Author Topic: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | IC Completed: Raffle/GB Announced!  (Read 43031 times)

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Offline jouz

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Just a couple of quick updates - even though it looks like we're not moving forward, I'm doing all things I can to prevent any delays down the line while other things are blocking me from moving forward right now (I'm still working out the final quotes from the manufacturer & working on setting up the business properly). Hope you gals & guys aren't loosing patience :-[
  • PCB design is updated for both the solder version and the hotswap version (gerbers and kicad projects are both on github, see render below).
  • I've ordered a final "test-batch" of PCBs to verify the last changes to the layouts are working as planned (added the split left and split right shift since the first prototypes).
  • This time it also includes samples of the solder version (as I haven't tested that one before).
  • I've ordered a small test batch of the Flex PCBs (files also on github now) - this time in the teal color instead of black, and bead-blasted instead of smoothed - this will give us some nice preview of the color and a way to decide on the final surface finish for the plates. And of course we can test out how well the flex works :)
  • Case/plate design updated on github (almost certain that there will be no changes after this, but obviously we'll wait for those last Plate & PCB prototypes for another verification)
  • Two whole bag of hex-keys arrived for the GB :) /li]
So the whole JLC not doing boards anymore above 200x200 seems to be false alarm, they were happy to take my order :).



Finally, here is also an image of the brass blocker with the new logo engraved (you might also notice that the logo changed slightly from the first draft, thanks to some feedback I got on discord :) ).
Still debating on whether to keep the "1" on there or not (to signify the first Bemeier "production" keyboard :) )


Offline vurtomatic

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If you do keep the 1, maybe write it as 01 or 001 to balance the logo?

Offline jouz

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If you do keep the 1, maybe write it as 01 or 001 to balance the logo?

brilliant idea! will try it out tomorrow, thanks!

Offline mgh112

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itf it's 01 or 001, maybe rotate it 90 deg clockwise leading away from the logo; might help avoid it feeling cramped, and it will make the blocker look longer.  my .02

Offline gorbachev

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Any chance you could offer PCBs in different colors than just green?

It doesn't matter all that much really, but the black and red color ones do look a little nicer IMHO. JLCPCB doesn't charge extra for the non-green color choices.

Offline jouz

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Any chance you could offer PCBs in different colors than just green?

It doesn't matter all that much really, but the black and red color ones do look a little nicer IMHO. JLCPCB doesn't charge extra for the non-green color choices.

JLC only offers assembly for the green solder mask. There is no way I'm hand-soldering 50+ SMT PCBs :). I'd have to switch manufacturer (to someone who likely is much more expensive) - just for an invisible cosmetic detail? Hope you can understand my reasoning here.

Offline xanderman1014

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  • I've ordered a small test batch of the Flex PCBs (files also on github now) - this time in the teal color instead of black, and bead-blasted instead of smoothed - this will give us some nice preview of the color and a way to decide on the final surface finish for the plates. And of course we can test out how well the flex works :)

I think this was a typo and jouz means the flex plate was ordered. Not PCB (if I'm wrong, please correct me, jouz)

Offline jouz

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  • I've ordered a small test batch of the Flex PCBs (files also on github now) - this time in the teal color instead of black, and bead-blasted instead of smoothed - this will give us some nice preview of the color and a way to decide on the final surface finish for the plates. And of course we can test out how well the flex works :)

I think this was a typo and jouz means the flex plate was ordered. Not PCB (if I'm wrong, please correct me, jouz)

Oh that makes sense. Sorry, the flex plate (which I also ordered!) was ordered from 3DHubs and from aluminum. Sorry for the confusion @gorbachev!
It's true, we've talked about making it from FR4 before, but I didn't get around to turning the flex plate design into gerbers yet (and I'm actually hopeful for the alu ones to be flexible enough, we'll see!).

Offline jouz

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Just a quick update regarding the color polls (some of you might have seen the intermediate results on discord):

Of the existing colors, we find that the dark blue one is the most popular, while black and dark violet are about equal:


And of those that weren't already happy with the existing color options, 48% voted for anthracite gray.
I'm happy that it's such a clear winner, so I'm definitely adding gray to the color to the options.

If you're curious about the plate colors, nothing too surprising:


There were some incidental comments regarding other colors, asking for polished brass plates, etc, but nothing stood out.
I would love to be able to please everybody here, but I hope people understand that not everything is possible at this small scale.

I had a final question on combining top and bottom half, not sure if I can manage this, but seeing that there is some interest, I'll consider it:


I'm also still learning more about the legal/bureaucratic side of things.
It's not as easy as I thought it would be, and Germany will definitely be taking a nice cut of any money that might be left over for me  :-\
Also, the quotes that I'm getting now with all color options are quite a bit higher than I was hoping, so still working on this next before I can decide the price (again, I think we'll all be happy, I just don't want to commit without knowing all details).

Offline hexa

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #109 on: Sun, 16 August 2020, 17:41:41 »
So cool, definitely interested!

Offline jouz

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #110 on: Tue, 18 August 2020, 11:48:28 »
Updated the price & base kit info in the main post.

  • We'll add the bottom weight to the base kit, as a decent majority is planning to buy it anyway (see below), and this way I can make it cheaper for everyone (as opposed to adding it as an extra).
  • Base Kit (as described in the first post) will be 299€ (excluding fees and shipping)

Prices on the extras are TBD (but likely to remain close to the estimates I gave in the polls).

« Last Edit: Tue, 18 August 2020, 11:50:24 by jouz »

Offline hexa

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #111 on: Tue, 18 August 2020, 17:11:43 »
Nice, a great price and an incredible value with the weight :thumb:

Offline jouz

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #112 on: Wed, 19 August 2020, 02:25:28 »
Nice, a great price and an incredible value with the weight :thumb:

Thanks, and thanks for your interest!  ;D

I've noticed some comments in the kits form asking about shipping. I'm guessing the "€" price suggests that it's might be europe-based :)
So I've added a note to the main post - I'm happy ship internationally (as far as DHL is offering that particular country).

Offline nathanchere

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I'm also still learning more about the legal/bureaucratic side of things.
It's not as easy as I thought it would be, and Germany will definitely be taking a nice cut of any money that might be left over for me  :-\

"I am not a lawyer" disclaimer etc applies, but if you're not already running this through a company then you might want to look at doing so. Due to the nature of this buy with both the work and the clients not being predominantly based in Germany, it would probably be worth setting up a country in another EU jurisdiction. Estonia is one of the easier ones to work with up front, has a flat 20% tax, and don't tax your company profits as long as they stay in the company and aren't paid out as dividends. Malta is a bit more work but another ideal option with what's called the "6/7" tax refund for companies. Both of these countries have agreements with Germany to avoid double taxation.

It might not be worth it for a small one-off group buy of 20 units or so but if this ends up having 50+ buyers or you want to do similar things in the future I would consider it. I would also speak to someone with expertise in this field because I don't know the specifics of German tax law which you'd need to consider and this is only worthwhile if you keep everything compliant and above-board.

Offline jouz

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #114 on: Thu, 20 August 2020, 11:56:29 »
[...] Estonia is one of the easier ones to work with up front, has a flat 20% tax, and don't tax your company profits as long as they stay in the company and aren't paid out as dividends. Malta is a bit more work but another ideal option with what's called the "6/7" tax refund for companies. Both of these countries have agreements with Germany to avoid double taxation. [...]

Absolutely appreciate your input, but I don't see myself in this stuff. I am definitely talking to an expert on it (IRL, not online), but just out of principle I don't really want to go elsewhere for paying less taxes :). It is what it is, at least I get somewhat decent representation for my taxation 💁‍♂️ (sorry, let's not get political here 😂)

Offline jouz

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #115 on: Mon, 31 August 2020, 14:20:39 »
Back from vacation, some updates:

PCB
Final PCBs have been made and are verified working, including all the layout options, with both the solder and hotswap version :)
I will do some tiny tweaks before the final version, such as cleaning up some silkscreen label positions, fixing the BMR logo (we ended up changing the "R-leg" to be longer).




Flex Plate (& teal plate color!)
Prototypes of the flex plate arrived. I made them from aluminum and took the opportunity to order them in the teal color that are part of the hammerhead colorway. I also got them bead-blasted. They look and feel great!


Again, I should credit hiney for his alice three-quarter" plate design on which this is heavily based on.
As you can see above, it's designed to be more flexible due to the added cutouts and - if you want - you can snap of the center and be left with a half-plate for even more flex.



And it's definitely more flexible than the regular plate. I've done some side-by-side comparison between the original plate and the flex plate, both mounted with four screws indicated in red below, and both using hotswap sockets (which may not be ideal, but it's more convenient for my testing):


Just using 4 screws also makes the regular plate a little flexible (as we already found out in the review of the prototypes), however, with the flex plate there also is some flex on the outer keys:
First the full flex plate (bottom) vs the regular plate (top): https://imgur.com/2HrDZZR

Snapping out the center part for a half-plate design makes it even more flexible:
First the full flex plate (top) then the half-plate (bottom): https://imgur.com/ODZATJq

If (enough) people are still interested in this, I'm happy to add it as an extra option, but I also don't want to sell snake oil to you.
To make the effect visible on camera, I'm pressing a little harder than I would when typing, and personally, the difference between the regular and the flex plate is not as obvious as you might think.
However, I can easily tell the difference between the regular plate and half plate!
One concern that I had with the half plate was crooked keys, but absolutely no issues when using PCB mounted switches for alignment even with the hotswap sockets.

Maybe other plate material would give a greater effect, but I think the flex is now mostly held back by the PCB, not by the plate.
So there is some potential down the road to try it with a thinner PCB, or for someone to add flex cuts and re-route the PCB, but this won't be part of the GB...

Group Buy
I want to get this going in mid September. Will post some more updates later this week on how I am planning to organize it.
« Last Edit: Tue, 01 September 2020, 02:56:00 by jouz »

Offline vurtomatic

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #116 on: Mon, 31 August 2020, 17:39:54 »
The hype is real  :cool:

Offline lanox

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Prototypes Arrived - Kit Form up!
« Reply #117 on: Mon, 31 August 2020, 18:04:13 »
TAKE MY MONEY RIGHT NOW.

Offline emperact

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Wrapping up IC - GB mid September
« Reply #118 on: Tue, 01 September 2020, 05:54:12 »
This looks amazing! I need a board a new board for work and hopefully this will be it. :D Fantastick work!

Offline nathanchere

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Wrapping up IC - GB mid September
« Reply #119 on: Tue, 01 September 2020, 06:02:44 »
Goddamnit... if this launches mid September it will be around the same time as the Pandora 60%. Expensive month :( but still excited to see this coming to life.

Offline jouz

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Re: [IC] BMEK - Alice + HHKB = ❤️🦈 | Wrapping up IC - GB mid September
« Reply #120 on: Tue, 08 September 2020, 04:35:07 »
GB thread got approved, announcing the raffle there:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=108511.0

Thanks everybody for participating in this IC, really appreciated all your feedback and I'm confident that it resulted in a great end result :)