Spray Lubing Box Blue Switches

[Hipyo]

Hello everyone!
I got a really cheap mechanical keyboard for a friend with BSUN blues that had horrific spring ping and felt really scratchy, being lazy as hell I wanted to spray lube them to save the time of taking them apart. I haven't really seen much about spray lubing blues as people have said in the past it ruins tactility and can muffle the click. In my experience with BSUN box blues a little spray lube just made them sound and feel much better without removing any of the tactility and click. I'm really curious if anyone else has tried this before and with what results. I made a video of the process of trying to make the budget board sound alright. It's a hot-swap board so I totally could have just brush lubed the switches but I wanted to try something really low effort to see if this could work for some of the newcomers who want a mech board but not the price tag.

[treeleaf64]

If it has horrific spring ping, what is the point of Spray lubing if you cannot lube the springs 

[Hipyo]

Spray lubing seemed to take care of it actually, cant hear it anymore on the lubed switches but can hear it on the ones I left unlubed

[Leslieann]

Spray lube is meant to be used in places where you can use it to flush out contaminants and coat with lube. There's no way to flush out contaminants in a switch without taking it apart.

This is asking for trouble and will likely to not age well.

[parablol]

Spray lube is meant to be used in places where you can use it to flush out contaminants and coat with lube. There's no way to flush out contaminants in a switch without taking it apart.

This is asking for trouble and will likely to not age well.

At least with Kailh Box switches, they are that special case, since they have a hole in the bottom that's designed for drainage of liquid. I suppose that is factored into the IP65 certification.

[Leslieann]

No.
Not all box switches have the hole, that was changed between revisions.

More importantly, that hole is a tube that goes clear up into the stem, it is not a drain hole, it's a vent. You will NEVER be able to get all the fluid out through it, nor can you completely flush the switch without filling it (due to the internals) even if you could use it as a drain.

[jamster]

Run that board for six months at least before putting up a YouTube video. To see if it introduces longer term problems. Doing otherwise is just irresponsible.

Someone posted just a couple weeks back that he had pretty much wrecked all his switches because he followed some 'how to lube your board easy'  instructional video on YouTube. By the sounds of it, the board is now practically unusable without a full switch replacement.

Here's the thread: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=107654.0

2 month old board, pretty much a write off.

[Leslieann]

Run that board for six months at least before putting up a YouTube video. To see if it introduces longer term problems. Doing otherwise is just irresponsible.

Someone posted just a couple weeks back that he had pretty much wrecked all his switches because he followed some 'how to lube your board easy'  instructional video on YouTube. By the sounds of it, the board is now practically unusable without a full switch replacement.

I suspect it can be saved but it's going to still require desoldering or finding someone with an ultrasonic cleaner capable of holding a keyboard. For the latter, there's no guarantee it will work better or feel good and could cost most of a new keyboard so I'm not sure it's worth even trying.

[jamster]

Run that board for six months at least before putting up a YouTube video. To see if it introduces longer term problems. Doing otherwise is just irresponsible.

Someone posted just a couple weeks back that he had pretty much wrecked all his switches because he followed some 'how to lube your board easy'  instructional video on YouTube. By the sounds of it, the board is now practically unusable without a full switch replacement.

I suspect it can be saved but it's going to still require desoldering or finding someone with an ultrasonic cleaner capable of holding a keyboard. For the latter, there's no guarantee it will work better or feel good and could cost most of a new keyboard so I'm not sure it's worth even trying.

Salvageable, but when it comes to hours of manual desoldering work or buying a dedicated tool for more than the cost of the board, really not worth it imo. Ultrasonic cleaner seems iffy too, the crud was embedded into the switches, just removing the lube wasn't going to fix the fundamental problem.

That was a sad thread. Really highlighted the need to do a bit of research rather than trusting Youtube tutorials.

[Leslieann]

Salvageable, but when it comes to hours of manual desoldering work or buying a dedicated tool for more than the cost of the board, really not worth it imo. Ultrasonic cleaner seems iffy too, the crud was embedded into the switches, just removing the lube wasn't going to fix the fundamental problem.

That was a sad thread. Really highlighted the need to do a bit of research rather than trusting Youtube tutorials.

Ultrasonics do some amazing things, I know it works well with Alps (only way to do some of them), but yeah, it's just not worth the trouble.

On the other hand, it's now a good board for learning to desolder and solder. Can't mess it up any more (unlike that DZ60, ouch).

[Hipyo]

You guys bring up some very good points, and I will for sure revisit the board in the future to make sure everything is still totally working. I mention people should check out :3ildcats video tutorials on it as I feel he does a better job of explaining how someone can mess up the process. From how I understand it, with the spray lube used in the video, the solvent fully evaporates and leaves a thin coating of grease across the switch. Spray lubing is not the most new technique and from my research before doing the video a lot of enthusiasts in Korea have been spray lubing cheap boards and as long as people do it the right way there do not seem to be any long term issues with it. 

(see the timestamp at 3:46 for some examples of korea's forums talking about it) I do think it would be good for more people to chime in with their experiences with spray lubing if they have tried it.

[Leslieann]

Spray lubing is not the most new technique and from my research before doing the video a lot of enthusiasts in Korea have been spray lubing cheap boards and as long as people do it the right way there do not seem to be any long term issues with it.

People on the internet are FAST to jump on a fad, especially if it's cheap and easy, but like Instagram, no one shows the down sides.

People online are fast to think they themselves did something wrong because obviously it worked for all these other people otherwise they wouldn't be praising the idea or promoting it. People don't like to admit they did something wrong or look stupid or somehow failed for reasons they don't understand. This leads to lost of posts by people it did work well for for, but little to none saying it didn't. If they do post about it the response is often "well it worked for me, you obviously did something wrong" or "you didn't do it the right way" (sound familiar?).

You get skewed results.

We have a pretty big issue with it here as well, people here never really like to admit that their shiny aluminum keyboard isn't as great as they portray. They aren't going to tell you they thought they over paid or wished they had bought X instead of Y. They have to justify those choices because they spent a lot on it. Your $20 keycaps can't possibly feel as good as my $180 set! Your $200 keyboard can't be as nice as my $100 keyboard, etc... I couldn't possibly have screwed up my switches by pushing a ton of garbage into my switches like someone online did, it worked for them!

In case you forgot, there is video of people eating Tide Pods.
Don't trust the internet.



And by the way, what is the "right way".
Sure you aim the nozzle, but you're probably sending twice the volume of the switch itself into it at high speed. It's a it's a confined space, do you honestly think that stuff is only hitting the surface you aimed it at? It's going to go in and swirl all around inside (which by the way is exactly what you do with a proper switch lubricant). I'm not sure there's really so much a right way as much as luck of the draw. You have no idea what all that is coating, you have no idea what contaminants were washed off the slider and you have no idea how compatible any of this (especially the solvent) is with the lube already inside the switch. That solvent could end up hardening the factory lube.

[jamster]

You guys bring up some very good points, and I will for sure revisit the board in the future to make sure everything is still totally working. I mention people should check out :3ildcats video tutorials on it as I feel he does a better job of explaining how someone can mess up the process. From how I understand it, with the spray lube used in the video, the solvent fully evaporates and leaves a thin coating of grease across the switch. Spray lubing is not the most new technique and from my research before doing the video a lot of enthusiasts in Korea have been spray lubing cheap boards and as long as people do it the right way there do not seem to be any long term issues with it. 

(see the timestamp at 3:46 for some examples of korea's forums talking about it) I do think it would be good for more people to chime in with their experiences with spray lubing if they have tried it.

Yes, I am sure that I also speak on behalf of others when I say that we know that spray lubricants consist of a solvent and the actual lubricant. I have been using this stuff for literally decades.

A solvent doesn't magically make it infallible. You're still doing an uncontrolled blast of liquid into a switch, the stuff goes everywhere.

Did you actually read the link that I posted where someone wrecked his new board? And that was just using an external brush, which is a much more controlled method of application than a spray can.

[ddrfraser1]

Spray lube is meant to be used in places where you can use it to flush out contaminants and coat with lube. There's no way to flush out contaminants in a switch without taking it apart.

Question, for switches that are near impossible to open do you think spray lube is a good solution? I've got some Monterey switches that are fairly dirty and from what I can tell, they are a pain in the ass and then some to open and get back together. If not, do you have any other recommendations? Thanks.

We have a pretty big issue with it here as well, people here never really like to admit that their shiny aluminum keyboard isn't as great as they portray. They aren't going to tell you they thought they over paid or wished they had bought X instead of Y. They have to justify those choices because they spent a lot on it. Your $20 keycaps can't possibly feel as good as my $180 set! Your $200 keyboard can't be as nice as my $100 keyboard, etc... I couldn't possibly have screwed up my switches by pushing a ton of garbage into my switches like someone online did, it worked for them!

Agree. Over on keebtalk we've got a 'Flawed but lovable boards' thread for just this. We talk about builds that didn't go as we hoped and what we hope to try next in order to fix it. It's a great place to learn and builds camaraderie. There may be a similar thread here.

[Leslieann]

Question, for switches that are near impossible to open do you think spray lube is a good solution? I've got some Monterey switches that are fairly dirty and from what I can tell, they are a pain in the ass and then some to open and get back together. If not, do you have any other recommendations? Thanks.

Let me put this in easy to understand terms.   NEVER spray lube into a switch.
Now there is something you can try, and that is electronics contact cleaner like Deoxit D5. However, there's still no guarantee. Also that stuff contains a rather nasty chemical (Xylene), use in a well vented area and wear gloves and probably eye protection.

My understanding the best way to deal with Montereys is ultrasonic cleaning.
One of these days I want to get back to mine and see if I can come up with a way to open and re-assemble them. I'm sure there's a way, it just take some creative thinking and possible some special tools but there has to be a way.

Agree. Over on keebtalk we've got a 'Flawed but lovable boards' thread for just this. We talk about builds that didn't go as we hoped and what we hope to try next in order to fix it. It's a great place to learn and builds camaraderie. There may be a similar thread here.

I'm sure this will ruffle some feathers but I just can't take anyone using "keeb" serious, sorry.
I all I can think of when I hear it is Keebler Elves.

I don't thin we have a thread like that here, but it's probably not a bad idea, at the moment I think a discussion regarding gasket mount is more pressing.