

Duro 20A = Rubber Band
Duro 40A = Pencil Eraser
Duro 60A = Car Tire Tread
Duro 70A* = Running Shoe Sole
Duro 80A = Leather Belt
Duro 100A = Shopping Cart Wheel

Edit: Better yet, here's a chart:

Show Image
(http://www.allsealsinc.com/durometer.gif)




Answer:
Red O-Rings
I think these are my favorites. They reduce the travel just a touch so it feels nice and they also soften the impact. Since theyíre not as hard, they have a bit more give and when you type the feel like a little cushion. They REALLY made things quieter; probably most quiet out of the four o-rings/dampeners types I tried. If I were recommend something, these would be it.

I prefer the 40A-L .2cm thick O-Rings.
I cover how the soft landing pads feel in the OP. To further reduce sound, put shelf liner in both keyboards and place the keyboards on something like a mousepad or a towel.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: O-Ring on Mon, 28 April 2014, 11:06:42
Last question:
Can i use this 40A-L - 2 mm (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AZQ3966) in both keyboards? Link (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40227.msg1310661#msg1310661)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Mon, 28 April 2014, 11:15:42
Last question:
Can i use this 40A-L - 2 mm (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00AZQ3966) in both keyboards? Link (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40227.msg1310661#msg1310661)

Yes. And besides this review, there's another thread (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53990.0) that might help you.

Is it able to use both o-rings and pad dampeners? And where can I (in the EU) buy pad dampeners? Would it make a noticeable difference in feel and sound?

I think there's enough room to do it. I'm not sure if anyone carries the pad dampeners besides Elitekeyboards. You can also try making them like o2dazone (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40582.0) did.

Overall, I quite like them. But if they are indeed 0.2, I am wondering how 0.4 feels.

There's accounts on some earlier pages in this thread about stacking two .2cm thick o-rings. I personally wouldn't like that much travel reduction so I haven't tried it but it's definitely possible.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: O-Ring on Mon, 28 April 2014, 11:17:44
Thank you for your help.

God bless you. Amen  :)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: mkawa on Mon, 28 April 2014, 16:16:56
wasd also carries an o-ring sampler on their site. might want to check it out! http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/sampler-kit/wasd-sampler-kit.html#ad-image-0

oops, out of stock right now, but should be back in stock soonish; i ordered this pretty recently. i suspect it's just a matter of packing the kits into baggies.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Wed, 30 April 2014, 18:26:24
1. Soft/Hard landing (i don't care, that feels best for you, since you tested the 2)
2. Minimal travel distance reduction (I do not want to feel like a laptop keyboard)
3. Reduce sound

My recommendation is the WASD 40A-L

I stand by my recommendation I posted above. With o-rings installed, the switches feel closer to scissor switches in terms of travel to me. Landing pads have the least amount of travel reduction.


I would like to expand on this. Soft landing pads engage earlier than o-rings from what I remember (it's been some time since I tried them). They don't reduce travel so much because they are softer than o-rings and you can squish them completely... but I found that the totally free key travel before any dampening occurs, is actually less with the landing pads.

For me they are too soft (even the firm ones are less than 30A durometer I *think*) and I cannot easily feel when the key bottomed out, which is an important part of tactile feedback you expect from a keyboard.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jacobolus on Fri, 02 May 2014, 11:15:20
For me [landing pads] are too soft (even the firm ones are less than 30A durometer I *think*) and I cannot easily feel when the key bottomed out, which is an important part of tactile feedback you expect from a keyboard.
I think feeling the bottom out is entirely unnecessary, assuming thereís a sufficient force drop at the tactile/actuation point, and enough post-actuation travel. This may be impossible with Cherry MX switches in general, of which even the ďtactileĒ varieties might better be described as ďlinear with a little speed bumpĒ, but for real tactile switches (e.g. buckling springs, Alps, space invaders, SMK, etc.), Iíd personally prefer to have force keep increasing as the key depresses, but no point at which it hard stops, on a typical keypress.

Maybe thatís just me though.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Fri, 02 May 2014, 13:04:49
Iíd personally prefer to have force keep increasing as the key depresses, but no point at which it hard stops, on a typical keypress.

That increasing force thing sounds like cherry MY ...
I get your point and we all need to try to float keys and not bottom out, but bottoming out is inevitable and the tactile stop helps us back off. I honestly found myself pushing the keys much harder especially with the black soft landing pads.

What also helps avoid bottoming out is audible feedback, either from clicky switch designs or electronic means (such as the piezo buzzer on the Kinesis Advantage or my similar ergodox mod - see my sig for that).
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lpwl on Fri, 04 July 2014, 08:14:37
I'm living in Europe and buying those WASD or Max Keyboard O-rings is too expensive for me to be able to conduct some tests ! Shipping cost is around $7 ... roughly half the price of the product, not cool at all :(

After some research, I was able to buy some o-rings directly from manufacturers in China. It took some time to come to me, but once there, I was glad to have the choice between several different thicknesses and hardness.


Here are the ones I've tried :

(http://i.imgur.com/FJ62Ff3.jpg)

Moar info :

A few comments :

I will not go much more into detail about my opinion.

There has been a lot of talk about o-rings (which are strictly equivalent to those I bought) and probably much more comprehensive than what I could offer.

CPTBadAss has done a great job by centralizing information on this compendium (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53990.0).



I also made a video (http://youtu.be/r9TUa_az9rI) yesterday trying to highlight the sound dampening and key travel reduction with some of those O-rings on Cherry MX Black / Red / Blue / Brown / Green switches.

(http://i.imgur.com/8WlyEL2.jpg)

Maybe this can bring some information - feel free to give me your opinion.


EDIT : Fixed some info.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: davkol on Fri, 04 July 2014, 08:41:26
Could you specify what kind of keycaps you used? Profile/height and crossbars matter.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: CPTBadAss on Fri, 04 July 2014, 08:43:37
Those keycaps look like they have cross bars in them so the o-rings sit properly. In the video, it looks like Lpwl is using the QWERKeys V1 tester with those clear OEM caps.

Thanks for sharing Lpwl! The video and pictures are great ^__^
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: swill on Fri, 04 July 2014, 10:47:11
I'm living in Europe and buying those WASD or Max Keyboard O-rings is too expensive for me to be able to conduct some tests ! Shipping cost is around $7 ... roughly half the price of the product, not cool at all :(

After some research, I was able to buy some o-rings directly from manufacturers in China. It took some time to come to me, but once there, I was glad to have the choice between several different thicknesses and hardness.


Here are the ones I've tried:

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/FJ62Ff3.jpg)


Moar info :
  • "Slim" O-rings : 5mm (ID) 8mm (OD) 1.5mm (CS)
  • "Fat" O-rings : 5mm (ID) 10mm (OD) 2.4mm (CS)

A few comments :
  • 40A "Fat" O-rings combined with Cherry MX Clear switches seem to be the best for me. The travel distance of the keys is now really reduced without hurting the "feeling" produced by the switches !
  • I was worried about the LED backlighting but it turns out that there is still enough light reaching the legends of my keys, even with the thicker o-rings.

I will not go much more into detail about my opinion.

There has been a lot of talk about o-rings (which are strictly equivalent to those I bought) and probably much more comprehensive than what I could offer.

CPTBadAss has done a great job by centralizing information on this compendium (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53990.0).



I made a video (http://youtu.be/r9TUa_az9rI) yesterday comparing the sound dampening and key travel reduction on the following switches : Cherry MX Black / Red / Blue / Brown / Green.

Show Image
(http://i.imgur.com/8WlyEL2.jpg)


Maybe this can bring some information - feel free to give me your opinion.

That is what I found as well. 40A slim on cherry profile is the most comfortable oring I have tried.

These are basically the same as the IMSTO small orings.

I have not done many tests with oem yet.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: swill on Fri, 04 July 2014, 10:47:58
Could you specify what kind of keycaps you used? Profile/height and crossbars matter.

He specified Cherry.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: davkol on Fri, 04 July 2014, 11:28:05
Could you specify what kind of keycaps you used? Profile/height and crossbars matter.

He specified Cherry.
Where? I see no such thing in the postóthat's why I asked. There's only the switch tester in a picture/video, but I don't think it's something I'd expect people to type on.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lpwl on Fri, 04 July 2014, 13:52:49
Those keycaps look like they have cross bars in them so the o-rings sit properly. In the video, it looks like Lpwl is using the QWERKeys V1 tester with those clear OEM caps.

Thanks for sharing Lpwl! The video and pictures are great ^__^

Nice catch CPTBadAss !

I used this QWERkeys switch tester bought from Massdrop (https://www.massdrop.com/buy/qwerkeys?mode=guest_open).

Could you specify what kind of keycaps you used? Profile/height and crossbars matter.

About those clear keycaps (seen on my video) :

(http://i.imgur.com/bcVYJyw.jpg)


EDIT : Fixed some info.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: swill on Fri, 04 July 2014, 20:47:45
Could you specify what kind of keycaps you used? Profile/height and crossbars matter.

He specified Cherry.
Where? I see no such thing in the postóthat's why I asked. There's only the switch tester in a picture/video, but I don't think it's something I'd expect people to type on.

My bad I read it wrong.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lpwl on Sun, 06 July 2014, 11:54:28
The thing is ... I didn't pay enough attention to the keycaps used in my tests (material / profile / thickness ...) and I realize now that I was wrong.

I justed fix it on my previous posts.

Thank you davkol for putting me on the right path !


EDIT : and thank you - swill - for your valuable information (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=53174.msg1258395#msg1258395) regarding this.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Kblavkalash on Sun, 27 July 2014, 02:10:15
I just received both 40A-L red and 40A-R o-rings, and tried all possible combinations on both of my KBC Poker II with cherry mx red and Filco Majestouch with cherry mx blue switches.

Surprisingly blue switches feel amazing with thicker 40A-R blue o-rings, cause all you can hear is that clicky sound without any bottoming out.

For red switches, I am little bit undecided, but currently I am using both blue and red o-rings combined. Most will say it's overkill, but I really like the feeling, because it's so light, I just barely need to touch key and it activates. So far this combination is my favorite.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lpwl on Sun, 27 July 2014, 02:17:28
I just received both 40A-L red and 40A-R o-rings, and tried all possible combinations on both of my KBC Poker II with cherry mx red and Filco Majestouch with cherry mx blue switches.

Surprisingly blue switches feel amazing with thicker 40A-R blue o-rings, cause all you can hear is that clicky sound without any bottoming out.

For red switches, I am little bit undecided, but currently I am using both blue and red o-rings combined. Most will say it's overkill, but I really like the feeling, because it's so light, I just barely need to touch key and it activates. So far this combination is my favorite.

Like I said before, some thicker O-rings (simple or doubled) is something that everyone should try !

I'm loving my "fat" O-rings with Cherry MX Clear.

Maybe you could send some you have left to swill (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=34585.msg1409903#msg1409903) ? He is trying to "write a comprehensive guide to outline the different o-rings that are available and how they compare against each other".
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Kblavkalash on Sun, 27 July 2014, 02:23:17
I just received both 40A-L red and 40A-R o-rings, and tried all possible combinations on both of my KBC Poker II with cherry mx red and Filco Majestouch with cherry mx blue switches.

Surprisingly blue switches feel amazing with thicker 40A-R blue o-rings, cause all you can hear is that clicky sound without any bottoming out.

For red switches, I am little bit undecided, but currently I am using both blue and red o-rings combined. Most will say it's overkill, but I really like the feeling, because it's so light, I just barely need to touch key and it activates. So far this combination is my favorite.

Like I said before, some thicker O-rings (simple or doubled) is something that everyone should try !

I'm loving my "fat" O-rings with Cherry MX Clear.

Maybe you could send some you have left to swill (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=34585.msg1409903#msg1409903) ? He is trying to "write a comprehensive guide to outline the different o-rings that are available and how they compare against each other".

I never tried mx browns, and that's my current goal now, wonder how o-rings will feel with that in comparison to red switches :)

Swill is in Canada, I am in Netherlands, do you think it's worth it sending some rings to other side of the world?
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lpwl on Sun, 27 July 2014, 02:28:23
I just received both 40A-L red and 40A-R o-rings, and tried all possible combinations on both of my KBC Poker II with cherry mx red and Filco Majestouch with cherry mx blue switches.

Surprisingly blue switches feel amazing with thicker 40A-R blue o-rings, cause all you can hear is that clicky sound without any bottoming out.

For red switches, I am little bit undecided, but currently I am using both blue and red o-rings combined. Most will say it's overkill, but I really like the feeling, because it's so light, I just barely need to touch key and it activates. So far this combination is my favorite.

Like I said before, some thicker O-rings (simple or doubled) is something that everyone should try !

I'm loving my "fat" O-rings with Cherry MX Clear.

Maybe you could send some you have left to swill (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=34585.msg1409903#msg1409903) ? He is trying to "write a comprehensive guide to outline the different o-rings that are available and how they compare against each other".

I never tried mx browns, and that's my current goal now, wonder how o-rings will feel with that in comparison to red switches :)

Swill is in Canada, I am in Netherlands, do you think it's worth it sending some rings to other side of the world?

Totally worth it ! It would help many people.

It cost me around 1Ä to send some leftovers to him (in a simple padded envelope) and I guess that swill would be ok to cover shipping.

Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Kblavkalash on Sun, 27 July 2014, 02:30:45
Totally worth it ! It would help many people.

It cost me around 1Ä to send some leftovers to him (in a simple padded envelope) and I guess that swill would be ok to cover shipping.

Ok, if he does not have 40A-L already I can send :) Blue ones are all used on my keyboards though :D
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: swill on Sun, 27 July 2014, 09:24:52
Totally worth it ! It would help many people.

It cost me around 1Ä to send some leftovers to him (in a simple padded envelope) and I guess that swill would be ok to cover shipping.

Ok, if he does not have 40A-L already I can send :) Blue ones are all used on my keyboards though :D

If they are from WASD, I think noisyturtle is sending me some of those. :)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: madik on Sun, 27 July 2014, 12:42:33
Guys Iam trying to buy some o-rings from Ebay. There is plenty of options but no-one is offering information about hardness of the material. I contacted 4 sellers and only one was able to give me the information (55 - nah). 
I need to go with ebay since I live in europe and the shipping from US is super expensive in comparison with the Free shipping offers from Asia  :thumb: .
Anyway If anyone have some tip on a good Asia Ebay seller with 40 hardness O-rings please tell. Thanks!
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lpwl on Sun, 27 July 2014, 15:17:44
Guys Iam trying to buy some o-rings from Ebay. There is plenty of options but no-one is offering information about hardness of the material. I contacted 4 sellers and only one was able to give me the information (55 - nah). 
I need to go with ebay since I live in europe and the shipping from US is super expensive in comparison with the Free shipping offers from Asia  :thumb: .
Anyway If anyone have some tip on a good Asia Ebay seller with 40 hardness O-rings please tell. Thanks!

You won't find it on Ebay imho. If you want this exact hardness, you should check my Interest Check here (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=60866.0) for 40A O-rings.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: cbot on Thu, 31 July 2014, 10:25:29
One hell of a review, worth the read! Makes me confident in looking at o-rings
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: sordna on Thu, 02 October 2014, 11:00:23
I recently discovered WASD o-rings are also sold on Amazon (free Prime shipping too).
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: telegraphist on Mon, 13 October 2014, 08:12:17
I would argue that the goal of a key-stroke is actuation and time a key takes to travel beyond this point is basically a wasted time. The O-rings, which are more effectively reducing the unneeded excessive key travel are the "thick" O-rings, not the thin ones. Additional benefit those blue "thick" O-rings provide is better cushioning for those of us, who tend to bottom out hard.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: davkol on Mon, 13 October 2014, 09:03:54
I would argue that the goal of a key-stroke is an actuation and time a key takes to travel beyond this point is a wasted time. The O-rings which are effectively reducing the unneeded excessive key travel are "thick" O-rings, not the thin ones. Additional benefit of those blue "thick" O-rings is better cushioning for those of us, who tend to bottom out hard.
You gotta love dem rubberdomes.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Wonko73 on Sat, 18 October 2014, 04:20:43
Hi,

I tried out three different kinds of o-rings: the kbc red ones, the blue ones and the black ones.... all tested on my Filco Minila Air with Cherry MX blues.

The result is very clear for me:

- Red ones are simply great: The sound becomes more solid and they feel really good
- Black ones are very decent, but I think you loose a little bit of feedback from your keys. I like the red ones better.
- Blue ones are terrible for me: They kill the feeling of my keys completely. Keys feel a kind of defect and you don't get any feedback. I would say, keys even feel dead.

Well  - that's only my opinion. I felt the red ones to be the right o-rings for me. The black ones may be fine, too, but the red ones feel a lot better and I can type even faster because of the excellent feedback.
Well... and the blue ones ... anybody needs them? :D
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jacobolus on Sat, 18 October 2014, 04:45:37
I would argue that the goal of a key-stroke is actuation and time a key takes to travel beyond this point is basically a wasted time.
The point of having the stroke continue post-actuation is to allow the typist to reliably actuate the switch at just a little bit more than the force required for actuation; on switches with the actuation at the very bottom of the stroke, especially where there isnít a steep drop in force (ďtactile responseĒ) nearly coincident with the actuation point, itís quite common for typists to get unreliable actuation unless they use dramatically more force than required. Much if not most of the injury to fingers comes from the impact at the bottom of the stroke, so itís a great advantage to have a switch with either enough post-actuation travel or a sharp tactile point at actuation, because this trains the typist to trust that the switch will reliably actuate, and as a result itís possible to use much less force, especially right at the bottom of the stroke.

Quote
Additional benefit of those blue "thick" O-rings is better cushioning for those of us, who tend to bottom out hard.
Bottoming out hard is quite bad for your joints, even with rubber dampers. I recommend trying to train yourself to only use as much force as necessary to actuate the switch. Thereís nothing wrong with pushing the key all the way down, but you definitely should not be slamming it into the bottom.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: telegraphist on Sat, 18 October 2014, 06:40:37
I've tried them all. In my opinion: the blue WASD O-rings are the best of all :thumb:
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Tiramisuu on Sat, 25 October 2014, 10:07:08
I just o-ringed and trampolined my poker 2, browns.   Entirely underwhelmed.   The tone when bottoming out is lowered a hair and it bottoms out just a hair sooner but from a typing feel perspective the difference is neutral.    Not really worth the time or effort of purchasing.

Audibly I think I prefer the click to the thump and I have a fairly light touch when typing so it really makes little difference.

Next try will be ergo clears or alps.   I'd like more feedback in the switch and even less noise.  I may have to try Torpre.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: jacobolus on Mon, 27 October 2014, 17:42:17
Next try will be ergo clears or alps.   I'd like more feedback in the switch and even less noise.  I may have to try Torpre.
Try Matias quiet switches.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Tiramisuu on Mon, 27 October 2014, 20:37:47
Being canadian, shipping a bag of matias switches would probably be quick and shipping wouldn't be painful for a change.

Mostly a matter of finding a decent 60% plate to play with.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: SpiderWaffle on Wed, 06 January 2016, 15:39:31
Big question to anyone that's installed o-rings before. Everyone that has done this installation just mentions removing keycap, putting on o-ring, putting back on key cap. And most will rave about how it noticeably reduced their bottoming out distance. But here's the problem I find with that:

When I go to put the keycap back on, it takes considerably more force to slide the keycap back on all the way (something like 1-3lbs of force I'd estimate based on when you first removed the keycaps and/or when put them back on without o-rings) than the amount of tension in whatever spring you're using (45-80g most likely) So about 10-20 times more force, we can all agree on that right? The spring force is not able to push the keycap back on all the way. So how does this slide the keycap back on all the way? Answer, as far I can tell it doesn't, it never will!! Why, because the O-ring blocks the KEY CAP from moving all the way to the black plastic stationary part of the switch like it would normally without any obstruction, ie the o-ring. Thus, you are never going to push the keycap on all the way. The best you can do is compress the elastic o-ring slightly, this tiny compression distance is the ONLY reduction in bottoming out travel distance you will get. How, far is that tiny distance? I suggest you try compressing an o-ring. For 50a shore hardness you can MAYBE compress half the thickness if you apply tons of force, like the amount of force that could break the plastic key caps and switches, and for 70a it's much much less, it's not a linear scale.

So unless your key caps just fly on and off like butter with 40g of force, the only way to properly install o-rings is to take apart the entire switch and hold the slider in place while you force the keycap back on. The point of this would be to 1. Reduce the travel distance to bottom out, 2. Secure the key caps on fully (big problem with thicker rings), and 3. lower how high the key caps rest relative to the baseplate/main body of the the keyboard, and in turn your desk/wristpad.

Otherwise, your keycaps are resting up higher, about the thickness of the o-ring minus how far you were able to compress it, and your bottom out distance is only reduced by how much you were able to compress the o-ring.

I'm really surprised I've never seen anyone else share this. Don't believe me, try putting on 2 or 3 of the normal 1.5-1.9mm thick o-rings most people get to pronounce the effect more, you probably won't be able to even get the keycap to stay on properly.

If someone has found otherwise, I'd love to know about it, I've considered freezing my keyboard (without caps on) and warming up the key caps to compress the siders and expand the keycaps slighlty and maybe the 45g springs will be enough then. Otherwise I have to desolder, remove, and take apart every switch then force the keycaps on each slider, then put back to together and resolder every switch, but some of the key caps would block the screws from going back in, so ... Seriously no one else in the world has noticed shared this? (I tried but could not find any such results)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Connly33 on Wed, 06 January 2016, 16:10:52
I installed o rings onto my board for the first time, cherry MX blue with just thin o rings, not to reduce travel but to soften the landing of the key, with the steel top plate on my board the bottoming out of each switch is pretty hard, causing my hands to go numb with my wrist issues, with o rings the travel is very slightly reduced, but more importantly its much softer on my wrists, my average typing speed went from 39 WPM to 45 in only 30 minutes of getting used to them, ( i know that's still not very good )  But at least for thin o rings when placing the keycaps back on i used a good amount of force and then repeatedly hit the key and i was able to get the keycap all they way onto the stem as i had noticed the issue SpiderWaffle mention. Id be curious if there is a relatively easy way to get keycaps all the way back on with a thicker/harder O ring without taking apart the switch. Or if there is any point in doing so ? if all keys are on the same o rings i dont see much of a point in getting them all the way onto the stems unless it changes the typing feel.
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: Lpwl on Thu, 07 January 2016, 05:25:19
Big question to anyone that's installed o-rings before. Everyone that has done this installation just mentions removing keycap, putting on o-ring, putting back on key cap. And most will rave about how it noticeably reduced their bottoming out distance. But here's the problem I find with that:

When I go to put the keycap back on, it takes considerably more force to slide the keycap back on all the way (something like 1-3lbs of force I'd estimate based on when you first removed the keycaps and/or when put them back on without o-rings) than the amount of tension in whatever spring you're using (45-80g most likely) So about 10-20 times more force, we can all agree on that right? The spring force is not able to push the keycap back on all the way. So how does this slide the keycap back on all the way? Answer, as far I can tell it doesn't, it never will!! Why, because the O-ring blocks the KEY CAP from moving all the way to the black plastic stationary part of the switch like it would normally without any obstruction, ie the o-ring. Thus, you are never going to push the keycap on all the way. The best you can do is compress the elastic o-ring slightly, this tiny compression distance is the ONLY reduction in bottoming out travel distance you will get. How, far is that tiny distance? I suggest you try compressing an o-ring. For 50a shore hardness you can MAYBE compress half the thickness if you apply tons of force, like the amount of force that could break the plastic key caps and switches, and for 70a it's much much less, it's not a linear scale.

So unless your key caps just fly on and off like butter with 40g of force, the only way to properly install o-rings is to take apart the entire switch and hold the slider in place while you force the keycap back on. The point of this would be to 1. Reduce the travel distance to bottom out, 2. Secure the key caps on fully (big problem with thicker rings), and 3. lower how high the key caps rest relative to the baseplate/main body of the the keyboard, and in turn your desk/wristpad.

Otherwise, your keycaps are resting up higher, about the thickness of the o-ring minus how far you were able to compress it, and your bottom out distance is only reduced by how much you were able to compress the o-ring.

I'm really surprised I've never seen anyone else share this. Don't believe me, try putting on 2 or 3 of the normal 1.5-1.9mm thick o-rings most people get to pronounce the effect more, you probably won't be able to even get the keycap to stay on properly.

If someone has found otherwise, I'd love to know about it, I've considered freezing my keyboard (without caps on) and warming up the key caps to compress the siders and expand the keycaps slighlty and maybe the 45g springs will be enough then. Otherwise I have to desolder, remove, and take apart every switch then force the keycaps on each slider, then put back to together and resolder every switch, but some of the key caps would block the screws from going back in, so ... Seriously no one else in the world has noticed shared this? (I tried but could not find any such results)

Frankly speaking, I have no idea what problem you are having.

A picture says more than a thousand words  ;)
Title: Re: O-Ring and Dampener Reviews
Post by: ideus on Thu, 07 January 2016, 07:54:44
I have tried many sizes and hardness O-rings, the famous trampoline mode with O-ring segments and silicon balls and I do not like them so far. I prefer the nice solid sound of the naked switch mechanisms.