Author Topic: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS  (Read 192771 times)

adamcobabe, _cramil, eyedrop, ClearKeys, netcelli, achooa and 5 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2450 on: Wed, 11 October 2017, 18:40:35 »
Is there anyone in this thread who has asked for a refund, but hasn't received a response?

Yup. I’m in that boat. Main reason I was trying to sell my spot.  I need my money back for my own life situation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Did you email support@keyckack, or jchans?

Offline squeakypizza

  • Posts: 42
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2451 on: Wed, 11 October 2017, 18:54:12 »
Is there anyone in this thread who has asked for a refund, but hasn't received a response?

Yup. I’m in that boat. Main reason I was trying to sell my spot.  I need my money back for my own life situation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Did you email support@keyckack, or jchans?
That I have.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Online _cramil

  • Posts: 36
  • Location: somewhere over the rainbow
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2452 on: Wed, 11 October 2017, 21:20:39 »
First, jchan, I sincerely feel for you and hope the best for you and your family during surely some difficult times. I have had my share and wouldn't wish them on anyone.

I typically check in here every couple days to see what the latest might be. I've been waiting patiently while respecting jchan's need to face personal realities, and resisting the urge to make any kind of unnecessary response. Today's flurry of posts however have pushed me to open up and make a few comments.

I (and most rational customers) totally understand that when any small business you work closely with is faced with a personal hardship that it will no doubt affect their operations, to include periods of time their doors are closed, the phones may go unanswered and emails are not returned. A sign on the door or a message on the website alerts you to the tragic news. With this there is usually an amount of time that this is I'll say "acceptable" from a customer's perspective before it starts to impact their attitudes toward that business regarding both current and future orders or even from a legal action standpoint. When reading through many posts here, what bothers me most and I see defended and promulgated often, is that jchan is just a guy doing a group buy like many of the others here or elsewhere on the internet, and that somehow allows for an open-ended time frame and justifies non-communication and frankly non-performance. The problem with this thinking is that jchan is not operating as just some individual on the internet. He opened up a business and put up a store front to operate under. Running a successful small business is hard work and requires sacrifice. Once you hang that sign up it's time to put on the big boy pants. I think the collective customers are now voicing that the "acceptable" amount of time to get things sorted out in ones personal life is coming to a close. It is not to say that anyone isn't sympathetic to the tragedy, or feels personal ill will, just it's not an unreasonable request to periodically answer collective questions and provide a timeline to meet your commitments.

I will caveat to say this isn't just something for KeyClack, but all the other small businesses that are popping up in the rapidly growing mechanical keyboard world need to think through and consider these things too.

Offline squeakypizza

  • Posts: 42
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2453 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 08:04:11 »
I do feel as though there has been no action regarding my refund and be it that I'm in need of that refund should be able to sell the spot, have JChan still ship the item to me and I can take card of shipping to the individual once I receive the board.  Is that something that would still be frowned upon?  I get it that times are tough and I understand tough for JChan and I'm sure he is in a difficult spot.  I really hope things get better for this GB.

Online Oblotzky

  • Posts: 611
  • Location: Cologne, Germany
  • When in doubt, buy both.
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2454 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 08:56:54 »
I do feel as though there has been no action regarding my refund and be it that I'm in need of that refund should be able to sell the spot, have JChan still ship the item to me and I can take card of shipping to the individual once I receive the board.  Is that something that would still be frowned upon?  I get it that times are tough and I understand tough for JChan and I'm sure he is in a difficult spot.  I really hope things get better for this GB.

That would be perfectly fine, but I'm pretty sure a refund would be processed earlier than shipment of more units.

Offline squeakypizza

  • Posts: 42
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2455 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 08:59:39 »
I do feel as though there has been no action regarding my refund and be it that I'm in need of that refund should be able to sell the spot, have JChan still ship the item to me and I can take card of shipping to the individual once I receive the board.  Is that something that would still be frowned upon?  I get it that times are tough and I understand tough for JChan and I'm sure he is in a difficult spot.  I really hope things get better for this GB.

That would be perfectly fine, but I'm pretty sure a refund would be processed earlier than shipment of more units.

Right on.  If anyone is still interested in the spot please PM.  If I hear anything back from Jchan regarding the refund, I will post that I have heard back from Jchan.

Online Oblotzky

  • Posts: 611
  • Location: Cologne, Germany
  • When in doubt, buy both.
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2456 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 11:05:20 »
I do feel as though there has been no action regarding my refund and be it that I'm in need of that refund should be able to sell the spot, have JChan still ship the item to me and I can take card of shipping to the individual once I receive the board.  Is that something that would still be frowned upon?  I get it that times are tough and I understand tough for JChan and I'm sure he is in a difficult spot.  I really hope things get better for this GB.

That would be perfectly fine, but I'm pretty sure a refund would be processed earlier than shipment of more units.

Right on.  If anyone is still interested in the spot please PM.  If I hear anything back from Jchan regarding the refund, I will post that I have heard back from Jchan.

It's just that 'selling my spot' means buying out someone elses order which is then shipped from the GB runner to the buyer. What you are offering is a simple 'buying my M65 once it arrives' so I would word it like that.

Offline deepthroat

  • Posts: 1
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2457 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 13:25:15 »
According to the "updates," approximately 150 of 450 orders have been shipped so far. Jchan received the shipment on July 19th, and has promised many times that shipping would be "quick" and "easy." We are all sympathetic for him and his personal situation, but remember that he presents Keyclack as a small professional business. He stood in front of all of us at the Seattle meetup and boasted about how he "built his business from the ground up," his transition to doing Keyclack full-time, buying a Prius because of it, and how he goes to great lengths to ensure his business exceeds expectations. I'm sure Jchan has spent a fair amount of time in the hospital, and we all respect that, but it seems he spends his free time playing video games and updating instagram about his "BKE Domes" project instead of fulfilling his responsibility to his customers. I'm less than satisfied, and I will not be ordering from Keyclack again.

Here's a condensed timeline of "updates" related to shipping and receiving:

Original Timeline
Estimated Group Buy Period : Approximately 10 - 12 Weeks.
January 7 - 11: Accept Submissions
January 12-14: Invoicing
January 17: Invoice Payment Due
January 19: Submit Payment to Manufacturers
About 50 work days later (excluding CNY 1-23 to 2-8 & Freight Time): Bulk Shipment Arrives
About 1 Week: QC for all the parts.
About 3 Days: Shipping

April 24, 2017
Original estimated ship date, April 30, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2410178#msg2410178

May 3, 2017
New estimate after manufacturer delay, May 12, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2416530#msg2416530

May 4, 2017 Top Clack
Jchan states he is "discouraged" by people cancelling their orders, but shipping is "not that difficult."
https://youtu.be/QuFV74SjNxM?t=18m32s

May 24, 2017
Fulfillment estimate "mid-late June"
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2429459#msg2429459

June 19, 2017
Jchan states he expects shipment to arrive from forwarding company between approximately June 20 through June 30.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2443036#msg2443036

June 29, 2017
Jchan states US customs will release pallets on July 2, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2448854#msg2448854

July 4, 2017
Jchan updates that he has no update.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2451946#msg2451946

July 5, 2017
Jchan updates that freight company has picked up the pallets and he hopes to ship the first 100 keyboards within one week.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2452350#msg2452350
July 11, 2017
Jchan states he should have the pallets by Friday, July 14, 2017. “Shipping to follow immediately.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2456366#msg2456366

July 14, 2017
Jchan states he will receive the pallets on Monday, July 17, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2458661#msg2458661

July 19, 2017
Jchan receives the keyboards at his office. He states shipping will begin Monday, July 24, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2461626#msg2461626

July 21, 2017
Jchan states he plans to ship 30+ per day and complete all shipping in 10 days.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2462613#msg2462613

July 26, 2017
Jchan states he’s been sick, and that shipping will begin tomorrow, July 27, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2465735#msg2465735

July 27, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 1” orders, 29 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2466201#msg2466201

July 28, 2017
Jchan states his intentions of having all orders shipped by August 4, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2466304#msg2466304

July 31, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 2” orders, 26 orders total. States “80-90%” of orders will be shipped by August 4, 2017. Also, this is the first mention of anodization issues. Jchan states he will be using extra units to fulfill those orders, so nobody will be affected.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2467978#msg2467978

August 1, 2017
Jchan updates that GMK sent him 200 stabilizers instead of 700, and that he is at fault for not checking the shipment when he received it two months prior. Also states he may be “done with M65-A” after round one.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468484#msg2468484
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468598#msg2468598
Jchan ships “Day 3” orders, 18 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468651#msg2468651

August 2, 2017
Jchan offers to ship boards without stabilizers, for people who don’t want to wait.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469125#msg2469125
Jchan ships “Day 4” orders, 29 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469239#msg2469239

August 4, 2017
Jchan updates that GMK is shipping stabilizers, he has 40 orders packed and ready to go once he receives them.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469910#msg2469910

August 8, 2017
Jchan updates that he will receive stabilizers “next week,” and that he’s “just about done with QC.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2472118#msg2472118

August 15, 2017
Jchan updates that he’s been in the hospital because someone close to him is having brain surgery.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476209#msg2476209
States he will not hold a round two.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476206#msg2476206

August 16, 2017
Jchan provides update that he is “done at the hospital,” and will package “15 or so” orders “tonight.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476759#msg2476759

August 17, 2017
Jchan states he prepared 10 orders the previous night, and that they should ship the following day.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2477062#msg2477062

August 18, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 5” orders, 18 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2477667#msg2477667

August 22, 2017
GMK stabilizers arrive.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2479311#msg2479311

August 27, 2017
Jchan states that he has 7 orders being picked up “tomorrow.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2481841#msg2481841

August 29, 2017
Jokes about “quitting keyboards” and states intention to package 30 orders “tomorrow.” Later states FedEx arrived “after hours” and that 19 orders will ship “tomorrow.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2482635#msg2482635

September 12, 2017
First mention that Jchan has hired someone to take on responsibilities at Keyclack.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2490829#msg2490829

September 19, 2017
Updates that things are “stabilizing” and that shipping should start next week.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2494776#msg2494776

September 23, 2017
Jchan updates that stabilizers are missing screws.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2496907#msg2496907

Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2458 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 13:33:44 »
"deepthroat"

So cryptic

Offline petrock

  • Posts: 33
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2459 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:02:23 »
"deepthroat"

So cryptic

Considering how earlier on whenever anyone asked for an update they were attacked for being insensitive (some of those attacks were justified due to the posters lack of moral sensitivity). The vast majority were attacked for a fairly reasonable request for a simple post. I don't blame them use of an alt.

Offline Tally810

  • Posts: 498
  • Location: Houston Texas
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2460 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:02:42 »
According to the "updates," approximately 150 of 450 orders have been shipped so far. Jchan received the shipment on July 19th, and has promised many times that shipping would be "quick" and "easy." We are all sympathetic for him and his personal situation, but remember that he presents Keyclack as a small professional business. He stood in front of all of us at the Seattle meetup and boasted about how he "built his business from the ground up," his transition to doing Keyclack full-time, buying a Prius because of it, and how he goes to great lengths to ensure his business exceeds expectations. I'm sure Jchan has spent a fair amount of time in the hospital, and we all respect that, but it seems he spends his free time playing video games and updating instagram about his "BKE Domes" project instead of fulfilling his responsibility to his customers. I'm less than satisfied, and I will not be ordering from Keyclack again.

Here's a condensed timeline of "updates" related to shipping and receiving:

Original Timeline
Estimated Group Buy Period : Approximately 10 - 12 Weeks.
January 7 - 11: Accept Submissions
January 12-14: Invoicing
January 17: Invoice Payment Due
January 19: Submit Payment to Manufacturers
About 50 work days later (excluding CNY 1-23 to 2-8 & Freight Time): Bulk Shipment Arrives
About 1 Week: QC for all the parts.
About 3 Days: Shipping

April 24, 2017
Original estimated ship date, April 30, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2410178#msg2410178

May 3, 2017
New estimate after manufacturer delay, May 12, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2416530#msg2416530

May 4, 2017 Top Clack
Jchan states he is "discouraged" by people cancelling their orders, but shipping is "not that difficult."
https://youtu.be/QuFV74SjNxM?t=18m32s

May 24, 2017
Fulfillment estimate "mid-late June"
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2429459#msg2429459

June 19, 2017
Jchan states he expects shipment to arrive from forwarding company between approximately June 20 through June 30.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2443036#msg2443036

June 29, 2017
Jchan states US customs will release pallets on July 2, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2448854#msg2448854

July 4, 2017
Jchan updates that he has no update.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2451946#msg2451946

July 5, 2017
Jchan updates that freight company has picked up the pallets and he hopes to ship the first 100 keyboards within one week.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2452350#msg2452350
July 11, 2017
Jchan states he should have the pallets by Friday, July 14, 2017. “Shipping to follow immediately.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2456366#msg2456366

July 14, 2017
Jchan states he will receive the pallets on Monday, July 17, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2458661#msg2458661

July 19, 2017
Jchan receives the keyboards at his office. He states shipping will begin Monday, July 24, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2461626#msg2461626

July 21, 2017
Jchan states he plans to ship 30+ per day and complete all shipping in 10 days.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2462613#msg2462613

July 26, 2017
Jchan states he’s been sick, and that shipping will begin tomorrow, July 27, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2465735#msg2465735

July 27, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 1” orders, 29 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2466201#msg2466201

July 28, 2017
Jchan states his intentions of having all orders shipped by August 4, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2466304#msg2466304

July 31, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 2” orders, 26 orders total. States “80-90%” of orders will be shipped by August 4, 2017. Also, this is the first mention of anodization issues. Jchan states he will be using extra units to fulfill those orders, so nobody will be affected.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2467978#msg2467978

August 1, 2017
Jchan updates that GMK sent him 200 stabilizers instead of 700, and that he is at fault for not checking the shipment when he received it two months prior. Also states he may be “done with M65-A” after round one.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468484#msg2468484
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468598#msg2468598
Jchan ships “Day 3” orders, 18 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468651#msg2468651

August 2, 2017
Jchan offers to ship boards without stabilizers, for people who don’t want to wait.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469125#msg2469125
Jchan ships “Day 4” orders, 29 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469239#msg2469239

August 4, 2017
Jchan updates that GMK is shipping stabilizers, he has 40 orders packed and ready to go once he receives them.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469910#msg2469910

August 8, 2017
Jchan updates that he will receive stabilizers “next week,” and that he’s “just about done with QC.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2472118#msg2472118

August 15, 2017
Jchan updates that he’s been in the hospital because someone close to him is having brain surgery.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476209#msg2476209
States he will not hold a round two.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476206#msg2476206

August 16, 2017
Jchan provides update that he is “done at the hospital,” and will package “15 or so” orders “tonight.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476759#msg2476759

August 17, 2017
Jchan states he prepared 10 orders the previous night, and that they should ship the following day.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2477062#msg2477062

August 18, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 5” orders, 18 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2477667#msg2477667

August 22, 2017
GMK stabilizers arrive.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2479311#msg2479311

August 27, 2017
Jchan states that he has 7 orders being picked up “tomorrow.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2481841#msg2481841

August 29, 2017
Jokes about “quitting keyboards” and states intention to package 30 orders “tomorrow.” Later states FedEx arrived “after hours” and that 19 orders will ship “tomorrow.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2482635#msg2482635

September 12, 2017
First mention that Jchan has hired someone to take on responsibilities at Keyclack.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2490829#msg2490829

September 19, 2017
Updates that things are “stabilizing” and that shipping should start next week.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2494776#msg2494776

September 23, 2017
Jchan updates that stabilizers are missing screws.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2496907#msg2496907

Wow this is very detailed but also shows the ride we have been on.  Just to let everyone know I did get a pm from Jchan on slack yesterday saying that he is working on everything.  He also offered a sincere apology.  However that being said I am in the camp that thinks these are not shipped because of issues with the boards.  Maybe they are in China getting the anode redone. This is only speculation but after getting the run around for so long that is all i can do is speculate.

Edit: spelling... sorry am on mobile
Sent from ur mam
« Last Edit: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:04:29 by Tally810 »

Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2461 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:04:41 »
"deepthroat"

So cryptic

Considering how earlier on whenever anyone asked for an update they were attacked for being insensitive (some of those attacks were justified due to the posters lack of moral sensitivity). The vast majority were attacked for a fairly reasonable request for a simple post. I don't blame them use of an alt.

Alts are against GH's TOS

Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2462 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:10:13 »

 He also offered a sincere apology.


I would appreciate it if he came into the thread and extended that apology to the rest of us and if he would be honest with us about what's been happening the last 3 weeks.

Offline clickstops

  • Posts: 29
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2463 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:14:06 »
Wow this is very detailed but also shows the ride we have been on.  Just to let everyone know I did get a pm from Jchan on slack yesterday saying that he is working on everything.  He also offered a sincere apology.  However that being said I am in the camp that thinks these are not shipped because of issues with the boards.  Maybe they are in China getting the anode redone. This is only speculation but after getting the run around for so long that is all i can do is speculate.


If they were all sent back to get the ano redone, why wouldn't he just say that? That would be incredibly understandable as far as group buys go.

Offline Tally810

  • Posts: 498
  • Location: Houston Texas
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2464 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:16:44 »
Wow this is very detailed but also shows the ride we have been on.  Just to let everyone know I did get a pm from Jchan on slack yesterday saying that he is working on everything.  He also offered a sincere apology.  However that being said I am in the camp that thinks these are not shipped because of issues with the boards.  Maybe they are in China getting the anode redone. This is only speculation but after getting the run around for so long that is all i can do is speculate.


If they were all sent back to get the ano redone, why wouldn't he just say that? That would be incredibly understandable as far as group buys go.
Like i said dude im just speculating and its the only thing that makes sense. Dont want to start any rumors  but the last update we got he mentioned boards in anode would we delayed due to the holiday in China

Sent from ur mam


Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2465 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 14:25:49 »
Wow this is very detailed but also shows the ride we have been on.  Just to let everyone know I did get a pm from Jchan on slack yesterday saying that he is working on everything.  He also offered a sincere apology.  However that being said I am in the camp that thinks these are not shipped because of issues with the boards.  Maybe they are in China getting the anode redone. This is only speculation but after getting the run around for so long that is all i can do is speculate.


If they were all sent back to get the ano redone, why wouldn't he just say that? That would be incredibly understandable as far as group buys go.
Like i said dude im just speculating and its the only thing that makes sense. Dont want to start any rumors  but the last update we got he mentioned boards in anode would we delayed due to the holiday in China

Sent from ur mam

I feel like most people would totally understand this.  /shrug

Offline Arcsxum

  • Posts: 30
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2466 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 17:10:50 »
According to the "updates," approximately 150 of 450 orders have been shipped so far. Jchan received the shipment on July 19th, and has promised many times that shipping would be "quick" and "easy." We are all sympathetic for him and his personal situation, but remember that he presents Keyclack as a small professional business. He stood in front of all of us at the Seattle meetup and boasted about how he "built his business from the ground up," his transition to doing Keyclack full-time, buying a Prius because of it, and how he goes to great lengths to ensure his business exceeds expectations. I'm sure Jchan has spent a fair amount of time in the hospital, and we all respect that, but it seems he spends his free time playing video games and updating instagram about his "BKE Domes" project instead of fulfilling his responsibility to his customers. I'm less than satisfied, and I will not be ordering from Keyclack again.

Here's a condensed timeline of "updates" related to shipping and receiving:

Original Timeline


Estimated Group Buy Period : Approximately 10 - 12 Weeks.
January 7 - 11: Accept Submissions
January 12-14: Invoicing
January 17: Invoice Payment Due
January 19: Submit Payment to Manufacturers
About 50 work days later (excluding CNY 1-23 to 2-8 & Freight Time): Bulk Shipment Arrives
About 1 Week: QC for all the parts.
About 3 Days: Shipping

April 24, 2017
Original estimated ship date, April 30, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2410178#msg2410178

May 3, 2017
New estimate after manufacturer delay, May 12, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2416530#msg2416530

May 4, 2017 Top Clack
Jchan states he is "discouraged" by people cancelling their orders, but shipping is "not that difficult."
https://youtu.be/QuFV74SjNxM?t=18m32s

May 24, 2017
Fulfillment estimate "mid-late June"
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2429459#msg2429459

June 19, 2017
Jchan states he expects shipment to arrive from forwarding company between approximately June 20 through June 30.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2443036#msg2443036

June 29, 2017
Jchan states US customs will release pallets on July 2, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2448854#msg2448854

July 4, 2017
Jchan updates that he has no update.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2451946#msg2451946

July 5, 2017
Jchan updates that freight company has picked up the pallets and he hopes to ship the first 100 keyboards within one week.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2452350#msg2452350
July 11, 2017
Jchan states he should have the pallets by Friday, July 14, 2017. “Shipping to follow immediately.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2456366#msg2456366

July 14, 2017
Jchan states he will receive the pallets on Monday, July 17, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2458661#msg2458661

July 19, 2017
Jchan receives the keyboards at his office. He states shipping will begin Monday, July 24, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2461626#msg2461626

July 21, 2017
Jchan states he plans to ship 30+ per day and complete all shipping in 10 days.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2462613#msg2462613

July 26, 2017
Jchan states he’s been sick, and that shipping will begin tomorrow, July 27, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2465735#msg2465735

July 27, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 1” orders, 29 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2466201#msg2466201

July 28, 2017
Jchan states his intentions of having all orders shipped by August 4, 2017.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2466304#msg2466304

July 31, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 2” orders, 26 orders total. States “80-90%” of orders will be shipped by August 4, 2017. Also, this is the first mention of anodization issues. Jchan states he will be using extra units to fulfill those orders, so nobody will be affected.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2467978#msg2467978

August 1, 2017
Jchan updates that GMK sent him 200 stabilizers instead of 700, and that he is at fault for not checking the shipment when he received it two months prior. Also states he may be “done with M65-A” after round one.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468484#msg2468484
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468598#msg2468598
Jchan ships “Day 3” orders, 18 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2468651#msg2468651

August 2, 2017
Jchan offers to ship boards without stabilizers, for people who don’t want to wait.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469125#msg2469125
Jchan ships “Day 4” orders, 29 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469239#msg2469239

August 4, 2017
Jchan updates that GMK is shipping stabilizers, he has 40 orders packed and ready to go once he receives them.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2469910#msg2469910

August 8, 2017
Jchan updates that he will receive stabilizers “next week,” and that he’s “just about done with QC.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2472118#msg2472118

August 15, 2017
Jchan updates that he’s been in the hospital because someone close to him is having brain surgery.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476209#msg2476209
States he will not hold a round two.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476206#msg2476206

August 16, 2017
Jchan provides update that he is “done at the hospital,” and will package “15 or so” orders “tonight.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2476759#msg2476759

August 17, 2017
Jchan states he prepared 10 orders the previous night, and that they should ship the following day.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2477062#msg2477062

August 18, 2017
Jchan ships “Day 5” orders, 18 orders total.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2477667#msg2477667

August 22, 2017
GMK stabilizers arrive.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2479311#msg2479311

August 27, 2017
Jchan states that he has 7 orders being picked up “tomorrow.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2481841#msg2481841

August 29, 2017
Jokes about “quitting keyboards” and states intention to package 30 orders “tomorrow.” Later states FedEx arrived “after hours” and that 19 orders will ship “tomorrow.”
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2482635#msg2482635

September 12, 2017
First mention that Jchan has hired someone to take on responsibilities at Keyclack.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2490829#msg2490829

September 19, 2017
Updates that things are “stabilizing” and that shipping should start next week.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2494776#msg2494776

September 23, 2017
Jchan updates that stabilizers are missing screws.
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=86756.msg2496907#msg2496907

Thanks deepthroat for putting the time and effort for condensing all the relevant dates and updates for us. For those who don't have time to go through the whole thread to find updates, I think this easily shows how long we have been waiting patiently. In addition, I do agree that from a business perspective, it has gone on long enough that it is not insensitive to say that this is unacceptable.

Offline anthonyooiszewen

  • Posts: 32
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2467 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 18:05:27 »
"deepthroat"

So cryptic

Considering how earlier on whenever anyone asked for an update they were attacked for being insensitive (some of those attacks were justified due to the posters lack of moral sensitivity). The vast majority were attacked for a fairly reasonable request for a simple post. I don't blame them use of an alt.

Jchan threatened to cancel my order unless I stopped posting/commenting. I never mentioned a refund and declined repeatedly when he kept pushing the "offer." He even told me to "search the aftermarket" (he's the most vocal vendor against the "evils of the aftermarket") for an M65-A if I "can't appreciate the time and care that [he's] putting into this."

He accused me of "harassing" him on Geekhack to the point of causing him an "emotional breakdown." If you look at my post history (in this thread and on the Master Control Rebirth GB thread), you'll see that I only ever asked for updates whenever there was yet another missed deadline without any news in the days that followed. Sure, I was a little snarky in maybe one or two comments, but I've since looked at all my posts here and maintain that nothing I said or asked was out of line for a customer dealing with a business.

I stopped commenting on all Keyclack/Jchan threads for fear of having my order cancelled without my consent (guess his threat worked) and because of the potential backlash from the "community."

I can send (in private messages, of course) screenshots of the email conversation between myself and Keyclack if anyone is curious/skeptical. Not a fan of drama, pitchforks, and witchhunts so I'd rather not post all that here.

"All people wanted was keyboards"
- JChan94, 27 days ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/70cq8u/ics_response_to_md/dn27v02/
« Last Edit: Thu, 12 October 2017, 18:17:41 by anthonyooiszewen »

Offline dohmain

  • Posts: 11
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2468 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 18:24:49 »
Adding to deepthroat's post, there is something that's been bothering me about the some of the updates we've been given. I've just been trying to ignore it, but at this point why not just air it out?

At one point jchan was asked about his new hire, and if he could ship out the M65-As and the response given was:

Hi,

the new hire is charge of:

- Support (emails to support@keyclack.com NOT jchan@keyclack.com)
- Helping organizing / maintaining the office
- Shipping Store / Newly incoming things (muted, 1965 up and coming)
- QC soon.

The M65A is a little too complex at this stage of training. It's only been a little over a week since I've worked with him.

This response bothered me a LOT. Maybe more than it should but I did my best to ignore it and trust in the reputation jchan has in this community.
Hear me out and then tell me if I'm wrong to be bothered by this.

When jchan discovered he was short on stabs he dedicated his time to doing purely QC on all the units. I assumed this was so every unit would be ready to ship once the stabs arrived. Remember, he was only missing 2u stabs, each box would get the same number of 2u stabs and be ready to go.

Day 4 is done.

Day 5 will be dedicated towards pure QC, and putting units away and documentation to get fixed up a little. Just need to make sure they are actual issues, and clean them up with some 120grit sand paper (jk).

Day 2,3,4 emails will be sent today. Sorry, haven't had a moment to catch a breath.

- Quality Control should finish by Monday/Tuesday for all the boards.

The stabs should be here soon, and QA/QC is almost done with.

News Update

Just about done with QC.

Also, I'm finishing up QC and then finishing shipping what I have. It's a lot sorting for those opting out of stabs and those in, and such. Literally a stack here with people who want stabs.

Running through another series of QC just to make sure some stuff isn't missed.

Calling DHL to pick up the unaccepted units to go back to Asia to get fixed later this week.

A bunch of units are just sitting here, ready to go, just waiting for the stabs. Just want to have it all here.

Thanks for your patience.

Here it seems like jchan is finishing up a 2nd round of QC for the boards. Double check, I can get with that.

but then...

Oh, of course. I was in the GMK Keyboard & Co GB for about a year and production hasn't even started yet. Out of the dozens of GBs I've been in, only one has ever met the initial ship date. My concern isn't about missing the original timeline - I really never expected that to be met even though Jchan was super optimistic (During the announcement he talked about how this GB won't have delays like the others). It's the constant "Will ship next week - [one or two weeks of silence] - [New unexpected delay] Will ship next week" - [one or two weeks of silence] - Repeat" that's gotten old.

Would much rather have been told to wait till September/October instead of hearing "Will ship this/next week" every couple of weeks since June. Again, just a realistic update instead of an overly optimistic new deadline that'll most likely be missed again anyway.

Hi Anthony,

I've been trying to ship boards every week.

A GB for a quality board is not just

- Design
- Order
- Pay
- Wait
- Ship out.

There is so much more organization involved in the process.

Here are many things that I do on the back end

- Talk to Customs
- Talk to a Customs Broker
- Wait for the shipment
- Make wire transfer for payments
- Ask for updates on the shipment
- Organize people's orders
- Refund people's cancels
- Adjust people's orders
- Send replacements/support stuff / email stuff / change emails
- QC 450 boards (over 1200 pieces, plate, weight, etc)

But there's a tad more to the QC process. You've seen how the boards are packed, but I also have to open the boxes, throw away the other boxes, make sure there's enough room in my dumpster, and such.

While I don't want to bore people with the little things that I do, I feel like it's now necessary to tell you that there is a lot of trash that I have to take care of with this. The boxes for this took me 4 trips to the recycling center in my Prius because I couldn't fit them all.

I also had to take 2 trips to DHL to drop off the parts that are bad because I had to pack them well in a lot of wrap to make sure they don't get damaged in transit, and try to compact them so I don't pay thousands in express air fees. Please also remember that it takes me time to load my car, move the boxes, reorganize, and such to stay optimal and efficient.

Anthony - I want to reiterate that there's a lot more to a GB than just shipping a board. A lot of people try to hide this process because it's boring and these details are not that important. I understand your frustration, but please understand that I'm frustrated that I don't have enough hours in my day to get everything out.

I hope this helps shed a little more light to what GB runners go through, and I hope people empathize with the process and stress that it takes for us to do this kind of stuff. I hope this in no way discourages people from running their own Buys, but it's definitely taken a toll on me.

Here, in order to explain the delays, jchan makes a list of tasks that are irrelevant to the delay (design, order, pay wait, etc..) all the way to tasks that should've been taken care of through the process of 2 rounds of QC.

At this point, I expected all of the boards to be QC'd, boxed up and ready to ship once a set of 2u stabs were thrown in the box... something that maybe a new hire is capable of doing?
But jchan says that this order is too complex for the new hire. It's just not making sense to me.

Offline Captainbuttmonkey

  • Posts: 153
  • Location: UK
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2469 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 19:30:51 »

Offline networkdrift

  • Posts: 6
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2470 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 19:44:49 »
I've been very patient through all of this because I don't know how I would deal with jchan's situation if I were in his shoes. After reading all of this, however, I'm starting to lose confidence in jchan's ability to deliver on this group buy. I was under the impression that the boards could not be shipped because they hadn't been QC'd, but I guess I'd forgotten all the times he'd talked about QC. I hope we get some clarification on what is actually going on with these kits and why so few have gone out despite the updates about shipping in the past month.

Offline pr0ximity

  • Posts: 1907
  • Location: Vacationland
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2471 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 20:58:16 »
Surely this analysis will put no more stress on a college-aged kid

Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2472 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 21:57:50 »
Surely this analysis will put no more stress on a college-aged kid

I'm assuming jchan was born in 94 - he is an adult.

Offline dohmain

  • Posts: 11
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2473 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 23:10:59 »
Surely this analysis will put no more stress on a college-aged kid

jchan is a college graduated man that started a bonafide business as his full time job.

Online ihalatch

  • Posts: 239
  • Location: Adelaide, Australia
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2474 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 23:27:52 »
In my opinion this keyboard is totally worth waiting for.
« Last Edit: Thu, 12 October 2017, 23:30:13 by ihalatch »

Offline therealmckellar

  • Posts: 25
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2475 on: Thu, 12 October 2017, 23:29:23 »
Surely this analysis will put no more stress on a college-aged kid
Riiiiiight. He graduated college. He started a business. He lives in the real world. You start a business you deal with stress, you communicate with your customers, you don't shut down operations for weeks and drop off the face of the earth (well, really only this thread, he's posted fine in other threads). Im the real world that's how you make sure your business closes.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk


Offline Vadurr

  • Posts: 244
  • Location: CA
  • Valar Morghulis
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2476 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 01:44:51 »
In my opinion this keyboard is totally worth waiting for.

I concur. I'd also appreciate an update though.

Offline gizmoplex

  • Posts: 16
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2477 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 01:54:09 »
In my opinion this keyboard is totally worth waiting for.

Bit of a headstand on my desk is always gud, thanks fam. Absolutely stunning keebs!

Offline squeakypizza

  • Posts: 42
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2478 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 09:14:03 »
What is kind of worrying me is the amount of time to process a refund.  I hope the funds are there.  I would only assume on the business end of things to process a refund is just a couple clicks away.  Not in any way shape or form trying to speculate but you would think this is something that could be done within a matter of minutes.  I needs my dough back.   :'(. Major bummer.

Offline Malenky

  • Posts: 256
  • Location: United Kingdom
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2479 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 09:29:43 »
I'm sure complete honesty and open communication would only be greeted with understanding and sympathy. I don't want a refund, I really want my keyboard. I would love a post once a week, just so we know where we are at. Turn it into a little blog or something, take 10 minutes to sit down and write about how the week has gone, help us understand. Even if personal matters mean you pack one board a week, show us. We want the buy to succeed, and we want you and Keyclack to succeed.

Offline dohmain

  • Posts: 11
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2480 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 09:34:56 »
In my opinion this keyboard is totally worth waiting for.

Throughout the delays a few people that have received theirs have said the same thing.

I don't have a problem with waiting, and I think that is the same with most people (or I would imagine there would be a flood of people asking for refunds)...
The problems I have are with the inconsistencies in his updates (which I have ignored until now) and his lack of updates on this particular buy while he took the time to update other threads (which is what prompted me to speak up after being silent until now).

The M65-A is (as far as I know) jchan's biggest buy, his most expensive, and his most hyped and delayed product. And yet, this was the one he ignored that day when he made updates.

Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2481 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 09:55:18 »
In my opinion this keyboard is totally worth waiting for.

Throughout the delays a few people that have received theirs have said the same thing.

I don't have a problem with waiting, and I think that is the same with most people (or I would imagine there would be a flood of people asking for refunds)...
The problems I have are with the inconsistencies in his updates (which I have ignored until now) and his lack of updates on this particular buy while he took the time to update other threads (which is what prompted me to speak up after being silent until now).

The M65-A is (as far as I know) jchan's biggest buy, his most expensive, and his most hyped and delayed product. And yet, this was the one he ignored that day when he made updates.

I can't imagine the amount of pressure jchan must feel at this point, both from a life side, and keeb/business side - everyone wants updates, and many of us are begging even for a "nothing new" update.  In reality, however, any update he makes, short of "all boards are being shipped today" will be met with some criticism.

I am fortunate enough to not really need my $350 currently, and will gladly wait as long as needed(even well into 2018 if that's what it takes), because this is the best board I've ever seen.  It is a bit concerning if refunds are not being processed in a timely manner though - this might lead to a panic for some people, which will only detract from the situation.

Offline squeakypizza

  • Posts: 42
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2482 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 09:57:31 »
In my opinion this keyboard is totally worth waiting for.

Throughout the delays a few people that have received theirs have said the same thing.

I don't have a problem with waiting, and I think that is the same with most people (or I would imagine there would be a flood of people asking for refunds)...
The problems I have are with the inconsistencies in his updates (which I have ignored until now) and his lack of updates on this particular buy while he took the time to update other threads (which is what prompted me to speak up after being silent until now).

The M65-A is (as far as I know) jchan's biggest buy, his most expensive, and his most hyped and delayed product. And yet, this was the one he ignored that day when he made updates.

I can't imagine the amount of pressure jchan must feel at this point, both from a life side, and keeb/business side - everyone wants updates, and many of us are begging even for a "nothing new" update.  In reality, however, any update he makes, short of "all boards are being shipped today" will be met with some criticism.

I am fortunate enough to not really need my $350 currently, and will gladly wait as long as needed(even well into 2018 if that's what it takes), because this is the best board I've ever seen.  It is a bit concerning if refunds are not being processed in a timely manner though - this might lead to a panic for some people, which will only detract from the situation.

I feel for Jchan.  I do feel a little panicked though.  Not too sure what to do at the moment.

Offline sixdeuces

  • Posts: 26
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2483 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 10:17:56 »
I feel for Jchan.  I do feel a little panicked though.  Not too sure what to do at the moment.

There's been three full pages of complaining but what it all boils down to is:

a) We wait and get our boards/refunds.
b) We wait and all get Ivan'd.

It sucks, but those are our options unless you're going to drive to LA and drag jchan to FedEx by the ear.

Also, people posting with alts and spreading vitriol is just dragging the forum down and souring the whole thing even further. Jchan's reputation was one of the reasons I was willing to take a chance on this in the first place. I'm confident he's acutely aware that reputation is burning by the day. If he intends to continue with KeyClack he'll try and stop that ASAP. If not, see option B above.

Offline Valaris

  • Posts: 82
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2484 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 10:22:28 »
I feel for Jchan.  I do feel a little panicked though.  Not too sure what to do at the moment.

There's been three full pages of complaining but what it all boils down to is:

a) We wait and get our boards/refunds.
b) We wait and all get Ivan'd.

It sucks, but those are our options unless you're going to drive to LA and drag jchan to FedEx by the ear.

Also, people posting with alts and spreading vitriol is just dragging the forum down and souring the whole thing even further. Jchan's reputation was one of the reasons I was willing to take a chance on this in the first place. I'm confident he's acutely aware that reputation is burning by the day. If he intends to continue with KeyClack he'll try and stop that ASAP. If not, see option B above.

I'm somewhat new to the community and I keep seeing these references to Ivan. What happened?

Offline sixdeuces

  • Posts: 26
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2485 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 10:24:51 »
I'm somewhat new to the community and I keep seeing these references to Ivan. What happened?

Before my time too, but basically a longstanding community member with good reputation collected a bunch of cash for a GB and then vanished.

Offline Rafa_n

  • Posts: 88
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2486 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 10:31:44 »
I feel for Jchan.  I do feel a little panicked though.  Not too sure what to do at the moment.

There's been three full pages of complaining but what it all boils down to is:

a) We wait and get our boards/refunds.
b) We wait and all get Ivan'd.

It sucks, but those are our options unless you're going to drive to LA and drag jchan to FedEx by the ear.

Also, people posting with alts and spreading vitriol is just dragging the forum down and souring the whole thing even further. Jchan's reputation was one of the reasons I was willing to take a chance on this in the first place. I'm confident he's acutely aware that reputation is burning by the day. If he intends to continue with KeyClack he'll try and stop that ASAP. If not, see option B above.

I'm somewhat new to the community and I keep seeing these references to Ivan. What happened?

VERY popular GB runner is running multiple gbs at the same time, has a personal problem, starts to come less and less to geekhack, breaks communication, runs of with thousands of dollars of group buy money.

Jchan is at the "slowly coming less and less to GH" phase

Offline dohmain

  • Posts: 11
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2487 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 10:35:38 »
In my opinion this keyboard is totally worth waiting for.

Throughout the delays a few people that have received theirs have said the same thing.

I don't have a problem with waiting, and I think that is the same with most people (or I would imagine there would be a flood of people asking for refunds)...
The problems I have are with the inconsistencies in his updates (which I have ignored until now) and his lack of updates on this particular buy while he took the time to update other threads (which is what prompted me to speak up after being silent until now).

The M65-A is (as far as I know) jchan's biggest buy, his most expensive, and his most hyped and delayed product. And yet, this was the one he ignored that day when he made updates.

I can't imagine the amount of pressure jchan must feel at this point, both from a life side, and keeb/business side - everyone wants updates, and many of us are begging even for a "nothing new" update.  In reality, however, any update he makes, short of "all boards are being shipped today" will be met with some criticism.

I am fortunate enough to not really need my $350 currently, and will gladly wait as long as needed(even well into 2018 if that's what it takes), because this is the best board I've ever seen.  It is a bit concerning if refunds are not being processed in a timely manner though - this might lead to a panic for some people, which will only detract from the situation.

I feel like most of the criticism was due to jchan promising shipping and not following through several times.

"A man is only as good as his word" is the saying.

Something similar was mentioned before, but if jchan came on and said, "hey, let me have some time to deal with this. I can't promise shipping anytime soon but I'll hit you guys back in a month and let you know where we stand." that would be alright in my book.

But as we stand right now, things were supposed to start shipping almost two weeks ago and didn't.
jchan updated his other buys, and ignored this one. I guess this is the one that irks me the most.

You know, if he didn't make any updates on his other buys on Oct2 (and an instagram update on Oct3), then I would probably still be silent thinking, "oh man, maybe there's something that he really has to deal with right now."

Offline sixdeuces

  • Posts: 26
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2488 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 10:50:57 »
VERY popular GB runner is running multiple gbs at the same time, has a personal problem, starts to come less and less to geekhack, breaks communication, runs of with thousands of dollars of group buy money.

Jchan is at the "slowly coming less and less to GH" phase

At least with him there is a name and location for legal recourse. Honestly hope it never gets anywhere near that, of course.

Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2489 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:07:59 »
Here's my HIGHLY speculative theory of a "worst-case scenario."  I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH THAT THIS IS SPECULATION - it is not intended to cast anyone in a negative light (except maybe one unknown individual, which I'll explain), nor is it intended to cause chaos in this thread, speculation ONLY, based on a largely unverifiable source I was able to dig up online.
.
.
.
SERIOUSLY - take this with a grain of salt (in fact, take all the salt from delayed GB's and take all of it)
.
.
.

June/July - jchan hits some unexpected delays with production, stabs, etc. -  common in group buys
Late July/August - Boards begin shipping at a decent rate, lots of QC, but movement.
Mid-August - life kicks in HARD, jchan obviously is dealing with a whirlwind of gigantic proportions - it is entirely understandable that he takes a step back for a moment to deal with it.
Late august thru September - Updates trickle in, jchan is dealing with life, and we are all (mostly) understanding

Sept 23rd - jchan's last update to this thread - says m65's will start moving next week

***SPECULATION PART***
through crimereports.com(my largely unverifiable source), there was a burglary reported on the block keyclack's warehouse is located (I won't post it, but it's pretty easy to find with a search) on September 29th around 7PM

I'm speculating that the M65-A's were stolen from Keyclack headquarters.

If this is the case, it would put jchan in an extremely tough situation(on top of life stuff) - especially if they were uninsured/not covered.

The question would arise whether this group buy was done under keyclack, or personally through mr. Chan himself.  If it was the former, the legal implications could be crippling for Keyclack, and if it was the latter, crippling for jchan himself.

.
.
.
If I'm being a total moron and causing issues just for speculating, I hope that jchan will say so.  Hopefully he can swoop in and clear everything up.

Offline sixdeuces

  • Posts: 26
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2490 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:18:32 »
Reiterating that this is pure speculation...

Even if that were true, KeyClack is likely a sole proprietorship which means it would land at jchans feet either way. (There's little legal protection there, contrary to popular belief.)

My question would be why steal them anyway? Pretty useless to most people, not worth much in materials, and virtually impossible to sell without this very small community noticing it.

Then, crooks aren't known for being the brightest or most practical bunch...
« Last Edit: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:22:19 by sixdeuces »

Offline therealmckellar

  • Posts: 25
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2491 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:22:17 »
Here's my HIGHLY speculative theory of a "worst-case scenario."  I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH THAT THIS IS SPECULATION - it is not intended to cast anyone in a negative light (except maybe one unknown individual, which I'll explain), nor is it intended to cause chaos in this thread, speculation ONLY, based on a largely unverifiable source I was able to dig up online.
.
.
.
SERIOUSLY - take this with a grain of salt (in fact, take all the salt from delayed GB's and take all of it)
.
.
.

June/July - jchan hits some unexpected delays with production, stabs, etc. -  common in group buys
Late July/August - Boards begin shipping at a decent rate, lots of QC, but movement.
Mid-August - life kicks in HARD, jchan obviously is dealing with a whirlwind of gigantic proportions - it is entirely understandable that he takes a step back for a moment to deal with it.
Late august thru September - Updates trickle in, jchan is dealing with life, and we are all (mostly) understanding

Sept 23rd - jchan's last update to this thread - says m65's will start moving next week

***SPECULATION PART***
through crimereports.com(my largely unverifiable source), there was a burglary reported on the block keyclack's warehouse is located (I won't post it, but it's pretty easy to find with a search) on September 29th around 7PM

I'm speculating that the M65-A's were stolen from Keyclack headquarters.

If this is the case, it would put jchan in an extremely tough situation(on top of life stuff) - especially if they were uninsured/not covered.

The question would arise whether this group buy was done under keyclack, or personally through mr. Chan himself.  If it was the former, the legal implications could be crippling for Keyclack, and if it was the latter, crippling for jchan himself.

.
.
.
If I'm being a total moron and causing issues just for speculating, I hope that jchan will say so.  Hopefully he can swoop in and clear everything up.
There's no way he did the order personally, you just wouldn't do that when you own a company. If he had a theft he should've come on here and told everyone. This whole dragging it out and ignoring the conversation is going to destroy his company, as it has many others in the past.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk


Offline kolashnikov

  • Posts: 32
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2492 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:33:31 »
Recent posts have me panicked too, but look at how big and how many of these things there are. It would have taken a few guys and/or a big-ass truck to run off with so many boxes. That is assuming a thief would even identify these as something of value.

It is a good day.

Show Image



Day 2 is over, and today I got through a lot more than expected.

There are boards that have this small anodization issues, but our amazing manufacturer is going to fix them. The anodization issue is only apparent when you shine light on it a certain direction. But it bugs the hell out of me.

Show Image



I should be done with most of the gb this Friday, and then I will be forwarding the units to them, and they will be fixed in a week or two.

Extra units are being used to make sure everyone gets their unit within the GB. After that, the units that come back will be used for extras, and we'll have our r2 colors as well.

Show Image




Offline jjwax

  • Posts: 74
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2493 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:40:17 »
Recent posts have me panicked too, but look at how big and how many of these things there are. It would have taken a few guys and/or a big-ass truck to run off with so many boxes. That is assuming a thief would even identify these as something of value.

It is a good day.

Show Image



Day 2 is over, and today I got through a lot more than expected.

There are boards that have this small anodization issues, but our amazing manufacturer is going to fix them. The anodization issue is only apparent when you shine light on it a certain direction. But it bugs the hell out of me.

Show Image



I should be done with most of the gb this Friday, and then I will be forwarding the units to them, and they will be fixed in a week or two.

Extra units are being used to make sure everyone gets their unit within the GB. After that, the units that come back will be used for extras, and we'll have our r2 colors as well.

Show Image



If it was stolen, I would suspect someone in this community over anyone else

Offline squeakypizza

  • Posts: 42
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2494 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:42:01 »
Man, just sent another follow up email practically begging for my money back.  Worst part is that I have read receipts when sending email and I certainly know that someone has seen me email.  This sucks.

Offline xondat

  • i'm not a star
  • * Maker
  • Posts: 3232
  • Location: United Kingdom
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2495 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 12:49:16 »
Man, just sent another follow up email practically begging for my money back.  Worst part is that I have read receipts when sending email and I certainly know that someone has seen me email.  This sucks.

It's possible Keyclack has refunded so many people that they're out of money.

I'm sure Jchan will follow through, it's just the length of time that'll suck.

Offline RubenMcNoobin

  • Posts: 47
  • Location: Florida
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2496 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 15:37:41 »
Man, just sent another follow up email practically begging for my money back.  Worst part is that I have read receipts when sending email and I certainly know that someone has seen me email.  This sucks.


Man, I'm sorry to hear the position you're in. Hopefully all this action lately with compel an update out of him soon, almost anything would be better than nothing :(
           
Silenced Novatouch           K70 RGB          Magicforce-68

Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2497 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 16:07:09 »
This has gone way too far. How is anyone going to respond to these wild stories and deepthroat inquisitions.

Offline Puddsy

  • Foreman of the salt mine
  • * Exalted Elder
  • Posts: 5969
  • Location: Amherst, MA or New York, NY
  • 大江 健三郎
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2498 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 16:08:58 »
This is ridiculous.

Speculating solves nothing.

Jchan, I hope you and your family are alright.
QFR (62g blacks) | MJ2 TKL | Realforce 87U | G81-3000 "Schumiboard" | Varmilo Bulgogiboard (Keycon 104) | KBD75 (MX silent blacks) | MIRA (soon!)

ahh, thanks puddsy. can always count on your snarky informitism

Add me on Steam | Add me on Battle.net: Puddsy#1914 | /u/Puddsy

Offline therealmckellar

  • Posts: 25
Re: [GB] M65-A | Made with RAMA.WORKS
« Reply #2499 on: Fri, 13 October 2017, 16:17:31 »
Here's my HIGHLY speculative theory of a "worst-case scenario."  I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH THAT THIS IS SPECULATION - it is not intended to cast anyone in a negative light (except maybe one unknown individual, which I'll explain), nor is it intended to cause chaos in this thread, speculation ONLY, based on a largely unverifiable source I was able to dig up online.
.
.
.
SERIOUSLY - take this with a grain of salt (in fact, take all the salt from delayed GB's and take all of it)
.
.
.

June/July - jchan hits some unexpected delays with production, stabs, etc. -  common in group buys
Late July/August - Boards begin shipping at a decent rate, lots of QC, but movement.
Mid-August - life kicks in HARD, jchan obviously is dealing with a whirlwind of gigantic proportions - it is entirely understandable that he takes a step back for a moment to deal with it.
Late august thru September - Updates trickle in, jchan is dealing with life, and we are all (mostly) understanding

Sept 23rd - jchan's last update to this thread - says m65's will start moving next week

***SPECULATION PART***
through crimereports.com(my largely unverifiable source), there was a burglary reported on the block keyclack's warehouse is located (I won't post it, but it's pretty easy to find with a search) on September 29th around 7PM

I'm speculating that the M65-A's were stolen from Keyclack headquarters.

If this is the case, it would put jchan in an extremely tough situation(on top of life stuff) - especially if they were uninsured/not covered.

The question would arise whether this group buy was done under keyclack, or personally through mr. Chan himself.  If it was the former, the legal implications could be crippling for Keyclack, and if it was the latter, crippling for jchan himself.

.
.
.
If I'm being a total moron and causing issues just for speculating, I hope that jchan will say so.  Hopefully he can swoop in and clear everything up.
I think we have no other choice but to presume this could be what happened, which changes the perspective when you take into account the absence, and the fact that other threads are being posted on and refund emails are being read but not responded to. The question is why.

Unless the crook or team of criminals are aware of this forum or /r/mechanical_keyboard or /r/mechmarket, or one of jchan's Instagram followers, they wouldn't be aware of the value of the product. That means this person, or most reasonably, this team (because of the sheer amount of items/weight), is likely someone amongst us.

But they could also have taken the inventory blindly, as happens in plenty of commercial burglaries and not have even looked at what they were taking, just taking a pallet full of inventory to appraise and sell afterwards.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
« Last Edit: Fri, 13 October 2017, 16:19:14 by therealmckellar »