Author Topic: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.  (Read 1238223 times)

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Offline Jagriff

  • Posts: 151
Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2150 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 01:33:46 »
so im guessing deep disk means what it sounds like? different from the normal DSA right?

 is the goal to put these keys where the asdfghjkl; keys are? or just the F and J?, would we want them to be a different color other than black? (for looks)

id get some at that price but i haven't got to the point where i don't need legends yet. not leet enough
You can see a picture of the contrast between DSA deep dish keys and normal DSA keys near the bottom of this page.

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=40175.870

Offline islisis

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2151 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 03:27:51 »
i personally prefer some distance apart :

the colour coordination in this pic is badass :D

and does it matter if users mod the ergodox into a case? i would think the point is: modular for custom fit

not everyone wants to take apart their kinesis

Offline kurplop

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2152 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 08:07:58 »
Ah... I thought the whole point of the ergo dox was to be able to separate them farther apart..

So, now you put them "BACK" together like the kinesis? why not just get a kinesis then ???

How far apart is the kinesis split?  Measuring from the center of the G to the center of H, a standard keyboard is about 1", my Truly Ergonomic keyboard is 2", my current ErgoDox position is 9". With the tenting and a 30º+ splay, that feels about right for me.

How far apart have other users spread their ErgoDoxes?

My bigger concern is whether I'll like the center trackball placement. I chose it because, with the keyboard tenting, it becomes difficult to tent the trackball the way I find comfortable.
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I'm hoping that the ambidextrous trackball position will make up for the loss.

Offline seferphier

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2153 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 08:41:06 »
Ah... I thought the whole point of the ergo dox was to be able to separate them farther apart..

So, now you put them "BACK" together like the kinesis? why not just get a kinesis then ???

ergodox gives you the freedom to set the distance. that is different from just buying the kinesis.

i might want to put them further apart if it wasn't for the mouse. i want the mouse to be aligned to my forearm.
« Last Edit: Thu, 18 April 2013, 08:42:37 by seferphier »

Offline SubGothius

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2154 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 17:44:04 »
... So now where can I get MX browns from? And is plate or pcb better?
You will probably want to plate mount the switches, but it's okay to get pcb mount switches as long as you don't mind cutting the two plastic pins on the back of each switch.
Actually, there's no need to cut off the extra PCB-mount pins, as the ErgoDox PCB already has holes drilled for them; it can take either kind of switch as-is. If you're going without a mounting plate (i.e., not buying the standard acrylic case supplied with the kit) you would probably want to get switches with the extra PCB-mount pins. I suspect it's also possible and desirable to melt down those side pins (not the big center post) after installation to act as rivet heads against the PCB, further securing the switch to the PCB and taking some strain away from the solder points.
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Offline Jagriff

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2155 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 17:49:57 »
Here's the link to the IC thread about the deep dish keycaps: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=42547.0

... So now where can I get MX browns from? And is plate or pcb better?
You will probably want to plate mount the switches, but it's okay to get pcb mount switches as long as you don't mind cutting the two plastic pins on the back of each switch.
Actually, there's no need to cut off the extra PCB-mount pins, as the ErgoDox PCB already has holes drilled for them; it can take either kind of switch as-is. If you're going without a mounting plate (i.e., not buying the standard acrylic case supplied with the kit) you would probably want to get switches with the extra PCB-mount pins. I suspect it's also possible and desirable to melt down those side pins (not the big center post) after installation to act as rivet heads against the PCB, further securing the switch to the PCB and taking some strain away from the solder points.
Oops, my bad. Thanks for the clarification.
« Last Edit: Thu, 18 April 2013, 18:12:47 by Jagriff »

Offline judascleric

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2156 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 19:04:10 »
by the way, anybody using ergodox on linux? media keys with firmware from massdrop configurator aren't sending any keycodes. Is there any way to change firmware to send standard media key codes?

There is a pull request on github to add the support for the media keys. It seems it is specifically designed for Windows but it might also work on Linux too:

https://github.com/benblazak/ergodox-firmware/pull/23

I wrote the patch. Have to clean it up and document when I get a chance before it gets merged. It supports Play/Pause, Next Track, Prev Track. I only tested in OS X, but it came from Microsoft documentation (actually it came from Hasu's tmk firmware) so it should work on Windows and I would be shocked if it didn't work in Linux. It's a separate scan code report from normal keys. I could hook up Volume Up and Volume Down media keys if the normal codes aren't working for Linux folk. I didn't bother because the normal key Volume Up and Volume down worked in OS X for me.

Offline Zalusithix

  • Posts: 165
Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2157 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 00:10:51 »
Ok, just finished installing stabilizers... A few interesting things to note:

The case is cut/designed wrong for the stabilizer closest to the main key cluster. For the key to align correctly the guides must be put in backwards. This creates it's own set of problems however in that the bars aren't meant to be used on that side of the switch and won't go down all the way as the switch housing interrupts the movement. By reshaping the bar, I got around that particular setback, but created a new one in turn. The newly bent bar ended up interfering with the key cap itself. I had to then shave down the key where the stabilizer was scuffing to fix that.

On the bright side, the key that was giving me a bit more resistance than I would have liked is now better. I doubt if I'll go through the hassle of doing that for the other boards though...

Offline spm

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2158 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 02:26:24 »
by the way, anybody using ergodox on linux? media keys with firmware from massdrop configurator aren't sending any keycodes. Is there any way to change firmware to send standard media key codes?

There is a pull request on github to add the support for the media keys. It seems it is specifically designed for Windows but it might also work on Linux too:

https://github.com/benblazak/ergodox-firmware/pull/23

I wrote the patch. Have to clean it up and document when I get a chance before it gets merged. It supports Play/Pause, Next Track, Prev Track. I only tested in OS X, but it came from Microsoft documentation (actually it came from Hasu's tmk firmware) so it should work on Windows and I would be shocked if it didn't work in Linux. It's a separate scan code report from normal keys. I could hook up Volume Up and Volume Down media keys if the normal codes aren't working for Linux folk. I didn't bother because the normal key Volume Up and Volume down worked in OS X for me.

Strange - volume up/down and mute keys aren't working for me... only tested with firmware from massdrop web configurator. Actually these 3 are only media keys which I really need :)

Offline CommunistWitchDr

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2159 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 02:30:17 »
Ok, just finished installing stabilizers... A few interesting things to note:

The case is cut/designed wrong for the stabilizer closest to the main key cluster. For the key to align correctly the guides must be put in backwards. This creates it's own set of problems however in that the bars aren't meant to be used on that side of the switch and won't go down all the way as the switch housing interrupts the movement. By reshaping the bar, I got around that particular setback, but created a new one in turn. The newly bent bar ended up interfering with the key cap itself. I had to then shave down the key where the stabilizer was scuffing to fix that.

On the bright side, the key that was giving me a bit more resistance than I would have liked is now better. I doubt if I'll go through the hassle of doing that for the other boards though...

Costar or cherry plate?

Offline r3dx

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2160 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 09:14:05 »
Ok, just finished installing stabilizers... A few interesting things to note:

The case is cut/designed wrong for the stabilizer closest to the main key cluster. For the key to align correctly the guides must be put in backwards. This creates it's own set of problems however in that the bars aren't meant to be used on that side of the switch and won't go down all the way as the switch housing interrupts the movement. By reshaping the bar, I got around that particular setback, but created a new one in turn. The newly bent bar ended up interfering with the key cap itself. I had to then shave down the key where the stabilizer was scuffing to fix that.

On the bright side, the key that was giving me a bit more resistance than I would have liked is now better. I doubt if I'll go through the hassle of doing that for the other boards though...

I also noticed this when I was trying to install some Costar stabilizers. I'm not sure if Cherry ones would work better cause I don't really have any to try or know where to pick some up.

Honestly I ended up just removing them because they probably aren't required due to the fact that your thumb is most likely hitting the key the full length anyways, but I'm sure they can't hurt.
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Offline rknize

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2161 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 10:05:14 »
I had no trouble with the inner 2x keys, but the outer ones often bind up on me.  I'll probably have to put stabs in.
Russ

Offline r3dx

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2162 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 10:18:50 »
Yeah, you might want to give it a shot. I tried it and wasn't all that impressed with how it turned out.

I'm pretty happy with how the keyboard is now with lubed clears and having fixed all the case clearance issues.
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Offline Zalusithix

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2163 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 12:45:49 »
I also noticed this when I was trying to install some Costar stabilizers. I'm not sure if Cherry ones would work better cause I don't really have any to try or know where to pick some up.

Honestly I ended up just removing them because they probably aren't required due to the fact that your thumb is most likely hitting the key the full length anyways, but I'm sure they can't hurt.
Yeah, they aren't really needed - the Kinesis works fine without them. It was more a matter of one key switch being less receptive to off center hits than others that prompted my experimenting with them. I figured since the plate gave me the option, then why not?

On my next build, I'm going to try and elongate the stabilizer slots in question and patch the back side an equal amount. The bent bars really aren't ideal in that's near impossible to keep the parts that are supposed to be parallel running true to each other. This causes the bar to pull on the tabs a bit unevenly and the hinge action to have points of resistance.

Offline bpiphany

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2164 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 13:26:28 »
I can just confirm that someone (me being the usual suspect) messed up those stabilizer mounts =P The slots are mirrored towards each other while the switches are the same direction...

Offline Zalusithix

  • Posts: 165
Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2165 on: Fri, 19 April 2013, 13:53:36 »
Yeah, I noticed that they were mirrored and just shrugged assuming that it was a goof up, or an assumption based on a previous layout.

I've actually started thinking about a slightly different route now, but I'll have to think the jig required through a bit more. Basically instead of doing a simple slot cutting/filling, it would just be slot cutting (on both sets). Then a layer of the switch plate would be ground off near the stabilizers thick enough for piece of metal the normal thickness for the stabilizer mounts. This is then screwed/epoxied/whatever into place over the extended slots. This would effectively allow the stabilizer mounts to click into place like they would on a normal plate. I shaved them down and super glued them into place, but that's not really ideal.

Offline tilmann

  • Posts: 14
Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2166 on: Sat, 20 April 2013, 17:21:10 »
I've soldered the right side of my ErgoDox and flashed the firmware on it but I can't see any keypresses and the OS also doesn't detect a new USB device when I plug the keyboard in. Any idea how to debug this?

Thanks in advance!

Offline cpf

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2167 on: Sat, 20 April 2013, 21:25:00 »
I've soldered the right side of my ErgoDox and flashed the firmware on it but I can't see any keypresses and the OS also doesn't detect a new USB device when I plug the keyboard in. Any idea how to debug this?

Thanks in advance!

Sure the loader application actually showed a success message in the status bar when it finished? If you're using Windows, does Device Manager reenumerate when you plug it in? I assume you loaded the firmware via the outboard USB connector (vs. the one on the Teensy).

Offline SubGothius

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2168 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 02:04:12 »
So, I haven't even got around to building mine yet, but when I went to Radio Shack to get some soldering supplies tonight, I stumbled across a promising solution to the desire for tenting. I found these PCB standoffs, which are basically just coupling nuts:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102848

As it turns out, they're M3 threaded, the same as the screws supplied for the layer case, so they can be used to fashion adjustable legs on the inboard end. Better yet, they're attractively chromed and come in a set of 4 for just $1.99! Use the standoffs instead of the nuts provided with the kit, add a couple additional M3 screws of desired length and adjust to taste, then use the provided nuts as locknuts, as pictured here.

EDIT: It just occurred to me it might be a good idea to add a washer between the standoff and the acrylic (and maybe on top as well, between the acrylic and screw head) to better distribute stress and avoid potentially cracking the acrylic due to the lever effect of the long legs. The M3 screws provided with the ErgoDox kit are barely long enough to fully engage the provided nuts, and the standoff threading is slightly countersunk, so adding washers would reduce thread engagement even further, thus it's prolly best to get some slightly longer M3 screws to go through the case at those points, keeping the provided screws to use as feet.
« Last Edit: Thu, 25 April 2013, 03:21:19 by SubGothius »
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Offline tilmann

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2169 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 06:27:15 »
Sure the loader application actually showed a success message in the status bar when it finished? If you're using Windows, does Device Manager reenumerate when you plug it in? I assume you loaded the firmware via the outboard USB connector (vs. the one on the Teensy).
I actually connected the ErgoDox only with the USB connector of the Teensy and incorrectly assumed that it doesn't make a difference whether you use the outboard USB connector or connect to the Teensy directly. But yeah I guess connecting only the Teensy means the rest of the keyboard is unpowered :) Although I don't understand why the ErgoDox didn't show up as a USB device since from the perspective of the Teensy itself there shouldn't be a difference in how you connect it, right?

I'm now using the outboard USB connector and the firmware boots fine, the three LEDs light up consecutively (so the firmware was indeed flashed correctly, I didn't reflash after soldering the outboard USB connector) and all the keys seem to work except for the first key with an LED counting from the bottom. I flashed the qwerty-kinesis-mod firmware (just for testing purposes, going to flash the colemak layout later) and looking at the sources it seems this key is used to switch between layers, what's the expected behavior there? Should the LED light up once the layer is active? It definitely doesn't activate another layer. The LED works fine though as it lights up during the boot.

Offline Larken

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2170 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 06:57:00 »
if you're using the firmware from the massdrop layout generator, led A, B, C is tied to the following in order: numlock, caplock, and scroll-lock.

keep in mind that ~L2 is not 'numlock', although it does allow you to access the numpad. The actual numlock toggle resides inside L2, and it is the one that activates the led A on/off status, which is why LED A tends to stay on all the time.
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Offline magnific0

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2171 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 11:03:00 »
So, I haven't even got around to building mine yet, but when I went to Radio Shack to get some soldering supplies tonight, I stumbled across a promising solution to the desire for tenting. I found these PCB standoffs, which are basically just coupling nuts:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102848

As it turns out, they're M3 threaded, the same as the screws supplied for the layer case, so they can be used to fashion adjustable legs on the inboard end. Better yet, they're attractively chromed and come in a set of 4 for just $1.99! Use the standoffs instead of the nuts provided with the kit, add a couple additional M3 screws of desired length and adjust to taste, then use the provided nuts as locknuts, like so:

Time to stop lurking. I'm participating in the second round and have been planning everything in my head for days.

I have been sleeping on the legs for the last three days. This is an amazing solution, great find, thanks! I'll definitely go this route as well.

I have a question about the LEDs. Did anyone manage to route the LEDs to the top of the case yet? I find it awkward to have them under keys that have no relation to their function.

Also, how comfortable is it to type on the classic-case Ergodox without wrists pads/rests on a flat desk?

Offline SubGothius

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2172 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 16:05:54 »
I have a question about the LEDs. Did anyone manage to route the LEDs to the top of the case yet? I find it awkward to have them under keys that have no relation to their function.

I had the same inclination, so this may be relevant to your interests:
I'm thinking of swapping the switch-mounted LEDs with their resistors -- i.e., putting the LEDs where their respective resistors would normally go (just to the left of the Teensy) and vice-versa (most likely putting the resistors on the underside of the PCB and soldering them same-side). They're series circuits, so I think it should work, just gotta take care to maintain proper LED polarity (I gather the + leads should point towards the Teensy), and of course some creative bending of the leads will be necessary to accommodate the solder pad spacing on the PCB.

Another approach I'm considering is leaving the LEDs soldered where they would normally go, but putting them under the PCB (rather than thru the switches) and leaving long enough leads to bend them over to the left edge of the PCB, so when illuminated they would shine into the left edge of the case.

As to your other question:
Quote
Also, how comfortable is it to type on the classic-case Ergodox without wrists pads/rests on a flat desk?
You could use small wrist rests without an attached mousepad, as some have posted earlier in this thread, or just buy a $12 pair of palm pads from Kinesis; any of these would be simple enough to adhere to the full-hand case, which would be necessary if you wanted wrist rests together with tenting.

That said, if you really want optimal ergonomics, I feel obliged to point out it's best to avoid resting your wrists on anything, and even worse to do so with your hands bent back, as that puts pressure on the carpal nerve, which is the canonical cause of carpal tunnel syndrome (wrist bending/twisting does not cause carpal tunnel per se, though that can cause other, unrelated wrist RSIs and aggravate existing wrist conditions).

It's best to rest your elbows and/or forearms on your chair arms and then put your desk or keyboard tray at a height where your hands can "hover" an inch or so above the keyboard. IMO, the "classic" case design without palm rests would tend to encourage this technique by providing nowhere for your wrists to rest upon.
"In theory there's no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is." -Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut

Offline Unix Guru

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2173 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 17:05:19 »
Here you go. I put them in but one side popped out because the wedge that normally grabs the underside of the plate (on normal keyboards with thin plates) needs to be filed off so it becomes like the red portion in the photo you provided in another thread:
Show Image


Just FYI... I used a small Dremel Engraving Cutter with a round cutter to make a dent inside each slot at both ends.  I am surprised at how well the stab mount works now.  No need to file/cut off the snap.

Offline dorkvader

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2174 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 19:49:34 »
Okay, just to doublecheck on the diodes. No matter which method, you should always have the line close to the square pad? I'm doing through hole on this one, 'cause I'm opening all the switches anyway to make ergo clears and "heavy reds".

I really don't want to mess this up and have to desolder everything.

Better question: is this good?
« Last Edit: Sun, 21 April 2013, 20:05:23 by dorkvader »

Offline TheQsanity

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2175 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 20:45:03 »
I will tell you in a sec. let me look at my dox
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Offline TheQsanity

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2176 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 20:51:06 »
The Cathode or the black line or the negative side will face the Square pad.

How do Heavy reds feel? Do they feel more like red's than blacks?
I think the red stem feels more hollow than the blacks and black stems feel a little more "stiff or solid"
What do you have to say?
SmallFry! <3

Offline dorkvader

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2177 on: Sun, 21 April 2013, 21:16:52 »
The Cathode or the black line or the negative side will face the Square pad.

How do Heavy reds feel? Do they feel more like red's than blacks?
I think the red stem feels more hollow than the blacks and black stems feel a little more "stiff or solid"
What do you have to say?
I'm making these two for someone else, but I have tried reds on my daily driver for a long while. I had a QFR in reds from PChome when they were first available. I really liked it. If you can "float" your fingers, you can really type fast on it, and gaming was easy too. now I've migrated to heavier switches, and use greens / buckling spring as my daily and sometimes I go to my ergoclears keyboard (phantom)

I'll bu putting either whites or light whites in my ergoDOX, I think.

Cherry blacks are my least favourite switch by far, but I have the most of them (for cherry, I have many many more B/S switches, even if I only count model F's). Several WYSE keyboards, several access-is, etc.

----
So I thought I was right. Line = pad. as long as I doublecheck before soldering, I should be okay, as the LH size is the reverse of the RH side.

Thanks for the confirmation, TheQsanity. It was a lot easier to visually check my personal ergoDOX, which I learned how to SMD for. My close vision must be decent, 'cause I can see the lines on the SM diodes quite well. It's harder for the diodes inside cherry switches, though.

Offline sahihe

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2178 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 09:48:50 »
@SubGothias - Love that tenting idea. Definitely going to give it a try. How was the stability overall? Did you feel a need for support from the third screw?
« Last Edit: Mon, 22 April 2013, 09:54:37 by sahihe »

Offline daerid

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2179 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 11:53:20 »
So, I haven't even got around to building mine yet, but when I went to Radio Shack to get some soldering supplies tonight, I stumbled across a promising solution to the desire for tenting. I found these PCB standoffs, which are basically just coupling nuts:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102848

As it turns out, they're M3 threaded, the same as the screws supplied for the layer case, so they can be used to fashion adjustable legs on the inboard end. Better yet, they're attractively chromed and come in a set of 4 for just $1.99! Use the standoffs instead of the nuts provided with the kit, add a couple additional M3 screws of desired length and adjust to taste, then use the provided nuts as locknuts, like so:

Perfect. Minimal, elegant, and functional solution. Definitely going to do this as well, but I'm going to see what I can do to make them easily removable without compromising the case integrity.

Offline Zalusithix

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2180 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 12:12:41 »
Just FYI... I used a small Dremel Engraving Cutter with a round cutter to make a dent inside each slot at both ends.  I am surprised at how well the stab mount works now.  No need to file/cut off the snap.
My question is how well the acrylic holds up to snapping the mount in and out over time. Seeing as how the notch leaves a rather thin overhang, I feared it breaking off eventually. I mean, obviously it's not something that should be happening on a regular basis, but thin pieces of relatively brittle plastic make me worry.

Offline magnific0

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2181 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 14:39:42 »
Thanks SubGothius for your answers.

Perfect. Minimal, elegant, and functional solution. Definitely going to do this as well, but I'm going to see what I can do to make them easily removable without compromising the case integrity.

I found an eBay seller that has a wide variety here:
http://stores.ebay.com/395six7/_i.html?_nkw=m3

For detachment you could first add a ~4mm F-F spacer and leave it on permanently and attach a longer F-M spacer to that. I also got some nylon screws, figured they would help prevent scratching.

Offline Canut

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2182 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 17:11:04 »
The threaded stand-offs look good. Just what I need to implement my idea of attaching swivel (leveling) feet.

The feet have a threaded post with a ball-joint foot on the end. So you get fine vertical adjustment (tenting!) plus the rubber foot-pad self-adjusts to the desk surface. They come in every size from industrial machinery downwards. Some M3 threaded versions should be easy to find

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=leveling+feet&rt=nc

   

Offline damorgue

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2183 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 17:26:31 »
The threaded stand-offs look good. Just what I need to implement my idea of attaching swivel (leveling) feet.

The feet have a threaded post with a ball-joint foot on the end. So you get fine vertical adjustment (tenting!) plus the rubber foot-pad self-adjusts to the desk surface. They come in every size from industrial machinery downwards. Some M3 threaded versions should be easy to find

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=leveling+feet&rt=nc
   

They are quite hard to find in those small sizes. I have been looking for some that small for several projects. Please let me know if you find any.

Offline SubGothius

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2184 on: Mon, 22 April 2013, 20:16:03 »
Love that tenting idea. Definitely going to give it a try. How was the stability overall? Did you feel a need for support from the third screw?
I haven't finished building mine yet, so I can't speak for how well it works in actual practice, but it seems quite stable poking around on it as pictured. The legs are slightly splayed out from vertical due to the tented board angle, so that effectively puts the actual foot closer below that inboard corner you pointed out.

Note that the nearside inner leg needs to be slightly longer than the farside leg, since they're different distances from the outboard edge, but this is easily adjustable thanks to the screws. If one wanted only a little bit of tenting, using the standoffs alone would probably suffice, though you'd probably need to add a short screw to the nearside leg to lengthen it slightly; the screws provided with the standoffs would probably suffice for this, though I haven't tested it.

As for anti-skid feet, I'm thinking that hardware/auto-parts stores may have push-in rubber bumpers with a shallow hole in the middle (normally used to press them into a blind hole) large enough to fit around the screw cap, or just get a small rubber stopper and drill a hole partway into it yourself.
« Last Edit: Mon, 22 April 2013, 21:44:10 by SubGothius »
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Offline kurplop

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2185 on: Tue, 23 April 2013, 19:41:39 »
19633-0
I finished the tray for my ErgoDox. I was going to use a black sheet metal cover for the modified Expert Mouse but when I'd glance at it it reminded me a little too much of Darth Vader. I decided to go with the Executive look. The mahogany doesn't match my desk but I've had a yearning to work with it for some time.
19635-1
I was surprised at how comfortable it is to use from my lap. The ergonomics are great and it rests solidly and comfortably in my lap. I'll mount it to the desk eventually but I have to troubleshoot a problem first. I'm having trouble getting the scroll wheel to work. I wonder if Kensington will honor the warranty? If anyone has ever modified an E.M. I'd like to hear from you.
19637-2
This is a view from the monitor. Sorry about the out of focus pictures.

Offline Lunartuna

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2186 on: Tue, 23 April 2013, 19:45:40 »
Gad damn man that's amazing!  :eek:
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Offline Glod

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2187 on: Tue, 23 April 2013, 19:51:05 »
(Attachment Link)
I finished the tray for my ErgoDox. I was going to use a black sheet metal cover for the modified Expert Mouse but when I'd glance at it it reminded me a little too much of Darth Vader. I decided to go with the Executive look. The mahogany doesn't match my desk but I've had a yearning to work with it for some time.
(Attachment Link)
I was surprised at how comfortable it is to use from my lap. The ergonomics are great and it rests solidly and comfortably in my lap. I'll mount it to the desk eventually but I have to troubleshoot a problem first. I'm having trouble getting the scroll wheel to work. I wonder if Kensington will honor the warranty? If anyone has ever modified an E.M. I'd like to hear from you.
(Attachment Link)
This is a view from the monitor. Sorry about the out of focus pictures.

i am speechless,

there are some impressive creations on geekhack and you have joined the club

sorry to hear the scrollwheel is not working but it is sexy nonetheless


Offline bisl

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2188 on: Tue, 23 April 2013, 20:54:26 »

Offline Larken

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2189 on: Tue, 23 April 2013, 21:05:06 »
downright amazing, kurplop. are you a craftsman by profession, or a hobbyist? that is actually really stunning work, both on the alu case and the support structure.
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Offline kurplop

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2190 on: Tue, 23 April 2013, 21:51:26 »
downright amazing, kurplop. are you a craftsman by profession, or a hobbyist? that is actually really stunning work, both on the alu case and the support structure.
Thanks for all the kind words. As most of you know, when we talk to outsiders about our enthusiasm over our "silly" keyboards we're often met with blank stares.  It's great to have a community like this that can appreciate our passion.

I am a remodeling contractor in Southern California. My small company does three to five projects a year. Primarily kitchens and additions. We do most of the trades in house including cabinetry. I started doing it as a hobby and it grew into a business. I still love the work and my customers but the oppressive  regulations are a frustration.

Offline Input Nirvana

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2191 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 00:07:27 »
WOW! Sordna linked me to this since I'm out of touch these days.

Outstanding work and I'm very impressed with your design. Very impressed.

Ok, here it goes, typical Input Nirvana questions:

Did you take any pics of the mouse work interior?
Is it possible to get a few pics with hand placement, one on keyboard another on the mousing?
Any close-up pics of the sides of the keyboard (front, side, back, under)?
How did you decide the placement of the Ergo-halves?
Any pics of the unit during construction?
How did you decide on the keyboard profiles/design? I like the detail.
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Offline Dreadwyrm

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2192 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 01:40:40 »
Shiiiiiiit kurplop, that is beyond epic...

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Offline Findecanor

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2193 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 03:04:01 »
Now that is a touch of class, Kurplop!

Offline phetto

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2194 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 03:11:07 »
(Attachment Link)
I finished the tray for my ErgoDox. I was going to use a black sheet metal cover for the modified Expert Mouse but when I'd glance at it it reminded me a little too much of Darth Vader. I decided to go with the Executive look. The mahogany doesn't match my desk but I've had a yearning to work with it for some time.
(Attachment Link)
I was surprised at how comfortable it is to use from my lap. The ergonomics are great and it rests solidly and comfortably in my lap. I'll mount it to the desk eventually but I have to troubleshoot a problem first. I'm having trouble getting the scroll wheel to work. I wonder if Kensington will honor the warranty? If anyone has ever modified an E.M. I'd like to hear from you.
(Attachment Link)
This is a view from the monitor. Sorry about the out of focus pictures.

You sir, just won the allstar prize. This is the best thing I have ever seen. Best mod EVUUUUR

Offline eviltobz

  • Posts: 95
Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2195 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 03:12:23 »
What they said. mmmm, woody :)

Offline dfj

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2196 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 09:09:41 »
Kerplop - beautiful build!

  What did you finish the wood with?

 I've had trouble just keeping steel protected on the high wear parts of keyboards, nvm Mahogany...

For my mousepad I went with end-grain maple, and I need to touch it up to keep it slick every 3-4 months (yay scrapers) I use (mostly because I have it) granite wax for countertops.
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Offline kurplop

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2197 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 13:45:38 »
Kerplop - beautiful build!

  What did you finish the wood with?

 I've had trouble just keeping steel protected on the high wear parts of keyboards, nvm Mahogany...

For my mousepad I went with end-grain maple, and I need to touch it up to keep it slick every 3-4 months (yay scrapers) I use (mostly because I have it) granite wax for countertops.

Good observations. I've had wood finishes that deteriorate and get gummy and dirty from hand oils. I decided to use about five coats of Varathane water borne floor finish over a shellac based sanding sealer. The sealer was used primarily to set the color of the wood because the water based products don't seem to enhance the color on dark woods as well. After sanding I rubbed the finish out with a clay bar (used for car finishes) and then used a paste wax and buffed out to a shine.
I'm hoping the durability of the floor finish plus the wax will maintain the finish. We'll see.

WOW! Sordna linked me to this since I'm out of touch these days.

Outstanding work and I'm very impressed with your design. Very impressed.

Ok, here it goes, typical Input Nirvana questions:

Did you take any pics of the mouse work interior?
Is it possible to get a few pics with hand placement, one on keyboard another on the mousing?
Any close-up pics of the sides of the keyboard (front, side, back, under)?
How did you decide the placement of the Ergo-halves?
Any pics of the unit during construction?
How did you decide on the keyboard profiles/design? I like the detail.

Talk about WOW! To be noticed by the two Guru's of Kinesis modifications is quite an honor.

I hope to start a new thread on my project so as not to take up too much space on this one but a few quick responses here.

You realize of course that showing the unfinished underside of my keyboard is like showing up for an underwear modeling gig before I had time to shave my back, but here goes. :-[ 
19698-0

Sorry the pictures are so out of focus. The top button is set for click and the thumb falls naturally to it. The left button is set for right click and it's very easy to get to. The others are set for forward and back in OSX and middle click in Windows.  They are not as easy to reach while using the ball but that's the beauty of a center mount trackball where you can assist with the other hand.
19700-119702-2

One final picture here of the mockup I made to help me determine the placement of things. I used hot glue to make a "hinge" and two wood scraps to find the best tenting angle for me. The amount of splaying and separation between units was predetermined by how my arms naturally lay.

19704-3

I have more pictures I will post soon in another thread.

Offline haskellelephant

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2198 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 14:15:29 »
Wow, that mod is rediculous! Me and some friends of mine have been
admiring that thing all day!

Offline WhiteFireDragon

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Re: ErgoDox - Custom split ergo keyboard.
« Reply #2199 on: Wed, 24 April 2013, 17:10:23 »
kurplop, that is some beautiful craftsmanship. Such nice custom work. We need more crafty people like you on this board :). You mentioned you were also have dexterity for metal work?