[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.0][img width=300 height=120]https://i.imgur.com/hZpmVKN.png[/img][/url]
dark and depressing.
dark and depressing.
ahh im excitedYeah. Great work crokto. And awesome handoff. Excited to see this come about.
Would be cool if you could have a kit with the same drilled keys as GMK Tex YodaGot the same idea, so +1Show Image(https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/images/products/large_3272_large_texy2gmkcaps_6.jpg)
I should think the people who bought TEX yoda and shinobi would be interested, though not sure how many there are
Nice set, but those renders man! Best ones I've seen so far, you made them yourself?
Nice set, but those renders man! Best ones I've seen so far, you made them yourself?
Looks neat, I'm down for the rgb and accent kit but not really a fan of the black and gray together.
Would be cool if you could have a kit with the same drilled keys as GMK Tex YodaGot the same idea, so +1Show Image(https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/images/products/large_3272_large_texy2gmkcaps_6.jpg)
I should think the people who bought TEX yoda and shinobi would be interested, though not sure how many there are
Also, why no arrow on the numpad and accent enter keys?
in the 40s kit the render shows R2 for the 1.75u enters and tab. should say R3
Come to think of it, neither did Cherry - every OG Cherry double-shot set I've seen (even ones that have icon-only mods) has text-only on numpad enter.
dark and depressing.Just how I like it.
can we add vertical 2u Delete key (same as numpad + key) to Novelties kit? or if Delete legend is not possible, can we use the corresponding key from GMK Dot?
Given the strong historical support from Thinkpad keyboards for ANSI, ISO and ANSISO physical layout variants in their keyboard lines, the "ISO" keys ought to be present in the base kit, I think (vertical "ISO" Enter, 1.25U left Shift, R3 \| and R4 <>). Sticking the (UK-only) ISO support to a separate kit doesn't come off as a good idea, IMHO.
BTW: icon mods: OG or centered? Some people will care to know... a lot. :p
Thanks for including a separate Accents kit. Any chance for getting an ISO Enter with Icon + Text?
WoB uses Icon + Text Mods and so does the included ISO Enters.
Could we get a set that makes this compatible with other GMK alphas?
Since ThinkCaps (right now) is not compatible with any other more advanced ISO sets (NORDE etc.) it would be cool to see a set that would go with existing GMK international alphas (e.g. from GMK WoB)
The Icon Mod Set + Accents is pretty close, but it's missing enough 1.25u for Ctrl, Alt or ISO Shift
Would you consider adding a full modifier set to go with existing alphas?
can we add vertical 2u Delete key (same as numpad + key) to Novelties kit? or if Delete legend is not possible, can we use the corresponding key from GMK Dot?
[...]
I know there are not many boards that support this key but please consider ;D
BTW: icon mods: OG or centered? Some people will care to know... a lot. :p
What's better?
Nice kit and even more nice of you providing a low cost accent only kit for existing blacks in use. Very few GB's leaders are so considered. Unfortunately.
Could we get a set that makes this compatible with other GMK alphas?
Since ThinkCaps (right now) is not compatible with any other more advanced ISO sets (NORDE etc.) it would be cool to see a set that would go with existing GMK international alphas (e.g. from GMK WoB)
The Icon Mod Set + Accents is pretty close, but it's missing enough 1.25u for Ctrl, Alt or ISO Shift
Would you consider adding a full modifier set to go with existing alphas?
Are you talking about the Icon mods kit? It is compatible with other N9 sets (eg. Dolch). Adding the complete modifiers (Control, Alt, etc.) would be quite redundant for everyone getting the base set.
Sorry, I'm not sure I completely understood your question... can you please specify what you meant?
Thanks for including R3 PgUp, R4 PgDn. Please also include basic ISO support in the base kit (ISO Enter, R3 1u \|, R4 1u <>, R4 1.25u Shift).
The R1 End and PgDn keys can be moved from the base kit to the numpad kit, since they are always used only on layouts that have numpads (1800, CP, 96-key).
Optionally, you could also move R1 1u Backspace, the second R4 1u Ctrl and the second R4 1u Alt to the ortho & 40s kit. The reason being that you almost never see 1u Backspace on ≥60% nowadays (you can add a copy to the Minila kit, since that keyboard uses it); no modern ≥60% layout uses 2× 1u Ctrl; and the second 1u Alt isn't needed for ≥60% because there are no 1.5u Code keys in the base kit. Alternatively, you can keep the second 1u Alt and add a 1.5u Code, which together with the 1.5u Fn can be used to cover Mac and OG-style HHKB bottom rows.
Could we get a set that makes this compatible with other GMK alphas?
Since ThinkCaps (right now) is not compatible with any other more advanced ISO sets (NORDE etc.) it would be cool to see a set that would go with existing GMK international alphas (e.g. from GMK WoB)
The Icon Mod Set + Accents is pretty close, but it's missing enough 1.25u for Ctrl, Alt or ISO Shift
Would you consider adding a full modifier set to go with existing alphas?
Are you talking about the Icon mods kit? It is compatible with other N9 sets (eg. Dolch). Adding the complete modifiers (Control, Alt, etc.) would be quite redundant for everyone getting the base set.
Sorry, I'm not sure I completely understood your question... can you please specify what you meant?
I was thinking about adding the missing keys as Icon Mods.
The base set right now only has a "Ctrl" key, but there is no Icon variant to replace the Ctrl key. The Icon Mod Set contains the classics, "icon only" Shift, Win key etc.
If you would add Icon varaints for all mods (ctrl, alt, etc.), like the in the Hiragana Micons set, it would make all existing GMK WoB out there compatible with ThinkCaps without the need to purchase the base set:Show Image(https://mykeyboard.eu/media/cache/9e/96/9e96eafa97d8e36086fdac07781779d0.jpg)
I have to be honest and say that ISO is not quite yet figured out. It's separate from the base kit for two reasons:
- Base is icon+text and ISO is icon only (as is historically)
- ISO sales are usually disproportionately low; why force everyone to buy it?
I know CandyKeys wants a NorDe kit, so it (ISO) may very well end up in the international kit.
BTW: icon mods: OG or centered? Some people will care to know... a lot.
What's better?
RE: ISO; still undecided!
You are right about moving the End and PgDn to Numpad. I put them in Base to offset the cost of the Numpad kit, but logically they should be in there.
Since there is no Extension/Specialty kit for this one (and Ortho & 40's may become a standalone set), we cannot move too many keys out of Base. I aimed at a complete 60%+ set (2u Shift and so on), and because I was specifically asked for a split (1u) backspace in the MT3 SNES IC, I figured we should include it here as well.
You are also correct about the number of 1u Ctrl/Alt keys in Base. The issue is that I'm not really a fan of the "Code" keys, therefore I removed the two 1.5u Codes from Base in favour of the 1.5u Meta (◇) in Icon mods.
That being said, the main reason for leaving the extra 1u Ctrl and Alt keys in Base is to again offset the cost of the Ortho & 40's extension. If we go with a standalone Ortho & 40's set, then we could remove (at least) the extra 1u Ctrl.
Hopefully this reply if not too confusing. ;D
I have to be honest and say that ISO is not quite yet figured out. It's separate from the base kit for two reasons:
- Base is icon+text and ISO is icon only (as is historically)
- ISO sales are usually disproportionately low; why force everyone to buy it?
I know CandyKeys wants a NorDe kit, so it (ISO) may very well end up in the international kit.
While I get the reasoning behind not including ISO Enter in base because it's icon-only (I think that's pretty smart), you also have to keep in mind that “forcing” 4 keys in the base kit has a much smaller relative impact on pricing than the current setup (in other words, the larger the kit, the smaller the price per key).
Whereas putting the 4 ISO keys in base would result in a $2 increase to the kit's price (number taken from actual GMK quotes where I did this for a similarly sized base kit), the current setup forces ISO users to also purchase $40–$50 worth of icon mods to get the keys that they need to be able to use their boards. In other words, you are effectively discouraging most ISO users from buying the set at all.
(Disclaimer: I'm not an ISO user, I just like to see kiting done in a sensible and considerate manner.)
Side note: The same logic could be applied to the R1 End, PgDn keys, which are only used by numpad users, and numpad kits also sell fairly poorly (see Dvorcol's numpad take rate stats for GMK sets). So they shouldn't be forced on everyone either, if you want to look at it that way.
Anyway, your idea of putting the 4 basic ISO keys in a NorDe kit is slightly better, but still isn't great for pretty much the same reasons as above. Namely, most ISO users are happy with basic support and don't want to spend a lot of money to buy an intl compatibility kit. This is why you always see these kits sell poorly. Rest assured that there are many more ISO users than sales of these kits would suggest.
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I'm not really happy either with the current placement of the ISO keys.
I think the reason why GMK numpads don't sell currently is because they are incomplete, ie. setup for full-size/1800/96-key boards and not actual separate numpads.
Thanks for including a separate Accents kit. Any chance for getting an ISO Enter with Icon + Text?
WoB uses Icon + Text Mods and so does the included ISO Enters.
It's more convenient to offer only one type of ISO Enter, because they come in pairs (blue and grey). Again, we're not really decided on ISO yet. I was hoping nobody would ask for the icon+text ISO Enter ;D
Thanks for including a separate Accents kit. Any chance for getting an ISO Enter with Icon + Text?
WoB uses Icon + Text Mods and so does the included ISO Enters.
It's more convenient to offer only one type of ISO Enter, because they come in pairs (blue and grey). Again, we're not really decided on ISO yet. I was hoping nobody would ask for the icon+text ISO Enter ;D
Really sad to hear this. That destroys the whole compatibility with already existing sets (WoB in this case) for me.
But well, that's the ISO-life...
Please also include basic ISO support in the base kit (ISO Enter, R3 1u \|, R4 1u <>, R4 1.25u Shift).
Please also include basic ISO support in the base kit (ISO Enter, R3 1u \|, R4 1u <>, R4 1.25u Shift).
Do you have a reference for this layout?
Please also include basic ISO support in the base kit (ISO Enter, R3 1u \|, R4 1u <>, R4 1.25u Shift).
Do you have a reference for this layout?
Ahem... http://www.farah.cl/Keyboardery/A-Visual-Comparison-of-Different-National-Layouts/#enUS (http://www.farah.cl/Keyboardery/A-Visual-Comparison-of-Different-National-Layouts/#enUS)
Please also include basic ISO support in the base kit (ISO Enter, R3 1u \|, R4 1u <>, R4 1.25u Shift).
Do you have a reference for this layout?
Ahem... http://www.farah.cl/Keyboardery/A-Visual-Comparison-of-Different-National-Layouts/#enUS (http://www.farah.cl/Keyboardery/A-Visual-Comparison-of-Different-National-Layouts/#enUS)
Please also include basic ISO support in the base kit (ISO Enter, R3 1u \|, R4 1u <>, R4 1.25u Shift).
Do you have a reference for this layout?
Ahem... http://www.farah.cl/Keyboardery/A-Visual-Comparison-of-Different-National-Layouts/#enUS (http://www.farah.cl/Keyboardery/A-Visual-Comparison-of-Different-National-Layouts/#enUS)
Oh, it's your page! Sorry, I'm out of the loop.
I actually came across your "Why do keycap sets have so many copies of the backslash-pipe key?" page on Google once and thought it was quite funny. :))
Hey voodoo and Croktopus,
First of all, thanks so much for moving forward with this great idea for a set!!
I’ve got some concerns with the new proposal of an “Accents” kit.
The current kit design is missing several keys that were present in the original Croktopus-authored IC. They are enclosed in red rectangles in the attached image.Show Image(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200511/3eea37b6971f25a84150ad53cde5bb03.plist)
I think these keys would really make the Accents a much better buy for WoB owners such as myself. When used alongside WoB, they make any keyboard more closely resemble the original Thinkpad keyboard. Remember several keys on Thinkpads had blue secondary legends. The missing keys would really complete the package.
Is there any chance to include those keys in the Accents kit?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
can we add vertical 2u Delete key (same as numpad + key) to Novelties kit? or if Delete legend is not possible, can we use the corresponding key from GMK Dot?
[...]
I know there are not many boards that support this key but please consider ;D
Is there any?
can we add vertical 2u Delete key (same as numpad + key) to Novelties kit? or if Delete legend is not possible, can we use the corresponding key from GMK Dot?
[...]
I know there are not many boards that support this key but please consider ;D
Is there any?
yes,
Duck TC-V3 (http://)
Timber Wolf (http://) (from Croktopus)
do you believe me if I say I have the urge to create a board which include this key? :D
The current kit design is missing several keys that were present in the original Croktopus-authored IC.
Love this. A lot. My only issue is that to get Alpha coloured split spacebars (2.25, 1.25, 2.75u all convex) you have to purchase the 40s kit and the minila kit. Would be nicer if only one kit was necessary (and ideally a small one at that!) Maybe put split alpha-coloured bars in the spacebar kit?
I'm very interested in this, but I need to know, for the Accent kit, and the RGB kit, are the icons centered ?
non-centered certainly is better for compatibility with other sets, WoB for exemple
[mention]voodoo6k [/mention]
Love it & hope that 40% specific kit w/ alphas & mods included makes it b/c I'll buy it. Then I'll just need the numberpad kit. EVERYONE PLEASE VOTE THE 40% SPECIFIC IN!!!!!
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Would join just to get my hands on a 3u spacebar!
If you would add Icon varaints for all mods (ctrl, alt, etc.), like the in the Hiragana Micons set, it would make all existing GMK WoB out there compatible with ThinkCaps without the need to purchase the base setYes pls! Offering a set as a compliment to GMK WoB would be awesome and an instant buy from me. I already own the candykeys WoB version and would love to be able to "spice it up" (which feels weird to say given this is thinkpad-inspired :P) without spending a ton on a full set where most of the keys are duplicates of ones I already own.
Why use CP for the legends? If you go with WS1 across the board, it offers more compatibility with other GMK sets (Originative Dolch, WoB, Burgundy).
I just remembered I already have this set in WS1, ;D
(Attachment Link)
I suggest to ask GMK for samples of the icon mods (particularly the Enter keys) when the order has been submitted. Just to assure that the long arrow molds have been fixed.
Uh oh. I didn't realize this wouldn't match the BoW Colevrak+ kits that recently ran on Novelkeys. Personally, I have way too much QWERTY sets and not enough complete Dvorak ones to match my actual keymap, so I'm less likley to join now since the whites don't match. That's a shame, because there are a lot of great kits here. I respect your choice tho.Why use CP for the legends? If you go with WS1 across the board, it offers more compatibility with other GMK sets (Originative Dolch, WoB, Burgundy).
I just remembered I already have this set in WS1, ;D
(Attachment Link)
This is my opinion, but I think WS1 is not the best choice for legends.
First, you mention Originative Dolch and Drop WoB; what about OG Dolch and Cherry WoB? These are CP and account for arguably more sets.
Second, WS1 is much more translucent than CP (and other colours in general). The result is a milky legend that is less sharp in most lighting situations. In other words: CP just looks better.
Lastly, this is more of an OG set. Those (like yourself) who want to combine WS1 Dolch and WoB, or WoB only, can purchase the accent kit which will have the WS1 legends for this exact reason.
Hopefully this clears things up.
Uh oh. I didn't realize this wouldn't match the BoW Colevrak+ kits that recently ran on Novelkeys. Personally, I have way too much QWERTY sets and not enough complete Dvorak ones to match my actual keymap, so I'm less likley to join now since the whites don't match. That's a shame, because there are a lot of great kits here.Why use CP for the legends? If you go with WS1 across the board, it offers more compatibility with other GMK sets (Originative Dolch, WoB, Burgundy).
I just remembered I already have this set in WS1, ;D
(Attachment Link)
This is my opinion, but I think WS1 is not the best choice for legends.
First, you mention Originative Dolch and Drop WoB; what about OG Dolch and Cherry WoB? These are CP and account for arguably more sets.
Second, WS1 is much more translucent than CP (and other colours in general). The result is a milky legend that is less sharp in most lighting situations. In other words: CP just looks better.
Lastly, this is more of an OG set. Those (like yourself) who want to combine WS1 Dolch and WoB, or WoB only, can purchase the accent kit which will have the WS1 legends for this exact reason.
Hopefully this clears things up.
Got a Tex Yoda II & a Shinobi in the mail.Looks neat, I'm down for the rgb and accent kit but not really a fan of the black and gray together.
Just to be clear, as a general response, the black is the same as WoB (CR), and dark grey is the same as the GMK Dolch modifiers (N9), very common colours to maximize compatibility.
This is basically like inverted (Sky) MoDo (https://i.redd.it/x3sa8qm3i2g41.jpg) with white legends.Would be cool if you could have a kit with the same drilled keys as GMK Tex YodaGot the same idea, so +1Show Image(https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/images/products/large_3272_large_texy2gmkcaps_6.jpg)
I should think the people who bought TEX yoda and shinobi would be interested, though not sure how many there are
No promises, but we can look into this...
Got a Tex Yoda II & a Shinobi in the mail.Looks neat, I'm down for the rgb and accent kit but not really a fan of the black and gray together.
Just to be clear, as a general response, the black is the same as WoB (CR), and dark grey is the same as the GMK Dolch modifiers (N9), very common colours to maximize compatibility.
This is basically like inverted (Sky) MoDo (https://i.redd.it/x3sa8qm3i2g41.jpg) with white legends.Would be cool if you could have a kit with the same drilled keys as GMK Tex YodaGot the same idea, so +1Show Image(https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/images/products/large_3272_large_texy2gmkcaps_6.jpg)
I should think the people who bought TEX yoda and shinobi would be interested, though not sure how many there are
No promises, but we can look into this...
For the Shinobi, GMK keys would be amazing, but I think the main challenge is the 0.75u keys at the top.
For both, I wonder if it would make more sense to have a 3D-printable jig that can hold the center keys in place for DIY drilling. On the other hand, AFAIK those special Tex Yoda sets from GMK came with the keys drilled, so they are presumably capable of doing it again.
1.25u R4 convex wasn't available when that GMK Tex Yoda keyset premiered. Not sure, but could be the same case for 1u R4C too. Now that both are available, it seems to me they'd be the preffered combo.Got a Tex Yoda II & a Shinobi in the mail.Looks neat, I'm down for the rgb and accent kit but not really a fan of the black and gray together.
Just to be clear, as a general response, the black is the same as WoB (CR), and dark grey is the same as the GMK Dolch modifiers (N9), very common colours to maximize compatibility.
This is basically like inverted (Sky) MoDo (https://i.redd.it/x3sa8qm3i2g41.jpg) with white legends.Would be cool if you could have a kit with the same drilled keys as GMK Tex YodaGot the same idea, so +1Show Image(https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/images/products/large_3272_large_texy2gmkcaps_6.jpg)
I should think the people who bought TEX yoda and shinobi would be interested, though not sure how many there are
No promises, but we can look into this...
For the Shinobi, GMK keys would be amazing, but I think the main challenge is the 0.75u keys at the top.
For both, I wonder if it would make more sense to have a 3D-printable jig that can hold the center keys in place for DIY drilling. On the other hand, AFAIK those special Tex Yoda sets from GMK came with the keys drilled, so they are presumably capable of doing it again.
Shinobi is not possible.
As for the Yoda, if we can get our hands on the machined G H B keys, then adding the spaces should be a no brainer.
I assume 2 x 1.25u and 1 x 1u convex is preferred for the thumb buttons?
Uh oh. I didn't realize this wouldn't match the BoW Colevrak+ kits that recently ran on Novelkeys. Personally, I have way too much QWERTY sets and not enough complete Dvorak ones to match my actual keymap, so I'm less likley to join now since the whites don't match. That's a shame, because there are a lot of great kits here.Why use CP for the legends? If you go with WS1 across the board, it offers more compatibility with other GMK sets (Originative Dolch, WoB, Burgundy).
I just remembered I already have this set in WS1, ;D
(Attachment Link)
This is my opinion, but I think WS1 is not the best choice for legends.
First, you mention Originative Dolch and Drop WoB; what about OG Dolch and Cherry WoB? These are CP and account for arguably more sets.
Second, WS1 is much more translucent than CP (and other colours in general). The result is a milky legend that is less sharp in most lighting situations. In other words: CP just looks better.
Lastly, this is more of an OG set. Those (like yourself) who want to combine WS1 Dolch and WoB, or WoB only, can purchase the accent kit which will have the WS1 legends for this exact reason.
Hopefully this clears things up.
Sorry. That's why we provide the accent kit.
Edit: You can refer to this post: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=99984.msg2766769#msg2766769
If you would add Icon varaints for all mods (ctrl, alt, etc.), like the in the Hiragana Micons set, it would make all existing GMK WoB out there compatible with ThinkCaps without the need to purchase the base setYes pls! Offering a set as a compliment to GMK WoB would be awesome and an instant buy from me. I already own the candykeys WoB version and would love to be able to "spice it up" (which feels weird to say given this is thinkpad-inspired :P) without spending a ton on a full set where most of the keys are duplicates of ones I already own.
I know CandyKeys wants a NorDe kit, so it (ISO) may very well end up in the international kit.
Imagine a set of these that fit a Model M13
Also, why no arrow on the numpad and accent enter keys?
I don't think IBM or Lenovo ever put an arrow on their numpad enter keys.
Also, why no arrow on the numpad and accent enter keys?
I don't think IBM or Lenovo ever put an arrow on their numpad enter keys.
For that matter, the numpad on IBM keyboards always had * and / (instead of Cherry's × and ÷ symbols).
Two humble requests: adding US-ISO to the ISO kit, and the more important one:
since you are trying to capture the old school feel, imo the old numpad icons ("/" and "*") would be better suited for this set.
I do prefer "/ *" on the numpad. As mentioned before, I'm not really a fan of "Code" as an OS key. Not fond of 1.5u Backspace either. Nit picky things.
I try to strike the right balance of OG and trendy. This is more of a Cherry/IBM hybrid. The symbols fit better with the icon mods.
Code
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I try to strike the right balance of OG and trendy. This is more of a Cherry/IBM hybrid. The symbols fit better with the icon mods.
The set not being a faithful representation of the OG board is the reason I’m not joining this GB.
Hopefully it gets run faithfully some day in the not-so-distant future.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I try to strike the right balance of OG and trendy. This is more of a Cherry/IBM hybrid. The symbols fit better with the icon mods.
Speaking of which, why haven't you gotten rid of the (rightly maligned) "Windows" icons/symbols yet? Generally speaking, we all agree that any logo is better. And specially on a set inspired by IBM(/Lenovo)'s keyboards.
The main motivation behind combining the ISO and icon modifier kits was that offering both icon+text and icon-only ISO options would require 4 vertical Enter keys in total (2 blue + 2 grey) to retain compatibility with the RGB modifiers.
We decided on icon-only (for now...) because that's how IBM, Cherry and most other manufacturers did it, historically. Thus moving ISO to the icon modifier kit was logical (and helps meeting MOQ for both). In addition, moving it there allows us to include more keys such as Alt Gr, which I like seeing.
In hindsight, it does look like we're "forcing" the icon modifiers onto the international users. I'm trying to find another solution. Sorry about the bad wording, and thanks for the picture!
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I try to strike the right balance of OG and trendy. This is more of a Cherry/IBM hybrid. The symbols fit better with the icon mods.
Speaking of which, why haven't you gotten rid of the (rightly maligned) "Windows" icons/symbols yet? Generally speaking, we all agree that any logo is better. And specially on a set inspired by IBM(/Lenovo)'s keyboards.
I do appreciate the tough love we get around here! Some people like the Windows keys (myself included).
Did you want me to substitute them for Meta ◇ symbols? I actually thought I was doing everyone a favour by not including the Windows keys in the base set... Have you noticed that they are optional?
I feel like you're trying to checkmate me here... I'm waiting for this: "No, they are not! Because us international users are forced to buy the icon modifiers!" ;)
[...]
Well, I like the icon modifiers (except the Windows logos!), so that's actually fine by me! :cool:
[...]
[...]
Well, I like the icon modifiers (except the Windows logos!), so that's actually fine by me! :cool:
[...]
So why are we arguing? :p
I hate to quote someone out of context, but the two biggest proponents (in this thread) for base set ISO are konstantin and yourself:
konstantin said it was "smart" to put ISO with icon mods, and you're actually fine with it?
[...]
Well, I like the icon modifiers (except the Windows logos!), so that's actually fine by me! :cool:
[...]
So why are we arguing? :p
This IS geekhack, is it not? ;)I hate to quote someone out of context, but the two biggest proponents (in this thread) for base set ISO are konstantin and yourself:
konstantin said it was "smart" to put ISO with icon mods, and you're actually fine with it?
As compromises go, this is workable. I still think the "minimal ISO" subset (short left Shift, R4 <>, R3 \| and one vertical Enter) ought to always be in the base kit.
I have posted on this previously and do not want to be repetitive, so this is the second and last time that I will bother you with this: You have to take care of preventing the irregular legends for icon modifiers to be produced. In particular, the long arrow in the enter key. GMK has stated that those legends being irregular is just normal, which is not the case with OG Cherry keys.
1.25u R4 convex wasn't available when that GMK Tex Yoda keyset premiered. Not sure, but could be the same case for 1u R4C too. Now that both are available, it seems to me they'd be the preferred combo.Got a Tex Yoda II & a Shinobi in the mail.Looks neat, I'm down for the rgb and accent kit but not really a fan of the black and gray together.
Just to be clear, as a general response, the black is the same as WoB (CR), and dark grey is the same as the GMK Dolch modifiers (N9), very common colours to maximize compatibility.
This is basically like inverted (Sky) MoDo (https://i.redd.it/x3sa8qm3i2g41.jpg) with white legends.Would be cool if you could have a kit with the same drilled keys as GMK Tex YodaGot the same idea, so +1Show Image(https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/images/products/large_3272_large_texy2gmkcaps_6.jpg)
I should think the people who bought TEX yoda and shinobi would be interested, though not sure how many there are
No promises, but we can look into this...
For the Shinobi, GMK keys would be amazing, but I think the main challenge is the 0.75u keys at the top.
For both, I wonder if it would make more sense to have a 3D-printable jig that can hold the center keys in place for DIY drilling. On the other hand, AFAIK those special Tex Yoda sets from GMK came with the keys drilled, so they are presumably capable of doing it again.
Shinobi is not possible.
As for the Yoda, if we can get our hands on the machined G H B keys, then adding the spaces should be a no brainer.
I assume 2 x 1.25u and 1 x 1u convex is preferred for the thumb buttons?
I hate to quote someone out of context, but the two biggest proponents (in this thread) for base set ISO are konstantin and yourself:
konstantin said it was "smart" to put ISO with icon mods, and you're actually fine with it?
but lmk what you think about the System/Sys suggestion.QuoteCode
Are you a cashier? ;D
I think the best compromise for a set is to go for the "English (US), terminal style" keys added to the base kit (1.25U left Shift, R4 <>, R3 \| and (at least) one vertical Enter key); this allows proper and complete support for one national layout (English (US), over an ISO, ANSI or ANSISO keyboard) and avoids the "backslash-pipe duplication" some people dislike.
Any chance of adding some of the novelties to the add-on pack? Specifically the blue fn keys and media keys in WS1 on CR?
1.25u R4 convex wasn't available when that GMK Tex Yoda keyset premiered. Not sure, but could be the same case for 1u R4C too. Now that both are available, it seems to me they'd be the preferred combo.Got a Tex Yoda II & a Shinobi in the mail.Looks neat, I'm down for the rgb and accent kit but not really a fan of the black and gray together.
Just to be clear, as a general response, the black is the same as WoB (CR), and dark grey is the same as the GMK Dolch modifiers (N9), very common colours to maximize compatibility.
This is basically like inverted (Sky) MoDo (https://i.redd.it/x3sa8qm3i2g41.jpg) with white legends.Would be cool if you could have a kit with the same drilled keys as GMK Tex YodaGot the same idea, so +1Show Image(https://mechanicalkeyboards.com/shop/images/products/large_3272_large_texy2gmkcaps_6.jpg)
I should think the people who bought TEX yoda and shinobi would be interested, though not sure how many there are
No promises, but we can look into this...
For the Shinobi, GMK keys would be amazing, but I think the main challenge is the 0.75u keys at the top.
For both, I wonder if it would make more sense to have a 3D-printable jig that can hold the center keys in place for DIY drilling. On the other hand, AFAIK those special Tex Yoda sets from GMK came with the keys drilled, so they are presumably capable of doing it again.
Shinobi is not possible.
As for the Yoda, if we can get our hands on the machined G H B keys, then adding the spaces should be a no brainer.
I assume 2 x 1.25u and 1 x 1u convex is preferred for the thumb buttons?
Opened up a Shinobi box today. Yeah, it's definitely not going to work.Too bad! GMK ABS double-shot keycaps would be a nice improvement over the Shinobi's stock Laser-foamed/ablated ones.
- There are 0.75u keys used for the F-row and above, as well as for the arrow cluster below.
- It also uses a very rare 4.5u size spacebar.
- The G, H, and B keys are quite different from the ones produced for the Yoda - more material is removed from the bottoms and top.
- The bottom mouse keys are also all 1.25u instead of the 1.25u+1u+1.25u arrangement found on the Yoda.
Imagine a set of these that fit a Model M13
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=102826.0
yooooo this is sick thanks
pls add Alt Gr to the RGB mods
I put up a project page and poll on Drop:i'm
- Project page: https://drop.com/talk/39383/gmk-think-caps
- Poll: https://drop.com/vote/GMK-ThinkCaps
Even though this is run independently, we'll need it for exposure. Especially if we want all these kits to be made.yooooo this is sick thanks
pls add Alt Gr to the RGB mods
Hey hiney. You're an Alt Gr fan, aren't you...
I have posted on this previously and do not want to be repetitive, so this is the second and last time that I will bother you with this: You have to take care of preventing the irregular legends for icon modifiers to be produced. In particular, the long arrow in the enter key. GMK has stated that those legends being irregular is just normal, which is not the case with OG Cherry keys.
No problem. I think I replied to your comment.I am not really aware of the issue, do you have any pictures of the irregular Enter keys so I can better explain it to GMK?
I think the best compromise for a set is to go for the "English (US), terminal style" keys added to the base kit (1.25U left Shift, R4 <>, R3 \| and (at least) one vertical Enter key); this allows proper and complete support for one national layout (English (US), over an ISO, ANSI or ANSISO keyboard) and avoids the "backslash-pipe duplication" some people dislike.
I agree. I wrote more about this issue here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=90706.msg2894820#msg2894820). I see voodoo seems to be fond of surveys; it includes an interpretation of data from an actual survey! ;)
Those numbers in your post don't add up. In the Imgur link there is only 293 ISO users. Yet somehow your numbers state "244 out of 503 surveyed ISO ...etc etc"
Even taking your numbers at face value.
Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .Yet, it is taking a key away from the UK ISO users which is " 173 out of 503 surveyed ISO users, or 34%." - your figures
Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .If you check the layouts I mentioned in the first footnote in that post again, all of them do in fact use either a R3 \| key or a R4 <> key. This is in line with what I said about them being partially supported, so my original statement is not incorrect.
Those numbers in your post don't add up. In the Imgur link there is only 293 ISO users. Yet somehow your numbers state "244 out of 503 surveyed ISO ...etc etc"
Even taking your numbers at face value.
Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .Yet, it is taking a key away from the UK ISO users which is " 173 out of 503 surveyed ISO users, or 34%." - your figures
Thanks for checking the data yourself and taking the critical approach here — I appreciate it.
At the time of writing that post, the data I had to go off were the respondents' country numbers from the survey. Despite the fact that the total ended up being higher than the number of self-reported ISO users, I decided that this would be good enough, since it's not the exact numbers that matter, but rather the relative distribution between the different countries / national layouts. This is why at first I was reluctant to cite the precise numbers in the post and not just the percentages, but I decided to do so anyway exactly because I wanted others to be able to check my calculations.
In the meantime, I've tried to do my due diligence by reaching out to the author of the 2020 Megasurvey, /u/blockedbyte, to obtain the raw results of the survey. I wanted to do this so I could conduct a more precise analysis by taking into account just the countries/layouts of self-reported ISO users (the 293 you mentioned). However, I've yet to receive a response, and the other person who was involved in the survey, /u/dont_settle, said that they've also been unable to reach the author and get the raw data.
So I'm afraid that the best data we currently have is the country distribution, which is what I used in the post. I believe it to be representative nonetheless since, again, it's the ratios that matter. If I do get the more detailed data from the survey, I'll be sure to update my post accordingly. For the time being, I've edited out the potentially confusing wording about user numbers (thanks for pointing that out).Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .If you check the layouts I mentioned in the first footnote in that post again, all of them do in fact use either a R3 \| key or a R4 <> key. This is in line with what I said about them being partially supported, so my original statement is not incorrect.
…
I also take issue with you (and DeplotedVespene) instead of proposing options to give ALL ISO some compatibility in this thread and others, (E.g. requesting an extra key or side printing like old kits like GMK Muted or having R3 ~# and R4 <> (where 83% of users will have partial compatibility - your numbers (49% + 34%)). you propose to take away compatibility from others
What is the reasoning that supports having the UK kit joined with the Icon Mods set?
The main reasons are:
- Going with icon only follows the almost universal convention that ISO keyboards use icon mods
- The icon mod kit would have to have the ISO Enters and 1.25u Shift anyway
- Alt Gr keys would be omitted from the base set
Recent stats (see dvorcol's posts (https://geekhack.org/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;sa=messages;u=52009)) show that ISO/international kits sell at around 5% of total base sets.
Do you think it is preferable to impose ISO on all buyers, or to impose icon mods on all ISO users?
Namely, most ISO users are happy with basic support and don't want to spend a lot of money to buy an intl compatibility kit. This is why you always see these kits sell poorly. Rest assured that there are many more ISO users than sales of these kits would suggest.I may be wrong, but I think Dvorcol's posts only cover international kit sales.
I copied here some examples of the pictures that show some of the issues. I hope that helps. The most concerning part of the problem is that GMK's did not acknowledge those issues as something that need to be fixed.Sorry to be a dumbass, but what's the issue in these photos? The keys in each look the same to me.
I copied here some examples of the pictures that show some of the issues. I hope that helps. The most concerning part of the problem is that GMK's did not acknowledge those issues as something that need to be fixed.Sorry to be a dumbass, but what's the issue in these photos? The keys in each look the same to me.
This might be a long shot, but is there any chance R5 could be added to the RGB mods to make it compatible with LightningXI’s upcoming R5 Dolch?
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106504.0
Those numbers in your post don't add up. In the Imgur link there is only 293 ISO users. Yet somehow your numbers state "244 out of 503 surveyed ISO ...etc etc"
Even taking your numbers at face value.
Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .Yet, it is taking a key away from the UK ISO users which is " 173 out of 503 surveyed ISO users, or 34%." - your figures
Thanks for checking the data yourself and taking the critical approach here — I appreciate it.
At the time of writing that post, the data I had to go off were the respondents' country numbers from the survey. Despite the fact that the total ended up being higher than the number of self-reported ISO users, I decided that this would be good enough, since it's not the exact numbers that matter, but rather the relative distribution between the different countries / national layouts. This is why at first I was reluctant to cite the precise numbers in the post and not just the percentages, but I decided to do so anyway exactly because I wanted others to be able to check my calculations.
In the meantime, I've tried to do my due diligence by reaching out to the author of the 2020 Megasurvey, /u/blockedbyte, to obtain the raw results of the survey. I wanted to do this so I could conduct a more precise analysis by taking into account just the countries/layouts of self-reported ISO users (the 293 you mentioned). However, I've yet to receive a response, and the other person who was involved in the survey, /u/dont_settle, said that they've also been unable to reach the author and get the raw data.
So I'm afraid that the best data we currently have is the country distribution, which is what I used in the post. I believe it to be representative nonetheless since, again, it's the ratios that matter. If I do get the more detailed data from the survey, I'll be sure to update my post accordingly. For the time being, I've edited out the potentially confusing wording about user numbers (thanks for pointing that out).Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .If you check the layouts I mentioned in the first footnote in that post again, all of them do in fact use either a R3 \| key or a R4 <> key. This is in line with what I said about them being partially supported, so my original statement is not incorrect.
I took issue with the misrepresentation of the figures and stating them as facts. There weren't even 503 self identified ISO users.
Of the 293 self-identified users, for all is known in the data, 100% of them could be UK/ISO or 100% of them could be FR AZERTY users.
I also take issue with you (and DeplotedVespene) instead of proposing options to give ALL ISO some compatibility in this thread and others, (E.g. requesting an extra key or side printing like old kits like GMK Muted or having R3 ~# and R4 <> (where 83% of users will have partial compatibility - your numbers (49% + 34%)). you propose to take away compatibility from others
Really liked this kit but will not be getting it if the only option is an R3 |\.
Also going to drop this now, as this is not an ISO discussion thread and any more would be disrespectful to the Designer
I copied here some examples of the pictures that show some of the issues. I hope that helps. The most concerning part of the problem is that GMK's did not acknowledge those issues as something that need to be fixed.Sorry to be a dumbass, but what's the issue in these photos? The keys in each look the same to me.
look closely at the pic of the enter keys, the symbol in enter key below is deformed
(Attachment Link)
I have received information that GMK has shipped out the set and it has arrived at our European vendor. The set is looking good and does not seem to have the issues that GMK WOB/BOW icond mods had for example.
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
This might be a long shot, but is there any chance R5 could be added to the RGB mods to make it compatible with LightningXI’s upcoming R5 Dolch?
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106504.0
Those numbers in your post don't add up. In the Imgur link there is only 293 ISO users. Yet somehow your numbers state "244 out of 503 surveyed ISO ...etc etc"
Even taking your numbers at face value.
Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .Yet, it is taking a key away from the UK ISO users which is " 173 out of 503 surveyed ISO users, or 34%." - your figures
Thanks for checking the data yourself and taking the critical approach here — I appreciate it.
At the time of writing that post, the data I had to go off were the respondents' country numbers from the survey. Despite the fact that the total ended up being higher than the number of self-reported ISO users, I decided that this would be good enough, since it's not the exact numbers that matter, but rather the relative distribution between the different countries / national layouts. This is why at first I was reluctant to cite the precise numbers in the post and not just the percentages, but I decided to do so anyway exactly because I wanted others to be able to check my calculations.
In the meantime, I've tried to do my due diligence by reaching out to the author of the 2020 Megasurvey, /u/blockedbyte, to obtain the raw results of the survey. I wanted to do this so I could conduct a more precise analysis by taking into account just the countries/layouts of self-reported ISO users (the 293 you mentioned). However, I've yet to receive a response, and the other person who was involved in the survey, /u/dont_settle, said that they've also been unable to reach the author and get the raw data.
So I'm afraid that the best data we currently have is the country distribution, which is what I used in the post. I believe it to be representative nonetheless since, again, it's the ratios that matter. If I do get the more detailed data from the survey, I'll be sure to update my post accordingly. For the time being, I've edited out the potentially confusing wording about user numbers (thanks for pointing that out).Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .If you check the layouts I mentioned in the first footnote in that post again, all of them do in fact use either a R3 \| key or a R4 <> key. This is in line with what I said about them being partially supported, so my original statement is not incorrect.
I took issue with the misrepresentation of the figures and stating them as facts. There weren't even 503 self identified ISO users.
Of the 293 self-identified users, for all is known in the data, 100% of them could be UK/ISO or 100% of them could be FR AZERTY users.
I also take issue with you (and DeplotedVespene) instead of proposing options to give ALL ISO some compatibility in this thread and others, (E.g. requesting an extra key or side printing like old kits like GMK Muted or having R3 ~# and R4 <> (where 83% of users will have partial compatibility - your numbers (49% + 34%)). you propose to take away compatibility from others
Really liked this kit but will not be getting it if the only option is an R3 |\.
Also going to drop this now, as this is not an ISO discussion thread and any more would be disrespectful to the Designer
I apologize for diverting the thread again, but I felt that it would be worthwhile to close out this discussion on a meaningful note.
You'll be happy to hear that I've managed to obtained the raw data from the r/MK Megasurvey 2020 (thanks to the authors, u/blockedbyte and u/Stopped_Lurker). You can find the relevant figures, as well as a detailed analysis of the ISO user distribution, at the following link. I invite you to check the data for correctness.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1vyY5EjTfzo6YXp_xwQYN_ffcoB0fXdNl8nc0WDteobs/edit?usp=sharing
As you can see, the data corroborates all of my original statements and assumptions from the post (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=90706.msg2894820#msg2894820). Not only that, but the number of actual, self-identified ISO users covered by R3 \|, R4 <> is even higher than was at first apparent: 56% (70% with US ISO) instead of 49%. Meanwhile, the number of ISO users covered by R3 #~, R4 \| actually went down from 34% to 19.5%.
On another note, I was surprised to see how many US ISO users there actually are out in the wild. It's a lot more than I thought. In fact, they're pretty much as common as German and UK users.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/jdJhIob.png)
I copied here some examples of the pictures that show some of the issues. I hope that helps. The most concerning part of the problem is that GMK's did not acknowledge those issues as something that need to be fixed.Sorry to be a dumbass, but what's the issue in these photos? The keys in each look the same to me.
look closely at the pic of the enter keys, the symbol in enter key below is deformed
(Attachment Link)
GMK seems to have fixed issues regarding the icon mods. I got my GMK Missing Keys yesterday and the legends are fine again. Other people in the thread are happy as wellI have received information that GMK has shipped out the set and it has arrived at our European vendor. The set is looking good and does not seem to have the issues that GMK WOB/BOW icond mods had for example.
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
F13 please
Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk
wait why is the vertical enter key r2/r3 on the novelties?
wait why is the vertical enter key r2/r3 on the novelties?
Sorry... I'm not sure I understand your question.
wait why is the vertical enter key r2/r3 on the novelties?
Sorry... I'm not sure I understand your question.
Sorry I meant accent kit, looked up saw novelty typed novelty.
Render of accent kit shows vertical enter key for numpad as r2/r3, it would be r4 right?
MoreThose numbers in your post don't add up. In the Imgur link there is only 293 ISO users. Yet somehow your numbers state "244 out of 503 surveyed ISO ...etc etc"
Even taking your numbers at face value.
Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .Yet, it is taking a key away from the UK ISO users which is " 173 out of 503 surveyed ISO users, or 34%." - your figures
Thanks for checking the data yourself and taking the critical approach here — I appreciate it.
At the time of writing that post, the data I had to go off were the respondents' country numbers from the survey. Despite the fact that the total ended up being higher than the number of self-reported ISO users, I decided that this would be good enough, since it's not the exact numbers that matter, but rather the relative distribution between the different countries / national layouts. This is why at first I was reluctant to cite the precise numbers in the post and not just the percentages, but I decided to do so anyway exactly because I wanted others to be able to check my calculations.
In the meantime, I've tried to do my due diligence by reaching out to the author of the 2020 Megasurvey, /u/blockedbyte, to obtain the raw results of the survey. I wanted to do this so I could conduct a more precise analysis by taking into account just the countries/layouts of self-reported ISO users (the 293 you mentioned). However, I've yet to receive a response, and the other person who was involved in the survey, /u/dont_settle, said that they've also been unable to reach the author and get the raw data.
So I'm afraid that the best data we currently have is the country distribution, which is what I used in the post. I believe it to be representative nonetheless since, again, it's the ratios that matter. If I do get the more detailed data from the survey, I'll be sure to update my post accordingly. For the time being, I've edited out the potentially confusing wording about user numbers (thanks for pointing that out).Majority, if not all ISO layouts you've stated does not use an R3 |\ .If you check the layouts I mentioned in the first footnote in that post again, all of them do in fact use either a R3 \| key or a R4 <> key. This is in line with what I said about them being partially supported, so my original statement is not incorrect.
I took issue with the misrepresentation of the figures and stating them as facts. There weren't even 503 self identified ISO users.
Of the 293 self-identified users, for all is known in the data, 100% of them could be UK/ISO or 100% of them could be FR AZERTY users.
I also take issue with you (and DeplotedVespene) instead of proposing options to give ALL ISO some compatibility in this thread and others, (E.g. requesting an extra key or side printing like old kits like GMK Muted or having R3 ~# and R4 <> (where 83% of users will have partial compatibility - your numbers (49% + 34%)). you propose to take away compatibility from others
Really liked this kit but will not be getting it if the only option is an R3 |\.
Also going to drop this now, as this is not an ISO discussion thread and any more would be disrespectful to the Designer
I apologize for diverting the thread again, but I felt that it would be worthwhile to close out this discussion on a meaningful note.
You'll be happy to hear that I've managed to obtained the raw data from the r/MK Megasurvey 2020 (thanks to the authors, u/blockedbyte and u/Stopped_Lurker). You can find the relevant figures, as well as a detailed analysis of the ISO user distribution, at the following link. I invite you to check the data for correctness.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1vyY5EjTfzo6YXp_xwQYN_ffcoB0fXdNl8nc0WDteobs/edit?usp=sharing
As you can see, the data corroborates all of my original statements and assumptions from the post (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=90706.msg2894820#msg2894820). Not only that, but the number of actual, self-identified ISO users covered by R3 \|, R4 <> is even higher than was at first apparent: 56% (70% with US ISO) instead of 49%. Meanwhile, the number of ISO users covered by R3 #~, R4 \| actually went down from 34% to 19.5%.
On another note, I was surprised to see how many US ISO users there actually are out in the wild. It's a lot more than I thought. In fact, they're pretty much as common as German and UK users.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/jdJhIob.png)
First, thank you for the info.
The main issue with how you presented the data is that a user's location does not indicate which layout they use.
For example, ISO users in Canada do not necessarily use a "Canadian" layout (they could be living abroad). Same goes for the US, obviously.
What I gather from this survey is that most ISO users (outside the US) are located in the UK, Germany, Sweden, the rest of the Scandinavian countries, and so on.
Besides, I rather go by recent group buy statistics than user location or layout. Because it's how many kits you think you will sell that dictates MOQ, not demographics directly.
First, thank you for the info.
The main issue with how you presented the data is that a user's location does not indicate which layout they use.
For example, ISO users in Canada do not necessarily use a "Canadian" layout (they could be living abroad). Same goes for the US, obviously.
What I gather from this survey is that most ISO users (outside the US) are located in the UK, Germany, Sweden, the rest of the Scandinavian countries, and so on.
Besides, I rather go by recent group buy statistics than user location or layout. Because it's how many kits you think you will sell that dictates MOQ, not demographics directly.
First, thank you for the info.
The main issue with how you presented the data is that a user's location does not indicate which layout they use.
For example, ISO users in Canada do not necessarily use a "Canadian" layout (they could be living abroad). Same goes for the US, obviously.
What I gather from this survey is that most ISO users (outside the US) are located in the UK, Germany, Sweden, the rest of the Scandinavian countries, and so on.
Besides, I rather go by recent group buy statistics than user location or layout. Because it's how many kits you think you will sell that dictates MOQ, not demographics directly.
Thank you for the feedback.
The country/layout breakdown should be taken at face value, because the dataset we have access to (as large as it is, with 1900 responses) didn't have a specific question for layout variants. Оf course, you're free to interpret the data however you like, and you're certainly correct that there isn't a 1:1 correspondence between a user's country of residence and the layout that they use. However, I don't think this makes any considerable impact on the result and conclusions of the analysis.
[...]
Just because something has been done a certain way in the past, doesn't mean that way is good. If that weren't the case, we would still be using Windows logos in all GMK sets. Change is good.
P.S. Unless the same set is run twice, each time with a different option for the ISO keys (but otherwise staying largely the same), looking at GB sales as an indicator for this doesn't mean much, since different sets/colorways enjoy different levels of popularity (and even the same set running at different times of the year, or at different points during the community's growth).
ISO layouts are so many and so diverse that there is no a cheap alternative to really offer any reasonable coverage. The UK layout is a US layout variantion with an ISO enter; but, it is not representative of ISO variants so please do not call it ISO. Its keys do not match any other European layout.
ISO layouts are so many and so diverse that there is no a cheap alternative to really offer any reasonable coverage. The UK layout is a US layout variantion with an ISO enter; but, it is not representative of ISO variants so please do not call it ISO. Its keys do not match any other European layout.
I though GMK does not have a 3U sb mold, right? I would be happy to hear that Im wrong.
This set already has a 3u spacebar in the Minila kit. That kit will soon become an Extension for all exotic 60% (Minila, split, Yoda, etc.)
This set already has a 3u spacebar in the Minila kit. That kit will soon become an Extension for all exotic 60% (Minila, split, Yoda, etc.)
apologies! my eyes glossed over that kit. still would love to see 3u in the accent color that's in the regular spacebar kit
ISO:
To help keep this thread on topic, I will ask those interested to please start a new thread about ISO layouts/kits/naming conventions, etc.
I will take into consideration all the suggestions that were made, but further discussion is unlikely to influence the kits for this group buy.
Thanks! ;)
I haven't published it yet, but Minila->Extension:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/3zoREjH.jpg)
This hypothetical kit is more of a 60% extension (Split SB/BS, Minila, Yoda, Alice). I'm in contact with TEX to see whether they could machine the GHB keys for Yoda (buyers would opt in or out).
Windowed keys could be nice... open to suggestions.
I haven't published it yet, but Minila->Extension:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/3zoREjH.jpg)
This hypothetical kit is more of a 60% extension (Split SB/BS, Minila, Yoda, Alice). I'm in contact with TEX to see whether they could machine the GHB keys for Yoda (buyers would opt in or out).
Windowed keys could be nice... open to suggestions.
If Tex can support with machined GHB for Yoda/Shinobi, it'd be excellent! This is just getting better and better!
I haven't published it yet, but Minila->Extension:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/3zoREjH.jpg)
This hypothetical kit is more of a 60% extension (Split SB/BS, Minila, Yoda, Alice). I'm in contact with TEX to see whether they could machine the GHB keys for Yoda (buyers would opt in or out).
Windowed keys could be nice... open to suggestions.
If Tex can support with machined GHB for Yoda/Shinobi, it'd be excellent! This is just getting better and better!
Yoda and Kodachi only. Shinobi uses 0.75u keys so most if not all aftermarket keysets won't fit.
I haven't published it yet, but Minila->Extension:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/3zoREjH.jpg)
This hypothetical kit is more of a 60% extension (Split SB/BS, Minila, Yoda, Alice). I'm in contact with TEX to see whether they could machine the GHB keys for Yoda (buyers would opt in or out).
Windowed keys could be nice... open to suggestions.
If Tex can support with machined GHB for Yoda/Shinobi, it'd be excellent! This is just getting better and better!
Yoda and Kodachi only. Shinobi uses 0.75u keys so most if not all aftermarket keysets won't fit.
Yes, I know that the top 0.75u row won't be supported, but the rest could be, so machined GHB (additional) would be nice.
When you say Opt-In for machine punched GHB keys, do we get two sets of GHB for an increase in cost, or is it the one set gets punched? For reference, TEX included two sets of keys for their custom Yoda keyset. You're not TEX, obviously, but it helps to know, for planning purposes.
I mentioned earlier in this thread that I've already cut and grinded some WoB cherry doubleshots of my own, so it doesn't really affect me that much either way.
I realized this set won't work for the shinobi, even with the custom ghb keys. The arrow keys do not have standard key spacing so custom molds would be needed. These keys would only be useful for Yoda owners, and maybe kodachi owners.
I realized this set won't work for the shinobi, even with the custom ghb keys. The arrow keys do not have standard key spacing so custom molds would be needed. These keys would only be useful for Yoda owners, and maybe kodachi owners.
Shinobi requires special keys for the arrows. No set would fit it. Not only this.
You can always keep the stock special keys and replace the others. Enjoy being special.
The Shinobi's GHB keys also have a lot more plastic cut out from the bottom compared to the Yoda. Can't comment on the Kodachi, but since I've got the Shinobi on hand so I can confirm about that. The 4.5u spacebar is also a problem - I don't believe GMK makes one, but kits for JIS-layout Filco boards do contain them.I realized this set won't work for the shinobi, even with the custom ghb keys. The arrow keys do not have standard key spacing so custom molds would be needed. These keys would only be useful for Yoda owners, and maybe kodachi owners.
Shinobi requires special keys for the arrows. No set would fit it. Not only this.
You can always keep the stock special keys and replace the others. Enjoy being special.
Lol I just mentioned that since people have mentioned the shinobi specifically. Didn't mean to imply that I had the expectation that this set would be compatible. Gear down a bit there bud.
Edit: to be fair I did mention the shinobi early on not realizing that the arrow keys are not standard 1u.
I realized this set won't work for the shinobi, even with the custom ghb keys. The arrow keys do not have standard key spacing so custom molds would be needed. These keys would only be useful for Yoda owners, and maybe kodachi owners.
Shinobi requires special keys for the arrows. No set would fit it. Not only this.
You can always keep the stock special keys and replace the others. Enjoy being special.
Lol I just mentioned that since people have mentioned the shinobi specifically. Didn't mean to imply that I had the expectation that this set would be compatible. Gear down a bit there bud.
Edit: to be fair I did mention the shinobi early on not realizing that the arrow keys are not standard 1u.
I haven't published it yet, but Minila->Extension:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/3zoREjH.jpg)
This hypothetical kit is more of a 60% extension (Split SB/BS, Minila, Yoda, Alice). I'm in contact with TEX to see whether they could machine the GHB keys for Yoda (buyers would opt in or out).
Windowed keys could be nice... open to suggestions.
If Tex can support with machined GHB for Yoda/Shinobi, it'd be excellent! This is just getting better and better!
Yoda and Kodachi only. Shinobi uses 0.75u keys so most if not all aftermarket keysets won't fit.
I haven't published it yet, but Minila->Extension:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/3zoREjH.jpg)
This hypothetical kit is more of a 60% extension (Split SB/BS, Minila, Yoda, Alice). I'm in contact with TEX to see whether they could machine the GHB keys for Yoda (buyers would opt in or out).
Windowed keys could be nice... open to suggestions.
If Tex can support with machined GHB for Yoda/Shinobi, it'd be excellent! This is just getting better and better!
Yoda and Kodachi only. Shinobi uses 0.75u keys so most if not all aftermarket keysets won't fit.
Unfortunately, Kodachi won't work either. Only Yoda. Kodachi also has the dramatic cutout under the GHB keys. (Unless TEX is able to machine those for you I suppose)
This might be a long shot, but is there any chance R5 could be added to the RGB mods to make it compatible with LightningXI’s upcoming R5 Dolch?I second this. It would be great!
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106504.0
This might be a long shot, but is there any chance R5 could be added to the RGB mods to make it compatible with LightningXI’s upcoming R5 Dolch?I second this. It would be great!
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106504.0
is there a timeline for this?
It's literally taking weeks at a time for every email from GMK, and months to get a quote. I'm still waiting for a response on an updated version of the kits.
As far as I'm concerned, the timeline is as soon as possible. Probably Q3/Q4, at this pace.
This is a great lookin set.
Voted on Drop and I'm sharing it around the internets in the hope it drums up some more interest.
You deleted the red dot caps ? AND the "Think" novelties? Loved those.
:(
Bring em back. At least maybe one R4 1.25u "Think"?
I'm really only interested in the top row. The rest not so much.
Media keys...
So we finally got the quote from GMK. You can see the updated kits above and in the OP (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.0#post_kits).I'd say drop them.
Novelties look like they are going to be around $40~45 as shown (250 MOQ). That's a bit expensive/high MOQ for my taste.
Do people really care about the highlighted keys?Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/fQPYfcX.png)
I like the dots on the bottom row, personally. Not sure if anybody else wants them...
I like the new kitting, I can see that some thought has gone into it, and it looks well put together. I'd like to suggest a few further potential improvements:
- 1.5u Code keys added to the Extension kit. This would allow users to cover Mac and OG HHKB bottom rows with text mods rather than having to use icon mods. It would also validate the inclusion of the second 1u Alt key in base rather than the Icon mods kit (which is where the only 1.5u OS keys currently are).
- Is the second 1u space key in the Extension kit necessary? It isn't for regular split spacebar boards, nor for ortho/40%, and it doesn't seem to be necessary for the exotic 60% boards you listed, either.
- The 1.75u accent space in the spacebars kit isn't necessary, seeing as that key is only used on three 40% boards (Vortex Core, Daisy, JD40) and is already included in the Ortho & 40's kit.
- The second 1.25u accent space isn't warranted either, in my opinion, seeing how fairly rare the board that uses it is, and the fact that two 1.25u space keys are already included elsewhere.
- It'd be better to include an accent 1u space instead of 1.75u and the second 1.25u, as that key would be more useful for more boards.
So we finally got the quote from GMK. You can see the updated kits above and in the OP (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.0#post_kits).I'd say drop them.
Novelties look like they are going to be around $40~45 as shown (250 MOQ). That's a bit expensive/high MOQ for my taste.
Do people really care about the highlighted keys?Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/fQPYfcX.png)
I like the dots on the bottom row, personally. Not sure if anybody else wants them...
P.S. The board renders are showing vertically centered Caps and Shift icon mods, whereas the kits only include OG top-left aligned mods.
Thanks. I will unpack this tomorrow.
As for the renders showing centered icons, they are an early version and they are wrong; The icons will be Cherry style like in the kit renders.
Cheers
So we finally got the quote from GMK. You can see the updated kits above and in the OP (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.0#post_kits).
Novelties look like they are going to be around $40~45 as shown (250 MOQ). That's a bit expensive/high MOQ for my taste.
Do people really care about the highlighted keys?Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/fQPYfcX.png)
I like the dots on the bottom row, personally. Not sure if anybody else wants them...
I'm glad people like the media keys! :D
I think a good compromise would be to scrap the 3 extra R1 dots, Hack key, and leave the R4 dots.
You deleted the red dot caps ? AND the "Think" novelties? Loved those.
:(
Bring em back. At least maybe one R4 1.25u "Think"?
No! These are just the kits that changed. Please refer to the OP (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.0#post_kits) for all the kits. :))
Can I get a F13 key?
You deleted the red dot caps ? AND the "Think" novelties? Loved those.
:(
Bring em back. At least maybe one R4 1.25u "Think"?
No! These are just the kits that changed. Please refer to the OP (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.0#post_kits) for all the kits. :))
Ah, I misunderstood, thanks for clearing that up.
WRT your highlighted keys, I add my vote to drop them if it reduces price.
Any news on Tex's involvement? And likely GB date?
If you're going to add keys to the accent pack, I'd like to throw in my vote for black media keys and blue function keys again :D
It's going to be more like this, to better emulate the actual Thinkpad Fn key:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/FndCbd0.jpg)
The blue legend is kind of dark, but we haven't found a better solution (Thinkpad keys are pad printed in a lighter colour).
It's going to be more like this, to better emulate the actual Thinkpad Fn key:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/FndCbd0.jpg)
The blue legend is kind of dark, but we haven't found a better solution (Thinkpad keys are pad printed in a lighter colour).
Well now why'd you have to go and fix the Fn key. Now I'm buying an accent kit. Next we'll have a space bar with the super zoom icon and top row fn keys with lock/battery/sleep/brightness/thinklight sublegends. :D
I like the new kitting, I can see that some thought has gone into it, and it looks well put together. I'd like to suggest a few further potential improvements:
- 1.5u Code keys added to the Extension kit. This would allow users to cover Mac and OG HHKB bottom rows with text mods rather than having to use (and buy) icon mods. It would also validate the inclusion of a second 1u Alt key in Base rather than the Icon mods kit (which is where the only 1.5u OS keys currently are).
- Is the second 1u space key in the Extension kit necessary? It isn't for regular split spacebar boards, nor for ortho/40%, and it doesn't seem to be necessary for the exotic 60% boards you listed, either.
- The 1.75u accent space in the spacebars kit isn't necessary, seeing as that key is only used on three 40% boards (Vortex Core, Daisy, JD40) and is already included in the Ortho & 40's kit.
- The second 1.25u accent space isn't warranted either, in my opinion, seeing how fairly rare the board that uses it is, and the fact that two 1.25u space keys are already included in Extension.
- It'd be better to include an accent 1u space instead of 1.75u and the second 1.25u, as that key would be more useful for more boards.
Yes, it's one of the things I would add. As you know, I'm not a huge fan of "Code". "System" is probably better (Mito is not fully committed to it in the new Laser!). Second 1u Alt is motivated by the Meta keys (diamond) in Icon mods. It's only one key and it wouldn't make sense to put it with the icons, therefore this is the most logical place. The Meta keys wouldn't necessarily be out of place with otherwise text+icon mods, imo.
Extension kits are not very popular. I have seen too many Alice boards without proper spacebars (when they were available in the extension kit). Hence putting only the necessary keys in there.
They should come in pair. It is in fact for ortho, as is the 3u and extra 2u. It's cheap.
Some boards have used two 1.75u spacebars (JD45). I see it more as an accent for Vortex Core.
Since there are no 1.5u spacebars (Atreus, etc.), these can serve as replacements. Also Minila has two convex 1.25u.
They're already included in the ortho set. Is there any non-ortho-40's board that could make use of them (convex 1u)?
Yes, it's one of the things I would add. As you know, I'm not a huge fan of "Code". "System" is probably better (Mito is not fully committed to it in the new Laser!). Second 1u Alt is motivated by the Meta keys (diamond) in Icon mods. It's only one key and it wouldn't make sense to put it with the icons, therefore this is the most logical place. The Meta keys wouldn't necessarily be out of place with otherwise text+icon mods, imo.
Extension kits are not very popular. I have seen too many Alice boards without proper spacebars (when they were available in the extension kit). Hence putting only the necessary keys in there.
As someone who very much dislikes Code for a number of reasons (outlined here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=101960.msg2803194#msg2803194) and here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=104460.msg2870032#msg2870032)), I support changing all Code legends to System/Sys or Super. In that case, my proposition would be to add two 1.5u System or Super keys to the Extension kit, not Code. (By the way, 1u Sys in GMK Laser R2 was changed to Code for a different reason.)
As I said, I agree with the placement of the second 1u Alt in the base kit, if text 1.5u System/Super keys are added to the Extension kit to make it more purposeful. Otherwise, the second 1u Alt is useful if and only if the Icon Mods kit is purchased. It shouldn't make a big difference anyway since it's just one key, but I'm sure text 1.5u OS keys would be appreciated by a number of users (mostly Mac users, but also those who prefer OG HHKB key positions).
Regarding “necessary” keys, 1.5u OS keys are definitely more popular than the second 2.25u Shift currently present in the Extension kit, which is only used on 660 keyboards (of which there aren't that many, whereas any keyboard with a Tsangan/HHKB bottom row can use 1.5u OS keys). If you only count Western audiences, they are more popular than 2u Shift, 1u Shift, 1u Delete as well.They should come in pair. It is in fact for ortho, as is the 3u and extra 2u. It's cheap.
Well, I think there is no point in including the second 1u for ortho in the Extension kit because two of them are already present in the Ortho & 40's kit. If you have ever seen an ortho keyboard with four convex 1u space keys, please link it so I can take note :D Otherwise, the second one can be removed from the Extension kit.
Besides that, 1u, 2u and 3u space keys are also used on regular ≥60% boards (most Alice-style boards, some ≥60% splits, Minila), so they serve a purpose outside of being just additional ortho compatibility.Some boards have used two 1.75u spacebars (JD45). I see it more as an accent for Vortex Core.
JD45 falls under the same category as the JD40 that I mentioned (which also uses 2× 1.75u). If you want to count it separately, that still makes it only four keyboards in total that use a 1.75u spacebar, none of which are very popular, not even Vortex Core. It's fine if you want to keep it, but consider whether it's objectively common enough to warrant that (and also keep in mind that one 1.75u is already present in the Ortho & 40's kit).Since there are no 1.5u spacebars (Atreus, etc.), these can serve as replacements. Also Minila has two convex 1.25u.
Again, two 1.25u space keys are already included in the Extension kit, which you have to buy in order to get Minila support anyway :) No need to duplicate them in the Spacebars kit (that was the point of my comment). Also, Atreus uses two 1.25u/1.5u spacebars, not four, so the Extension kit on its own will be enough for that as well.They're already included in the ortho set. Is there any non-ortho-40's board that could make use of them (convex 1u)?
Yes, convex 1u is useful for most Alice-style ergo boards (Alice, Lubrigante, Rukia, Maja, Type K...), ≥60% split boards (VE.A, Doppelgänger, Uni660...), etc.
I haven't read all the discussions about Laser, why was 1u Sys changed to Code? I'm leaning towards Code because it's more popular (at this time). I think the Meta keys are a good enough option for Mac users. Both Extension and Icon mods will be priced similarly. I see more value in Icon mods for most people and all OSes.
Regarding the convex keys... removing one 1u or 1.25u will not change the price of the kits, so it's pointless to remove them. My approach is about offering all convex sizes, in both colours.
I haven't read all the discussions about Laser, why was 1u Sys changed to Code? I'm leaning towards Code because it's more popular (at this time). I think the Meta keys are a good enough option for Mac users. Both Extension and Icon mods will be priced similarly. I see more value in Icon mods for most people and all OSes.
It was done purely for aesthetics on HHKB boards, and also for people who use Code for both 1u bottom row keys on HHKB even when they don't map the second one to be an OS key (Code is more neutral than Sys in that particular use case).
Regarding the convex keys... removing one 1u or 1.25u will not change the price of the kits, so it's pointless to remove them. My approach is about offering all convex sizes, in both colours.
In that case, please add a 1u convex option in both colors as well. In that case I can just get Spacebars (I need the 1u for my Rukia) and not bother with Extension.
And it's actually 4 extraneous keys in total (3 of which in Spacebars), which isn't insignificant.
Can't you get all the spacebars you need for Rukia in the Extension kit?
Can't you get all the spacebars you need for Rukia in the Extension kit?
Yes, but I will be getting Spacebars anyway for the 6u's and large accent bars. Since I don't mind the color of the small bars, that leaves just 1u that isn't covered by the Spacebars kit, and I don't want to have to get another kit for just that one key. Why not drop the 1.75u and second 1.25u and add a 1u (a more commonly used space key on ≥60%)? Or just add a 1u straight up? In the former case the kit would be $3–$5 cheaper (depending on vendor markup) without really sacrificing anything. In the latter case it would be in line with what you said about offering all convex sizes in both colors. Either way, a 1u should be in there, imo.
Can't you get all the spacebars you need for Rukia in the Extension kit?
Yes, but I will be getting Spacebars anyway for the 6u's and large accent bars. Since I don't mind the color of the small bars, that leaves just 1u that isn't covered by the Spacebars kit, and I don't want to have to get another kit for just that one key. Why not drop the 1.75u and second 1.25u and add a 1u (a more commonly used space key on ≥60%)? Or just add a 1u straight up? In the former case the kit would be $3–$5 cheaper (depending on vendor markup) without really sacrificing anything. In the latter case it would be in line with what you said about offering all convex sizes in both colors. Either way, a 1u should be in there, imo.
I would call this an edge case... ;)
Let me reiterate. The reason for keeping the extra 1.75u is because some boards have two, it's their only option. The reason for two 1.25u is because Yoda and Minila support are staples of this set (due to the theme and new GMK 3u SB). Therefore removing one 1.25u makes no sense. Adding two 1u's is something to consider.
You should seriously consider asking an ortho user to sell you their blue convex 1u's!
I would call this an edge case... ;)
Let me reiterate. The reason for keeping the extra 1.75u is because some boards have two, it's their only option. The reason for two 1.25u is because Yoda and Minila support are staples of this set (due to the theme and new GMK 3u SB). Therefore removing one 1.25u makes no sense. Adding two 1u's is something to consider.
You should seriously consider asking an ortho user to sell you their blue convex 1u's!
My approach is about offering all convex sizes, in both colours.
You should seriously consider asking an ortho user to sell you their blue convex 1u's!
I would call this an edge case... ;)
Let me reiterate. The reason for keeping the extra 1.75u is because some boards have two, it's their only option. The reason for two 1.25u is because Yoda and Minila support are staples of this set (due to the theme and new GMK 3u SB). Therefore removing one 1.25u makes no sense. Adding two 1u's is something to consider.
You should seriously consider asking an ortho user to sell you their blue convex 1u's!
Take a cursory look at the IC and GB boards on this forum, and you will find that Alice-style boards are by no means an edge case :D All of them (I can't think of any exceptions rn) support 2.25u+1u spacebar layouts.
I'd absolutely be willing to pay more for a larger accent kit fyi. I took that question as meaning "what would you be willing to pay for this small accent pack."
Anytime you ask "how much are you willing to pay" the results are gonna be skewed towards the low end, because people think that the lower they vote, the less it will cost.
You need to decide what you want in the kit, get a quote, and that's what it's gonna cost. It's not a request to set a price. The less you wanna pay, the smaller the kit will need to be to hit that price.
I like the dots on the bottom row, personally. Not sure if anybody else wants them...
I like the dots on the bottom row, personally. Not sure if anybody else wants them...
I like the bottom row dots too. On the Preonic render you have I think they look pretty cool, especially with the red case. I also didn't see any renders of standard keyboards using them for their arrow keys, but I think that would be cool too. I can see 65%/75%/CP users also having three of them in place over the right-side Ctrl/Win/Alt keys.
But overall, I can see why they'd be unpopular. It's kind of a niche thing. :(
I got a numpad for my girlfriend's ThinkPad T420 and the kit here will be a great kit for it. Just need a R1 1u "Fn" key, but I suppose one of the red TrackPoint-looking novelties will do fine instead.
I'm interested in that stand-alone ortho kit. It's got almost everything I need except for an extra 2u R4C key, but I'll just buy a spacebar kit so I can enjoy the extra 1u R4C keys too.
Looking forward to the GB!
Keycap set is looking great I like the GMK Dot vibes too!
Alice is supported by both spacebars and extension kits, in both colours... I'm sorry, but what I meant by "edge case" is you trying to score all the keys you need in a single kit (for two keyboards!).
Edit: no hard feelings <3
I've sworn off buying anymore keycap sets, but I really like the IBM/Lenovo/Thinkpad theme. I'll keep an eye on this.
Alice is supported by both spacebars and extension kits, in both colours... I'm sorry, but what I meant by "edge case" is you trying to score all the keys you need in a single kit (for two keyboards!).
Edit: no hard feelings <3
Just saw this. No worries, it's all preference and trade-offs; you win some, you lose some :) In general I'm happy with the current kits. Ik you know what you're doing :)
After looking over the set with a US vendor, we concluded that there may be too many kits. Icon mods is at risk. So you may get your way in the end, as the kits get jumbled again... ;) Only thing is, where would the windows keys go?
And then there's Ortho & 40's (standalone)... 250 MOQ is huge. I think we can do it, and I commit to buy any remainder to reach 250 (as Canadian proxy Yakk shop).
I will make separate IC threads for the RGB and icon mods, as they're compatible with many other sets.
After looking over the set with a US vendor, we concluded that there may be too many kits. Icon mods is at risk. So you may get your way in the end, as the kits get jumbled again... ;) Only thing is, where would the windows keys go?
And then there's Ortho & 40's (standalone)... 250 MOQ is huge. I think we can do it, and I commit to buy any remainder to reach 250 (as Canadian proxy Yakk shop).
I will make separate IC threads for the RGB and icon mods, as they're compatible with many other sets.
[...]
Are you interested in optimizations for the Ortho & 40's kit? Cause I got those :D I see at least 5 keys that can be cut / merged / offloaded. But also a couple that would need to be added for full physical coverage of some popular 40% boards.
Are you interested in optimizations for the Ortho & 40's kit? Cause I got those :D I see at least 5 keys that can be cut / merged / offloaded. But also a couple that would need to be added for full physical coverage of some popular 40% boards.
Let's go
Please don't take away my 1u R3 Ctrl.
Let's go
I'll send you a message on Discord.Please don't take away my 1u R3 Ctrl.
R3 1u Ctrl is used by a number of users, so I wouldn't suggest removing it. However, would you mind it being changed to a more generic legend such as Hack, Meta or Code? As such, it would also be able to cover R3 Caps, Shift or Fn (alongside Ctrl, ofc) for ortho users who prefer to use those keys on R3.
I personally am fine with a 1u R3 novelty. It's what I usually do, was just hoping I didn't have to this time. I would be happy with another term as well - hack, code, whatever.
My main concern is being stuck with ESC and TAB as my *only* options for that slot. To that point, if I'm being honest, if there's two or more non-ESC/TAB options for R3, I'm going to use one of them for the N9 ortho kit that ran before. It only has ESC/TAB.
I am personally covered by the novelties as is. Would I prefer a Ctrl/Code/Hack there instead of a novelty? Yes.
Is it a deal breaker for me if there is no Ctrl/code/hack and I have to rely on novelties? Not at all.
Edit: to answer the real question you're asking: I only need one key there. I don't care if it's Ctrl/code/hack or novelty, though my preference is not the novelty for this particular set because I *love* the idea of the dot in the middle of the board; it's friggin brilliant.
Sweet. And I would 1000% be fine if it was some other generic word there like konstantin was suggesting. I personally have that key mapped to backspace on tap, control on hold and know that others may use it for FN or caps or whatever.
I just don't want tab or Esc because those are R2 and r1 respectively on all my boards and having either of those on R3 and another one on R2 or R1 is just goofy.
Maybe add prev/skip keys to the novelties kit if you're going to have multimedia keys?
The other kits look pretty spot on though.
Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
Cool. I would stick with Ctrl because otherwise we have to choose an existing R3 1u legend (to keep the cost down). Not sure what the options are, off the top of my head.
Edit: C70 keyset has R3 1u Code.
Cool. I would stick with Ctrl because otherwise we have to choose an existing R3 1u legend (to keep the cost down). Not sure what the options are, off the top of my head.
Edit: C70 keyset has R3 1u Code.
FYI, any legend mold can be used on any row, except R0 and R5, as long as the key size stays the same. So a 1u Code mold can be used for any 1u Code key on rows 1–4.
Some useful legend-mold–related info from GMK:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/02NLPH7.png)
List of suggested changes for the 40s kit coming soon!
I would snap this set up in a heartbeat if it had better UK ISO support.
Just R4 |\ and R3 #~ in the base would be fine but ideally full U.K. ISO even if it’s an additional kit
Lookin at these renders, wondering why I try :'(
Beautiful set man.
[...]
List of suggested changes for the 40s kit coming soon!
Every day that goes by without a reply... I imagine you like this:
Ohhh I can't find anything wrong with! It's already perrrfect!!Show Image(https://media1.tenor.com/images/9c1db3bd3a4b2193cabe47ba84019b1d/tenor.gif?itemid=9170373)
Set of the year right here. Can't wait.
I really like this set! I had decided on a few more sets this year and to draw the line there, but I think my will is broken and I’ll have to get this.
Where did the UK ISO go?
A couple of thoughts, I really like the idea of using a dot dot the second alice B. Would it make sense to include a dot alongside the extra b in that kit?
Also it would be fun with some eye-bee-m novelties/artisans based on the work of Paul Rand.
Any F13?
Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk
Not sure why I am only just now seeing this. I ****ing love Thinkpads so this is a must-have for me. Thank you. Any projections on GB?
Any chance of offering Vim keycaps as an addon? I think that'd go nicely with the set and the thinkpad aesthetic. I really dig the set!!
Every day that goes by without a reply... I imagine you like this:
Ohhh I can't find anything wrong with! It's already perrrfect!!Show Image(https://media1.tenor.com/images/9c1db3bd3a4b2193cabe47ba84019b1d/tenor.gif?itemid=9170373)
Doing some research for one of my own 40s kits, I want to wait until I finish that to make sure I don't miss anything here. Granted, it's only a few keys so far ;)
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200809/967b7aed3c67ff4dca6445d442635a1c.jpg)...
Doing some research for one of my own 40s kits, I want to wait until I finish that to make sure I don't miss anything here. Granted, it's only a few keys so far ;)
Still waiting...
A couple of thoughts, I really like the idea of using a dot dot the second alice B. Would it make sense to include a dot alongside the extra b in that kit?
Also it would be fun with some eye-bee-m novelties/artisans based on the work of Paul Rand.
I didn't know about that logo.
It's super nice, however I'm afraid we can't step into trademark territory...
As for the Dots, I have permission from Biip (original designer) to use them as novelties, so I won't put one in Extension.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Zb7uDda.jpg)
I’m in for everything except alphas.A couple of thoughts, I really like the idea of using a dot dot the second alice B. Would it make sense to include a dot alongside the extra b in that kit?
Also it would be fun with some eye-bee-m novelties/artisans based on the work of Paul Rand.
I didn't know about that logo.
It's super nice, however I'm afraid we can't step into trademark territory...
As for the Dots, I have permission from Biip (original designer) to use them as novelties, so I won't put one in Extension.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Zb7uDda.jpg)
Mayhaps we can contact the company? Also, please check out their color palettes which are public! I understand they are web colors but it's my understanding they are also refined across materials.
It's moderately funny that this is basically their laws/principles of color:
https://www.ibm.com/design/language/color/ (https://www.ibm.com/design/language/color/)
You might be able to use interest check numbers to leverage the idea of them allowing you to use that poster design when you get in contact with the correct staffing at IBM. Here's another piece of the puzzle, take it with a fist sized rock of pink Himalayan salt because Wikipedia.
not covered under fair use as corporate identity/logo because it is not an official company logo (nor is it endorsed by IBM)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Eye-Bee-M-Poster.jpg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Eye-Bee-M-Poster.jpg)
I’m in for everything except alphas.A couple of thoughts, I really like the idea of using a dot dot the second alice B. Would it make sense to include a dot alongside the extra b in that kit?
Also it would be fun with some eye-bee-m novelties/artisans based on the work of Paul Rand.
I didn't know about that logo.
It's super nice, however I'm afraid we can't step into trademark territory...
As for the Dots, I have permission from Biip (original designer) to use them as novelties, so I won't put one in Extension.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Zb7uDda.jpg)
Mayhaps we can contact the company? Also, please check out their color palettes which are public! I understand they are web colors but it's my understanding they are also refined across materials.
It's moderately funny that this is basically their laws/principles of color:
https://www.ibm.com/design/language/color/ (https://www.ibm.com/design/language/color/)
You might be able to use interest check numbers to leverage the idea of them allowing you to use that poster design when you get in contact with the correct staffing at IBM. Here's another piece of the puzzle, take it with a fist sized rock of pink Himalayan salt because Wikipedia.
not covered under fair use as corporate identity/logo because it is not an official company logo (nor is it endorsed by IBM)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Eye-Bee-M-Poster.jpg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Eye-Bee-M-Poster.jpg)
I mean, yeah. This site is a gold mine when it comes to design inspiration. More on the IBM bee/rebus (https://www.ibm.com/design/language/ibm-logos/rebus/) logos.
Despite the download agreement (https://www.ibm.com/design/v1/language/legal/download-agreement/), I'm not completely clear on what can be used, freely, for commercial purposes.
I'm already using the IBM Plex (https://www.ibm.com/plex/) font for the kit renders. Not sure if I want to poke the bear any further...
- The following are terms of a legal downloader agreement (the “Agreement”) regarding Your download of Content (as defined below) from this Website
- This Website may contain other proprietary notices and copyright information, the terms of which must be observed and followed
- Any use of the Content in violation of this Agreement is strictly prohibited
- The Content may be provided by IBM or third-parties
- IBM-Content is owned by IBM and is copyrighted and licensed, not sold
- Third-party Content is owned by its respective owner and is licensed by the third party directly to You
- IBM’s decision to permit posting of third-party Content does not constitute an express or implied license from IBM to You or a recommendation or endorsement by IBM of any particular product, service, company or technology
- The party providing the Content (the “Provider”) grants You a nonexclusive, worldwide, irrevocable, royalty-free, copyright license
- edit, copy, reproduce, publish, publicly display and/or perform, format, modify and/or make derivative works of, translate, re-arrange, and distribute the Content or any portions thereof and to sublicense any or all such rights and to permit sublicensees to further sublicense such rights
- for both commercial and non-commercial use, provided You abide by the terms of this Agreement
- Neither IBM nor the provider of the Content grants a patent license of any kind, whether expressed or implied or by estoppel
- As a condition of exercising the rights and licenses granted under this Agreement, You assume sole responsibility to obtain any other intellectual property rights needed
- The Provider of the Content is the party that submitted the Content for Posting and who represents and warrants that they own all of the Content, (or have obtained all written releases, authorizations and licenses from any other owner(s) necessary to grant IBM and downloaders this license with respect to portions of the Content not owned by the Provider)
I’m in for everything except alphas.A couple of thoughts, I really like the idea of using a dot dot the second alice B. Would it make sense to include a dot alongside the extra b in that kit?
Also it would be fun with some eye-bee-m novelties/artisans based on the work of Paul Rand.
I didn't know about that logo.
It's super nice, however I'm afraid we can't step into trademark territory...
As for the Dots, I have permission from Biip (original designer) to use them as novelties, so I won't put one in Extension.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/Zb7uDda.jpg)
Mayhaps we can contact the company? Also, please check out their color palettes which are public! I understand they are web colors but it's my understanding they are also refined across materials.
It's moderately funny that this is basically their laws/principles of color:
https://www.ibm.com/design/language/color/ (https://www.ibm.com/design/language/color/)
You might be able to use interest check numbers to leverage the idea of them allowing you to use that poster design when you get in contact with the correct staffing at IBM. Here's another piece of the puzzle, take it with a fist sized rock of pink Himalayan salt because Wikipedia.
not covered under fair use as corporate identity/logo because it is not an official company logo (nor is it endorsed by IBM)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Eye-Bee-M-Poster.jpg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Eye-Bee-M-Poster.jpg)
I mean, yeah. This site is a gold mine when it comes to design inspiration. More on the IBM bee/rebus (https://www.ibm.com/design/language/ibm-logos/rebus/) logos.
Despite the download agreement (https://www.ibm.com/design/v1/language/legal/download-agreement/), I'm not completely clear on what can be used, freely, for commercial purposes.
I'm already using the IBM Plex (https://www.ibm.com/plex/) font for the kit renders. Not sure if I want to poke the bear any further...
I'm not a lawyer, but this is how it appears to me.This is important in relation to the hyperlinked agreement, I implore you to read these sections as it also pertains to the font you are using (quoted for brevity):
- The IBM rebus is, in its essence, an artistic adaptation of the IBM logo.
- If the likeness of the 8 bar logo M is removed you will have greater favor.
- The font's name, Plex, is a registered trademark.
- The design however, might not be.
Quote
- The following are terms of a legal downloader agreement (the “Agreement”) regarding Your download of Content (as defined below) from this Website
- This Website may contain other proprietary notices and copyright information, the terms of which must be observed and followed
- Any use of the Content in violation of this Agreement is strictly prohibited
- The Content may be provided by IBM or third-parties
- IBM-Content is owned by IBM and is copyrighted and licensed, not sold
- Third-party Content is owned by its respective owner and is licensed by the third party directly to You
- IBM’s decision to permit posting of third-party Content does not constitute an express or implied license from IBM to You or a recommendation or endorsement by IBM of any particular product, service, company or technology
- The party providing the Content (the “Provider”) grants You a nonexclusive, worldwide, irrevocable, royalty-free, copyright license
- edit, copy, reproduce, publish, publicly display and/or perform, format, modify and/or make derivative works of, translate, re-arrange, and distribute the Content or any portions thereof and to sublicense any or all such rights and to permit sublicensees to further sublicense such rights
- for both commercial and non-commercial use, provided You abide by the terms of this Agreement
- Neither IBM nor the provider of the Content grants a patent license of any kind, whether expressed or implied or by estoppel
- As a condition of exercising the rights and licenses granted under this Agreement, You assume sole responsibility to obtain any other intellectual property rights needed
- The Provider of the Content is the party that submitted the Content for Posting and who represents and warrants that they own all of the Content, (or have obtained all written releases, authorizations and licenses from any other owner(s) necessary to grant IBM and downloaders this license with respect to portions of the Content not owned by the Provider)
This being my supporting material, I can say that by using the three components of the IBM rebus separately (as three individual novelties: Eye, Bee, [monogram] M) with recommendations stated prior is of equal or lesser level to using the Plex font which is a registered trademark. Note that all trademarks are removed in their reference images of the IBM rebus on their website:Show Image(https://www.ibm.com/design/language/ab9936fcbc48b33beb969671629e07be/rebusclassic1.svg)
This is not legal advice.
These fonts are licensed under the Open Font License.
You can use them freely in your products & projects - print or digital, commercial or otherwise. However, you can't sell the fonts on their own.
This isn't legal advice, please consider consulting a lawyer and see the full license for all details.
As for IBM rebus, I'm not really comfortable using it or any parts of it.
QuoteAs for IBM rebus, I'm not really comfortable using it or any parts of it.
Fair enough, I believe you would receive overwhelming support and respect if you successfully coordinated with IBM to do so. If this was a set I was designing I would make it happen, with all consequences registered. You don't have to change your mind, because your decision is correct and within your own tolerances. As you said in your post, this is an Thinkpad-IBM/Lenovo set rather than one that is exclusively IBM. As a fellow designer though, I say it's a let down and missed opportunity. That's all the feedback I have to offer besides using custom colors.
Doing some research for one of my own 40s kits, I want to wait until I finish that to make sure I don't miss anything here. Granted, it's only a few keys so far ;)
Still waiting...
Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/ojWQ5bD.jpg)
- Standalone orthogonal and 40% set (250 MOQ)
- R3 1u Tab/Ctrl/Enter, all minibars, MiniVan modifiers, etc.
- Alternative extention set: https://i.imgur.com/2jaf2Ep.jpg
Doing some research for one of my own 40s kits, I want to wait until I finish that to make sure I don't miss anything here. Granted, it's only a few keys so far ;)
Still waiting...
Hi there ;) Sorry to keep you waiting! I was away for a bit. Here you go:Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/ojWQ5bD.jpg)
- Standalone orthogonal and 40% set (250 MOQ)
- R3 1u Tab/Ctrl/Enter, all minibars, MiniVan modifiers, etc.
- Alternative extention set: https://i.imgur.com/2jaf2Ep.jpg
Kitting suggestions
- Let's start with the biggest change proposition I have, which goes beyond just the Ortho & 40's kit. That is replacing Code with either System or Start, and then changing R3 1u Ctrl to Code in the 40s kit, as we've discussed previously.
- I believe you've said (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.msg2926800#msg2926800) that you aren't a fan of Code. That's good, because I think Code doesn't make (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=101960.msg2803194#msg2803194) sense (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=104460.msg2870032#msg2870032) as an OS key legend.
- Lenovo has a history of using Start (https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/wdAAAOSwT4pdYk5w/s-l640.jpg) as an OS key legend on their standalone ThinkPad keyboards. Start molds exist in both 1.25u and 1u; GMK DMG (https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1679/2319/products/GMK_DMG_basekit_181109-2_1200x1200.jpg?v=1572646308) introduced them. I don't think that a 1.5u Start mold exists, but this isn't a problem as GMK ThinkCaps doesn't have textual 1.5u OS keys, only ♢.
- The other option is System, which exists in 1.25u (introduced by GMK Yugo (https://i.imgur.com/k0fgkdF.png)) and 1u as Sys (one of Cherry's OG molds). System is a good legend choice since OS keys do system-specific actions.
- As mentioned previously in the thread, R3 1u Code will allow the key to cover for Shift, Caps and Fn, in addition to Ctrl. An approximate usage distribution for these keys can be found here (https://i.imgur.com/OVofoyd.png) (sans Fn as that wasn't included in the survey (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=102205.msg2806656#msg2806656), but rest assured that that key is also used).
- Action points: Change 1.25u Code legends to Start or System, and change 1u Code to Start or Sys, in the TKL and 40s kits (keep 1.5u Code in 40s as this is a generic key). Afterwards, change R3 1u Ctrl to Code in 40s kit.
- The second R4 1u Fn key can be removed.
- Most ortho boards use at most 3 layer keys (Lower, Raise, Fn). Some layouts (including the Planck default one (https://i.redd.it/5a129uawmycx.png)) have a dedicated “config” key (e.g. for backlight), but a single Fn covers for that.
- Some layouts use two layer/config/other keys alongside Lower and Raise. Meta covers for this as it's a generic legend.
- Pretty much no layouts use two Fn keys that do the same thing, which renders the second Fn key fairly useless.
- I based this analysis on various Planck, Preonic, Boardwalk, XD75 user layouts found on Google Images (https://www.google.com/search?q=planck+layout&tbm=isch), the r/mk (https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/search?q=planck%20layout&restrict_sr=1) and OLKB (https://www.reddit.com/r/olkb/search?q=planck%20layout&restrict_sr=1) subreddits, QMK keymap repos (https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/tree/master/keyboards/planck/keymaps) and the Plank EZ keymap repo (https://configure.ergodox-ez.com/planck-ez/search), as well as discussions with other ortho users in the 40% Discord.
- Action points: Remove second R4 1u Fn from the 40s kit.
- Move accent 1u spacekeys to the Spacebars kit.
- 2u space is at least as popular as 2× 1u space on ortho layouts. Additionally, 2u space is used by some staggered 40% boards. Despite this, there is no accent 2u space in the 40s kit, only 1u's.
- Having accent 1u spacekeys in Spacebars would:
- reduce the size of the 40s kit by two keys;
- make the Spacebars and Extension kits fully symmetric in terms of offered split spacekeys;
- also allow Alice users to have an accent 1u spacekey (a use case which I mentioned in our previous discussion, here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.msg2926850#msg2926850) and here (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=106305.msg2926890#msg2926890)).
- Action points: Move both blue 1u spacekeys from 40s to Spacebars.
- Add R3 1.25u Code or Fn.
- R3 1.25u is a very common key on staggered 40% boards, but not all users like to put Tab there (which is currently the only option offered in the kit). Some use Fn, some use Ctrl, and so on.
- Additionally, if this key is added, two more boards will be able to be covered: Dimple (https://i.loli.net/2019/03/29/5c9daf903cad9.jpg) and UT47.2 (https://groupbuys.mechboards.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/UT47-W-_0004_Layer-1-copy.png) (a widely available 40% board). These boards use a R3 1.25u Enter in addition to a R3 1.25u Tab. See the Comments & remarks section below for more details.
- Similar to the proposed R3 1u Code key for ortho, Code is an appropriate legend here because it's generic and can fill many roles (Fn, Ctrl, Enter...).
- Action points: Add R3 1.25u Code or Fn to 40s.
- Kit looks good otherwise!
Comments & remarks
- The following 40% boards can be outfitted by purchasing Icon Mods in addition to Ortho & 40's:
- Prime_E (https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2016/1211/products/Prime_E_listing_grande.jpg) (uses six 1.25u keys in total)
- Equinox (https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0238/7342/1376/products/kPRMCz4_1024x1024@2x.jpg), Romeo (https://i.redd.it/frccm5e4rtn41.jpg) (uses 1.5u Backspace, 1.5u Tab, 1.75u Caps, 2.25u Enter)
- if R3 1.25u Code or Fn is added to 40s: Dimple (https://i.loli.net/2019/03/29/5c9daf903cad9.jpg), UT47.2 (https://groupbuys.mechboards.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/UT47-W-_0004_Layer-1-copy.png) (uses 1.5u Backspace)
Wish more ortho kits supported larger split orthos. (another 2u key, and enough keys to populate 14 columns instead of just 12).
If you're transitioning to ortho, 14 is a much easier transition than going down to 12.
- love the colorway though.
wishful thinking i guess...
will wait to see what final pricing ends up being.
Good points. My answer is simple: I agree with almost everything.
- I'm not decided on System vs Code. I personally like System, but I think most people are used to Code as the most neutral "system" key. Another argument for Code is that it fits on both 1.25u and 1.5u keys, while being aesthetically pleasing. Start is just aweful. As for ortho, thinking about adding R3 1u Code... though from the comments, most people are fine with Ctrl.
- We could remove one R4 1u Fn. The reason for it is mostly the Vortex Core, which uses two (or three) Fn keys. Perhaps its popularity has waned over the years. In general, Fn is one of the only keys that looks good when repeated.
- (2) x blue R4C 1u's: I think it makes sense in the Ortho set because:
- There's not enough blue accents (without them). Otherwise, additional blue Lower/Raise is redundant;
- You can use them to either replace or together with Lower/Raise, as spacekeys or other;
- Bonus: ortho users don't have to buy Spacebars kit for two small keys.
- Lastly, adding R3 1.25u Ctrl or Fn or Code makes sense. It's just a matter of pricing. As is, Ortho & 40's set is already one or two keys over budget. It's just too bad that there's no other option in the other kits.
wishful thinking i guess...
will wait to see what final pricing ends up being.
Out of curiosity and for future reference, what 14-column friendly keys would you say are missing, apart from the 2u spacebar?
The Icon Mods kit is missing the Esc key in its icon version. :(
The Icon Mods kit is missing the Esc key in its icon version. :(
Isn't that a Mac thing?
Are you thinking about offering a led cut out on the caps lock? either way i am buying these when they make it to GB. If we fill out the IC form is there anyway to receive an email when these hit GB? I do not want to miss out on these.
The Icon Mods kit is missing the Esc key in its icon version. :(
Isn't that a Mac thing?
I am a PC user and I have never used a Mac, so I know nothing about Macs. I have this example of a previous Icon Mod kit.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/TIHed7i.jpg)
The Icon Mods kit is missing the Esc key in its icon version. :(
Isn't that a Mac thing?
I am a PC user and I have never used a Mac, so I know nothing about Macs. I have this example of a previous Icon Mod kit.Show Image(https://i.imgur.com/TIHed7i.jpg)
that esc icon made it's first mac appearance on the apple adjustable keyboard (icon was not on the keycap, but beside it on the case). it was later part of the "think different" keyset and i'm sure has been used in a couple mac-centric sets since.
- also the modifier key right next to the spacebar is the icon for apple's "option" key (alt on pc)
- also the modifier key right next to the spacebar is the icon for apple's "option" key (alt on pc)
Is there a projected GB date? I’ve been purchasing parts over the past months exclusively for these keycaps.
i was 100% expecting a set made of thinking emojis. Cant tell if i'm disappointed that its not or relieved
Very nice set! I‘m interested. Just filled out the form.
Do you have any artisan collabs coming up with regards to nipples? I'd buy a rose gold rama nipple.
has adding an R4 'page up' key already been talked about?
i thought for sure this was going to be the kit to finally give it to me.
has adding an R4 'page up' key already been talked about?
i thought for sure this was going to be the kit to finally give it to me.
has adding an R4 'page up' key already been talked about?
i thought for sure this was going to be the kit to finally give it to me.
How would this key be put to use on a mechanical keyboard?
has adding an R4 'page up' key already been talked about?
i thought for sure this was going to be the kit to finally give it to me.
How would this key be put to use on a mechanical keyboard?
pretty much any layout with an arrow cluster and 1u keys on either side of the 'up' arrow
i know this example is probably pretty specific to me, but i use a macro pad that has an arrow cluster with the two keys on either side of the 'up' arrow as pgUp/pgDn. my specific pad is set up for text/code editing, but it's also useful for browsing the web.
the first thing i missed when switching from using just a thinkpad to a desk with an external keyboard full time was being able to have those keys there.
but setting aside my personal preference, if for no other reason, this is a Thinkpad themed set, pretty much every thinkpad in the past ten years has had that setupShow Image(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.quikfixlaptopkeys.com%2Fproducts%2Fkb%2Flenovo_t431s.jpg&f=1&nofb=1)
I cannot think on any mechanical keyboard with such layout. I also have my thinkpad in front of me and I may say that I have never used those keys.
I cannot think on any mechanical keyboard with such layout. I also have my thinkpad in front of me and I may say that I have never used those keys.
i had this layout on a dz60 for a whileShow Image(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.dhresource.com%2F0x0s%2Ff2-albu-g1-M01-2D-E7-rBVaGFoQB-mAcoybAAE6bmQ66A8837.jpg)
also any ortho layout
I know it's pretty late in the game as far as this IC goes, but has there been any thought/discussion around either a full mod-colored F-row or blue pad-printed front legends for SysRq & Break (or more)?
[...]
I know it's pretty late in the game as far as this IC goes, but has there been any thought/discussion around either a full mod-colored F-row or blue pad-printed front legends for SysRq & Break (or more)?
[...]
Yes. At one point, I wanted this set to be more "authentic" (relative to what? all TP's are different) but anticipated the huge headache that that would be. :p
For example, if the 60% mods were black, then people would be asking for the accent keys only... because WoB is a thing... but we're already offering that. ;)
The "authentic 2000's TP" add-on will have to be for another round, I'm afraid.
First of all, a big thank you for proposing a TKL kit as default. I feel too many set designers opt for full kits even though a large percentage of the community are in the 60%-80% range and do not need to cover numpad. (IMHO, I personally see it as a money-grab despite all the rationale/excuses I've heard)
I personally have accumulated 3 GMK sets' alphas without mods to match them with (Ex: I've unused Oblivion alphas because I also got the hagoromo alphas), and ThinkCaps mods would be a fantastic match for them. Would it even be possible to offer a mods-only kit? (Everything in the TKL sans the alphas). Totally understand if you're not willing.
First of all, a big thank you for proposing a TKL kit as default. I feel too many set designers opt for full kits even though a large percentage of the community are in the 60%-80% range and do not need to cover numpad. (IMHO, I personally see it as a money-grab despite all the rationale/excuses I've heard)
I personally have accumulated 3 GMK sets' alphas without mods to match them with (Ex: I've unused Oblivion alphas because I also got the hagoromo alphas), and ThinkCaps mods would be a fantastic match for them. Would it even be possible to offer a mods-only kit? (Everything in the TKL sans the alphas). Totally understand if you're not willing.
The stories you hear are true... It's because of GMK pricing that you usually see larger base sets; it's much more expensive per key to split up the set into smaller kits. Not a money grab, imo.
The reason we're attempting it here is because the set is neutral enough (as far as colours go) to expect a number of users getting it for their standalone numpads. Whereas another more colourful set might not be as popular for this application.
So, no, there is no intention of splitting the alphas.
First of all, a big thank you for proposing a TKL kit as default. I feel too many set designers opt for full kits even though a large percentage of the community are in the 60%-80% range and do not need to cover numpad. (IMHO, I personally see it as a money-grab despite all the rationale/excuses I've heard)
I personally have accumulated 3 GMK sets' alphas without mods to match them with (Ex: I've unused Oblivion alphas because I also got the hagoromo alphas), and ThinkCaps mods would be a fantastic match for them. Would it even be possible to offer a mods-only kit? (Everything in the TKL sans the alphas). Totally understand if you're not willing.
The stories you hear are true... It's because of GMK pricing that you usually see larger base sets; it's much more expensive per key to split up the set into smaller kits. Not a money grab, imo.
The reason we're attempting it here is because the set is neutral enough (as far as colours go) to expect a number of users getting it for their standalone numpads. Whereas another more colourful set might not be as popular for this application.
So, no, there is no intention of splitting the alphas.
Got it. Thanks for the quick response and clarification. Still interested in the set - haven't decided on whether to pick up a TKL kit or Icon Mods + Novelties. Let's see how it goes!
First of all, a big thank you for proposing a TKL kit as default. I feel too many set designers opt for full kits even though a large percentage of the community are in the 60%-80% range and do not need to cover numpad. (IMHO, I personally see it as a money-grab despite all the rationale/excuses I've heard)
I personally have accumulated 3 GMK sets' alphas without mods to match them with (Ex: I've unused Oblivion alphas because I also got the hagoromo alphas), and ThinkCaps mods would be a fantastic match for them. Would it even be possible to offer a mods-only kit? (Everything in the TKL sans the alphas). Totally understand if you're not willing.
The stories you hear are true... It's because of GMK pricing that you usually see larger base sets; it's much more expensive per key to split up the set into smaller kits. Not a money grab, imo.
The reason we're attempting it here is because the set is neutral enough (as far as colours go) to expect a number of users getting it for their standalone numpads. Whereas another more colourful set might not be as popular for this application.
So, no, there is no intention of splitting the alphas.
Got it. Thanks for the quick response and clarification. Still interested in the set - haven't decided on whether to pick up a TKL kit or Icon Mods + Novelties. Let's see how it goes!
Np.
FYI, it may not be exactly what you're looking for, but Icon + RGB mods make a complete 60% modifier set..
I wonder the same: When is this happening?
I wonder the same: When is this happening?
November 16.
Sorry, I'll post the details at a later time.
is it going to be on Drop.com?
Am I missing something, or the pricing has not been announced yet?
I fear that multiple sets of this will be required. I have dug out a Cherry G80-3000 and a Cherry 1800 from storage just to put these on them.
Any news on vendors yet? We're almost a week out.
Please guys add italian support :(
I fear that multiple sets of this will be required. I have dug out a Cherry G80-3000 and a Cherry 1800 from storage just to put these on them.
Excellent :thumb:Any news on vendors yet? We're almost a week out.
Vendors are YAKK shop (myself for Canada), CandyKeys, Dixie Mech along with Daily Clack, zFrontier and IlumKBPlease guys add italian support :(
Italian and other Romance languages are not typically supported. For example, GMK Avanguardia (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=105981.0) is an upcoming Italian-designed keyset with no Italian support.
I fear that multiple sets of this will be required. I have dug out a Cherry G80-3000 and a Cherry 1800 from storage just to put these on them.
Excellent :thumb:Any news on vendors yet? We're almost a week out.
Vendors are YAKK shop (myself for Canada), CandyKeys, Dixie Mech along with Daily Clack, zFrontier and IlumKBPlease guys add italian support :(
Italian and other Romance languages are not typically supported. For example, GMK Avanguardia (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=105981.0) is an upcoming Italian-designed keyset with no Italian support.
Awesome to see this has vendors! You might want to add them to the made top thread for people to see!
Five days remaining and there is no prices yet?
Five days remaining and there is no prices yet?
Prices will be posted this week...
If that helps you, TKL and Ortho will most likely be $110 and $115, respectively.
The NordeUK's legends will be CP?
The NordeUK's legends will be CP?
Yes, CP legends everywhere except Accent (WS1).
Do you prefer USD or CAD prices?I think so long as the price values show which currency is being used. Nothing worse than shopping with the impression that you're shopping with one currency only to discover at checkout that it was another.
Do you prefer USD or CAD prices?I think so long as the price values show which currency is being used. Nothing worse than shopping with the impression that you're shopping with one currency only to discover at checkout that it was another.
Yes I will label it C$ and Paypal should confirm it as well.
As usual Paypal payment will be authorized but only captured when the GB ends.
extra 2u spacebar[/b] to the Ortho & 40's set. Enjoy! ;)
3. Lastly, we added an extra 2u spacebar to the Ortho & 40's set.40's set. Enjoy! ;)
3. Lastly, we added an extra 2u spacebar to the Ortho & 40's set.40's set. Enjoy! ;)
Oh very nice!
Sucks about the pricing increases but GMK is ramping up production so I'm sure there are inherent costs with trying to keep up with demand.
Good luck with the group buy! Been waiting on this for what feels like forever so it's nice to see this finally coming to fruition.
3. Lastly, we added an extra 2u spacebar to the Ortho & 40's set.40's set. Enjoy! ;)
Oh very nice!
Sucks about the pricing increases but GMK is ramping up production so I'm sure there are inherent costs with trying to keep up with demand.
Good luck with the group buy! Been waiting on this for what feels like forever so it's nice to see this finally coming to fruition.
Higher production volumes mean a better scale economy, they should reduce the prices, not increase them. GMK is full of surprises...
Is the GB approved yet?