running floppies in 5150

[EverythingIBM]

Okay, I must be bad with vintage technology. I got a few DOS games on 5" floppies and want to play them on my 5150. So I put one in, hit F3 for LOAD, and then type "A" for drive A (I'm guessing that's how it works). Then it clicks, waits for a minute, clicks again and I get a message that the "device timed out".

WHAT'S WRONG?!?!?! I need some IBMage.

[kishy]

some old games of that particular vintage will require you to boot with them inserted. they are entirely independent of your OS of choice.

best i can offer right there.

another possibility is your drive is dirty or faulty.

Edit: in retrospect, I see you're obviously letting it boot into BASIC in ROM.

If the game is the sort that the computer can boot from, boot the system with it in the drive. If it gives you no luck that way then you need to boot to an OS first - BASIC is not an OS. You'd need DOS something or other on another floppy, boot to it, then access the game in second drive (or swap for first if only equipped with one).

[ch_123]

Also, are the floppy disks the correct density for the drive?

[Rajagra]

What are you booting into? If at the C:> prompt, type
A:
at the A:> prompt type the name of the game. Type
dir
to see what's there.
You kind of lost me at 'press F3 to load.' Is that an option presented when that model doesn't find a boot device, or is it some DOS shell?
(Sorry if I'm stating the obvious.)

[kishy]

Also, are the floppy disks the correct density for the drive?

VERY valid point.

What are you booting into? If at the C:> prompt, type
A:
at the A:> prompt type the name of the game. Type
dir
to see what's there.
You kind of lost me at 'press F3 to load.' Is that an option presented when that model doesn't find a boot device, or is it some DOS shell?
(Sorry if I'm stating the obvious.)

5150 didn't include a hard drive by spec, so he'd need to boot a DOS floppy.

The fact that he is presented with the ability to press F3 to "load" means it found no suitable boot device and went to BASIC in ROM. IBM computers, I believe up to the Aptiva series, have Microsoft BASIC present in their ROM and will boot to it if they find no suitable OS on any other bootable media.

Accordingly, in order to have ANY DOS prompt, he's going to need to boot into DOS first. It is my belief that he doesn't have such a disk or he'd already have done it.

[itlnstln]

Ironically, 5150 is the California Welfare and Institution code for crazy people.  Ripster is on home confinement under this code.  That's why he can post here all day.

[bhtooefr]

I know the PS/1, which predated the Aptiva, didn't have BASIC in ROM, had to use BASICA.COM to get BASIC.

[kishy]

I know the PS/1, which predated the Aptiva, didn't have BASIC in ROM, had to use BASICA.COM to get BASIC.

PS/2s definitely do have it.

I believe after the PS/1 was the Aptiva and I don't think Aptivas had it...I also know the 300PL didn't have it, so maybe PS/1 was the c-c-c-c-combo breaker.

[bhtooefr]

It could've also been part-way through the PS/2's run. I know the PS/2 I used was a very early 386-based one, but maybe a 286 PS/1 could've had it.

[kishy]

It could've also been part-way through the PS/2's run. I know the PS/2 I used was a very early 386-based one, but maybe a 286 PS/1 could've had it.

My PS/2 8530-E01 (that's a Model 30 286) has BASIC in ROM.

It's been a while since I fired it up with no bootable media, but I believe my 8556-045 (Model 56 SX) also has it.

[bhtooefr]

Er, I meant PS/1 everywhere I said PS/2, but my comments might still apply to the PS/2.

[ricercar]

5150 is the California Welfare and Institution code for crazy people.  Ripster is ...

That's me. ripster's not a Californian, at least not the last time he sent me a letter bomb.

[ricercar]

Damn. I bet you're going to tell me the Credit Fairy isn't real either.

[itlnstln]

Greece is finding that out the hard way.

[ricercar]

Credit Fairy?

If you were really Californian, you'd know about the Credit Fairy commercials. Or wait. Maybe that''s only if you're from Hulu.

[ch_123]

PS/2s definitely do have it.

I believe after the PS/1 was the Aptiva and I don't think Aptivas had it...I also know the 300PL didn't have it, so maybe PS/1 was the c-c-c-c-combo breaker.

IBM was still putting BASIC ROMs into PS/2s? You'd think they'd have moved on by that stage to something more useful....

[kishy]

IBM was still putting BASIC ROMs into PS/2s? You'd think they'd have moved on by that stage to something more useful....

Something to do with a license agreement with MS.

[EverythingIBM]

Yeah, before I get ahead of myself I'll need some old 5" DOS floppies to run the game.

The drive doesn't look dusty to me, the computer was kept in dustless condition.

[Hak Foo]

Yeah, before I get ahead of myself I'll need some old 5" DOS floppies to run the game.

The drive doesn't look dusty to me, the computer was kept in dustless condition.

F3 for load suggests you're at the Casette BASIC "Ok", not the DOS "A>"


http://www.freedos.org/ will help.

[kishy]

FreeDOS won't help if he doesn't have the ability to actually write an appropriate disk (which is likely to be a 360k, and if written in a high density drive will be unreliable at best)

[EverythingIBM]

FreeDOS won't help if he doesn't have the ability to actually write an appropriate disk (which is likely to be a 360k, and if written in a high density drive will be unreliable at best)

I do have a 5" floppy drive that fits into (moreso) modern computers, but it's some weird port which I've never seen before.

[kishy]

I do have a 5" floppy drive that fits into (moreso) modern computers, but it's some weird port which I've never seen before.

I almost guarantee it's high density. Useless for getting stuff onto disks if you want them readable in a low density drive, even if using low density media.

It's a card edge connector and is nothing unusual, it's the same connector that's been present on the majority of floppy cables forever in addition to the pin connectors.

[ricercar]

It's a card edge connector and is nothing unusual, it's the same connector that's been present on the majority of floppy cables forever in addition to the pin connectors.

The 5-1/4 floppy card edge connector stopped general availability with the Pentium (1). I haven't seen a cable for those at retail for 15 years.

[kishy]

The 5-1/4 floppy card edge connector stopped general availability with the Pentium (1). I haven't seen a cable for those at retail for 15 years.

Perhaps I've got a stockpile of something useful to Mr. OP then.

[ch_123]

The 5-1/4 floppy card edge connector stopped general availability with the Pentium (1). I haven't seen a cable for those at retail for 15 years.

eBay and skips are your friend.

I think I remember reading that there was some issues with 360K floppies in 1.2MB drives. Can anyone confirm?

[Rajagra]

I almost guarantee it's high density. Useless for getting stuff onto disks if you want them readable in a low density drive, even if using low density media.

Works fine as long as you start with an unused disk - i.e. *never* formatted before.

[bhtooefr]

The issue is that 5.25" High Density drives have trouble writing Standard Density/Double Density disks correctly, so that 360k and smaller drives can read them.

SD and DD have different magnetic coercivity.

[Rajagra]

I thought the problem was much simpler. The tracks on 1.2MB disks are half the width of those on a 360K one, as are the active parts of the read/write/erase heads.

A high density drive can effectively only write to half of a track width on a low density disk. That leaves half of the track holding old data, making it hard to read reliably.

If you start with a fresh, never formatted disk, the high density drive can use it properly up until the point a low density drive writes something to it.

[kishy]

Works fine as long as you start with an unused disk - i.e. *never* formatted before.

I was referring to the track width thing also.

Even never-before-formatted media can give problems simply because the high density drive is going to write slightly "off" from where the low density drive may expect. No way to know if it'll work without just doing it to see.