Author Topic: [IC] DSA Encore  (Read 36382 times)

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Offline Ahngel

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #50 on: Mon, 23 August 2021, 20:54:11 »
F

Offline Kokaloo

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #51 on: Mon, 23 August 2021, 23:10:25 »
oh nooo darn who could have seen this coming
« Last Edit: Mon, 23 August 2021, 23:12:46 by Kokaloo »

Offline hagiwaraDaisuke

  • Posts: 16
Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #52 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 00:06:08 »
oh nooo darn who could have seen this coming

What happened?


Offline AuthenticDanger

  • Posts: 402
Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #53 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 00:10:37 »
oh nooo darn who could have seen this coming

What happened?

The GB page on dangkeebs is gone (maybe a copyright takedown?)

edit: gone from alphakeys, too
« Last Edit: Tue, 24 August 2021, 00:12:15 by AuthenticDanger »
F Keys belong on the left.

Offline MIGHTY CHICKEN

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #54 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 00:12:41 »
The GB page on dangkeebs is gone (maybe a copyright takedown?)
The story goes when the set first launched, Astro "asked" a riot friend if it was fine with no written confirmation from what I think. Astro then received a cease and desist letter which was ignored and Riot now has sent another one to all vendors to refund and shut it down.

Offline fishbiscuit13

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #55 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 00:26:03 »
Honestly,

Best of luck. I wont be shocked if this gets pulled you are playing with riots current huge money maker. That has links to GIDLE and Twice, two other big idol groups.

The last two Idol GB had a super quick legal action, GMK Blink and KAT Comet (though not as big the desk mat got pulled day 1)

I mean im all for if trying, wish you luck just don't be surprised if hitting a huge wall of legal action.

To the real issues I have is 1, the helmet looks odd to me just empty honestly, 2. Your sig is off, you need to put a "code" section above it and post it so people can copy paste.

Thanks for the tip about the signature, much appreciated :)\

And yeah I wouldn't be shocked either. Tons of ppl seem to think I didn't do my research, weigh the pros and cons, and reach out to the right people for this, it's hilarious. But I wasn't going to not at least try with this, and I didn't half ass this effort either. I know there are ppl who would love to see Encore get shut down, but that's not going to stop me from doing my best :D

Nothing great without risk was ever made.

this aged like milk

Offline dandruff

  • Posts: 226
Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #56 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 00:53:07 »
I've been following... and let's say you had a great plan in mind. I'm not trying to "kick while you're down"...

but I need help understanding... why ignore a cease and desist letter?

Offline Starston3

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #57 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 01:06:07 »
I've been following... and let's say you had a great plan in mind. I'm not trying to "kick while you're down"...

but I need help understanding... why ignore a cease and desist letter?
Be cause “**** ‘em” that’s why…

Ultimately hubris is the down fall of many. But vendors actually have a lot to lose compared to designers that “ask someone at x company” if they can use their IP.

The designer was warned many times - instead of taking the warning just turned around and ****ted on them saying the GH crowd was toxic.

Offline Kokaloo

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #58 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 01:56:49 »
since the designer doesn't feel it's appropriate to notify those on all platforms



i feel it's wholly irresponsible of the runner and the vendors to allow this to happen, arrogantly pushing this set towards group buy while there clearly being a breach of terms of service

Offline Synergist

  • Posts: 23
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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #59 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 02:15:41 »
I hope Astro Bunny now realizes that if the C&D happened when the set was already in production or production was already completed it would have screwed over everyone who bought the set since refunds would be impossible at that point.

Maybe be a little less willing to take such risks with other people's money involved in the future.

Offline MILKYWAY KEYS

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #60 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 02:44:31 »
The GB page on dangkeebs is gone (maybe a copyright takedown?)
The story goes when the set first launched, Astro "asked" a riot friend if it was fine with no written confirmation from what I think. Astro then received a cease and desist letter which was ignored and Riot now has sent another one to all vendors to refund and shut it down.

................... :eek:

Offline Ustinj

  • Posts: 390
Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #61 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 02:53:06 »
While I found the irony in this situation predictable and expected, and well overdue.. (seriously, after seeing the news I had to hit my inhaler), it's actually pretty sad in the bigger picture and don't think it's doing anyone any favors to rub salt in the wound. OP probably knows very well that they f**ked up astronomically, and their ignorance leading to this outcome already comes with a lot of guilt. There is no way this is not a learning lesson. I think it's really important to realize that while they were willing to "take the risk", being the designer in this situation is a pretty low-risk position compared to others that are affected - especially the vendors.
« Last Edit: Tue, 24 August 2021, 03:47:25 by Ustinj »

Offline 7h3of7

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #62 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 08:06:43 »
Where is the info about her getting a C&D letter and ignoring it?
Not saying it didn't happen just hoping someone can confirm it with something other than paraphrasing.

And in the case this did actually happen, could you please explain the thought process of ignoring an official C&D from the IP holder?
Getting C&D'd is one thing, ignoring a letter and Riot having to send another one to the vendors directly is significantly worse.
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Offline dgneo

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #63 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 08:13:34 »
In case people missed the 'reflection' at the top of the post:

Quote
Regarding the drama here, I have for awhile removed myself from that since it was negatively affecting my wellbeing, hence the lack of updates to it (as I'm sure many of you have noticed). I admit my initial reaction to the comments on it was immature, arrogant, and inflammatory, but have since reflected with the guidance of kindhearted veteran designers & moved forward from the incident. Those who stuck with me can vouch for my growth if that matters to any of you. I do not expect others to forgive my previous behavior & have put it behind me, & what others decide to do is up to them of course. It's a shame what happened happened, but I've learned from it & that's all I can do.

In regards to why I strongly believe it's OK in the legal gray area, it's because after reading their Legal Jibber Jabber, I immediately thought of several public instances where creators were blatantly breaking their code, but Riot Games didn't care. Riot is known to willingly turn a blind eye on paywalled fanmade merch as long as the designer/seller does NOT use their logo anywhere or say that it is a Riot-backed project. A great example would be the NSFW artist Sakimichan who makes tons of NSFW fanart for many games including League of Legends. She's extremely popular and Riot is well aware that her LoL champ fanart is Patreon-exclusive which is in direct violation of their Legal Jibber Jabber on paper. However, she's still allowed to continue this 'cause she doesn't use their Riot Games logo & also, Riot would never back a NSFW artist publicly (privately, though yes, as many Rioters are avid fans of her Patreon).  Another example would be the many creators who sell League of Legends IP fanmerch at conventions (Anime Expo, Fanime, etc.) or in their online stores. These fanmade merch include art prints, apparel, accessories, & more that are produced & sold by a 3rd-party to the creator. Riot is aware of all of this, but they have bigger fish to fry (such as other game studios copying their game i.e. Mobile Legends; you can Google the lawsuit that occurred).

The difference between my set & GMK Blink is I'm not mentioning Riot Games or K/DA anywhere in my set. I steered clear of using their official logos & I checked what is officially trademarked by Riot Games (https://trademarks.justia.com/owners/riot-games-inc-1359372/page2), and none of my novelties are listed. The "KDA" font I'm using for social assets is free to use (https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/jjfs29/kda_font/). The assets looking similar to official KDA art (banners, font, colors, etc.) is intentional, but I am NOT using anything that's copyrighted or trademarked here AFAIK. I'm not trying to hide that this set is K/DA/Riot Games inspired though, otherwise I wouldn't have included the Riot Games Legal Jibber Jabber blog here and on my site. I was actually initially satisfied that it was so easily recognized as K/DA without using their logo 'cause it meant I got close enough to the real deal, but in hindsight, maybe too close for comfort for folks. Time will tell.

I hope for the best, but if Riot Games reaches out to me and tells me "No, you cannot do this", I will of course comply because this project was born out of love for them and what they do. The last thing I want to do is upset my favorite game studio. If Riot Games graciously allows it, I will do my best to redesign the keyset so it does not infringe upon the IP, but still remains close enough to it that true KDA fans can enjoy it, much like how KAT Eternal was designed. I will also take full responsibility for going about this the wrong way initially and disappointing those were truly excited for the set with me. To those who have been following me all this time & supporting the set, thank you from the bottom of my heart. If the worst case scenario were to pass, it would be knowing that I let the set's supporters down that would hit the hardest, including the vendors who put themselves at risk too for supporting my set. I've gotten to know so, so many lovely folks since this IC was posted, and my biggest fear is the disappointed and headaches the worst case scenario would cause to people I truly care about. It is my fault for jumping into this headfirst without considering the possible consequences for others rather just for myself. I sincerely apologize.

TLDR - I admit I have nothing legally on paper to protect my set from a C&D like the others mentioned above, it's just solid hearsay, but hearsay nonetheless. I was unnecessarily arrogant and ignorant when I launched this, but have matured since (20/20 hindsight). If things go awry, I won't be able to forgive myself for the falling out that will affect my supporters. I have no problems facing the consequences of my own actions, but I wish I could shield my supporters from whatever may happen as a result of my actions. Thank you for reading.

Offline doggo1dance

  • Posts: 118
Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #64 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 08:54:58 »
since the designer doesn't feel it's appropriate to notify those on all platforms

Show Image


i feel it's wholly irresponsible of the runner and the vendors to allow this to happen, arrogantly pushing this set towards group buy while there clearly being a breach of terms of service

shockedpikachu.jpg

Lets be real here. We were all expecting this to happen, and its amazing how this set went as far as it did. :p



Offline Visionaire

  • Posts: 613
Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #65 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 10:57:33 »
While I found the irony in this situation predictable and expected, and well overdue.. (seriously, after seeing the news I had to hit my inhaler), it's actually pretty sad in the bigger picture and don't think it's doing anyone any favors to rub salt in the wound. OP probably knows very well that they f**ked up astronomically, and their ignorance leading to this outcome already comes with a lot of guilt. There is no way this is not a learning lesson. I think it's really important to realize that while they were willing to "take the risk", being the designer in this situation is a pretty low-risk position compared to others that are affected - especially the vendors.

Understandable, but all of this was easily preventable. Many people shared this ahead of time and the runner went ahead, believing somehow the rules did not apply to them. Its sad that they're here, but this community has grown to a point where you really shouldn't be taking people's money if you're walking to a pretty obvious legal issue. And yeah, I feel worse for the vendors who are going to be hit with all of these refund requests and what that does to them financially.

Offline _rubik

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #66 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 11:42:04 »
While I found the irony in this situation predictable and expected, and well overdue.. (seriously, after seeing the news I had to hit my inhaler), it's actually pretty sad in the bigger picture and don't think it's doing anyone any favors to rub salt in the wound. OP probably knows very well that they f**ked up astronomically, and their ignorance leading to this outcome already comes with a lot of guilt. There is no way this is not a learning lesson. I think it's really important to realize that while they were willing to "take the risk", being the designer in this situation is a pretty low-risk position compared to others that are affected - especially the vendors.

Understandable, but all of this was easily preventable. Many people shared this ahead of time and the runner went ahead, believing somehow the rules did not apply to them. Its sad that they're here, but this community has grown to a point where you really shouldn't be taking people's money if you're walking to a pretty obvious legal issue. And yeah, I feel worse for the vendors who are going to be hit with all of these refund requests and what that does to them financially.

Yeah. The argument "we're unlike GMK Blink because we didn't mention Riot by name" just doesn't hold water. Riot's IP goes well beyond their name. Feels a little irresponsible to push ahead (on all parties, vendors included)
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Offline Visionaire

  • Posts: 613
Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #67 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 11:47:34 »
Just read back through Reddit... and you see interactions like this:



I think its understandable when people are ready top play "I told you so" when such interactions were arrogantly invited. This person never got a lawyer and bragged about their research only to arrive as an obvious outcome. Dangerous arrogance.

https://www.reddit.com/r/mechmarket/comments/jpgc76/ic_dsa_encore/

Offline Puddsy

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #68 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 13:53:10 »
i dont really comment on drama anymore since it just ****s up the thread, but the arrogance on display during this entire process has been one of the most entertaining displays of hubris i have ever witnessed

the world of keyboards is no longer small enough to avoid C&Ds
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Offline Vigrith

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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #69 on: Tue, 24 August 2021, 14:46:09 »
Not a very poggers outcome it seems. Shocking.

Offline AstroBunny

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Re: []
« Reply #70 on: Thu, 07 October 2021, 18:02:14 »
Reserved
I think this is how you use a Reserved reply post? I'll be adding this to the IC too just in case.

10/7/21 UPDATE:
Hello! There is no TLDR of this. As most of you have already know, DSA Encore (renamed DSA Uncore by 1 of my supporters with a sense of humor) was C&D'd a few months after GB ended. I won't go into too much detail about it for legal & private reasons; however, I wanted to set the record straight for several rumors about the situation that are negatively affecting myself, my supporters, & the reputation of the vendors who supported the GB. It's been brought to my attention that the following assumptions have been made & circulated as the truth.

1. MYTH: I ignored the C&D and lied to my vendors.
This is false. I don't know who made this assumption and spread this based on pieces of information from sources either not directly involved or sources without a full grasp of the situation, but this is utterly untrue. My vendors as well as Riot Games can vouch for me. Riot Games and I spoke about this after and as it stands, Riot Games and I are on good terms as they understand I never meant to offend them. When my vendors were directly contacted regarding the C&D, I did not try convincing them to ignore it & instead urged them to comply while thanking them for their support & patience. I kept them in the loop the entire time throughout the process when it was clear there was a misunderstanding between myself and the third-party representing Riot Games.

2. MYTH: The keyset was rushed into production shortly after GB ended to try and circumvent a possible C&D.
False. I'm not sure where people are getting their information, but it certainly isn't from me nor my vendors, who are the only sources of truths in this matter. The keyset was being prototyped and sent to me. I approved V2, but the set itself never went into mass production before the C&D as I was still noodling on some stuff for it. No sets of DSA Encore were produced beyond the two prototype sets.

There's also a less serious rumor saying I tried to hide the C&D and the provided "proof" of this was that I didn't notify/update the GeekHack post ASAP.  Also untrue. As many of you are aware, when things went awry with the IC initially, I pulled back from Geekhack and moving forward, provided updates about the set ONLY in my server and my Instagram. My server was notified first because that was where the majority of the set's followers were. In my server statement announcing the C&D, I also stated I'd be updating my Instagram accordingly soon after. As you can imagine, my first priority was handling the C&D itself followed by notifying my supporters whenever I had major updates. Updating a post on a forum I hadn't been active on for several months and NOT where the majority  of my followers were residing was obviously not at the top of my list. The fact that some members are using this against me as proof that I tried to hide the C&D happening is wild to me.

I'm aware that when I first landed on GH with my IC, my initial reaction to most of the comments was immature, arrogant, & inflammatory, so I understand how most of GH is reveling in a "They had it coming / Told you so / Haha get f*cked" moment. That's fair. Everyone is entitled to schadenfreude every now and then, especially when it's towards someone who was deserving of it with an attitude like mine before; however, I would greatly appreciate it if community members would stop playing a broken telephone game and create their own theories to spread regarding what occurred. If it didn't come directly from me, then there's an extremely high chance that the information is skewed and not 100% accurate.

I am not asking the community to simply forget my initial behavior on the IC, as I understand that the C&D was no fault of my own, but I am humbly asking that you not mentally hold me to what I was previously; however, I also understand there will always be people who refuse to accept that people can grow & learn from their mistakes. I've seen enough of this toxic behavior of cancel culture on Twitter to recognize the similarities in some of the Discord server conversations surrounding me, but to each their own. Whether you as an individual would like to forgive my initial arrogant behavior is up to you, though I strongly believe I've grown as a person and designer since. Anyone who has truly followed me within my server can see that. I say truly since I'm well aware there are a handful of folks who lurk in my server to screenshot content and share elsewhere to discuss in a malicious manner. I find that a bit sad, but it do be like that, so feel free to come and go as you may in the server.

The C&D situation got me down bad to say the least. Besides that though, I was extremely disheartened and hurt having seen a few designers who I thought were true friends of mine in the hobby, some of whom I've collaborated with for projects, say some of the most mean-spirited comments regarding the situation. While I may have pulled back on my previously very active status in the Discord servers in the community to handle the issue, I was still lurking in them. I’m shocked how some people can feign sympathy in a server to maintain their nice façade to everyone there while simultaneously spewing some seriously hurtful sentiment in another server. I understand general toxicity coming from strangers I didn't really interact with outside the GH IC, but to have it come from a few folks I befriended is something entirely unexpected.

Some vendors also unfairly received misdirected negativity towards them just because they backed my GB. I want to emphasize that the C&D was solely my responsibility and my vendors were nothing but great, supportive, and patient. They are all still 100% trustworthy vendors and none of them (nor myself) attempted to deceive anyone during this process.

On a completely different note, if any designer is curious about how to handle a C&D, talking to the offended party, what constitutes a gray area of a policy, or just do's & don't's for a situation like that, my Discord DMs are open for the genuinely well-meaning and curious. It was a rocky road, but I did learn a lot from it, and I have to thank Riot Games in helping me understand the situation too and they were kind enough to have an open discussion about it when I politely requested one (details of that convo won't be revealed though).

And with that, I think that's all I've to say about the situation. If anything else major comes up, I may or may not address it depending on what it is. This hasn't stopped me from designing. I do plan to come back to using these colors, but after finishing my 2nd keyset design. Have a great day/night, stay safe, and thanks for reading!
« Last Edit: Thu, 14 October 2021, 15:35:17 by AstroBunny »

Offline Ella

  • Posts: 293
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Re: [IC] DSA Encore
« Reply #71 on: Fri, 08 October 2021, 12:17:19 »
Reserved
I think this is how you use a Reserved reply post? I'll be adding this to the IC too just in case.

10/7/21 UPDATE:
Hello! There is no TLDR of this. As most of you have already know, DSA Encore (renamed DSA Uncore by 1 of my supporters with a sense of humor) was C&D'd a few months after GB ended. I won't go into too much detail about it for legal & private reasons; however, I wanted to set the record straight for several rumors about the situation that are negatively affecting myself, my supporters, & the reputation of the vendors who supported the GB. It's been brought to my attention that the following assumptions have been made & circulated as the truth.

1. MYTH: I ignored the C&D and lied to my vendors.
This is false. I don't know who made this assumption and spread this based on pieces of information from sources either not directly involved or sources without a full grasp of the situation, but this is utterly untrue. My vendors as well as Riot Games can vouch for me. Riot Games and I spoke about this after and as it stands, Riot Games and I are on good terms as they understand I never meant to offend them. When my vendors were directly contacted regarding the C&D, I did not try convincing them to ignore it & instead urged them to comply while thanking them for their support & patience. I kept them in the loop the entire time throughout the process when it was clear there was a misunderstanding between myself and the third-party representing Riot Games.

2. MYTH: The keyset was rushed into production shortly after GB ended to try and circumvent a possible C&D.
False. I'm not sure where people are getting their information, but it certainly isn't from me nor my vendors, who are the only sources of truths in this matter. The keyset was being prototyped and sent to me. I approved V2, but the set itself never went into mass production before the C&D as I was still noodling on some stuff for it. No sets of DSA Encore were produced beyond the two prototype sets.

There's also a less serious rumor saying I tried to hide the C&D and the provided "proof" of this was that I didn't notify/update the GeekHack post ASAP.  Also untrue. As many of you are aware, when things went awry with the IC initially, I pulled back from Geekhack and moving forward, provided updates about the set ONLY in my server and my Instagram. My server was notified first because that was where the majority of the set's followers were. In my server statement announcing the C&D, I also stated I'd be updating my Instagram accordingly soon after. As you can imagine, my first priority was handling the C&D itself followed by notifying my supporters whenever I had major updates. Updating a post on a forum I hadn't been active on for several months and NOT where the majority  of my followers were residing was obviously not at the top of my list. The fact that some members are using this against me as proof that I tried to hide the C&D happening is wild to me.

I'm aware that when I first landed on GH with my IC, my initial reaction to most of the comments was immature, arrogant, & inflammatory, so I understand how most of GH is reveling in a "They had it coming / Told you so / Haha get f*cked" moment. That's fair. Everyone is entitled to schadenfreude every now and then, especially when it's towards someone who was deserving of it with an attitude like mine before; however, I would greatly appreciate it if community members would stop playing a broken telephone game and create their own theories to spread regarding what occurred. If it didn't come directly from me, then there's a high chance that the information is skewed and not 100% accurate.

I am not asking the community to simply forget my initial behavior on the IC, as I understand that the C&D was no fault of my own, but I am humbly asking that you not mentally hold me to what I was previously. Whether you as an individual would like to forgive my initial arrogant behavior is up to you, though I strongly believe I've grown as a person and designer since. Anyone who has truly followed me within my server can see that. I say truly since I'm well aware there are a handful of folks who lurk in my server to screenshot content and share elsewhere to discuss in a malicious manner. I find that a bit sad, but it do be like that, so feel free to come and go as you may in the server.

The C&D situation got me down bad to say the least. Besides that though, I was extremely disheartened and hurt having seen a few designers who I thought were true friends of mine in the hobby, some of whom I've collaborated with for projects, say some of the most mean-spirited comments regarding the situation. While I may have pulled back on my previously very active status in the Discord servers in the community to handle the issue, I was still lurking in them. I’m shocked how some people can feign sympathy in a server to maintain their nice façade to everyone there while simultaneously spewing some seriously hurtful sentiment in another server. I understand general toxicity coming from strangers I didn't really interact with outside the GH IC, but to have it come from a few folks I befriended is something entirely unexpected.

Some vendors also unfairly received misdirected negativity towards them just because they backed my GB. I want to emphasize that the C&D was solely my responsibility and my vendors were nothing but great, supportive, and patient. They are all still 100% trustworthy vendors and none of them (nor myself) attempted to deceive anyone during this process.

On a completely different note, if any designer is curious about how to handle a C&D, talking to the offended party, what constitutes a gray area of a policy, or just do's & don't's for a situation like that, my Discord DMs are open for the genuinely well-meaning and curious. It was a rocky road, but I did learn a lot from it, and I have to thank Riot Games in helping me understand the situation too and they were kind enough to have an open discussion about it when I politely requested one (details of that convo won't be revealed though).

And with that, I think that's all I've to say about the situation. If anything else major comes up, I may or may not address it depending on what it is. This hasn't stopped me from designing. I do plan to come back to using these colors, but after finishing my 2nd keyset design. Have a great day/night, stay safe, and thanks for reading!
seethe mald cope