[IC] DSA Scientific (April 10 launch)

[Jkush463]

i feel that looks better,

[lazyfart]

Definitely keen to pick up one of each colourway, deciding has been too hard!

[rumlyne]

Removed some keys from the novelties and added a teal modifier option to the TI-83 kit. Obviously, I am restraining myself on colour because I think it will quickly upset the balance.

Good choice! Also you didn't forget the color in the ortho keysets - great! I like the novelty keys, they aren't over the top but just right.

I once more need to lobby for a norde keyset. *starts lobbying*

For us Europeans it'd be great if you added a mono comma to the numpad or norde keyset.
When it comes to numbers we use commas and points in the exact opposite way to north-americans and brits.
Also most of us grew up with these texas instruments calculators in school and university, sooo... *hinting at untapped market*
Personally prefer the norde sets with only the standard and the shift state printed on since the keys with the third state on tend to look very stuffed imo.
See Mito's Canvas as opposed to Winmix.


Moreover you should post this over on deskthority and keebtalk to reach an even broader audience!

[William_S_Jones]

I ❤️ DSA profile & ❤️ this set!


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[voodoo6k]

Thanks for all the comments.

I've updated the renders to reflect the latest kits.

Poll incoming.

[lazyfart]

Thanks for all the comments.

I've updated the renders to reflect the latest kits.

Poll incoming.

Take my money now! Pls. Also, how goes the vendor hunt? Would love it if you have vendors for Asia.

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[pixelpusher]

Holy smokes, those renders are fantastic.  Can't wait to see these become a reality.

[voodoo6k]

Poll incoming.

Poll is live.

https://www.massdrop.com/vote/DSA-Scientific

PS. Sorry, I didn't add any other kits (norde, extra homing, ergo, etc.) because I didn't take the time to make appropriate 3d models. Nonetheless, I am keeping those options in mind in case this IC grows in popularity.

[lazyfart]

Poll incoming.

Poll is live.

https://www.massdrop.com/vote/DSA-Scientific

PS. Sorry, I didn't add any other kits (norde, extra homing, ergo, etc.) because I didn't take the time to make appropriate 3d models. Nonetheless, I am keeping those options in mind in case this IC grows in popularity.

Voted! Unfortunately only 3 votes are allowed, but hopefully the child kits will still go through, love all the kits shown so far!

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[rumlyne]

We're already at 32 votes - this is gonna be good 

[dr_unconscionable]

Great-looking sets, been following this for a little while. I love the teal in the new renders! Any chance of standalone ortho / ergodox kits? This set seems made for ortho/split keyboards, and the standalone kits are getting more and more common in GBs now.

Also, as far as GB goes, as a fellow Canadian I would love to have the option of shipping within Canada! Paying duties on top of shipping is such a downer....

[voodoo6k]

Great-looking sets, been following this for a little while. I love the teal in the new renders! Any chance of standalone ortho / ergodox kits? This set seems made for ortho/split keyboards, and the standalone kits are getting more and more common in GBs now.

I think this is the number one complaint; the need for a standalone ortho option OR separate alphas / modifiers kits (which I am less fond of).

Also, as far as GB goes, as a fellow Canadian I would love to have the option of shipping within Canada! Paying duties on top of shipping is such a downer....

This. No import duties for Canadians. Keep in mind that you still have to pay corresponding provincial tax and domestic shipping.

[jtallbean]

perhaps there could be a way to combine the ducky, ti-83, and novelties kit into one larger one.  also adding a 'C' key to one of those kits?  there appears to be an 'AC' but no 'C'

[voodoo6k]

perhaps there could be a way to combine the ducky, ti-83, and novelties kit into one larger one.  also adding a 'C' key to one of those kits?  there appears to be an 'AC' but no 'C'

There may be some sort of combination happening; it will depend on pricing (waiting). The Pocket kit is still uncertain since I am not getting much feedback. I have to either commit to it or drop it. The reason for AC is because it is a Pocket legend in calc mode, and there is no "C"!

[voodoo6k]

First draft of 40s kit. As requested on reddit. It's DSA, after all.

Covers Vortex Core, JD40, AMJ40, MiniVan, and others.

Spacebars are: 2.75u, 2.25u, 2u, 1.75u.

40s

[William_S_Jones]

First draft of 40s kit. As requested on reddit. It's DSA, after all.

Covers Vortex Core, JD40, AMJ40, MiniVan, and others.

Spacebars are: 2.75u, 2.25u, 2u, 1.75u.

40s

Show Image

Beautiful, great job, I ❤️ this!!!!


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[mik1]

Hi, I just wanted to say your key cap set is absolutely gorgeous.

However, if buying I'd like to buy it very much primarily as *all white on black*.

+1 to NorDe ("Swedish") and +1 to blank variants offered for Windows buttons.

Wider NorDe (Swedish) thread here https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=97874

[voodoo6k]

Hi, I just wanted to say your key cap set is absolutely gorgeous.

However, if buying I'd like to buy it very much primarily as *all white on black*.

+1 to NorDe ("Swedish") and +1 to blank variants offered for Windows buttons.

Wider NorDe (Swedish) thread here https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=97874

Thanks for the comment! Let me reply very generally.

As you may have expected, there is a high probability that this group buy will be split into two nonconcurrent phases: 1. Grey / deep teal, 2. High contrast / slate blue.

That's the reason why kits are split up this way, down the middle and not by alphas / modifiers. The main TLK set is aimed at making MOQ. Additional kits will be subjected to "survival of the fittest". I will work on a Norde kit (and investigate the Swedish variant), as it has been requested a number of times.

The blank Windows key has been in my head since the beginning. I don't like the "WIN" legend and otherwise "MODE" or blank are good candidates for replacing "DRG".

Off-topic, here are some 40s:

[William_S_Jones]

Hi, I just wanted to say your key cap set is absolutely gorgeous.

However, if buying I'd like to buy it very much primarily as *all white on black*.

+1 to NorDe ("Swedish") and +1 to blank variants offered for Windows buttons.

Wider NorDe (Swedish) thread here https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=97874

Thanks for the comment! Let me reply very generally.

As you may have expected, there is a high probability that this group buy will be split into two nonconcurrent phases: 1. Grey / deep teal, 2. High contrast / slate blue.

That's the reason why kits are split up this way, down the middle and not by alphas / modifiers. The main TLK set is aimed at making MOQ. Additional kits will be subjected to "survival of the fittest". I will work on a Norde kit (and investigate the Swedish variant), as it has been requested a number of times.

The blank Windows key has been in my head since the beginning. I don't like the "WIN" legend and otherwise "MODE" or blank are good candidates for replacing "DRG".

Off-topic, here are some 40s:

Show Image

Freaking beautiful 40s kits!!! I want them both!!!
...gotta guess JD40?? & Minivan


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[voodoo6k]

...gotta guess JD40?? & Minivan

Vortex Core and MiniVan

[William_S_Jones]

Nice, I’m joining, any word on the GB start date yet?


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[voodoo6k]

Nice, I’m joining, any word on the GB start date yet?


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I'm waiting on SP's response (RE: kits). After that, there will be some tweaking and finalizing. Should be in the forthcoming weeks but it's hard to say until I get the numbers.

[William_S_Jones]

Nice, I’m joining, any word on the GB start date yet?


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I'm waiting on SP's response (RE: kits). After that, there will be some tweaking and finalizing. Should be in the forthcoming weeks but it's hard to say until I get the numbers.

Understood & thanks for your response.


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[voodoo6k]

Update:

Just got a quote from SP for the first draft of kits.

I will have to trim down the Specialty modifiers kit and especially the 40s kit... it is too expensive!

Now it is back and forth with SP trying to make these kits as cheap as possible... (splitting alphas / modifiers also an option)

[William_S_Jones]

Update:

Just got a quote from SP for the first draft of kits.

I will have to trim down the Specialty modifiers kit and especially the 40s kit... it is too expensive!

Now it is back and forth with SP trying to make these kits as cheap as possible... (splitting alphas / modifiers also an option)

Damn....


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[voodoo6k]

Okay, I've updated the OP with the latest kits. Notable changes:

• Phase I = Grey / deep teal
• Separate alphas!
• 40% kit 
• Combined novelties

Notes:
- Response is not grand enough to offer two colourways simultaneously. Deep teal is more popular.
- Splitting the main TKL set into alphas/modifiers does not increase cost. Hopefully we can get onboard as many small keyboard enthusiasts as possible!
- Please roast this 40's kit
- Less options = greater buying power

Additionally:
- MOQ is set according to SP pricing at 100 for the alphas and (probably) 50 for the other kits. More details to come.
- ISO and Norde will be offered, however there's no guaranty that they will hit MOQ.


PS. Support the GB by adding this BB code to your signature:

Code: [Select]

[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=92780.0][img width=290 height=120]https://i.imgur.com/UGvVECS.gif[/img][/url]
Thanks 

[voodoo6k]

Also, please help generate interest by voting on our Massdrop poll if you haven't already! Thanks

[cijanzen]

I think these are very logical separations and I’m definitely going to get in on most sets. Can’t wait for a nice Canadian group buy!

Edit: only thing I’d maybe change is a separate spacebars kit with 7u 2.25/2.75 etc. But I get the reasoning behind what is setup now as well.

[William_S_Jones]

Okay, I've updated the OP with the latest kits. Notable changes:

• Phase I = Grey / deep teal
• Separate alphas!
• 40% kit 
• Combined novelties

Notes:
- Response is not grand enough to offer two colourways simultaneously. Deep teal is more popular.
- Splitting the main TKL set into alphas/modifiers does not increase cost. Hopefully we can get onboard as many small keyboard enthusiasts as possible!
- Please roast this 40's kit
- Less options = greater buying power

Additionally:
- MOQ is set according to SP pricing at 100 for the alphas and (probably) 50 for the other kits. More details to come.
- ISO and Norde will be offered, however there's no guaranty that they will hit MOQ.


PS. Support the GB by adding this BB code to your signature:

Code: [Select]

[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=92780.0][img width=290 height=120]https://i.imgur.com/UGvVECS.gif[/img][/url]
Thanks 

Updated my profile to support you, sir!

[voodoo6k]

Updated my profile to support you, sir!

Wait is there a typo?

Edit: I think it's fine... misplaced tag on your side! )

[rumlyne]

Future DSA Scientific owners, assemble!

Also voodoo maybe post the groupbuy over on https://typehype.net as well (just found it. nice little forum!)

[voodoo6k]

Edit: only thing I’d maybe change is a separate spacebars kit with 7u 2.25/2.75 etc. But I get the reasoning behind what is setup now as well.

I'm listening... do you mean offer it in addition to the kits or remove them from the kits and add a spacebar kit?

[cijanzen]

Edit: only thing I’d maybe change is a separate spacebars kit with 7u 2.25/2.75 etc. But I get the reasoning behind what is setup now as well.

I'm listening... do you mean offer it in addition to the kits or remove them from the kits and add a spacebar kit?

Yeah, I was thinking remove from the kits and offer as a stand-alone kit. For example there would be 60% users with split spacebar that would want the 2.25/2.75 spacekeys but they currently have to shell out for the whole 40% kit. On the one hand this would potentially boost the 40% numbers but on the other, it’s probably not a cheap kit and so people may just opt not to get them at all.

[voodoo6k]

Edit: only thing I’d maybe change is a separate spacebars kit with 7u 2.25/2.75 etc. But I get the reasoning behind what is setup now as well.

I'm listening... do you mean offer it in addition to the kits or remove them from the kits and add a spacebar kit?

Yeah, I was thinking remove from the kits and offer as a stand-alone kit. For example there would be 60% users with split spacebar that would want the 2.25/2.75 spacekeys but they currently have to shell out for the whole 40% kit. On the one hand this would potentially boost the 40% numbers but on the other, it’s probably not a cheap kit and so people may just opt not to get them at all.

Spacebars and larger caps (1.5u+) are much more expensive per "u" than regular 1u's and given SP's price curve, separating them only works if you can sell can at least 50 or ideally 75.

Unless there is a common situation where people getting the 40's kit don't need the 1.75u~2.75u spacebars (?), it will end up costing more for most... I've tried distilling down the 40's kit as much as possible and I think that's the thinnest we can do without sacrificing Vortex Core or MiniVan (the others are a subset of these two).

Right now, the 40's kit looks like this:

40's	MOQ	Price
	50	$65
	75	$55
	100	$49

[cijanzen]

Edit: only thing I’d maybe change is a separate spacebars kit with 7u 2.25/2.75 etc. But I get the reasoning behind what is setup now as well.

I'm listening... do you mean offer it in addition to the kits or remove them from the kits and add a spacebar kit?

Yeah, I was thinking remove from the kits and offer as a stand-alone kit. For example there would be 60% users with split spacebar that would want the 2.25/2.75 spacekeys but they currently have to shell out for the whole 40% kit. On the one hand this would potentially boost the 40% numbers but on the other, it’s probably not a cheap kit and so people may just opt not to get them at all.

Spacebars and larger caps (1.5u+) are much more expensive per "u" than regular 1u's and given SP's price curve, separating them only works if you can sell can at least 50 or ideally 75.

Unless there is a common situation where people getting the 40's kit don't need the 1.75u~2.75u spacebars (?), it will end up costing more for most... I've tried distilling down the 40's kit as much as possible and I think that's the thinnest we can do without sacrificing Vortex Core or MiniVan (the others are a subset of these two).

Right now, the 40's kit looks like this:

40's	MOQ	Price
	50	$65
	75	$55
	100	$49

I think the price on the 40s kit sounds good. Just wanted to throw the idea out there but like I said, I think your kits make a lot of sense and should provide ideal coverage for the majority of users!

[sevenseacat]

I have to buy this just for those awesome green keys...

Just one request though - homing keys for non-Qwerty users? A tiny kit with a homing H, U, N and T ?

[voodoo6k]

I have to buy this just for those awesome green keys...

Just one request though - homing keys for non-Qwerty users? A tiny kit with a homing H, U, N and T ?

Still not sure whether to offer it. It would probably be around $9-12 for "H U N T" keys in sub 25 quantities.

Same for NorDe (Edit: but more expensive of course). Here's ISO:

ISO	MOQ	Price
	25	$23
	50	$17
	75	$15

[voodoo6k]

double post

[voodoo6k]

Future DSA Scientific owners, assemble!

Also voodoo maybe post the groupbuy over on https://typehype.net as well (just found it. nice little forum!)

so many keeb forums. i like it

[dvorcol]

Just one request though - homing keys for non-Qwerty users? A tiny kit with a homing H, U, N and T ?

I added a HUNT homing key kit to the Massdrop poll about a week ago, but it is not getting much love.  Part of it is probably because you only get three votes.  Also, the poll was old when I added it.

[voodoo6k]

Just one request though - homing keys for non-Qwerty users? A tiny kit with a homing H, U, N and T ?

I added a HUNT homing key kit to the Massdrop poll about a week ago, but it is not getting much love.  Part of it is probably because you only get three votes.  Also, the poll was old when I added it.

As you suggested on our Massdrop talk page, the idea of setting a low MOQ for the HUNT kit seems feasible.


On another matter, to address the few comments (on reddit) saying that this kind of looks like Dolch with green (this "green" is more blue than actual green), here's an RGB simulation comparing the two:

DSA Dolch (left) vs DSA Scientific (right)


Above: Dark grey (DSA Sci, right) is slightly darker and more brown, apparent in physical samples. Light grey is visibly lighter and neutral, contributing to the sterile "scientific" aesthetic.

Could be helpful for those wanting to get a TKL kit that includes all of the deep teal keys.


While I'm at it and waiting for the final (?) quote from SP, here's a closeup of my favourite key in this set, h-bar (reduced Planck constant):

[WarmCat]

This looks great, I love the colours.

To support HHKB layout and for non-window users, would be nice to have another 1u alt in the "Specialty" kit and an additional "2nd" 1.5 keys (or any other key that can be used as meta).

I'll be watching :-D

[cijanzen]

Just one request though - homing keys for non-Qwerty users? A tiny kit with a homing H, U, N and T ?

I added a HUNT homing key kit to the Massdrop poll about a week ago, but it is not getting much love.  Part of it is probably because you only get three votes.  Also, the poll was old when I added it.

As you suggested on our Massdrop talk page, the idea of setting a low MOQ for the HUNT kit seems feasible.


On another matter, to address the few comments (on reddit) saying that this kind of looks like Dolch with green (this "green" is more blue than actual green), here's an RGB simulation comparing the two:

DSA Dolch (left) vs DSA Scientific (right)

Show Image

Above: Dark grey (DSA Sci, right) is slightly darker and more brown, apparent in physical samples. Light grey is visibly lighter and neutral, contributing to the sterile "scientific" aesthetic.

Could be helpful for those wanting to get a TKL kit that includes all of the deep teal keys.


While I'm at it and waiting for the final (?) quote from SP, here's a closeup of my favourite key in this set, h-bar (reduced Planck constant):

Show Image

Your renderings are so great! The texture detail for DSA is perfect.

[voodoo6k]

This looks great, I love the colours.

To support HHKB layout and for non-window users, would be nice to have another 1u alt in the "Specialty" kit and an additional "2nd" 1.5 keys (or any other key that can be used as meta).

I'll be watching :-D

Thanks.

You can always use 2 x 1.5u "Alt" with 2 x 1u "Sys", no?

[voodoo6k]

Your renderings are so great! The texture detail for DSA is perfect.

Thanks. It looks fine at certain angles.

If anyone is interested, I can share the parameters (3ds Max). Results may vary.

What has a greater impact though are the legends, I need to work on those... it's a long process so my advice is do it right the first time.

[SifakaMon]

Voted at MD. Thinking about an Ergodox set? I'd be happy even with a minimal add-on to the ortho set that includes some legended 1.5Us.

[holtenc]

Looking forward to this.

[voodoo6k]

Voted at MD. Thinking about an Ergodox set? I'd be happy even with a minimal add-on to the ortho set that includes some legended 1.5Us.

Thanks! Unfortunately, no... we may be adding two 1.5u blanks for Atreus but I don't think Ergo would make it... sorry.

Looking forward to this.

:pray:

[William_S_Jones]

Voted at MD. Thinking about an Ergodox set? I'd be happy even with a minimal add-on to the ortho set that includes some legended 1.5Us.

Thanks! Unfortunately, no... we may be adding two 1.5u blanks for Atreus but I don't think Ergo would make it... sorry.

Looking forward to this.

:pray:

Yes, atreus !!!
What up holtenc!


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[fn]

This looks awesome! And great renders, you can almost press the keys 

Does DSA suffer the same super-long production time as SA at the moment? Just trying to curb my excitement if this could be a year away from reality...