Placement of trackpoint

[alkozu]

Hi, first post after lots of reading in the forum.

So, I understand that the idea of a trackpoint is to have the hand in the homerow as much as possible. Normally, it is located between GHB and there are some additional buttons south of the space bar. This is reasonably fine, but still the hand has to move quite a bit. If one does not care about the buttons, because for instance they are pressed by the left hand via some function layer, where would be the best placement for the trackpoint? I conjecture that between YUH in QWERTY but I am not an expert in ergonomics, what do you think? Is there any study available?

These questions are related to a custom I would like to make with a trackpoint but no buttons.

[Phenix]

If its going to be an 40% or 60% with split spacebar - im interested in an nice build. Log!
(was thinking about doing something like that. oneday.)

[size=85]typos due to my touch screen are possible[/size]

[alkozu]

Did not decide yet, but my idea is something like the atreus but split and with one of the sprintek trackpoints or perhaps an ebay joystick and having the joystick translated to a mouse by the OS. But this is all the far future , for the moment thinking about the layout and where would the trackpoint make more sense.

[Phenix]

Nice idea! looking forward seeing progress! (why not just getting an ergodox. And mount it Maybe among thumb and writinf section? Theres already place for it..)

[size=85]typos due to my touch screen are possible[/size]

[alkozu]

Yes, that was one of my first ideas. But beyond the fun of doing my own thing, there are several problems with the ergodox + trackpoint option, first the trackpoint would be placed for the thumb which I am not sure is the most confortable option, and second my hands are not the biggest in humankind and I understand that the most exterior thumbkeys are quite unusable in that case. The second one is a problem of the ergodox, nothing to do with the trackpoint.

[Phenix]

Ok. Please post once you are going to order plates', depending on price some (and maybe I ) will join

[size=85]typos due to my touch screen are possible[/size]

[hanya]

Did not decide yet, but my idea is something like the atreus but split and with one of the sprintek trackpoints or ...

Sprintek SK8702 Pointing Stick Mouse Module has been marked as obsoleted and it has been gone from their list to buy.

[alkozu]

Yes, you are right sprintek's device seems obsoleted by now, I found an alternative but it is tremendously expensive at around 70 euros if you buy one and not much cheaper if you order a bunch:

http://www.interlinkelectronics.com/MicroJoystick.php

Do you guys know other options?
If not, I guess I might have a thumb joystick in an atreus like layout. But not very sure if it is easy to manipulate with the index finger, otherwise I would need to place it for thumb use...

[nephiel]

For a one-off custom, your best bet would be to salvage a TrackPoint from a broken ThinkPad.

[Darkshado]

On a split keyboard I'd position the trackpoint between either H-J-N or F-G-V rather than one row higher. This way you bring your index closer instead of stretching it every time you want to move the pointer.

[alkozu]

Thanks a lot for the feedback Darkshado! Aha, so HJN, now I was thinking left of HN and on top of the thumb key, logistically it would be easier, but I guess you are right, ergonomically between HJN would be the easiest for the finger...

[Phenix]

I would rather suggest do both
One between
 H-J-N
and the other between F-G-V

This way you can use both hands + (as long as the firmware support it, I cant say that, sorry) you could do some fun things like left site high DPI, right side low DPI
(and of cause have the possibility to change the trackpoint hand while writing!)

[jacobolus]

I recommend putting the trackpoint either between (on a QWERTY layout board) KM or between JI, with the idea being that it won’t interfere with your fingers when they are reaching for keys to press.

You can use home row keys on a shifted layer for mouse buttons; works better than standard mouse switches anyway.

[alkozu]

What is the rationale behind KM and JI? I would say that in a standard row staggered keyboard going to HJN or in your design: http://i.imgur.com/BBZJcF5.png going to HJNM is almost zero effort, but in order to reach KM with the index finger you need to contract quite a bit the hand.

[jacobolus]

If you put the trackpoint between HJN, then when you reach your index finger to the N key, it will hit the top of the trackpoint on the way.

I could be wrong about that though. I haven’t done much real hardware testing of integrated trackpoints in different places, only idle theorizing.

[xtrafrood]

If you put the trackpoint between HJN, then when you reach your index finger to the N key, it will hit the top of the trackpoint on the way.

I could be wrong about that though. I haven’t done much real hardware testing of integrated trackpoints in different places, only idle theorizing.

Should be one of the most seamless transitions from using a right handed mouse, especially for those that space with the right hand. I owned a compaq laptop that had a trackball on the right side of the monitor (Compaq LTE Elite 4/75CX) and that is my only frame of reference that is even remotely close to why I think a trackpoint between HJN could be worth a shot.

[jacobolus]

Sure, the trackpoint will be easy to reach. My concern is that when you try to press the N key, your finger might sometimes hit the top of the trackpoint instead. Might not be a problem in practice though.

[Phenix]

I also assume this wont be a problem in daily use

[size=85]typos due to my touch screen are possible[/size]

[alkozu]

Nephiel, I did not realize that you were active on geekhack and sent you a private message to your reddit account. Many questions regarding your trackpoint custom kb!

[nephiel]

No prob - answered as well as I could.

As for the placement, I like it on the default position (between G, H and B) myself. Right in the middle, so it can be used with either hand, yet it doesn't get in the way while typing.

I guess this location wouldn't be available on a split board, though.

[alkozu]

Thanks a lot for the reply! I imagine that the getting on the way problem might be solved if the trackpoint is at a slightly higher level than the N key but much lower than J. I will be doing some tests now, and show you guys how it goes

[Parzival]

I think it would be best in the YUH postition mostly because I am right handed and use that hand for mouse related things.