[IC] donut81 MX/Alps 75% PCB

[donutcat]

This is a pretty basic IC for this 75% PCB that is a collaboration between myself and @amtra5 on the #mechkeys Discord. I've already received a good deal of interest on Reddit and have already done a Rev1 prototype run.




While this initial version utilized a Teensy2.0 for the sake of easy and lower costs for a small run, Rev2 is utilizing an SMD Atmega32u4.



Features list:
 - 75% form factor
 - MX and Alps style compatibility
 - Several layout support options, picture below
 - WS2812B strip support
 - Support for QMK/TMK/Soarer's firmware
 - Normal and rotated Alps ISO Enter

More

Layout options:


The initial prototype run was a success, though at this point it was mainly a proof of concept as we've changed the controller in Rev2. Sometime soon I will be doing the Rev2 prototype run with full SMD assembly and will most likely have extra PCBs for sale afterwards to help make up for some of the prototyping costs.

For the eventual GB, I am currently in contact with several custom case makers in the community in order to provide some simple but nice cases for the first round GB, and perhaps a fancier case option available for future rounds.


4-27-2017 Update:

I've ordered the Rev2 prototypes and they should arrive mid next week going by previous shipping times. This is the first test of our SMD controller design and I'll actually be doing the assembly myself since low quantity SMD assembly setup costs scared me. Switching to SMD we've also managed to shrink down the PCB size slightly and moved the USB port, so I think now that it should actually fit into any aftermarket case that a B.mini PCB could fit into, barring the screwhole cutouts that the B.mini has on its edge. I need B.mini dimensions though to be certain, so if anyone could get ahold of them that would be nifty.

Bump from hell up in this *****. I finally found someone to do the SMD soldering on the 2nd prototype and I'll have in on hand to test in a couple days. As soon as that happens I can work with my case makers and try to get case options available to order when the PCB GB goes live. On a related note, I've contacted Matias about possibly setting up a 75% Alps keyset to GB alongside the PCB. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like Matias is very receptive to business inquiries as it took several tries to get my email through their spam filter. They have yet to reply. In the meantime I've considered going to SP to get an Alps 75% set going, in either DSA or DCS. While I don't agree with some of their business choices or some of their past interactions with the community, working with them would mean a cooler looking set and the chance to do an MX companion set at the same time.

New layout options:


I've got another IC form here https://goo.gl/forms/PabRvK8KlnrgMaM32 for a little more feedback.

As always, suggestions and thoughts are welcome.

[donutcat]

Update from the main post:
Rev2 prototypes on the way, I'll be doing the SMD assembly, PCB should now fit almost any case a B.mini PCB will, but I need someone to measure a B.mini PCB to be certain.

[merlin64]

From one cat to another, this is awesome!!

[Robotical]

I really like how this PCB gives the option to separate the function keys. Definitely a fantastic call. Do you have a pricing estimate?

[donutcat]

I really like how this PCB gives the option to separate the function keys. Definitely a fantastic call. Do you have a pricing estimate?

I'm really aiming to keep the base PCB price under $40 since I feel that's a good spot for something like this that doesn't have some of the fancier features of other boards but is looking to be a good budget option. Quantity is the real enemy here though since SMD assembly cost is quite high at lower quantities.

[aggroxcraig]

I was secretly wishing for a keeb in the shape of a donut when I saw this thread.

Looks awesome regardless.

[smithyithy]

I'm definitely into this one dude. My question would be - case support? Is there a 'universal' standard for 75% cases like there is for 60% 'Poker' cases?

I've found acrylic / sandwich cases in 75% but I'd like proper aluminium if possible. Just wondering if you know what this PCB could fit into?

[terrifictorkoal]

Since it'll fit the same cases as the b.mini, does this mean it'll fit inside the KBD75 case? Because an alps kbd75 sounds really attractive right about now - especially with ALPS granite being confirmed (given that we can get a plate cut of course).

[donutcat]

I'm definitely into this one dude. My question would be - case support? Is there a 'universal' standard for 75% cases like there is for 60% 'Poker' cases?

I've found acrylic / sandwich cases in 75% but I'd like proper aluminium if possible. Just wondering if you know what this PCB could fit into?

AFAIK there is no real "standard" yet for 75%. This PCB will be plate mount only for this version at least, so in theory any case that mounts the plate to the case and has the USB port between the 1st and 2nd column will work. I would eventually like to do a "fancy" aluminum case for it that would also fit B.mini PCBs as well for the sake of options and reaching a wider audience.

Since it'll fit the same cases as the b.mini, does this mean it'll fit inside the KBD75 case? Because an alps kbd75 sounds really attractive right about now - especially with ALPS granite being confirmed (given that we can get a plate cut of course).

So, while the B.mini PCB fits the KBD75, it uses standoffs to do so, whereas the donut81 will more than likely be plate-mount only, meaning that the plate needs to mount to the case in order for it to be used. By saying it fits cases that the B.mini does, I was referring more to physical dimensions.

[smithyithy]

Since it'll fit the same cases as the b.mini, does this mean it'll fit inside the KBD75 case? Because an alps kbd75 sounds really attractive right about now - especially with ALPS granite being confirmed (given that we can get a plate cut of course).

You read my mind 

[xondat]

AFAIK there is no real "standard" yet for 75%. This PCB will be plate mount only for this version at least, so in theory any case that mounts the plate to the case and has the USB port between the 1st and 2nd column will work.

What's stopping people from saying "this is the standard now"? The Octagon and TX75 both use centered ports, but I think every other board has it between the 1st and 2nd columns so it'd be useful to establish it as the standard.

[smithyithy]

I think it's partially down to 75% boards being less common than 60% so there are still variations. If we could buy those AliExpress aluminium 'Pok3r' cases in 75% dimensions it'd be brilliant 

[donutcat]

Bump from hell up in this *****. I finally found someone to do the SMD soldering on the 2nd prototype and I'll have in on hand to test in a couple days. As soon as that happens I can work with my case makers and try to get case options available to order when the PCB GB goes live. On a related note, I've contacted Matias about possibly setting up a 75% Alps keyset to GB alongside the PCB. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like Matias is very receptive to business inquiries as it took several tries to get my email through their spam filter. They have yet to reply. In the meantime I've considered going to SP to get an Alps 75% set going, in either DSA or DCS. While I don't agree with some of their business choices or some of their past interactions with the community, working with them would mean a cooler looking set and the chance to do an MX companion set at the same time.

I've got another IC form here https://goo.gl/forms/PabRvK8KlnrgMaM32 for a little more feedback.

As always, suggestions and thoughts are welcome.

[calavera]

This has nothing to do with user quantastrophus own 75% pcb/plate gb on reddit, right?

[donutcat]

This has nothing to do with user quantastrophus own 75% pcb/plate gb on reddit, right?

No, this is a completely separate project that has been in the works since the beginning of the year, and is meant to be its own board rather than just a PCB for an existing case.

[duynguyenle]

The possibility of stagger F-row excites me greatly, as it's one of my minor gripes with the more usual 75% layout: one indistinct block of keys that makes it a little difficult to accurately locate the precise F key I'm trying to hit without actually looking.

[donutcat]

Fully functional prototype was received and tested. At this point logistics for PCB production and assembly need to be worked on, as well as working with case makers. Matias still hasn't returned contact, so I'm considering them a lost cause and moving to contact SP about the possibility of a set.

[Rykno]

I like it Donut!

Any thoughts on an Alps keycap group buy or case compatibility?

[donutcat]

I like it Donut!

Any thoughts on an Alps keycap group buy or case compatibility?

Definitely wanting to get an Alps keyset run since the short right shift is quite uncommon. As for the cases, my original plan was going through case makers in the community in order for them to supply cases suited to individual needs. After thinking back through thoughts on cases, I might be looking to find a large-order plastic cutting service to run the cases through. Going this route, I would be able to get cheaper cases for the Gb, but I would be limited to a "universal" plate design that would be somewhat limited. So in short there's still a bit of work for me to figure out.

[Rykno]

Thanks for the info!

I've been keeping tabs on your project and I love the spacer layout on the F block. Another 75% called ION is in the works that has a similar aesthetic but I would much rather have Alps support for all the quality tactile switches it affords.

If you could line up a high profile case (doesn't have to be aluminum) especially one perhaps without an incline (muh ergonomics) would definitely sway me. A matching keycap set would be icing.


I never did thank you for a pleasant Coniferous group buy.

Thank you.

[pixelpusher]

Also need to sell batches of brown alps to put in this!  Ha!

I can't seem to find any old alps switches.  Maybe the new Matias linears are good though.  Have to check some out

[donutcat]

Some thoughts on the current situation:

Getting a case for the PCB is notably more difficult than previously anticipated due to the fact that MX and Alps will most likely need separate plates to work properly, and then the top row requires 3 different layouts to work and not look just awful. So that would mean 6 different plate designs in theory. I may end up needing to just support a single layout for each of them for the GB and just release the other layouts. This would really be the only way to get MOQ pricing for plate designs. Other than that I'm still scouting for a laser cutting service that would be able to cut the cases for a reasonable cost.

In regards to the keycaps, I was made aware of something I had forgotten in regards to SP's Alps caps: the fact that it's basically necessary to trim/sand the stems on them to avoid ripping your switches apart. The fact that this is even an issue adds to the stack of problems I have with SP and is making me very much consider ignoring them as a possibility. Though that'd mean no Alps caps for the board, so I'll have to think on it.

[pixelpusher]

Some thoughts on the current situation:

Getting a case for the PCB is notably more difficult than previously anticipated due to the fact that MX and Alps will most likely need separate plates to work properly, and then the top row requires 3 different layouts to work and not look just awful. So that would mean 6 different plate designs in theory. I may end up needing to just support a single layout for each of them for the GB and just release the other layouts. This would really be the only way to get MOQ pricing for plate designs. Other than that I'm still scouting for a laser cutting service that would be able to cut the cases for a reasonable cost.

In regards to the keycaps, I was made aware of something I had forgotten in regards to SP's Alps caps: the fact that it's basically necessary to trim/sand the stems on them to avoid ripping your switches apart. The fact that this is even an issue adds to the stack of problems I have with SP and is making me very much consider ignoring them as a possibility. Though that'd mean no Alps caps for the board, so I'll have to think on it.

Looking forward to this board whatever the final details may be.  As someone who recently spent 4 days with an xacto knife to get my alps light cycle caps usable, I hope to god Matias will manufacture some decent alps caps in my lifetime. 

[xtreg]

Is there any progress on this? I am very interested in getting two of these pcbs, if compatible cases, keycaps and stabilizers are readily available.

[donutcat]

This has been a bit on the back burner for a lot of reasons, but we're slowly working on getting it back in progress. Working on the budget96 cases gave me some ideas for reworking the troublesome previous case designs, so I'm looking forward to being able to apply those changes to the project.

[lac29]

Very cool project. I already put down money into an 75SQ but I think the future exploration of 75% layouts is with the f-row up top and the ergonomics of it. I'm wondering if having a slight gap between the numbers row and f-row will be beneficial or not. IMO it's similar to the ergonomic gap that Whitefox's Truefox layout has with the arrow cluster. It took me awhile to really appreciate that gap. At first I thought it was just silly, but after using it for awhile and after using a 75% Keyclack ps2avr ... I realize that these landmark spacings are actually kinda useful.

[waldorf120]

I'm in for a Rev2 with an ATMega chip.