Noppoo-Choc-Mini or Cherry G84-4100?

[grandpatzer]

Hello Geekhack!

This is my first post here.
I'm currently considering going into the mechanical keyboard world as I use my pc alot.
From my research it seems like the "brown cherry" is good starter for beginners of mechanical keyboards?

I do play a lot of multiplayer fps games, I tend to press hard on my keyboard at intense gaming situations.

I'm actually satisfied with my current keyboard but I guess it is worth trying mechanical when I do spend alot of time in fron of pc

The noppoo choc mini looks attractive as is has the right width and it the linked below has brown, I wonder if the seller
intelligent-pro is still good?
I'm mostlikely buying from ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Noppoo-Choc-Mini-NKRO-Mechanical-Keyboard-Cherry-MX-Red-/250888280157

Another option is the Cherry G84-4100?
It actually is cheaper + it comes with 2 years warranty in my country.
however not sure about the "cherry ml", is it inferior to the "cherry brown"?
http://www.cherry.de/cid/b2b_corded_keyboards_Compact-Keyboard_G84-4100.htm?

I'm assuming pretty much I have little warranty when buying from china ebay seller.

[jabar]

That same Cherry G84 model was available at eBay for $16. ML switches have shorter travel and are generally not preferred over MX.

[grandpatzer]

That same Cherry G84 model was available at eBay for $16. ML switches have shorter travel and are generally not preferred over MX.

thanks for your input, so the ML are much more inferior product?
I guess I'll go for the choc mini then or are there other suggestions?

has anyone bought from the ebay seller in first link recently?
still good keyboards?

[Kmynis]

Noppo. G84-4100 with ML was the first mech board and it almost prevented me from buying another mechanicals, because it was terrible. Keys depress inconsistently, bottom row keys are too small. You know, many people here have G84 and would sell you for like 10 bucks so don't buy it new if you decide to give it a chance. @postabove: yes, they are much inferior than mx.

[samwisekoi]

Hey, but they would make nice display boards for unused keycaps!

 - Ron | samwisekoi

[inteli722]

Well, MX has more compatibility with keycaps. Haven't tried ML, but its reactions have been mixed at best. It seems like if you get a ML board, lubing is a must, so there's that extra work.

[davkol]

G84-4100 has only 2KRO, you may run into some trouble when playing FPS games. Moreover, it doesn't have a plate, and ML switches are known for being too stiff when pressed off-center, which shouldn't be much of an issue for a typist with correct technique, but I wouldn't risk it in case of gaming.

On the other hand, choc mini is definitely a good keyboard for gaming as long as you don't run into problems with its NKRO implementation.

[grandpatzer]

Well, MX has more compatibility with keycaps. Haven't tried ML, but its reactions have been mixed at best. It seems like if you get a ML board, lubing is a must, so there's that extra work.

I get a feeling the noppoo is much better then the G84-4100.
maybe I'll try buy used G84-4100 and see how it is.

I saw that filco has also a small keyboard, but it's more expensive.
is the filco much better then the noppoo choc mini?

There also seems to be KBC Poker and KBTalk, those are slightly more expensive vs noppoo

[jabar]

Filco has one of the best build qualities, definitely "better" than Noppoo but it does come at a cost. What's nice is the Noppoo comes with PBT or black POM keycaps natively, although the legends are prone to rubbing off over time (it depends how oily one's hands are).

I would also suggest looking at Keycool which has TKL and 84 key Choc Mini-esque keyboards, including 84 key backlit options.

[WhiteFireDragon]

ML switches don't feel as nice and consistent as MX switches. Some people like them though, but more people dislike them, including myself lol. It also feels a bit flimsy and light. The one good thing about a G84 is that it's several time cheaper than a Noppoo. I would elaborate more, but just watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5nScpSnec4

[PointyFox]

Anyone who prefers ML is crazy.  The 2KRO will not work for gaming.  The Noppoo is way overpriced.  I wouldn't consider either.

Do not get MX brown since you say you press hard.  Those require a very light touch.  The best keys for gaming and a heavy touch are MX Black if you like smooth key travel and MX Green if you like tactile/clicky.

The best bang for your buck for a small keyboard would be the Cooler Master Quickfire Rapid or Cooler Master XT.

[elttaboi]

I have 2 4100s. They are great little keyboards, but 2KRO is not good for gaming. I use it for playing stepmania since it has short key travel. It works great.
Keys can stick if you press them off center. It's a nice backup portable, but I wouldn't get it for gaming.

[davkol]

I would also suggest looking at Keycool which has TKL and 84 key Choc Mini-esque keyboards, including 84 key backlit options.

Keycool have stopped production of the non-backlit 84key keyboards AFAIK.

The Noppoo is way overpriced. (...) The best bang for your buck for a small keyboard would be the Cooler Master Quickfire Rapid or Cooler Master XT.

Please, elaborate. I'd like to just remind you that (1) OP is probably in Europe (2-year warranty on G84-4100), and QFR costs about as much as choc mini here; and (2) choc mini has thick PBT/POM keycaps. BTW 75% layout > tenkeyless IMHO, but YMMV.

[grandpatzer]

Anyone who prefers ML is crazy.  The 2KRO will not work for gaming.  The Noppoo is way overpriced.  I wouldn't consider either.

Do not get MX brown since you say you press hard.  Those require a very light touch.  The best keys for gaming and a heavy touch are MX Black if you like smooth key travel and MX Green if you like tactile/clicky.

The best bang for your buck for a small keyboard would be the Cooler Master Quickfire Rapid or Cooler Master XT.

I do find my self pressing hard the "crouch" button or the "move slow" button.
I propably press har other buttons aswell I think 

I read that the Red MX are similar but are slightly softer and "smoother"?

so not considering price the Quickfire and choc mini are the equal quality?

I think the Quickfire MX black or MX red might be my first keyboard

[davkol]

I do find my self pressing hard the "crouch" button or the "move slow" button.
I propably press har other buttons aswell I think 

I read that the Red MX are similar but are slightly softer and "smoother"?

Not slightly. You need the same amount of force to actuate MX Black and bottom out MX Red.

so not considering price the Quickfire and choc mini are the equal quality?

We're not talking about neither filco (good), nor razer (bad). While QFR feels more solid (except keycaps), it's not much better, especially considering the recent bad batches. It all depends on your DIY skills, warrranty or pure luck.

[grandpatzer]

so not considering price the Quickfire and choc mini are the equal quality?

We're not talking about neither filco (good), nor razer (bad). While QFR feels more solid (except keycaps), it's not much better, especially considering the recent bad batches. It all depends on your DIY skills, warrranty or pure luck.

So are you saying QFR feels more solid and slightly better then Noppoo choc mini?

Because atm the QFR is not only cheaper then the choc mini it also is available in Sweden with 1 or 2 year warranty.

I really like the design of QFR Red(has MX Red), I think I'll order a QFR Red & QFR Black(MX black).
Then return to store the keyboard that I like less, or if I don't like mechanical keyboards then return both.

I'm hoping I prefer QFR Red because it looks hotter to me
Then replacing button with blank black or Ragnarok Red buttons as in the pic the bottom keyboard is QFR Red with Ragnarok Red:

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=37432.0

[davkol]

so not considering price the Quickfire and choc mini are the equal quality?

We're not talking about neither filco (good), nor razer (bad). While QFR feels more solid (except keycaps), it's not much better, especially considering the recent bad batches. It all depends on your DIY skills, warrranty or pure luck.

So are you saying QFR feels more solid and slightly better then Noppoo choc mini?

Not really, actually. The case definitely feels more solid, but I don't touch it almost at all. On the other hand, I press keys all the time, and keycaps on the choc mini are way better than CM Storm's. This point is mooted if you buy aftermarket keycaps, of course.

Because atm the QFR is not only cheaper then the choc mini it also is available in Sweden with 1 or 2 year warranty.

It was possible to get a brand new choc mini with warranty shipped from France a while ago. Price was somewhere around 90 EUR, which was more or less on par with price of the QFR here in Czechia. I'm not sure about prices in Sweden, but I guess they shouldn't be too different.

[grandpatzer]

I just realized the Rapidfire looks like a bad candidate
The button placement makes 5-8cm too wide on right side, the mouse will hit the keyboard.
maybe I will go for the Noppoo choc mini, but then no warranty.
Here is my current keyboard and left hand setup, now the mouse will not hit keyboard when fps gaming.

[davkol]

http://www.amazon.fr/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1/276-8227283-1177265?&field-keywords=noppoo