[GB] GMK Triumph Adler. Pics posted...

[billnye]

Just want to express my gratitude to intelli for his awesome work on this set. Can't wait to get it on my Corsa

[jdcarpe]

Here's the bottom line: this isn't the set for you. Don't buy it.

See, the thing is, I want it to be. Do you know how many group buys I buy into? You don't want to know. And maybe you're right. Maybe it is too late. But, then again, maybe it's not. Is there a chance, even a small one, that we could get an add-on set with the "missing" keys for a few dollars? I don't know the answer to that. But at least I'm trying. I don't feel I'm being "toxic" by speaking up for the silent majority.

[dimmu]

intelli its not your job to respond to everyone who has a question or a complaint. The buy is already live, its already tipped, and if the pace continues its going to be a pretty successful buy.

it hasn't tipped yet, it's either 500 buys or we get nothing. threadcrapping can still very much hurt this buy, which is why everyone is trying to stay positive.

[Fnzzy]

If the set is pre-sorted, will it come in neat boxes or just thrown together into a plastic bag?

[saturnotaku]

intelli its not your job to respond to everyone who has a question or a complaint. The buy is already live, its already tipped, and if the pace continues its going to be a pretty successful buy.

^ This.

Especially in the Massdrop discussion. It's just causing a lot of clutter there, and probably a lot of undue stress on you.

One thing I would do, though, is ask MD to swap the first image under the initial paragraph of text to what you get in the box, which might help alleviate some of the confusion. You have to scroll down quite a bit to see what you're actually getting.

[intelli78]

Here's the bottom line: this isn't the set for you. Don't buy it.

See, the thing is, I want it to be. Do you know how many group buys I buy into? You don't want to know. And maybe you're right. Maybe it is too late. But, then again, maybe it's not. Is there a chance, even a small one, that we could get an add-on set with the "missing" keys for a few dollars? I don't know the answer to that. But at least I'm trying. I don't feel I'm being "toxic" by speaking up for the silent majority.

Unfortunately, it is too late because Massdrop cannot retroactively add onto people's committed prices, even by a few dollars. And besides, it all comes down to what I've said over and over, about the slippery slope. We add these, then voices from Europe get even louder about language packs, 1800 users will threaten to boycott if we don't add 0 and +, etc etc. There has to be a line somewhere, and I erred on the side of few keys. Maybe I messed up, I'll be sure to self-evaluate once it's all said and done. I'm not perfect. But the fact remains that this set has some kick ass features and it's cheap as hell. For $99, I think we can all live with a little compromise.

[intelli78]

If the set is pre-sorted, will it come in neat boxes or just thrown together into a plastic bag?

Plastic trays.

[Jixr]

One thing I would do, though, is ask MD to swap the first image under the initial paragraph of text to what you get in the box, which might help alleviate some of the confusion. You have to scroll down quite a bit to see what you're actually getting.

Which that was my only complaint, as when I first saw the page i thought it was for the original layout, and is causing confusion with other people as well.

[BunnyLake]

intelli its not your job to respond to everyone who has a question or a complaint. The buy is already live, its already tipped, and if the pace continues its going to be a pretty successful buy.

actually, its precisely his job to make sure he answers everyones questions and complaints

[intelli78]

One thing I would do, though, is ask MD to swap the first image under the initial paragraph of text to what you get in the box, which might help alleviate some of the confusion. You have to scroll down quite a bit to see what you're actually getting.

Which that was my only complaint, as when I first saw the page i thought it was for the original layout, and is causing confusion with other people as well.

Agreed, and asking.

[intelli78]

intelli its not your job to respond to everyone who has a question or a complaint. The buy is already live, its already tipped, and if the pace continues its going to be a pretty successful buy.

actually, its precisely his job to make sure he answers everyones questions and complaints

I tend to agree with Bunny, so I am trying to answer as many people as possible and be candid about why decisions were made.

At the same time, we need to unite and not be complaining about things that are set in stone, as it's only going to harm the effort. Complaints about things we can change, great. But the IC is done.

[jdcarpe]

And besides, it all comes down to what I've said over and over, about the slippery slope. We add these, then voices from Europe get even louder about language packs, 1800 users will threaten to boycott if we don't add 0 and +, etc etc. There has to be a line somewhere, and I erred on the side of few keys.

I'm not talking about some esoteric layout like an 1800 or a European language pack, though. I'm talking about ANSI standard 104, which is what the vast majority of buyers will have, with a profile mismatch and a strange legend choice for one key.

I guess there's no point in even trying to make a go of an add-on pack? We just admit defeat?

[cjhard]

The problem with making it another pack is in Massdrop, each order for the tiny pack will look like an additional qty towards our 500 MOQ, and we'll have no way to tell how much we truly have met on the base set. You will also have a MOQ of 500 for the mini-pack itself, of which if not met, people will bail out of the base set because it does not fit their requirements now that mini-pack had not tipped.

[billnye]

And besides, it all comes down to what I've said over and over, about the slippery slope. We add these, then voices from Europe get even louder about language packs, 1800 users will threaten to boycott if we don't add 0 and +, etc etc. There has to be a line somewhere, and I erred on the side of few keys.

I'm not talking about some esoteric layout like an 1800 or a European language pack, though. I'm talking about ANSI standard 104, which is what the vast majority of buyers will have, with a profile mismatch and a strange legend choice for one key.

I guess there's no point in even trying to make a go of an add-on pack? We just admit defeat?

[exitfire401]

And besides, it all comes down to what I've said over and over, about the slippery slope. We add these, then voices from Europe get even louder about language packs, 1800 users will threaten to boycott if we don't add 0 and +, etc etc. There has to be a line somewhere, and I erred on the side of few keys.

I'm not talking about some esoteric layout like an 1800 or a European language pack, though. I'm talking about ANSI standard 104, which is what the vast majority of buyers will have, with a profile mismatch and a strange legend choice for one key.

I guess there's no point in even trying to make a go of an add-on pack? We just admit defeat?

As he's stated, it's not possible to do so within the Massdrop model. It would change the price for everybody, and that could be a breaking point for some. If it fails, maybe there will be further discussion, but with the amount of time left vs. how many orders are left to hit MOQ, I don't see that happening.

[jdcarpe]

And besides, it all comes down to what I've said over and over, about the slippery slope. We add these, then voices from Europe get even louder about language packs, 1800 users will threaten to boycott if we don't add 0 and +, etc etc. There has to be a line somewhere, and I erred on the side of few keys.

I'm not talking about some esoteric layout like an 1800 or a European language pack, though. I'm talking about ANSI standard 104, which is what the vast majority of buyers will have, with a profile mismatch and a strange legend choice for one key.

I guess there's no point in even trying to make a go of an add-on pack? We just admit defeat?

Show Image

Yeah, that board looks like poo, sorry. And it's not even the same as the one in the MD photos.

[intelli78]

And besides, it all comes down to what I've said over and over, about the slippery slope. We add these, then voices from Europe get even louder about language packs, 1800 users will threaten to boycott if we don't add 0 and +, etc etc. There has to be a line somewhere, and I erred on the side of few keys.

I'm not talking about some esoteric layout like an 1800 or a European language pack, though. I'm talking about ANSI standard 104, which is what the vast majority of buyers will have, with a profile mismatch and a strange legend choice for one key.

I guess there's no point in even trying to make a go of an add-on pack? We just admit defeat?

I understand what you're saying, but look: it is ANSI standard 104. Key profiles aren't a part of the ANSI standard. It's only a few mm. Most people won't know or care, and it allows WKL users--who will use the set it its most authentic format--to have all A-profile. It's a compromise, and I just frankly think it's silly to think that a couple mm profile difference, nicely split between segments of the keyboard, is a dealbreaker. Yeah it'll suck for winkey lightsavers, but... deal with it? Use it on a different keyboard?

Also, you say it's not an esoteric issue. I disagree. For you it's a dealbreaker. For other people, QWERTZ, Nordic language packs, 1800, etc, are all dealbreakers. Everybody has their own rock-solid preferences that they don't want to budge on. I disagree that this issue is more universal than any other one.

The whole point was to keep everything in one pack, no add ons, and I highly doubt we would meet MOQ for an addon pack.

Regarding the CTRL and PRT SC, not only are they authentic, I personally like them, and they are staying because dammit, I am going to get at least 1 thing i personally wanted. 

Finally, it's not defeat... it's exactly by design.

[wlhlm]

I asked this at Massdrop, but nobody answer, so maybe someone here knows:

Why does the original set have "CTRL" keys? Are there any other sets that have them? It is the only Cherry keycap set I know, that has these. This seems very odd to me.

[billnye]

I asked this at Massdrop, but nobody answer, so maybe someone here knows:

Why does the original set have "CTRL" keys? Are there any other sets that have them? It is the only Cherry keycap set I know, that has these. This seems very odd to me.

A bunch of old Oli boards had them as well:

[Photekq]

Yeah, that board looks like poo, sorry.

It's all a matter of opinion.

[exitfire401]

Yeah, that board looks like poo, sorry.

It's all a matter of opinion.

Seconded. I like it. Also, MD overexposes photos of everything...so I'm not entirely surprised that it's not 100% accurate on their site. The same thing has happened with a few other keysets.

[jdcarpe]

Yeah, that board looks like poo, sorry.

It's all a matter of opinion.

Seconded. I like it. Also, MD overexposes photos of everything...so I'm not entirely surprised that it's not 100% accurate on their site. The same thing has happened with a few other keysets.

It's not the color...

[motherbrain]

If you have any respect for me and the work it took to create this set, please do not turn this into a popcorn thread. And the above post is not personal attack on JD or anyone else. It's strictly about the comments being posted. I absolutely hate squabbling and it makes me sick that I even had to make my last post. I try to treat everyone on this forum with professionalism and respect. I am asking for the same in return, and a little bit of COMPROMISE, which is sorely lacking here.

i think you've done an amazing job with this group buy--i mean seriously, the numbers speak for themselves and we're not even 24 hrs in.  you should be extremely proud of what you've accomplished--there are going to be a lot of people who are thrilled to get this keyset (myself included). there's a reason behind every choice you've made, and i respect that.  you've tried to stay true to the original design as much as possible, but make some concessions for accessibility.  there's always going to be nay-sayers, but they're outnumbered probably 50:1.  Excellent job!!

i apologize for my attempt at humor fail.

[wlhlm]

I asked this at Massdrop, but nobody answer, so maybe someone here knows:

Why does the original set have "CTRL" keys? Are there any other sets that have them? It is the only Cherry keycap set I know, that has these. This seems very odd to me.

A bunch of old Oli boards had them as well:

Show Image

Ah, thanks. Man these keys look delicious...

[intelli78]

If you have any respect for me and the work it took to create this set, please do not turn this into a popcorn thread. And the above post is not personal attack on JD or anyone else. It's strictly about the comments being posted. I absolutely hate squabbling and it makes me sick that I even had to make my last post. I try to treat everyone on this forum with professionalism and respect. I am asking for the same in return, and a little bit of COMPROMISE, which is sorely lacking here.

i think you've done an amazing job with this group buy--i mean seriously, the numbers speak for themselves and we're not even 24 hrs in.  you should be extremely proud of what you've accomplished--there are going to be a lot of people who are thrilled to get this keyset (myself included). there's a reason behind every choice you've made, and i respect that.  you've tried to stay true to the original design as much as possible, but make some concessions for accessibility.  there's always going to be nay-sayers, but they're outnumbered probably 50:1.  Excellent job!!

i apologize for my attempt at humor fail.

No worries.

I have to sign off for now but I'll be back later tonight.

[Bomble]

It's so, so beautiful makes me wish I owned a novatouch, or SOMETHING MX-compatable.

This sounds to me like great logic to purchase another keyboard. Don't fight it.....

I don't think my bank balance would be my friend for the next month or three... BUT I SO WANT TO

[jonathanyu]

I asked this at Massdrop, but nobody answer, so maybe someone here knows:

Why does the original set have "CTRL" keys? Are there any other sets that have them? It is the only Cherry keycap set I know, that has these. This seems very odd to me.

A bunch of old Oli boards had them as well:

Show Image

Every time I see this picture  :'(

[wlhlm]

I asked this at Massdrop, but nobody answer, so maybe someone here knows:

Why does the original set have "CTRL" keys? Are there any other sets that have them? It is the only Cherry keycap set I know, that has these. This seems very odd to me.

A bunch of old Oli boards had them as well:

Show Image

Every time I see this picture  :'(

I can feel you :'(

[livingspeedbump]

thanks for the work you put into this intelli! absolutely fantastic set. definitely going to place an order for one, probably two, hell maybe even 3.

[Ouro]

No accent enter and escape keys? I'm going to have to pass on this gorgeous set even though it is being made with THREE custom colors. I spend more time looking at my keyboard when I type than on the screen so it is very critical to have this feature.

[rand77]

Due to how they overexpose photographs at massdrop (or they just have extremely bright lighting), the a lot of keysets / keyboard appear much darker in real life.  My Varmilo keycaps were dark grey in real life, but appeared to be light grey in the pictures, the different in shade was a lot.

[quochung1989]

Don't worry about color. Massdrop wrote: "Even more interesting is that the iconic teal and gray colorway was actually a complete accident. TA Dario 286 keyboards originally had bright blue modifier keys—not teal. But over time, the blue keys on the few remaining boards slowly turned to teal thanks to a flaw in the plastic’s chemical composition, serendipitously creating the beautiful teal/gray combo seen today."

[ideus]

What is the purpose of this thread? The GB is an MD drop with its proper discussion forum now; thus, a GB thread at GH is redundant, in the best case, or a window for complains that is not benefiting the GB.

[cjhard]

Purpose is to rally support. We still need to get 500 people on board for this, or else none of us get our coveted keys. It was posted on Reddit, Deskthority, and probably elsewhere too. As of this statement, we are 187 orders away from meeting MOQ, with 10 days to get 187+ people in on this. Having this thread constantly bumped to the top will help to serve this purpose because many folks here check only this subforum.

[hwood34]

What is the purpose of this thread? The GB is an MD drop with its proper discussion forum now; thus, a GB thread at GH is redundant, in the best case, or a window for complains that is not benefiting the GB.

to let people know it exists?

[intelli78]

I will make a deal.

We're not changing the base set, but I'm willing to do one of two things.

1. Make a giant "everything else" set to be sold alongside the base set.

I'll comb through the IC, through the DT thread, through this thread, through Massdrop and reddit comments. I'll add every key that's been requested that makes a lick of sense to add. All the requested euro languages, alternate row 4 modfiiers, winkeys, hhkb, 1800, blanks, you name it.

We launch it as a drop in a few days time, so it has plenty of time to run alongside this one.

Everybody who wanted to add their own keys will get a chance, but they will reap what they sow: a high price and a high MOQ.

It will be a chance to put your money where your mouth is.

2. I'll tally up all the extra wanted keys in the same way, but I'll split them into child packs. So you'll be able to get only what you want at a cheaper price. Trade-off: it'll be highly fragmented and still have high MOQs, I doubt many packs will make it, if any. Not that the mega-pack would have a great chance either.

=======================

I'll make the decision about (1) or (2) purely democratically. Have a vote, I'll defer to the masses completely. Then we'll do it ASAP, provided I can get Massdrop on board.

Then there can be NO further B1TCHING from ANYONE, no matter what the outcome is. Agreed? The community decides which approach to take, design by committee, and then everyone has equity of opportunity to purchase the keys he/she wants. Success proves the demand is there. Failure proves it's not. It doesn't get any more meritocratic.

This will be a referendum for the future as well, to gauge what keys actually have demand.

I don't predict it will be a success either way but I'll do it however you guys think will be best.

[ideus]

If complaining and whining serve as advertising; then, keep this alive and kicking.

[hwood34]

If complaining and whining serve as advertising; then, keep this alive and kicking.

If this thread wasn't here, how would people know when the buy dropped or where it even was?

[ideus]

I will make a deal.

We're not changing the base set, but I'm willing to do one of two things.

1. Make a giant "everything else" set to be sold alongside the base set.

I'll comb through the IC, through the DT thread, through this thread, through Massdrop and reddit comments. I'll add every key that's been requested that makes a lick of sense to add. All the requested euro languages, alternate row 4 modfiiers, winkeys, hhkb, 1800, blanks, you name it.

We launch it as a drop in a few days time, so it has plenty of time to run alongside this one.

Everybody who wanted to add their own keys will get a chance, but they will reap what they sow: a high price and a high MOQ.

It will be a chance to put your money where your mouth is.

2. I'll tally up all the extra wanted keys in the same way, but I'll split them into child packs. So you'll be able to get only what you want at a cheaper price. Trade-off: it'll be highly fragmented and still have high MOQs, I doubt many packs will make it, if any. Not that the mega-pack would have a great chance either.

=======================

I'll make the decision about (1) or (2) purely democratically. Have a vote, I'll defer to the masses completely. Then we'll do it ASAP, provided I can get Massdrop on board.

Then there can be NO further B1TCHING from ANYONE, no matter what the outcome is. Agreed? The community decides which approach to take, design by committee, and then everyone has equity of opportunity to purchase the keys he/she wants. Success proves the demand is there. Failure proves it's not. It doesn't get any more meritocratic.

This will be a referendum for the future as well, to gauge what keys actually have demand.

I don't predict it will be a success either way but I'll do it however you guys think will be best.

This may help to allow this GB thread to be more focus in the features of the set, and less in whining.

[whentheclouds]

If this thread wasn't here, how would people know when the buy dropped or where it even was?

maybe not for mortals like yourself, but thanks to my TA avatar i can read intelli's mind and knows exactly how he wants us to participate in the GB, as well as the color of his favorite pair of underwear

[intelli78]

maybe not for mortals like yourself, but thanks to my TA avatar i can read intelli's mind and knows exactly how he wants us to participate in the GB, as well as the color of his favorite pair of underwear

Confirmed.

[cjhard]

It is entirely likely I will only ever use straight US ANSI on my 60% boards, however I'd still put dollars into the Everything Else bundle. I have my doubts it'll reach MOQ, and I have my fears people who require it to reach MOQ will cancel their base set if it does not, however it does serve as a good experiment. For science.

My biggest fear? We reach MOQ on base set with minutes to spare, but Everything Else falls short, and people who don't know how to find Ø, Å, Æ, and Ä without looking brings us back below MOQ. If this were only Swedish-Dvorak, w/ inverted profile, I'd still buy it. Some folks would pay $1000 for the original no matter the language.

[ideus]

It is entirely likely I will only ever use straight US ANSI on my 60% boards, however I'd still put dollars into the Everything Else bundle. I have my doubts it'll reach MOQ, and I have my fears people who require it to reach MOQ will cancel their base set if it does not, however it does serve as a good experiment. For science.

My biggest fear? We reach MOQ on base set with minutes to spare, but Everything Else falls short, and people who don't know how to find Ø, Å, Æ, and Ä without looking brings us back below MOQ. If this were only Swedish-Dvorak, w/ inverted profile, I'd still buy it. Some folks would pay $1000 for the original no matter the language.

The good news are: You are not a prophet, fortunately.

[intelli78]

I have my doubts it'll reach MOQ, and I have my fears people who require it to reach MOQ will cancel their base set if it does not,

This occurred to me as well. Perhaps we can spread the word and offer to do it, but only AFTER the base set is done; that forces people who think there is demand for their obscure layouts, to put their money where their mouth is. Could do the same way with child packs.

[cjhard]

You know you will be chastised and harassed for not making it available at the same time as the base set, and people will scream "But now it's too late to get in on the base set, I'm stuck with useless keys!"

[ideus]

Let the drop follows its course. Open an IC on add-on sets to be offered if the drop is successful; otherwise, there is no reason for follow ups.

[intelli78]

Let the drop follows its course. Open an IC on add-on sets to be offered if the drop is successful; otherwise, there is no reason for follow ups.

I like this idea. Maybe I can get all the packs and renders prepared ASAP, to show off.

We'll just say, "if the GB is successful, we'll do a follow buy for all these, with X MOQ at Y price, can't guarantee what will happen, but we will offer the chance."

That's pretty solid.

[Belfong]

Ordered
Thanks intelli.

[cjhard]

Hint hint to all the people, you can buy more qty now and resell to suckers who lost out on the base set but totally want in on the Everything Else pack later.

[whentheclouds]

Hint hint to all the people, you can buy more qty now and resell to suckers who lost out on the base set but totally want in on the Everything Else pack later.

i can already see the WTB posts in the classifieds after the mod set drops  )