Author Topic: graphics card upgrade  (Read 24455 times)

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Offline rowdy

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graphics card upgrade
« on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 06:10:50 »
I'm well out of touch with graphics cards - have been since, well, maybe 10 years ago.  There have been a few changes since then ...

Last week I acquired a depreciated asset from work - a Dell Inspiron 580 minitower PC (not slimline or SFF) with some RAM and core i5 CPU and an ATI Radeon HD5450 GPU.

The PC is faster than most of my other PCs (Macs excluded, but they don't run many of my games), but the video card sucks for gaming.

Technically, my budget is $0 :))

The PC has a 300W PSU, which I'd prefer not to have to upgrade in order to keep costs down.

I'm fairly sure it does NOT have the 4 (or whatever) pin extra power connector for a graphics card.

So, what graphics card would be a comfortable upgrade to play games from 5 to 10 years ago (e.g. Crysis, No Mans Sky, Stalker, Metro 2033), ideally without the extra GPU power requirement so I can avoid having to upgrade the PSU too?

Preferably under $100.

Bonus point if you can link to somewhere in Australia that sells it.

Thanks :D
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

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Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #1 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 07:02:21 »
Interesting - I was going to say the 300W PSU probably wasn't going to be any good but the HD5450 was recommended to have 400W+ so if you've checked it's stable while running games in its current configuration it should be OK with a similarly powered new(er) card.  The 55 chipsets used with the original iX CPUs have PCIE-2.0 which won't limit any card in your price range so that's good too.

Another consideration is what resolution are you hoping to play at?  At lower resolutions new low end cards tend to do better, at higher ones you might want an older but better card (or maybe it's the other way round?  I'm not exactly caught up myself, but adding this will help anyone who looks who is)
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #2 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 07:43:55 »
It may be a waste of money to do it up for games. Because it's not in a good bracket for price/performance given the psu limitation, cpu limitation,

1050ti is the only card that will fit into those limitations, and it's not really that cheap,  yet it only has 2012 lvl performance equivalent to an Ati hd 7970


if you're adamant about doin' it up...  look for 1050ti w/4gb ram at ~$100 refurb, maybe even new, on black friday this year.  Make sure to get one with Heatpipes,  the solid block versions run hot /noisy and can throttle.


1060gtx 6gb version might come down to $150 this black friday though.. big maybe..



Gaming right now, if you're NOT starting a Youtube streaming career,   you'd want at least the Intel 8700k overclocked to 5jigahertz


1080 or 1080Ti is best bang for buck considering the inflated pricing right now.  Anything less has 0x staying power.

1060 gtx w/ 6gb  is alrite, but honestly I still wouldn't recommend it because alot of games require way m0ar power these days (lazy programing).



Offline oumakavoula

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #3 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 08:08:18 »
for that budget i'd look for both a psu and gpu on ebay

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #4 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 08:21:53 »
for that budget i'd look for both a psu and gpu on ebay

Never buy a used PSU. if will blow up, burn your house down, and you die.. all to save $20

Offline JP

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #5 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 09:41:38 »
for that budget i'd look for both a psu and gpu on ebay

Never buy a used PSU. if will blow up, burn your house down, and you die.. all to save $20

Go with a high quality PSU like Seasonic (or Seasonic based). Do not cheap out if you get a new PSU. My PSU came with a 7 year warranty and now there is even the prime series with a 12 year warranty. Also a 1050GTX 4GB is the really nice card for the money and also supports 4k. The GPU will run you a bit over $100 though. I got mine for $130 USD a year ago and they are around the same price on eBay.
« Last Edit: Tue, 25 September 2018, 09:46:12 by JP »
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Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #6 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 15:09:26 »
Interesting - I was going to say the 300W PSU probably wasn't going to be any good but the HD5450 was recommended to have 400W+ so if you've checked it's stable while running games in its current configuration it should be OK with a similarly powered new(er) card.  The 55 chipsets used with the original iX CPUs have PCIE-2.0 which won't limit any card in your price range so that's good too.

Another consideration is what resolution are you hoping to play at?  At lower resolutions new low end cards tend to do better, at higher ones you might want an older but better card (or maybe it's the other way round?  I'm not exactly caught up myself, but adding this will help anyone who looks who is)

I've read that Dell underclocked that graphics card or something to make it stable under 300W.  This is something that other people have discussed, but quite a few years ago when the machines were much newer.

Replacing the PSU is often suggested along with upgrading the GPU.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

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Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #7 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 15:10:37 »
for that budget i'd look for both a psu and gpu on ebay

Never buy a used PSU. if will blow up, burn your house down, and you die.. all to save $20

+1

PSU I would never buy used.

Or hard drives - the postal service might not treat them as precious.

RAM is also questionable, as you don't know if the seller has taken appropriate anti-static precautions, or just rippsed apart a PC to sell for parts.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #8 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 15:13:55 »
for that budget i'd look for both a psu and gpu on ebay

Never buy a used PSU. if will blow up, burn your house down, and you die.. all to save $20

Go with a high quality PSU like Seasonic (or Seasonic based). Do not cheap out if you get a new PSU. My PSU came with a 7 year warranty and now there is even the prime series with a 12 year warranty. Also a 1050GTX 4GB is the really nice card for the money and also supports 4k. The GPU will run you a bit over $100 though. I got mine for $130 USD a year ago and they are around the same price on eBay.

1050GTX 4GB?  Or 1050GTX Ti 4GB?

I can only find the 1050GTX 4GB (non-Ti) with 2GB RAM.

The 1050GTX Ti 4GB comes in at around AUD$250, which is more than double my (non-existent) budget :(
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

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Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #9 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 15:18:16 »
It may be a waste of money to do it up for games. Because it's not in a good bracket for price/performance given the psu limitation, cpu limitation,

1050ti is the only card that will fit into those limitations, and it's not really that cheap,  yet it only has 2012 lvl performance equivalent to an Ati hd 7970


if you're adamant about doin' it up...  look for 1050ti w/4gb ram at ~$100 refurb, maybe even new, on black friday this year.  Make sure to get one with Heatpipes,  the solid block versions run hot /noisy and can throttle.


1060gtx 6gb version might come down to $150 this black friday though.. big maybe..



Gaming right now, if you're NOT starting a Youtube streaming career,   you'd want at least the Intel 8700k overclocked to 5jigahertz


1080 or 1080Ti is best bang for buck considering the inflated pricing right now.  Anything less has 0x staying power.

1060 gtx w/ 6gb  is alrite, but honestly I still wouldn't recommend it because alot of games require way m0ar power these days (lazy programing).




Thanks for the list - I'll go through it soon.

I don't want to play new games, I have amassed, er, about 150 games, and about half of them won't run on my old PCs but will run on this Inspiron except for the GPU.  Most of these are 5 to 10 years old, so any graphics card that was good 5 years ago is probably considered old now, but should play those games well.

Grabbing one from the list at random, the 1060gtx 6gb costs around AUD$400 which is four times my (non-existent) budget.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #10 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 15:33:27 »

Thanks for the list - I'll go through it soon.

I don't want to play new games, I have amassed, er, about 150 games, and about half of them won't run on my old PCs but will run on this Inspiron except for the GPU.  Most of these are 5 to 10 years old, so any graphics card that was good 5 years ago is probably considered old now, but should play those games well.

Grabbing one from the list at random, the 1060gtx 6gb costs around AUD$400 which is four times my (non-existent) budget.



Australian dollroos is the problem here.

Seems murican' prices are much lower..

That's weird cuz, u got taiwan right next door making these things, hahahahahaha..


if budget is an absolute concern, 1050ti is going to be the go to, it HAS to be the Ti version w/ heatpipes, do not get the 1050 non-ti .


IDK, when the black friday equivalent in australia is,  but yea, 1050ti on one of those days then.. it should handle 1080p no probz.

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #11 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 17:28:00 »

Thanks for the list - I'll go through it soon.

I don't want to play new games, I have amassed, er, about 150 games, and about half of them won't run on my old PCs but will run on this Inspiron except for the GPU.  Most of these are 5 to 10 years old, so any graphics card that was good 5 years ago is probably considered old now, but should play those games well.

Grabbing one from the list at random, the 1060gtx 6gb costs around AUD$400 which is four times my (non-existent) budget.



Australian dollroos is the problem here.

Seems murican' prices are much lower..

That's weird cuz, u got taiwan right next door making these things, hahahahahaha..


if budget is an absolute concern, 1050ti is going to be the go to, it HAS to be the Ti version w/ heatpipes, do not get the 1050 non-ti .


IDK, when the black friday equivalent in australia is,  but yea, 1050ti on one of those days then.. it should handle 1080p no probz.


I know, sucks.  I think all the cheap hardware gets shipped to you guys, and we get what's left.

You suggested:

GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$250
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$430
Core i7 8700K ~ AUD$559 (just for the CPU, then I'd need new RAM, new mobo, new case, new PSU)
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$730
GeForce GTX 1080 Ti ~ AUD$1100 :))

I won't be playing the latest games - I tend to wait a couple of years until the price drops, and buy them from GOG or Steam sales.  My plan is that hardware prices have also dropped.

Most of the games I have are 5 to 10 years old, e.g. Metro 2033 = 2010 = 8yo, Stalker = 2008(ish) = 10yo, Crysis = 2007 = 11yo, No Mans Sky = 2016 = 2yo (the most recent).

suicidal_orange asked the resolution - the monitor is 1920x1200 so that, or half at 960x600.  Doesn't have to be full detail either, I grew up with games in the 80s and 90s so ultra-high detail is not a significant factor.  TBH I'd prefer to turn details down a bit to get better frame rates.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #12 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 17:49:31 »

GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$250
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$430
Core i7 8700K ~ AUD$559 (just for the CPU, then I'd need new RAM, new mobo, new case, new PSU)
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$730
GeForce GTX 1080 Ti ~ AUD$1100 :))



Hrrrrmmm.... ridiculous price,  maybe used on ebay..

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #13 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 18:22:18 »

GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$250
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$430
Core i7 8700K ~ AUD$559 (just for the CPU, then I'd need new RAM, new mobo, new case, new PSU)
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$730
GeForce GTX 1080 Ti ~ AUD$1100 :))



Hrrrrmmm.... ridiculous price,  maybe used on ebay..

Used prices are somewhat more palatable ...

GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$150-200
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$150-200
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$350-550
GeForce GTX 1080 Ti ~ AUD$500+

Looks like I'll also have to make sure a double-width card will fit in the proprietary Dell case.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline Carcharocles

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #14 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 18:53:47 »
It's not just an Aussie problem. The mining craze is killing PC gamers right now. Honestly, I'd stay away from used cards at the moment, simply because used mining cards are out there and they're pretty much burned out by the time they hit the used market.

Consider AMD's RX 550 if you need to really cut down on price. It only has 2 GB of VRAM, but it's enough to run most of the games you mentioned (trying to max Metro and Crysis will still bring GTX 1060 level hardware down to its knees--still too much eye candy to render in those games). Try to run modern games on it though, and you'll basically be gimping yourself (we're getting to the point already where 3GB of VRAM holds cards back.) It's still well over 100 dollars in Aussie money, but it's cheaper than the 1050 and 1050 Ti (retails for 80 bucks USD over here). It's also about twice as powerful as your 5450, so worth it at least for a temp fix.

In either case, I'd consider looking at newegg.com/global/au for your parts.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #15 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 18:59:17 »

GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$250
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$430
Core i7 8700K ~ AUD$559 (just for the CPU, then I'd need new RAM, new mobo, new case, new PSU)
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$730
GeForce GTX 1080 Ti ~ AUD$1100 :))



Hrrrrmmm.... ridiculous price,  maybe used on ebay..

Used prices are somewhat more palatable ...

GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$150-200
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$150-200
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$350-550
GeForce GTX 1080 Ti ~ AUD$500+

Looks like I'll also have to make sure a double-width card will fit in the proprietary Dell case.

Get the 1080Ti..  get it.. if those are the prices, that's best bang for buck..

Offline Leslieann

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #16 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 20:42:52 »
That PSU  is an issue, and while Dell used to use a proprietary ATX connector and later a proporietary mount (wtf Dell!), apparently yours does not. The rating is still a problem though. Luckily you can get a decent 450+ watt psu for pretty cheap these days.

Get the cheapest 450+ watt Corsair or EVGA power supply that you can, should be less than $40. It may not be a Seasonic, but let's face it, this system is not worth spending $100 for a power supply. You need good enough, not "I can power quad 1080 SLI for 10 years" good.  Then go on Ebay or Craigslist or whatever you have there and look for a Radeon Rx series card that a miner with a decent ebay rating is selling. Do NOT buy the generic Chinese cards no matter how good the deal.

You should be able to do all of that for under $150 and you will get between Nvidia 1050 and 1060 performance. Some will say that's nothing spectacular (it's middle of the road at best), but considering your budget, that's pretty darn good. Besides, your system (1st gen I series) can't really push anything better anyway (you are bottlenecked).
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #18 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 21:12:53 »
what exact cpu is this i5.
650 or 750
Not terrible ghz speed, but the L1, L2, and L3 cache size hurts 1st gen performance.
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62g Zilents/lubed/Novelkeys 39g springs, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, pic
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Vortex case squared up/blasted finish removed/custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, foam sound dampened, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs, 40g actuation
| GMMK TKL
More
w/ Kailh Purple Pros/lubed/Novelkeys 39g springs, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, Netdot Gen10 Magnetic cable
| PF65 3d printed 65% w/LCD and hot swap
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Box Jades, Interchangeable trim, mini lcd, QMK, underglow, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, O-rings, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, in progress link
| Magicforce 68
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MF68 pcb, Outemu Blues, in progress
| YMDK75 Jail Housed Gateron Blues
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Cherry Blacks, custom 3d printed case
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Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #19 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 21:56:41 »
It's not just an Aussie problem. The mining craze is killing PC gamers right now. Honestly, I'd stay away from used cards at the moment, simply because used mining cards are out there and they're pretty much burned out by the time they hit the used market.

Consider AMD's RX 550 if you need to really cut down on price. It only has 2 GB of VRAM, but it's enough to run most of the games you mentioned (trying to max Metro and Crysis will still bring GTX 1060 level hardware down to its knees--still too much eye candy to render in those games). Try to run modern games on it though, and you'll basically be gimping yourself (we're getting to the point already where 3GB of VRAM holds cards back.) It's still well over 100 dollars in Aussie money, but it's cheaper than the 1050 and 1050 Ti (retails for 80 bucks USD over here). It's also about twice as powerful as your 5450, so worth it at least for a temp fix.

In either case, I'd consider looking at newegg.com/global/au for your parts.

Good thought!  Although I'm not looking for a new card (as in the latest tech), so a slightly older lower-end card may not have suffered through mining.

RX 550 I can get locally new for about $160, Newegg seems to be a bit more expensive.

Mainly for my own reference, the list is currently:

Radeon RX 550 ~ AUD$160
GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$250
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$430
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$730

That PSU  is an issue, and while Dell used to use a proprietary ATX connector and later a proporietary mount (wtf Dell!), apparently yours does not. The rating is still a problem though. Luckily you can get a decent 450+ watt psu for pretty cheap these days.

Get the cheapest 450+ watt Corsair or EVGA power supply that you can, should be less than $40. It may not be a Seasonic, but let's face it, this system is not worth spending $100 for a power supply. You need good enough, not "I can power quad 1080 SLI for 10 years" good.  Then go on Ebay or Craigslist or whatever you have there and look for a Radeon Rx series card that a miner with a decent ebay rating is selling. Do NOT buy the generic Chinese cards no matter how good the deal.

You should be able to do all of that for under $150 and you will get between Nvidia 1050 and 1060 performance. Some will say that's nothing spectacular (it's middle of the road at best), but considering your budget, that's pretty darn good. Besides, your system (1st gen I series) can't really push anything better anyway (you are bottlenecked).

There are reports online of people using GPUs that require a 400W PSU in similar Dell computers with no problems.  I'll try the GPU first, if it starts flaking out I'll have to upgrade the PSU too.  Somewhere I read that the PSU in the Inspiron is a reasonable one so I'm hoping to get away with it.

what exact cpu is this i5.
650 or 750
Not terrible ghz speed, but the L1, L2, and L3 cache size hurts 1st gen performance.

Dell's description of the CPU based on the machine's service tag is "4WTF4 - 1 - PROCESSOR, I5-760, 2.8, 8MB, LYN, 95W, B1".

I'm definitely not expecting stellar performance out of it, just hoping that it will be better than a Core 2 Duo at playing the above games, and a few more of a similar vintage.  I tried one already, and CPU and RAM were almost idling but the game was playing like a slideshow - caused by the GPU.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #20 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 21:56:48 »
what exact cpu is this i5.
650 or 750
Not terrible ghz speed, but the L1, L2, and L3 cache size hurts 1st gen performance.

hrrrmm.. that's no problem for anything except games like starcraft 2.. which have a single thread bottlenecks.

1050ti is a good fit overall without gpu upgrade..

It may be possible to get an old overclocking mobo though..

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #21 on: Tue, 25 September 2018, 23:56:49 »
There are reports online of people using GPUs that require a 400W PSU in similar Dell computers with no problems.  I'll try the GPU first, if it starts flaking out I'll have to upgrade the PSU too.  Somewhere I read that the PSU in the Inspiron is a reasonable one so I'm hoping to get away with it.
What are those GPUs, their wattage and how hard were they being pushed. How long ago where they doing this and how long did the psu last? PSUs lose capacity as the capacitors age  and these are now almost 8 years old.  More importantly, that power statement may have more to do with aftermarket power supplies, not an OEM, does your power supply even have two 8pin PCI-e power connectors?

If it has the PSU I saw on Ebay for it it's only capable of only about 130 watts on the 12v accessory line and lacks those connectors, don't forget, your hard drive and any other drives also use that power. A 1050 uses 70 watts, a hard drive uses 25, how much is that psu capable of today, because you don't have a lot of overhead at that point.

Edit... Don't forget about the dust it's acquired acting as an insulator.


It may be possible to get an old overclocking mobo though..
There's barely enough money in this budget for a GPU, much less a motherboard. By the time you overclock and put a 1050 you can bet even a good 400watt psu is going to be stressed.
« Last Edit: Wed, 26 September 2018, 00:00:26 by Leslieann »
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Vortex case squared up/blasted finish removed/custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, foam sound dampened, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs, 40g actuation
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w/ Kailh Purple Pros/lubed/Novelkeys 39g springs, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, Netdot Gen10 Magnetic cable
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Box Jades, Interchangeable trim, mini lcd, QMK, underglow, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, O-rings, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, in progress link
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| YMDK75 Jail Housed Gateron Blues
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J-spacers, YMDK Thick PBT, O-rings, SIP sockets
| KBT Race S L.E.
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Ergo Clears, custom WASD caps
| Das Pro
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Costar model with browns
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #22 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 00:48:11 »
By the way, too little power is just as bad for a computer as a spike and when power supplies have a problem things get ugly fast.

A lot of people online will tell you it's fine, and it might be for 6 months, but it also might only be good for 5 minutes, you don't know when and you don't know how bad it will be, but it will fail. A good power supply that can't supply enough will go nuclear and eat itself trying (this is why people like Seasonic and such), a lower end power supply doesn't eat itself, it goes nuts and starts doing whatever which usually ends up destroying every part in the computer. It may be subtle, like eating up several usb sticks over a few weeks time (can't trust anything in that system now) or it can be catastrophic like the one that sent 12volts down the 5volt wires letting all of the magic smoke out of nearly every part in the system (cpu and ram were all that was saved on a $1300 system).

You need a power supply, before you put this card in, not after.
Novelkeys NK65AE w/62g Zilents/39g springs
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62g Zilents/lubed/Novelkeys 39g springs, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, pic
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Vortex case squared up/blasted finish removed/custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, foam sound dampened, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs, 40g actuation
| GMMK TKL
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w/ Kailh Purple Pros/lubed/Novelkeys 39g springs, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, Netdot Gen10 Magnetic cable
| PF65 3d printed 65% w/LCD and hot swap
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Box Jades, Interchangeable trim, mini lcd, QMK, underglow, HK Gaming Thick PBT caps, O-rings, Netdot Gen10 magnetic cable, in progress link
| Magicforce 68
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MF68 pcb, Outemu Blues, in progress
| YMDK75 Jail Housed Gateron Blues
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J-spacers, YMDK Thick PBT, O-rings, SIP sockets
| KBT Race S L.E.
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Ergo Clears, custom WASD caps
| Das Pro
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Costar model with browns
| GH60
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Cherry Blacks, custom 3d printed case
| Logitech Illumininated | IBM Model M (x2)
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Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #23 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 01:17:49 »
There are reports online of people using GPUs that require a 400W PSU in similar Dell computers with no problems.  I'll try the GPU first, if it starts flaking out I'll have to upgrade the PSU too.  Somewhere I read that the PSU in the Inspiron is a reasonable one so I'm hoping to get away with it.

What are those GPUs, their wattage and how hard were they being pushed. How long ago where they doing this and how long did the psu last? PSUs lose capacity as the capacitors age  and these are now almost 8 years old.  More importantly, that power statement may have more to do with aftermarket power supplies, not an OEM, does your power supply even have two 8pin PCI-e power connectors?

If it has the PSU I saw on Ebay for it it's only capable of only about 130 watts on the 12v accessory line and lacks those connectors, don't forget, your hard drive and any other drives also use that power. A 1050 uses 70 watts, a hard drive uses 25, how much is that psu capable of today, because you don't have a lot of overhead at that point.

Edit... Don't forget about the dust it's acquired acting as an insulator.

It may be possible to get an old overclocking mobo though..

There's barely enough money in this budget for a GPU, much less a motherboard. By the time you overclock and put a 1050 you can bet even a good 400watt psu is going to be stressed.

I'd have to search again - there's a bunch of posts on the Dell forums about people upgrading GPU in these and similar Dell PCs.  Asking is graphics card X would work, someone says "but the PSU doesn't put out enough power", and someone else saying "I upgraded mine and it's working well".  Nothing concrete though.

AFAICR the PSU was reported to have only SATA and (20 pin?) mobo connectors, nothing else.  But a standard PSU will fit into the case, which is something at least.

You need a power supply, before you put this card in, not after.

I was afraid of that - eats into the budget a bit :(
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline Fiery

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #24 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 04:29:50 »
Just throwing in some help I guess, I personally have the 1050ti and it's a great card for 1080p gaming, and by the sounds of your requirements for gaming is going to give you more than you say you need. I would probably look for a 900 series cards used as you can probably get one cheap and it will be powerful enough. PSU wise having a stable 500W PSU with a good rating (gold) is pretty important as you don't want your system to blow up, and I would get that first and use what's left on the GPU. So when you're on the hunt check benchmarks, see what prices you can get X card for and try and find the best balance for your budget. Just my 2cents.
TP4 fanboy

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #25 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 06:17:05 »
Just throwing in some help I guess, I personally have the 1050ti and it's a great card for 1080p gaming, and by the sounds of your requirements for gaming is going to give you more than you say you need. I would probably look for a 900 series cards used as you can probably get one cheap and it will be powerful enough. PSU wise having a stable 500W PSU with a good rating (gold) is pretty important as you don't want your system to blow up, and I would get that first and use what's left on the GPU. So when you're on the hunt check benchmarks, see what prices you can get X card for and try and find the best balance for your budget. Just my 2cents.

More great input, thank you!

And another card to consider.

Looking at a GeForce GTX 970 to start with, it seem to have more than enough power to run the games I have, but does need 2 x 6-pin pwoer connectors, so a new PSU would be absolutely necessary.

Based on Leslieann's valued input above, I'm pretty much resigned to getting a new PSU as well.

The GeForce GTX 970 looks like on eBay for about AUD$75 or, at one Aussie shop (not my usual one) for AUD$568 :))  Yeah, right.

The eBay ones are allegedly new, and the price is about what I was hoping to pay.  Maybe a go-er, unless you meant a different 900 series.

Now I just have to find a PSU...

I checked inside the case this evening, it looks like there is room for a double-width card.  And there are 3 SATA power cables, one 20 (24?) pin mobo cable and one other 4 pin cable going to the mobo - that's it!  No GPU power cables.  No molex cables.  It's as little PSU as you can get away with.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline Fiery

  • Posts: 158
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  • Click Clack Clock and a nice Thock
Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #26 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 06:43:28 »
Just throwing in some help I guess, I personally have the 1050ti and it's a great card for 1080p gaming, and by the sounds of your requirements for gaming is going to give you more than you say you need. I would probably look for a 900 series cards used as you can probably get one cheap and it will be powerful enough. PSU wise having a stable 500W PSU with a good rating (gold) is pretty important as you don't want your system to blow up, and I would get that first and use what's left on the GPU. So when you're on the hunt check benchmarks, see what prices you can get X card for and try and find the best balance for your budget. Just my 2cents.

More great input, thank you!

And another card to consider.

Looking at a GeForce GTX 970 to start with, it seem to have more than enough power to run the games I have, but does need 2 x 6-pin pwoer connectors, so a new PSU would be absolutely necessary.

Based on Leslieann's valued input above, I'm pretty much resigned to getting a new PSU as well.

The GeForce GTX 970 looks like on eBay for about AUD$75 or, at one Aussie shop (not my usual one) for AUD$568 :))  Yeah, right.

The eBay ones are allegedly new, and the price is about what I was hoping to pay.  Maybe a go-er, unless you meant a different 900 series.

Now I just have to find a PSU...

I checked inside the case this evening, it looks like there is room for a double-width card.  And there are 3 SATA power cables, one 20 (24?) pin mobo cable and one other 4 pin cable going to the mobo - that's it!  No GPU power cables.  No molex cables.  It's as little PSU as you can get away with.
nop I was thinking that 900 series of GPUs :) and if you can snap a 970 you should be pretty golden imho. Just see if you can squeeze in a decent PSU as well. Good luck on your journey  :thumb:
TP4 fanboy

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #27 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 08:07:24 »
Just throwing in some help I guess, I personally have the 1050ti and it's a great card for 1080p gaming, and by the sounds of your requirements for gaming is going to give you more than you say you need. I would probably look for a 900 series cards used as you can probably get one cheap and it will be powerful enough. PSU wise having a stable 500W PSU with a good rating (gold) is pretty important as you don't want your system to blow up, and I would get that first and use what's left on the GPU. So when you're on the hunt check benchmarks, see what prices you can get X card for and try and find the best balance for your budget. Just my 2cents.

Man, when those 980 TIs were $200,  I regret not buying 4x..  GDI, i was so obsessed with 4k blurays at the time.. sigh... 980Ti can't play 4k h265..


970 is equivalent to 1060gtx, but 1060 has h265,  keep eye on the price, h265 decoding is important, because that cpu in the pc won't do it.


Offline JP

  • Posts: 359
  • Location: Indianapolis, IN ander, our true elevated elder.
Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #28 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 08:19:01 »
On your current rig I think you could run something older like a GT 730 but the games you listed are really intensive so you would need to find something better. A power supply is what you need first but first find the power requirements of the card you plan on going with and then add 100 watts. That should be a good estimate of your overall power demands. You will also to need find a power supply that has the power connectors your GPU needs, e.g, 6 pin, 8 pin, 2x 6 pin, etc. It really doesn't hurt to splurge on a nice PSU since if in the future you need more capabilities hopefully you won't need to buy yet another. You just won't need anything crazy like a 800+ watt high end unit. I'd also recommend Corsair or Evga branded power supplies and 450W+ is where you should start looking. In fact my Evga branded unit was Seasonic based.
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Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #29 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 17:59:59 »
970 is equivalent to 1060gtx, but 1060 has h265,  keep eye on the price, h265 decoding is important, because that cpu in the pc won't do it.
Besides h265, you are going to pay almost as much for a used 970 as you will for a used 1060 (used card market is still readjusting to the price drops), so why buy a card that is several years older for the same price and less capable (again, discount the Chinese knockoffs!).




I'm well out of touch with graphics cards - have been since, well, maybe 10 years ago.  There have been a few changes since then ...
Oh, one last thing Rowdy...
Check the monitor ports you have available. I recently upgraded monitors and I could no longer use my DVI cables or my mini displayport to DVI cables and had to dig out some HDMI cables until I could order some Displayport cables. New cards do not use VGA cables, and quite a few do not even support DVI these days. You can get adapters, but that will add another $10-$20 to your costs to do this.
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Offline Carcharocles

  • Posts: 102
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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #30 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 18:36:44 »
If you haven't looked at power supplies, I suggest looking at Seasonic's S12II series. They're efficient (they're 80+ Bronze, but some models come close to Silver), very inexpensive (the 520 watt version only 80 Australian Dollars at Newegg, you can probably find it cheaper elsewhere), and are downright solid. They won't play well with Haswell, but you don't have Haswell (it can be remedied by turning off certain power states with Haswell anyway). They also have a 5 year warranty when bought new (not the 3 year warranty on the box--they changed it right after it was released) and despite what it says on the power supply, a single 12 volt rail (this is good for a 520 watt power supply, but with something like 700 watts you should start to consider dual-rail).

The M12II Evo is an improved (slightly) variant of the S12II that is fully modular. Non-Evo M12II are out there but are discontinued, and are basically partly modular S12II power supplies with no  other alterations.

Note that a lot of good quality "cheap" PSU's are based on the S12 II platform--Antec Earthwatts 520 is basically a slightly customized Seasonic S12II 520, for instance. Earthwatts 520 might actually be a better buy if you can find a new one, as they are cheaper due to lacking a power cable. If you have a solid power cable that works with it, you can use that and save some cash.

Like others have said, you do not want to play around with cheap or old power supplies. Dell's power supplies are only efficient for what they already have inside their systems--the 5450 is a power sipper, but anything even a little more powerful is going to suck power out of that PCIe port (about 70 additional watts if they're not overclocked--if they are, don't get a card without at least a six-pin power port, because they can ruin your motherboard).

The 9xx GTX series, as mentioned above, will be good for you, but be warned the 970 will be slightly short on RAM in modern games (it is actually a 3.5GB VRAM card, not 4 GB as advertised; this is right on the edge of viability for 1080p in newer games, but it did lead to a false advertising lawsuit when the GTX 9xx series was dominant). Because of this, however, they are/were not often used by miners, who preferred cards like the 980 Ti for their higher VRAM and compute power (AMD cards were far more dominant here for a while, as they had better compute performance than GTX cards at the time. Don't by used AMD cards, as AMD still gets used a lot for mining.)
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Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #31 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 22:08:34 »
I'm well out of touch with graphics cards - have been since, well, maybe 10 years ago.  There have been a few changes since then ...

Oh, one last thing Rowdy...
Check the monitor ports you have available. I recently upgraded monitors and I could no longer use my DVI cables or my mini displayport to DVI cables and had to dig out some HDMI cables until I could order some Displayport cables. New cards do not use VGA cables, and quite a few do not even support DVI these days. You can get adapters, but that will add another $10-$20 to your costs to do this.

My monitor is probably older than the PC.  It is a 24" Acer 1920x1200 monitor with one of each DVI and VGA ports.  It does not have HDMI.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 22:49:15 »

My monitor is probably older than the PC.  It is a 24" Acer 1920x1200 monitor with one of each DVI and VGA ports.  It does not have HDMI.

See if you can borrow a calibration probe from work..   It'll look brand new..

Offline clankgy1

  • Formerly digifiend
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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #33 on: Wed, 26 September 2018, 22:53:52 »
...(it is actually a 3.5GB VRAM card, not 4 GB as advertised; this is right on the edge of viability for 1080p in newer games, but it did lead to a false advertising lawsuit when the GTX 9xx series was dominant).

I got my $30 check from the settlement on the GTX970, lol.  I wonder how much the lawyers got from that.

Looking at your game list, the 970 should handle everything fine if you can get a good deal on one.  Otherwise, listen to the good folks and get a 1060.

Regarding power supplies, all of these people are dead on.  Lack of a reliable power supply = no joy.  No specific recommendations other than what the good folks recommend here.  No chinese or ****-tier power supplies, everything in the rig depends on clean, reliable power.

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Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 4518
Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #34 on: Thu, 27 September 2018, 00:22:29 »
My monitor is probably older than the PC.  It is a 24" Acer 1920x1200 monitor with one of each DVI and VGA ports.  It does not have HDMI.
Exactly why I mentioned it.
If you know other people in your area someone may have an HDMI to dvi converter you can have, some cards come with them, but you can get them online for just a couple dollars. Be sure to get the right one to use your current cable or you will be needing a cable as well.

See if you can borrow a calibration probe from work..   It'll look brand new..
I was more concerned with his ability to connect to it.
Ports have changed a lot in the last few years, and this being an older system, it's probably attached to an older monitor which lacks the newer ports. It's actually becoming difficult to find anything with a vga or even a DVI port these days. Some even lack HDMI, particularly as you go up in resolution.
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Offline Badwrench

  • * Destiny Supporter
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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #35 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 16:01:09 »
If you want to just snag a decent older card that runs on pci power, a gtx 750ti (make sure its a model that doesn't need a 6-pin) makes a fine 1080p gpu for games a few years old. 

They can be had decently cheap too: https://www.ebay.com/itm/ZOTAC-Nvidia-GTX-750-Ti-2GB-Graphics-Card-640-Cuda-Cores/123382350573?epid=2223409119&hash=item1cba2942ed:g:w1IAAOSww0xbpJjd:sc:USPSPriority!92084!US!-1

  or for a little more $, a 1050Ti is much better performing, but you can still find pci powered models. 
https://www.ebay.com/itm/MSI-NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-1050-TI-4GB-GDDR5-PCI-Express-3-0-1050TI/263962680826?hash=item3d7566ddfa:g:nTEAAOSwdudbiWqg
wut. i'd buy a ****ty IBM board for that green V2

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #36 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 16:41:23 »
def don't want to buy a 750,  needz h265/hevc

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #37 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 18:52:17 »
If you haven't looked at power supplies, I suggest looking at Seasonic's S12II series. They're efficient (they're 80+ Bronze, but some models come close to Silver), very inexpensive (the 520 watt version only 80 Australian Dollars at Newegg, you can probably find it cheaper elsewhere), and are downright solid. They won't play well with Haswell, but you don't have Haswell (it can be remedied by turning off certain power states with Haswell anyway). They also have a 5 year warranty when bought new (not the 3 year warranty on the box--they changed it right after it was released) and despite what it says on the power supply, a single 12 volt rail (this is good for a 520 watt power supply, but with something like 700 watts you should start to consider dual-rail).

The M12II Evo is an improved (slightly) variant of the S12II that is fully modular. Non-Evo M12II are out there but are discontinued, and are basically partly modular S12II power supplies with no  other alterations.

Note that a lot of good quality "cheap" PSU's are based on the S12 II platform--Antec Earthwatts 520 is basically a slightly customized Seasonic S12II 520, for instance. Earthwatts 520 might actually be a better buy if you can find a new one, as they are cheaper due to lacking a power cable. If you have a solid power cable that works with it, you can use that and save some cash.

Like others have said, you do not want to play around with cheap or old power supplies. Dell's power supplies are only efficient for what they already have inside their systems--the 5450 is a power sipper, but anything even a little more powerful is going to suck power out of that PCIe port (about 70 additional watts if they're not overclocked--if they are, don't get a card without at least a six-pin power port, because they can ruin your motherboard).

The 9xx GTX series, as mentioned above, will be good for you, but be warned the 970 will be slightly short on RAM in modern games (it is actually a 3.5GB VRAM card, not 4 GB as advertised; this is right on the edge of viability for 1080p in newer games, but it did lead to a false advertising lawsuit when the GTX 9xx series was dominant). Because of this, however, they are/were not often used by miners, who preferred cards like the 980 Ti for their higher VRAM and compute power (AMD cards were far more dominant here for a while, as they had better compute performance than GTX cards at the time. Don't by used AMD cards, as AMD still gets used a lot for mining.)

Lots of info, thanks.

I've got a few local preferred suppliers, and I'm a bit leery of getting some things off eBay.

I can get a Seasonic Focus Gold 450W for $99 from PCCaseGear.  The same thing from Amazon is $163.40 btw - just forget about the Aussie Amazon site, it is nothing like the US version.

The Focus Gold 650W is $129 - $30 more for an extra 200W - worth it?  Pushing the budget though.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #38 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 18:53:28 »

My monitor is probably older than the PC.  It is a 24" Acer 1920x1200 monitor with one of each DVI and VGA ports.  It does not have HDMI.

See if you can borrow a calibration probe from work..   It'll look brand new..

That's hilarious :))

We have no such thing.  Nor has anyone ever mentioned one.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #39 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 18:59:02 »

My monitor is probably older than the PC.  It is a 24" Acer 1920x1200 monitor with one of each DVI and VGA ports.  It does not have HDMI.

See if you can borrow a calibration probe from work..   It'll look brand new..

That's hilarious :))

We have no such thing.  Nor has anyone ever mentioned one.

Janice, the one who spends alot of time shopping her cat photos..

she might have one.

Chk ur coworker facebook profiles, the amateur photographers love to buy these things even though they really can't use um.

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #40 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 19:12:28 »
Prices on a 750 Ti range from $90 (used), $100 (new), up to $250.  I'll list it as $200 as the few places that still claim to sell them tend to have slightly higher prices.  The lower prices for it come from eBay.

There's been a few votes on a 1060, but that is way above my budget.  The 970 seems to be a close second contender,

Nowhere obvious seems to sell GTX 970 any more, and eBay prices vary.  I can get one from eBay for about $75, but it has "low consumption and calorific value" and "high quality and durable performance".  Something slightly lost in translation?  Rowdy becomes wary.

The next higher price is $140 for a used specimen.  Then quickly jumps up to $250.  Too far above budget :(  I'll list it for $150 as the $75 ones seem a bit dodgy.

GTX 750 Ti - rofl eBay sellers listing two items in the same listing, a SATA cable or a graphics card.  Choose one.  WTF?  Next ...  Lots of them have exactly the same pictures.  There is a used one with 2GB for $90.  Any good?  Do I really need h265?  Not going to be watching videos on this PC, just occasionally playing a few games like those listed above.

GeForce TGX 750 Ti ~ AUD$90 (used)
GeForce GTX 970 ~ AUD$150
Radeon RX 550 ~ AUD$160
GeForce GTX 750 Ti ~ AUD$200
GeForce GTX 1050 Ti ~ AUD$250
GeForce GTX 1060 ~ AUD$430
GeForce GTX 1080 ~ AUD$730

Seasonic Focus Gold 450W ~ AUD$99
Seasonic Focus Gold 650W ~ AUD$129
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline Carcharocles

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #41 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 19:19:43 »

Lots of info, thanks.

I've got a few local preferred suppliers, and I'm a bit leery of getting some things off eBay.

I can get a Seasonic Focus Gold 450W for $99 from PCCaseGear.  The same thing from Amazon is $163.40 btw - just forget about the Aussie Amazon site, it is nothing like the US version.

The Focus Gold 650W is $129 - $30 more for an extra 200W - worth it?  Pushing the budget though.

Yeah, don't do ebay for power supplies.

Focus Gold 450 watt will be just fine for something like the GTX 1050/1050 Ti or RX 550/560. Those cards practically sip power. GTX 970 though... I'm not sure it would be safe to use on a 450 watt power supply, since it calls for a 500 watt PSU. Those specs are usually a little inflated due to the abundance of cheap power supplies on the market that can't do full power consistently (keeps graphics card manufacturers from being sued), so let me check out some old reviews and get back to you on that. Generally speaking though, the Focus Gold PSU's are fantastic power supplies for the money--better than the S12II and M12II Evo.

Keep in mind that there is both a Focus Gold and a Focus Plus Gold. Focus Gold is typically cheaper as it is only semi-modular (it's meant to be a sort of replacement for the S12/M12 II series.) Focus Plus is more expensive due to being fully modular (you only plug in the cables you need) and likely have somewhat better stability. This is Seasonic though, so the regular Focus Gold is something I would have no issues with running any graphics card on.
« Last Edit: Fri, 28 September 2018, 19:21:30 by Carcharocles »
T1000 , Firmware ver. Doge.

Most deadly of them all.
Keyboards: Drevo Gramr (Outemu Browns); Logitech K480

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #42 on: Fri, 28 September 2018, 21:41:42 »
If you're sure on the 1050ti make sure to get one that has the 6 pin connector.

Some cards draw from the pcie slot, and some boards don't deliver that much.

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #43 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 19:26:11 »

Lots of info, thanks.

I've got a few local preferred suppliers, and I'm a bit leery of getting some things off eBay.

I can get a Seasonic Focus Gold 450W for $99 from PCCaseGear.  The same thing from Amazon is $163.40 btw - just forget about the Aussie Amazon site, it is nothing like the US version.

The Focus Gold 650W is $129 - $30 more for an extra 200W - worth it?  Pushing the budget though.

Yeah, don't do ebay for power supplies.

Focus Gold 450 watt will be just fine for something like the GTX 1050/1050 Ti or RX 550/560. Those cards practically sip power. GTX 970 though... I'm not sure it would be safe to use on a 450 watt power supply, since it calls for a 500 watt PSU. Those specs are usually a little inflated due to the abundance of cheap power supplies on the market that can't do full power consistently (keeps graphics card manufacturers from being sued), so let me check out some old reviews and get back to you on that. Generally speaking though, the Focus Gold PSU's are fantastic power supplies for the money--better than the S12II and M12II Evo.

Keep in mind that there is both a Focus Gold and a Focus Plus Gold. Focus Gold is typically cheaper as it is only semi-modular (it's meant to be a sort of replacement for the S12/M12 II series.) Focus Plus is more expensive due to being fully modular (you only plug in the cables you need) and likely have somewhat better stability. This is Seasonic though, so the regular Focus Gold is something I would have no issues with running any graphics card on.

Semi-modular is fine - according to the info the mobo and 8in ATX cables are permanently connected, the rest aren't.  Fine by me as those would be required all the time.

But ...

The PC has a 24-pin and a 4-pin power cable plugged into it.  The Focus Gold PSU (both of them) say it has non-modular 24-pin and 8-pin ATX cables.  The PSU specifications indicate it is supplied with main power 24/20 pins and CPU 8/4 pins - how does that work?  It is 8 pin or 4 pin?  Is it two 4 pin plugs that can sit side by side?  Is the mobo too old and I have to look for a PSU with only 4 pin plug?

Sorry for all the questions, I am so far out of date with this stuff.

This post suggests that the 8-pin plug separates into 2 x 4-pin plugs, and either can be used.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #44 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 19:43:00 »
If you're sure on the 1050ti make sure to get one that has the 6 pin connector.

Some cards draw from the pcie slot, and some boards don't deliver that much.


1050 Ti is too expensive at this stage, I'll probably go for the used GTX 750 Ti.

But ... (there's so many "but"s) ... this uses PCIe power, but not much of it.  Hopefully not an issue.

Although Tom';s Hardware review suggests that average FPS for BioShock Infinite is 57, Far Cry 3 is 40, Metro: Last Light is 50, and all using only 60W or so of power.  These are all 1080p at high detail - I'll probably run at similar resolution with lower detail, or lower resolution with higher detail.

So does the combination of the Focus Gold 450W PSU + (used) GeForce GTX 750 Ti seem reasonable?
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline PadawanGeek

  • Posts: 709
Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #45 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 20:03:23 »
Don't expect too much out of the 750 Ti and you should be okay, that combo seems fine. In fact, somewhere down the line, should you feel like upgrading that GTX 750Ti to, say, a GTX1060, I don't see a problem because the Focus 450W Gold is a Seasonic after all. I have a Seasonic X-1250W Gold in my main rig since 2012, a testament to its durability and sheer power (had a water loop running for my 2x R9 290X before upgrading to a RTX 2080 TI yesterday). Have you tried looking at a used GPU? A used GTX1050 Ti would be a vast improvement over the GTX750 Ti, and I'm pretty sure the Fucus 450W PSU can handle the card. I'd recently snagged a GTX 1080 for about 456AUD (converted from local currency), it was a mining card but only for about 6 months  and still has about 18 months of warranty.....so glad the mining craze is dying down.

With regards to the cable 8 pin plug, I believe it can be separated into 2x 4 pin if your board doesn't need more power and has only a 4 pin ATX power connector. SImilar to the PCIe cables which can be use on 8 or 6 pin plugs on the GPU (depending on the GPU) since it can be separated into 6+2 pin.
« Last Edit: Sat, 29 September 2018, 20:12:59 by PadawanGeek »

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #46 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 20:09:50 »
If you're sure on the 1050ti make sure to get one that has the 6 pin connector.

Some cards draw from the pcie slot, and some boards don't deliver that much.


1050 Ti is too expensive at this stage, I'll probably go for the used GTX 750 Ti.

But ... (there's so many "but"s) ... this uses PCIe power, but not much of it.  Hopefully not an issue.

Although Tom';s Hardware review suggests that average FPS for BioShock Infinite is 57, Far Cry 3 is 40, Metro: Last Light is 50, and all using only 60W or so of power.  These are all 1080p at high detail - I'll probably run at similar resolution with lower detail, or lower resolution with higher detail.

So does the combination of the Focus Gold 450W PSU + (used) GeForce GTX 750 Ti seem reasonable?

U reallllly shouldn't get 750,  it doesn't decode h265.. alot of video content in the future are gonna be h265.. 750 is very obsolete.

Offline rowdy

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Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #47 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 21:22:27 »
If you're sure on the 1050ti make sure to get one that has the 6 pin connector.

Some cards draw from the pcie slot, and some boards don't deliver that much.


1050 Ti is too expensive at this stage, I'll probably go for the used GTX 750 Ti.

But ... (there's so many "but"s) ... this uses PCIe power, but not much of it.  Hopefully not an issue.

Although Tom';s Hardware review suggests that average FPS for BioShock Infinite is 57, Far Cry 3 is 40, Metro: Last Light is 50, and all using only 60W or so of power.  These are all 1080p at high detail - I'll probably run at similar resolution with lower detail, or lower resolution with higher detail.

So does the combination of the Focus Gold 450W PSU + (used) GeForce GTX 750 Ti seem reasonable?

U reallllly shouldn't get 750,  it doesn't decode h265.. alot of video content in the future are gonna be h265.. 750 is very obsolete.


This is a PC for playing 5-10 year old games, not decoding the latest video formats.  It doesn't need to have the latest and greatest of anything, just enough power to comfortably play games from 5-10 years ago.  And because it's already obsolete, I don't want to spend too much upgrading it for the intended purpose.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline rowdy

  • HHKB Hapster
  • * Erudite Elder
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  • Posts: 21175
  • Location: melbourne.vic.au
  • Missed another sale.
Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #48 on: Sat, 29 September 2018, 21:45:00 »
Don't expect too much out of the 750 Ti and you should be okay, that combo seems fine. In fact, somewhere down the line, should you feel like upgrading that GTX 750Ti to, say, a GTX1060, I don't see a problem because the Focus 450W Gold is a Seasonic after all. I have a Seasonic X-1250W Gold in my main rig since 2012, a testament to its durability and sheer power (had a water loop running for my 2x R9 290X before upgrading to a RTX 2080 TI yesterday). Have you tried looking at a used GPU? A used GTX1050 Ti would be a vast improvement over the GTX750 Ti, and I'm pretty sure the Fucus 450W PSU can handle the card. I'd recently snagged a GTX 1080 for about 456AUD (converted from local currency), it was a mining card but only for about 6 months  and still has about 18 months of warranty.....so glad the mining craze is dying down.

With regards to the cable 8 pin plug, I believe it can be separated into 2x 4 pin if your board doesn't need more power and has only a 4 pin ATX power connector. SImilar to the PCIe cables which can be use on 8 or 6 pin plugs on the GPU (depending on the GPU) since it can be separated into 6+2 pin.

GTX 1050 Ti is still available in-store for AUD$240-260.  Second-hand is anything from $150 up, with dozens of bids and days to go.  There are a bunch of "new" "unbranded" cards on eBay for under $100 - those are probably the Chinese clones.  I'll avoid those.  All these prices exclude postage, btw, so at end of auction including postage they probably won't be far off the price of a new card.

Unfortunately this is starting to push the price a bit higher than I would have liked.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline PadawanGeek

  • Posts: 709
Re: graphics card upgrade
« Reply #49 on: Sun, 30 September 2018, 00:01:36 »
GTX 1050 Ti is still available in-store for AUD$240-260.  Second-hand is anything from $150 up, with dozens of bids and days to go.  There are a bunch of "new" "unbranded" cards on eBay for under $100 - those are probably the Chinese clones.  I'll avoid those.  All these prices exclude postage, btw, so at end of auction including postage they probably won't be far off the price of a new card.

Unfortunately this is starting to push the price a bit higher than I would have liked.
Oh man, I'd forgotten how badly Aussie hardware price sucks the big one......I was astounded at the prices I see in eBay Australia. Are you set on nVidia, or would you consider AMD? The latter has great bang for buck value, consider the RX470....
https://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313.TR1.TRC0.A0.H0.Xrx+470.TRS0&_nkw=rx+470&_sacat=27386&LH_TitleDesc=0&_osacat=27386&_odkw=rx+480&LH_TitleDesc=0

Look at the Int'l listing, some can be had for pretty cheap. In my neck of the wood, an RX 580 8GB can be had for about 284AUD.....


I do understand your trepidation when it comes to buying used, the difference with me is, I get to meet up with the seller to test that the card is working. When I'd gotten my GTX 1080, the seller tested it by getting to POST. As card is under warranty, and should I encounter any issue, I could go to the distro service center to have it checked.
« Last Edit: Sun, 30 September 2018, 00:16:26 by PadawanGeek »