NOW OPEN SOURCE!!! swill's plate building tool [builder.swillkb.com]

[swill]

I really want to get a custom-swill made, I personally just use the builder for plates, I use 60% cases, drill PCB's to support non-standard layouts, but I want to try completely custom layouts and hand-wired keyboards, as the builder is intended to produce, for an outsider, the challenges are:

1) Screws, bumpons (Especially challenging for people outside US, especially the screws, they really determine the quality of the keyboard in a custom-produced keyboard)
2) Producers, materials, quality (Like BigBlueSaw, lasergist, different materials, different challenges)

A proposed solution: Builder blog -or- builds-only-thread - Where every post, or entry, in this thread/blog is a keyboard, with every screw, every component linked(source), so others can purchase/acquire the same materials, use the same production companies too

If I was in US, this wouldn't be much of an issue, I could just go ahead and try once, then retry, then retry, but as someone not in U.S., even one try will cost me more in terms of time and money, considering customs, ordering efforts etc. - so basically I want to do it once and do it right (for each layout, idea) - and It's super challenging to find information, such a collective would solve the issue

I like this idea.  There are a couple features in the works which will start to make some of this easier.

- Custom cutout and addition polygons added to any layer.  This means that a board built with the tool will be reproducible and ideally no one will need to make any modifications outside the tool (additional holes, etc...).
- I am in the process of working out the details for including 'Presets' and with that feature will be the ability to 'Save' and 'Load' a configuration.  This will let you create, save, iterate, save, share, etc...  It will make it much easier for people to be able to post pictures of a case they built and include a JSON file which can be loaded into the builder to produce the exact same case.  In combination with the above new feature, this will make the builder much more flexible and shareable.

As I get through these features I will keep this idea in mind so I can hopefully make this easy to do.  Nice ideas.  Thanks... 

[duynguyenle]

I really want to get a custom-swill made, I personally just use the builder for plates, I use 60% cases, drill PCB's to support non-standard layouts, but I want to try completely custom layouts and hand-wired keyboards, as the builder is intended to produce, for an outsider, the challenges are:

1) Screws, bumpons (Especially challenging for people outside US, especially the screws, they really determine the quality of the keyboard in a custom-produced keyboard)
2) Producers, materials, quality (Like BigBlueSaw, lasergist, different materials, different challenges)

A proposed solution: Builder blog -or- builds-only-thread - Where every post, or entry, in this thread/blog is a keyboard, with every screw, every component linked(source), so others can purchase/acquire the same materials, use the same production companies too

If I was in US, this wouldn't be much of an issue, I could just go ahead and try once, then retry, then retry, but as someone not in U.S., even one try will cost me more in terms of time and money, considering customs, ordering efforts etc. - so basically I want to do it once and do it right (for each layout, idea) - and It's super challenging to find information, such a collective would solve the issue

There's your problem right there, ordering things from the US. It's gonna be much more cost-effective for you to find a machining shop in your region instead, that will cut out a lot of the costs associated with making plates.

Fasteners (nuts, bolts and rivets etc...), bumpons, lubricants etc etc are all standard parts, you can usually source them from any competent hardware store or DIY retailer, usually by the bagful for dirt cheap (ebay or your local equivalent will have a lot of stuff too). Drills and taps are also available in standard sizes, and if you don't want to invest in your own tools, there are a lot of companies that will rent you some professional tools for short term use. Worst come to worst, you could always try auto garages or mechanics, they will usually have most of the relevant tools and you can ask them to let you use some of their tools if you ask really nicely or offer to pay a nominal fee.

Just being resourceful and thinking a bit outside the box will get you a long way, I remember back when I was a student, I used to stay in lab shops after hours to use some of their tools, metal files and bending presses because I didn't want to buy my own tools and even if I did, my student accommodation wouldn't have any room to store them. 

[KHAANNN]

I really want to get a custom-swill made, I personally just use the builder for plates, I use 60% cases, drill PCB's to support non-standard layouts, but I want to try completely custom layouts and hand-wired keyboards, as the builder is intended to produce, for an outsider, the challenges are:

1) Screws, bumpons (Especially challenging for people outside US, especially the screws, they really determine the quality of the keyboard in a custom-produced keyboard)
2) Producers, materials, quality (Like BigBlueSaw, lasergist, different materials, different challenges)

A proposed solution: Builder blog -or- builds-only-thread - Where every post, or entry, in this thread/blog is a keyboard, with every screw, every component linked(source), so others can purchase/acquire the same materials, use the same production companies too

If I was in US, this wouldn't be much of an issue, I could just go ahead and try once, then retry, then retry, but as someone not in U.S., even one try will cost me more in terms of time and money, considering customs, ordering efforts etc. - so basically I want to do it once and do it right (for each layout, idea) - and It's super challenging to find information, such a collective would solve the issue

There's your problem right there, ordering things from the US. It's gonna be much more cost-effective for you to find a machining shop in your region instead, that will cut out a lot of the costs associated with making plates.

Fasteners (nuts, bolts and rivets etc...), bumpons, lubricants etc etc are all standard parts, you can usually source them from any competent hardware store or DIY retailer, usually by the bagful for dirt cheap (ebay or your local equivalent will have a lot of stuff too). Drills and taps are also available in standard sizes, and if you don't want to invest in your own tools, there are a lot of companies that will rent you some professional tools for short term use. Worst come to worst, you could always try auto garages or mechanics, they will usually have most of the relevant tools and you can ask them to let you use some of their tools if you ask really nicely or offer to pay a nominal fee.

Just being resourceful and thinking a bit outside the box will get you a long way, I remember back when I was a student, I used to stay in lab shops after hours to use some of their tools, metal files and bending presses because I didn't want to buy my own tools and even if I did, my student accommodation wouldn't have any room to store them. 

U.S. retailers has admirable systems for parts inventorying, some asian countries also have their own resources, where I come from, all your assumptions are wrong

It's nearly impossible to find any kind of decent small screw/nut, large ones are available tho, so if I was building something bigger, your advice would apply

There's also the consideration of "time" - I can't spend days looking for a small nut

[duynguyenle]

I really want to get a custom-swill made, I personally just use the builder for plates, I use 60% cases, drill PCB's to support non-standard layouts, but I want to try completely custom layouts and hand-wired keyboards, as the builder is intended to produce, for an outsider, the challenges are:

1) Screws, bumpons (Especially challenging for people outside US, especially the screws, they really determine the quality of the keyboard in a custom-produced keyboard)
2) Producers, materials, quality (Like BigBlueSaw, lasergist, different materials, different challenges)

A proposed solution: Builder blog -or- builds-only-thread - Where every post, or entry, in this thread/blog is a keyboard, with every screw, every component linked(source), so others can purchase/acquire the same materials, use the same production companies too

If I was in US, this wouldn't be much of an issue, I could just go ahead and try once, then retry, then retry, but as someone not in U.S., even one try will cost me more in terms of time and money, considering customs, ordering efforts etc. - so basically I want to do it once and do it right (for each layout, idea) - and It's super challenging to find information, such a collective would solve the issue

There's your problem right there, ordering things from the US. It's gonna be much more cost-effective for you to find a machining shop in your region instead, that will cut out a lot of the costs associated with making plates.

Fasteners (nuts, bolts and rivets etc...), bumpons, lubricants etc etc are all standard parts, you can usually source them from any competent hardware store or DIY retailer, usually by the bagful for dirt cheap (ebay or your local equivalent will have a lot of stuff too). Drills and taps are also available in standard sizes, and if you don't want to invest in your own tools, there are a lot of companies that will rent you some professional tools for short term use. Worst come to worst, you could always try auto garages or mechanics, they will usually have most of the relevant tools and you can ask them to let you use some of their tools if you ask really nicely or offer to pay a nominal fee.

Just being resourceful and thinking a bit outside the box will get you a long way, I remember back when I was a student, I used to stay in lab shops after hours to use some of their tools, metal files and bending presses because I didn't want to buy my own tools and even if I did, my student accommodation wouldn't have any room to store them. 

U.S. retailers has admirable systems for parts inventorying, some asian countries also have their own resources, where I come from, all your assumptions are wrong

It's nearly impossible to find any kind of decent small screw/nut, large ones are available tho, so if I was building something bigger, your advice would apply

There's also the consideration of "time" - I can't spend days looking for a small nut

Fair dos, whereabouts are you from? I've had limited experiences outside of US, EU and SEA vendors, but standard parts should not be hard to come by. I was able to source parts when I was living at home in Vietnam, often from the most random of places (turns out opticians and optometrists have very good access to small screws and fasteners). Autogarages were also a good place to look, if not for gettings parts straight from them, you can usually ask them about their supply chain and where they get their fasteners from.

[swill]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

[KHAANNN]

Fair dos, whereabouts are you from? I've had limited experiences outside of US, EU and SEA vendors, but standard parts should not be hard to come by. I was able to source parts when I was living at home in Vietnam, often from the most random of places (turns out opticians and optometrists have very good access to small screws and fasteners). Autogarages were also a good place to look, if not for gettings parts straight from them, you can usually ask them about their supply chain and where they get their fasteners from.

Turkey, only screw source I could find in the past: http://cabacivata.com.tr/ <- large screws, bought 100x screws for one motorcycle screw I needed

Some RC stores have some random RC screws, probably with 100x markup

Even in U.S. it's kind of a challenge to find the "best" looking screw/nut combos, in my eyes, almost impossible in many other countries

Keep in mind that I'm chasing the dream keyboard, some keyboards cost up to $1000 when you factor things in, I'm trying to access things practically, so too much research for a screw is not something that I like to do again, as I did it once for some missing 60% case screws

I think we might have some generational differences too, I'm around 25, spoiled by the ease of access the internet-era brings, going the brick-and-mortar route is unthinkable, especially in Turkey

[swill]

Fair dos, whereabouts are you from? I've had limited experiences outside of US, EU and SEA vendors, but standard parts should not be hard to come by. I was able to source parts when I was living at home in Vietnam, often from the most random of places (turns out opticians and optometrists have very good access to small screws and fasteners). Autogarages were also a good place to look, if not for gettings parts straight from them, you can usually ask them about their supply chain and where they get their fasteners from.

Turkey, only screw source I could find in the past: http://cabacivata.com.tr/ <- large screws, bought 100x screws for one motorcycle screw I needed

Some RC stores have some random RC screws, probably with 100x markup

Even in U.S. it's kind of a challenge to find the "best" looking screw/nut combos, in my eyes, almost impossible in many other countries

Keep in mind that I'm chasing the dream keyboard, some keyboards cost up to $1000 when you factor things in, I'm trying to access things practically, so too much research for a screw is not something that I like to do again, as I did it once for some missing 60% case screws

I think we might have some generational differences too, I'm around 25, spoiled by the ease of access the internet-era brings, going the brick-and-mortar route is unthinkable, especially in Turkey

I buy most of my components from eBay. Quality is not great, but good for an inexpensive solution.

[KHAANNN]

This project inspired me recently by the way: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=71551.msg2249663#msg2249663
The OP also has another interesting solution for keeping things together: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=71551.msg1734427#msg1734427

I might not be assessing things clearly, but, the screws make or break the keyboard in my opinion, ideally, it would be great to have a recessed plate and a matching screw combo as http://winkeyless.kr/ uses

But I think there are other elegant solutions out there that would match well with water/laser cut parts

My ultimate point is, it would be nice to have options in one place

[duynguyenle]

This project inspired me recently by the way: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=71551.msg2249663#msg2249663
The OP also has another interesting solution for keeping things together: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=71551.msg1734427#msg1734427

I might not be assessing things clearly, but, the screws make or break the keyboard in my opinion, ideally, it would be great to have a recessed plate and a matching screw combo as http://winkeyless.kr/ uses

But I think there are other elegant solutions out there that would match well with water/laser cut parts

My ultimate point is, it would be nice to have options in one place

Turkey... Jeeze, I thought you lived in some really remote places...

I did a cursory search, it seems the two major electronics/parts supplier (Digikey and Farnell) have dedicated Turkish sites available. A quick search of Farnell's catalogue shows plenty of M3 machine screws available (which is a pretty sensible size for keyboard fasteners). I think by 'recessed plate and screw combo', you're probably looking for a countersunk head (or a socket head if you want to counterbore your plate, which would need to be fairly thick plate). Fasteners are cheap, you can get a bag of 100 screws for about 3 Euros, shipping shouldn't be too bad to Turkey, these big companies all have dedicated warehouses serving the EU region.

You should start here:
http://www.digikey.com.tr/
Or here:
http://tr.farnell.com/

For example, using a search for M3 screws with countersunk filter, I found this:
http://tr.farnell.com/duratool/m316-krstmcz100/screw-pozi-csk-steel-bzp-m3x16/dp/1420400
Which is a zinc coated machine screw, these are more or less suitable. You can paint the heads on these if you want to match it to your plate.

Feet, bumpons etc... are also availble, with a bit of searching:
http://tr.farnell.com/3m/sj5302trans/feet-polyurethane-2-2x7-9mm-pk144/dp/1165067
(that was a pack of 144, which is probably more than you need, but you get my point. They're not hard to find, you just have to do a bit of searching and know what keywords or filters to use.

Hope this helps in your quest for the perfect keyboard.



On a separate note, @swill: Maybe this would be helpful to put in your documentation? Would be a great resources to help people find parts for their build. I know Farnell is very popular in Europe, and they carry a lot of useful parts.

[swill]

On a separate note, @swill: Maybe this would be helpful to put in your documentation? Would be a great resources to help people find parts for their build. I know Farnell is very popular in Europe, and they carry a lot of useful parts.

Ya. Adding a resources section with links to these types of things makes a lot of sense.

[KHAANNN]

Thanks, duynguyenle, it does help, and I genuinely know you mean well

But the devil is in the details, as you see most of these are bulk-sale items, digikey seems to have a $75 min-shipping cost, to top them off, sometimes customs hold these items, and you get to explain why you bought 200 screws etc. They laugh when you explain they don't sell less then 200 and you bought 200 for 2 of the item etc. (If I could get everything from Digikey, the $75 cost could be gulpable) - also, chellenges of living in Turkey, I can't order multiple international items at once, I can only safely order one thing at a time, and it takes 3-4 weeks for them to reach me (again, customs people hate regular people)

Anyway, my ultimate solution to all these problems is Shipito, buy them from US, batch them, re-declare them to be customs-friendly, send them to yourself in a batch - so now, practically, I can shop like I'm in the US, it's wonderous when buying small things like these

But still, even with all these experiences, it's unclear which parts are ideal for usage on keyboards

And again, this is my ultimate point, it would be nice to have a "vetted" list of parts, collected by our community

[swill]

And again, this is my ultimate point, it would be nice to have a "vetted" list of parts, collected by our community

Yes. Having a resources section that lists vendors and parts that are known to work will be nice. Also a build log site which let's people upload the details of their projects and the vendors they used would complement that we'll.

[duynguyenle]

Thanks, duynguyenle, it does help, and I genuinely know you mean well

But the devil is in the details, as you see most of these are bulk-sale items, digikey seems to have a $75 min-shipping cost, to top them off, sometimes customs hold these items, and you get to explain why you bought 200 screws etc. They laugh when you explain they don't sell less then 200 and you bought 200 for 2 of the item etc. (If I could get everything from Digikey, the $75 cost could be gulpable) - also, chellenges of living in Turkey, I can't order multiple international items at once, I can only safely order one thing at a time, and it takes 3-4 weeks for them to reach me (again, customs people hate regular people)

Anyway, my ultimate solution to all these problems is Shipito, buy them from US, batch them, re-declare them to be customs-friendly, send them to yourself in a batch - so now, practically, I can shop like I'm in the US, it's wonderous when buying small things like these

But still, even with all these experiences, it's unclear which parts are ideal for usage on keyboards

And again, this is my ultimate point, it would be nice to have a "vetted" list of parts, collected by our community

Bleh, I don't like the sound of your country's customs agency. They sound really douchey.

[timmah]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

Not sure I understand everything, but pretty much what I was imagining - amazing!

On the topic of bolts, screws and nuts. How about an option in the builder for a cutout of the screw-head as well as for the nut?! This option could be part of the mount holes section. I imagine some people do not want the screw-head or the nut to stick out of surface. The option could include normal cylindrical as well as a cone cu- out with values such as depth, width and for cones, top width and bottom width (although bottom width = screw diameter?!).

I suppose this can be solved with your polygon function? Just not sure how one would go about placing the polygons reliably on top of the mount holes.

And I have another question - again not sure on the terminology. The builder is for poker and sandwich build. Is it possible to realize a "classic" case with top bottom part and bottom and the plate inside the case?

[duynguyenle]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

Not sure I understand everything, but pretty much what I was imagining - amazing!

On the topic of bolts, screws and nuts. How about an option in the builder for a cutout of the screw-head as well as for the nut?! This option could be part of the mount holes section. I imagine some people do not want the screw-head or the nut to stick out of surface. The option could include normal cylindrical as well as a cone cu- out with values such as depth, width and for cones, top width and bottom width (although bottom width = screw diameter?!).

I suppose this can be solved with your polygon function? Just not sure how one would go about placing the polygons reliably on top of the mount holes.

And I have another question - again not sure on the terminology. The builder is for poker and sandwich build. Is it possible to realize a "classic" case with top bottom part and bottom and the plate inside the case?

You mean a countersink or a counterbore cut? Countersink is certainly doable, and countersink drillbits have well-defined standards that you can follow. But keeping in mind Swill's tool is currently a 2D geometry generator only, you would have to import the drawing into your CAD package of choice and generate the countersinks yourself. Seeing as the aim of the tool is to generate cutting paths for laser or waterjet, it doesn't make too much sense to incorporate countersinks, as that would be a postprocessing step. You're probably better off doing it manually countersink the holes yourself.

As for counterboring, I imagine it is probably not too relevant to switchplates, as you would need a fairly thick plate to do that, again, it would be a post-process step, you can't counterbore or countersink with a waterjet or laser cutter.

[tobsn]

i'm in the same boat here in poland... production is a ****ing mess. i can't buy M3  screws in any store here so i had to order them all online. i'm still trying to find a source for lead free solder and solder paste. it's a ****ing nightmare. i found a very cheap metal laser cutter in town, same for plastics. but response time of those people is crazy slow... my biggest problem right now is that i can't even countersink my m3 holes because i don't have a bench drill and there is nobody i know or any workshop you can do it in. i'd literally have to buy a bench drill to drill 16 countersink holes. i already bought a countersink drill bit which i to order t online forbes for $17... because after visiting 8 stores i gave up.

anyway, shipping from US sources is a nightmare. my signature plastics order is currently stuck in customs and who knows, maybe they send it back. that's $25 down the drain and if you add that over the price per keycap i'm going to be above $3-4 per single keycap once it's here.

[duynguyenle]

i'm in the same boat here in poland... production is a ****ing mess. i can't buy M3  screws in any store here so i had to order them all online. i'm still trying to find a source for lead free solder and solder paste. it's a ****ing nightmare. i found a very cheap metal laser cutter in town, same for plastics. but response time of those people is crazy slow... my biggest problem right now is that i can't even countersink my m3 holes because i don't have a bench drill and there is nobody i know or any workshop you can do it in. i'd literally have to buy a bench drill to drill 16 countersink holes. i already bought a countersink drill bit which i to order t online forbes for $17... because after visiting 8 stores i gave up.

anyway, shipping from US sources is a nightmare. my signature plastics order is currently stuck in customs and who knows, maybe they send it back. that's $25 down the drain and if you add that over the price per keycap i'm going to be above $3-4 per single keycap once it's here.

That sucks... I'm lucky enough to have hardware stores around and ebay takes care of the rest... It would be useful if we can start some sort of repository for best practice and vendors for sourcing parts for different countries. I'm just amazed that it seems so difficult to get basic standard parts such as bolts and nuts, seems crazy! Maybe I'm just spoilt for choice.

[KHAANNN]

i'm in the same boat here in poland... production is a ****ing mess. i can't buy M3  screws in any store here so i had to order them all online. i'm still trying to find a source for lead free solder and solder paste. it's a ****ing nightmare. i found a very cheap metal laser cutter in town, same for plastics. but response time of those people is crazy slow... my biggest problem right now is that i can't even countersink my m3 holes because i don't have a bench drill and there is nobody i know or any workshop you can do it in. i'd literally have to buy a bench drill to drill 16 countersink holes. i already bought a countersink drill bit which i to order t online forbes for $17... because after visiting 8 stores i gave up.

anyway, shipping from US sources is a nightmare. my signature plastics order is currently stuck in customs and who knows, maybe they send it back. that's $25 down the drain and if you add that over the price per keycap i'm going to be above $3-4 per single keycap once it's here.

While I have no idea about countersink drilling, can you do it with a Dremel and the Dremel's drill-stand (might be a stupid advice, onto my useful advice ->)

If you buy a lot of keyboard related stuff, I strongly suggest Shipito, they are not super cheap, but they combine packages and you can re-declare them, send them with DHL if you want - It's risky but I usually choose DHL and get things in 2-3 days without any customs hassle (if you know the limits) - and from my experience, my plates and PCB's always arrived safe (it's again risky tho, since plates can bend)

The plate bending, acrylic breaking should be a universal issue with international shipping - especially at customs, usually they open the package, but don't repack it well, keycaps arrive scratched, plates might arrive broken or bent

[timmah]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

Not sure I understand everything, but pretty much what I was imagining - amazing!

On the topic of bolts, screws and nuts. How about an option in the builder for a cutout of the screw-head as well as for the nut?! This option could be part of the mount holes section. I imagine some people do not want the screw-head or the nut to stick out of surface. The option could include normal cylindrical as well as a cone cu- out with values such as depth, width and for cones, top width and bottom width (although bottom width = screw diameter?!).

I suppose this can be solved with your polygon function? Just not sure how one would go about placing the polygons reliably on top of the mount holes.

And I have another question - again not sure on the terminology. The builder is for poker and sandwich build. Is it possible to realize a "classic" case with top bottom part and bottom and the plate inside the case?

You mean a countersink or a counterbore cut? Countersink is certainly doable, and countersink drillbits have well-defined standards that you can follow. But keeping in mind Swill's tool is currently a 2D geometry generator only, you would have to import the drawing into your CAD package of choice and generate the countersinks yourself. Seeing as the aim of the tool is to generate cutting paths for laser or waterjet, it doesn't make too much sense to incorporate countersinks, as that would be a postprocessing step. You're probably better off doing it manually countersink the holes yourself.

As for counterboring, I imagine it is probably not too relevant to switchplates, as you would need a fairly thick plate to do that, again, it would be a post-process step, you can't counterbore or countersink with a waterjet or laser cutter.

Thanks, this clears some things for me as I do not know anything about the production steps as of yet. Only one way to learn

Is it generally possible to CNC a case based on the tool outputs?

[duynguyenle]

Thanks, this clears some things for me as I do not know anything about the production steps as of yet. Only one way to learn

Is it generally possible to CNC a case based on the tool outputs?

A case? Yes sure but the tool at the moment is relatively limited, it's basically a sandwich case. If you want to produce something like a TEX case, you would have to model it yourself I think, then have it prototyped by a machining shop.

[swill]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

Not sure I understand everything, but pretty much what I was imagining - amazing!

On the topic of bolts, screws and nuts. How about an option in the builder for a cutout of the screw-head as well as for the nut?! This option could be part of the mount holes section. I imagine some people do not want the screw-head or the nut to stick out of surface. The option could include normal cylindrical as well as a cone cu- out with values such as depth, width and for cones, top width and bottom width (although bottom width = screw diameter?!).

I suppose this can be solved with your polygon function? Just not sure how one would go about placing the polygons reliably on top of the mount holes.

And I have another question - again not sure on the terminology. The builder is for poker and sandwich build. Is it possible to realize a "classic" case with top bottom part and bottom and the plate inside the case?

I currently can't support anything that is not a perpendicular cut all the way through a layer.

Not sure I understand what a classic case would be. You can use multiple closed and open layers to build up the middle layers of a sandwich case. This gives you a pretty standard case.

[swill]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

Not sure I understand everything, but pretty much what I was imagining - amazing!

On the topic of bolts, screws and nuts. How about an option in the builder for a cutout of the screw-head as well as for the nut?! This option could be part of the mount holes section. I imagine some people do not want the screw-head or the nut to stick out of surface. The option could include normal cylindrical as well as a cone cu- out with values such as depth, width and for cones, top width and bottom width (although bottom width = screw diameter?!).

I suppose this can be solved with your polygon function? Just not sure how one would go about placing the polygons reliably on top of the mount holes.

And I have another question - again not sure on the terminology. The builder is for poker and sandwich build. Is it possible to realize a "classic" case with top bottom part and bottom and the plate inside the case?

You mean a countersink or a counterbore cut? Countersink is certainly doable, and countersink drillbits have well-defined standards that you can follow. But keeping in mind Swill's tool is currently a 2D geometry generator only, you would have to import the drawing into your CAD package of choice and generate the countersinks yourself. Seeing as the aim of the tool is to generate cutting paths for laser or waterjet, it doesn't make too much sense to incorporate countersinks, as that would be a postprocessing step. You're probably better off doing it manually countersink the holes yourself.

As for counterboring, I imagine it is probably not too relevant to switchplates, as you would need a fairly thick plate to do that, again, it would be a post-process step, you can't counterbore or countersink with a waterjet or laser cutter.

Yes. Countersink in is expected to be a post fab process. I would do it with a drill press if I did that.

For the bottom fastener. I would not use nuts and would instead make the holes in the bottom smaller than the other layers and tap them. This means you don't need anything sticking out the bottom of the case.

[swill]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

Not sure I understand everything, but pretty much what I was imagining - amazing!

On the topic of bolts, screws and nuts. How about an option in the builder for a cutout of the screw-head as well as for the nut?! This option could be part of the mount holes section. I imagine some people do not want the screw-head or the nut to stick out of surface. The option could include normal cylindrical as well as a cone cu- out with values such as depth, width and for cones, top width and bottom width (although bottom width = screw diameter?!).

I suppose this can be solved with your polygon function? Just not sure how one would go about placing the polygons reliably on top of the mount holes.

And I have another question - again not sure on the terminology. The builder is for poker and sandwich build. Is it possible to realize a "classic" case with top bottom part and bottom and the plate inside the case?

You mean a countersink or a counterbore cut? Countersink is certainly doable, and countersink drillbits have well-defined standards that you can follow. But keeping in mind Swill's tool is currently a 2D geometry generator only, you would have to import the drawing into your CAD package of choice and generate the countersinks yourself. Seeing as the aim of the tool is to generate cutting paths for laser or waterjet, it doesn't make too much sense to incorporate countersinks, as that would be a postprocessing step. You're probably better off doing it manually countersink the holes yourself.

As for counterboring, I imagine it is probably not too relevant to switchplates, as you would need a fairly thick plate to do that, again, it would be a post-process step, you can't counterbore or countersink with a waterjet or laser cutter.

Thanks, this clears some things for me as I do not know anything about the production steps as of yet. Only one way to learn

Is it generally possible to CNC a case based on the tool outputs?

CNC is currently not supported because a CNC can not make square corners and the tolerances are too tight to not have square corners.

There are a few different cutouts which people have created that work with CNC machines, but I have not implemented any yet. nudeCNC and I have had some preliminary discussions around collaborating to add the ability to produce CNC compatible output. This is not a short term road map feature though.

[timmah]

Hi,

never built a keyboard myself, but your tool + KLE makes me curious. Just some suggestions for your tool and your documentation

-when building the CAD, you get a "switch layer" which I believe is the plate? This may be confusing for absolute beginners
-the explanations (Question mark Box) are good. This could be improved by adding a model or a real life picture pointing to what the specific options change. Visual aids help a lot imo
-example picture of some cases built with the tool

Things which are probably a lot of work:
-option for bottom side cutouts for rubber feet
-inclination for top/bottom plate
-offset for the holes (5th and upward)

timmah, what do you think of the docs here now?  http://builder-docs.swillkb.com/features/#plate-layout

I am not finished, just getting through sections one at a time as I have time.

Not sure I understand everything, but pretty much what I was imagining - amazing!

On the topic of bolts, screws and nuts. How about an option in the builder for a cutout of the screw-head as well as for the nut?! This option could be part of the mount holes section. I imagine some people do not want the screw-head or the nut to stick out of surface. The option could include normal cylindrical as well as a cone cu- out with values such as depth, width and for cones, top width and bottom width (although bottom width = screw diameter?!).

I suppose this can be solved with your polygon function? Just not sure how one would go about placing the polygons reliably on top of the mount holes.

And I have another question - again not sure on the terminology. The builder is for poker and sandwich build. Is it possible to realize a "classic" case with top bottom part and bottom and the plate inside the case?

You mean a countersink or a counterbore cut? Countersink is certainly doable, and countersink drillbits have well-defined standards that you can follow. But keeping in mind Swill's tool is currently a 2D geometry generator only, you would have to import the drawing into your CAD package of choice and generate the countersinks yourself. Seeing as the aim of the tool is to generate cutting paths for laser or waterjet, it doesn't make too much sense to incorporate countersinks, as that would be a postprocessing step. You're probably better off doing it manually countersink the holes yourself.

As for counterboring, I imagine it is probably not too relevant to switchplates, as you would need a fairly thick plate to do that, again, it would be a post-process step, you can't counterbore or countersink with a waterjet or laser cutter.

Thanks, this clears some things for me as I do not know anything about the production steps as of yet. Only one way to learn

Is it generally possible to CNC a case based on the tool outputs?

CNC is currently not supported because a CNC can not make square corners and the tolerances are too tight to not have square corners.

There are a few different cutouts which people have created that work with CNC machines, but I have not implemented any yet. nudeCNC and I have had some preliminary discussions around collaborating to add the ability to produce CNC compatible output. This is not a short term road map feature though.

Thanks for the responses. Will have to see how I go about this then. I do have access to a CNC machine, but not a laser cutter that can cut through metal (engraving only) or a waterjet.

[tobsn]

While I have no idea about countersink drilling, can you do it with a Dremel and the Dremel's drill-stand (might be a stupid advice, onto my useful advice ->)

If you buy a lot of keyboard related stuff, I strongly suggest Shipito, they are not super cheap, but they combine packages and you can re-declare them, send them with DHL if you want - It's risky but I usually choose DHL and get things in 2-3 days without any customs hassle (if you know the limits) - and from my experience, my plates and PCB's always arrived safe (it's again risky tho, since plates can bend)

The plate bending, acrylic breaking should be a universal issue with international shipping - especially at customs, usually they open the package, but don't repack it well, keycaps arrive scratched, plates might arrive broken or bent

Dremel won't do with a 1.5mm stainless steel plate...
The issue is also not the shipping cost, mostly, its that VAT is calculated (technically illegally) on shipping and product cost, meaning if you order something for $50 + $20 shipping = $70 + 23% tax = $86.1 - so you're ending up having your $50 worth of products costing you $36 in "shipping"... that's the insane part.

btw. props to oshpark, they send stuff marked as merchandise worth $10... meaning no VAT (under $25) and the shipping was free... so that is AMAZING.
(I ordered amoeba one key PCB's)

[IBNobody]

Hey Swill... I have some feedback for your future custom hole project, whenever it makes it out the door.

I recently created this backplate using your existing tool, and I had to customize it to add screw holes and a reset hole. While the screw holes are all in a symmetrical pattern, the reset hole is not.

Here is the final backplate...



But notice that even though the reset hole on the right is in the correct position, ordering this file from Lasergist would have resulted in the top of this plate - the one inside the sandwich - being the finished side.

What I needed was a mirrored plate with the reset on the left side.



How can we handle this with the GUI and Lasergist ordering page?

[swill]

Hey Swill... I have some feedback for your future custom hole project, whenever it makes it out the door.

I recently created this backplate using your existing tool, and I had to customize it to add screw holes and a reset hole. While the screw holes are all in a symmetrical pattern, the reset hole is not.

Here is the final backplate...

Show Image

But notice that even though the reset hole on the right is in the correct position, ordering this file from Lasergist would have resulted in the top of this plate - the one inside the sandwich - being the finished side.

What I needed was a mirrored plate with the reset on the left side.

Show Image

How can we handle this with the GUI and Lasergist ordering page?

You are saying there is a finished and non-finished side on the material that lasergist uses?  I will look into that...

[IBNobody]

You are saying there is a finished and non-finished side on the material that lasergist uses?  I will look into that...

Cool, thank you.

This is what they say on their website regarding the polishing option.

"Typically laser-cut parts have one good side. The top one. By selecting the Polishing add-on, your piece gets polished on both sides right after it gets cut."

So to keep costs down, we would want the top of the switch plate or top plate to be polished/"good" and the bottom of the bottom plate to be polished/"good".

[swill]

You are saying there is a finished and non-finished side on the material that lasergist uses?  I will look into that...

Cool, thank you.

This is what they say on their website regarding the polishing option.

"Typically laser-cut parts have one good side. The top one. By selecting the Polishing add-on, your piece gets polished on both sides right after it gets cut."

So to keep costs down, we would want the top of the switch plate or top plate to be polished/"good" and the bottom of the bottom plate to be polished/"good".

Maybe I can just try to get the "polishing of both sides" option to be the default.    

[IBNobody]

Maybe I can just try to get the "polishing of both sides" option to be the default.   

That would cost a lot. I thought it was a $30 adder or something for my big board. My wallet would weep.

Polished faces are something I want to add to the documentation once you get it fleshed out a bit more.

If you set it up to auto-flip the bottom artwork before sending the data to Lasergist and put a note on your CAD display that says that only the bottom is getting polished, we might be able to get away with keeping this hands-off from the user. Heck, your current tool could technically do it now since it always produces bottoms that are vertically symmetrical.

Something else to consider... I know you were working with Lasergist to get the inner layers optimized... I wonder if we could save costs on the inner layers by not having the top polished at all? On my plate, they polished the top and edges. If I were to buy inner layer pieces, I would only need edges polished.

[swill]

Maybe I can just try to get the "polishing of both sides" option to be the default.   

That would cost a lot. I thought it was a $30 adder or something for my big board. My wallet would weep.

Polished faces are something I want to add to the documentation once you get it fleshed out a bit more.

If you set it up to auto-flip the bottom artwork before sending the data to Lasergist and put a note on your CAD display that says that only the bottom is getting polished, we might be able to get away with keeping this hands-off from the user. Heck, your current tool could technically do it now since it always produces bottoms that are vertically symmetrical.

Something else to consider... I know you were working with Lasergist to get the inner layers optimized... I wonder if we could save costs on the inner layers by not having the top polished at all? On my plate, they polished the top and edges. If I were to buy inner layer pieces, I would only need edges polished.

I need to talk to them to see how we can specialize their service to our needs.  We have a pretty predictable use case, so we may be able to figure out ways to handle this sort of stuff.

[IBNobody]

As a stopgap measure on the hole discussion, would you consider adding another JSON parameter that converts the next key into a hole?

The following parameter...

Code: [Select]

{_h:3},""
...could place a hole of 3mm at the center of the switch rather than placing the switch cutout.

Or you could interpret decals as holes. It would make building plates with extra holes somewhat simple.

[swill]

As a stopgap measure on the hole discussion, would you consider adding another JSON parameter that converts the next key into a hole?

The following parameter...

Code: [Select]

{_h:3},""
...could place a hole of 3mm at the center of the switch rather than placing the switch cutout.

Or you could interpret decals as holes. It would make building plates with extra holes somewhat simple.

That feels pretty ghetto to me.  I would prefer to just solve the problem once in a more elegant and flexible way.

[IBNobody]

That feels pretty ghetto to me.  I would prefer to just solve the problem once in a more elegant and flexible way.

I would want that, too, but you are probably 5-6 months out from getting the full feature. I thought this might be a quick way for you to turn out a feature for advanced users.

[swill]

That feels pretty ghetto to me.  I would prefer to just solve the problem once in a more elegant and flexible way.

I would want that, too, but you are probably 5-6 months out from getting the full feature. I thought this might be a quick way for you to turn out a feature for advanced users.

I just need to find some time that I can focus on this.  It will only take me about 2 weeks to develop it correctly, but I only get like an hour or two a night right now which makes it hard to be productive.  Trying to get all the outdoor renos done before the snow flies, and it looks like winter is coming early this year here in Canada...

[KHAANNN]

By the way, I just re-stumbled onto this (I had it favourited): https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/4umu21/photos_666725_key_build_log/

In terms of screw, hole and spacer-wise, It's a gold mine (and other aspects too :)

[kawasaki161]

I totally forgot that I wanted to post about the cutouts I designed. Turns out I kinda f*ed up the measurements I had, resulting in the cut at the stabwire being too close to the stabhousing and the cut on the other side (where the stabs clip into the PCB) being too far away. I'll post my edited cutout measurements here, I hope there are people here that have access to a 3D printer or a laser cutter and a few scrap pieces of acrylic to test the fitment. In theory it should fit, but you never know for sure.

Here it is, next to one of the cutouts how they come out of the builder.

[swill]

I totally forgot that I wanted to post about the cutouts I designed. Turns out I kinda f*ed up the measurements I had, resulting in the cut at the stabwire being too close to the stabhousing and the cut on the other side (where the stabs clip into the PCB) being too far away. I'll post my edited cutout measurements here, I hope there are people here that have access to a 3D printer or a laser cutter and a few scrap pieces of acrylic to test the fitment. In theory it should fit, but you never know for sure.

Here it is, next to one of the cutouts how they come out of the builder.

Show Image

Can you give us a little more context around why you created a new cutout? What are the problems being solved and what is the rational for the size and shape?

I am sure some of us can figure it out, but it helps if we get a good description so we can have a good conversation about it and potentially adding it to the tool.

[kawasaki161]

Can you give us a little more context around why you created a new cutout? What are the problems being solved and what is the rational for the size and shape?

I am sure some of us can figure it out, but it helps if we get a good description so we can have a good conversation about it and potentially adding it to the tool.

Sure, no problem.

You see, when you get into thicker acrylic plates (or thicker plates in general) for use with a PCB it is impossible to use your current cutouts since there won't be any space for the stab wires and part of the housing. There are two ways of fixing this, one is machining out the plastic that would interfere with the stabs like zennasyndroxx did here:


But that can't be made with a laser cutter, so I chose a different route, similar to what you can see on winkeyless.kr boards, where everything that interferes with the stabilizer is simply cut out of the whole plate:


This also allows for the stabilizer to be removed without removing the plate. So, not having to desolder ALL switches when one stabilizer goes bad, in fact even without having to desolder a single switch.

[swill]

Can you give us a little more context around why you created a new cutout? What are the problems being solved and what is the rational for the size and shape?

I am sure some of us can figure it out, but it helps if we get a good description so we can have a good conversation about it and potentially adding it to the tool.

Sure, no problem.

You see, when you get into thicker acrylic plates (or thicker plates in general) for use with a PCB it is impossible to use your current cutouts since there won't be any space for the stab wires and part of the housing. There are two ways of fixing this, one is machining out the plastic that would interfere with the stabs like zennasyndroxx did here:

Show Image

But that can't be made with a laser cutter, so I chose a different route, similar to what you can see on winkeyless.kr boards, where everything that interferes with the stabilizer is simply cut out of the whole plate:

Show Image

This also allows for the stabilizer to be removed without removing the plate. So, not having to desolder ALL switches when one stabilizer goes bad, in fact even without having to desolder a single switch.

Great. Thanks for the use case. So this is specifically for thicker plates when using a PCB because there is no space between the plate and the PCB for the Cherry PCB mount stabilizer wire. This makes sense.

So I guess nothing will need to clip into the cutout or anything, so it just needs enough space that everything will be able to fit inside the cutout and operate without anything touching. Is that right?

So what measurements were wrong with the first attempt and what are you adjusting?

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk

[kawasaki161]

So I guess nothing will need to clip into the cutout or anything, so it just needs enough space that everything will be able to fit inside the cutout and operate without anything touching. Is that right?

So what measurements were wrong with the first attempt and what are you adjusting?

1: Correct

2: I accidentally swapped the measurements for the wire and non-wire side of the housing, so there was over 1mm room left on the non-wire side (the side that has the clip) and not enough room on the wire side (the side with the plastic hook). If you look at the picture I moved the upper ledge up by 1,2mm and the lower ledge up by 1mm. It could potentially still be not the best fit, so it needs further testing.

Also note that this design would need to be mirrorable if it indeed gets added to the tool since some PCB's insert the stabs the other way around.

[swill]

So I guess nothing will need to clip into the cutout or anything, so it just needs enough space that everything will be able to fit inside the cutout and operate without anything touching. Is that right?

So what measurements were wrong with the first attempt and what are you adjusting?

1: Correct

2: I accidentally swapped the measurements for the wire and non-wire side of the housing, so there was over 1mm room left on the non-wire side (the side that has the clip) and not enough room on the wire side (the side with the plastic hook). If you look at the picture I moved the upper ledge up by 1,2mm and the lower ledge up by 1mm. It could potentially still be not the best fit, so it needs further testing.

Also note that this design would need to be mirrorable if it indeed gets added to the tool since some PCB's insert the stabs the other way around.

I can review the measurements of a PCB stab in a PCB with a caliper to verify your numbers as well. I have one handy here as well as a Sprit plate which has a similar type of cutout.

As for the ''mirror" details, I would suggest we make the cutout specific for one orientation, and if have rotated stabilizers, they just specify the `{_rs:180}` object value for that key in the layout to rotate the stabilizer by 180° in the output.  I need to spend some time to make some of these features more obvious for people, but the documentation does cover most of those details pretty well.

[MacGruber117]

Hey, I'm hoping someone has tried this before and can help me out. I want to cut a new plate for my Poker 3, if I select 'Poker' in the case style will the default holes line up and be the right size to fit the stock case?

[axtran]

As for the ''mirror" details, I would suggest we make the cutout specific for one orientation, and if have rotated stabilizers, they just specify the `{_rs:180}` object value for that key in the layout to rotate the stabilizer by 180° in the output.  I need to spend some time to make some of these features more obvious for people, but the documentation does cover most of those details pretty well.

Figured I'd add to this AWESOME thread instead of PMs which don't help any others

When do you estimate that you can add the 5mm plate option (similar to us making custom sprit-style plates)? I'd love to have one of them run through Ponoko for a custom plate, totally understand that it'd have to be specific to PCB mount stabilizers only. And the GH60 Rev. C would require some stabilizer rotation (180 deg).

[swill]

As for the ''mirror" details, I would suggest we make the cutout specific for one orientation, and if have rotated stabilizers, they just specify the `{_rs:180}` object value for that key in the layout to rotate the stabilizer by 180° in the output.  I need to spend some time to make some of these features more obvious for people, but the documentation does cover most of those details pretty well.

Figured I'd add to this AWESOME thread instead of PMs which don't help any others

When do you estimate that you can add the 5mm plate option (similar to us making custom sprit-style plates)? I'd love to have one of them run through Ponoko for a custom plate, totally understand that it'd have to be specific to PCB mount stabilizers only. And the GH60 Rev. C would require some stabilizer rotation (180 deg).

For your 5mm plate, you are basically missing stabilizer cutout which are large enough to work for plate mounted stabilizers with a 5mm plate?

The feature I am currently adding will allow you to add or subtract any polygon to any layer of the case, so with that you would be able to add extra space around the stabilizer in order for it to work with the 5mm plate.  The dynamic UI including error handling and data collection is basically done.  I just have to pass that data to the back end and write the logic to apply it to the layers.  Life has been crazy for me the last few months, so I have had pretty limited time.  I need to find another 10-12 hours to work on this to get this feature to get at least the first iteration out.  Not sure how quickly I can get through that, but it is my current focus for the builder.

[axtran]

For your 5mm plate, you are basically missing stabilizer cutout which are large enough to work for plate mounted stabilizers with a 5mm plate?

The feature I am currently adding will allow you to add or subtract any polygon to any layer of the case, so with that you would be able to add extra space around the stabilizer in order for it to work with the 5mm plate.  The dynamic UI including error handling and data collection is basically done.  I just have to pass that data to the back end and write the logic to apply it to the layers.  Life has been crazy for me the last few months, so I have had pretty limited time.  I need to find another 10-12 hours to work on this to get this feature to get at least the first iteration out.  Not sure how quickly I can get through that, but it is my current focus for the builder.

I guess I'm essentially looking for PCB mount stabilizer holes (rather simple rectangular instead of the complex Cherry Plate Mount cuts) combined with the little trench/channel for the wire to run from stabilizer mount on left to stabilizer mount on right. I don't know the measurements required for the "trenches."

Combine that with your function to already accomodate requirements to "flip" the stabilized keys (as is the case of the GH60 Rev. C PCB having "non-Poker-standard" PCB mount stabilizer configurations) and that would be perfect!

[seattle_ice]

I recently used the keyboard layout tool and the plate builder to order a laser cut piece, and it worked great except I had to change all the stroke weights to .01mm as per their requirements? Any chance you could add that option to the plate builder? I understand it adds a level of complexity to the math when calculating the paths.

[swill]

I recently used the keyboard layout tool and the plate builder to order a laser cut piece, and it worked great except I had to change all the stroke weights to .01mm as per their requirements? Any chance you could add that option to the plate builder? I understand it adds a level of complexity to the math when calculating the paths.

That is trivial for me to add, I can make sure it is in the next release. I think I have it defaulting to 0.02mm right now.

[IBNobody]

Hey Swill.

I just got a second reorder from Lasergist, and I wanted to suggest making brushing on both sides the default option when ordering using your tool. This second reorder was back-side-brushed, and it got rid of all the slag present on my first order. It saved me about an hour of filing / cleanup.

[swill]

Hey Swill.

I just got a second reorder from Lasergist, and I wanted to suggest making brushing on both sides the default option when ordering using your tool. This second reorder was back-side-brushed, and it got rid of all the slag present on my first order. It saved me about an hour of filing / cleanup.

Ya. I can do that. That is a good idea. Thanks for confirming.