The Living Soldering Thread

[minho]

On sprits keyboard, the caps lock and delete key do not light up unless you are using caps lock or num lock respectively. Not really sure how that is shocking though.

Haha, that's hardly surprising at all

Thank you both 

[HPE1000]

On sprits keyboard, the caps lock and delete key do not light up unless you are using caps lock or num lock respectively. Not really sure how that is shocking though.

Haha, that's hardly surprising at all

Thank you both 

Hehe

Good luck!

(I will be more than happy to answer any more of your questions, I already built a KB from sprit)

[minho]

Hehe

Good luck!

(I will be more than happy to answer any more of your questions, I already built a KB from sprit)

Awesome, because I just encountered another simple question:
On the order form for LEDs, the question asks this

LED High Bright : 110pcs (with Resistors) = 10 USD - *Auto Multi- 7 Color LED 20pcs = 10USD

Does that mean 110 pieces [with resistors] is 10 USD for a standard LED, but the 7 color LED is 20 pieces for 10 USD?

What exactly is the Auto Multi- 7 color LED? Does that mean you can choose a color for it to be or something?

[HPE1000]

Hehe

Good luck!

(I will be more than happy to answer any more of your questions, I already built a KB from sprit)

Awesome, because I just encountered another simple question:
On the order form for LEDs, the question asks this

LED High Bright : 110pcs (with Resistors) = 10 USD - *Auto Multi- 7 Color LED 20pcs = 10USD

Does that mean 110 pieces [with resistors] is 10 USD for a standard LED, but the 7 color LED is 20 pieces for 10 USD?

What exactly is the Auto Multi- 7 color LED? Does that mean you can choose a color for it to be or something?

Yes, $10 for 110 single color leds with resistors, or 20 multicolor for $10 I guess.

The multicolor led just cycles randomly between colors. You have no control over it.

Refer to this post:
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=33155.msg1296218#msg1296218

[minho]

Holy crap I had no idea that existed 

That's pretty cool, although I'm trying to imagine a whole keyboard full of them and I'd imagine that might get crazy pretty fast

Thanks

[Pacifist]

got two issues:

issue #1: Spacebar doesn't work. Desoldered the key, saw that the pins were rusted, so I put in a new one. Still doesnt work and I see gunk surrounding the pads. Think previous owner must have spilled something. Gunk is pretty hard to get out

edit: going to put wires from spacebar to menu key and remap menu to spacebar
edit2: it worked! spacebar now works through AHK

issue #2: (different board) '" cap doesn't work. Looked at PCB, one of the pads on the PCB was physically lose from the PCB. Desoldered, ended up peeling off the pad. Solder won't flow accross the gap to the traces, what do?

a little update: deck is working, but some kkeyss are double pressing--just like that. Its using some pretty used up blacks, they're buttery sssmooth. should I desolder them with new ones or is this a controller issue?

also still need help on the 2nd bboard with the lifted pad

[TheSoulhunter]

don't forget the hexane!

Nah, I will skip the hexane...
In difference to the 3 others it's ranked "toxic" as it can cause neuronal damage.

[swill]

got two issues:

issue #1: Spacebar doesn't work. Desoldered the key, saw that the pins were rusted, so I put in a new one. Still doesnt work and I see gunk surrounding the pads. Think previous owner must have spilled something. Gunk is pretty hard to get out

edit: going to put wires from spacebar to menu key and remap menu to spacebar
edit2: it worked! spacebar now works through AHK

issue #2: (different board) '" cap doesn't work. Looked at PCB, one of the pads on the PCB was physically lose from the PCB. Desoldered, ended up peeling off the pad. Solder won't flow accross the gap to the traces, what do?

a little update: deck is working, but some kkeyss are double pressing--just like that. Its using some pretty used up blacks, they're buttery sssmooth. should I desolder them with new ones or is this a controller issue?

also still need help on the 2nd bboard with the lifted pad

Try adjusting the debounce rate in your firmware to get rid of the double press of keys.

[stancato9]

Here, check it out: To me it looks like it ripped off and there was some sort of adhesive holding it together.

Show Image

right, so what you're holding is an SS series soldapullt. it's a completely different animal from the DS017. the only sample i have from that series is the SS343, which is threaded like the SS011, SS350, and SS102. each of these have different sized barrels and different tips. the ss343 that i hae looks to be able the right diameter, but the tip looks too large. my guess is that you have a soldapullt successor SS model and that you need an LS36x replacement tip. you're going to need to save the barrel threads somehow, probably by turning the internal thread with a probe. the external thread is molded into the barrel on these designs, so if you kill the thread, you have to replace the barrel.

i generally would just recommend replacing the unit with a DS017 variant if you're not doing very fine pitched desoldering. the challenger and successor lines are made for space constrained and fine pitched situations. the ds017 has the maximum capacity, suction and so on.

Thanks mkawa! I will keep it in mind for the future but I picked up a replacement.

I asked this before with no answer so I'll ask it again.

On my Poker 2, the left windows key LED won't light up. I figure I can just use the LED pads from the free key beside the left shift.

I cut some LED leads and soldered them to the LED pads on the free key. When I make contact between and LED and the leads, it lights up.

If I solder the LED leads to the left windows key LED pads, the LED in the windows key switch won't light up.

What am I doing wrong?

[mkawa]

don't forget the hexane!

Nah, I will skip the hexane...
In difference to the 3 others it's ranked "toxic" as it can cause neuronal damage.

yes, sorry, that was a joke. please don't purchase or use hexane in a non-laboratory setting

[HoffmanMyster]

don't forget the hexane!

Nah, I will skip the hexane...
In difference to the 3 others it's ranked "toxic" as it can cause neuronal damage.

yes, sorry, that was a joke. please don't purchase or use hexane in a non-laboratory setting

But that said, hexanes can be really useful if used properly!   

[Pacifist]

got two issues:

issue #1: Spacebar doesn't work. Desoldered the key, saw that the pins were rusted, so I put in a new one. Still doesnt work and I see gunk surrounding the pads. Think previous owner must have spilled something. Gunk is pretty hard to get out

edit: going to put wires from spacebar to menu key and remap menu to spacebar
edit2: it worked! spacebar now works through AHK

issue #2: (different board) '" cap doesn't work. Looked at PCB, one of the pads on the PCB was physically lose from the PCB. Desoldered, ended up peeling off the pad. Solder won't flow accross the gap to the traces, what do?

a little update: deck is working, but some kkeyss are double pressing--just like that. Its using some pretty used up blacks, they're buttery sssmooth. should I desolder them with new ones or is this a controller issue?

also still need help on the 2nd bboard with the lifted pad

Try adjusting the debounce rate in your firmware to get rid of the double press of keys.

Can't do that. its a deck legend with a non programable controller

[karazi]

Did some online shopping at stanleysupplyservices.com and I am pretty happy with my haul for my first keyswitch mod (rosewill -> blue to clear) and general supply hoard for my relatively new hobby:

DS017 DESOLDERING TOOL EDSYN 114-202 $17.40         
63/37-020-44-66-1 ROSIN WIRE SOLDER KESTER P 111-288 $27.50         
CW8200 ROSIN FLUX PEN CHEMTRONICS 408-447 $6.15         
CHEM WIK LITE BLUE CHEMTRONICS 25L 113-658 $16.41         
599B-02 TIP CLEANER HAKKO 447-719 $9.47
BRS-715.00 BURN AWAY FLUX BRUSH LARGE 468-995 $3.02

$80 subtotal, $13 (NY) tax+ship, $8 (10%) discount, $86 total shipped ground.  Ordered yesterday morning, shipped from MA to NY, will get here by tonight!  How did I do?

Ordered wayyyy too much solder but I simply could not find any .02" kester 44 between 1oz and 16oz on the internet, so I went for the 16oz (I shop at costco) since the price was right.  Also ordered a Soldapullt as well as desoldering braid, since I like the braid, and wanted to try the Soldapullt.  Will be using RadioShack's 70w soldering station which did fine by me for desoldering the rosewill with a braid.  I guess next on the list is some new Hakko tips as I only have the pointy one that came with it.  I see a lot on Amazon, any suggestions what tips I should have in my arsenal?

edit:
Got the package less than 24 hours later.  Clears installed.  Typing on them now, fantastic.  Already made the leaderboard on typeracer @ 151wpm .  These are a lot different than browns, a lot harder to bottom-out, let you float a little bit more and bounce from one key to the next.  Very nice, I'm addicted, good thing I got all that solder .  Once these break in I plan to do ergo-clear mod and lube, possibly sticker if I can find them somewhere.

[intelli78]

So, I could use some help... I have only a limited amount of soldering and electronics experience.

Last night I converted my Kingsaver from Matias Quiet switches to Blue ALPS, using a Leading Edge donor board. Everything was going well, but when I removed my Kingsaver's right arrow Matias switch, I yanked out a bunch of copper with it. Wasn't careful enough.

When I soldered in blues, all the switches worked except for the right arrow. 

I took these pics to show what's going on. Pretty messy, because I tried reheating the joints to get the solder to reflow. This actually made the right arrow work intermittently, but when I applied even more heat, I actually lifted the southernmost trace in pic 2 (bottom of the pcb).





So the status quo is this ^ but with the bottom pad now lifted. 

Worse, I had one other switch pull out a bit of copper too, on the other pin, so I'm not even sure which hole suffered the problem.

Any suggestions on how to fix this, or what I need to bridge to get things working again?  This was so close to being a total success... argh.

[intelli78]

Just a thought -- logically, it seems that if I bridge the northern trace on the bottom of the pcb to the near side of the diode, and then, if necessary, scrape laminate off the top trace and bridge it to the top pad, I should circumvent any problems at the holes. Right?

Also, why are there 2 traces connecting the pad on the bottom to the diode? Can someone explain what is going on, electrically?

[mkawa]

yah, those are pretty messy. you're going to need to find a point of continuity on the back of the board and run a jumper wire (26ga to 30ga generally) to your switch there.

[Melvang]

What I did when I rotated a switch 180 and drilled new holes through traces was to break the trace 100% and run a jumper from the previous pad on the trace.  This allowed me to work with the larger wire that I had on hand.

[intelli78]

Thanks guys. Fixed it with a matching red jumper wire 

[mkawa]

  looks great!

[Zeal]

Could I get some tips on how to desolder super duper fine, unleaded soldered points, if I don't have a hot air station/desoldering wick?   

Here's a picture of 0.02" kester 44 right next to the joints: About as thick as the soldering spots themselves. Solder pads are probably even smaller, since they're ovular in shape.


I've only tried adding a bit of solder on the right USB 3.0 joint, but it appears that even 0.02" kester might be too thick...and has a high chance of sticking to the other joint.

Thanks in advance!

[mkawa]

what are the components on the other side? do you need them to work afterward?

[Zeal]

what are the components on the other side? do you need them to work afterward?

It's a flat USB 3.0 internal header that I'm desoldering. Wanted to sleeve them like sata cables...

So yes, I would like to not destroy the PCB in the process.

[Melvang]

Could I get some tips on how to desolder super duper fine, unleaded soldered points, if I don't have a hot air station/desoldering wick?   

Here's a picture of 0.02" kester 44 right next to the joints: About as thick as the soldering spots themselves. Solder pads are probably even smaller, since they're ovular in shape.

Show Image

I've only tried adding a bit of solder on the right USB 3.0 joint, but it appears that even 0.02" kester might be too thick...and has a high chance of sticking to the other joint.

Thanks in advance!

Can you post a poc of then other side?

[mkawa]

what are the components on the other side? do you need them to work afterward?

It's a flat USB 3.0 internal header that I'm desoldering. Wanted to sleeve them like sata cables...

So yes, I would like to not destroy the PCB in the process.

oh the pcb will be fine. ICs and other delicate components will have magic smoke let out of them though. basically put the board in a metal vice and point a heat gun at it. ta-da, everything falls out of the board. clean up the solder pad by pad with a solder sucker. the obvious problem with the heat gun is that it destroys plastic and heat sensitive components.

[Zeal]

Could I get some tips on how to desolder super duper fine, unleaded soldered points, if I don't have a hot air station/desoldering wick?   

Here's a picture of 0.02" kester 44 right next to the joints: About as thick as the soldering spots themselves. Solder pads are probably even smaller, since they're ovular in shape.

Show Image

I've only tried adding a bit of solder on the right USB 3.0 joint, but it appears that even 0.02" kester might be too thick...and has a high chance of sticking to the other joint.

Thanks in advance!

Can you post a poc of then other side?

Some tiny SMD components and such..

what are the components on the other side? do you need them to work afterward?

It's a flat USB 3.0 internal header that I'm desoldering. Wanted to sleeve them like sata cables... :p

So yes, I would like to not destroy the PCB in the process.

oh the pcb will be fine. ICs and other delicate components will have magic smoke let out of them though. basically put the board in a metal vice and point a heat gun at it. ta-da, everything falls out of the board. clean up the solder pad by pad with a solder sucker. the obvious problem with the heat gun is that it destroys plastic and heat sensitive components.

So...no way to desolder it? And if I were to try, it would heat up the sensitive ICs/SMD Resistors around it and make my room smell bad?  :(

[swill]

Looking from some advice from you pros...

I am using a Hakko FX-888D soldering station.  Below is an image of some of my extra tips.  The tip that is up a bit more than the others is the one that is currently on my iron.



I have been doing some more precise soldering recently and I plan to change my tip to one of the smaller tips for this work.  I have two options for a smaller tip, a chisel or pencil tip.  I realize that I do not know the pros and cons of these tips, so I wanted to see if you guys had any feedback on the topic.

I know I should be looking for a tip that is about the same size as the combined size of the two pieces of work that I am soldering (or there abouts).  Other than that, I don't really have more knowledge to make an informed decision.  I am sure either would work, but I figure this is as good a time as any to learn something.    Thx...

[mkawa]

if you don't know exactly what tip you need, then you just need a chisel of the appropriate size. big chisels for large power flow, small chisels for small power flow. heat transfer is a function of contact area and thermal conductivity at the joint. the easiest shape to get predictable contact out of will always be a chisel (sometimes called a spade). the three sizes you generally want to have is a ~1mm, a ~1.5mm and a large 3mm tip. the only other generally useful tip shape is the cup tip, which is just a chisel with a scoop out of one side. the cup holds solder for slide soldering. however, typically you're better off using solder paste and sliding your small chisel down the leads instead. cup tips for slide soldering are really only needed when doing huge TQFP or SOICs packages and lots of them. i would argue instead that if you have a ton of large SMT packages to solder, you should be using hot air anyway, as you will probably need to desolder at least one of those packages, and your 1mm tip is going to be pretty crap at getting one of those chips off without damaging anything.

[TheSoulhunter]

Looking from some advice from you pros...

I am using a Hakko FX-888D soldering station.  Below is an image of some of my extra tips.  The tip that is up a bit more than the others is the one that is currently on my iron.

(Attachment Link)

I have been doing some more precise soldering recently and I plan to change my tip to one of the smaller tips for this work.  I have two options for a smaller tip, a chisel or pencil tip.  I realize that I do not know the pros and cons of these tips, so I wanted to see if you guys had any feedback on the topic.

I know I should be looking for a tip that is about the same size as the combined size of the two pieces of work that I am soldering (or there abouts).  Other than that, I don't really have more knowledge to make an informed decision.  I am sure either would work, but I figure this is as good a time as any to learn something.    Thx...

I use a 2,4mm chisel tip for almost all through-hole soldering...
The hoof tips (left on your image) are good for SMD/drag soldering, never found a use for conical ones.

[minho]

I have a two questions:

1) Should I tin my tip before and after every soldering session? (How about just desoldering?) Is just heating up a kester 44 63/37 on the tip and then wiping it off after sufficient? (And do I have to worry about the timing before it oxidizes or something...? I heard this mentioned in a youtube video about tinning the tip but not from other sources)


2) Does anyone (perhaps mkawa can shed some light on this?) know how to assemble the stand for the Geekhack solder spool? I can't for the life of me figure out how to put three bits of plastic together (I spent an embarrassingly long amount of time on this).

[swill]

I have a two questions:

1) Should I tin my tip before and after every soldering session? (How about just desoldering?) Is just heating up a kester 44 63/37 on the tip and then wiping it off after sufficient? (And do I have to worry about the timing before it oxidizes or something...? I heard this mentioned in a youtube video about tinning the tip but not from other sources)


2) Does anyone (perhaps mkawa can shed some light on this?) know how to assemble the stand for the Geekhack solder spool? I can't for the life of me figure out how to put three bits of plastic together (I spent an embarrassingly long amount of time on this).

Tin before and after (and during if your iron sits for like 15 minutes without you using it and it's on).

Don't wipe off all the solder or you are not tinning.

Tinning basically means that you totally coat the tip with a thin layer of solder. This reduces oxidation of the tip itself because only the solder is exposed to the air.

I use a brass sponge when I work and it is great for leaving a nice layer of solder on the tip.

[minho]

I use a brass sponge when I work and it is great for leaving a nice layer of solder on the tip.

What is the general opinion about these? I looked around online and while most people say they're convenient, some say that they're a waste of money in that sponges do the job just fine. How long do these last for?

[swill]

I use a brass sponge when I work and it is great for leaving a nice layer of solder on the tip.

What is the general opinion about these? I looked around online and while most people say they're convenient, some say that they're a waste of money in that sponges do the job just fine. How long do these last for?

I HATE the water sponges. For me brass is the only option.

Water sponges give tip shock when you clean the tip which will reduce its lifespan. Also, I find that the solder clumps and oxidizes on the tip when using these.

The brass sponge always leaves my tip in a perfect state. I don't have to think at all, just poke a couple times and it's good.

I only use a brass sponge and I wouldn't do it any other way. This is my opinion obviously.

They should last forever. I have never had to change mine.

[MythicalWagyu]

2) Does anyone (perhaps mkawa can shed some light on this?) know how to assemble the stand for the Geekhack solder spool? I can't for the life of me figure out how to put three bits of plastic together (I spent an embarrassingly long amount of time on this).

If you are asking about what I think you are, don't feel bad, I too spent an embarrassing amount of time assembling the soldering kit  ) Check out the this thread for Mkawa's guidance (I'll paste a little here for reference): http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=57970.msg1324874#msg1324874 - I'm sure you could PM him for further clarification.

yes yes!

the spool and soldapullt holder is a new addition, and actually works best if the spindle on it is glued to the base. if i weren't out of bases, i would make a quick video on how to glue them together. in the meantime, to secure the top piece to the spindle a bit better, insert the soldapullt into the big column in the top. the tip will lock into the spindle and secure it.

actually, gluing the spindle into the bottom piece is pretty straightforward. you can do it with acetone or standard cyanacrolate (crazy glue). for acetone (nail polish remover will work fine), brush or drop some acetone into the hold in the base, then insert the spindle. hold it there, straight up for about 15 minutes. it will glue in and stay that way. with cyanacrolate, it will set in about 30s to 1 minute, otherwise it's the same deal.

i don't recommend gluing the top piece to the spindle, as then you can't replace the solder spool if needed.

[minho]

Ah, thanks! I did end up on that configuration last night but couldn't figure out what the top piece was for for the life of me so I just gave up and put it away.

i don't recommend gluing the top piece to the spindle, as then you can't replace the solder spool if needed.

How would you be able to replace the solder spool with the spindle glued to the base? Regardless of if the top piece is glued to the spindle, It seems like the spindle restricts the solder spool from being removed.

To my understanding (please correct me if I'm wrong), red thing = solder spool, blue thing = spindle, big white thing = base, big but slightly smaller white thing = top piece.

[mkawa]

I use a brass sponge when I work and it is great for leaving a nice layer of solder on the tip.

What is the general opinion about these? I looked around online and while most people say they're convenient, some say that they're a waste of money in that sponges do the job just fine. How long do these last for?

I HATE the water sponges. For me brass is the only option.

Water sponges give tip shock when you clean the tip which will reduce its lifespan. Also, I find that the solder clumps and oxidizes on the tip when using these.

The brass sponge always leaves my tip in a perfect state. I don't have to think at all, just poke a couple times and it's good.

I only use a brass sponge and I wouldn't do it any other way. This is my opinion obviously.

They should last forever. I have never had to change mine.

thermal shock on the tip is a non-issue with a high quality large-heater iron and high quality copper tips. if the heater can push enough power out quickly enough, the tip will actually not experience much if any thermal delta. if you think about it, you're just touching your tip to something that's at room temperature. but that's what you're constantly doing when you solder. the joint starts at room temperature, you thermally connect the tip to it, and bam. the specific heat capacity of water is larger than most metals, but the tip only contacts a small film of it, and as soon as that water hits vapor temp it phase changes away. in short, thermal shock for water cleaning of tips is highly overstated. however, sponges have basically unlimited debridement; that is, you can wipe as much crap and excess solder off of them as you want. you don't need more flux to pull crap off because the combination of nucleation of boiling water and the sponge will pull pretty much anything off of your tip.

and this highlights the two problems with brass tips. they don't last very long, and they're not very good at absorbing excess solder on your tip. the reasons are as above. the brass sponge relies on an animal-fat-based flux on the sponge surfaces, because the brass alone is non-abrasive to the tip. if a material like steel was used that was harder than the tip material, you would significantly wear away at the tip just from the mechanical scraping action. so they use soft brass and flux it. however, as we all know, flux burns away. so your tip has a lifetime only as long as it carries flux. once the flux is gone it will become very near useless. this is why instructions for using brass sponges usually tell you to push your tip in for like a fraction of a second, twist and pull. this often won't get the crap off of your tip, because you need more scraping action, so you repeat, and each time you put your tip in you burn more of the limited flux off. the second issue is that the excess solder you're pulling off your tip only falls through the brass as long as there is flux on the brass. as soon as it hits some unfluxed brass, it will stick to the brass (that is, not flow, which is where the name flux for deoxidizing compounds comes from..). so effectively, as you use your brass sponge, you're filling it full of excess solder, and it will get to the point where it's a ball of tinned brass and not fluxed brass. at that point your only option is really to toss it out, as you're not going to be able to clean your tip very well on it.

sponges and water, however, are indescribably cheap (heck, i just cut up kitchen sponges if i don't have something else around). have worked for cleaning tips for a half decade, and with a properly provisioned iron, will basically have no negative effect on the iron itself, and when your sponge is so gross that even soap and water can't recover it, sponges are biodegradable. brass strips with lead and tin all over them are not.

[swill]

I use a brass sponge when I work and it is great for leaving a nice layer of solder on the tip.

What is the general opinion about these? I looked around online and while most people say they're convenient, some say that they're a waste of money in that sponges do the job just fine. How long do these last for?

I HATE the water sponges. For me brass is the only option.

Water sponges give tip shock when you clean the tip which will reduce its lifespan. Also, I find that the solder clumps and oxidizes on the tip when using these.

The brass sponge always leaves my tip in a perfect state. I don't have to think at all, just poke a couple times and it's good.

I only use a brass sponge and I wouldn't do it any other way. This is my opinion obviously.

They should last forever. I have never had to change mine.

thermal shock on the tip is a non-issue with a high quality large-heater iron and high quality copper tips. if the heater can push enough power out quickly enough, the tip will actually not experience much if any thermal delta. if you think about it, you're just touching your tip to something that's at room temperature. but that's what you're constantly doing when you solder. the joint starts at room temperature, you thermally connect the tip to it, and bam. the specific heat capacity of water is larger than most metals, but the tip only contacts a small film of it, and as soon as that water hits vapor temp it phase changes away. in short, thermal shock for water cleaning of tips is highly overstated. however, sponges have basically unlimited debridement; that is, you can wipe as much crap and excess solder off of them as you want. you don't need more flux to pull crap off because the combination of nucleation of boiling water and the sponge will pull pretty much anything off of your tip.

and this highlights the two problems with brass tips. they don't last very long, and they're not very good at absorbing excess solder on your tip. the reasons are as above. the brass sponge relies on an animal-fat-based flux on the sponge surfaces, because the brass alone is non-abrasive to the tip. if a material like steel was used that was harder than the tip material, you would significantly wear away at the tip just from the mechanical scraping action. so they use soft brass and flux it. however, as we all know, flux burns away. so your tip has a lifetime only as long as it carries flux. once the flux is gone it will become very near useless. this is why instructions for using brass sponges usually tell you to push your tip in for like a fraction of a second, twist and pull. this often won't get the crap off of your tip, because you need more scraping action, so you repeat, and each time you put your tip in you burn more of the limited flux off. the second issue is that the excess solder you're pulling off your tip only falls through the brass as long as there is flux on the brass. as soon as it hits some unfluxed brass, it will stick to the brass (that is, not flow, which is where the name flux for deoxidizing compounds comes from..). so effectively, as you use your brass sponge, you're filling it full of excess solder, and it will get to the point where it's a ball of tinned brass and not fluxed brass. at that point your only option is really to toss it out, as you're not going to be able to clean your tip very well on it.

sponges and water, however, are indescribably cheap (heck, i just cut up kitchen sponges if i don't have something else around). have worked for cleaning tips for a half decade, and with a properly provisioned iron, will basically have no negative effect on the iron itself, and when your sponge is so gross that even soap and water can't recover it, sponges are biodegradable. brass strips with lead and tin all over them are not.

This is not the experience I have had.  I do have to dump the solder filings out of the bottom of the container I have my sponge in and maybe bang the brass sponge a couple times to get some more out, but I do not get build up of solder on the sponge.

You are right that the sponge and water takes off more, but that is a problem in my eyes.  It removes the tinning from the tip as well, so it exposes the tip to air.  The brass sponge removes all the excess solder and leaves the tip perfectly tinned.

I respect your opinion, but I personally prefer a brass sponge...

[mkawa]

water shouldn't remove the tin on your tip. either you're running at a suboptimal temp, not using enough flux (Cu2O will not bond to Sn), or some combination of the above. at a certain point, nothing can get the crap off of your tip and you actually need to use a brass or steel brush to clean it up. you should never have to get to that point. tip your tip often and when it's sitting, cover it with a ton of solder.

[minho]

thermal shock on the tip is a non-issue with a high quality large-heater iron and high quality copper tips. if the heater can push enough power out quickly enough, the tip will actually not experience much if any thermal delta.

So low quality heaters will not sustain the temperature as well? (And simply turning up the temperature wouldn't do anything because it's the relative temperatures of the water and the tip that causes any supposed thermal shock?)

[mkawa]

thermal stresses are relatively simple. whenever there are large very quick changes in tip temperature, you will get thermal stress in the bulk material of the tip and in the iron heater. the stress is a mechanical stress from thermal expansion and contraction.

the larger the heater, the more instantaneous power it can flow to the tip. to avoid rapid temperature changes, you need power to reach the tip very quickly. you don't need a huge amount of it, but you need it very quickly when the tip is presented with a thermal load. small heaters hold less energy, and typically have smaller surface areas to transfer that energy to the tip (although the energy reservoir is more important, as there is generally not a lot of impedance due to lack of contact area in a good heater design).

the heater is by far the most expensive part of an iron, as it is a non-trivial ceramic shape that should be precisely formed for predictable thermal envelopes (this is one of the problems with metcal tip and heater cartridges, as you're buying a new heater with every tip).

[CPTBadAss]

Just to add to swill's and mkawa's conversation: I've been liking the brass sponge more than the water/sponge I've used in the past. I noticed when I first was learning to solder, that the thermal shock would kill the tips pretty quickly. We were using Weller WES51s and we seem to run through tips pretty regularly (new tip every week or two). And I found I had to tip the tip much more often. The brass sponge has me tinning less and my tip is going strong after a year of intermittent usage.

[MythicalWagyu]

Finally got a chance to use my learn to solder kit today! The Soldapult is pretty damn slick, makes desoldering fast. Couldn't make the 3D printed iron stand work for me; tried zip-tying a heavy weight to the bottom but the cord on the iron is just too much, pushes the hot iron into the side of the stand, so the helping hands will do for now.


The only pins I had trouble with were bent flush with the PCB... I think I lifted a pad or two off the trace trying to get them off the PCB but not too concerned since the intent is to wire up a Teensy to this. Now I'm off to look for diodes and ribbon cable!


(all desoldered, checking switches for continuity, everything seems to be in order)

[mkawa]

you can push the soldapullt down a bit more until it locks in

the extension cord included helps quite a bit in getting the big-fat-iron-cord to behave. if you've already filled the basin with water and used the grippy bumpons and it's still not staying up, pull out all the stops and use some double sided tape to tack it to your desk. yes, the cord is a monster, but you just have to tell it who's boss and it'll behave.

[mkawa]

Just to add to swill's and mkawa's conversation: I've been liking the brass sponge more than the water/sponge I've used in the past. I noticed when I first was learning to solder, that the thermal shock would kill the tips pretty quickly. We were using Weller WES51s and we seem to run through tips pretty regularly (new tip every week or two). And I found I had to tip the tip much more often. The brass sponge has me tinning less and my tip is going strong after a year of intermittent usage.

a week or two?!?! that's insane. what would happen to the tip?

[kurplop]

I had an old range hood sitting around for years and decided to make an air cleaner for my solder station out of it. 
It already had a carbon filter in it. I cut the width down to 21" from 30" and bent the nose 90 degrees to bring the controls to the front when I stood it up. Variable speed too!

I personally think we have overreacted to many of the 'dangers' that our predecessors somehow survived. It's hard to go a day in California without seeing a prop65 label, warning that a product you are about to use will likely kill you. The problem is that it is like the boy who cried wolf; after a while he is ignored and when a genuine danger arises nobody pays attention.

Having said that I'm still looking forward to soldering in fresh air.

[physicsmajor]

So unfortunate the original Hakko FX-888 got discontinued in favor of the digital version. I got one of the last analog types and love it, but the digital is not as intuitive or quick to use.

Performs equally well, it's an ergonomic thing. But aren't we all about ergonomic things around here?

[mkawa]

public service announcement:

cptbadass sent me these pictures of his soldering pencil when he was having trouble desoldering some joints:





what you're looking at is a heavily oxidized pencil and tip. metal oxides have really poor thermal conductivity and will refuse to be tinned with solder. however, this is very easily fixable.

the solution is:

SCRUB THE CRAP OUT OF IT. use something hard. sandpaper works. baking soda slurry works. steel or brass brushes work (often used for painting; cheap at the hardware store). steel wool works. heck, sand slurrys work too.

bottom line: expose the underlying metal. the tip will either be made with tin (not the highest quality, but heck, it works), or copper (more typical). the shaft and the rear bit of the tip will be zinc plated steel. that won't take solder, but it will clean up nicely. KEEP YOUR IRON CLEAN. this is the key to maintaining thermal efficiency. without thermal efficiency, your iron is going to very slowly heat the workpiece, resulting in either the workpiece not getting hot enough to take solder, or getting too hot and burning up.

PROTIP: scrubbing a hot iron is a little bit easier than scrubbing a cold iron, as you can cover your brush with flux, and use the wetting action of the flux (really what's happening is that the flux is corrosive and helps chemically get rid of the oxide layer while your brush mechanically debrides the oxide layer). then, once your tip is clean, IMMEDIATELY tin it by melting a crapton of solder on it. keep the tip over something that won't burn if hot solder drops on it. at the end of this process you should have a clean iron and a shiny tinned tip.

happy soldering!!

[hasu]

'Chemical paste' works magically well for me and saved precious tips of my vintage Weller several times.
Spare tips are no long available for my model, so situation is critical

http://www.hakko.com/english/maintenance/topic_kotesaki.html#case1

I don't use sandpaper, just cleaning wire and sponge is enough to clean tip before dunking it into chemical past. I use Hakko FS-100 but other brands will work same way.

And Weller video.

[Melvang]

Well between the last two nights I swapped out the switches in my keyboard for lubed ghost blacks.  The feel insanely smooth.  But the w and the 6 in the number row didn't work at all.  Tore it apart a couple minutes ago and apparently I forgot to solder the pads.

[mkawa]

'Chemical paste' works magically well for me and saved precious tips of my vintage Weller several times.
Spare tips are no long available for my model, so situation is critical

http://www.hakko.com/english/maintenance/topic_kotesaki.html#case1

I don't use sandpaper, just cleaning wire and sponge is enough to clean tip before dunking it into chemical past. I use Hakko FS-100 but other brands will work same way.

And Weller video.

tip cleaning paste is just very corrosive flux.

cleaning wire is about the same as a brass brush. but when you have really bad oxidization like the picture above, just attack it with whatever abrasive you have available.

[tbc]

today....i think i learned the hard way about how what mkawa meant about surface area.

using a smaller tip meant that I had to leave it on there for ALOT longer than before in order to desolder properly.  took me half an hour before I realized what I was goofing up


also question: what wire do you get for hand-wiring a board?  do you need to buy something that says 'tinned'?  thanks in advance.