RAMA Solderable vs Hot-swap

[KRMing]

Hi,

I recently bought a RAMA keyboard which is still under production. It is possible to change my PCB configurations, so I have a question regarding it.
I'm aware that the RAMA pcb dies very easily due to various reasons. So, would a hot-swappable one be a better option?
RAMA offers free replacement for the dead PCB, but if it's a solderable PCB that has died, you have to desolder each and every switch and solder them back onto the new PCB.
This seems like a tedious task, also having a possibility of damaging the switches if encountering repeated runs.
However, the sound and feel of a solderable PCB is better, so I really can't decide.
Can you guys give me some advice? Thanks.

[treeleaf64]

Solder always if possible. If you have a solder sucker it takes like 60 min max to desolder keyboard. If you have desoldering gun, even faster.

Solder definitely worth it

[udller]

buy one of each pcb. that way you have a back up.

[shansoft]

Solder always if possible. If you have a solder sucker it takes like 60 min max to desolder keyboard. If you have desoldering gun, even faster.

Solder definitely worth it

I went from full solder to mill-max everything.... desoldering have a decent chance to destroy the pad, especially with the sucker.

If there is a hotswap, personally that is a more preferable option..... From pop wire fixing to selling the board with buyer's intent.

I see almost no benefit with soldering unless it's half plate or PCB mount.

[Leslieann]

Mill-Max do not fit every board.

If you rip a Kailh (the most common hot swap) off the PCB it's often more difficult (and catastrophic) to fix than a soldered pcb and from what I've seen, pretty easy to do as they are bottom mount. From an engineering perspective it's actually a terrible design.

[greedy3290]

desoldering gun ?

[Leslieann]

desoldering gun ?

Awesome, but not cheap, at least decent ones.

[shansoft]

Mill-Max do not fit every board.

If you rip a Kailh (the most common hot swap) off the PCB it's often more difficult (and catastrophic) to fix than a soldered pcb and from what I've seen, pretty easy to do as they are bottom mount. From an engineering perspective it's actually a terrible design.

To be fair, I built over like 20+ PCB with Mill-Max, none of them have issue of fitting using 7305.....
Also, for Kailh hotswap socket, just press down switch on a flat table, it won't fall out regardless how you push down....

[treeleaf64]

wow, I might look into 7305 then, it sounds good !

[Leslieann]

To be fair, I built over like 20+ PCB with Mill-Max, none of them have issue of fitting using 7305.....
Also, for Kailh hotswap socket, just press down switch on a flat table, it won't fall out regardless how you push down....

There's a chart listing some boards they do not  fit, I can't locate it at the moment but it's out there. They are also quite a bit more expensive then the Kailh (hence companies not using them) and they're a bit delicate to install.

As per Splitkb.com
"The sockets won't fit Kailh Choc Low Profile switches, Kailh Pro Switches, and on other switches where one leg of the switch is wider than the other leg. "


That said, I do agree, they are better than the Kailh sockets. I'm just not sure I want them on a high end board as it's still another failure point.


As for Kailh.
It's not an issue of falling out. If the pins on the switch are slightly off they press on the hot swap housing and have been Known trip the pads off the pcb. They are SMD mounted from underneath. When this happens it rips off the pad and part of the trace with it. They also stretch and have inconsistent contact.

[walie]

I'm aware that the RAMA pcb dies very easily due to various reasons.

They do?

[hvontres]

To be fair, I built over like 20+ PCB with Mill-Max, none of them have issue of fitting using 7305.....
Also, for Kailh hotswap socket, just press down switch on a flat table, it won't fall out regardless how you push down....

There's a chart listing some boards they do not  fit, I can't locate it at the moment but it's out there. They are also quite a bit more expensive then the Kailh (hence companies not using them) and they're a bit delicate to install.

As per Splitkb.com
"The sockets won't fit Kailh Choc Low Profile switches, Kailh Pro Switches, and on other switches where one leg of the switch is wider than the other leg. "


That said, I do agree, they are better than the Kailh sockets. I'm just not sure I want them on a high end board as it's still another failure point.


As for Kailh.
It's not an issue of falling out. If the pins on the switch are slightly off they press on the hot swap housing and have been Known trip the pads off the pcb. They are SMD mounted from underneath. When this happens it rips off the pad and part of the trace with it. They also stretch and have inconsistent contact.

probably a small dab of 5-minute epoxy on the Kalih sockets will help with that problem. I'll report back once I build up my Jampad boards, which will happen when my Kalih sockets finally get here....

[Leslieann]

probably a small dab of 5-minute epoxy on the Kalih sockets will help with that problem. I'll report back once I build up my Jampad boards, which will happen when my Kalih sockets finally get here....

Not a bad idea except what do you do when the socket goes bad (100 insert avg. lifespan).

I'm not against hot swap, just that if your keyboard is a long term investment, solder it.

[mrvco]

buy one of each pcb. that way you have a back up.

Or one of each PCB, take your time and figure out your preferred setup using the hot-swap board and when ready, solder away!

[tp4tissue]

Soldered is for grown-ups Only.. Rated R.

[shansoft]

probably a small dab of 5-minute epoxy on the Kalih sockets will help with that problem. I'll report back once I build up my Jampad boards, which will happen when my Kalih sockets finally get here....

Not a bad idea except what do you do when the socket goes bad (100 insert avg. lifespan).

I'm not against hot swap, just that if your keyboard is a long term investment, solder it.

I would be surprise if solder pad can even survive that desoldering attempts without burning or lift the pad... Kalih socket is still outpacing solder in term of usage.

For long term investment, neither is better.... buying multiple PCB is a better investment.

Soldered is for grown-ups Only.. Rated R.

Solder mill-max into it.... Rated X.
Bulletproof with maximum potential.

[Leslieann]

I would be surprise if solder pad can even survive that desoldering attempts without burning or lift the pad...

I can see it being an issue if you have a garbage PCB and crappy iron (or damaged pcb), but a decent pcb and iron should allow many replacements without that problem. If not it's PEBKAC.

Kalih socket is still outpacing solder in term of usage.

You don't say.

For long term investment, neither is better.... buying multiple PCB is a better investment.

That's not always an option.