Alps Appreciation Thread

[catawalks]

Listing the Monterey, its just ain't for me Can't always win I guess. Anyone interested?

I would rate SMK better than SKCM White from my experience. At least the SKCM White i've tried. They might be better in something like an Omnikey or simply better condition switches. Still I would call SMK an underrated switch.

Just got this behemoth today, man is it big. Thanks for the sale Mattr.

With a little toying around I was able to wire the keyboard PCB to an old Dell AT101 PS/2 cable I had laying around (the connector on that cable already fit the connector on the K104 PCB). The pinout, in case anyone else ever needs it, is as follows: 1. Clock 2. Data 3. Ground 4. VCC

I'll play with the typing experience more tomorrow or this weekend, for now I need to finish rebuilding this AEK II on my desk.

[Mattr567]

Listing the Monterey, its just ain't for me Can't always win I guess. Anyone interested?

I would rate SMK better than SKCM White from my experience. At least the SKCM White i've tried. They might be better in something like an Omnikey or simply better condition switches. Still I would call SMK an underrated switch.

Just got this behemoth today, man is it big. Thanks for the sale Mattr.

With a little toying around I was able to wire the keyboard PCB to an old Dell AT101 PS/2 cable I had laying around (the connector on that cable already fit the connector on the K104 PCB). The pinout, in case anyone else ever needs it, is as follows: 1. Clock 2. Data 3. Ground 4. VCC

I'll play with the typing experience more tomorrow or this weekend, for now I need to finish rebuilding this AEK II on my desk.

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Glad to see you got it working!!!

[alienman82]

removed.

[E3E]

alps make your desk grow mold

I spray my Alps with mold remover with 3 months of protection so I don't have to worry about any of that.

[catawalks]

alps make your desk grow mold

I spray my Alps with mold remover with 3 months of protection so I don't have to worry about any of that.

I should give that a shot. I always thought it was the years of no mouse pad. Turns out I'm just dirty.

[alh84001]

I heard it through the grapevine that there was a batch of striped amber boards found recently, but not recognized for what they were, so they ended up in the grinder.

Here's a pic of a kitten to make y'all feel better.
Either pic embedding is not working, or I forgot how to do that stuff.

[mike52787]

I heard it through the grapevine that there was a batch of striped amber boards found recently, but not recognized for what they were, so they ended up in the grinder.

Here's a pic of a kitten to make y'all feel better.
Either pic embedding is not working, or I forgot how to do that stuff.

damn kids and
 their crayons lmao

[alienman82]

removed.

[mike52787]

I heard it through the grapevine that there was a batch of striped amber boards found recently, but not recognized for what they were, so they ended up in the grinder.

Here's a pic of a kitten to make y'all feel better.
Either pic embedding is not working, or I forgot how to do that stuff.

damn kids ans their crayons lmao

ans their speiing!!

fick you

[Mattr567]

I heard it through the grapevine that there was a batch of striped amber boards found recently, but not recognized for what they were, so they ended up in the grinder.

Here's a pic of a kitten to make y'all feel better.
Either pic embedding is not working, or I forgot how to do that stuff.

Evidence? I need links!

[alh84001]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

[Mattr567]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

Hmm. Well that sucks. Assuming they were Tandem's. If they knew it was some kind of Alps why would they throw it away? Even the worst Alps is worth keeping in some sort of way.

[klennkellon]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

Hmm. Well that sucks. Assuming they were Tandem's. If they knew it was some kind of Alps why would they throw it away? Even the worst Alps is worth keeping in some sort of way.

There is no worst alps! Heathen.

Nah actually stock SKCM Black are kind of gross.

[MandrewDavis]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

As that source, I would want to keep quiet too. That is a ton of guilt to be carrying around - OR - IT WAS A BIG CONSPIRACY TO KEEP STRIPED AMBERS SUPER RARE! If Mattr can't have them, nobody can! 

[klennkellon]

Hey guys I've got an idea for a mod for SKCM Blacks that might help the roughness a bit.

A main reason the SKCM Black seem so rough is because it feels like there are two tactile bumps, and the force graph confirms this.

The idea is just to use a Cherry O-ring and wrap it around the slider to reduce the keytravel just enough that it doesn't get past that "second bump". So you end up with a much shorter travel but quieter and less rough feeling tactility.

[OfTheWild]

I just did a thing tonight as well... my whitefox came with some foam and I really liked the way it sounded. So i decided to get a roll of 1/4" and 1/8" and make some sound deadening for all my other boards... the V80 came first:



Its heavier, it sounds quieter. It feels pretty good to me. Sorry i didnt do a before and after sound test.

[chyros]

Hey guys I've got an idea for a mod for SKCM Blacks that might help the roughness a bit.

A main reason the SKCM Black seem so rough is because it feels like there are two tactile bumps, and the force graph confirms this.

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The idea is just to use a Cherry O-ring and wrap it around the slider to reduce the keytravel just enough that it doesn't get past that "second bump". So you end up with a much shorter travel but quieter and less rough feeling tactility.

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That's an interesting idea actually. I advocate either linearising black Alps, or clickifying them - the increased tactility makes you shoot past the second tactile bump, so the keyfeel is much cleaner.

[klennkellon]

Hey guys I've got an idea for a mod for SKCM Blacks that might help the roughness a bit.

A main reason the SKCM Black seem so rough is because it feels like there are two tactile bumps, and the force graph confirms this.

Show Image

The idea is just to use a Cherry O-ring and wrap it around the slider to reduce the keytravel just enough that it doesn't get past that "second bump". So you end up with a much shorter travel but quieter and less rough feeling tactility.

Show Image

That's an interesting idea actually. I advocate either linearising black Alps, or clickifying them - the increased tactility makes you shoot past the second tactile bump, so the keyfeel is much cleaner.

Could you also bend the tactile leaf to increase the tactility and get a similar effect?

[chyros]

Hey guys I've got an idea for a mod for SKCM Blacks that might help the roughness a bit.

A main reason the SKCM Black seem so rough is because it feels like there are two tactile bumps, and the force graph confirms this.

Show Image

The idea is just to use a Cherry O-ring and wrap it around the slider to reduce the keytravel just enough that it doesn't get past that "second bump". So you end up with a much shorter travel but quieter and less rough feeling tactility.

Show Image

That's an interesting idea actually. I advocate either linearising black Alps, or clickifying them - the increased tactility makes you shoot past the second tactile bump, so the keyfeel is much cleaner.

Could you also bend the tactile leaf to increase the tactility and get a similar effect?

Could work in theory, yes, although it's pretty hard to bend all the leaves in a whole board CONSISTENTLY to the same degree.

[fohat.digs]

The idea is just to use a Cherry O-ring and wrap it around the slider to reduce the keytravel just enough that it doesn't get past that "second bump". So you end up with a much shorter travel but quieter and less rough feeling tactility.

I seem to remember trying O-rings on Alps back a long time ago, with unacceptable results. My recollection is that travel was reduced to near zero, weirdly so.

Maybe I will locate to find my O-rings (I have thin soft ones and also dental bands) and try it again.

[Hypersphere]

Hey guys I've got an idea for a mod for SKCM Blacks that might help the roughness a bit.

A main reason the SKCM Black seem so rough is because it feels like there are two tactile bumps, and the force graph confirms this.

Show Image

The idea is just to use a Cherry O-ring and wrap it around the slider to reduce the keytravel just enough that it doesn't get past that "second bump". So you end up with a much shorter travel but quieter and less rough feeling tactility.

Show Image

[/spoiler]
I've done this from time to time on just a few particularly noisy switches (e.g., Enter, Shift, Spacebar) on Alps boards, but I ended up removing the O-rings. I didn't like the feel or the reduced travel, and the rings tend to slip off with time and use anyway.

[Mattr567]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

As that source, I would want to keep quiet too. That is a ton of guilt to be carrying around - OR - IT WAS A BIG CONSPIRACY TO KEEP STRIPED AMBERS SUPER RARE! If Mattr can't have them, nobody can! 

You mean I have them, and nobody (but E3E) can! /s

[E3E]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

As that source, I would want to keep quiet too. That is a ton of guilt to be carrying around - OR - IT WAS A BIG CONSPIRACY TO KEEP STRIPED AMBERS SUPER RARE! If Mattr can't have them, nobody can! 

You mean I have them, and nobody (but E3E) can! /s

 

[alienman82]

removed.

[Hypersphere]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

As that source, I would want to keep quiet too. That is a ton of guilt to be carrying around - OR - IT WAS A BIG CONSPIRACY TO KEEP STRIPED AMBERS SUPER RARE! If Mattr can't have them, nobody can! 

You mean I have them, and nobody (but E3E) can! /s

 

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Yes, the possibilities for modded Alps are practically endless!

[happylacquer]

You too can have them!

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Please.

I didn't know the //c has Alps. You never would have known because that god awful rubber pad under the keys that makes every keystroke require something like 1000 grams of force

[mike52787]

You too can have them!

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Show Image

Please.

I didn't know the //c has Alps. You never would have known because that god awful rubber pad under the keys that makes every keystroke require something like 1000 grams of force

some IIcs have alps, not all. any with a rubber pad wont have alps.

[happylacquer]

You too can have them!

Show Image

Show Image

Please.

I didn't know the //c has Alps. You never would have known because that god awful rubber pad under the keys that makes every keystroke require something like 1000 grams of force

some IIcs have alps, not all. any with a rubber pad wont have alps.

That explains why i was so taken aback when i saw that. I learned to type on a //c. I will never stop hating it either.

[E3E]

I'll keep it hear-say. But source is very reputable. Scrounging kind of reputable

As that source, I would want to keep quiet too. That is a ton of guilt to be carrying around - OR - IT WAS A BIG CONSPIRACY TO KEEP STRIPED AMBERS SUPER RARE! If Mattr can't have them, nobody can! 

You mean I have them, and nobody (but E3E) can! /s

 

Show Image

Yes, the possibilities for modded Alps are practically endless!

(Attachment Link)

I think S. Ambers will forever confuse people who aren't aware of them. "Oh, those are just ambers that some kids marked up! GET RID OF EM. I HATE APPLE IICs"

The Amber oppression continues.

Why else do you think SKCM Ambers are the loudest of the Alps clicky switches?

[kawasaki161]

Hi guys, I'm currently working on a 60% top mount case which I want to be compatible with the alps64 PCB. Unless I messed it up the case itself should be okay by now, but next is the hardest part:
plates.
The options for ALPS layouts are almost endless, and the type of stabilizers used is also not always the same for different keysets even if they use the same layout. Making matters worse, ALPS plates that support multiple layouts aren't really a thing (at least not to my knowledge). Since this will be a small production run with both ALPS and Cherry options I also can't offer many ALPS plate options without having them priced at or close to one-off pricing, I think two options is the highest I can go.
Since my experience with ALPS is very limited I now want to ask more knowledgeable people (you) about this. Which layouts should I support (and what kind of stabs do they use)? And which plate material would work best?

My current plans are to definitely support the AEK layout, as this is rather commonly available and the caps are of pretty good quality.
But then I'm left with only one other option, and even that will probably only make MOQ problems worse. My current idea for that one is either the V60 layout to have support for Tai Hao ALPS caps, or a standard 60% layout using cherry stabilizers in order to support future Signature Plastics sets.
Or, if MOQ is too much of a problem, I will just offer one plate option (probably AEK) and make the plate files available for everyone to get their own plate made, but this is also a huge pita for the consumer at the end.

Next up is the plate material, options are alu, steel and brass. I can probably only choose one of these, as I imagine the amount of ALPS orders will be pretty small. I'd love to see brass as this would probably be one of the first times that this is offered, but if that makes it less desirable for many people I will probably settle for alu or steel.

I hope you guys can give me some insight in this part of the hobby and help me with deciding for the options that please the majority.

Thanks for reading and thanks in advance for answers and help.

Edit:

I might have found a solution to part of the plate layout problem, but I don't have the stuff at hand to check if it works. Can someone please check for me if a standard 2u Costar wire fits into a 2.25u ALPS cap? If yes that would mean I can use the Matias adaptors for those keys and support both ALPS stabilizer based keycaps and Cherry stabilizer based ones (with the same layout) with one plate which would make things a lot easier.

Edit2:

I just found the one Costar wire I knew I still had somewhere. Bad news: doesn't fit as is. Good news: it's only off by a tiny bit and just having these Matias adapters should make for enough clearance.

Edit 3: Scrap that, I should have checked before, but 2u and 2.25u ALPS caps might have differently spaced stabmounts, at least I don't know if they are the same or not. I still need one of you guys to check that for me as I don't have a 2.25u ALPS cap

[happylacquer]

Any readily available alps pcb's out there not TKL? Having numpad back in my life made me realize I can't have a non full size board 

[zombimuncha]

@kawasaki161
Use Alps plate-mount stabs and wires, and use the keycap-stab-mount appropriate for the specific keycap. The Alps wires fit in either kind of keycap-mounts.
The only tricky bit is you have to bend the wire to shape a little for use with costar/cherry style keycap-mounts. So if you want to switch between SP (cherry-style cruciform stab mounts) caps and standard alps caps, you would also swap your stab wires - stock for alps, bent for SP. The Matias stabilizer kit has everything you need. Even the 2.75 stab wire is long enough after bending, although it'll probably need to be a little bit diagonal in the corners. Assuming you have a costar-style stab on your spacebar, you can use that spacebar wire as a template for where to bend the other stab wires.

Another option, if you're designing the plate, is to include two sets of holes for mounting alps-style mounts, like this: http://matias.ca/60/pc/viewer/?p=5
One for costar, one for alps. That way you can use costar wires with SP caps and not have to worry about bending any wires.

But really you should make a separate IC thread instead of discussing it here.

[Mattr567]

For some reason i've been craving a AEK II with SKCM Salmon. Right now there aren't any on ebay though You can tell by the back label what switch type it holds. S or non S, copyright dates, and country of manufacture, label type etc.

[fohat.digs]

You can tell by the back label what switch type it holds. S or non S, copyright dates, and country of manufacture, label type etc.

I think that those 1989 copyrights are pretty rare.

[alienman82]

removed.

[ShawnMeg]

For some reason i've been craving a AEK II with SKCM Salmon. Right now there aren't any on ebay though You can tell by the back label what switch type it holds. S or non S, copyright dates, and country of manufacture, label type etc.

I picked up one recently, and it's sweet.  In fact, I'm typing this message with that board.  Perhaps it's the novelty, but I put the AEK II with Salmons as my number 2 favorite board after my Model F 122.  I'm enjoying the sound and feel.  I also have an AEK with Salmons.  They're excellent switches.

There's a listing for an AEK with salmons:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272559493798?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

It might be priced somewhat steep given that oranges have gone for less, but then again, the salmons are more rare.  Dell AT101's with salmons go for a pretty penny.

[MandrewDavis]

I still got an alps board

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I am actually cleaning the caps tonight, but I wanted to use it a bit more first.

Nice wrist rest

[alienman82]

removed.

[E3E]

I still got an alps board

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I am actually cleaning the caps tonight, but I wanted to use it a bit more first.

Nice wrist rest

dont feel the trolls  :mad:

[Mattr567]

You can tell by the back label what switch type it holds. S or non S, copyright dates, and country of manufacture, label type etc.

I think that those 1989 copyrights are pretty rare.

Yea. SKCM Salmons may be the rarest AEKII, more than the Japanese one with Mitsumi's. There are actually two of those on ebay right now with 1989 copyrights but only USA mades one are Salmon. As far as we know all Japanese made AEKII's are Mitsumi.

I would also love a Japense sublegend AEKII, but you can only get those off Japanese auction websites, and right now there aren't any Plus the fact that finding a AEKII that has Salmon AND sublegends would prove to be difficult. Salmon > Sublegends. My last and only AEKII has Cream Damp, they were ok but I grew tired of the rubbery bottoming out feeling.

Funny how I seem to be buying all my old boards back. Recently bought a G80-11800 again but with the thick PBT, me like )

For some reason i've been craving a AEK II with SKCM Salmon. Right now there aren't any on ebay though You can tell by the back label what switch type it holds. S or non S, copyright dates, and country of manufacture, label type etc.

I picked up one recently, and it's sweet.  In fact, I'm typing this message with that board.  Perhaps it's the novelty, but I put the AEK II with Salmons as my number 2 favorite board after my Model F 122.  I'm enjoying the sound and feel.  I also have an AEK with Salmons.  They're excellent switches.

There's a listing for an AEK with salmons:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/272559493798?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

It might be priced somewhat steep given that oranges have gone for less, but then again, the salmons are more rare.  Dell AT101's with salmons go for a pretty penny.

Lucky /s

I'm looking for a AEKII specfially. Don't know why but I like the AEKII more, and the fact that they go for a lot cheaper. Nice to see a AEKII break free of its usual dampening.

Where did you get yours? Looked on ebay's sold area and found only two Salmon boards sold in the last 2-3 months.

[subcat]

Mattr, I have an AEKII with Japanese sublegends on the way. I will let you know when it arrives 

[E3E]

I actually like the original AEK much more than the AEK II, but I'd never want SKCM Salmons in any of my boards. I'm very much not a fan of that boring switch. It's a shame, since I really like the fish.

[Mattr567]

Mattr, I have an AEKII with Japanese sublegends on the way. I will let you know when it arrives 

Do you know if it has SKCM Salmon?? Made in USA 1989 or 1990 with no S in the bottom right corner.

So its going to go from Japan to Australia to America, ok then

I actually like the original AEK much more than the AEK II, but I'd never want SKCM Salmons in any of my boards. I'm very much not a fan of that boring switch. It's a shame, since I really like the fish.

So you don't like SKCM Orange then? It's only a weight difference really.

[subcat]

There is a chance - it is made in the USA. However, the seller didn't provide a complete photo of the back label, so I can't check for the S.

[Mattr567]

There is a chance - it is made in the USA. However, the seller didn't provide a complete photo of the back label, so I can't check for the S.

Do you know what year? Should be in the same area of the label if the right where the S is cutoff. 1989 and 1990 Salmon exist but I don't think 1989 Cream does.

[subcat]

Again, no idea. Only pic of the label provided was this:
https://auctions.c.yimg.jp/images.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/image/dr000/auc0301/users/9/2/2/8/hn0912jp-img600x450-1484734670kcbdtk8040.jpg

[E3E]

So you don't like SKCM Orange then? It's only a weight difference really.

I've had multiple Dell AT101s and an AEK with Salmons and they never felt pleasing to me. I like SKCM Oranges, but neither of them are switches I'm head over heels about using. I like SKCM Cream (NeXT) better than either of them.

The lightness of SKCM Orange is an appealing aspect, but I've always felt SKCM Salmons to feel a bit more tactile but also weirdly sterile. Just not a fan of them.

SKCM Creams have a sound that's very much like SKCM Blue but without the click. I'd describe it as "choppy." Sounds like a chop. Not all switches have that. I'd say only SKCM Blue and Cream have it so distinctively.

[Mattr567]

Again, no idea. Only pic of the label provided was this:
https://auctions.c.yimg.jp/images.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/image/dr000/auc0301/users/9/2/2/8/hn0912jp-img600x450-1484734670kcbdtk8040.jpg

Welp, that's SKCM White Damp, you can tell by the new style logo.

So you don't like SKCM Orange then? It's only a weight difference really.

I've had multiple Dell AT101s and an AEK with Salmons and they never felt pleasing to me. I like SKCM Oranges, but neither of them are switches I'm head over heels about using. I like SKCM Cream (NeXT) better than either of them.

The lightness of SKCM Orange is an appealing aspect, but I've always felt SKCM Salmons to feel a bit more tactile but also weirdly sterile. Just not a fan of them.

SKCM Creams have a sound that's very much like SKCM Blue but without the click. I'd describe it as "choppy." Sounds like a chop. Not all switches have that. I'd say only SKCM Blue and Cream have it so distinctively.

Yea I have to agree with you on the SKCM Cream, it is special and reminds me of SKCM Blue. Orange and Salmon are very similar to me. Must be the weight of SKCM Salmon for you. I do see a odd appeal to the 'sterile' feel of Salmon though.

[mike52787]

Again, no idea. Only pic of the label provided was this:
https://auctions.c.yimg.jp/images.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/image/dr000/auc0301/users/9/2/2/8/hn0912jp-img600x450-1484734670kcbdtk8040.jpg

Welp, that's SKCM White Damp, you can tell by the new style logo.

So you don't like SKCM Orange then? It's only a weight difference really.

I've had multiple Dell AT101s and an AEK with Salmons and they never felt pleasing to me. I like SKCM Oranges, but neither of them are switches I'm head over heels about using. I like SKCM Cream (NeXT) better than either of them.

The lightness of SKCM Orange is an appealing aspect, but I've always felt SKCM Salmons to feel a bit more tactile but also weirdly sterile. Just not a fan of them.

SKCM Creams have a sound that's very much like SKCM Blue but without the click. I'd describe it as "choppy." Sounds like a chop. Not all switches have that. I'd say only SKCM Blue and Cream have it so distinctively.

Yea I have to agree with you on the SKCM Cream, it is special and reminds me of SKCM Blue. Orange and Salmon are very similar to me. Must be the weight of SKCM Salmon for you. I do see a odd appeal to the 'sterile' feel of Salmon though.

SKCM Cream is the best alps switch hands down

[MandrewDavis]

I think SCKM Cream and SKCM Orange are on the same tier, just depends on your preference in weighting. Oranges absolutely blow SCKM Salmon out of the water, so boring.

Mattr, I have an AEKII with Japanese sublegends on the way. I will let you know when it arrives 

I always loved the look of those, Japanese sublegends just add to the novelty of AEK caps.