- The thumb keys are not shaped as you would expect. (I've left mine in place)
- The wide symbol keys - + | " are mostly fugly when replaced with single-width standard key caps.
- The cursor arrows do not match the angle of their neighbors.
not sure that i understand that… do they fit with the stock keycaps?The arrow keys fit on the stems fine, but the key height and angle are dramatically different than the keys above them and to the sides.
The arrow keys fit on the stems fine, but the key height and angle are dramatically different than the keys above them and to the sides.
Kinesis wants 1000. If it were 500 I'd throw money in to make a buy, but I'm conservative. There is a market for the custom caps, I don't know how big it is since I would imagine almost all Kinesis users are touch-typists. You almost have to be.
If WASD could be profitable being THE Kinesis Custom Key Cap Guy on the Planet, I'm sure he might consider doing it.it would be great but i am not sure that the market is really big… most of kinesis users only need blank keycaps…
Can you clarify the SP info? I'm a bit lost.
Front Back Front Kinesis
P0 340 380 A S D F J K L ;
P1 475 550 75° Ctrl Alt Alt Ctrl
P2 400 425 73° =+ 1 2 4 5 6 7 9 0 -_ Home PageUp
P3 350 335 71° 3 8 Q W E R T Y U I O P
P4 350 290 70° Tab \| CapsLock G H '" SHIFT SHIFT End PageDown
P5 380 280 71° Z X C V B N M , . /
P6 415 275 71° `~ Insert Left Right Up Down [{ ]} Delete Enter
P7 415 300 70° BackSpace Space
P0 A row A S D F J K L ;
P1 Function row Ctrl Alt Alt Ctrl
P2 1 row =+ 1 2 4 5 6 7 9 0 -_ Home PageUp
P3 Q row 3 8 Q W E R T Y U I O P
P4 A row Tab \| CapsLock G H '" SHIFT SHIFT End PageDown
P5 Z row Z X C V B N M , . /
P6 Modifier row `~ Insert Left Right Up Down [{ ]} Delete Enter
P7 Keypad Enter BackSpace Space
Can I use this in the Split Kinesis mod article? It can be helpful for others.
Interesting note about differences between two rows that was mentioned before:
I'm noticing that there is a difference between the two rows (P5 and P6), but not on the newer Advantage.
I do have an Advantage (at work) and a KB120 (in storage). Some day I may get around to measuring them as well.
Doubleshot keys have a shorter "skirt" or the "sides of the key cap" than the singleshots.Good point. I will switch to stem-relative measurements in the diagrams.
KB120 KB130 Advantage
Fr Bk St Fr Bk Fr Bk St Fr Bk Fr Bk St Fr Bk
P0 285 320 -90 340 380 -40 345 375 -40
P1 435 490 -10 74° 85° 475 550 -55 75° 88° 500 550 -45 80° 85°
P2 340 350 -5 66° 88° 400 425 -55 73° 88° 405 425 -40 72° 88°
P3 275 250 -10 67° 85° 350 335 -40 71° 88° 345 325 -35 69° 88°
P4 275 210 -5 61° 83° 350 290 -60 70° 88° 340 285 -40 69° 88°
P5 255 205 -10 62° 85° 380 280 -40 71° 88° 375 285 -40 69° 88°
P6 355 305 -10 63° 88° 415 275 -45 71° 88° 375 285 -40 69° 88°
P7 355 215 -10 63° 83° 415 300 -45 70° 88° 380 285 -40 69° 88°
You confirm P5 and P6 are the same on the Advantage. What is the serial # of your Advantage?Model KB500USB-bkl Serial# 51919UB
EDIT---I guess different key cap manufacturerAlthough I only measure two of each profile from the Advantage, my impression is that its keycaps are molded to tighter tolerances than the older ones, though we're talking <5 mils rather than ~10.
some specifications not crucial, the degree of slope seems the same? Height of key top on switch should be the same?I was surprised by how much difference there was in some of the caps, e.g. a full 1/10 inch in the home keys between KB120 and KB130. I certainly have never noticed any difference in key shape between KB130 and Advantage (my primary home and work keyboards) though I did notice a difference in key feel (Cherry switches do wear!).
Now to see if all the key caps can be acquired as 'standard' key caps from sources....a few with the very high 'skirts' wouldn't be too crucial I think...I suspect any reasonably similar caps would be fine. I think SP has a choice of stem lengths, which might help someone ordering from them.
Model# KB500USB-bkl Serial# 51919UB
I believe my KB132MPC is 30xxx.
Although I only measure two of each profile from the Advantage, my impression is that its keycaps are molded to tighter tolerances than the older ones, though we're talking <5 mils rather than ~10.
I was surprised by how much difference there was in some of the caps, e.g. a full 1/10 inch in the home keys between KB120 and KB130. I certainly have never noticed any difference in key shape between KB130 and Advantage (my primary home and work keyboards) though I did notice a difference in key feel (Cherry switches do wear!).
I suspect any reasonably similar caps would be fine. I think SP has a choice of stem lengths, which might help someone ordering from them.
Cherry switches wearing: Are you referring to the tactile bump, the spring tension, or both?
I wonder if there is a difference in the actual keywells (the 'basket' that the switches are mounted into)? I'm not going to investigate that :)
On the most recent "CODE" measurements, can you explain the relative measurements?
KB120 KB130 Advantage
Fr Bk St Fr Bk Fr Bk St Fr Bk Fr Bk St Fr Bk
P0 285 320 -90 340 380 -40 345 375 -40
P1 435 490 -10 74° 85° 475 550 -55 75° 88° 500 550 -45 80° 85°
P2 340 350 -5 66° 88° 400 425 -55 73° 88° 405 425 -40 72° 88°
P3 275 250 -10 67° 85° 350 335 -40 71° 88° 345 325 -35 69° 88°
P4 275 210 -5 61° 83° 350 290 -60 70° 88° 340 285 -40 69° 88°
P5 255 205 -10 62° 85° 380 280 -40 71° 88° 375 285 -40 69° 88°
P6 355 305 -10 63° 88° 415 275 -45 71° 88° 375 285 -40 69° 88°
P7 355 215 -10 63° 83° 415 300 -45 70° 88° 380 285 -40 69° 88°
My Kinesis doubleshots home row are shiny and smoother than the singleshot home row.
The doubleshots other than home row are less shiny and smooth than the singleshots other than home row.
Can you confirm Sordna and KPS?
Just to let you know, I'd be interested in a set or 3 of Colemak (or possibly blank) key caps as well. Wouldn't mind getting rid of the stickers on the numbers row and other places, but that'd mean a slightly different layout in my case.
You mean from WASD Keyboards? PM me with the keyboards/key cap info/questions/thoughts asap.
KEY ISSUE #1 (affects 6 keys-pinky keys)
(Attachment) 35890[/ATTACH]
The extreme right row, lower 3 pinky keys are R2/P4 1.25 which is the same profile as a "G" and "H" key. The replacement keys are about 1mm taller front skirt than the original Kinesis keys (which affects the slope). Note the 2 red arrows to show the slightly high key corners. The bottom key it's not an issue, the top key you may graze the high corner. This key may not be an issue\problem, I'm just trying to get the exact replacements as a first choice.
OPTION: Need R2 1.25 keys that have the actual same slope of key top. (HELP: you can compare with the "G" or "H" key, should be same exact top slope and height).
Are you using R1 1x1.25 as replacement? Or some R2 1x1.25 that is for some reason not the exact right size? Either way, doesn't all three of them have the high corners?
EDIT---The 3 pinky keys have the same profile as the R1 key caps but are 1.25 wide. I assume these are R1 1x1.25 keys. I'm checking to see if there are R2 1x1.25 key available. If there are, I think this one issue disappears.
WASD Keyboards has the following colors, laser, etching available (if not more that I don't know about):
(Attachment) 35912[/ATTACH]
And keys can always be Rit Dyed for more combinations like purple, pink, safari stripes or camo.
I'm still confused.. They should be R1, therefore you're looking for... R2?
When I ordered from WASD recently, the only 1x1.25 key available (in individual keys, at least) was R1 so I'm surprised you got an R2. Either way, I'll report on using three WASD R1 1x1.25 as the pinky keys when I receive them.
Sounds good!
Btw, what does a full standard replacement set from Kinesis cost?
$35 for standard keycaps and $39 for the dual legend (qwerty/dvorak ones). Both come in black or white. That's what they quoted me early August. At that time I learned they even have black dual legend keycaps (for some reason I had thought the dvorak caps only came in white).
KEY ISSUE #4 (affects 4 keys-thumb cluster single keys)
The two keys at the top of the cluster are very tall (see P1 on KPS chart). The slope is not a problem, it's available, but not in a key of that dramatic height. I'm working on changing some other key heights for a work around. Since we didn't have any of the 2 highest keys, I'm playing with adjusting all three key heights. In the pictures above, you can see the original Kinesis keys with legends, and the 2 lower keys that are the appropriate keys for those positions (red and grey keys). What I've done to keep the staggered height, is to remove the highest keys and move the keys "up" a spot to see if it will all work together. There are a couple ways to do this, and I'm looking for what's best.
(Attachment) 35883[/ATTACH] (Attachment) 35885[/ATTACH]
100% agree. I replaced the original keys last night, noted the feel and swapped with replacements this morning...not satisfied with the downgraded experience. :(Can you source "row5" keycaps like on the Race? They look a bit taller.
The profile of the 4 keys is available, the height is the problem.
Time to consider options.
Also, something looks off about the right enter key on that kinesis on ebay. It might just be me, though.
I should guess less and test more. R3s as home keys just do not feel right. It's weird that such small differences mean so much for the fingers. Changing them around makes me feel all not-at-home at my keyboard.
But having actually tried all three options now, I'm gonna go with R2 as the winner. I can't decide on who gets second place but it would probably be R1.
For the right hand keywell/thumb cluster the "SPACE" key is an 'enter' key on a num pad. The "ENTER" key is a '+' key on a num pad.
Do normal num pad plus keys have a sideways slope?
And what about the left hand delete key?
The Delete and Enter keys, the sideways-sloping ones, are modifier-row keys turned on their sides.
If everything fails, I will make a bunch this summer. (see GH thread on making key caps)I wonder if we can contact vortex (if that really is their name: wasn't it KBT or something before?) directly about where they got the row5 keycaps for the race?. Also, you'll be the clack factory of kinesis!
R1, R2, and R3.... Comparing the 3 of these for the home row, can you please rate in order of preference and why?
We get a third person to concur, and I'll close that chapter for good.
So you're saying the sphericals are definitely better, but R2 is almost as good and is acceptable?
The goal is for custom colors, legends, engraving/etching.
It's taking me a little while to get used to the keyboard coming from a Goldtouch but it's a challenge I am enjoying.
So you're saying the sphericals are definitely better, but R2 is almost as good and is acceptable?
Oh my. I can't really decide if I'd want blank or Colemak caps. I'm a bit worried I'll order both when it is possible :-P
I contacted SP a couple years ago and they said they 'used to' supply Kinesis keys, but they away the molds. Who does that? And I believe they must have supplied the doubleshots after comparing at WASD Keyboards.I read you have to be careful with RIT dye on ABS because of the heat. That said, PBT kinesis keys in any colour wound be amazing.
I think Dorkvader suggested a possible 'tall key' replacement from the RACE keyboard, I don't know if anyone has taken a close look, or looked elsewhere for possible replacements.
Again, someone could call Kinesis and beg Rick for some info on this situation...I have a feeling they won't say their source, many places won't, but it could be helpful anyhow. If blank white keys were purchased, they could be Rit Dyed.
I read you have to be careful with RIT dye on ABS because of the heat. That said, PBT kinesis keys in any colour wound be amazing.
Never talked directly to him but I've been emailing Rick for years about various Kinesis things.
Imagine working a keyboard company, especially Kinesis. You KNOW there is some crazy stupid stuff coming in on the phone line. As silly as it sounds, I bet the guy goes home to his girlfriend, puts his head on her lap, covers his eyes and says "You can't believe what someone called and asked me. Why would someone want to hook up a keyboard to a car battery?" Poor Rick, go easy on him.
Hahaha, epic! :-)Why wouldn't they?
I almost feel bad about asking, but why would someone want to hook up a keyboard to a car battery? :-P
I just double checked and unfortunately it's 1,000 sets, not 1,000 total keycaps.
For the right hand keywell/thumb cluster the "SPACE" key is an 'enter' key on a num pad. The "ENTER" key is a '+' key on a num pad. The 10 Black and blue keys with legends in this picture are original Kinesis key caps that don't have an exact replacement (yet). At this stage, everything is as original, no changes.
For the right hand keywell/thumb cluster the "SPACE" key is an 'enter' key on a num pad. The "ENTER" key is a '+' key on a num pad. The 10 Black and blue keys with legends in this picture are original Kinesis key caps that don't have an exact replacement (yet). At this stage, everything is as original, no changes.
No reply from Kinesis.
Anyway, we can replace all but the 4 tall thumb cluster keys, and I would like to do so. I did notice something though.
@IN: question about the replacements: you replaced both the P5 and P6 keys with R1 keys, even though P5 and P6 have a slightly different slope. Is the replacement really just one key type?
Assuming the above replacement is acceptable the total order for one Advantage without 4 tall thumb keys would be:1w means width of one, 1.25w means width of 1.25, 2w means width of 2.
- 10 NUM (1w)
- 12 R3 (1w)
- 12 R2 (1w)
- 18 R1 (1w)
- 8 R1 (1.25w)
- 2 NUM_PAD_+ (2w)
- 2 NUM_PAD_ENTER (2w)
Update: More questions as I'm ordering. :)
Are you sure about the Kinesis-ENTER key cap being the same as a WASD-Numpad "+" (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/individual-blank-keycaps/numpad-plus-cherry-mx-keycap.html)? It doesn't look right. WASD-R1 1x2 (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/individual-blank-keycaps/row-1-size-1x2-00-cherry-mx-keycap.html) looks like a much better fit.
I do agree on the Kinesis-Space/Backspace, it does look like the WASD-Numpad "Enter" (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/individual-blank-keycaps/numpad-enter-cherry-mx-keycap.html)
I spent a week with num-row keys in place of the tall thumb keys. To compensate for the height difference, I replaced Delete and Enter with numpad-enter keys (i.e. like BackSpace and Space) and that worked well. I also replaced Home and PageUp with the next shorter keys, and that did not work so well — it was fine for the modifier, but made Home and PageUp harder to press.
Cheers for the update kps.
I'm not going to mess around with the tall thumb keys at all, because these as well as the Home key (serves as Ctrl for me) are crucial for me.
So I just ordered a full set of dark grey blank key caps, with the option of black thumb keys, because I plan to leave the 4 tall keys in place, so they'll stay black; also I think the Delete/Enter key replacements won't have the correct shape so I might leave those as well (looking forward to IN's answer to questions above). I threw in an optional orange WASD cluster (though for me (http://homepage.mac.com/boli/ars/80329_kinesis_colemak_small.png) it will be FRST), as well as optional orange home keys. I also ordered extra pairs of the 1.25 wide keys in various colors to play around with, and a set of 40A o-rings.
Damn you GH, making me spend $138 ($10 is international slow shipping) plus VAT/customs... :P
When did you order? I need to be more careful :(
If you get stuck with wrong keys, I'll take care of it. I don't want that hanging over my head :(
The confirmation mail says 19:55, that's 10:55 am PST I think. But seriously don't worry about it, not your fault, I could have waited - but I was so eager. Only after ordering did I spend more time looking at the fotos and my own keyboard and noticed that R1 1x2 looks much better. :)
Boli:
Spoke to Weyman, the change will be made to the R1 1x2 keys.
We, as a group, need to put together the info for WASD and he will create a Kinesis 'set' we can order at the drop of a hat, at a good price point with the usual available options.
*just those damn tall keys!!*
Digesting this. But I'm thinking the only real answer is the 4 tall key caps regardless. The whole thumb cluster needs to work together, so it all works, or it all doesn't work, yes?
What was the method of payment? If there's an issue, I'll spot you the $1 USD, with interest, compounded hourly, minimum 90 day terms. I'll need collateral, preferably a Kinesis keyboard, but almost anything will do. lol
All those colored keys in the pics I have to figure this out and swap/try profiles with are on loan, gratis, or toss aways from WASD to the cause.
There are a couple methods to 'blank' a key, depending on how the legend is applied. It's kind of a drag no matter what :(
Quick reply from WASD, doesn't look good for the tall thumb keys. He says his supplier won't have them as they're too unique, having them made (requires new tooling etc.) wouldn't be economical given the likely rather low demand, and the same applies for having them sourced by Kinesis's supplier, hundreds/thousands of keys in various colors for just 4 keys in each set... so we're stuck with the originals for now.
@Input Nirvana: While I replied to Weyman I started wondering: have you tried the R1 1.25 keys for the top left/right corners both ways? If used the wrong way the slant would be more like the original, however the height would be lower.
You could always mod keys, cut off stems from donor keys and glue them on keycaps that you want to make taller (making their stems extra long).
Quite a few people have done this, it must work well. It sure seems to me it wouldn't though. Need to check the slant of the 4 keys first, then determine the height adjustment. Someone else needs to go first. My confidence is low. I'd rather make keys from molds and have more options. Oh yea, I'm gonna do that with my first spare $100 and 2 free days :)
I have liberated a stem from a spare key, but what is a good way to affix it to a NUM key? Will hot glue be strong enough? Btw, my spare stem is 7.5 mm and a NUM key needs about 3.0 mm extra to match the modifier height.
Not always about sheer strength.
Thanks a bunch IN! They haven't replied to my mail yet, I wonder how I can pay the extra dollar (the R1 1x2 cost $1.25 vs the Numpad+ $1, and I ordered 2 black 2 dark gray).
As for the info, this is it for a Kinesis set without the 4 tall thumb keys:
- 10 R4 (1w)
- 12 R3 (1w)
- 12 R2 (1w)
- 18 R1 (1w)
- 8 R1 (1.25w)
- 2 R1 1x2 (2w)
- 2 NumpadEnter (2w)
BTW this set costs $66.50 normally (blank, dunno about engraving cost).
You could possibly bring the price down by ordering an existing keycap set, perhaps an 87 key set at $36.99 and the individual missing keys. The 104 set is an especially good deal at $39.99.
I was kind of hoping there would be a Kinesis set with a similar price reduction compared to ordering single keys. Maybe we could get such a set even though it is not complete yet.
Btw, how slow/fast is wasd with replying to emails?
...the actual keys were not replaced. :(Unfortunate, but I doubt it will be a problem in practice. I spent a week with all num-enter and the difference was essentially unnoticable.
He got numpad-plus, which when used as Delete/Enter make it hard to press Home/End/PgUp/PgDown without interfering, I just tried it.
Sorry about that. That's pretty frustrating for me too as I totally wrote it there but my employee pulled the order with the description column and didn't look the other column!
I'll have replacements sent out right away and, of course, you can keep the wrong keycaps.
You could possibly bring the price down by ordering an existing keycap set, perhaps an 87 key set at $36.99 and the individual missing keys. The 104 set is an especially good deal at $39.99.
Cool.. good to know. Do your counts treat keys with dots/lines (qwerty F and J, numpad 5) separately?
Geekhack got hacked, but before it was reloaded, ...
You could possibly bring the price down by ordering an existing keycap set, perhaps an 87 key set at $36.99 and the individual missing keys. The 104 set is an especially good deal at $39.99.
After having used blanks for a few days I noticed it's occasionally quite handy to have legends. While they're not needed for typing it's often nice to confirm at a glance that one's pressing the right key.
Edit: I just noticed that this week's forum restore (or whatever it was) brought back posts that were lost with last week's restore, however posts made since last week's restore are gone. Great. I did save one post in a text file
Is this for some types of keys in particular (letters, symbols) or just all of them?
Good you had a backup :-)
I tried gluing my stem fragment to an R4 with hot glue, just to test it before I considered more extreme glues. It didn't endure being pulled off again, but here's how it looked:
Not the same slope as the tall modifiers, but pretty close.
I didn't seat it fully because I wanted to be able to get the 3 mm stem piece up, so you can see a bit of the red switch stem below. But even if fully seated, an R4 with stem extension will still leave a small gap between the keycap and the case.
I like this pic, btw. f/2.8 :-)
I found a few keys with the high profile of the thumb keys in my SP grab bag.
So, I'm pretty sure that SP can still do them.
Last time I ordered some non stocked keycaps from SP, I had to pay 20$ per keycap (I ordered 4 keycaps). What was for some blank PBT. Price will get lower in a group buy.
I have a Esc, F1, F2, F5, F6, F8, F9, / and Insert.
I was happy when I found those as they will probably be useful for my future ErgoDoxs!
The simple email answer from SP today is that they no longer have the tooling for the Kinesis Contoured line. :(
Someone, (I can't follow up properly at this time) could possibly get the info from Dox and figure out what he's got, if SP has it, and/or where that possibility may stand.
Other choices:
-We can see about removing legends from black and white key cap sets from Kinesis.
-We can find sphericals in other colors.
-We can make the missing keys in a couple months, unless someone else does it sooner.
Hummm..... I think she is confusing them with the old home row spherical.
Yeah I think that they are the same. I will confirm it when I receive sordna kinesis from the try and forward tour.
I guess that IN answer from SP came from Melissa. (never heard of anyone else there)
It's out of focus, /qq! ;) Seriously though, nice shallow depth of field effect. :)
The extended R4 looks pretty good, I don't think the small gap would matter, as long as the key feels alright. Did it feel OK?
Hmm, the keys you have don't seem to be any of the ones in the following chart from SP's FAQ (http://keycapsdirect.com/faq.php).DCS row 5. What's what it is.Show Image(http://keycapsdirect.com/images/faq/FamilyProfilesLG.jpg)
DCS row 5. What's what it is.
Yeah, it was fine. I wasn't completely relaxed when I was touching it consciously because I knew it was fragile, but I used it for some days without any issues.
The simple email answer from SP today is that they no longer have the tooling for the Kinesis Contoured line. :(
-We can find sphericals in other colors.
Which is the correct row numbering?
A less expensive option which wouldn't require WASD to offer a Kinesis Advantage set would be to create a custom layout template (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/custom-keyboard-options/custom-option-upload-your-key-design.html) for a Kinesis Advantage (which could be adjusted for individual custom layouts) and use the Custom Keyboard Designer (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/custom-designer/) to order key caps. When done right one would need only 3 extra custom keys (same as for the 104 set listed above). Cost would be $59.99 for the custom 104 key cap set, plus $21 for the 3 custom keys ($7 each).
If anyone is proficient with Adobe Illustrator or Corel Draw this shouldn't be too much work. Basically all the R1 1x1.25 keys which are normally used for 2x Ctrl, 2x Command/Win, 2x Alt,
Hi Weyman
I finally found time to adapt your custom layout templates for a Kinesis Advantage board. Attached you'll find a preview (it's being reviewed/corrected at GeekHack, I can provide AI (CS4 version) or PDF once it's final).
The keys I left blank aren't needed on a Kinesis Advantage, however the 3 extra keys I put at the bottom are needed. I'm wondering if you can use a layout like this to make a custom Kinesis set, and if so what the price would be (without the blank keys, but with the extra 3 keys instead).
Just to make sure, please confirm a few assumptions:
- the Home and PgUp are R4?
- The `, Insert, [ and ] in the numpad area are R1?
- The PgDn in the numpad area is R2?
- The four arrows are R1?
Thank you and best regards, Oliver
A less expensive option which wouldn't require WASD to offer a Kinesis Advantage set would be to create a custom layout template (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/custom-keyboard-options/custom-option-upload-your-key-design.html) for a Kinesis Advantage (which could be adjusted for individual custom layouts) and use the Custom Keyboard Designer (http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/custom-designer/) to order key caps. When done right one would need only 3 extra custom keys (same as for the 104 set listed above). Cost would be $59.99 for the custom 104 key cap set, plus $21 for the 3 custom keys ($7 each).
If anyone is proficient with Adobe Illustrator or Corel Draw this shouldn't be too much work. Basically all the R1 1x1.25 keys which are normally used for 2x Ctrl, 2x Command/Win, 2x Alt,
Hi Weyman
I finally found time to adapt your custom layout templates for a Kinesis Advantage board. Attached you'll find a preview (it's being reviewed/corrected at GeekHack, I can provide AI (CS4 version) or PDF once it's final).
The keys I left blank aren't needed on a Kinesis Advantage, however the 3 extra keys I put at the bottom are needed. I'm wondering if you can use a layout like this to make a custom Kinesis set, and if so what the price would be (without the blank keys, but with the extra 3 keys instead).
Just to make sure, please confirm a few assumptions:
- the Home and PgUp are R4?
- The `, Insert, [ and ] in the numpad area are R1?
- The PgDn in the numpad area is R2?
- The four arrows are R1?
Thank you and best regards, Oliver
Awesome job :-)
I think the Enter text should be vertical upside down compared to the Delete key.
Sent an email to WASDkeyboards
Any word from Weyman?
sandpaper
The caps are lovely, boli :-)
[snip] Haha, I just tried sandpapering a key yesterday to see how easy it was to get nice looking. Unfortunately it still looks rough while it feels smooth. But I don't have anything finer than grit P400.
Yeah I like the caps too. When I received them I thought 8pt was way too small/subtle, but now that they're on the board it's much better. Still wondering how larger fonts would look like when etched
Actually a sanded key should look better over time, remember how textured keys get shiny anyway? Of course, getting finer sandpaper like 800 or finer grit would help too.
But I just got an idea and used my jeans for the final "sanding"! Now it looks better and it's the smoothest key I have :-P
Yeah, the size looks good. I guess normal Kinesis keycap letters would be around 16pt in that scale, but that's not really a good. Size <10pt or something centered and huge (30pt?) would be cool I think. There are so many options and I want to order them all!
Boli-
I pinched photo #2 and inserted it into the Split Kinesis gallery...it's slick!
Thanks for laying it out like that. I'd be happy to assist you and other GH members with getting a custom Kinesis set. I have a few other projects I need to finish at the moment, so I'll have get back to you on this set in about a week. I can offer the set at the same price as a regular custom set. I think what I'll do is make a special template that users can upload with their orders. I'll let you know as soon as I have time to work on it. Thank you.
Update: Weyman replied!
Hi Weyman
Great to hear back from you, I'm looking forward to your follow-up mail in a week. :)
A special template sounds good, even though I've already created 3 different versions based on the current 104 template - I'm happy to recreate them though.
As for price that would mean $60, despite needing 40 keys less than the normal 104 set? I take it the extra cost is for the extra work you'd have when lasering the 3 extra keys that don't fit in the 104 jig...
Best regards, Oliver
In the interest of making it work out, if it turns out I need to make these darn 'missing' key caps, I'd make a ton and give them to Weyman so the Kinesis template can be flawless. But don't worry, you guys working/contributing in these threads will still get the 'missing' keys from me directly. Mostly so I can get your addresses should I need places to hide out from girlfriends :)
I'm in for blank. And, despite my 'exciting' and 'arty' flair for the Kinesis, the black color suits me fine. But of course I'm open to other color options/mixes.
An email needs to go to SP about the measurements of DCS-1X ROW 5....oops, I just sent it :)
Will report back when I get a response.
Mostly so I can get your addresses should I need places to hide out from girlfriends :)
Interest check:
- Who would buy blank key cap sets from WASD at the current $44?
- Who would buy lasered key cap sets from WASD at the current $60?
The Mogambo-Mothership-of-all-Kineses-Keyboards? The one at the beginning of the gallery has been there a loooong time. The huge pic with the notes I am making is very recent.
Ye I meant the one at the very end - that thing has almost everything. :) *Must focus on the keyboard*
-If the Kinesis had a proper escape button I'd have put a red key cap on it (like I did on my TE), as the single "special" key.
-Personally I don't care about Click Clack keys or other key caps with weird 3D surfaces.
-To be fair a Darth Vader would look pretty neat on a full black Advantage.
BTW the WASDkeyboards website was updated with a 105 key custom designer, and while they were at it they raised the price of custom layout key caps to $80, up from $60.You had me scared for a moment! But no, the price of a custom set is still $60, which is -$80 from a custom keyboard.
You had me scared for a moment! But no, the price of a custom set is still $60, which is -$80 from a custom keyboard.
I wrote $59.99 total, but had I missed the $10 for custom all along, or did the price increase by $10?
For the spherical keys on the homerow, you can order from these:
Item - Qty - Price - Description
BLANKSPH/R3U100D/SPHBLUE 1 2 Blank 1 unit key with deep dish /50
BLANKSPH/R3U100D/SPHGREY 1 2 Blank 1 unit key with deep dish /50
I suppose one would ideally get 8 sphericals and the rest cylindricals from the round 4 group buy so they would match, or is it just the sphericals that are extra long?
I ask because I found this in IN's sig, apparently the cylindrical key caps in the pic are shorter than stock:Show Image(http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=15817&d=1299376935)
Other than that they look pretty much what I saw from some round 3 group buy pics. I quite like that style. :)
The pic is from this Geekhack thread:
http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?13894-Mmmm-ergo-Kinesis-Advantage-)
The info source may have dried up, may be worth a PM?
IN, your sig is quite a treasure trove. This trackball (http://geekhack.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=19273&d=1308455232) looks very comfortable for right handed people. :)
Aha, SP keys from Whiterice, which seem to be a quarter inch (~6 mm!?) shorter than the stock Kinesis. No part no.
And I see you've been on your quest for replacement key caps for over a year. :)
Update: rantenki is still active on GH, I sent a PM to ask for details.
IN, your sig is quite a treasure trove.
or (did you say blank doubleshot?) ABS
I like the kittys for the thumb keys...they have a bit of understated style.... :)
Yes, they are blank, but they are doubleshot just to keep the same thickness as the other keys.
Please help by ordering some longcat and, more importantly, tacgnol <-- that guy is going to get cut unless we get 27 more orders :(
Go go Kinesis users! http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?26824-TACGNOL-ADDED!-Meme-keys-group-buy
The cats are cool, and are coolest as a set. I could be good for a set, possibly a second.
The colors will match the ones that are being used in the main sets which you can see here: http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?20485-Double-shot-replacements-ROUND-FOUR!-6-days-2-go!
I'm not sure if there are minimum order requirements for these blank keys.
Go for two! :) If we don't get enough orders for the black on white cat there won't be any sets at all!
ROUND3/ALPHA
ROUND3/COLEMAK
BLANKPBT/R1U125/BLACK 4
BLANKPBT/R3U125X/BLACK
BLANKPBT/R3U125/BLACK 2
ROUND3/ALPHACOLEMAK
ROUND3/ALPHA 0
ROUND3/COLEMAK 0
ROUND3/ALPHACOLEMAK
I think that the following special keys, on top of ALPHA and CURARROWS sets, would fill a Kinesis.
(Attachment) 41962[/ATTACH]
I'm not sure how realistic this to Round 4 is, unless someone wants a couple dozen of them.
At this time, I'm only interested in one set black set of keys with NO legends, I don't know if anyone else (at least 3 copies) is interested in that.
It seems we may have half a dozen sets (total)...I'm not clear on what the minimums may be, or if we need to all order the same, etc....maybe we need to wait this one out? Are there other options that Oneproduct mentioned? Boli, did you ever hear back from 7bit?
Someone should double check if I picked the right row profiles maybe.
//the four keys next to the arrow keys - $1.2 each
BLANK/R1U100/BLACK 4
//numpad enter I think. It's considered row 1 rather than row 2 right? Row 2 is also available if I'm wrong - $3.6 each
BLANK/R1U200V/BLACK 2
//numpad 0 $3.6 each
BLANK/R1U200H/BLACK 2
Someone should double check if I picked the right row profiles maybe.
//the four keys next to the arrow keys - $1.2 each
BLANK/R1U100/BLACK 4
//numpad enter I think. It's considered row 1 rather than row 2 right? Row 2 is also available if I'm wrong - $3.6 each
BLANK/R1U200V/BLACK 2
//numpad 0 $3.6 each
BLANK/R1U200H/BLACK 2
I got the keyboard from sordna's kinesis try and forward tour and I can confirm that the high thumb keys on the 20 years old keyboard ARE Signature Plastics DCS row 5.
If we do double shot ABS it will be much cheaper because we can get an alpha-numerial kit (number row, all letters, punctuation) for a reasonable price because they match with sets that can be ordered through the group buy whereas for PBT ones we'd be the only ones ordering them really.
So if you want to get a whole set in double shot ABS it's possible (with Colemak instead of qwerty at no additional cost) BUT if you want to do PBT (as I do) then it's better to buy a blank set from elsewhere at a cheaper price and just get the PBT keys that we couldn't find elsewhere from this group buy, which are the 8 side keys of size 1.25
The single shot key caps have a taller skirt than the double shot key caps. You can see the extensive measurements and concise graphics Kps made earlier in this thread (posts #52, 54, 58). Same key cap, just a taller skirt.
Crazy how it got figured out, too, heh heh :)
Hmm, I couldn't find anywhere what material the ROUND3 doubleshots are. I assumed they were PBT, but if I understand you correctly they are in fact ABS? (If so I better adjust my order of the 1.25 wide side keys to match)As far as I can tell, all doubleshots are ABS. I know for a fact that SP only does doubleshot ABS, so the round3 keys must be. I don't have any firsthand knowledge, as I didn't participate in round3, though.
As far as I can tell, all doubleshots are ABS.
So we have:Correct?
- Alpha keys, extra bottom row, most thumb keys either from WASDkeyboards or round 4 group buy, with the exception of the 3 and 8 key (3 and 8 are only an issue if you want legends, no issue for blank key caps).
- Side keys (1.25 wide) from round 4 group buy
- Tall thumb keys from Signature Plastics
- Is this correct? ^^^
- The tall thumb keys from SP, can they be blank doubleshot?
- The Group Buy 4, (ABS doubleshot) is that coming from SP?
- Now the keys are all figured out, is this something WASD could put together?
- Boli...any info from 7bit?
"E" on the thumb cluster layout? Share???You can find out symphonic's and my own trials at the Colemak forum in Optimizing the Maltron layout (http://forum.colemak.com/viewtopic.php?pid=9453#p9453). The idea is taking the Colemak layout, putting E on the left thumb, moving a few other letters around (as few as possible) and hopefully getting a good Malt-like layout.
qwfp * j luy;
arst g h ndio
zxcv b k m,./
e Space
The * spot is unused. If I end up switching to this I might put Tab there, as I noticed during the TrulyErgonomic test that having Tab operated by the index finger feels very nice.- The Group Buy 4, (ABS doubleshot) is that coming from SP?Yep, since devlin are expensive, unless something radical changes, Round4 should be through SP. I guess I'm the bridge to the GB forum? :P
Yep, since devlin are expensive, unless something radical changes, Round4 should be through SP. I guess I'm the bridge to the GB forum? :P
Regarding the Malt Optimization thread on the Colemak forum, I hadn't checked up on that thread recently...and look what you guys have done! I think there is a major Kinesis-specific layout hidden in some on that work. In my split Kinesis mod article, I have a header and pics for the custom-optimized layout that should be developed.
Once you add some thumb keys to the Kinesis it all falls into place, I can assign at least 2 letters on my thumb keys :-) Love my extra thumb keys, but I'll be adding palm keys very soon.I assume the palm keys are for control?
Cheers! Wut there's stuff outside the ergo/layout subforums? ;) Seriously though, that round 4 thread is massive. Just saw posts about 4 separate group buys and whatnot, will need to read on. :)Yeah, there's a GB for red on black "ragnorock" which was invented, added to r4, then spun off. Since SP quoted lower prices to him, 7bit wants to "spin off" all the styles in an attempt to get lower pricing. Ofcourse the "special" addon kits are still expensive.
I assume the palm keys are for control?
Order-ID |Description |Price|Qty|Pcs|Total
BLANK/R1U125/BLACK |Blank 1.25 units (row 1 / Function row) /50 | 2.00| 4| 4| 8.00
BLANK/R3U125/BLACK |Blank 1.25 units (row 3 / ASDFGH row) /50 | 2.00| 2| 2| 4.00
BLANK/R3U125X/BLACK|Blank 1.25 units (10x row 3 / ASDFGH row) /50|18.00| 1| 10|18.00
ROUND3/ALPHACOLEMAK|! A-Z and Punctuation keys COLEMAK |69.00| 1| 53|69.00
Total | | | | 69|99.00
RETRO/ALPHA |! A-Z and Punctuation keys |29.00| 1| 53| 29.00
RETRO/COLEMAK |! Colemak language kit |29.00| 1| 14| 29.00
RETRO/ALPHACOLEMAK |! A-Z and Punctuation keys COLEMAK |64.00| 1| 53| 64.00
ROUND3/ALPHA |! A-Z and Punctuation keys |29.00| 1| 53| 29.00
ROUND3/COLEMAK |! Colemak language kit |29.00| 1| 14| 29.00
ROUND3/ALPHACOLEMAK|! A-Z and Punctuation keys COLEMAK |64.00| 1| 53| 64.00
SPH/ALPHA |! A-Z and Punctuation keys |29.00| 1| 54| 29.00
SPH/COLEMAK |Colemak language kit | 9.00| 1| 14| 9.00
SPH/ALPHACOLEMAK |! A-Z and Punctuation keys COLEMAK |54.00| 1| 54| 54.00
This is wrong, I will correct the prices. They will be lower.
Expect $54 for ALPHACOLEMAK at most, maybe less.
SPH/COLEMAK might be a bit more expensive and SPH/ALPHA a bit cheaper.
To bring prices really down, please order more!!!
1- We need a price from SP for the exact replacement set in both doubleshot and PBT.
2- Cost for Weyman to put on legends.
Maybe buying 2-5 blank sets will help pricing?
I don't have time for doing this.:)
Thank you for the request! Our pricing is volume sensitive, so I have given
you a range of prices. Pricing for ABS or PBT is the same. These are all
blank keycaps - no printing.The vertical keycaps on the num pad are a row 2/3 keycap for the + and a row
- 5 sets: $133.09 / set
- 10 sets: $75.13 / set
- 15 sets: $55.80 / set
- 25 sets: $40.34 / set
- 50 sets: $28.75 / set
4/4 keycap for the Enter key. Pricing above does not include shipping costs.
Let me know if you need anything else!
Melissa Petersen
Signature Plastics LLC
All blank keycaps are single shot. We don't manufacture 2-shot blank keycaps
as there is no difference from a single shot keycap.
Price breaks are below:
1 set $596.83 per set
2 sets $305.99 per set
3 sets $210.38 per set
4 sets $162.07 per set
5 to 9 sets $133.09 per set
10 to 14 sets $75.12 per set
15 to 24 sets $55.80 per set
25 to 49 sets $40.34 per set
50 to 74 sets $28.75 per set
75 to 99 sets $24.89 per set
Boli: I thought the blank ABS doubleshots in group buy 4 were from SP? Maybe I misread a post about that? Who is 7bit buying them from I wonder?
We need a price for a Kinesis set, no extra keys, blah blah blah.
I doubt we'd get anywhere close to 25 ordersI think you'd be surprised. We didn't think we'd get more than about 10 for the ergoDOX. There are a lot of people with Kinesis on this forum.
I think you'd be surprised. We didn't think we'd get more than about 10 for the ergoDOX. There are a lot of people with Kinesis on this forum.
Can you find me PBT, textured/matte arcade buttons ?
:-)
[LIST=|INDENT=1]
- 2 DCS row 4/4 1x2 vertical.....Enter Delete
I would think something being set up with WASD probably makes the most sense, unless there's something I'm not thinking of. Blanks, colors, etching...
I think this is not a vertical key, as that would be the wrong slope. Isn't it a horizontal R4 key turned 90 degrees, so only the legend is vertical?
Here's an adapted version of kps' chart with Signature Plastics naming:Show Image(http://homepage.mac.com/boli/geekhack/Kinesis-kps-chart-adapted-for-SP.png)
Hmmm....
What I have from WASD a couple months ago...I know we discussed it in the thread...then there was some confusion when you made your order...I don't remember exactly what the answer was we thought we came up with...
I got the key designation from the email Melissa at SP sent you. Did I misunderstand what she wrote? I think the 4/4 means the direction of the slope, which would make the slope as a non-vertical key, BUT it's on its side...which is why it's in the "vertical" box on their order sheet.
I THINK: DCS 1x2 row 4=DCS 1x2 row 4/4 vertical SAME EXACT KEY. But the different designation indicates it is in a vertical configuration.
Boli-Are you closer to the answer than I am?
Technically, I could make the missing keycaps. But, the problem is still the initial tooling costs of making the mold and then producing the minimum quantity needed for each color. Unfortunately, I don't think there's going to be enough demand overall to justify making them. You have a link to the thread? I'll take a look and maybe I can at least work something out with SP to get the missing keys in a single color.
Yes our keycaps will look like what you have illustrated, but please be aware that ours are a bit shorter in profile than those pictured. Attached is a picture of our keycaps compared to standard Filco keycaps which are taller, like those pictured.
She confirmed we need vertical 2x1 row 4/4 (NumPadEnter) and horizontal 1x2 row 4 (NumPadZero). I sent along your picture above.YAYYY! We are positively confirmed! I made the corrections in the thread and Split Kinesis mod wiki for the "OFFICIAL PARTS LIST". I'll add the Kps/Boli diagram now in the wiki article for visual reference.
The file she attached is this: Filco vs. Signature Plastics key caps (http://homepage.mac.com/boli/geekhack/FilcoVsSignature.pdf)
If the Filco keys match WASDkeyboards keys like she said, we might have trouble mixing SP keys with WASD keys. :-/Yes, WASD keys are Filco keys. I don't think there would be much of an issue mixing, but if we do this whole thing right, we shouldn't have to. That's what I've been trying for :)
That said, the only crucial SP key caps (in my opinion anyway) are the tall thumb cluster keys (DCS row 5). I suggest one of you guys in the US orders one to see how well it fits. :)Dox confirmed the SP DSC Row 5 1x1 to the the 4 tall thumb cluster keys. I looked in the awesome key wiki, but I don't see that Filco has a Row 5 key? That would explain why WASD drew a complete blank when looking at the 4 tall keys on the Kinesis.
The 1.25 wide side keys would be nice to have, but not a dealbreaker (IMO), as the WASD replacements work fairly well. I think I'll stick to my order of those from the round 4 group buy, so will hopefully be able to see how well they mix and match.It doesn't matter where the blank keys come from, just that they are the correct replacement keys and that WASD will laser them. That way we have the option of correct blanks and correct custom laser.
Personally I'm most interested in a custom lasered set with as many proper keys as possible, so I hope Weyman will come through.
A full blank set from SP is not important to me, but I might buy one for cheap (say $40, which is the price we get for 25+ sets).
Yes, WASD keys are Filco keys. I don't think there would be much of an issue mixing, but if we do this whole thing right, we shouldn't have to.
Dox confirmed the SP DSC Row 5 1x1 to the the 4 tall thumb cluster keys. I looked in the awesome key wiki, but I don't see that Filco has a Row 5 key? That would explain why WASD drew a complete blank when looking at the 4 tall keys on the Kinesis.
It doesn't matter where the blank keys come from, just that they are the correct replacement keys and that WASD will laser them. [snip] It seems to me that WASD getting and stocking blanks from SP (or whomever) and selling them as blanks and custom laser will make almost everyone happy.
What did you wind up buying from the round 4 group buy?
Well I already have 3 keyboards full of WASDkeyboards caps. ;) About the mixing, IIRC Filco/WASD and SP keys have different stem lengths to make up somewhat (totally?) for the different skirt length. Melissa's comparison picture makes the difference look more pronounced than I thought, hence my concerns.Yea, too risky to try and put a custom laser set with mixing key caps. No one wants crap. Stupid different stem lengths. I had mixed Kinesis doubleshots and Kinesis singleshots and didn't notice a difference, but that doesn't mean anything. I'm taking the idea of mixing off the radar, too problematic. And...we shouldn't need to do this.
I thought they were function keys, but the Filco vs. SP comparison pics made me doubt myself. :) I wonder if Melissa's comparison picture shouldn't read R5, R1 to R4 from top to bottom. As it is, it lists row 4 twice, and doesn't have the number row. I asked for clarification.
That would be awesome, my hopes are on Weyman (you did see his message above?).Saw his note. I'm not at the 'making custom key caps' threshold. There should be no reason for it (unless I'm missing something?). The best pricing would be from getting complete sets from one source (consistency) and all the keys are currently manufactured....so....I want this for everybody. No compromise. (Am I missing something?)
I'll get 3 sets of 1.25-wide side keys for sure, and maybe a round3 Colemak Alpha set. Current price is too high though, still more than QWERTY Alpha + Colemak set (still have those in my order to get price updates, will remove them eventually), which doesn't make sense.I pulled my interest off that group buy because it was confusing, think I had to buy a bunch of extras, too expensive, still may not have gotten what I want, and I have not had the time to devote to sorting it all out and getting it done. It's been a nasty several months for me, and everything has suffered :( I am intrigued by his blank doubleshots though.
I had mixed Kinesis doubleshots and Kinesis singleshots and didn't notice a difference, but that doesn't mean anything.
There are DS Kinesis caps? :oYou didn't the KEY CAP section in the Split Kinesis mod wiki????
You didn't the KEY CAP section in the Split Kinesis mod wiki????
On a standard keyboard, the function row and the number row are the same height and are row 1 keycaps. The QWERTY row is row 2, the ASDFG row is row 3 and the bottom two rows are row 4.
I hope this clarifies!
I swapped my keys out during one of the early cherry keycap group buys, and they work _awesome_. I never looked back, and there is nothing unusual about the keys. The main issue is relocating keys from various rows to the thumb keys. The kinesis keys are all kinda tall though, so YMMV.
(Attachment) 30709[/ATTACH]
No time for other stuff ATM (work).
How do you game on your Kinesis – do you operate WASD with your pinky/ring/middle fingers? Seems to me like if a man were to get a Kinesis, a man would migrate to ESDF-centric gaming.
I'm making effort :)
So far we learned that the Race function (F#) key row is also called R5, just like the tall SP keys, right?
Hey all, just thought I would drop a heads up that thingiverse has a keycap library that I am working on. You can take a (very early) peek here:
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:20953
There will eventually be a full set of parametrically generated keys, I just need to get a script together that actually generates them from a spreadsheet rather than having to manually set the design parameters. It's in solidworks, btw.Show Image(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7099/6906598788_c211f2c1c4.jpg)
Cheers;
- Derek
p.s. The flash really added a sheen. The key doesn't stand out at all from the other keys (other than being cleaner) in person.
There is nearly no material, maybe a couple meters of filament tops. I am using a PLA plastic in a reprap, specifically this one:
[video=youtube_share;OuQZ-TEaSpg]http://youtu.be/OuQZ-TEaSpg[/video]
This is all a lead up for building a new kinesis variant with adjustable split, tilt and spacing:Show Image(http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5038/7061836431_8710be05d7_c.jpg)
You've been gone quite a while...I figured you took a trip to the South Pacific and hooked up with a native girl :)
We've been trying to get 2 options:
1) SP keys (available in ABS or PBT)....these are available.
2) Taller non-SP keys (in either ABS and PBT)....I had several sources that confirmed they could not do all the keys, was waiting for a couple more answers....then I had some serious life issues cropped up the 3rd week of April that brought almost everything to an absolute stop :(
Kinesis has a few sets they found of ABS BLACK with BLUE home row keys that are taller without labels (blank) for $40. If I could afford it, I would buy one set, but it's not a prudent purchase for me at this time. I'm in debt.
My bigger desire is to get keys in PBT and hopefully that are taller than the SP keys. But, if not available, I'll settle for the shorter SP keys made of PBT. The only drawback is that the key set pricing in ABS or PBT is very expensive unless you buy many sets. :(
I may be able to get involved again to try and source the taller keys (we know they are made in ABS) and maybe even PBT...our keyboards and fingers deserve it. But I don't know when I'll be able to do this, maybe towards the end of the year, so if someone wants to pick up where it's been left off....go for it.
But do you think Weyman from WASDkeyboards would even laser key caps we bought from somewhere else? Last I heard he wouldn't do it because of "could be lost during shipment" concerns. Also since he'll be offering PBT keys in a few months he might tell us to wait... (he has not replied to my last few mails so I'm not even trying to ask).
Frequently requested, but not planned
- PBT (currently unable to find a manufacturer with a reasonable price)
NO doubleshot blanks.Wanting Doubleshot blank keycaps is kind of a joke, as there is no practical difference to a normal blank keycap (except the underside has the potential to be a different colour) and it is considerably more expensive to produce them. As far as I know, they only exist on keyboards that had all doubleshot keys and one blank one (where it kind of makes sense) and possibly devlin.
I just ordered a full replacement set from WASD with my Danish Colemak layout and a bold retro look. Can't wait to get it!!WASD sells a complete Kinesis Advantage keycap set?
WASD sells a complete Kinesis Advantage keycap set?
No (not yet :-)
I used the replacements discussed in this thread: http://geekhack.org/showthread.php?23446-kinesis-advantage-keycap-replacement-limitations&p=477340&viewfull=1#post477340
Specifically, all eight 1x1.25 side keys are R1 (instead of three R2 and one R4), the eight home keys are R2 (instead of sphericals), and -- the only actual issue -- the four modifiers are R4 instead of the fabled R5 which has recently turned out to not be a custom Kinesis creation, it's just that WASD doesn't have it.
I think I never posted my WASD caps from 2012 in here:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
So, any news about Kinesis keycap replacements? I'm planning to order some for my other Kinesis from WASD as soon as I get my ergodox ;D
I ended up buying ducky double shot pbt. They’ve been great. Not the labels I want, but they caps are good
I just bought these: https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_detail&p=3248 and asked them to include an extra PBT KP0 and KPEnter. You just add this to your cart and put it in special instructions: https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/index.php?l=product_detail&p=2380
They sent me an extra KP0 and KPenter and a bunch of other keys I didn't end up needing. I've got almost all the keys covered but the tall keys, the square brackets and the tilde/|\ key on the lower left. Those I don't tend to use very often so I preferred to leave them properly legended. I'm quite happy w/ it.
Note the 3 and the 8 which should be right square bracket and KP8 respectively to have the proper profile.