Author Topic: COFFEE THREAD  (Read 79455 times)

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Offline Corgi Butts

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #150 on: Fri, 26 April 2019, 12:11:56 »
My Hario V60 setup at work is doing quite well for making cups during the day.  My main issue is that I'm using a JavaPresse hand grinder that I picked up on amazon with the hario and kettle and while it's easy to use, I find it difficult to get consistent flavor results in the cup, especially as I switch between different beans.  I'll finally dial it in with a bean and then grab something new and I'm back to square one again.  And it generates a lot of fines and boulders.  Need to pick up a decent compact grinder that generates consistent results.  Should probably just grab a Baratza Encore at some point and call it a day.

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #151 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 15:21:41 »
Tried my friend's Chemex today. Holy crow, what an overblown hypemachine. Took like 15 mins to brew a few cups of coffee with this stupid blanket of a filter you need to fold up in a special way, and it just tasted the exact same as when I brew coffee with a drip machine. Is it the waiting that gives the ego time to inflate, or does the filter contain little pompous particulates that mix into your coffee and make you smug from using the Chemex?

Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #152 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 15:27:34 »
Tried my friend's Chemex today. Holy crow, what an overblown hypemachine. Took like 15 mins to brew a few cups of coffee with this stupid blanket of a filter you need to fold up in a special way, and it just tasted the exact same as when I brew coffee with a drip machine. Is it the waiting that gives the ego time to inflate, or does the filter contain little pompous particulates that mix into your coffee and make you smug from using the Chemex?

Really? Was it just some cheap coffee? I had a pour over the other day (clever dripper, little different) and it was amazing. Sooo different than nasty drip.

But it was high quality fresh ground beans.

Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #153 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 15:29:12 »
Tried my friend's Chemex today. Holy crow, what an overblown hypemachine. Took like 15 mins to brew a few cups of coffee with this stupid blanket of a filter you need to fold up in a special way, and it just tasted the exact same as when I brew coffee with a drip machine. Is it the waiting that gives the ego time to inflate, or does the filter contain little pompous particulates that mix into your coffee and make you smug from using the Chemex?
You're clearly not worthy if you can't taste the difference.

Seriously though I think a lot of coffee preparation is hype.

But like the above poster said, fresh beans make a lot of difference.

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Offline noisyturtle

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #154 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 15:33:12 »
Tried my friend's Chemex today. Holy crow, what an overblown hypemachine. Took like 15 mins to brew a few cups of coffee with this stupid blanket of a filter you need to fold up in a special way, and it just tasted the exact same as when I brew coffee with a drip machine. Is it the waiting that gives the ego time to inflate, or does the filter contain little pompous particulates that mix into your coffee and make you smug from using the Chemex?

Really? Was it just some cheap coffee? I had a pour over the other day (clever dripper, little different) and it was amazing. Sooo different than nasty drip.

But it was high quality fresh ground beans.

No, it was fresh ground made from decent beans. I just don't get it. Is it because people don't wash their drip machines or use tap water and not filtered? It was the ****ing same! Just took much longer.

I reckon if you used some ****ty $5 hotel room Mr. Coffee machine there would be a difference, but using a good drip machine that is properly cleaned and uses fresh ground beans and filtered water tastes the same to me idk

Offline romevi

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #155 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 15:40:48 »
Here's my IngenuiTEA I use at work, which I mentioned a bit ago. Had this one for ten years.




I'll see if I can use it to make coffee.


And just for SpAmARaY, here's a pic of it cleaned.


Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #156 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 15:46:38 »
Here's my IngenuiTEA I use at work, which I mentioned a bit ago. Had this one for ten years.

Show Image



I'll see if I can use it to make coffee.


And just for SpAmARaY, here's a pic of it cleaned.

Show Image

It's on my amazon wish list. :thumb:

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Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #157 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 15:56:51 »
Tried my friend's Chemex today. Holy crow, what an overblown hypemachine. Took like 15 mins to brew a few cups of coffee with this stupid blanket of a filter you need to fold up in a special way, and it just tasted the exact same as when I brew coffee with a drip machine. Is it the waiting that gives the ego time to inflate, or does the filter contain little pompous particulates that mix into your coffee and make you smug from using the Chemex?

Really? Was it just some cheap coffee? I had a pour over the other day (clever dripper, little different) and it was amazing. Sooo different than nasty drip.

But it was high quality fresh ground beans.

No, it was fresh ground made from decent beans. I just don't get it. Is it because people don't wash their drip machines or use tap water and not filtered? It was the ****ing same! Just took much longer.

I reckon if you used some ****ty $5 hotel room Mr. Coffee machine there would be a difference, but using a good drip machine that is properly cleaned and uses fresh ground beans and filtered water tastes the same to me idk

Yeah most the time when I drink drip its from a cheap machine. We have an old school Bunn machine at work, fresh roast for me still taste like crap. IDK if its the plastic filter basket or what.

Offline dubious

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #158 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 16:05:27 »
Tried my friend's Chemex today. Holy crow, what an overblown hypemachine. Took like 15 mins to brew a few cups of coffee with this stupid blanket of a filter you need to fold up in a special way, and it just tasted the exact same as when I brew coffee with a drip machine. Is it the waiting that gives the ego time to inflate, or does the filter contain little pompous particulates that mix into your coffee and make you smug from using the Chemex?


Yaaa agreed, I've never been able the taste the difference between regular drip, chemex, or a "hand crafted pour-over." I also don't weigh my grounds, or use a specific ratio, I just kinda eye ball stuff. Good beans freshly ground makes the most difference to me.

Offline JP

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #159 on: Mon, 29 April 2019, 19:51:58 »
Finally got my French press after the seller forgot to ship it. Now I need to buy some decent coffee.

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #160 on: Tue, 30 April 2019, 10:56:39 »
Tried my friend's Chemex today. Holy crow, what an overblown hypemachine. Took like 15 mins to brew a few cups of coffee with this stupid blanket of a filter you need to fold up in a special way, and it just tasted the exact same as when I brew coffee with a drip machine. Is it the waiting that gives the ego time to inflate, or does the filter contain little pompous particulates that mix into your coffee and make you smug from using the Chemex?


Yaaa agreed, I've never been able the taste the difference between regular drip, chemex, or a "hand crafted pour-over." I also don't weigh my grounds, or use a specific ratio, I just kinda eye ball stuff. Good beans freshly ground makes the most difference to me.

It's probably possible to measure particle count/ acidity,  things like that , and MAYBE Chemex did , maybe they didn't.

Overall, I don't think Most humans have ever refined their palate to detect such differences.

For example,  people talk about how their new monitors are Great.

When in fact, EVERY new monitor is almost certainly shi7 until they're Calibrated.


But because the majority owners have never seen a reference image, They are not truly qualified to say, This looks good.

They have the freedom to say, something tastes or looks good to them.  But that's NOT a meaningful / testable assessment.


UNTIL they establish a REFERENCE cup of coffee.. The game is all just profit driven premium branding.


There are REAL life taste testers, who are both Super-Tasters (biological gift), AND trained to detect certain qualities of Edibles.

They've got panels of these people drinking different batches of orange juice, or Eating rice prepared with slightly different heating times.


Offline JP

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #161 on: Tue, 30 April 2019, 12:50:32 »
Chemex strips away the oils many find enjoyable which isn't an issue with a French press.
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Offline Carcharocles

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #162 on: Tue, 30 April 2019, 16:58:07 »
I should also point out that both drip machines and most homebrewers boil the water they use for coffee. This is a huge don't--boiling temperature is a bit too hot for coffee beans. About 195 - 200°F is the proper brewing temp (for anyone not still stuck in the Imperial System, this is approximately 91 - 93°C), but if you need it a little hotter, 205°F (96°C) is as high as you should go--any higher will disrupt the flavor. Temperature for the Aeropress is lower, at about 175°F (about 79 or 80°C). Chemex should definitely not exceed 205°F or 96°C, and yes, it does strip the oils if you use a paper filter (mesh filters exist, but they require a bit more technique to use).
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Offline smarmar

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #163 on: Wed, 01 May 2019, 10:18:22 »
Chemex strips away the oils many find enjoyable which isn't an issue with a French press.
^This is why I enjoy my moka pot so much. It's my main 99.9% of the time. No filter to steal the delicious oils.
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Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #164 on: Wed, 01 May 2019, 10:51:42 »


Chemex strips away the oils many find enjoyable which isn't an issue with a French press.
^This is why I enjoy my moka pot so much. It's my main 99.9% of the time. No filter to steal the delicious oils.

Another item on my 'to buy eventually' list.

Do you use a special grind/specific blend with the moka pot?





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Offline noisyturtle

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #165 on: Wed, 01 May 2019, 18:17:41 »
Finally got my French press after the seller forgot to ship it. Now I need to buy some decent coffee.

(Attachment Link)



I am curious what is the advantage of a gooseneck kettle? Is it for more precise pouring, or another reason??

Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #166 on: Wed, 01 May 2019, 18:49:18 »
I ordered a cheap V60, going to have the local guy do grind the beans for now, I only have the grinder on my Barista Express.

Whats the recommended grind for pour overs?

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #167 on: Wed, 01 May 2019, 19:53:42 »
Finally got my French press after the seller forgot to ship it. Now I need to buy some decent coffee.

(Attachment Link)



I am curious what is the advantage of a gooseneck kettle? Is it for more precise pouring, or another reason??
It's for better control of exact amount, rate and placement of pour.

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Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #168 on: Wed, 01 May 2019, 20:04:55 »
I ordered a cheap V60, going to have the local guy do grind the beans for now, I only have the grinder on my Barista Express.

Whats the recommended grind for pour overs?
You'll want it on the coarser side vs medium used for drip.

But whoever is grinding them can probably dial it in for you if you tell them your using the V60.

Just remember once ground the beans have a limited shelf life.

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Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #169 on: Wed, 01 May 2019, 20:07:28 »
I ordered a cheap V60, going to have the local guy do grind the beans for now, I only have the grinder on my Barista Express.

Whats the recommended grind for pour overs?
You'll want it on the coarser side vs medium used for drip.

But whoever is grinding them can probably dial it in for you if you tell them your using the V60.

Just remember once ground the beans have a limited shelf life.

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Yeah I figure they will know what to do. I totally don't like the idea of grinding before hand, but until I get a hand grinder its what I will do. Thanks

Offline smarmar

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #170 on: Thu, 02 May 2019, 10:56:49 »


Chemex strips away the oils many find enjoyable which isn't an issue with a French press.
^This is why I enjoy my moka pot so much. It's my main 99.9% of the time. No filter to steal the delicious oils.

Another item on my 'to buy eventually' list.

Do you use a special grind/specific blend with the moka pot?

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I use a manual hand-crank burr grinder set to the finest grain. Really any grinder that has a fine setting if fine.

The moka pots are meant for espresso grounds. I usually buy espresso roast beans but any fresh-roasted bean works well and tastes good.
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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #171 on: Tue, 07 May 2019, 20:59:24 »
My kid bought me a shot glass.



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Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #172 on: Thu, 09 May 2019, 11:38:49 »
I've had the v60 for about a week now. I don't have a gooseneck kettle, and the beans had to be grinded when I bought them because my grinder is on my espresso machine.

But have to say overall I am pretty happy. It's not magic, but it does put out a very nice balanced cup of coffee. I will never eye ball coffee again. I make the coffee for church in the morning in a big old school perc and I never seem to get the ratio right, going to bring my scale on Sunday.

That said still nothing beats a home made latte or cappuccino. They are still my first love but 2-3 cups of milk a day is bad for the ol' waste line.

Offline smarmar

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #173 on: Thu, 16 May 2019, 11:05:31 »
My kid bought me a shot glass.

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Is that a goshdarned war hammer on that glass? How manly!...but also kinda random.
I'm extremely partial to martial hammers. I once played a dwarf cleric in a long-running D&D campaign who's weapon of choice was a lucerne hammer.
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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #174 on: Thu, 16 May 2019, 11:11:39 »


My kid bought me a shot glass.

Show Image


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Is that a goshdarned war hammer on that glass? How manly!...but also kinda random.
I'm extremely partial to martial hammers. I once played a dwarf cleric in a long-running D&D campaign who's weapon of choice was a lucerne hammer.

I believe it's the logo for a local ball team, they went to a game and she bought it in the gift shop. But your version sounds cooler. :d

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Offline smarmar

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #175 on: Thu, 16 May 2019, 11:13:46 »


My kid bought me a shot glass.

Show Image


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Is that a goshdarned war hammer on that glass? How manly!...but also kinda random.
I'm extremely partial to martial hammers. I once played a dwarf cleric in a long-running D&D campaign who's weapon of choice was a lucerne hammer.

I believe it's the logo for a local ball team, they went to a game and she bought it in the gift shop. But your version sounds cooler. :d

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Hmmm...I guess it's more of a battle bat than a war hammer. Sounds cooler, anyway  :p
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Offline JP

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #176 on: Thu, 16 May 2019, 12:28:44 »
Looks like that would be great for piecing armor  :thumb:
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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #177 on: Thu, 16 May 2019, 15:19:16 »
Looks like that would be great for piecing armor  :thumb:

Chainmail for sure, but what about Plate ?

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #178 on: Wed, 05 June 2019, 15:33:00 »
Starting to notice I actually prefer my coffee brewed a little weak. I followed the general rule this morning and measured it all out using 2 tbsp per 6oz of water and it came out far too strong for my tastes. Like drinking black soup, way too strong. Feels weird being in the minority that actually prefers weaker-brewed coffee.

Offline JP

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #179 on: Wed, 05 June 2019, 17:57:31 »
Starting to notice I actually prefer my coffee brewed a little weak. I followed the general rule this morning and measured it all out using 2 tbsp per 6oz of water and it came out far too strong for my tastes. Like drinking black soup, way too strong. Feels weird being in the minority that actually prefers weaker-brewed coffee.

You just have refined tastes  :thumb:
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Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #180 on: Thu, 06 June 2019, 08:55:08 »
I recently bought some Mayorga Organics Cafe Cubano and it is very good.

Been doing french press and cold brew.

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Offline TacticalCoder

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #181 on: Fri, 14 June 2019, 07:41:16 »
I'm not a coffee connoisseur but, after drinking coffee from a Jura machine at a friend's place, I did replace my Nespresso with a fully automated machine a few months ago. It's better and it's also going to be much cheaper on the long run (I ran the numbers). I know I know: semi automated are better and should have gone semi + grinder but, hey, I'm lazy for coffee.

So I either use my fully automated machine (which I fill with beans and then let do the hard work) or I use my trusty old moka press.

I don't know much about coffee besides that I'm an addict since forever and, well, I can use a Moka press!
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Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #182 on: Fri, 14 June 2019, 15:23:39 »
Fruity, bright funky. I'm in love.

After making espresso from your standard choclatey type beans, I recently tried some stuff that was supposed to taste like orange soda! The first drink was odd but I am in love now.

Anyone recommend their favorite fruity light roast?

Offline smarmar

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #183 on: Thu, 11 July 2019, 12:18:02 »
Fruity, bright funky. I'm in love.

After making espresso from your standard choclatey type beans, I recently tried some stuff that was supposed to taste like orange soda! The first drink was odd but I am in love now.

Anyone recommend their favorite fruity light roast?
I'm not a huge fan of fruity teas or coffees...too tangy and tart. I can't recall the last time I had a light roast...I'm a med-dark roast man. That being said, I did have a delicious green ginger peach tea the other day at a tea house.

Looks like that would be great for piecing armor  :thumb:
The warhammers of yore, especially the lucerne hammer, were designed for exactly that. The hammer side for denting plate so that it would cave in, causing trauma to the body. Then the spiky side for the piercy stuff. Imagine your cuirass being pierced by multiple spikes so that the torn metal bits permanently embed in your chest and every move causes them to tear your flesh. :cool:

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Offline captainkai

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #184 on: Thu, 18 July 2019, 01:48:39 »
Has anyone here tried oat milk (not goat; oat) in coffee? I know of only one coffee joint in Orlando that has it as a creamer option. For you O-town folks, the place is called Lineage. They have 2 locales: one on Colonial near Mills and at East End Market. The flavour blows away any non-milk creamers that I've had and it's more subtle than almond so it doesn't overpower the coffeeness as much.

I recently tried oat milk at a local coffee place (on accident, the barista mixed up drinks), and it wasn't bad at all!  Tasted a bit sweeter than milk.

As for me, I keep going back to a Chemex + Kone filter setup  :thumb:

Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #185 on: Thu, 18 July 2019, 13:31:06 »
Fruity, bright funky. I'm in love.

After making espresso from your standard choclatey type beans, I recently tried some stuff that was supposed to taste like orange soda! The first drink was odd but I am in love now.

Anyone recommend their favorite fruity light roast?
...I'm a med-dark roast man.


Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D



Offline JP

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #186 on: Thu, 18 July 2019, 14:21:37 »
Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D

That or get Starbucks  :))
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Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #187 on: Thu, 18 July 2019, 16:34:15 »
Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D

That or get Starbucks  :))

Don't speak like that around here.  :-[       :))

Offline JP

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #188 on: Thu, 18 July 2019, 21:33:49 »
Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D

That or get Starbucks  :))

Don't speak like that around here.  :-[       :))

 ;D I'm not wrong though...they roast their beans extra dark to achieve a consistent flavor profile which is a polite way of saying burnt. Nothing wrong with that if it's what you prefer though.
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Offline lightsout714

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #189 on: Fri, 19 July 2019, 09:05:44 »
Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D

That or get Starbucks  :))

Don't speak like that around here.  :-[       :))

 ;D I'm not wrong though...they roast their beans extra dark to achieve a consistent flavor profile which is a polite way of saying burnt. Nothing wrong with that if it's what you prefer though.
For sure. Most American coffee is way over roasted imo. "Espresso roast" somehow means dark roast do you can make it in a drip machine and it tastes like "espresso". Yeah right. I mean if that's your thing is all good. I thought I liked dark roast until I started trying single origin light Ross and got to enjoy some real flavors.


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Offline ArchDill

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #190 on: Fri, 19 July 2019, 09:40:56 »
Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D

That or get Starbucks  :))

Don't speak like that around here.  :-[       :))

 ;D I'm not wrong though...they roast their beans extra dark to achieve a consistent flavor profile which is a polite way of saying burnt. Nothing wrong with that if it's what you prefer though.
For sure. Most American coffee is way over roasted imo. "Espresso roast" somehow means dark roast do you can make it in a drip machine and it tastes like "espresso". Yeah right. I mean if that's your thing is all good. I thought I liked dark roast until I started trying single origin light Ross and got to enjoy some real flavors.


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I do not mind Starbucks. I know they are frowned upon by most coffee lovers but they make a good latte and I love me a Flat White

Offline dubious

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #191 on: Fri, 19 July 2019, 15:56:54 »
Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D

That or get Starbucks  :))

Don't speak like that around here.  :-[       :))

 ;D I'm not wrong though...they roast their beans extra dark to achieve a consistent flavor profile which is a polite way of saying burnt. Nothing wrong with that if it's what you prefer though.
For sure. Most American coffee is way over roasted imo. "Espresso roast" somehow means dark roast do you can make it in a drip machine and it tastes like "espresso". Yeah right. I mean if that's your thing is all good. I thought I liked dark roast until I started trying single origin light Ross and got to enjoy some real flavors.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I do not mind Starbucks. I know they are frowned upon by most coffee lovers but they make a good latte and I love me a Flat White


Offline romevi

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #192 on: Fri, 19 July 2019, 16:51:19 »
Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D

That or get Starbucks  :))

Don't speak like that around here.  :-[       :))

 ;D I'm not wrong though...they roast their beans extra dark to achieve a consistent flavor profile which is a polite way of saying burnt. Nothing wrong with that if it's what you prefer though.
For sure. Most American coffee is way over roasted imo. "Espresso roast" somehow means dark roast do you can make it in a drip machine and it tastes like "espresso". Yeah right. I mean if that's your thing is all good. I thought I liked dark roast until I started trying single origin light Ross and got to enjoy some real flavors.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I do not mind Starbucks. I know they are frowned upon by most coffee lovers but they make a good latte and I love me a Flat White

Show Image


Do you think he's drinking Starbucks?

Offline JP

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #193 on: Fri, 19 July 2019, 17:06:05 »
Do you think he's drinking Starbucks?

Who, Clint Eastwood? Hell no. He's drinking tea  :p

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Offline TacticalCoder

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #194 on: Fri, 26 July 2019, 05:39:31 »
'dat Clint Eastwood gif holding a cup... I lol'ed.   Very apropos.
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Offline noisyturtle

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #195 on: Sun, 28 July 2019, 16:53:20 »
Did you know stores with a Starbucks in them generally use the same POS checkout system, so if the lines are too long chances are Starbucks could check you out much faster. A little secret tip for you all!

Offline smarmar

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #196 on: Mon, 05 August 2019, 10:26:45 »


Did you know stores with a Starbucks in them generally use the same POS checkout system, so if the lines are too long chances are Starbucks could check you out much faster. A little secret tip for you all!
*mind blown*

[/quote]

Might as well just go brew up some coals out of the BBQ :D



[/quote]
Nobody told me that that was a thing!
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Offline noisyturtle

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #197 on: Mon, 05 August 2019, 15:47:32 »
Been having one of these with my coffee in the morning. You set it on top of the mug like a cover and the steam melts the caramel inside.

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #198 on: Mon, 05 August 2019, 15:53:21 »
Been having one of these with my coffee in the morning. You set it on top of the mug like a cover and the steam melts the caramel inside.


NT dabbles in BLACK MAGIC.

Offline smarmar

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Re: COFFEE THREAD
« Reply #199 on: Tue, 06 August 2019, 11:16:45 »
Been having one of these with my coffee in the morning. You set it on top of the mug like a cover and the steam melts the caramel inside.


NT dabbles in BLACK MAGIC.
Black magic, purple magic, whatever...those things are gooooooood! If you're into delicious liqueurs try Van Meer's Stroopwafel Liqueur in yer coffee. I did. No regrets.
1992 IBM Model M | Tesoro Durandal[Browns] | Hi-Tek Series 725[Space Invaders] | Tandy Enhanced[Sliders] | Dell Quiet Keys | Mitsumi[AT]