Author Topic: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears  (Read 4273 times)

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Offline jwburrows

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    • KeyBee
[IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« on: Fri, 02 April 2021, 14:45:30 »


Designed by KeyBee & TW Keycaps

IC Form


Hello everyone!

As many of you may know, the next project KeyBee will undertake is a heavy, progressive, linear- the Honey Switch. This switch will have a beautiful golden color that makes it truly eye-catching. In addition to the mesmerizing look, the switches will have a unique material composition, giving them a press feel unlike any other linear switch on the market. We set out to make a switch that would stand out amongst other switches, and we believe that we have done just that with the Honey Switch. With the heavy progressive spring, every key press will remind you of silky-smooth honey.



Switch Specs:
Name: Honey Switch
Type: Linear
Springs: 62g-70g Progressive (Gold-Plated)
Housing Material: PC Top and POM Bottom
Stem: POM
Factory Lube: No
Pin Mounting: 5-Pin (PCB Mount)

Manufacturers:
We have officially narrowed down our selection to three amazing manufacturers for the Honey switches! Although all three of the manufacturers are very different and come with various benefits, we are confident in the ability of each of them and the potential they hold to make this amazing project come to fruition. We should have a very clear idea of who we’ll select in the coming week with meetings in store that should narrow down the selection further. Look for an official announcement on this in the next Honey switch IC!

Pricing:
We aim to sell the switches at $.50-$.65 per switch. We are confident that we can bring an immense level of value to the community with a switch priced in this range. Of course, as the project continues, we will post updates regarding the price as it becomes more clear.

Accessories:
Along with the switches, we will be working with a few popular artists in the community to get some high-quality artwork for accessories and stickers to create the full KeyBee Honey experience! As you might have noticed from the illustration below, one of our artists is u/seo_bun! They have done an amazing job creating an art piece that fits the theme of the Honey switches perfectly and allows us to create some great accessories to pair with them. We still have one other artist we’re working to get some accessories made with, but we will wait until that project is perfect to release the details.



Extra:

Of course, if you like the KeyBee Honey switches, make sure to fill out our IC form here to let us know!


Don’t forget, you can join our Discord servers to get more updates and news on upcoming projects:

KeyBee Discord

TW Keycaps Discord


Offline Chippy

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 02 April 2021, 19:30:32 »
Feel like I just saw something similar, but was listed as a dollar? Is this the same thing?
This and the swiss cheese keyboard is the next generation of keyboards

Offline jwburrows

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 02 April 2021, 21:15:24 »
Feel like I just saw something similar, but was listed as a dollar? Is this the same thing?

Yes, sorry for the confusion! We had originally planned on the Honey switches using an Ink v2 housing that was marked up by Gateron to an insane price which we had to basically pass on to end consumers. We reconsidered our options however, and decided to go with a different material combination that would give a better sounding and feeling switch for a cheaper price because it wouldn't have to support the pricing of the other Ink v2's on the market. Of course, we will most likely not go with Gateron all together, but they're still on the table with this new Honey switch. Hope that answers your question!

Offline NSkeptic

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 02 April 2021, 22:38:26 »
These switches look great. I'd buy this if a GB turns up.

Offline acitrin

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 03 April 2021, 00:44:45 »
Hey!

Just wanted to ask a few clarifying questions:

1. Why have you not yet released a manufacturer's name? Is there any ETA on when you'll do that? For many, it's a crucial piece of information. (For reference, the last switch GB that didn't release a manufacturer's name until the last minute were the Emeralds... which did not end well.)

2. I'm curious as to the usage of POM in the bottom of a switch. What potential benefits does that have? Why pair the POM bottom with a PC top?

3. You advertise this as a "Heavy, Progressive, Linear" in the title, but don't delve into either "Heavy" or "Progressive" in the specs. What type of progressive spring is this? You cite a 62g-70g spring, but many would argue that isn't a heavy spring.

I'm sorry for the nitpicks, but I wouldn't feel comfortable joining this kind of GB without the full details. Thank you! :)

Offline jwburrows

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 03 April 2021, 14:57:23 »
Hey!

Just wanted to ask a few clarifying questions:

1. Why have you not yet released a manufacturer's name? Is there any ETA on when you'll do that? For many, it's a crucial piece of information. (For reference, the last switch GB that didn't release a manufacturer's name until the last minute were the Emeralds... which did not end well.)

2. I'm curious as to the usage of POM in the bottom of a switch. What potential benefits does that have? Why pair the POM bottom with a PC top?

3. You advertise this as a "Heavy, Progressive, Linear" in the title, but don't delve into either "Heavy" or "Progressive" in the specs. What type of progressive spring is this? You cite a 62g-70g spring, but many would argue that isn't a heavy spring.

I'm sorry for the nitpicks, but I wouldn't feel comfortable joining this kind of GB without the full details. Thank you! :)

Hi! No worries at all these are all great questions. First, we haven't decided on a manufacturer because we have a meeting with a prominent manufacturer in the coming week that would be our first pick, but that's not a guarantee due to their availability at this moment. We don't want to disclose names until after this meeting as we can then move forward based on the results and give exact details on everything. Secondly, originally we were going to go with a full PC switch to achieve the fully transparent look to the housing and really give the honey look we were going for. This being said, after talking with some experts and prominent reviewers, we decided against a PC bottom due to the increased ping. We chose POM because of the sound profile it would give the switch and the smoothness it offers. Of course, we kept the top housing PC as a way to stick with the original honey look as the top housing material is going to have a smaller impact on the switch performance than the bottom housing. On top of this, in a keyboard you only really see the top housing so the honey look will be achieved with the PC well. Lastly, we want to get feedback for the springs in our interim period while deciding on a manufacturer. I think we were originally thinking 70+, but after feedback we have come to realize that 65-70g is the sweet spot for the majority of people. We have recently looked at progressives that mimic closely to a 68.5g spring, but no decisions on the springs will be concrete until we get serious with the manufacturer. Hope that clears some things up! Feel free to reach out if you have any other questions!!

Offline lush_bunny

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #6 on: Sun, 04 April 2021, 02:04:13 »
1. Why have you not yet released a manufacturer's name? Is there any ETA on when you'll do that? For many, it's a crucial piece of information. (For reference, the last switch GB that didn't release a manufacturer's name until the last minute were the Emeralds... which did not end well.)

Are Emeralds the switches that were supposed to have PME housings? What happened with them, I was always curious.

Offline lush_bunny

  • Posts: 633
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  • TBR Prime | 7V | BOCC
Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #7 on: Sun, 04 April 2021, 02:19:04 »
Feel like I just saw something similar, but was listed as a dollar? Is this the same thing?

Yes, sorry for the confusion! We had originally planned on the Honey switches using an Ink v2 housing that was marked up by Gateron to an insane price which we had to basically pass on to end consumers. We reconsidered our options however, and decided to go with a different material combination that would give a better sounding and feeling switch for a cheaper price because it wouldn't have to support the pricing of the other Ink v2's on the market. Of course, we will most likely not go with Gateron all together, but they're still on the table with this new Honey switch. Hope that answers your question!

Shame about that, lubed and filmed v2 Inks are one of the smoothest switches I've ever used. Looking forward to a manufacturer who's up to the task.

Offline VellFlamm

  • Posts: 60
Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #8 on: Sun, 04 April 2021, 04:16:56 »
The original idea of this being Ink housing with UHMWPE stems was so much more interesting IMHO.
Ink black housing with UHMWPE stem is one of my favorite switches, and I was pretty hyped to test some new UHMWPE stems.
Even with a higher price point, it had something different from other switch ICs.

GLWIC tho.

Offline Shoe17

  • Posts: 12
Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #9 on: Sun, 04 April 2021, 11:01:24 »
The original idea of this being Ink housing with UHMWPE stems was so much more interesting IMHO.
Ink black housing with UHMWPE stem is one of my favorite switches, and I was pretty hyped to test some new UHMWPE stems.
Even with a higher price point, it had something different from other switch ICs.

GLWIC tho.

I would disagree with this sentiment. Having a housing that's already been done before, with stems that are already available, is something that's not really new or exciting. Granted I was also hyped to try some UHMWPE stems, but the fact they're deciding to use POM housing, progressive springs, new molds, and looking for a cheaper price all speaks like something that's interesting to me. They're trying to do something that actually hasn't been done before, they're not some ink recolor, or some stem swap, it's a whole new thing which is very exciting to me, but I can see where you're coming from.

To OP, I am very excited to see where how these switches progress, and I'll probably end up trying them as something new. GLWIC!

Offline jwburrows

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #10 on: Sun, 04 April 2021, 19:48:58 »
The original idea of this being Ink housing with UHMWPE stems was so much more interesting IMHO.
Ink black housing with UHMWPE stem is one of my favorite switches, and I was pretty hyped to test some new UHMWPE stems.
Even with a higher price point, it had something different from other switch ICs.

GLWIC tho.

I would disagree with this sentiment. Having a housing that's already been done before, with stems that are already available, is something that's not really new or exciting. Granted I was also hyped to try some UHMWPE stems, but the fact they're deciding to use POM housing, progressive springs, new molds, and looking for a cheaper price all speaks like something that's interesting to me. They're trying to do something that actually hasn't been done before, they're not some ink recolor, or some stem swap, it's a whole new thing which is very exciting to me, but I can see where you're coming from.

To OP, I am very excited to see where how these switches progress, and I'll probably end up trying them as something new. GLWIC!

Thanks for the feedback from both of you! It is great to hear the opinions on the changes we have made so far. I appreciate the note you made in regards to being unique as this is a very important core value of the switch. The Gateron Ink v2 housings sounded like a great idea on paper, but at the end of the day there were three main problems with it.

First, they were stupid pricey solely on the fact that they were "Ink v2" housings. If they sold them to us at a fair price based on material costs, we could have easily undercut the current 75 cent Ink pricing. Gateron needs to sell them at a high markup so that we can't do this and the vendors who carry Ink v2 switches aren't undercut.

Secondly, the Ink v2 material looks great, but doesn't perform necessarily well. While talking with some experts who know way too much about switches (and much more than we do), we realized that the material used in Ink v2 switches will create a spring ping noise that would be undesirable with a friction higher than alternative materials. To put it simply, we want to create a good value for those who put their trust in us. If we can make something at half the price without the fancy "Ink v2" name, it's still a better value even if it's not as exciting.

Third and lastly, using the Gateron Ink v2 housing with UHMWPE stems and progressive springs would be cool. Again, it sound great on paper, but at the end of the day there is so much marketing in the sentence I have just written. Marketing is important in something like and IC, but truth be told there are relatively unknown brands that can get us better quality switches at a lower price. We want to create a great value for those who support this project. This doesn't mean we won't fight for the best switch materials we can and aim for a great switch of course.

A switch recolor or selling a frankenswitch (Ink + PE stem) direct to customers isn't our goal here. We want something that's unique to our brand and aligns with our values and I believe the final product will reflect this. Hope this clears things up for anyone wondering why this decision was made. Of course, feel free to reach out if either of your have any questions!

Offline jwburrows

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #11 on: Sun, 04 April 2021, 19:53:39 »
Feel like I just saw something similar, but was listed as a dollar? Is this the same thing?

Yes, sorry for the confusion! We had originally planned on the Honey switches using an Ink v2 housing that was marked up by Gateron to an insane price which we had to basically pass on to end consumers. We reconsidered our options however, and decided to go with a different material combination that would give a better sounding and feeling switch for a cheaper price because it wouldn't have to support the pricing of the other Ink v2's on the market. Of course, we will most likely not go with Gateron all together, but they're still on the table with this new Honey switch. Hope that answers your question!

Shame about that, lubed and filmed v2 Inks are one of the smoothest switches I've ever used. Looking forward to a manufacturer who's up to the task.

Ink v2s are nice there's no doubt about it. A $1 recolored Ink v2 didn't sit right with us though, even with the Gateron PE stems coming to market. I truly think we will be able to offer a better switch at a lower price point. Of course, we will see with time.

Offline Nuap

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Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #12 on: Sun, 04 April 2021, 21:31:46 »
Are Emeralds the switches that were supposed to have PME housings? What happened with them, I was always curious.

The proxy vendors pulled out because of some allegations about poor behaviour by the GB runner.

Offline maceofspades

  • Posts: 5
Re: [IC] KeyBee Honey Switches | Heavy, Progressive, Linears
« Reply #13 on: Mon, 12 April 2021, 09:42:37 »
Not sure if this was mentioned somewhere but it would be great if these were sold in packs of 10s. Not sure if that has been decided yet or if the 70,90,110 packs is something that the vendors enforce but having to buy 70 switches as an exclusively 40% user drives me away from a lot of switch options.