"foreign" language mech switch keyboards?

[Datamancer]

Hello all, I was curious if anyone knew of any foreign language keyboards with mechanical switches (I know "foreign" is a relative descriptor, but since most keyboards seem to be built around the English QWERTY layout, I mean "non-English" in this case). In particular I'm interested in a Spanish keyboard (there's one extra key near the left SHIFT key) and Korean (which has a few extra keys at the bottom). Any help would be greatly appreciated. I skimmed Google quickly but didn't get many promising results so I figured someone here would probably just know this offhand.

Thanks!
-~D~-

[clickclack]

Off hand I think there was a Spanish Model M around here somewhere. I wish I could be of more help, maybe someone will remember. Was it rippy that had one?

[ch_123]

Javifest was selling one, but it is gone now.

Unicomp still makes them.

[microsoft windows]

I think you can get Model M's in other languages too. I've seen some Italian ones.

[t13]

I'm not familiar with Acekey, but WeirdStuff has an Arabic AT Keyboard for sale.

[British]

most keyboards seem to be built around the English QWERTY layout, I mean "non-English" in this case). In particular I'm interested in a Spanish keyboard

According to Wikipedia, spanish layouts are based upon QWERTY as well...

Spanish (Spain), aka Spanish (International sort)


Spanish (Latin America)


Being so, I guess it wouldn't be too hard to make a spanish keyboard out of an english one (not like french :pout:).

[microsoft windows]

I remember also a guy here talking about an Arabic Model M he found in Iraq.

[Henry]

Hello all, I was curious if anyone knew of any foreign language keyboards with mechanical switches (I know "foreign" is a relative descriptor, but since most keyboards seem to be built around the English QWERTY layout, I mean "non-English" in this case). In particular I'm interested in a Spanish keyboard (there's one extra key near the left SHIFT key) and Korean (which has a few extra keys at the bottom). Any help would be greatly appreciated. I skimmed Google quickly but didn't get many promising results so I figured someone here would probably just know this offhand.

Thanks!
-~D~-

I have yet to encounter a Korean keyboard with dedicated 한/영 and 한자  keys. They are just mapped to right alt and right control respectively. Mechanical keyboards sold in Korea are therefore in ANSI layout.

[Mental Hobbit]

Cherry makes keyboards in ISO layout of course. Spanish legends are only available with black MX switches, but most European language versions have that extra key next to L-Shift.

[Datamancer]

According to Wikipedia, spanish layouts are based upon QWERTY as well...

Spanish (Spain), aka Spanish (International sort)

Show Image

Spanish (Latin America)

Show Image

Being so, I guess it wouldn't be too hard to make a spanish keyboard out of an english one (not like french :pout:).

Thanks for the responses, everyone. British, the Spanish keyboards look like QWERTYs at a glance, but if you look next to the left shift key, there's an extra physical key there, the <,> key, which is messing me up.

[clickclack]

So to recap, ch_123 says Unicomp sells them. That sounds like a good way to go! Unless you were looking for a mechanical board that used individual switch modules.
good luck on your searches and please tell us what ya find or go with.

=)

[Henry]

?

Show Image

Any Japanese keyboard could be remapped as well.  My Filco Zero (with no transposing controller issues) was easily remapped and I wouldn't be surprised if the Kanji/Hirigana key scancodes  match the Korean hangul keys.

That's why I shouldn't post here after having beers with colleagues. :biggrin:

I knew 106-key Korean keyboards existed, I just forgot that Filco made one. And I haven't seen any keyboard in this layout yet.

Edit: Ok I'm completely wrong, there are plenty of them around. Newer keyboards seem to stick to the ANSI layout though.

[Datamancer]

So to recap, ch_123 says Unicomp sells them. That sounds like a good way to go! Unless you were looking for a mechanical board that used individual switch modules.
good luck on your searches and please tell us what ya find or go with.

=)

Yeah I was looking for something with a solid PCB and an Alps or Cherry switch, if possible. Thanks, though.
-~D~-

[ch_123]

Thanks for the responses, everyone. British, the Spanish keyboards look like QWERTYs at a glance, but if you look next to the left shift key, there's an extra physical key there, the <,> key, which is messing me up.

What you mean here is ISO and ANSI.

ISO is the standard for the physical layout of buttons on a keyboard used by most parts of Europe (including Spain).  This has the key between Left shift and Z, the inverted L shaped enter, and the extra key along the middle row to the left of the lower part of the enter/

ANSI is the standard used in the US, and parts of the far east. This has the horizontal bar enter and no key between left shift and enter.

The Spanish layout is QWERTY based (first six letters on the top letter row). This is distinct to AZERTY used in Francophone countries, and QWERTZ used in Germany and other central European countries.

And I'd argue that buckling springs are better than Alps or Cherry, unless you want a quiet keyboard that is...

[Datamancer]

Ripster, that Japanese keyboard looks promising. Does it come ten-keyed as well?
It has the extra keys to either side of the spacebar, which is what I needed.

Additionally I'm looking for something that doesn't require any custom remapping in software and will be "plug-n-chug" when I give it to a customer.

-~D~-

[ch_123]

One of our forum members in Spain is selling a Spanish layout Dell AT102. See here.

[clickclack]

Perhaps try fentek, they might be able to help you =)

that dell seems like a good idea!

I just saw this random one-
http://cgi.ebay.com/Key-Touch-Win-95-Mechanical-Click-Spanish-Keyboard-/350230058795?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs

[Datamancer]

What you mean here is ISO and ANSI.

ISO is the standard for the physical layout of buttons on a keyboard used by most parts of Europe (including Spain).  This has the key between Left shift and Z, the inverted L shaped enter, and the extra key along the middle row to the left of the lower part of the enter/

ANSI is the standard used in the US, and parts of the far east. This has the horizontal bar enter and no key between left shift and enter.

The Spanish layout is QWERTY based (first six letters on the top letter row). This is distinct to AZERTY used in Francophone countries, and QWERTZ used in Germany and other central European countries.

And I'd argue that buckling springs are better than Alps or Cherry, unless you want a quiet keyboard that is...

Oh, awesome. Thanks for clearing that up. That helps me greatly. I've worked with the standard ANSI QWERTY layout pretty extensively but just recently started branching out into the foreign language stuff, so it's all a bit of a mystery to me.

Is there a special classification for the Japanese/Korean layout that has the extra modifier keys near the spacebar?

Thanks again,
-~D~-

[British]

Thanks for the responses, everyone. British, the Spanish keyboards look like QWERTYs at a glance, but if you look next to the left shift key, there's an extra physical key there, the <,> key, which is messing me up.

What ch_123 said :wink:

Regarding the <> key, I remapped it using AutoHotKey.
On my MX-11800, I put those on the key directly above the enter key (which is horizontal, as that keyboard is ANSI).
That key is labelled |\, but when using AZERTY layout it's *.
So now I have left Ctrl * = < and left Alt * = >.

[Datamancer]

So with the ISO keyboards, they're all exactly the same? So if I was going to be making my own custom key lettering stickers and the original key labeling was irrelevant, I could use a UK ISO as a Spanish ISO or a German QWERTZ ISO, etc, etc?

Just double-checking.

-~D~-

[Mental Hobbit]

Yes.
If you're living in Spain, you could check if used Cherry G81-3000 boards are as cheap and easy to get there as they are here in Germany. G81s are terrible keyboards, but their keys fit on any board with Cherry MX switches. Certainly more elegant and durable than key stickers.

[Datamancer]

Yes.
If you're living in Spain, you could check if used Cherry G81-3000 boards are as cheap and easy to get there as they are here in Germany. G81s are terrible keyboards, but their keys fit on any board with Cherry MX switches. Certainly more elegant and durable than key stickers.

OK, cool, thanks! I just used the stickers as an example. The material I  actually cover the keys with is quite elegant and durable.

Here's one of my latest...




-~D~-

[Mental Hobbit]

Here's one of my latest...

Man, those keys look badly worn. :madgrin:

Ok, now I'm getting the connection between slamming some custom mechanical board together, and giving the result to customers. Cherry G80-3000s will work fine for that kind of project. As I suppose your customers want new internals, I'd go with the German version, that's the easiest to find. Clicky switches should match the theme best I guess? Model number for that would be G80-3000 LSCDE. Costs around €55+shipping online.

[clickclack]

nice =)
Looks like your doing more custom fab now with excellent results (with respect to the keys).

I also think the faux (crackle?) finish on the plate and switch housing is a unique approach.

=)

[Datamancer]

Thanks for the input, I'll have to look into the G80-3000s.

clickclack- thanks, I'm really happy with the way those keys came out. It sounds like you're familiar with my work already? I made those keys from scratch and it makes such a nicer finished product than trying to use transfer lettering and things like that.

Here's the link to that keyboard, in case anyone wants to see more pics-

http://www.datamancer.net/keyboards/marquis/marquis.htm

-~D~-

[Datamancer]

oh, and with the keyswitches, I dust some base color paint on them and then follow up with a special brush I have (by "special" I mean beat-to-crap in JUST the right way) and hand-dab the speckled finish on them to perfectly match the stripes and spots in the leather.

[Datamancer]

Thanks so much, everyone. This helps me greatly. Yeah I'm in the process of scaling up my operation into a "real" business, so I'm researching all the different possibilities for new products with some more modular construction methods and lower prices. I think you're right that the foreign language market would be huge. I'm trying to get away from pure commission work in favor of small batches of products (though I'll still probably take the really cool commissions from time to time). I'm going to have to start participating more on this forum. It's a really great place but I always sort of forget it exists until I go looking for some obscure piece of keyboard trivia and Google drops me back here every time, haha.
Thanks again,
-~D~-

[Datamancer]

Hey folks, I tried that Cherry ISO keyboard and you're right, it is a piece of crap. It got the job done....but just barely.
For any future foreign language products, I've decided I really need ALPS switches.
I've been looking all over the place and still can't wrap my head around the idea that there simply aren't any ALPS ISO keyboards in existence with PS2/USB connectivity. I really don't want to have to design my own circuit board for them (though something tells me I'll end up doing that soon anyway for an ALPS ergonomic keyboard I want to build).

Anywho, I figured I'd take one more shot and see if anyone here knew of one.

I'm looking for ALPS (or clone) switches, ISO euro format, PS2 or USB, full tenkeyed layout.

Thanks!
-~D~-

[bladamson]

I've been looking all over the place and still can't wrap my head around the idea that there simply aren't any ALPS ISO keyboards in existence with PS2/USB connectivity.

I seem to recall Alps Electronics going out of business some years ago, so I have a feeling that any real Alps switches that are floating around out there are NOS.  Hence the lack of any new boards being manufactured with them.

[bladamson]

Oh wow!  Your work is beautiful!

Edit: If you want a really beefy new mechanical keyboard, I think your best bet is one of these: http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/customizer.html

I read a blog somewhere where someone cut the stems off with a dremel and attached antique typewriter keys to them, with excellent results.

[Datamancer]

Oh wow!  Your work is beautiful!

Edit: If you want a really beefy new mechanical keyboard, I think your best bet is one of these: http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/customizer.html

I read a blog somewhere where someone cut the stems off with a dremel and attached antique typewriter keys to them, with excellent results.

Thanks! I'm glad you like my work.
Yeah, that's Unicomp. That actually bought out all the patents for the IBM Model M keyboards and have been manufacturing them ever since IBM abandoned the design. Very rugged keyboards, but they're "buckling spring" switches, which don't exactly work for my design.

-~D~-

[elef]

For any future foreign language products, I've decided I really need ALPS switches.

That might not be the right decision. If you look up the stats, the cherries are geekhackers' favourite switches by a looong way. IIRC the brown and blue cherries got more votes in the last "your favourite switch" poll than all other switches combined. Buckling springs were closest to the cherries, but not close: blue & brown put together got twice as many votes as BS.

...an ALPS ergonomic keyboard I want to build

That sounds good. Make it blue cherries and you got a buyer. Seriously, I think there are lots of people on here that would pay a very handsome amount of money for a sensibly designed ergonomic keyboard with a choice of brown or blue cherry switches, myself included. Even a simple adjustable split keyboard would be quite popular imo.

[Datamancer]

That might not be the right decision. If you look up the stats, the cherries are geekhackers' favourite switches by a looong way. IIRC the brown and blue cherries got more votes in the last "your favourite switch" poll than all other switches combined. Buckling springs were closest to the cherries, but not close: blue & brown put together got twice as many votes as BS.



That sounds good. Make it blue cherries and you got a buyer. Seriously, I think there are lots of people on here that would pay a very handsome amount of money for a sensibly designed ergonomic keyboard with a choice of brown or blue cherry switches, myself included. Even a simple adjustable split keyboard would be quite popular imo.

Thanks for the suggestion but I have some other reasons for using the ALPS switches. Most of my parts are already geared toward ALPS so I dont want to change too many things around.

Am I the only one that DOESN'T like buckling springs? To me, they're just way too loud and harsh. It's like typing with a hammer.

I'm sure the torches are coming after that statement!


-~D~-