New Truly Ergonomic models (207, 209); older models retired

[impiri]

Hi folks. I pre-ordered a Truly Ergonomic 109 a couple of weeks ago and just got an email from TE.

Manufacturing Update

We are pleased to confirm manufacturing of the Truly Ergonomic Keyboard has been finalized in accordance with our design specifications, and it has been transported into our new warehouse in the United States.
 

Model changes

We are also pleased to mention we have made enhancements to the Truly Ergonomic Keyboard. We have combined and upgraded model 104 and model 105 into the new enhanced model 207, and we have upgraded model 109 into the new enhanced model 209.

If you backordered Model 104 or Model 105, you have been automatically upgraded to the new Model 207.

If you backordered Model 109, you have been automatically upgraded to the new Model 209.
 

Model 207 is configured for English US or International languages (ANSI - ISO).

Model 209 is configured for Asian or International languages (JIS - or to reprogram additional keys using ANSI - ISO).

Mac users: please note we only recommend Model 209 for Mac OSŪ.

It looks like the old 104, 105, and 109 models aren't on the site anymore. Here are some comparisons.

Old 109:


New 209:


The 207 is the same thing except with large Alt keys in the bottom left and right.

[impiri]

Old 104:


New 207:

[Tracer]

HAH. It's closer to how I have my keyboard mapped anyways. Glad I got the blank one.
Hopefully they'll release the programming tool soon too.

Edit: I actually like some of their changes, but these changes require firmwear updates as they relate to special keys etc. I want the reprogramming tool even more now.

[treigle]

I like what they did with the 207; it a small but real improvement (contiguous -+ keys, more familiar ~ location). Seems mostly a wash on the 209 though.

[Tezkat]

Hmm... I approve of what they've done with the 207. It's a simple change but a fairly significant improvement.

I still don't think I'll be buying any more until they release the promised reprogramming software though...

[fatchoi]

And the Win key is also moved to the middle

I love the new version and lucky I've placed orders for two 209

[sordna]

Interesting, but is the reprogramming software out yet?

[Input Nirvana]

It is interesting. I'm glad TE is still alive. Maybe this continued effort and refined keyboard will help with the PR issue (which is still a big issue) and and get more of them "out there".

I would like to try one.

[treigle]

Input Nirvana and Sordna: if either of you want to borrow my TE104 ANSI/red for a month or so, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it....

[sordna]

I would probably buy one if:
1. It was offered again with red switches
2. The programming software was available
3. It was sold on Amazon with Prime free 2-day shipping

[treigle]

I wouldn't count on the programming software everbecoming available. Even if it does, what platforms will it support? That's really the beauty of Kinesis's onboard mapping: OS independence....

It's nice that they upgraded the models (conveniently reducing SKUs), but how many months till they are actually in stock?

[Input Nirvana]

I would probably buy one if:
1. It was offered again with red switches
2. The programming software was available
3. It was sold on Amazon with Prime free 2-day shipping

I agree with Sordna.
I'm glad the guy is still doing things, but....
I hate being a weenie, but I'll believe the programming when I see it, and I would feel better purchasing from a retailer that had it in stock.

I won't borrow your board, but thank you for the very cool offer. I do want to try one for a couple weeks. It has some very neat features.

Where's our little buddy Architect?

[dorkvader]

Where's our little buddy Architect?

Quit the forum some time ago, unfortunately.

As has been posted above, I feel programmability would be a better feature than just changing the key layout.

[Tracer]

According to this, https://secure.trulyergonomic.com/index.php?route=information/information&information_id=6
Pre-orders ship today and standard orders start tomorrow.

Programming would be nice, but it is by far not a deal breaker, just an annoyance.

@treigle Would love to try your board but being in Canada, shipping would be stupid and customs might get annoying.

[impiri]

For what it's worth, I haven't yet received any sort of shipping notification from TE. I'm not holding out much hope for a way to reprogram the keyboard, either. (Prove me wrong, TE!)

The new key layout looks much better to me. Del should get a good workout, and ~ is back home next to the 1.

[Tracer]

Regular orders are up.
If my last order is any indication, my keyboard has shipped, they just didn't bother changing the status.

[fatchoi]

For what it's worth, I haven't yet received any sort of shipping notification from TE. I'm not holding out much hope for a way to reprogram the keyboard, either. (Prove me wrong, TE!)

The new key layout looks much better to me. Del should get a good workout, and ~ is back home next to the 1.

I got the shipping email 12 hours before. International order.

[impiri]

Just received my 209 preorder via FedEx. These shift keys will take some getting used to!

[sordna]

They should have taken the opportunity and swapped the shifts and controls in the 209 back to normal, and let users decide if they want to remap them the other way around, or add a dip switch setting for it, since the remapping software is not available. The shift choice is the most controversial feature of this keyboard.

[Tracer]

My keyboard has been in "Processing" state since Tuesday.
I don't mind the slowness, I do mind the lack of good honest communication from these people.

[jnakano]

Does anyone use TECK 209 models on Mac?
I'm trying to use it, with left space altered to International6, but although with PCKeyboardHack utility, left space is not recognized as key event.
On Windows machines, left space is recognized as International6, I'll believe this problem is not keyboard fault.

Tested Environment is:
Mac OS X 10.6.8
PCKeyboardHack 7.4.0
KeyRemap4MacBook 7.7.0
TECK DIPs: Off On Off On On / Off Off On On On (both is tried)

[jasonwirth]

I am on the bubble about this keyboard given some other user's poor experience with the company. I'm interested in the 209 (former 109) because I use a Mac. From my understanding others have no problem with the left spacebar working on Windows machines out of the box. However, on the Mac they got it working with ControllerMate.

From TE's Website:

International keys on Model 209 or Model 109 don't appear to work

The extra keys of Model 209 and Model 109 are intended for Asian or International layouts/languages, or for Mac OSŪ after setting-up your Model 209. If you want to use them for another language, you can use third party software to reprogram these keys as mentioned in the Installation & Quick Start Guide depending on the Operating System you are using.

If you are using the Mac OSŪ, after setting-up your Model 209, both Ctrl keys on the keyboard become command ⌘ keys, both Alt keys become option keys, both blank lower corner keys become control keys, and the SuperKey becomes an additional command ⌘ key.

Pressing the Fn key along with the F7-F12-Del keys provide special functionality.

Mac users: please note we only recommend Model 209 for Mac OSŪ.

You can also change some settings within Keyboard preferences: Click Apple menu > System Preferences > Keyboard.

As per third party software, you can use KeyRemap4MacBook or ControllerMate.

Gerk, another Geekhack user, got his working:

Ok .. I finally got the left space working. The _only_ thing that seems to pick it up is controller mate. With controller mate running I now get a key code (even in other apps). If I disable the controller mate daemon I get no key code from it at all in any app. Not sure I understand why, but I finally got something that works for me. Worth the $25 to buy it.

I've done some more remapping ... if I decide to keep the new mappings I'll update the info here. So far it seems to be working better for me.

I guess if you can get your keyboard working it's not truly "broken". It kinda sucks that you have to spend another $25 to get the thing working as it should. Someone mentioned before, TE really needs to release key mapping software.

[boli]

Quite nice, the 207 is just the kind of mix between 105 and 109 I wished I had back when I tried the 105 - small number row keys and large modifier keys.

I agree with Sordna that they'd do well by making the Ctrl-Shift swap a changeable option (say by adding an extra DIP switch).

[poetik]

I remember seeing this keyboard like a year or so ago but it still was in pre-order.  Looks like a very cool idea.

[jnakano]

I am on the bubble about this keyboard given some other user's poor experience with the company. I'm interested in the 209 (former 109) because I use a Mac. From my understanding others have no problem with the left spacebar working on Windows machines out of the box. However, on the Mac they got it working with ControllerMate.

I guess if you can get your keyboard working it's not truly "broken". It kinda sucks that you have to spend another $25 to get the thing working as it should. Someone mentioned before, TE really needs to release key mapping software.

I tried some settings with ControllerMate, but they didn't work...(ControllerMate doesn't have any response
with LeftSpace)
I checked USB Raw packet too and I found there are no differences between Model 109's LeftSpace and Model 209's LeftSpace...
hmmm....
Is there anyone using Model 2xx on Mac and working International keys?

[jasonwirth]

I tried some settings with ControllerMate, but they didn't work...(ControllerMate doesn't have any response
with LeftSpace)
I checked USB Raw packet too and I found there are no differences between Model 109's LeftSpace and Model 209's LeftSpace...
hmmm....
Is there anyone using Model 2xx on Mac and working International keys?

No luck huh? That sucks.

It looks like a great keyboard but how can they sell something where the left spacebar doesn't work. I don't even think I use my right hand to press the space bar, the left side of my spacebar has a shiny area from being pressed while the right side is spotless.

Also, I noticed that they extended their refund period from 30 days to 60 days but with a catch, there is a 20% restocking fee.

Our confidence in the quality of our products allows us to provide our customers with a no-questions-asked 60-Day Money Back Guarantee on all our Truly Ergonomic Keyboards.
        60-Day Money Back Guarantee

If after using your Truly Ergonomic Keyboard for a period of up to 60 days from the date of delivery, you are dissatisfied for any reason, you can request a refund.

But then they go on to say...

Please be aware that you must use your Truly Ergonomic Keyboard for at least 30 days to request a Return.

For orders made after July 15th 2012, please note a restocking fee of 20% may be deducted from refunds for items returned within 60 days of purchase and have not incurred material damage and are not missing components included in the original shipment. This policy help us keep costs (and thus prices) down when dealing with the return of items that are not defective. There is no fee for DOA products.

They are SO confident with their product that they charge 20%?!?! What kind of confidence is that?

I'm assuming the buyer pays shipping both ways ($20 x 2); with a $45 restocking fee (20% x $230) charged that amounts to one costly return.

I wonder if customers ordered the keyboard, discovered left-shift didn't work, then sent it back.

[jnakano]

It looks like a great keyboard but how can they sell something where the left spacebar doesn't work. I don't even think I use my right hand to press the space bar, the left side of my spacebar has a shiny area from being pressed while the right side is spotless.

With some dipswitch configuration, this keyboard's left spacebar outputs "International 6" scancode to PC(0x8c).
It helps to setup left spacebar as backspace(like Kinesis Contoured) or something else. Because of it, I usually use right thumb to type spacebar with TECK.
When dipswitch is configured to treat left spacebar as normal spacebar, it works normally.

I wonder if customers ordered the keyboard, discovered left-shift didn't work, then sent it back.

I think money-back gurantee and product warranty are different.
If ordered keyboard doesn't work correctly and it seems to be broken, they will send another keyboard as replacement when you send broken one, I hope.

[jasonwirth]

Well, I finally got off my ass and ordered one. I've been using a Logitech Wave keyboard and a few things about it kill me. The keyboard is very wide, I hate stretching over to reach my trackball. The Logitech, even though it's about 2 years old, has feel somewhat "sticky" and difficult to press. Presumably this is because the plastic key mechanism has worn down through use.

[MykB77]

I recently got my 209 blank, and I have to say, although I am still getting used to the keys in columns... (lower left hand row!!!) I really like this board.  I have used ms ergos for 10 years; now I understand what I have been missing not using a mechanical keyboard.  (1st mech ever)

AutoHotKey has allowed me to do any remappings I wanted to do. 
Is there any drawbacks to using this?  I haven't hit any yet.

[Tracer]

Have both the 209 and 109. I like the tweaks in the 209 and am glad these were made.

I love this keyboard and can't deal with using much of anything else now.

Still make typos though. 

[Tracer]

I wonder if customers ordered the keyboard, discovered left-shift didn't work, then sent it back.

What? Left shift doesn't work?

[daerid]

Even though I'm pretty much going all Topre these days, I might actually spring for one of these. I always like MS's Naturals, and they helped out with my wrists immensely.

[jasonwirth]

Have both the 209 and 109. I like the tweaks in the 209 and am glad these were made.

Do you use it on a Mac or Windows machine (or Linux)?

[MykB77]

Even though I'm pretty much going all Topre these days, I might actually spring for one of these. I always like MS's Naturals, and they helped out with my wrists immensely.

I would try one out, the column for the keys are straight and the rows are arched for your different finger lengths.  Having the split space bar with another button in the middle is really good too.  I still am using MS Ergo 4000's at home but slowly transitioning to the 209.  Left hand is the most difficult to adjust to the bottom row being directly under the middle.  Really like this keyboard, well made, no issues.  I will consider a second one for work.

[Gerk]

And it looks like there's still no software that comes with it (that was promised what ... 3 years ago?).  While I'm glad they are moving forward with their designs I wish they'd finish the job first.

[fatchoi]

I recently got my 209 blank, and I have to say, although I am still getting used to the keys in columns... (lower left hand row!!!) I really like this board.  I have used ms ergos for 10 years; now I understand what I have been missing not using a mechanical keyboard.  (1st mech ever)

AutoHotKey has allowed me to do any remappings I wanted to do. 
Is there any drawbacks to using this?  I haven't hit any yet.

Hm... I'm still thinking what keys to assign, for the lower left and right corner, and top left corner keys...
Any suggestions?

[pyro]

Mouse key modifier, pin window on top / unpin window. Or numbers/symbol modifier keys for your own layers.

[Input Nirvana]

So Architect quit the forum? I guess being called out on some of the ridiculous claims he made was too much for him? I'm still suspicious, I think he was a TE shill. No matter.

The new models are a huge move actually. The guy must have made money.

I really want to try one more than ever now, and will consider buying one in the future.

[kurplop]

I don't know if Architect had other motives or not for his positive comments about the TE keyboard. If he did I guess it worked because I bought one after reading his review. After all, if you can't trust the Geekhacks forum who can you trust?

I've been using a TE 104 since March and except for my Mac not recognizing it at startup I am very happy with it. I even like the shift location in spite of the fact that I forget to change back when I'm using my laptop AND I START TYPING LIKE THIS.

I was concerned that the keyboard wasn't splayed enough for my wrists but it seems to be enough to relieve some of the discomfort I normally have typing. It didn't take long to get use to the stacked keys and the slightly arched rows are more natural to position my hands on.

Probably the thing I dislike the most is the apparent deception and lack of follow through by the distributor that many TE owners have experienced.  I usually will not support a company with such a dubious reputation. Having said that, if I lost my TE104, I'd probably buy another.
 

[Input Nirvana]

Architects posts contained many problems, from his odd and blatant pro TE a year before it shipped, his slamming of Kinesis firmware with problems no one has ever heard of, including Kinesis, and some other items.

The faux Architect aside, the TE has a nice following, and has been earning an ergo reputation with normal types of suggestions for small tweaks to improve. The biggest drawback appears to be the shoddy PR and customer follow up and information. Maybe a price point about $30-40 less as well.

I look forward to trying one someday

[Tracer]

Have both the 209 and 109. I like the tweaks in the 209 and am glad these were made.

Do you use it on a Mac or Windows machine (or Linux)?

Windows and Linux.

[Tracer]

The faux Architect aside, the TE has a nice following, and has been earning an ergo reputation with normal types of suggestions for small tweaks to improve. The biggest drawback appears to be the shoddy PR and customer follow up and information. Maybe a price point about $30-40 less as well.

I have to agree with their communication. I've dealt with them several times. Where it counted, they got back to me.
a. cancelling my initial pre-order after a year of nothing. got money back in a couple of days.
b. asking why my 209 hadn't shipped and got a detailed email apologizing with promise of shipping next day. it did.

I have NEVER gotten a response when asking
a. why the original pre-order kept getting delayed
b. asking weather they will be releasing Cherry MX Red boards again
c. where the reprogramming software is

The board itself is really good quality. I'm happy with the purchase overall even though the company itself has less than stellar marketing and communication policies. If they re-released the Cherry Red version I'd buy another for a total of three!

I also did not pay full price for the two boards I did get. One was 189 the other 179 at various sales they had.

[jasonwirth]

Well my board arrived today. The key placement makes it really strange to type. It's like the first time i switched to Dvorak, I have to imagine where my finger should move before pressing the key.

In particular the keys that give me trouble are:
shift -- i want to press ctrl
backspace & enter/return -- my pinky moves to the "[" key

And my right hand keeps moving over a key to the left.

Let's see what happens with a full day of typing tomorrow at work.

[Gerk]

I have NEVER gotten a response when asking
a. why the original pre-order kept getting delayed
b. asking weather they will be releasing Cherry MX Red boards again
c. where the reprogramming software is

Yep exactly the same for me (except for asking about another cherry red based board and change it for no response when asking about firmware updates for the broken hardware) ... I got a red based board the first time around and am happy with the build quality and the switches ... but what I'm unhappy about is that there's still been no firmware update released to resolve all the problems my board has with macs (which was what I bought it for).  Having to unplug and replug the board constantly when waking my machines from sleep (when you even could wake it) and having to unplug and replug it after each reboot make it pretty boat anchor-ish for me and now that they have moved on to a new model I highly doubt that we'll ever see any software or updates for the original boards.

Unless they actually deliver what they promised (and promised, and promised and made us wait years for) they'll not be getting any more money from me or any recommendations to anyone I know.  It's like buying a car that you have to jump start every time you turn it off ...

[Tracer]

I highly doubt that we'll ever see any software or updates for the original boards.

Having both the 109 and 209, I can assure you that it's not a new board. The only difference I can tell between the old and new board IS firmwear.

[Gerk]

Having both the 109 and 209, I can assure you that it's not a new board. The only difference I can tell between the old and new board IS firmwear.

Hmm does it resolve the waking from sleep and bootup issues on Macs do you know?  I hope they release a freakin' update ... I'd like to use the board again but it's a royal pain having to constantly unplug and replug (which also causes problems with the software I use to remap stuff)

[kurplop]

I was afraid I'd wear out the usb plug so I bought an inexpensive usb switch from Monoprice. It's a simple AB switch. I thought it would be easier to flip a switch rather than constantly unplug, plug the cord into the usb hub. Low tech? Yes. Rinky dink? Yes.  But it does work. It probably won't help your remapping issues but it has saved me a lot of frustration.

I recently got a second computer and the switch lets me effortlessly assign the keyboard to either one saving me buying another TE. Take that Truly Ergonomics!

[Gerk]

That's a good idea kurplop.  I have an old KVM switching kicking around that I could put inline -- I'll have to give that a try when I have time to dig that switch out.

[daerid]

Unfortunately, for a keyboard like this, not being able to reprogram the board is a deal breaker. Maybe one of these days I'll spring for one just to pop it open and replace the chip with a teensy or something else reprogrammable.

[Tracer]

Having both the 109 and 209, I can assure you that it's not a new board. The only difference I can tell between the old and new board IS firmwear.

Hmm does it resolve the waking from sleep and bootup issues on Macs do you know?  I hope they release a freakin' update ... I'd like to use the board again but it's a royal pain having to constantly unplug and replug (which also causes problems with the software I use to remap stuff)

No idea. I don't use Macs except for testing. I have no issues with Windows or Linux.

[nomaded]

I've been happy with my 109 since getting it at the beginning of this year. I have one at work, on a Win7 box, and one at home, on an iMac. Well, actually, I've been happy, up until the 0 key on my work one started flaking out. Trying to get in touch with the guy to see what can be done about it.

As for remapping, I've had no problems with mapping on either keyboard. On Win7, I used KeyTweak to get my changes into the registry, so that I'd have them at the login screen. On OSX, I use both KeyRemap4MacBook and PCKeyboardHack. I haven't quite figured out how to get the remapping to work on the login screen, though.

Since I type Dvorak, I have made the following changes:

- Left space -> Backspace
- Left control -> Left shift
- Left shift -> Left Control
- ' -> / (/ is 'z' in Dvorak)
- Right alt -> Right control
- Right control -> Right shift
- Right shift -> ' (' is - in Dvorak)

At home, on OSX, I have the same changes, with the addition of Backspace -> Cmd.

Since I've seen several comments about how PCKeyboardHack doesn't seem to work in getting Left space -> Backspace, I'll check how I have it setup because it works fine for me, as long as I'm logged in, with KeyRemap4MacBook running. And I have no comments about the sleep issue since I don't sleep my iMac, but it reboots fine.

[tbaker000]

Got my new TEK 209 and decided that I needed to refresh my typing skills and went to this site to practice: http://www.powertyping.com/qwerty/lessonsq.htm
Unfortunately, after practicing for a while my (windows 7) machine rebooted.
I can reproduce this every time with the 209 but not with other standard keyboards.
Add another item to the of list things they will not respond to

Can anybody else reproduce this?

[Tracer]

Got my new TEK 209 and decided that I needed to refresh my typing skills and went to this site to practice: http://www.powertyping.com/qwerty/lessonsq.htm
Unfortunately, after practicing for a while my (windows 7) machine rebooted.
I can reproduce this every time with the 209 but not with other standard keyboards.
Add another item to the of list things they will not respond to

Can anybody else reproduce this?

I use the 109 and 209 daily in Windows 7 Pro (Home/Work) and have never had this issue.

[Tracer]

Unfortunately, for a keyboard like this, not being able to reprogram the board is a deal breaker. Maybe one of these days I'll spring for one just to pop it open and replace the chip with a teensy or something else reprogrammable.

I use KeyTweak for Windows. I can't imagine that similar software doesn't exist for other OSes. Yes, it's annoying there is no programming software, but it's not a deal breaker in any way. I can't use the default layout of this keyboard and never have. Mine you, having to use software like KeyTweak to go from QWERTY to DWORAK would be a huge pain. (Don't know how extensive your reprogramming will be)

[SilverRubicon]

Hmm does it resolve the waking from sleep and bootup issues on Macs do you know?

I did not know about this issue prior to purchasing my 209.  I have NOT had to plug and unplug the keyboard from the MBP nor have I had any other issues with waking.  I do have it plugged into USB hub.  I'd say that this issue has been resolved.

[Gerk]

Unfortunately, for a keyboard like this, not being able to reprogram the board is a deal breaker. Maybe one of these days I'll spring for one just to pop it open and replace the chip with a teensy or something else reprogrammable.

I use KeyTweak for Windows. I can't imagine that similar software doesn't exist for other OSes. Yes, it's annoying there is no programming software, but it's not a deal breaker in any way. I can't use the default layout of this keyboard and never have. Mine you, having to use software like KeyTweak to go from QWERTY to DWORAK would be a huge pain. (Don't know how extensive your reprogramming will be)

It's a deal breaker when they advertised for 1.5 years (and already had our money) that this keyboard would come with reprogramming software that worked in all OSes ... and then it didn't.  And now they don't even mention it on their site.   When I paid for this board that was supposed to be part of the deal.  Doesn't instil much faith in their promises and if someone wanted to go after them for it legally they would probably win and the TE folks would either have to deliver the software or refund some money to everyone that purchased.

Hmm does it resolve the waking from sleep and bootup issues on Macs do you know?

I did not know about this issue prior to purchasing my 209.  I have NOT had to plug and unplug the keyboard from the MBP nor have I had any other issues with waking.  I do have it plugged into USB hub.  I'd say that this issue has been resolved.

That's good to hear at the very least.  Now I wish they would release the firmware update so that my keyboard could work like this.  They do still specifically say on their site that OSX users may experience problems and have to unplug/replug .. so maybe you just got lucky or it doesn't affect your specific hardware combination.  I also plug mine into a hub and have this problem (in fact last night I noticed that I had to unplug the keyboard in order to boot up my machine after clearing the PRAM or it wouldn't even boot).  After first boot then I am able to cold start with it plugged in -- but then I do have to unplug/re-plug to get it to actually register and work in the OS.

That all sounds like buggy firmware to me so let's hope they at least make some sort of effort to fix it.

[Tracer]

Unfortunately, for a keyboard like this, not being able to reprogram the board is a deal breaker. Maybe one of these days I'll spring for one just to pop it open and replace the chip with a teensy or something else reprogrammable.

I use KeyTweak for Windows. I can't imagine that similar software doesn't exist for other OSes. Yes, it's annoying there is no programming software, but it's not a deal breaker in any way. I can't use the default layout of this keyboard and never have. Mine you, having to use software like KeyTweak to go from QWERTY to DWORAK would be a huge pain. (Don't know how extensive your reprogramming will be)

It's a deal breaker when they advertised for 1.5 years (and already had our money) that this keyboard would come with reprogramming software that worked in all OSes ... and then it didn't.  And now they don't even mention it on their site.   When I paid for this board that was supposed to be part of the deal.  Doesn't instil much faith in their promises and if someone wanted to go after them for it legally they would probably win and the TE folks would either have to deliver the software or refund some money to everyone that purchased.

They do mention it on their site:
https://secure.trulyergonomic.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=20_69
https://secure.trulyergonomic.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=79_75#Application

And it took them a year of delays just to get the keyboard out and made. Yes, you can criticize their poor communication and updates all you want, and I will agree. Considering how obvious that this is a mom and pop operation though, I can't really complain about the delays much. I have faith the software will come. When? Who knows..  but considering this is the closest thing that exists to my ideal keyboard, griping over reprogrammable firmware is rather minor at least for me.

[Gerk]

They do mention it on their site:
https://secure.trulyergonomic.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=20_69
https://secure.trulyergonomic.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=79_75#Application

And it took them a year of delays just to get the keyboard out and made. Yes, you can criticize their poor communication and updates all you want, and I will agree. Considering how obvious that this is a mom and pop operation though, I can't really complain about the delays much. I have faith the software will come. When? Who knows..  but considering this is the closest thing that exists to my ideal keyboard, griping over reprogrammable firmware is rather minor at least for me.

I'm glad for you then if this is the closest thing that exists to your ideal keyboard.  It's kind of far from mine hence the need to reprogram keys.  At this point I have little faith the software will come, and if it does by that point in time I may have completely given up on the keyboard itself.  BTW where it says "click here to learn more" about the software they are supposedly making ... it only then tells you about the third party software you can use.  There is only that one mention of the software on their site now.

As for the year of delay to get the keyboard made, I think you may have jumped into the whole situation later than some of us here ... it was longer than a year unless my memory is fooling me.  They missed their shipping date by over a year (let alone when they first started collecting pre-order money).

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one though because I still feel like I got the pointy end of the stick on this one.  And also worth mentioning there are some things that just don't work on OSX (like the number pad/num lock) and they don't look like they are being addressed.  They certainly still don't work on the new models -- they just made notes about the things that don't work now and blame the OS, but funny enough ALL my other keyboards have no issues with num lock so who's to blame there ...  will we ever get the promised software and/or fixes for the issues with the current hardware's firmware?  I'm kind of doubting it at this point.

[Tracer]

They do mention it on their site:
https://secure.trulyergonomic.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=20_69
https://secure.trulyergonomic.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=79_75#Application

And it took them a year of delays just to get the keyboard out and made. Yes, you can criticize their poor communication and updates all you want, and I will agree. Considering how obvious that this is a mom and pop operation though, I can't really complain about the delays much. I have faith the software will come. When? Who knows..  but considering this is the closest thing that exists to my ideal keyboard, griping over reprogrammable firmware is rather minor at least for me.

I'm glad for you then if this is the closest thing that exists to your ideal keyboard.  It's kind of far from mine hence the need to reprogram keys.

Why did you buy this keyboard if it was so far from your ideal keyboard? Unless you just mean the mapping of the keys. In which case I can sympathise with you. I did not buy this keyboard on pre-order but after it was launched so I knew when purchasing it that I would have to use third party software. I can see having pre-ordered the the expectation of having remapping ability being annoyed.

  At this point I have little faith the software will come, and if it does by that point in time I may have completely given up on the keyboard itself.  BTW where it says "click here to learn more" about the software they are supposedly making ... it only then tells you about the third party software you can use.  There is only that one mention of the software on their site now.

Every product page lists "Reprogrammable" as a feature. Honestly, from what I remember this is about the same amount of content about the reprogramability of the keyboard as has always existed.

As for the year of delay to get the keyboard made, I think you may have jumped into the whole situation later than some of us here ... it was longer than a year unless my memory is fooling me.  They missed their shipping date by over a year (let alone when they first started collecting pre-order money).

I had actually preordered when the preorders had first started. I then cancelled the preorder and got my money back. I still have all my emails since signing up to the original mailing list for initial pre-orders.
Initial preorders were taken in Oct. 2010.
Expectations where around the holiday time frame for shipping. 
Got my money back in March.
Keyboards didn't ship until Jan-Feb of this year.
So about 1 year in delays (+/- 1 mont).

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one though because I still feel like I got the pointy end of the stick on this one.  And also worth mentioning there are some things that just don't work on OSX (like the number pad/num lock) and they don't look like they are being addressed.  They certainly still don't work on the new models -- they just made notes about the things that don't work now and blame the OS, but funny enough ALL my other keyboards have no issues with num lock so who's to blame there ...  will we ever get the promised software and/or fixes for the issues with the current hardware's firmware?  I'm kind of doubting it at this point.

This is the first really valid issue you've brought up. And this could also be pointing to why all the delays in the software. I can imagine them wanting to fix bugs in their keyboards basic functionality before features like repgrograming, especially with 3rd party software filling the gap.

I can see why you are frustrated, the company presented it self as a far more professional outfit then it really is. By now it's clear that it's a guy and his wife. All CS emails come from the same women, Michelle, and the keyboards were designed by a guy whos FB profile eludes me right now. However I do not feel they are in it to screw anyone. I feel that they are showing dedication to the product if anything, which can be seen in the fact that they have revised the keyboard already in the companies short life span.

If it's any help, provided you have a 109/209 model, I'll take the keyboard off your hands if you really don't want it anymore.

[Gerk]

Yep my email was in and around the same time frame for the pre-order as well so I overstated the time frame.

The hardware portion of things is close to my ideal but the key layouts are terrible for me.  I knew that going into it and was counting on decent re-programmability being part of the package.  I have made lots of tweaks and have the layout the way I want with the commercial software for the most part now but am still bitter I had to dish out for commercial software to do what I needed to do with this board (and KeyRemap4MacBook didn't get the job done).  Also as I say it doesn't work before a user actually logs in, which means that any single user and/or logging in makes it pretty useless if you do any key remapping.

The killer thing for me on this in terms of remapping is all the "geek" keys ... I code all day long every day and the disparity of location for all the things like [] {} - _ = + / ? \ | ' " are very difficult for me to deal with and still be able to get a decent amount of work done without ripping out my hair.  On a more typical keyboard layout they are all in a big group, but on the TE layouts the consideration for the location of those keys played second fiddle to the qwerty layout.  If I typed standard english/textual based stuff all day long I would probably be fine with the layout, but not for coding -- and unfortunately I code on all my machines on a regular basis.  Ideally I would love to be able to reprogram the layout on the board itself (like they Kinesis) but that's not going to happen.  I'm just hoping that their remapping software is low level enough to do what I want it to do.

Lastly I respect the Mom and Pop stuff and the failing I've had with them is twofold.  First and foremost the constant slipping date and secondly while I understand they want to move the hardware platform forward I think that they only did 75% of the job and have already moved on to the next project without finishing what they promised all the pre-orders for so long.  I've had to deal with a lot of that over the years with various types of hardware (admittedly usually much more expensive than a keyboard!) and I've just seen way too much abandonware when it comes to early adopters.  They tend to make promises for drivers/updates/whatever and then just never deliver, eventually moving up 3 hardware revisions, and then drop support for the early adopters and the original hardware if/when they do release the software.  As for holding off to fix bugs I'm all for that as well as I would rather have good code than buggy code any day, but at the same time something would be better than nothing.  They were never really that forthcoming with information which makes it more frustrating either.  So are they really working on it, or is the cheque in the mail (i.e. they haven't gotten to it yet but intend to at some point).

For now I'm going to hold on to it and see how things play out, but I may take you up on that offer in the future.  My board is a 109 w/ reds.

[c64]

The 104 is on sale for $179. Is the 207 worth $50 more?

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I purchased the 109 and then 209 so that I could use the extra keys provided by these keyboards to map keys to more closely match a "regular" keyboard. So I have cntrl, alt and shift in a more natural position. This would be impossible with the 104/105.

So it all depends on you. I personally wouldn't do it. Mind you, I also purchased both my 109 and 209 on sale for $170-180.

[c64]

I purchased the 109 and then 209 so that I could use the extra keys provided by these keyboards to map keys to more closely match a "regular" keyboard. So I have cntrl, alt and shift in a more natural position. This would be impossible with the 104/105.

So it all depends on you. I personally wouldn't do it. Mind you, I also purchased both my 109 and 209 on sale for $170-180.

Im a bit confused.  So the 209 has keys in a more natural position or you need to buy both to use the keys?

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I purchased the 109 and then 209 so that I could use the extra keys provided by these keyboards to map keys to more closely match a "regular" keyboard. So I have cntrl, alt and shift in a more natural position. This would be impossible with the 104/105.

So it all depends on you. I personally wouldn't do it. Mind you, I also purchased both my 109 and 209 on sale for $170-180.

Im a bit confused.  So the 209 has keys in a more natural position or you need to buy both to use the keys?

The 209 and 109 are identical other than their default key mappings.
The reason I like those boards is that they have extra keys so you can have alt and ctrl and subsequently shift and enter in about the position you expect them on a keyboard. You cannot do this on the 104, 105 and 207 models.

The keys I'm talking about are the ones on the bottom left and right. On the 104, 105 and 207, it's one double wide key, on the 109 and 209, it's two keys.