Bing Cashback Back For Ebay

[skcheng]

Currently 8% off when using Bing as your search vehicle on Buy it Now purchases on Ebay paid with Paypal.    That's a lot and it adds up quickly.  

For those who don't know about Bing (seemingly everyone here on Geekhack), simply set up an account at Bing.com.

Log in to cash back stores.

Search for Ebay under stores listed under the letter "E".  

Click on the Ebay link and purchase any item listed with a Buy it Now.  

Pay with Paypal (which I hate.....but I'll use if I get an 8% discount).  

That's it.  Some cashback payments will be immediate.  Others will take two months.  

Other sites that might be of interest here on Geekhack:

Newegg - 2%
Buy.com - 4-7%
J&R Music and Computer World - 5%
Lenovo - 10%
Office Depot - 10%
TigerDirect.com -  10.4 to 12% (been at 15% in the past)

And tons of other stores.  

Doesn't cost anything and Microsoft doesn't appear to send any Spam for signing up.  

I bought a TV online at Best Buy when they had a 10% discount.  Got $150 cashback into my Paypal account just recently.   Turned that into a couple of keyboards  )

Love to hear if others use this and any (+) and/or (-) feedback.

[hyperlinked]

This is effin awesome. I'm going to be plunking down a nice hunk of change to upgrade to Adobe CS5 pretty soon. This will come in handy for sure!

Thanks!

[skcheng]

This is effin awesome. I'm going to be plunking down a nice hunk of change to upgrade to Adobe CS5 pretty soon. This will come in handy for sure!

Thanks!

Cool!!  Be sure to sign up for the instant cashback also.  You win big time when the auction includes free shipping.  The shipping isn't part of the cashback.

[wellington1869]

i mentioned bing on GH back when it was still called 'ms live search cashback' Bing is great, i rarely make a major ebay purchase without it. Dont know why its not more popular. 8% off the top isnt bad, for very little effort.

[Rajagra]

What's the catch?

That's a rhetorical question, please don't answer it. If you can get 8% off of something you would have paid the full price for that's great. But 'they' have ulterior motives, so read the small print, ask yourself if you are being manipulated.

[wellington1869]

What's the catch?

That's a rhetorical question, please don't answer it. If you can get 8% off of something you would have paid the full price for that's great. But 'they' have ulterior motives, so read the small print, ask yourself if you are being manipulated.

well, the "catch" is you only get the 8% if you search for the product using bing.com which is MS's search engine; its obviously meant to promote their search engine.
I pretty much only use bing for its ebay discounts, so it hasnt swayed me away from google.com yet. I'm sure its a fine search engine but old habits die hard.
I dont know of any other catches; i've used bing-cashback now for over a year at least once a month and the process has been smooth and predictable. My cashback appears instantly in my paypal account within minutes of an ebay purchase.

That's a rhetorical question, please don't answer it.

oops.

[skcheng]

What's the catch?

That's a rhetorical question, please don't answer it. If you can get 8% off of something you would have paid the full price for that's great. But 'they' have ulterior motives, so read the small print, ask yourself if you are being manipulated.

What does the small print say??

[Rajagra]

What does the small print say??

No idea, I've just become very cynical over the years. I avoid schemes that try to manipulate me, even if it costs me money. When somebody offers me something for nothing, I suspect there's a catch until proven otherwise.

An example: I recently had a cold call from my phone company offering a change to my contract that made my line rental a bit cheaper. I checked there were no other changes to prices and it seemed OK. Normally I wouldn't just agree to such a thing from a cold call, but I was still in a fuddled state because they had woken me up. So I agreed. When the paperwork came through a few weeks later, the catch became clear - by making the change I had committed to my contract for another year. Also this commitment will self-renew every year without my consenting to it in any way! The onus is on me to tell them I don't want to keep committing to it. (I'm not sure this concept is even legal, but that's what the paperwork says.)

Now this isn't a problem for me as such. I have no plans to change provider. But the point is you don't get anything for nothing. Not from a business, anyway.

[wellington1869]

well you're right to be uber-cautious (i am too most of the time) but sometimes the cutthroat competition out there actually can work in consumer's favor!
I think this is just a case of MS competing with google's own 'froogle' network of sellers/advertisers. Google also runs a 10% discount program from time to time (during holiday season for instance) if you use the google payment program (I forget what its called. oh yea, its called "google checkout").

[skcheng]

No idea, I've just become very cynical over the years. I avoid schemes that try to manipulate me, even if it costs me money. When somebody offers me something for nothing, I suspect there's a catch until proven otherwise.

I don't know.....I'm never cynical.  I'm just the optimistic "glass half full" type.  I personally don't see any catch using Bing.com.  

I just a Google search LOL on "Bing cashback" and couldn't come with any negatives.   There are already people who have figured out how to "cheat" the system.  

But so far using Bing as a search vehicle hasn't panned out as fully as Microsoft would like.

[hyperlinked]

No idea, I've just become very cynical over the years. I avoid schemes that try to manipulate me, even if it costs me money. When somebody offers me something for nothing, I suspect there's a catch until proven otherwise.

I'm there with you. I usually would rather just pay a competitive fair price than have to work at finding the rock bottom price from a vendor that I have no history with. I didn't scour the Bing fine print and probably should have. I just figured that the catch was the following

• Gets you to use Bing
• Microsoft gets no bull**** hard data about your purchasing habits across the entire spectrum of marketplaces
• Your usage might pad some stats for Microsoft that they can leverage to get more favorable terms with retailers later
• Might help them get you to buy a bunch of **** you don't need
• The discounts may be priced in at some places

Does Microsoft pay the rebate enitrely or does the retailer have to chip in some as well?

I bought a portable hard drive and I wasn't able to use my credit card on it through PayPal. Someone out there is probably claiming part of the fee that would normally go to the credit card company.

I know I'm probably going to pay for this eventually in some way whether directly or indirectly. The question is if I'll end up paying for this behavior even if I don't get the deal.

Also, if this hurts retailers that I favor, I'm not going to make it a habit.

[skcheng]

I'm there with you. I usually would rather just pay a competitive fair price than have to work at finding the rock bottom price from a vendor that I have no history with. I didn't scour the Bing fine print and probably should have. I just figured that the catch was the following

• Gets you to use Bing
• Microsoft gets no bull**** hard data about your purchasing habits across the entire spectrum of marketplaces
• Your usage might pad some stats for Microsoft that they can leverage to get more favorable terms with retailers later

Does Microsoft pay the rebate enitrely or does the retailer have to chip in some as well?

I bought a portable hard drive and I wasn't able to use my credit card on it through PayPal. Someone out there is probably claiming part of the fee that would normally go to the credit card company.

I know I'm probably going to pay for this eventually in some way whether directly or indirectly. The question is if I'll end up paying for this behavior even if I don't get the deal.

Also, if this hurts retailers that I favor, I'm not going to make it a habit.

Why weren't you able to use your credit card through Paypal??   Was it an Ebay purchase?  

I think if Bing cashback hurt ebay sellers, it would be mentioned somewhere.  So far after 100 or so purchases through Bing, I haven't heard anyone complain to me.  

Just thought I'd share Bing cashback with fellow Geekhackers.   It's not like it's a big scam or anything??

I simply learned to save when and where I can.   Sites like Bens Bargains and Slickdeals are the ones to search for discounts/rebates etc..   And they often post good deals that are often even better with Bing cashback.

[wellington1869]

I actually always do a quick google search for the latest e-coupons before i buy anything online. You get some amazing deals that way. techbargains.com is another great site that lists ecoupon codes and online deals. Its been around forever; was featured in a new york times article at one point. I've used it for years.

I also like boddit.com., can search for deals/coupons on a particular product.

[hyperlinked]

Why weren't you able to use your credit card through Paypal??   Was it an Ebay purchase?  

TigerDirect.com didn't seem to give me a credit card through PayPal option. Maybe it was there and PayPal hid it in a new place.

I think if Bing cashback hurt ebay sellers, it would be mentioned somewhere.  So far after 100 or so purchases through Bing, I haven't heard anyone complain to me.

I imagine eBay/PayPal are key partners of Microsoft in this so perhaps eBay is picking up the tab for your discount on eBay purchases, but you have to wonder what the terms are for the other retailers outside of eBay.

Just thought I'd share Bing cashback with fellow Geekhackers. It's not like it's a big scam or anything??

I don't think anyone was suggesting it's a scam, but more of a buyer beware kind of situation in which you are likely to end up paying for your free lunch whether directly or indirectly in the long haul.

You have to admit, it does come close to sounding too good to be true and that's always a reason to move ahead with caution.

[skcheng]

TigerDirect.com didn't seem to give me a credit card through PayPal option. Maybe it was there and PayPal hid it in a new place.


I imagine eBay/PayPal are key partners of Microsoft in this so perhaps eBay is picking up the tab for your discount on eBay purchases, but you have to wonder what the terms are for the other retailers outside of eBay.

 
I don't think anyone was suggesting it's a scam, but more of a buyer beware kind of situation in which you are likely to end up paying for your free lunch whether directly or indirectly in the long haul.

You have to admit, it does come close to sounding too good to be true and that's always a reason to move ahead with caution.

Caution is probably wise in this day and age.   Meanwhile, Tigerdirect is one of my FAVORITE Bing cashback stores.  They've had up to 15% off at various times.  You did something wrong buddy!!   Next time you buy something off of Tiger Direct, I'll go through the steps with you.   It can be a little confusing at first getting Bing cashback to work.    I picked up a laptop for practically "free" after all of the discounts and rebates etc...

[wellington1869]

seriously, you guys are missing out on some truly amazing online deals if you're going to be fuddy duddy. Paypal btw also has some amazing buyer protections. The one time I got ripped off on ebay they refunded my purchase price in a week. They have a $2000 (or so) guarantee on most purchases (the ones that arent covered are clearly marked when you check out).
yea its good to be cautious but capitalism does eventually work, too.

The bing discount program may not last forever either, seems like its simply an ongoing promotion for bing, for now. MS has a lot of catching up to do with google and others.

[Infinite north]

Google searching bing scam I found this:

http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/is_bing_cashback_costing_users_money_sometimes_yes.php

Also saw some complaints about people using the service and it not functioning so they didn't get the rebate. There is also the obligatory http://bingcashbackscam.com/. Looking through it I couldn't even see why it was set up in the first place, just looks like someone needed a domain to hate the service in. I USED BING CASH BACK AND IT LEFT THE NEXT MORNING AND NEVER RETURNED MY CALLS.

[skcheng]

Google searching bing scam I found this:

http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/is_bing_cashback_costing_users_money_sometimes_yes.php

Also saw some complaints about people using the service and it not functioning so they didn't get the rebate. There is also the obligatory http://bingcashbackscam.com/. Looking through it I couldn't even see why it was set up in the first place, just looks like someone needed a domain to hate the service in. I USED BING CASH BACK AND IT LEFT THE NEXT MORNING AND NEVER RETURNED MY CALLS.

I've never not received my Bing cashback.   And even when I didn't do things correctly (initially), Bing support still credited my account.

So I'm assuming you've never used Bing cashback before??   Like anything else  (Paypal for ex), it's not perfect.   But how can you lose if you get 8% back for every Ebay purchase you make??   It's not like Ebay sellers are jacking things up 8% to compensate?

[kishy]

How is the discount applied? A PayPal coupon code, adjusted total in checkout, or a separate payment back to your PayPal account after checking out?

[skcheng]

How is the discount applied? A PayPal coupon code, adjusted total in checkout, or a separate payment back to your PayPal account after checking out?

You have a choice of Paypal reimbursement, mailed payment and I think direct deposit into a checking account IIRC.   I've only used the Paypal option and the money is usually spent as soon as it hits  

[nowsharing]

Don't use your cashback rewards on small purchases though, because you're limited to 100 on Ebay. I used all of mine up without realizing there was a limit.

[kishy]

Screw that, I'd do a monthly cash out to my bank account (or do they limit those as well?)

[skcheng]

Don't use your cashback rewards on small purchases though, because you're limited to 100 on Ebay. I used all of mine up without realizing there was a limit.

Didn't know that.  Thanks for the info.   I probably have 30 this year so far on ebay.   Mostly keyboards LOL.

[wellington1869]

Didn't know that.  Thanks for the info.   I probably have 30 this year so far on ebay.   Mostly keyboards LOL.

yea i didnt know that either, good to know.
I'm probably doing about 20 a year right now.

[tamasrepus]

Good to know The eBay/Paypal cashback thing is back, it looked for a while that Microsoft had killed it—cashback links haven't been showing up for some two weeks.

cashbackr.com has a trend graph of cashback percentages so you can see how it's been fluctuating lately.

[wellington1869]

my standard search term on bing is "t43". the ebay 8% link has always shown up when i do that.
I heard tho that if you do a few purchases rapidly in a row that the cashback drops to 5% and so on. If you wait a week or so it comes back up to 8%. There's some formula that seems to determine the actual cashback percentage based on usage probably. At my usage rates tho i've always gotten 8% at least, from ebay anyway.

[hyperlinked]

So.... I think we've answered a question that nobody was really asking. I think we've pretty well established that it's not hard to get your cash back.

The question is whether this is simply a very aggressive way for Microsoft to gain marketshare for their search engine and place a check on the growth of Google Checkout at the same time or is the data being collected going to end up toward some sinister end somewhere down the road?

Or perhaps Microsoft already understands something about the people who would be attracted to this that the rest of us don't. For example, when I buy something through a discount program, they're things that have been on my shopping list for months or they're things I really need urgently. They money I get back almost never turns into an unplanned purchase. I'm probably not a very valuable user to them unless the cost of giving me a discount is that I have a friend, skcheng, who finds out about it through me and he's likely to think of other things he could now buy with the extra money he got back.

Of course, the scenario unfolded in reverse in this case, but it's a plausible objective and one that I'd be comfortable with if it was part of the rationale for the service because then my participation may give MS some market research, but otherwise won't come back to silently bite me a year or two from now. My modest savings would be subsidized by the extra shopping that Chenger's doing.

[izzypizzy]

Bing CB is great. I've gotten close to $200 in CB from tigerdirect this year, it took a couple months, but I was e-mailed each time it was ready, and I deposited it directly into my checking account.

[tamasrepus]

The question is whether this is simply a very aggressive way for Microsoft to gain marketshare for their search engine and place a check on the growth of Google Checkout at the same time or is the data being collected going to end up toward some sinister end somewhere down the road?

Google Checkout is a completely different product from Bing Cashback. Apples and oranges.

I'm not sure why the data collected is any more sinister than data collected for normal searches or the data collected for any of Microsoft's more popular web destinations... it's worth pointing out that Bing has a 6-month data retention policy, beating out Google's 9 months.

Or perhaps Microsoft already understands something about the people who would be attracted to this that the rest of us don't. For example, when I buy something through a discount program, they're things that have been on my shopping list for months or they're things I really need urgently. They money I get back almost never turns into an unplanned purchase. I'm probably not a very valuable user to them unless the cost of giving me a discount is that I have a friend, skcheng, who finds out about it through me and he's likely to think of other things he could now buy with the extra money he got back.

Of course, the scenario unfolded in reverse in this case, but it's a plausible objective and one that I'd be comfortable with if it was part of the rationale for the service because then my participation may give MS some market research, but otherwise won't come back to silently bite me a year or two from now. My modest savings would be subsidized by the extra shopping that Chenger's doing.

There are an arbitrary number of business strategies Microsoft may be trying.

IMHO, it's a way for Microsoft to get people to use Bing for product searches instead of Google. People doing product searches are usually signaling an intent to buy something, which drives up the rates for those keyword advertisements on Bing.

[hyperlinked]

Google Checkout is a completely different product from Bing Cashback. Apples and oranges.

I brought that up as a possible rationale because the Bing search engine's most direct competitor is Google and Google Payments is the most directly competitor to one of the major partners in Bing Cashback, eBay/PayPal.

I'm not sure why the data collected is any more sinister than data collected for normal searches or the data collected for any of Microsoft's more popular web destinations... it's worth pointing out that Bing has a 6-month data retention policy, beating out Google's 9 months.

Sorry, I didn't mean to suggest that Bing Cashback is more sinister. It was just a generalization and I'm not ranting against Bing Cashback... just thinking out loud about a range of possibilities.

[kishy]

I'm not understanding something here.

I go to the appropriate Bing page, sign in with my Live account, find eBay in the list...but if I click go to store it takes me to ebay.com. Why am I not seeing a list of products available on ebay on bing? Am I supposed to search for a product I want then try to find one of it on ebay instead? If so that's crap.

I don't use ebay to find specific items, I use ebay to find contents of particular categories and buy items that interest me. Bing doesn't seem to be applicable to this type of usage.

[wellington1869]

I'm not sure why the data collected is any more sinister than data collected for normal searches or the data collected for any of Microsoft's more popular web destinations...

i was thinking this too.  MS isnt a brand no one's ever heard of, nor is this service "new". They are well watched in the blogosphere, and there will be outcry if they stray too far from the norm, just as there's outcry about facebook's privacy policy changes right now. Yes, proceed with caution, but I dont see any reason to think Bing is beyond the pale in any of its current policies. You're always welcome to actually read the fine print if thats the concern, or google them thoroughly until you're satisfied.

I just logged into my bing account, so far i've made $156.10 thru bing's cashback program. Thats straight cash straight into my paypal account. Since i dont expect them to be particularly sinister, and I did research this to the usual degree before i joined, and am willing to take whatever small normal internet risk there is with any internet-based program -- you know what? I'll take that $156.10 :-D

[wellington1869]

I'm not understanding something here.

I go to the appropriate Bing page, sign in with my Live account, find eBay in the list...but if I click go to store it takes me to ebay.com. Why am I not seeing a list of products available on ebay on bing? Am I supposed to search for a product I want then try to find one of it on ebay instead? If so that's crap.

I don't use ebay to find specific items, I use ebay to find contents of particular categories and buy items that interest me. Bing doesn't seem to be applicable to this type of usage.

hey kishy, yes, what makes this so flexible is that you're not limited to what BING "offers" as products; you're only limited to anything you can find on ALL of ebay, which is to say, pretty much anything ever invented.

So here's what i do:

1. go to bing.com and make sure you're signed in (sign in link in upper right corner of screen). You'll need a live.com account with MS if you dont already have one, as your login here.

2. search for a product using the bing search engine. For instance, i simply type in 't43' into the search box. hit enter.

3. one of the top 2 returns will be in the sponsored sites box listed as 'ebay.com' and it'll say "Buy T43. You may get 8% off with PayPal if eligible." Click that link.

4. That takes you to ebay. notice the little "gold coin" icon.  That icon will appear on every ebay page during the next 1 hour of your ebay session. You have one hour in which to buy something. (If you're "not ready", simply FIRST find what you want to buy, and write down its ebay item number,and when you're ready to buy it, THEN do these steps. You can re-find your item by simply entering that ebay item number into the ebay search box on the ebay site).  Bing doesnt care if you jump around the ebay site once you're there. You'll still get credit for anything you wind up buying.

5. Notice also: a) you have to checkout with paypal. As you check out, there will be multiple indications that you'll be getting the bing discount on taht purchase, various icons on the screen, starting iwth that gold coin icon, and various other 'badges' that will appear during checkout. Google for the process if you have doubts, i'm sure people have put up pics, else i'll put up pics for you.  b) it has to be a 'buy it now' purchase. This wont work on auctions. has to be 'buy it now' (ie, fixed price).

6. search ebay for your product as you normally would. filter by 'buy it now' and buy it. check out via paypal as you normally would.

7. If you're new to bing, it may take up to 2 months before you get your cashback. You can log into your bing account at any time and verify that you got credit for the purchase. you'll also get numerous email reminders - one saying you got credit for it; when it becomes cash and is deposited into your paypal acct (if you chose that option which i recommend) you'll also get an email reminder that its been deposited. You can also log into your bing account and see how many days before it'll be deposited. The tracking of the cashback is superb, lots of ways to see exactly where in the process your cashback is at right now.    

8. Once you've had a certain number of purchases under your belt, you'll find the cashbacks are "instant". When i buy something this way today, the cash appears in my paypal account within 2 minutes.

9. Only ebay/bing works this way. For other normal stores -- for example, tigerdirect.com, simply login at bing.com, then click on the 'shopping' link, left side of bing.com website, and click on "T" alphabetical search and scroll down to tigerdirect.com listing. Then click on that tigerdirect link. It takes you to the tigerdirect website, with a gold coin icon again or some badge indication that in that session whatever advertized discount bing offered will apply to your purchase (so long as you checkout with paypal i believe).

hope that helps.

[wellington1869]

I don't use ebay to find specific items, I use ebay to find contents of particular categories and buy items that interest me. Bing doesn't seem to be applicable to this type of usage.

I dont get why bing isnt applicable? So find what you want to buy, and right before you buy it, go thru the steps above and pay with paypal. Presto, 8% off whatever you wanted to buy.

[kishy]

Yeah I think it does (help, that is - you ninja-doubleposted)

In this usage method you've described, it's basically cheating bing, correct? Since you aren't actually using bing to search for the product you ultimately want...

As long as it works, it's good in my book. I really like ebay's search and filtering facilities as they are and I hate "more intuitive" search engines because they screw with the results I expect to get.

[wellington1869]

Yeah I think it does (help, that is - you ninja-doubleposted)

In this usage method you've described, it's basically cheating bing, correct? Since you aren't actually using bing to search for the product you ultimately want...

not at all; MS can prevent this behaviour if they want quite easily, but they obviously chose not to. Seems like designed behaviour to me. Bing probably still gets credit for having sent you to ebay in the first place from their search engine site, which in fact they did, after all.

As long as it works, it's good in my book. I really like ebay's search and filtering facilities as they are and I hate "more intuitive" search engines because they screw with the results I expect to get.

i agree, i always do my searching on ebay alone, and when i'm ready to buy, i do this process to go to ebay via bing.  MS's hope is that one day i'll just start using bing on my own for non-purchases. Thats the idea of promotions like this. Well, lets see if it'll happen. So far i'm still a google guy for normal searches, but you know what, as a result of this promotion, I'm definitely more bing-aware, arent I? So their promotion does work, in that sense.

I'll say this, too, for bing -- i like how videos can play directly on the search results page. And if it wasnt for this promotion i wouldnt ever have visited bing.com and ever have noticed that.  This sort of exposure is worth a lot for companies like MS.  So we both win. They've introduced me to bing, and for my part I get a fabulous discount. Long live capitalism.

[Rajagra]

In this usage method you've described, it's basically cheating bing, correct?

Sounds to me like it's working as intended. I.e. eBay is working in cahoots with Bing.

[wellington1869]

Also note that the process is quite sophisticated. for example: if you're thinking that someone can just buy things, get 8%, and then return the things and keep the 8%, well it doesnt quite work that way. If you return the item paid with paypal/bing within 90 days, the return is processed via paypal, and the bing cashback comes back out of your paypal account. So they do have some built-in scam protection.

[wellington1869]

whats crazy about this thing, and the reason it got so much buzz initially, is when they first launched it, they were offering an incredible 30% off ebay, and that wasnt just for the first purchase, it was for like the first month. It was truly insane. I caught some of that, they were reducing the cashback by 5% every month or so, and I caught a couple of 25% off purchases, which was really amazing on a big item.

It basically went down rapidly tho but has been "stable" at 8% for at least a year now. Which is pretty good still if you dont have a better ecoupon available.  During xmas holiday season i've seen it spike to 15%.

sites like the one tamasrepus mentioned above, track the bing discount level and can notify you if it spikes, which is handy during holiday season anyway.

[wellington1869]

as far as why MS would do something like this -- I'd argue a promotion like this is more cost effective as advertizing for a service like bing. its probably cheaper than expensive television ads blanketing the nation for months; and better than a tv ad, it got me to interact with the site in person. More effective, more bang for the buck than traditional advertizing. I think thats why they continue to do it. Compared with the cost/effectiveness of traditional advertizing, it actually probably makes economic sense for them to do it this way via this promotion. So long as MS is committed to bing.com, they already have an advertizing budget for it. Plus deals with individual retailers to share the cost i'm sure, which most retailers are probably glad to do with their own advertizing budgets.

I certainly started checking out tigerdirect.com much more often because I know there is a reliable decent discount to be had thru this program. Even if I dont happen to buy something there in a given instance, I still visit and their site gets exposure.

[wellington1869]

lastly, this is also why smaller retailers (lets say keyboard retailers for instance) should crosslist their stuff on an ebay storefront if possible.

DSI has an ebay storefront and i did wind up buying 2 boards from them via ebay, and yep you guessed it, with 8% off each time, which definitely made it slightly easier to pull the trigger.

[wellington1869]

What happens if you automated snipe on Ebay?  

doesnt work for auctions. the discount program only applies to 'buy it now' fixed price sales.

I'll just stick to my 1% automatic cash back credit card.   I'm lazy.  Plus, I KNOW my credit card company is evil.

chase has a 5% cashback credit card, incidentally

I like my amazon.com credit card. Every 2k i spend i get $25 coupon for amazon. Which is like every three months basically since i use it for everything

[Rajagra]

The Internet has a proud history of awful business models ("Yes, we're losing a million dollars a month, but we've only been running for 3 years, things will turn around eventually...") and I guess MS aren't immune to these failings. I won't tell them if you don't.

(But I still think these schemes are inherently evil. MS/Bing are working with eBay/Paypal, and this is pushing up prices one way another so you are getting an 8% discount on an artificially inflated price, so other people are losing out even if you aren't. I prefer not to be a collaborator.)

[wellington1869]

 MS/Bing are working with eBay/Paypal, and this is pushing up prices one way another so you are getting an 8% discount on an artificially inflated price, so other people are losing out even if you aren't. I prefer not to be a collaborator.)

dude, this just isnt true.  you can in fact buy from those "other people". In fact, you can buy from any seller (including private individuals) who list on ebay, and still get the bing cashback.  Those private individuals have nothing to do with the ebay/paypal/bing deal other than that they happened to have listed, for their own personal reasons, their item for sale on ebay, which millions of people do every year anyway.

You're no more a 'collaborator' than if you bypassed the bing deal and simply went on ebay and bought an item from a private individual. There is no difference to that individual. That individual did not call MS and jack up his personal price just because they know you're coming along and are planning on using bing. That individual set his price for his own reasons and would have set that price regardless of whether you use bing or not.

if you're accusing ebay/paypal/bing of "jacking up listing fees" on ebay to get their 8% back, I dont think thats true either. Ebay listing fees didnt go up 8% when bing started.  Whether you like ebay listing fees or not is a different topic; every one on ebay does pay them and have paid them since the inception of ebay.

If you're saying that in some grand milton friedman style social trickle-down theory of economics, that that 8% is eventually and ultimately paid by "the consumer", thats true for all sales anywhere, all discounts anywhere, no matter their source. There's nothing there that is unique to bing. Welcome to the cost of participating in a capitalist economy.

I've never in my life met a bunch of people so insistent on not getting a free discount. It blows my mind  Right down to the "I'd rather not 'collaborate' on a sales event!' argument, which frankly I dont think i've even ever heard that line before! Most people I know are delighted with sales events. Collaboration? Jesus christ. You make it sound like i'm complicit with the third reich if I buy toothpaste thats been marked down in this week's Walgreen's sales flyer. I mean, what?!

I can see Raj marching into Walgreens, and insisting on paying the extra dollar for the toothpaste. The manager, confused, queries him: Sir, you dont understand, Pepsodent is on sale for $2 this week!
Raj: No thank you. I'd like to pay the usual $3 please.
Manager: But sir... you dont understand, thats our price this week for pepsodent! I dont think it will even ring up at the register for $3!
Raj: I'd like to pay $3, please.
Manager: But you can have it for $2! Its on sale!
Raj: You lie! The consumer will eventually pay $3! I do not wish to "collaborate" in your "sale". I'll pay $3, thank you very much!
Manager: But sir! The price of Pepsodent is in fact $2 this week!
Raj: Look. I'm going to put the extra dollar on the counter. You can take it while I look away. No questions asked and no questions answered!
Manager: Sigh. *walks to back room and shoots self in the head*.


On sale this week (except for Raj):

[hyperlinked]

In this usage method you've described, it's basically cheating bing, correct? Since you aren't actually using bing to search for the product you ultimately want...

Ok, Kishy... I think you just brought up the part that wasn't making any sense to me and I'm starting to see something here.

I had the same thoughts as Kishy when I got my cashback pending notice. My first thought was, "I don't see how this benefits Bing. I didn't have to use Bing to search to find my deal. My usage of Bing was just incidental and does nothing to make me more likely to use Bing and less likely to use Google for my next search."

A lot of these companies that are participating in the Bing Cashback program are also vendors that frequently occupy top spots in Google AdWords. Hanging onto those 1, 2, and 3 spots in the search engine ads get expensive and you'll have to suffer through a lot of clicks that don't earn you anything.

Google's search, as good as it is isn't what's making them impossible to move out of their throne. It's their combined mastery of search and search advertising delivery that makes them so powerful because it presents a near endless stream of cash.

I don't think this is about digital vs. expensive TV advertising as Welly thinks it is. That's a different animal and the cannibalization that the Internet has had on broadcast and print advertising has already peaked. Companies rich enough to buy into broadcast and print markets are probably not looking at this as an either or proposition. If you have the money and you believe that broadcast advertising will translate into sales for you, odds are that you're going to do it... and you'll do the online advertising too.

This is a digital vs digital battle. It's about Microsoft vs Google. If Bing Cashback becomes wildly successful, it could subvert the search engine advertising market that is making Google so powerful.

If you think about it, it's rather amazing that Google is able to make so much money on the red-headed stepchild of Internet advertising: the pay-per-click ad. Before Google, nobody wanted to buy into a pay-per-click ad market because they'd rather go with a cost per impression or pay a affiliate percentages on sales that completed.

What's interesting is that it wouldn't matter if Google created their own Google Cashback and overtook Bing's Cashback because decoupling the money from search creates a big time short circuit in Google's business model in which Search, AdWords, and AdSense form a perpetual motion money machine.

Then again, as Ray pointed out, the Internet is full of really ****ty business models that take utmost faith to believe in and there could be a much simpler reason behind Bing Cashback: Pompous idiots are at the helm.

[hyperlinked]

chase has a 5% cashback credit card, incidentally

We are all paying for that 5% cashback reward. Ray is right about that one. A chunk of that cashback is coming from the merchant who is getting charged higher fees whenever you use that card as opposed to a Visa card with no cashback benefits. Over time, that likely translates into a need to bump up the prices a little elsewhere to keep the doors open.  

I don't pay by credit card at mom n' pop shops if I can help it anymore. I try to remember to bring cash and a checkbook. I'd rather that more of my money stays with them and less of it goes to the bank. If that means that I end up losing $5 in air miles and the shop gets to avoid $5 in fees, I'm fine with that.

The age of extra bonus reward cards as we know it may be coming to an end in the US. In some legislation getting worked on in the financial reform overhaul, it dilutes the power of credit card companies' power to impose terms and charges on merchants. Businesses may start charging one price for cash purchases and a special price indexed against the cost of supporting certain credit cards.

I've already seen a store or two offering their customers a discount for making their purchases in cash.

I'm of the same mind as Ray when it comes to psychological schemes to get me to feel good about spending more money. Screw the dog and pony show. I just want a fair price, but I'm not going to opt out all the time because I don't believe the problem will go away if I refuse to play... at least when it comes to the Internet marketplace. If we're talking about the local marketplace, it's a different story.

[wellington1869]

We are all paying for that 5% cashback reward. Ray is right about that one. A chunk of that cashback is coming from the merchant who is getting charged higher fees whenever you use that card as opposed to a Visa card with no cashback benefits. Over time, that likely translates into a need to bump up the prices a little elsewhere to keep the doors open.  

I don't pay by credit card at mom n' pop shops if I can help it anymore. I try to remember to bring cash and a checkbook. I'd rather that more of my money stays with them and less of it goes to the bank. If that means that I end up losing $5 in air miles and the shop gets to avoid $5 in fees, I'm fine with that.

The age of extra bonus reward cards as we know it may be coming to an end in the US. In some legislation getting worked on in the financial reform overhaul, it dilutes the power of credit card companies' power to impose terms and charges on merchants. Businesses may start charging one price for cash purchases and a special price indexed against the cost of supporting certain credit cards.

I've already seen a store or two offering their customers a discount for making their purchases in cash.

I'm of the same mind as Ray when it comes to psychological schemes to get me to feel good about spending more money. Screw the horse and pony show. I just want a fair price, but I'm not going to opt out all the time because I don't believe the problem will go away if I refuse to play... at least when it comes to the Internet marketplace. If we're talking about the local marketplace, it's a different story.

Lol, Ok, in the pepsodent example above, replace Ray's name with yours :-D Seriously thats what youre saying ultimately. And thats fine, a lot of people also put their cash in their mattresses and only buy locally. Some of that is noble, some of it can be quite flakey and paranoid. I guess i'm not there yet. I'll take the cashbacks and i'll buy pepsodent on sale

[wellington1869]

Pay the bill monthly on time every month and you are basically screwing over the credit card company.

true dat; i do, always. And I like that i get to screw over the credit card company and get their benefits. I dont have any sympathy for large faceless evil corporations but i'll benefit from their economies of scale and purchasing power if I can.

Show Image

one of my favorite movies of all time.

[hyperlinked]

Lol, Ok, in the pepsodent example above, replace Ray's name with yours :-D Seriously thats what youre saying ultimately. And thats fine, a lot of people also put their cash in their mattresses and only buy locally. Some of that is noble, some of it can be quite flakey and paranoid. I guess i'm not there yet. I'll take the cashbacks and i'll buy pepsodent on sale

Where Ray's point and mine splits is that it appears that he'll opt-out on principle. I'm not convinced that opting out on principle always has an effect so I'll pick and choose when I choose not to play the game. I may feel infantalized by all the games played to get to me overestimate the real price of something that's on "discount", but I accept it as something you just have to put up with.

I'm also not so sure that this program is necessarily going to drive up costs because what I think Bing is trying to do most likely supplants an expense (AdWords) that is already factored into Internet retail pricing models. I do see some sense in what he's saying because if Bing Cashback like programs become the way everyone expects to shop online, then prices most definitely will inflate. I just don't think that will happen and as I explained above, I see strategic reasons for why Microsoft would want to do this in their fight against Google.

The Pepsodent story is silly in the context of anonymous chain retail and Internet retail, but in the context of local shopping it might not be so idiotic. Not every retailer competes on price alone and I appreciate the value and convenience of a good store with people I trust and fair pricing across the board so I'll pay a little extra even if I could get it cheaper online or down the street at some place that doesn't treat me like a human being. There's a difference between being a Pepsodent chump and using your money to support things like trust and service that have intangible value to you.

[itlnstln]

We have some prolific writers in this thread.  I can't remember the last time I read this much.  Carry on.

[itlnstln]

You read all that?  I just look at the pictures.

C'mon, you know me.  I saw there was about 3 pages of stuff I didn't read and moved on.

[wellington1869]

Where Ray's point and mine splits is that it appears that he'll opt-out on principle. I'm not convinced that opting out on principle always has an effect so I'll pick and choose when I choose not to play the game. I may feel infantalized by all the games played to get to me overestimate the real price of something that's on "discount", but I accept it as something you just have to put up with.

well i think you and i are more or less on the same page.
I do "get" where raj is coming from. I'm just not as idealistic as that I guess. Its a question of degree, probably.

I just don't think that will happen and as I explained above, I see strategic reasons for why Microsoft would want to do this in their fight against Google.

i agree that their main bogey here is probably google. (I additionally agree that MS will likely fail in the long run in this project. But I understand that they have to try).

The Pepsodent story is silly in the context of anonymous chain retail and Internet retail, but in the context of local shopping it might not be so idiotic.
Not every retailer competes on price alone and I appreciate the value and convenience of a good store with people I trust and fair pricing across the board so I'll pay a little extra even if I could get it cheaper online or down the street at some place that doesn't treat me like a human being.

believe it or not, i actually agree with this too. I too value the mom n pop experience, personal attention and etc, capitalism-with-a-human-face, and i too believe in supporting local farms and local manufacturers. To a point. THere's no one in my neighborhood manufacturing keyboards locally, so for that i'm happy to go to ebay (and bing).

 There's a difference between being a Pepsodent chump and using your money to support things like trust and service that have intangible value to you.

agreed. I too would gladly pay a bit extra, when it makes sense, to maintain local trust and value and i too would pay for service in certain cases. Like you, I just dont think thats the argument against bing here.
For that matter, nor do I use bing all that often (as I said, once a month; the vast majority of my purchases online and locally are spread quite widely across retailers, some of which i gladly pay extra for their local accessibilty or their personalized service).


And lastly, here's a picture for itlnstln and ripster:

[Rajagra]

OK then. Pictorial proof that things aren't always what they seem at first glance:

[wellington1869]

OK then. Pictorial proof that things aren't always what they seem at first glance:

I'm staring hard hoping to see either a naked lady or a spaceship. So far I see a large white cat

[wellington1869]

pictorial proof that sometimes things are what they appear to be at first glance?:  

[skcheng]

What happens if you automated snipe on Ebay?  Sounds like Bing has to be tracking your logon and search somehow.  

I'll just stick to my 1% automatic cash back credit card.   I'm lazy.  Plus, I KNOW my credit card company is evil.

Bing Cashback only works for Buy it Now items followed by Paypal payments on Ebay.   Regular auctions don't work.  

My 8% is 7% > your 1% which equals a lot in my book.   Stop being so lazy!!

[skcheng]

We are all paying for that 5% cashback reward. Ray is right about that one. A chunk of that cashback is coming from the merchant who is getting charged higher fees whenever you use that card as opposed to a Visa card with no cashback benefits. Over time, that likely translates into a need to bump up the prices a little elsewhere to keep the doors open.  

As a merchant (health care provider actually), I accept credit cards as payment.   These can vary anywhere from 2% to over 6% based on the credit card.  Business American Express Travel cards are the WORST.  I have an entire list of exactly what I pay and I deal with it.  I don't "bump" up my prices based on credit card used for payment and I don't discount for cash.  But that's me.  I report everything and I'm happy to pay whatever taxes my accountant tells me pay.   The more taxes I pay, the more money I'm making.  That's how it's supposed to work.   If I give a cash discount to my patients, isn't that implying that my other patients pay "more" since they're not paying cash??   And I gladly accept checks and I'll work out payment arrangements if necessary.   If I deem it appropriate, I'll do the work for free.  I've never sent anyone out to collections and I "most likely" never will.  I sleep well at night and every year despite the recession, I've seen my practice grow.   So that's my take on it.  The advantage of a credit card payment is that payment is immediate.  "Check's in the mail" stories get old sometimes.  

I don't pay by credit card at mom n' pop shops if I can help it anymore. I try to remember to bring cash and a checkbook. I'd rather that more of my money stays with them and less of it goes to the bank. If that means that I end up losing $5 in air miles and the shop gets to avoid $5 in fees, I'm fine with that.

That's great that you feel this way.  Me too.   I pay cash whenever I can.  But like most people, I order a LOT online.   And if you like collecting and you use Ebay, well......most people want Paypal these days.  When I've purchased from members here on Geekhack, I've sent a USPS money order whenever possible.     Some have been fine with that, while others have insisted on Paypal.   That's fine.  I also have a Paypal credit card which gives me a small cashback incentive.   In the past, it was a NIGHTMARE trying to send money overseas.   Bank transfers, concealed cash etc...  So like most people, I've given up and accepted Paypal.  But if anyone here has had a chargeback experience or some other negative Paypal situation, then they know that Paypal can be frought with issues.   The seller is not always protected......

The age of extra bonus reward cards as we know it may be coming to an end in the US. In some legislation getting worked on in the financial reform overhaul, it dilutes the power of credit card companies' power to impose terms and charges on merchants. Businesses may start charging one price for cash purchases and a special price indexed against the cost of supporting certain credit cards.

To each their own.  We've paid one price for gas at the gas pump via credit and another price for cash.   The better the Credit Card appears to the customer, the worse it is for the business.   The customer usually has no idea that the business eats the extra percentage for those travel miles or those bonus spending points.   And they probably don't care....

I've already seen a store or two offering their customers a discount for making their purchases in cash.

I personally think that's wrong......but that's me.  As business owners, we can choose to practice what we believe in.   Some can get away entirely as cash based businesses.   Other's can't.   Eat at Peter Luger's Steak House in Brooklyn and you better bring a lot of cash.    But I don't think that would fly in most restaurants.  

I'm of the same mind as Ray when it comes to psychological schemes to get me to feel good about spending more money. Screw the dog and pony show. I just want a fair price, but I'm not going to opt out all the time because I don't believe the problem will go away if I refuse to play... at least when it comes to the Internet marketplace. If we're talking about the local marketplace, it's a different story.

I think we're looking too negatively at the picture here.   It's very simple.  You and I both purchase the same item on sale at Tiger Direct.   We both pay with Paypal.   You pay X amount directly.   I pay (X - 12-15%) just by going through Bing.com.   Nothing dishonest or illegal.  If I can save some.....I just might spend more.   If Tiger Direct doesn't like dealing with Bing.com, then they can refuse to do so.  I'm quite certain that the Bing cashback has created more sales for Tiger Direct.   Wouldn't you agree to at least that point??  It's a voluntary partnership.

But if you don't feel comfortable with all of this......simply don't use it.  No big deal.   And total disclaimer here:   I do not work for Microsoft or have any affiliation with Bing.com or Bing cashback.    I just wanted to pass along some savings to fellow Geekhackers who might like purchasing Buy It Now items listed on Ebay  with Paypal.   That's all  

skc

[skcheng]

My son's orthodontist discounts for cash up front.  

And "Buy It Now" is no fun.  Sniping someone 5 seconds before Auction close is fun.  I'm too lazy to do the whole Bing search thing.

I know most dentists probably "do" discount for cash.   As a rule, I don't discount at all.   And I also don't accept insurance as payment in full.   My personal feeling is that my fee should be the same regardless of whom I'm treating.   Others seem to think that it's okay to jack up fees to then give a discount.   Eh......don't get me started.  

Buy It Now can be fun depending on the situation.   What heppened with Ebay was they started charging increased amounts for everything.  Lising fee, reserve fee etc...   And some sellers really don't want to wait for a lengthy auction to end.  So Buy it Now serves a purpose on Ebay.  

As for the "too lazy" part.....really can't help you there      I wouldn't bother with sales, discounts, good deals, or cashback either if I had your deeper than deep NIB pockets  

[wellington1869]

skc, you forget to add some pics for ripster and itlnstln.

[wellington1869]

fwiw, bing is holding market share at about 10%, with 8 months of growth earlier this year (tho the numbers are tiny).  Also its hemorraging money but MS seems to be ok with that for now.

from: http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gnNDa28muSZhB5AsG5rTbE0bbxwg

Microsoft's new Internet search engine Bing slightly increased its share of the US search market in January, the eighth month in a row of modest gains, online tracking firm comScore said Wednesday.

Bing's share of the US search market rose to 11.3 percent in January from 10.7 percent in December, comScore said, while its search partner Yahoo! saw its share dip from 17.3 percent to 17.0 percent.

Google remained the overwhelming leader of the lucrative US search and advertising market last month although its share fell to 65.4 percent in January from 65.7 percent in December.

[wellington1869]

her first name is "bada"

[Input Nirvana]

I bought a Logitech mouse a few minutes ago on Ebay Buy-It-Now PayPal. The seller went to great lengths point by point to explain Bing CashBack and how to use it on his listing. It seemed that he was getting paid to promote it. The sale was $19.45 for an RX1500 mouse, so even though I took several of the steps, I ultimately blew it off. A larger purchase could have swayed me.

I'll try Bing, you guys are so positive about it.

[skcheng]

I like Urban Dictionary's definition.

I don't necessary search for anything on Bing.  Google is still King for search engines.   I use Bing almost exclusively for their cashback.   Slickdeals, Techbargains and other sites are always posting the "best" cashback deals.  

And it's EASY.......unless you're really lazy.  

[skcheng]

I bought a Logitech mouse a few minutes ago on Ebay Buy-It-Now PayPal. The seller went to great lengths point by point to explain Bing CashBack and how to use it on his listing. It seemed that he was getting paid to promote it. The sale was $19.45 for an RX1500 mouse, so even though I took several of the steps, I ultimately blew it off. A larger purchase could have swayed me.

I'll try Bing, you guys are so positive about it.

Once you start using Bing, you'll find it fairly easy and routine.   I was surprised when Ebay wasn't listed under Bing cashback stores for a while.  I'm glad it's back.   Occasionally it's higher than 8%, but lately it's been sitting there steady.

Even a $20 purchase gives you back $1.60.   I didn't know that there was a 100 purchase limit.   I'll probably pass over that limit before the year is up.

[wellington1869]

I use Bing almost exclusively for their cashback.  

lol, same here

[wellington1869]

I'll try Bing, you guys are so positive about it.

yes, if you have any questions, just come back and post to this thread

I dont work for bing either, but like skc I like promoting decent deals to like minded shoppers.

[Input Nirvana]

I'm self-employed, which by definition means I'm a professional skinflint gambler.

[skcheng]

I AM lazy.  Don't even use coupons at the store.

Drives my mother nuts.

>

[wellington1869]

I'm self-employed, which by definition means I'm a professional skinflint gambler.

i'm a perpetual student, so that definition automatically applies to me too

[skcheng]

I forgot to mention that Bing Cashback also applies to sale items.   It's not limited to full retail online purchases.    And MANY stores even offer free shipping when used with Bing.  

Hey Rip, the closest thing I could find for you was a nice 5% cashback at Bigdaddybeauty.com

[hyperlinked]

I think we're looking too negatively at the picture here.   It's very simple.  You and I both purchase the same item on sale at Tiger Direct.   We both pay with Paypal.   You pay X amount directly.   I pay (X - 12-15%) just by going through Bing.com.   Nothing dishonest or illegal.  If I can save some.....I just might spend more.   If Tiger Direct doesn't like dealing with Bing.com, then they can refuse to do so.  I'm quite certain that the Bing cashback has created more sales for Tiger Direct.   Wouldn't you agree to at least that point??  It's a voluntary partnership.

I don't think we're actually debating anything here. I'm actually in agreement with what you're saying and I grudgingly accept that this is the way it is. I say grudgingly because what TigerDirect.com does is their business, but I'm just not a fan of discount culture even though I'm probably no more likely to pay a penny more for something online than you would if I can help it. I want to save money, but don't want to be forced into a chess match to do so.

I think it's a little too simple to say that lower prices equate to improved sales and improved profits. Discount retailers are already moving stuff at very slim margins and any deeper cuts probably put them on the wrong side of the curve of diminishing returns... but I'm not going to cry for TigerDirect.com if their discounts don't result in higher overall profits. As you said, nobody's forcing them into this so they probably have very good reasons for doing it and will withdraw the day those reasons cease to be true.

But if you don't feel comfortable with all of this......simply don't use it.  No big deal.   And total disclaimer here:   I do not work for Microsoft or have any affiliation with Bing.com or Bing cashback.    I just wanted to pass along some savings to fellow Geekhackers who might like purchasing Buy It Now items listed on Ebay  with Paypal.   That's all  

I think somewhere in this thread it got misunderstood that I was uncomfortable with using Bing Cashback. I just wanted to know what the reasoning behind the free lunch was. As someone who lived and died the dot-com Internet boom and bust revolution as a very active agent of change, I'm suspicious, but mostly intensely curious of the real rationales behind campaigns that appear to be leveraging Y2K marketing strategies on the surface.

And I thank you that I'm probably going to save around $100 on stuff that I needed to buy and that I would have had to buy from otherwise nameless online retailers anyway.

[EverythingIBM]

I bought whatever I felt like eating.  Usually, chips, beer, ice pops......the essentials.

Chips have lots of MSG, which, passes through your "blood brain barrier", causes bad headaches and strokes. Also can make some people fat (hasn't had any effect on me but killer headaches and temporary vision loss). I ate two large bags of old dutch chips straight, just wanted to see what would happen... not a good idea ha.

Popsicles are usually just frozen artificial flavours

Itlnstln knows a thing or two about how REAL homemade food is SO MUCH BETTER. Italian recipies are some of the best. I like Greek food too.

Junkfood is for the uninformed.

[hyperlinked]

Chips have lots of MSG, which, passes through your "blood brain barrier", causes bad headaches and strokes. Also can make some people fat (hasn't had any effect on me but killer headaches and temporary vision loss). I ate two large bags of old dutch chips straight, just wanted to see what would happen...

No doubt MSG is not health food and at best it's just something that won't kill you. That said, what you're claiming is a stretch. You're not a neuroscientist and probably barely know what the Blood Brain Barrier is.

MSG gives me fits too so I'm sympathetic to what it does to you, but the part of me that took a bunch of research science classes in grad school just won't let a medical half truth go by without a wag of the finger. It's a bridge too far to say MSG has direct causation to obesity, headaches, and stroke because not everyone who eats MSG is fat, has headaches, and can't keep blood off of his grey matter.

[skcheng]

And I thank you that I'm probably going to save around $100 on stuff that I needed to buy and that I would have had to buy from otherwise nameless online retailers anyway.

Just trying to be helpful.   I know I've saved a LOT of money using Bing.   And I try to buy only what I need.  In fact, I'm going to limit myself to NO more than 30-40 more keyboards LOL.

[skcheng]

Chips have lots of MSG, which, passes through your "blood brain barrier", causes bad headaches and strokes. Also can make some people fat (hasn't had any effect on me but killer headaches and temporary vision loss). I ate two large bags of old dutch chips straight, just wanted to see what would happen... not a good idea ha.

Popsicles are usually just frozen artificial flavours

Itlnstln knows a thing or two about how REAL homemade food is SO MUCH BETTER. Italian recipies are some of the best. I like Greek food too.

Junkfood is for the uninformed.

Wow, I think I derailed my own thread.  Or was it Ripster again???

Kudos to you if you choose to ALWAYS eat healthy.   But then again, you did voluntarily eat two large bags of chips for some unknown reason??   I suggest you try that same experiment with the following foods:   cheesecake, haggish, and Snickers  

I was sorta, kinda kidding about the beer, chips and ice pops.......well, not really  

Just an FYI, my wife is constantly feeding me crap like wilder than farm raised fish (or something like that) and these disgusting things called vegetables.   Uggghhhh.  

As a trained health care provider with a minor in nutrition, I'm well aware of the benefits of healthy food consumption.  I just can't help myself from occasionally indulging in unhealthy treats.

At least I don't like mayo.   100% pure unadulterated emulsified oil!!!  YUMMY!!!

[itlnstln]

I AM lazy.  Don't even use coupons at the store.

Drives my mother nuts.

>

[wellington1869]

You mean like buying multiple keyboards and RMAing them all?

thats not illegal; in fact, someone's about to do just that in order to go back and buy a filco. That should make you happy NOt to mention the irony that they could never have had that luxury if they had gotten a filco

[skcheng]

I have absolutely NO idea what you guys are talking about.  I don't think I've ever returned anything in my life.  I'm not kidding....

[wellington1869]

Just saying.   The practice raises the cost for EVERYBODY.

yes we've covered that in this thread, its the cost of doing business and a lot of folks wont buy it unless they can try it and anyway the right to an RMA is protected by law in most countries and recognized as a good business practice in the rest. So yea, it'll continue.

[itlnstln]

I have absolutely NO idea what you guys are talking about.  I don't think I've ever returned anything in my life.  I'm not kidding....

They're bringing up old ****.  This and this and especially this.

[wellington1869]

wasnt me who brought it up...   I'm just being consistent with my consumer values and not giving anyone a "let" just cuz i like their product.

[skcheng]

Can we puhleeez stick to Bing Cashback on this thread??   So far, Welly likes it, Raj thinks it's evil internet propaganda designed to destroy us all,  Hyperlink is caving in to save some hard earned dollars, Ripster is flat out too lazy and RICH to be bothered.  I'm not sure where itlnstln stands other than the fact that he can find no good food in San Antonio.  

Anyone else?  I just used my Bing Cashback to buy this since I don't have one yet.

IBM 1390131 Clicky

Saved myself $2.52 which is already in my Paypal account.   Now I can call up Chuck to order another colored keycap  

[wellington1869]

when I bought the scorpius m10 on ebay, it was $59, minus 8%, came out to about $54 shipped. saved about $5 for 15 seconds of work.

saved more on the DSI boards. Will save when I pick up that keytronic 3600 later this week.

I saved something like $32 in a single transaction when I bought my guitar on ebay. Also about that much with my laptop which i bought used on ebay. (I"ve had pretty good luck with buying used ebay stuff).

[kishy]

Can we puhleeez stick to Bing Cashback on this thread??   So far, Welly likes it, Raj thinks it's evil internet propaganda designed to destroy us all,  Hyperlink is caving in to save some hard earned dollars, Ripster is flat out too lazy and RICH to be bothered.  I'm not sure where itlnstln stands other than the fact that he can find no good food in San Antonio.  

Anyone else?  I just used my Bing Cashback to buy this since I don't have one yet.

IBM 1390131 Clicky

Saved myself $2.52 which is already in my Paypal account.   Now I can call up Chuck to order another colored keycap  

I'll give you my thoughts when I make a purchase of a size where it makes enough impact to be noticed.

The vast majority of my ebay purchases are under $10 shipped.

Although, few pennies here, few there...eh why not.

[skcheng]

I promise to stay on topic in this thread if SKCheng and Welly stop polluting the rest of Geekhack with "BING this" and "BING that".

You guys are the pawns of Steve Ballmer.  Good guerrilla marketing but annoying nonetheless.

Promise.  No more mention of Bing from me, outside of this thread.

[wellington1869]

I promise to stay on topic in this thread if SKCheng and Welly stop polluting the rest of Geekhack with "BING this" and "BING that".

You guys are the pawns of Steve Ballmer.  Good guerrilla marketing but annoying nonetheless.

i wonder which is worse - guerilla marketing for filco and getting people to spend extra money, or guerilla marketing for coupons and saving money.

you're right, the latter must be worse  Business lobby > consumer lobby.

I've rarely mentioned bing until this thread reminded me of its awesomeness. And yea, i guess this is the official bing thread.

[skcheng]

I thought it was kinda funny they were discussing the benefits of this for MS or lack of such, while mentioning Bing on an unrelated forum a thousand times. Reminds me of that Apple spammer.

Do you purchase items on Ebay??   Use Paypal??   I'm not sure why anyone would have animosity towards MS or trying to save a few bucks on purchased items?  Isn't that the point of having an "Ebay Finds" section??  If not, then I apologize for the spam.   We can delete this entire thread......

[skcheng]

Do NOT delete the thread.  All I'm asking is there's no need to keep referring to it on EVERY Ebay auction.  Occasional references to a store that HAPPENS to be on Bing like Newegg is OK too - I didn't know about that particular option for example until you started the thread.  Fine to point out in moderation.

Welly, Webwit and I kid around a lot.  Reminds me of the dog park I go to every day where the dogs greet each other by sniffing each other's butts.

Rip.....you are like my brother from another mother!!  LiLo was such a hotty.   Do you remember when Lindsay Lohan used to look like this and was voted Maxim's No.1 Hottest???  What happened to her??

[skcheng]

She graduated from Tenafly High which is across the street from my office.  

I like Quinn.  The ex-Prez of the Chastity Club.

[itlnstln]

went to the dawgs?

Anyway, i've moved on to big nosed italians.

Show Image

wish fox wasn't such a copyright stickler on youtube videos or i'd be posting those all the time.

she graduated from tenafly high which is across the street from my office.  

I like quinn.  The ex-prez of the chastity club.

Show Image

I would just like to say... BING!!!

[itlnstln]

I just carry one of these.  I don't have to say a word.

[wellington1869]

Do NOT delete the thread.  All I'm asking is there's no need to keep referring to it on EVERY Ebay auction.

thats fine, but something here is confusing me. Every forum? Every thread? Do you have some links?   I mentioned it once in recent memory when the OP of a thread specifically stated she was trying to keep price down to $60. (diogenes thread). That was it. To confirm this, I just did a search on the entire forum with my username and the word 'bing'.  Yea, other than this bing thread, and the single mention in diogenes thread for reasons explained above, my 2 or so previous bing mentions were in the Fall of 2009.

I dont mind criticism but would love it if people kept some perspective. Not just you rippy, from skc's quote of webwit's ridiculous post above, i can see he's jumped on the stupid bandwagon without looking once again.

--No one is "spamming" the forum with bing. Please keep your perspective.
--"bing" isnt about "microsoft". Its about a deal ms made with hundreds of retailers, including private sellers who benefit on ebay.

Yes, this is the bing thread and we'll keep news of bing here. In fact, thats what has happened so far. Dont exaggerate to make a false mountain out of a molehill. I cant help but wonder if we searched 'filco' and username 'ripster' just how many search returns we'd get, to compare with.

[Rajagra]

Chips have lots of MSG, which, passes through your "blood brain barrier", causes bad headaches and strokes.
...
Junkfood is for the uninformed.

Toothpaste has lots of fluoride, which passes through the blood-brain barrier, and is a neurotoxin. It accumulates over time and your body can't get rid of it.

Brushing teeth is for the uninformed.

(Joking aside, if I was a young person I would never use fluoride toothpaste.)

Back to bing. I never meant to criticize the original post, just wanted to throw in an opinion. I might even have tried it out myself if bing UK had the cashback thing. (I know, they redirect you to a similar site, but even so.)

Maybe they should call it bung*, under the circumstances?

(*Bung=slang for bribe.)

[itlnstln]

A bung hole and a tap.

[wellington1869]

(Joking aside, if I was a young person I would never use fluoride toothpaste.)

The funny thing is, Pepsodent was like the last toothpaste to finally add flouride. So I picked the right one for you

[Input Nirvana]

Is someone(s) "in the know" making a type of "discounts/rebates/cashback/buyers club" list for the non-informed-but-want-to-know people out there? I, for one, have seen quite a few names just in this thread alone that were new to me.

I thought I read that here, but I don't see it now.

[wellington1869]

maybe a page in the wiki?
or turn this thread into a generic discount/coupon thread?

[kishy]

Just a little tidbit of info, just tried this on an item that had an existing 10% discount. Can't combine the two, unfortunately.

However, this is abnormally simple. I like it.

This is how you know you've arrived at eBay via bing and will receive cashback:

[skcheng]

Just a little tidbit of info, just tried this on an item that had an existing 10% discount. Can't combine the two, unfortunately.

However, this is abnormally simple. I like it.

This is how you know you've arrived at eBay via bing and will receive cashback:

Show Image

Actually, you can combine the two.   It was a seller 10% discount right?  Should work??  As long as it wasn't a Best Offer discount.  Then it doesn't work.

[kishy]

Actually, you can combine the two.   It was a seller 10% discount right?  Should work??  As long as it wasn't a Best Offer discount.  Then it doesn't work.

Nope, seller 10% discount. Cashback thing threw a message during checkout saying the item didn't qualify. Buy-it-now, not auction or best offer.

Bought it anyway, since I wanted the item, but 18% woulda been better than 10%.

[Half-Saint]

http://www.discoverbing.com/cashback/programupdate/index.html?fbid=73wWh-9x5BO&wom=true

[skcheng]

http://www.discoverbing.com/cashback/programupdate/index.html?fbid=73wWh-9x5BO&wom=true

I just got that too.   Oh well.....I didn't think it would last.

[tamasrepus]

Just got an e-mail earlier today. Apparently, Microsoft has killed Bing Cashback:

Dear valued cashback customer:
 
  We are writing to notify you that the Bing cashback program will be discontinued, and the last day to earn cash back on your Bing Shopping purchases will be July 30, 2010.
 
 Until July 30, 2010 9:00 pm PST, it's business as usual so continue to take advantage of great offers from your favorite merchants. You can redeem all of your earned cashback savings consistent with the cashback terms and conditions and access the Bing cashback customer support system through July 30, 2011. We encourage you to redeem your cashback savings and to further support redemption, we are waiving the $5 minimum payout effective July 31, 2010. To assist with prompt delivery of your cashback earnings, please visit http://cashbackaccount.bing.com to ensure your account information is current. For more details and answers to your questions, please visit our frequently asked questions page.
 
 Thank you very much for being a loyal cashback user.  We remain committed to delivering great value to our customers, and we are currently working on an exciting new program which you will hear more about from us later this summer.
 
 Sincerely,
 
 Bing cashback team

[hyperlinked]

Bing is now a default search engine choice in Safari 5.

That's a really disappointing graph for Microsoft. All the belated Windows 7 upgrades was supposed to give them a massive boost in payola.

[shellyagal]

I am a regular online frugal shopper and mostly use cash back portals like Bing, ShopAtHome, AAfter Search and Ebates.

[wellington1869]

Tragedy!  Buy while you can, folks.

"Dear valued cashback customer:
 
We are writing to notify you that the Bing cashback program will be discontinued, and the last day to earn cash back on your Bing Shopping purchases will be July 30, 2010."


http://www.discoverbing.com/cashback/programupdate/index.html?fbid=KV1v1GavtLi&wom=false

Well, that also answers the question of how long can such a promotion continue realistically.

[hyperlinked]

Bing! Time's up Welly... and you're late by 2 weeks.

[wellington1869]

Bing! Time's up Welly... and you're late by 2 weeks.

lol, thats what i get for going to chicago Just catching up with the rest of the world...

well I dont know which is a bigger tragedy, that bing is dying, or that I just ventured back into mechanicals... i bought a mech board... i'll probably regret it  I definitely dont want to get sucked back into all the buying and the modding, but I think I can handle just one.

[hyperlinked]

Welly, you've fallen off the wagon.

[didjamatic]

"One won't hurt you."
"Everybody does it."
"You can quit any time."

[wellington1869]

Welly, you've fallen off the wagon.

seriously. I'm very disappointed in myself.

"One won't hurt you."
"Everybody does it."
"You can quit any time."

haha i think thats how i got into this mess to begin with

but really I have to hold the line at one... It was totally a shopping-therapy episode. I was too wiped out from chicago (spent 2 weeks relocating my mom who just retired). I was a good son (for 2 weeks anyway, lol). Since no one noticed, hell, I rewarded myself  Just so happens I have everything else I need at the moment technology wise, so I got something I totally dont need right now, lol.

[wellington1869]

glory hallelujah, bing is still alive.

i'm still getting the bing discount icon when i go to ebay VIA the bing.com website's search.

[aegrotatio]

Are Browns for real, or is it just misinterpreted Reds that people think look like Browns?

[muchadoaboutnothing]

It's stupid that they killed Bing cashback.

Basically, a few years ago, there was a site called jellyfish.com. They figured that they could use affiliate linking to make a profit, take a cut off the top, and then give a check back to the consumer for some of the affiliate money. They also had cool "Smack Shows" where they'd have an unknown quantity of an item, and you'd watch the discount rise on the item. It was a game of chicken since you wouldn't know when there was only one left (or if there was more than one), so if you waited too long you'd forego any form of discount altogether. I almost got a PRS-500 in 2006 for $150...

Microsoft liked the concept and thought it would make Bing popular, so they implemented it.

Microsoft markets the concept, but not the engine. So Microsoft tries to increase usage through cashback promos where they pay out more cashback then they take in (MS did the same with the Xbox, and while that division is still deep in the hole, it has made a consistent quarterly profit for a couple years). The result is sites like SlickDeals and Fatwallet using it heavily, but consumers not even knowing about it.

So Microsoft moves the extra cashback links into ads within the Bing search (if you go to bing.com/cashback you may see 3% for Tiger Direct, but if you search "LCD TV" on bing instead you get 15%). Neat concept, but it just lead to people keyword scrapung regularly for extra cashback links.

Microsoft could have saved the program by marketing it better (a TV commercial where someone is enjoying their laptop, or watching their new plasma, and a guy from Microsoft shows up and hands them some cash. Simple, effective, memorable.) and stopping encouraging SlickDeals by making unprofitable promos (e.x. 30% off eBay and HP) that people would watch deal sites for and not use the search engine at all.

[wellington1869]

bing is still working though... they havent turned off the spigot yet.

[muchadoaboutnothing]

bing is still working though... they havent turned off the spigot yet.

It goes dark on July 30th.

[wellington1869]

It goes dark on July 30th.

oh, my mistake. I thought the cut off date was JUNE 30th.

damn, so i have 2 more weeks to buy all I can, lol.

[hyperlinked]

Microsoft could have saved the program by marketing it better.

I'm still not sure how MS could make money at this even if it does get wildly popular. I wrote earlier in this thread about some possible strategic motivations, but I don't see a revenue model here.

[hyperlinked]

so i have 2 more weeks to buy all I can, lol.

I'll decide on your next purchase for you Welly... a calendar.

[muchadoaboutnothing]

I'm still not sure how MS could make money at this even if it does get wildly popular. I wrote earlier in this thread about some possible strategic motivations, but I don't see a revenue model here.

Bing cashback is powered by affiliate links.

• User logs into Bing Cashback and searches for something, uses the Bing Cashback link
• Site sees affiliate is Bing CB
• User completes purchase. Store gives MS cut of sale as affiliate. For our hypothetical, we'll say 8%.
• MS takes some percentage for overhead.
• The user gets whatever percent MS promised - 5%, perhaps.
• MS keeps the rest for overhead and maintaining the program.

The problem is that Microsoft has been offering cashback in excess of what they're getting in the affiliate links. Instead of increasing user loyalty (using Bing, because typically the extra cashback links come up when you search for terms like "lcd tv" in  the search engine) or attracting new people to the site, they're making people on SlickDeals and Fatwallet who would use the program at whatever percentage happier.

They never marketed it effectively either so people outside of these communities don't even know Bing cashback exists.

[wellington1869]

I'll decide on your next purchase for you Welly... a calendar.

lol, my new palm pre plus (arriving tomorrow, yay) should help with that

[wellington1869]

I don't see a revenue model here.

thats probably why they're shutting down, to be honest. I'm sure they've run the numbers on this promotion and made an economic decision. Ultimately the numbers have to make sense else companies wont do it.

tho i also agree that they probably made some strategic mistakes (bad marketing etc) which affected those numbers.

[muchadoaboutnothing]

thats probably why they're shutting down, to be honest. I'm sure they've run the numbers on this promotion and made an economic decision. Ultimately the numbers have to make sense else companies wont do it.

tho i also agree that they probably made some strategic mistakes (bad marketing etc) which affected those numbers.

The revenue model works properly when your cashback is offered below the amount of affiliate money you're getting from the store.

MS has been offering it in excess of the affiliate money, but hasn't gained a ton of users from it (other than deals forums people, who will use it endlessly). They never marketed the cashback.

They're giving up a program that had a working revenue model when they acquired it and could very well be saved.

[hyperlinked]

They're giving up a program that had a working revenue model when they acquired it and could very well be saved.

I can see how that would work as a business, but it really doesn't make any sense for Microsoft unless they use it as a way to

• help Bing gain market share
• reduce the dominance of AdWords as the online advertising channel of choice for many vendors

It makes no sense for Microsoft to crawl into a totally unrelated market to their core competency and start a discount deal brokerage. If it's integrally tied to their search engine, then it makes sense, but not as business in of itself.

I'm disappointed. I was hoping there would be some secret business strategy in all this that would make this very interesting to dig into.

[muchadoaboutnothing]

I can see how that would work as a business, but it really doesn't make any sense for Microsoft unless they use it as a way to

• help Bing gain market share
• reduce the dominance of AdWords as the online advertising channel of choice for many vendors

It makes no sense for Microsoft to crawl into a totally unrelated market to their core competency and start a discount deal brokerage. If it's integrally tied to their search engine, then it makes sense, but not as business in of itself.

I'm disappointed. I was hoping there would be some secret business strategy in all this that would make this very interesting to dig into.

• That's what they were hoping, but they implemented it in a totally wrong fashion
• That was also part of the point, vendors would increase the cashback offered (not as much as MS made it) when they got in for terms like "ps3". They show up in prime positioning at the top of search results. Additionally, when you searched for a product it would show product links that went to Bing cashback anyways.

They already paid a few million for Jellyfish. Why flush it down the toilet?

[hyperlinked]

That's what they were hoping, but they implemented it in a totally wrong fashion

They already paid a few million for Jellyfish. Why flush it down the toilet?

Oh, was Bing just Jellyfish reborn as Bing Cashback?

I think they also got caught doing this at the wrong time. Retail vendors have been increasing their griping about the amount of money they they're having to pay in fees to specialty cards with exotic reward systems.

Once everyone stopped spending money they didn't have,  businesses that were sustained by volume alone really came undone. I suppose that would include the Bing network.

[muchadoaboutnothing]

Oh, was Bing just Jellyfish reborn as Bing Cashback?

Yes. Minus the cool reverse auction shows

I think they also got caught doing this at the wrong time. Retail vendors have been increasing their griping about the amount of money they they're having to pay in fees to specialty cards with exotic reward systems.

Most stores have an affiliate system anyways. Most stores like Newegg had nominal cashback (2.5%) which was perfectly sustainable.

Once everyone stopped spending money they didn't have,  businesses that were sustained by volume alone really came undone. I suppose that would include the Bing network.

The bigger problem is that MS knows what it wants to be internet kings, but they have no cohesive strategy to do so that they're implementing.

[hyperlinked]

The bigger problem is that MS knows what it wants to be internet kings, but they have no cohesive strategy to do so that they're implementing.

It seems that perhaps Microsoft got too large for its own good. With the success of the iPad, there are all these stories coming out about how Bill Gates beat Steve Jobs to the punch (at least publicly) on having a tablet computing strategy, but yet could not come up with a viable product. Along with that all the stories about how vicious politics at Microsoft is.

Then again, it's always easy to attribute a cause to a result in hindsight and  maybe their size had nothing to do with all the stumbling they've done in recent years.

[muchadoaboutnothing]

It seems that perhaps Microsoft got too large for its own good. With the success of the iPad, there are all these stories coming out about how Bill Gates beat Steve Jobs to the punch (at least publicly) on having a tablet computing strategy, but yet could not come up with a viable product. Along with that all the stories about how vicious politics at Microsoft is.

Then again, it's always easy to attribute a cause to a result in hindsight and  maybe their size had nothing to do with all the stumbling they've done in recent years.

It's all Microsoft's size which leads to politics, conflicting groups that are not merged, different groups that refuse to work with each other, etc.

The head of the Office division was heavily anti-tablet at the time that MS was really pushing the tablet PC movement. As  a result he refused to help them integrate the handwriting recognition and other features into Microsoft Office.

MS can't win because its size gets in the way. They need to restructure some of the groups internally.

Of course, saying it is easy. Doing it is hard

[aegrotatio]

I still like my $280 dual-core laptop and my other dual-core $350 laptop courtesy of Bing Cashback.

[hyperlinked]

MS can't win because its size gets in the way. They need to restructure some of the groups internally.

True, but this was what I meant in that it's easy to assign a cause to an outcome. Not that long ago, the conventional wisdom was that Microsoft was unbeatable because of its size. That they weren't nimble enough to get anything right the first time because their size was too much of a hindrance, but they'd just keep churning and put out a capable second version, and by the third version you might as well quit if you were competing against them.

[cicada]

nvm