Author Topic: Laser/VTCL 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)  (Read 8698 times)

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Offline jd29

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Laser/VTCL 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« on: Mon, 10 August 2015, 23:28:05 »
tl;dr:
*There are two 2269 variants. The one with arrow keys in the shape of a plus has a decent case, the one with an "inverted T" arrow cluster has a very not-decent case.
*The SMK second generation white Cherry mount switches are phenomenal, but easy to bottom out on.
*The caps are nice, relatively thick doubleshot ABS.

107983-0 111087-1

The one on the left has FCC ID IFS80-2269-1. The one one the right has FCC ID BNX84H80-2269-1. From here on I'll refer to them as "T board" and "plus board". Besides the arrow keys and case, the two boards are identical. In fact, you could desolder the switches in the plus board's arrow cluster and resolder them in the inverted T position, and they would work, as long as you changed Home to "Up" in Autohotkey or something.

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Top is plus, bottom is T. You want the plus board. The case weighs half a pound more than the T board's and is much higher-quality. My ten year old brother could probably snap the T board in half with ease. It's bad.

You can see my T board is broken. It was packaged well, and doesn't appear to have been abused in shipping, but the PCB broke anyway because the build quality is awful. The plus board has an equally flimsy, fragile PCB, by the way.

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The switches are SMK second generation Cherry mount. These are from the same family as "Monterey" blues. The stems feel lubricated, and are much less frictiony than my Alps SKCM, especially on off-center presses. They feel a lot like MX blues and greens, but thocky instead of clicky. I attached a video just below. By stacking pennies, I measured between 65 and 85 g of force to actuate each switch, with an average of 70. The outliers are rare, and despite the wide range, they feel very consistent - I never would have guessed that my O key is so much heavier than the rest. This contrasts my genuine complicated white Alps board, where each switch seems to have aged different from the rest, and the inconsistencies feel very unpleasant (until you clean them/bend the stems back).

It's hard to avoid bottoming out on these because the "click" point is very near the bottom. Still, you can get used to them. SMK second gen is my favorite switch.

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There's a diode symbol on the bottom of the switch assembly, but my standard glass package diodes are fat and the switch won't close back up with them in place. In the spot where the diode would lie, there's a wire that solders into the PCB, apparently for stability - but you could use it as a connection to jump over a PCB track, if you're using these for a custom design. Springs are the size of Alps springs. From top to bottom: SMK, Alps SKCM, Cherry MX blue.

I thought these couldn't be plate mounted, but as jacobolus pointed out, they can :)

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The caps on the T board are quite loose, and can easily be pried off with fingers alone. The caps on the plus board are tighter and require a lot more force. This isn't due to the caps, but the switches. The switches on the T board have skinnier stems.

This isn't a big problem, I think. I thought this was causing cap unevenness on the board, visible in the above picture, but I later realized that the switches themselves are unevenly mounted to the PCBs.

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From left to right: Focus 2001 (comparable to most modern stock caps, I think), Laser, and vintage Cherry Corp. The caps are of a decent thickness. I love the legends, can anyone guess the manufacturer? They weigh a little more than a gram each.

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What else? My board hooked up through a passive AT-PS/2 converter, and then through a passive PS/2-USB converter without a hitch. The PCBs have diodes (about 40 IIRC) indicating they have some rollover capability.

I think the poor build quality of the case and PCB can be forgiven given the nice caps and excellent switches, if your PCB doesn't disintegrate in shipping like my first one did. I recommend the 2269.
« Last Edit: Wed, 14 December 2016, 09:26:48 by jd29 »

Offline jd29

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #1 on: Tue, 11 August 2015, 01:29:05 »
~
« Last Edit: Tue, 15 September 2015, 22:43:44 by jd29 »

Offline jacobolus

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #2 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 02:49:46 »
If you’re making a custom keyboard, definitely plate-mount the switches, they take the same size square holes as MX switches (if you want you can use a standard MX plate, though you’ll need to hand wire or use a custom PCB). You’ll get less sound out of them, but they’ll feel much more stable.
« Last Edit: Wed, 12 August 2015, 02:53:08 by jacobolus »

Offline jd29

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #3 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 03:38:02 »
I had to trim a hole in my acrylic tester a little bit, but once in they certainly do stay put. I thought these were PCB-only versions. Thanks for the advice.

Some copper-clad board is already on the way, and I'm about to order some acrylic for a backplate prototype. I think I'll open a log in the DIY section if that sort of thing is accepted.
« Last Edit: Wed, 12 August 2015, 03:54:19 by jd29 »

Offline chyros

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #4 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 06:57:12 »
Nice review, thanks! :) From the impression I get, it's very similar to my Chicony 5981.
Check my keyboard video reviews:


Offline jd29

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #5 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 07:06:36 »
Thanks for the comment! The small Deskthority wiki page for the 2269 does say "the OEM has been suggested to be Chicony". And I guess they had some relationship with SKM.

I feel a strong urge to hunt down some Monterey Alps now, to see how they compare.

Offline chyros

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #6 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 10:02:36 »
DO IIIIIITTTTT :D
Check my keyboard video reviews:


Offline jacobolus

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #7 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 13:58:27 »
Note, these need a pretty thin plate to clip into, I’d recommend 18 gauge steel (<1.5 mm thick). Not sure you can do it with acrylic.

The switch is basically the same as the blue Alps-mount type except for the (much bigger) keycap mount, though none of the Alps-mount ones I’ve seen were PCB-mounted.

PCB mounting does make a big difference in the sound, especially since those Laser cases are very echoey plastic. Makes them louder and deeper.
« Last Edit: Wed, 12 August 2015, 14:04:03 by jacobolus »

Offline jd29

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #8 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 21:59:08 »
Note, these need a pretty thin plate to clip into, I’d recommend 18 gauge steel (<1.5 mm thick). Not sure you can do it with acrylic.

The switch is basically the same as the blue Alps-mount type except for the (much bigger) keycap mount, though none of the Alps-mount ones I’ve seen were PCB-mounted.

PCB mounting does make a big difference in the sound, especially since those Laser cases are very echoey plastic. Makes them louder and deeper.

Thanks again for the advice man. I'll be sure to remember that when I'm out of the prototyping stage. I'm getting more and more excited for this thing - they already feel and sound great on PCB and plastic. Weird that the blues got so much recognition while these seem to be more obscure.

Offline jacobolus

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #9 on: Wed, 12 August 2015, 23:42:15 »
These are more obscure because there are a lot of Chicony 5181 boards floating around, and not nearly as many Laser boards.

Offline jd29

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Re: Laser 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #10 on: Tue, 15 September 2015, 22:44:05 »
I ordered another Laser a while back for some backup switches and one backup cap. Turns out there are two 2269 variants. Also, I learned some things while using the new board as my DD, and also while completely tearing down my old one. I updated the OP to reflect this.

Sorry if it's taboo, but the point of this post is to inform anyone who looks at buying one of these in the future. I was careful not to change anything so as to make the comments on here out of place.

Offline sorin

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Re: Laser/VTCL 2269 review (SMK 2nd gen Cherry mounts)
« Reply #11 on: Wed, 14 December 2016, 06:59:36 »
Hi guys, I found another variant of this keyboard. It uses standard layout instead of the big ass enter.