On that note. Should I just change the title of this thread and change its intent to be specific to my case, or should I create a new thread specifically for my case design and leave this thread as is for people to discuss case cad topics?
Thank you for your input so far. I have introduced my case design in my entry in Glissant's giveaway (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=50855.msg1118484#msg1118484), so you can go check it out there. I will be creating an actual thread specifically for this case design so I can field questions about it.
On that note. Should I just change the title of this thread and change its intent to be specific to my case, or should I create a new thread specifically for my case design and leave this thread as is for people to discuss case cad topics?
One thing that I am unsure about so far is if the PCB will be held in place well enough with just the mount points that are in the PCB.
Aluminum will be fine. Taps very easy just don't over tighten the screws. I wouldn't go with anything thinner than 1/16". I believe this is pretty close to 16 gauge. I don't usually work with stuff that thin at work aside from precision shim stock which comes down to .001" and is exactly what they say it is. For the most part I work with 1/8" up to 2" plate.
One thing that I am unsure about so far is if the PCB will be held in place well enough with just the mount points that are in the PCB.
I think it will. Once that thing is snug against the foam, it isn't going to want to move. There is also the issue of catching the corners, though. It would be easy to lift it and break things.
Aluminum will be fine. Taps very easy just don't over tighten the screws. I wouldn't go with anything thinner than 1/16". I believe this is pretty close to 16 gauge. I don't usually work with stuff that thin at work aside from precision shim stock which comes down to .001" and is exactly what they say it is. For the most part I work with 1/8" up to 2" plate.
I got a quote from a local place for $6/piece of .09" (~3/32) of 6" x 12" cut offs. I picked that thickness originally because I thought it would be thick enough, but I was really just guessing. Maybe I will start out by getting a piece at 3/32 and one at 1/8 and see which I prefer.
When I tap, I should probably try to use a higher thread count in order to minimize the possibility of stripping the threads, is that right? Or should I just try to get as much thread depth as possible? I am not sure which is more durable. Higher thread count makes it easier to know that you are tight enough without putting too much pressure, but the threads are usually not as deep in the plate walls.
Aluminum will be fine. Taps very easy just don't over tighten the screws. I wouldn't go with anything thinner than 1/16". I believe this is pretty close to 16 gauge. I don't usually work with stuff that thin at work aside from precision shim stock which comes down to .001" and is exactly what they say it is. For the most part I work with 1/8" up to 2" plate.
I got a quote from a local place for $6/piece of .09" (~3/32) of 6" x 12" cut offs. I picked that thickness originally because I thought it would be thick enough, but I was really just guessing. Maybe I will start out by getting a piece at 3/32 and one at 1/8 and see which I prefer.
When I tap, I should probably try to use a higher thread count in order to minimize the possibility of stripping the threads, is that right? Or should I just try to get as much thread depth as possible? I am not sure which is more durable. Higher thread count makes it easier to know that you are tight enough without putting too much pressure, but the threads are usually not as deep in the plate walls.
I would use a coarse thread for this purpose. I realize that this isn't a high strength application but fine thread doesn't usually stand up as well in softer materials. Plus fine thread is a lot easier to cross thread in these smaller sizes.
Anyone know the length and width of a 75% PCB? Thx...
Anyone know the length and width of a 75% PCB? Thx...
A 75% doesn't have to be a specific width/height. However, the numbers you are looking for are these: 12" width x 4.5" height.
Thanks everyone. There are definitely ones in here I did not know about, so I will have to go check them out.
Not sure that I can afford solidworks right now.
I've designed a whole 3d printer with it.
I've designed a whole 3d printer with it.
Mega geek-cred.
Also, Solidworks can be had for the low-low price of free if you know where to look...
I've designed a whole 3d printer with it.
Mega geek-cred.
Also, Solidworks can be had for the low-low price of free if you know where to look...
Anyhow, back on topic: Great idea! I suspect 3/32 aluminium will be a little thin to hold a good thread without nuts (unless you're very careful tightening the bolts), but 1/8 should do very well. I'd go for 1/8 for rigidity, too, but it all depends on the feel you want. 3/32 will be more "springy".
I really like this idea, and I think the wood base would be gorgeous. What do you guys think would be the best way to cut that slant, though? Bandsaw with a tilting table, maybe?
Nice. I like this idea, trying to figure out how to adapt to to board where I have stuff stuck to the bottom. Maybe some cutouts in the bottom plate in strategic places.
Nice. I like this idea, trying to figure out how to adapt to to board where I have stuff stuck to the bottom. Maybe some cutouts in the bottom plate in strategic places.
This is why I asked you about the profile of the bottom of the board in the GH60 thread. :)
The great thing is that there is a silicon sheet between the bottom plate and the PCB, so yes, I will be doing cutouts in the silicon sheet for the components that are taller than average. For example, the USB connector and the reset switch, etc... For something like the reset switch, I may even do a cutout in the bottom plate as well so it can be accessed without removing the case at all...
Nice. I like this idea, trying to figure out how to adapt to to board where I have stuff stuck to the bottom. Maybe some cutouts in the bottom plate in strategic places.
This is why I asked you about the profile of the bottom of the board in the GH60 thread. :)
The great thing is that there is a silicon sheet between the bottom plate and the PCB, so yes, I will be doing cutouts in the silicon sheet for the components that are taller than average. For example, the USB connector and the reset switch, etc... For something like the reset switch, I may even do a cutout in the bottom plate as well so it can be accessed without removing the case at all...
Yes, Komar answered in there with some measurements, but I have some one-offs with daughterboards sticking ~7mm off the bottom, but I'd guess they're unique to me, and not really a problem for anyone else. I just have this (probably unwise) fascination with the idea.
We can definitely do cutouts in the bottom plate, with the non-wedge design, to accommodate for the daughter board. Probably easiest to prototype with 1/4" acrylic, but if the cutout is large we may want to go with aluminum or steel to make sure we don't lose too much structure...
We can definitely do cutouts in the bottom plate, with the non-wedge design, to accommodate for the daughter board. Probably easiest to prototype with 1/4" acrylic, but if the cutout is large we may want to go with aluminum or steel to make sure we don't lose too much structure...
They're pretty small: 46mm x 17mm and 38mm x19mm... even with the wedge made of wood, I could just chisel out some space I suppose. Anyway, I like your ideas!
we DO NOT condone illegal activity or software piracy here. please remove references or the mod team will do it for you.
swill? what does pricing look like on those silicone sheets? those are really nice. what dimensions (thickness in particular) can your provider supply? i have a particularly cool application for them
The 40% designs could really take advantage of this, I imagine. I'll make sure you get one to play with when I get some prototypes made.
mod team cleaned up the piracy reference (except for my reference to their reference)...we DO NOT condone illegal activity or software piracy here. please remove references or the mod team will do it for you.
swill? what does pricing look like on those silicone sheets? those are really nice. what dimensions (thickness in particular) can your provider supply? i have a particularly cool application for them
What reference are you referring to in regards to software piracy? I don't think I have promoted software piracy, at least I never intended to.
I am going to see if I can get away with 1/8th thickness. The height difference between the average and tallest component will be my limiting factor.
For testing I am just getting from eBay cause my supplier likes quantity. On eBay it is priced in the ballpark of $20/square foot. I am also getting it with an adhesive backing and with high temp rating.
mod team cleaned up the piracy reference (except for my reference to their reference)...we DO NOT condone illegal activity or software piracy here. please remove references or the mod team will do it for you.
swill? what does pricing look like on those silicone sheets? those are really nice. what dimensions (thickness in particular) can your provider supply? i have a particularly cool application for them
What reference are you referring to in regards to software piracy? I don't think I have promoted software piracy, at least I never intended to.
I am going to see if I can get away with 1/8th thickness. The height difference between the average and tallest component will be my limiting factor.
For testing I am just getting from eBay cause my supplier likes quantity. On eBay it is priced in the ballpark of $20/square foot. I am also getting it with an adhesive backing and with high temp rating.
you should be fine at 1/8". that is pretty thick compared to the average passive component and far thicker than anything but a very large bga IC. people have been using those mesh PU sheets for shelf lining for quite a while now under pcbs here and those are more like 3/32" thick
what kind of quantities does your supplier need?
I plan on making my own cases for Sprit's internals.
This looks interesting.
All the raw materials for the prototypes are starting to slowly trickle in. The only thing I am missing to get started is the silicon sheets, which are stuck in the postal system. I will start prototyping with my Filco TKL to see how things go. The metal back plates will wait till I make sure the kinks are worked out with the materials which are easier to work with.
Here are some shots of some of what I have already...
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
Do you have an estimate of how much one case would cost?
A question from a newbie: that layer of silicon, how durable is that? It won't break down after a few years?
Hum, count me interested for a 60% case with a plate!
Hum, count me interested for a 60% case with a plate!
I will not provide plates, but you can use one from somewhere else.
Hum, count me interested for a 60% case with a plate!
I will not provide plates, but you can use one from somewhere else.
So the plate would not be anchored to the case itself then ... anyone know if it would be a problem? I suspect not since 60+ switches will anchor it, but still.
Hum, count me interested for a 60% case with a plate!
I will not provide plates, but you can use one from somewhere else.
So the plate would not be anchored to the case itself then ... anyone know if it would be a problem? I suspect not since 60+ switches will anchor it, but still.
If you use a plate, yes, it would be bolted to the back plate of the case (in the same way the pcb only option would be bolted to the back plate).
My point was only that I do not want to get into the hassle of getting plates cut for all sorts of layouts and sizes, so I will not be producing/providing plates. I will do my best to support plates from existing plate providers (as long as I don't go broke trying to get samples of them all).
I think the bread and butter of this case design will actually be the pcb mounted approach. Because of the silicone sheet, the pcb mounted option will have a much more solid feel than a traditional pcb mounted case. By adding a plate I suspect that we will lose some of the 'feel' properties that the silicone will provide.
We will see once I have some different prototypes together. :)
This is wonderful. I'll make sure to follow your project closely. As for the silicone sheet, does it have name?
Hello,
Do you know where i could find big half cylinder rubber feet like the one in your prototype ?
It seems to be the perfect combination to add weight and stability.
I find "laptop lifts" but they are too thin, they could only work for the front side to keep a low height.
Thank you for your concept, i am gonna work on something like that for my future keyboard.
Thank you for your reply but i didn't speak about the ones you bought but the one you imagine for your design (first picture on the opening post)
Cool ideas!
Regarding the black rubber cylindrical feet: can they just be made to specification? Rubber rods of certain diameter, cut to specified section lengths, then split in half. Double-sided adhesive tape od some sort to attach them to the case.
Swill, what's the latest?
My butterfly keypad arrived sans case, so I need to build one.
I am waiting for my first of 5 pcbs headed my direction. Once I get the first one I will add a lot more details including images etc.
Site looks great swill -- very excited to see where this goes. Good luck!
Updated the OP with this prototype. I will post the pictures here too.
Acrylic back plate, brass threaded inserts, brass male/female standoffs. I will do a silicon pad instead of the standoffs soon, but I will start with this for now. I will also be adding feet at some point soon as well.Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68206;image)Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68208;image)Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68210;image)
Updated the OP with this prototype. I will post the pictures here too.I really like that barebones look!
Acrylic back plate, brass threaded inserts, brass male/female standoffs. I will do a silicon pad instead of the standoffs soon, but I will start with this for now. I will also be adding feet at some point soon as well.Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68206;image)Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68208;image)Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68210;image)
Updated the OP with this prototype. I will post the pictures here too.
Acrylic back plate, brass threaded inserts, brass male/female standoffs. I will do a silicon pad instead of the standoffs soon, but I will start with this for now. I will also be adding feet at some point soon as well.Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68206;image)Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68208;image)Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68210;image)
Are the standoffs screwed into the case or did you glue them?
Tonight I tapped an M2 hole in acrylic to see how the threads would hold up. I was able to tighten the screw enough to strip it completely and the threads did not budge. After removing the screw (from the other side with pliers), I was able to use a new screw in the hole as if nothing had happened.
I have to admit, I was not expecting this to hold up nearly as well as it has. I was fully expecting to have this fail dramatically. This is a really promising result because it simplifies the acrylic version of this case dramatically. The threaded inserts were a total PITA, so if I don't have to use them, that is awesome. The threaded inserts were hard to find (in M2) and they were not cheap, so that is a huge bonus.
The tap was $7 on ebay (I already had a handle that works), so that is a pretty good investment. This is how I planned to do Aluminum and Steel anyway, so its nice that I can just use the same process...
Now I need to see how thin I can go with the acrylic before the threads become a problem. I don't think it is realistic to do the acrylic less than 1/8" anyway, so I actually expect this to work pretty well. This test was with 5mm acrylic (just over 3/16").
Here is a pic...Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68566;image)
Tonight I tapped an M2 hole in acrylic to see how the threads would hold up. I was able to tighten the screw enough to strip it completely and the threads did not budge. After removing the screw (from the other side with pliers), I was able to use a new screw in the hole as if nothing had happened.
I have to admit, I was not expecting this to hold up nearly as well as it has. I was fully expecting to have this fail dramatically. This is a really promising result because it simplifies the acrylic version of this case dramatically. The threaded inserts were a total PITA, so if I don't have to use them, that is awesome. The threaded inserts were hard to find (in M2) and they were not cheap, so that is a huge bonus.
The tap was $7 on ebay (I already had a handle that works), so that is a pretty good investment. This is how I planned to do Aluminum and Steel anyway, so its nice that I can just use the same process...
Now I need to see how thin I can go with the acrylic before the threads become a problem. I don't think it is realistic to do the acrylic less than 1/8" anyway, so I actually expect this to work pretty well. This test was with 5mm acrylic (just over 3/16").
Here is a pic...Show Image(http://geekhack.org/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=51872.0;attach=68566;image)
The minimum thickness I would recommend would be about 3mm or 1.5x fastener diameter for tapping into acrylic. For threads in steel you don't gain any extra pull out strength once you get over 1x the diameter in length of the threaded hole. So the 1.5x just includes a bit of a safety factor. Though if I remember that was with drilling the hole for a 75% thread depth. There is almost 0 gain in pull out strength going over 75% thread depth though there can be some benefits depending on application. I would also limit acres removal and insertion in strength critical areas with acrylic threads.
For what its worth in an old project from an old hobby, I had to tap a hole that was an inch deep. Material was 1/16" aluminum (and countersunk) on both sides of a piect of 7/8" of hard maple. I threaded this with 6-32 and I stripped the hex head before the threads let go. And the screws only went half away through.
This looks awesome!
I look forward to the pictures.. and being able to buy some of these perhaps! It would be nice to be able to pick up a nice minimalist 'case' that doesn't cost more than my keyboards!
Nice.
Have you though about a thin layer of sticky rubber underneath the wedge? That would keep the keyboard absolutely still on a desk.
- Ron | samwisekoi
We do need to find a more, um, attractive form of the silicon layer, however.
I'm designing a gamepad with some subset of a 36-key matrix, and I'd very much like its profile to match a keyboard, which means a wedge shape. Cost is very much an issue, so CNC and similar methods are right out. But YOUR design concept could work very well; certainly much better than any of the acrylic sandwich designs running around.
But what acrylic does have in its favor is cost. I wonder if there is a way to get the wooden wedge made cheaply from plastic. You could have a piece of acrylic or aluminum to hold the PCB, so structural strength would not be needed for the wedge itself.
We do need to find a more, um, attractive form of the silicon layer, however.
Does it come in basic black?
- Ron | samwisekoi
We do need to find a more, um, attractive form of the silicon layer, however.
For myself I think the hazard-orange is part of the charm of the whole thing. I very nearly made something like this for my Ergodox (links in the IC thread I started, IIRC). Then I sorta roped myself into buying stainless layers instead. Thanks, JD ... I'd have done that if he hadn't written up the spacers.
I think I'll be ordering a Sprit 60% white pcb, and I really like the idea of putting it on to a 'topless' case like the ones pictured here. Could use more info about the silicon sheets too!
Really digging that case swill, nice job :D