geekhack
geekhack Community => Keyboards => Topic started by: ComradeSniper on Tue, 18 December 2012, 23:08:20
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Hi all, I finally decided to stop lurking and post here. I'll start off by saying I received a Filco Majestouch 2 Ninja with Blues today as my first mechanical keyboard, and I love it. Feels so much nicer than the Razer Lycosa I was typing on before.
Anyway, on to the topic at hand. My friends have been giving me a lot of crap for dropping $160 on a keyboard. I can't really blame them, I was going between this and a Leopold and ended up going for the Filco because it looks awesome. Since this is my first mech keyboard, I don't really have anything to compare it to, which is why I came here to ask, is there much of a quality difference between Filco boards and other cheaper boards, or is the main appeal of Filco keyboards their appearance?
Thanks in advance. Have a little Filco porn for your troubles :p
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It's a great standard of Cherry MX keyboards given their general aesthetics, as well as customizability (considering all the custom cases that end up being made for them, as well as the recent bpiphany programmable controller). Has possibly nicer internals than other competing boards (attached cable, heavier PCB, cleaner stock soldering job). The front-printed keycaps from the "Ninja" boards also have more resale value than many other keyboards' stock keycaps, and its clean use of italicized Futura probably helps with that.
But some would forgo all of the above for some cheaper alternatives like the Quickfire Rapid, because the Filco's doubled price doesn't necessarily mean it's twice as good.
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manufactures/designers attention to detail
e.g. for aesthetics sake take the black filco inlay on the front of the ninja it just looks awesome
and as far mechanical wise- double layer circuit board and plate mounted switches won me over
all 980g of it.
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Filcos are amazing. The only thing that might be considered a con about them is that they don't have the detachable USB option. However, many custom USB cables now come with the purchase option of a Filco adapter ( ex: MiMICS Cables (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36065.0) ). Oh, and also some alleged complaints about "pinging" noises from key depressions have been made. But not every user experiences that issue, and there are many threads about how to fix this if it really is a bother.
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980 cross that 960g of it*
after digging in my previous post-
i weighed it in this thread on my crappy kitchen scale:
http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=34505.msg654810#msg654810
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Just a good solid keyboard from a recognised name.
Ducky is similar, but backlit.
CM QFR is good quality too, but much cheaper (and TKL).
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I notice a lot of people being turned off from something with the name ducky thinking it's not as good of a product. Filco's designs are pretty blank and likeable by virtually anyone. they're like the essential mech keyboard.
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First of all, Razer Lycosa is a membrane keyboard. Totally different league than a Filco.
Main reason Filco is the reference keyboard on here is because it stood the test of time, where it has high reliability, nice aesthetics, and quality internals, all for a decent price. Other boards like Deck or Das are solid boards too, but their aesthetics and price is a turnoff (especially for Deck). Recently, now there are many Chinese, Taiwanese, and Korean keyboards (excluding customs) that emerge that drive prices down, namely Leopold, Ducky, or CoolerMaster. Overall, they're good keyboards, but have not been around as long and quality has not surpassed Filco yet to be the new standard.
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I notice a lot of people being turned off from something with the name ducky thinking it's not as good of a product. Filco's designs are pretty blank and likeable by virtually anyone. they're like the essential mech keyboard.
The problem lies with Ducky's quack engineers that refuse to fix their severely unpolished product despite release newer "versions".
Ducky 9008
(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k221/undarken/random/Sucky.jpg)
Ducky Shine
(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k221/undarken/Ducky%20Shine/sucky1.jpg)
- Badly offseted keys
- Overly tall start height of the keyboard
- Cable guide tend to be sharp that "cut" into the cable unless other competitors
and the list goes on...
Filco are far more well-designed/finished as compared to Ducky. Filco are not perfect either.
Found on older tenkeyless models(Filco Gen 1)
(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k221/undarken/random/Filco1.jpg)
But Costar have somewhat "fixed/reduce" the flaw in newer models (QFR and Filco MJ2)
(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k221/undarken/random/Offset.jpg)
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^Squarebox: Ducky did improve their quality a little with this year's model (they're Costar. 1000 Series I was told by a Ducky rep that it is a Costar as well, but at the cheapest subcontract factory). But they have to go and pull this. http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=38115.msg739441#msg739441 see pix 1 and 5.
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Filcos are amazing. The only thing that might be considered a con about them is that they don't have the detachable USB option. However, many custom USB cables now come with the purchase option of a Filco adapter ( ex: MiMICS Cables (http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=36065.0) ). Oh, and also some alleged complaints about "pinging" noises from key depressions have been made. But not every user experiences that issue, and there are many threads about how to fix this if it really is a bother.
Filco Adapter? Can you explain more about this to me?
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He meant a Molex connector that will connect directly to the Filco PCB.
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Ah ok, thanks!
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^Squarebox: Ducky did improve their quality a little with this year's model (they're Costar. 1000 Series I was told by a Ducky rep that it is a Costar as well, but at the cheapest subcontract factory). But they have to go and pull this. http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=38115.msg739441#msg739441 see pix 1 and 5.
If that is true, even at the cheapest subcontract factory would make it just as bad as before. Until someone posts detail pics on the internal, for all we know it may even be made by the terrible iOne because Costar dont really manufacture backlit keyboards.
The only-known backlit keyboards that Costar help manufacture so far is the Mionix Zibal which has a custom PCB which is probably designed by Mionix themselves.
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Are we sure about that?
I could've sworn people were talking about costar bring backlit keyboards to some sort of electronics conference.
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One more reason why I prefer Filco over all the other modern boards, is the case, especially the surface of the case. Its more rough (PBT like) than most of the other boards, which have a very clear plastic surface which makes them more vulnerable to become shiny compared to the Filco.
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If that is true, even at the cheapest subcontract factory would make it just as bad as before. Until someone posts detail pics on the internal, for all we know it may even be made by the terrible iOne because Costar dont really manufacture backlit keyboards.
The only-known backlit keyboards that Costar help manufacture so far is the Mionix Zibal which has a custom PCB which is probably designed by Mionix themselves.
I think you misunderstood. 1000 series aren't built at the same factory as 9000 series.
The Taiwanese factories certainly can make backlit boards.
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FILCO SUCKO, LOLOLOL
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They're just iconic. I buy Filco boards because I like the minimalistic design. The inlayed Filco badge is just sexy.
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The name...
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They're just iconic. I buy Filco boards because I like the minimalistic design. The inlayed Filco badge is just sexy.
Yea but it's the ghetto kinda inlay, not the individual letters kinda inlay.
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their keyboards are sexy especially the tkl ninja imo. I wish more kbd manufactures will emerge and produce keyboards with similar minimal aesthetics.
it gives a vibe of high quality.
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It's the premium for mechanical keyboards everywhere
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It's the premium for mechanical keyboards everywhere
I just want to know why, it seems like the CM Storm keyboards are nearly the same thing with different looks.
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It's the premium for mechanical keyboards everywhere
I just want to know why, it seems like the CM Storm keyboards are nearly the same thing with different looks.
The filco uses a thicker PCB, less likely to crack, and stiffer.
I don't think this makes a difference in the feel of the switches though because both keyboards are plate mounted.
The filco also has better STOCK keycaps, apparently has a UV protection layer. I don't know if this was changed in recent models.
The Quickfire Rapid has SUPER Crappy keycaps, the legend starts to turn gray and worn within 2 days of use. disappointed I was.
So I got a blank white set from ebay.. They felt weird at first because I'm used to feeling the bumpy legend under my fingers. But i got used to it. and now when I go back to a keyboard WITH feel-able legend, it's agony.
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Filco is pretty overpriced if you ask me. It is similar to the Das, but looks better and costs more and way more than Leopold. Though I guess Leopold doesn't have as much advertisement and brand name.
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Filco is pretty overpriced if you ask me. It is similar to the Das, but looks better and costs more and way more than Leopold. Though I guess Leopold doesn't have as much advertisement and brand name.
Filco has advertisement? haven't seen any certainly not razer level advertisement anyways.
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I guess we advertise it here a lot lolz.
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I guess we advertise it here a lot lolz.
It is some sort of advertisement but not a very effective one because it reaches only people who got to this forum or other forums who specialize in keyboards in searchof probably a mechanical keyboard. so it isn't directed at a mass audience.
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It's hard to say what makes a Filco so special. I have two QFR's, and there's something a bit indescribable about typing on my Filco as compared to the QFR's. I know they're made in the same factory and all, but still. It just feels more solid.
Totally could be confirmation bias though, I haven't ruled that out yet.
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probably psychological... your mind is playing tricks on you.
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Ya know, I'm actually totally cool with that.
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their keyboards are sexy especially the tkl ninja imo.
/me all for the beige one
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It's hard to say what makes a Filco so special. I have two QFR's, and there's something a bit indescribable about typing on my Filco as compared to the QFR's. I know they're made in the same factory and all, but still. It just feels more solid.
Totally could be confirmation bias though, I haven't ruled that out yet.
I actually prefer my QFR over my Filcos, although that's probably down to the caps, my QFR has gotten a set of POM caps whereas my Filos still have their stock caps, which are not all that good.
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ninja caps are cool and all but I come to realize I never look at my keyboard. ><
Was thinking of getting ninja 10keyless as my first kb
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I think Filco (Diatec) has great customer service. I've had problems with my Filco twice out of warranty and both times Diatec wrote me nice emails and shipped me replacement parts for free.
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Filco + PBT Caps = best cherry experience so far.
Eagerly anticipating putting some PBT's on a WASD V2 (need that hardware switchable caps/ctrl)
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Filco + PBT Caps = best cherry experience so far.
Eagerly anticipating putting some PBT's on a WASD V2 (need that hardware switchable caps/ctrl)
Big pbt makes anything feel good haha.
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is there much of a quality difference between Filco boards and other cheaper boards, or is the main appeal of Filco keyboards their appearance?
I could buy 1 Filco or 3 Rosewills (Cherry Reds).
Are Filcos better than Rosewills?
Filcos have Pad printed keycaps so Rosewills are better.
Filcos have normal USB cable so Filcos are better.
Filcos have solid cable connection so Filcos are better.
Filcos cannot detach their cable so Rosewills are better.
I went for 3 Rosewills because 312 keys are better than 104 :p
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Filco have nicer yellow keycaps ;)
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You can also get Filcos with front printed keycaps although that version does cost a bit more.
With other keyboards u would have to buy front-printed keycaps separately.
If u care about such things.
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is there much of a quality difference between Filco boards and other cheaper boards, or is the main appeal of Filco keyboards their appearance?
I could buy 1 Filco or 3 Rosewills (Cherry Reds).
Are Filcos better than Rosewills?
Filcos have Pad printed keycaps so Rosewills are better.
Filcos have normal USB cable so Filcos are better.
Filcos have solid cable connection so Filcos are better.
Filcos cannot detach their cable so Rosewills are better.
I went for 3 Rosewills because 312 keys are better than 104 :p
Filcos are made in Japan so Filcos are better.
Filco has better customer service so Filco is better.
Filco is not a Rosewill so Filco is better.
For what it's worth, my Filco has a Multicam pattern on it and Cherry double shot keycaps.
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Filco have nicer yellow keycaps ;)
Yes, I actually just ordered one with Black switches :p
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Filcos have normal USB cable so Filcos are better.
Filcos have solid cable connection so Filcos are better.
Filcos cannot detach their cable so Rosewills are better.
This makes almost no sense, are you talking about the cord to PCB joint or something?
Filcos are made in Japan so Filcos are better.
No, they may be a japanese company but they are made in TAIWAN.
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As someone who compulsively taps fingers on the dead space just above the arrow keys, I am in love with the relative silence of the filco compared to other keyboards such as the Das, 6gv2, or (gasp) membrane boards. It's probably all in my head but this makes me feel as if the design is pretty solid.
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I had a Filco and sold it. Unfortunately there is no spell over me with this brand. I do, however, think their logo is very nice looking and would not mind it on any of my keyboards.
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http://www.twsbi.com/
Taiwanese company.
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http://www.twsbi.com/
Taiwanese company.
Japanese pens are still the best.
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http://www.twsbi.com/
Taiwanese company.
Japanese pens are still the best.
There are all sort of writing instruments. The Japanese gel pens are great. Nobody made Japanese Maki-e fountain pens as artistic as coming from Japan. On the other hands, I have not seen lawyers and top bosses use another other than Montblanc pens. This is a marketing issue.
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Yeah, people in suits usually wear Montblanc pens for some reason. I don't see what makes them special besides their logo.
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unfair price.
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Filco build is nice except for the keycaps and the non detachable cable. The one thing that puts the QFR on top for me though is the media keys.
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aesthetics, weight (heavy pcb), build quality.
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When I hear people say build quality I hear "I have no idea"
Try to be more specific than just "I like it"
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When I hear people say build quality I hear "I have no idea"
Try to be more specific than just "I like it"
"Build quality" means free from defects in materials, design, or workmanship such as wobbling keyboard, breaking cable connectors, failing ICs, etc.
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Filco is pretty overpriced if you ask me. It is similar to the Das, but looks better and costs more and way more than Leopold. Though I guess Leopold doesn't have as much advertisement and brand name.
honestly the extra bulky plastic on the das and shiny finish is bad enough that it justifies the price of a filco.
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"Build quality" means free from defects in materials, design, or workmanship such as wobbling keyboard, breaking cable connectors, failing ICs, etc.
Also, freedom from reverberation on impact from typing. I find my filco to be comparatively silent compared to the das in that respect. I find myself calling this "build quality" when people ask me why I have it.
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I find Filco to be just better quality.
Maybe not comparable to Leopold, but I can get a TKL filco for $139 AUD and a Leopold FC700R for $120. I find the $19 increase is well worth it considering the lack of hassle in getting new keycaps, and the pretty logo on the front not to mention it's costar.
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"Build quality" means free from defects in materials, design, or workmanship such as wobbling keyboard, breaking cable connectors, failing ICs, etc.
Also, freedom from reverberation on impact from typing. I find my filco to be comparatively silent compared to the das in that respect. I find myself calling this "build quality" when people ask me why I have it.
aluminum case really helps with the reverberations too.
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"Build quality" means free from defects in materials, design, or workmanship such as wobbling keyboard, breaking cable connectors, failing ICs, etc.
Also, freedom from reverberation on impact from typing. I find my filco to be comparatively silent compared to the das in that respect. I find myself calling this "build quality" when people ask me why I have it.
aluminum case really helps with the reverberations too.
A towel or a giant mouse pad under keyboard helps too, no joke.
Though I find it odd that people list "non-detachable cable" as a negative, in my opinion it's s plus because it will have a lower chance to break. I honestly haven't heard anyone break the Filco cable yet.
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I like them. I get to switch my kb without having to go behind my tower.
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"Build quality" means free from defects in materials, design, or workmanship such as wobbling keyboard, breaking cable connectors, failing ICs, etc.
Also, freedom from reverberation on impact from typing. I find my filco to be comparatively silent compared to the das in that respect. I find myself calling this "build quality" when people ask me why I have it.
aluminum case really helps with the reverberations too.
A towel or a giant mouse pad under keyboard helps too, no joke.
Though I find it odd that people list "non-detachable cable" as a negative, in my opinion it's s plus because it will have a lower chance to break. I honestly haven't heard anyone break the Filco cable yet.
the towel and mousepad alone doesn't feel anything like a heavy metal case... it's spongy vs brick wall... I'm not saying one's better, but that's the difference.
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I like them. I get to switch my kb without having to go behind my tower.
For this reason, I wish my stock Filco had a detachable cable.