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geekhack Marketplace => Interest Checks => Topic started by: dimsum on Tue, 15 March 2022, 08:41:57

Title: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: dimsum on Tue, 15 March 2022, 08:41:57
Hi yall!
Very excited to show you something I have been working on for over a year now:



(https://i.imgur.com/FXvdQ57.jpeg)



PAL
Your friendly neighborhood 60% ft. an exploded arrow key cluster


IC Form (https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSe3Tt7RmwS6pqqZ6DlfnX5O90OUKkq3-EhPFjhVh4oPIslCGg/viewform?usp=sf_link)
Discord (https://discord.gg/dNvkkmgY2E) <<< This is where the good updates are; if you feel like following this project - come and hang out.
Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/bananastand.works)




{Sry, long intro}
More
I have spent the entirety of the year 2021 using various renditions of this layout as my daily drivers - starting with a handwired PLA print and moving onto a nicer SLA-printed case with a functioning PCB proto.

This has been one of the personal projects that I completely fell in love with, as it decisively solved the 60% arrow key contention for me. Now I am hoping that a few more people out there will find it helpful too.

From now on, the goal is to release a robust entry-level package and begin the popularization of the PAL layout.

A lot of time has been spent in pursuit of simplifying and optimizing the assembly, which is why Geon’s tadpole mount came in extra clutch. Released right around the time I was experimenting with mounting styles for my own boards, it ticks the most important boxes for me: closely resembles a top-mount in its feel, while eliminating screws and hence minimizing complexity of the assembly.

I’ve been very fortunate to make some great new friends in this hobby and their feedback and encouragement has been extremely helpful on my journey here. And hence I am really happy to say that the good folks at Protozoa Studio have become an invaluable acquaintance, offering their help to run & QC this project.

Together we aim to put out a clean, relatively simple package at a very reasonable price while utilizing Protozoa’s awesome manufacturing network to ensure the best quality.



Specs

This is where we sit currently:

-6063 alu
-tadpole mount
-6° typing angle
-front face height ≈17.5mm (w/o feet), 18.8mm (with feet)
-effective keyboard height (EKH) ≈ 21.5mm
-FR4 Plate
-about 1kg fully built

-solderable pcb by Yiancar
-hotswap pcb layout TBA

-no weights
-no daughterboard
-no foam (might cave in on this one due to apparent demand)

-colors TBA (tentatively - silver, black, volcanic green)

-target price - under US$300 (how much under is TBD)
-vendor, manu, qc - Protozoa Studio

-regional vendors TBA
-timeline TBA



Layouts

(https://i.imgur.com/KmNXIvB.png)



Renders

(https://i.imgur.com/l0GK1V5.jpeg)(https://i.imgur.com/OX0qHxV.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/q7E5HED.jpg)(https://i.imgur.com/DXWhVcK.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/9lhXyl2.jpeg)(https://i.imgur.com/IvVeQIx.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/L07rZ5X.jpeg)(https://i.imgur.com/IEzwQG3.jpeg)



Special Thanks

-Ecto & Protozoa team for making this happen
-Geon for the tadpole mount (bless)
-Ramon Imbao (RMI-KB) for the help with the early proto PCBs
-my homie YZ (Hex Keyboards) for all the positive encouragement
-MechMerlin for all of the youtube tutorials on qmk/via  (absolute mvp)
-Simon for treating Ron the way he deserves to be treated.
-rest of the community for a good ride <3



Signature code in case you would like to support the project:
Code: [Select]
[url=https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=116569.0][img]https://i.imgur.com/TQNNgvz.jpeg[/img][/url]
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: dimsum on Tue, 15 March 2022, 08:42:52
UPD (May 18, 2022):

Prototype #1 arrived a couple weeks ago:

(https://i.imgur.com/wrgvfb5.jpeg)(https://i.imgur.com/s50Rl4m.jpeg)
(https://i.imgur.com/1tCnd78.jpeg)(https://i.imgur.com/oWdpvaC.jpeg)



A local builder fatboychard (https://www.twitch.tv/fatboychard) did a build stream, sound test clip here (https://www.twitch.tv/fatboychard/clip/CaringSpotlessSangBrainSlug-1Y2EFSQb9bMzMUpL)

So far the board is really fun to type on, quite happy with the height & angle.
Going to implement some design improvements and order a prototype #2 shortly.

More updates will be posted on Discord (https://discord.gg/dNvkkmgY2E), come hang out.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Biscuit on Tue, 15 March 2022, 08:58:51
GLWIC. There were quite a bit of people who are interested in seeing exploded arrows on a 60, but didn't agree with removing the right shift.
So this is a great option for those people.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: unwashed_heathen on Tue, 15 March 2022, 09:26:48
In love with this layout. 60% boards have never been for me, but PAL has me sold. Will be keeping an eye on this for sure! Although I would like to see some more interesting color options.

With this board coming from the Banana Stand I'm going to need to see a banana colored PAL :D.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: stotle.caps on Tue, 15 March 2022, 09:40:23
GLWIC, pretty interesting layout, rlly like the simple design and the price i rlly like it
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: noctoornal on Tue, 15 March 2022, 09:45:38
really loving the layout, so unique and having an exploded arrow keys on a 60% is a definitely buy for me
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: linell on Tue, 15 March 2022, 09:53:14
I hate 64 key but this is cool :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Zyrophr on Tue, 15 March 2022, 10:09:58
Really like the design, looks nice to me. Too bad I'm a right-shift user.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: m1gs on Tue, 15 March 2022, 11:09:48
count me in!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Croktopus on Tue, 15 March 2022, 11:45:17
Hey this layout is actually nice
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: SxM Designs on Tue, 15 March 2022, 12:24:35
Great job. I really like this layout more than the recently IC'd ones. This has really grabbed my attention.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: kbye on Tue, 15 March 2022, 14:22:32
I like this
led indicator and the raised booty are a nice touch
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: paperassgasket on Tue, 15 March 2022, 14:24:31
I love those chamfers.
Overall design is really nice. Typing angle is very preferable. I'm not a fan of exposed screw holes, but I'm not offended here. Would prefer not to see them but it's not a dealbreaker.
I actually kinda like that seam too.

Only issue I could see is the plate potentially smacking the underside of the arrows since it's tadpole mount.

Full disclosure: I abhor having the shift all the way out past arrows, and I also hate arrows, prefer split shift or at least 7u and I'm STILL interested in this if that tells you anything about how aesthetically pleasing it is.

That indicator is kyoot af.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Ustinj on Tue, 15 March 2022, 15:28:27
I like the beveled front face of the top case, GLWIC
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: chris_ on Tue, 15 March 2022, 15:32:24
this looks really clean, nice work!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: JJ48_24 on Tue, 15 March 2022, 15:43:43
Damn renders look great and the design is super clean. Definitely a board I will be following. GLWIC!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Takkun on Tue, 15 March 2022, 16:51:46
Wow this is a really interesting concept! I love how the arrow keys are weaved in there in the most unintrusive way. This might actually be the first 60% that I can actually see myself using.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: JQ27 on Tue, 15 March 2022, 17:10:51
I like it. As an ISO user I'd need to find two 1.25u shifts, but on the flipside I never use right shift, so I guess it's a bonus Ctrl or the FN key for me.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: potato_panda- on Wed, 16 March 2022, 00:24:56
GLWIC. Looks very interesting, would you consider adding split spacebar support?
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Treasure on Wed, 16 March 2022, 10:36:33
Love the layout  :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: djmantis on Wed, 16 March 2022, 12:48:56
This looks great! Can you provide the actual height of the front? You stated it is low, but I would like to know that actual measurement. Thank you!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: conternecticus on Wed, 16 March 2022, 13:10:25
This layout looks great! Would love to see more one more color option (maybe purple/lilac would be cool).
Can't wait for the sound test of this board. GLWIC!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: dimsum on Wed, 16 March 2022, 13:57:23
This looks great! Can you provide the actual height of the front? You stated it is low, but I would like to know that actual measurement. Thank you!

Thanks!
Here are the current dimensions:
(https://i.imgur.com/g30qaSi.png)

edit: adding the measurements into the spec list
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: djmantis on Wed, 16 March 2022, 15:02:01
Beautiful! Thank you!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Ghostinn on Wed, 16 March 2022, 19:28:21
I am not a fan of 60s, but I would absolutely consider buying this beauty. Great job on this!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: TranquilMarmot on Thu, 17 March 2022, 01:29:06
Love it. Tiny lil right shift and the light are awesome. The green looks really nice!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: QWER|key on Thu, 17 March 2022, 03:30:13
I really love this design but that lack of right shift will kill me.   :(

Good look with the IC
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Malvix Studio on Thu, 17 March 2022, 03:55:36
Layout is definitely unconventional, but cool nonetheless! Sometimes I feel like I'm one of the few who actively swaps between left and right shift, haha. Bezel proportions look spot on though, great job!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Getsome!!! on Thu, 17 March 2022, 05:47:55
Dope layout! I would of coarse replace that useless R-shift with a FN key or something if i were doing a build on it, but dope none the less. I have to pass becasue the bezels are way too small for me though. I'm sure the more dainty folks will love it though.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: m1gs on Fri, 18 March 2022, 05:46:46
What is the led on the lower right for? Is that a capslock indicator?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: dimsum on Fri, 18 March 2022, 10:54:36
What is the led on the lower right for? Is that a capslock indicator?

just an ambient RGB bar, not indicating anything in particular; think of it as a badge.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: conternecticus on Fri, 18 March 2022, 21:18:10
Would half plate work on this board?
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Vibex on Sat, 19 March 2022, 06:30:12
Any chance of getting some split spacebar support? Would be an instant buy for me if it did
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: dimsum on Sun, 20 March 2022, 04:30:58
Would half plate work on this board?
I dont see why not.
I have no plans of making one, but I will release the plate files in case anyone wants to make/run their own.


Any chance of getting some split spacebar support? Would be an instant buy for me if it did
A few people asked for this feature, I will think about it.
Even if the final pcb had the support for it - im against making the default universal plate look like a cheese grater. Might also look into options of open sourcing the pcb files for people who want to add their own split-sb support or more obscure layouts (minila/jis, 6u, 7u, knobs etc etc).
Again, if there is enough people that really want it - perhaps it can be run as a separate small gb.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Keeblet_257 on Sun, 20 March 2022, 04:47:58
the leds in the bottom right corner adds aomething to it I like it personally :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: HappyB0T on Sun, 20 March 2022, 06:01:30
I like the disco light.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: SafeAtShore on Sun, 20 March 2022, 15:41:17
Agreed with others that this just looks aesthetically pleasing. Nice.

Also want to point out that folks can just use mod tap in QMK (assuming this PCB supports it) to combine forward slash/question mark with R Shift. IMO, it's comfy and works--and that far right key can be used as Fn like on a typical HHKB layout.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: VaporKeebs on Sun, 20 March 2022, 18:43:49
I will be getting this no matter what. Oh my god.

I will likely get a hotswap version but honestly I want to at some point get a solder mk and ship it out to taeha just so I can have a taeha build. But told myself it would have to be a soldered mk so maybe itll be this.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: rndr on Mon, 21 March 2022, 05:43:04
Right shift is a must for me. Passing this one!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Lincolnworks on Mon, 21 March 2022, 07:09:02
The layout seems cool and unique, but honestly not for me. I'd prefer a 65% much more. ;D
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: ReverbSlush on Mon, 21 March 2022, 11:06:13
I hope hotswap layout is split backspace (or has both compatible).  Beautiful looking board!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: JackPikatea on Mon, 21 March 2022, 15:40:30
It's always a blast to see new layout. As a 60% fan, I can definitely see myself liking the layout. I typically use this layout except it's with layers and and a function key. I think a lot of others do too.

Nice work!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: spedywin on Mon, 21 March 2022, 22:45:31
interesting, glwic
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: nqbshas on Tue, 22 March 2022, 02:51:24
Fresh and clean design. Good luck!

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk

Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: m1gs on Wed, 23 March 2022, 19:53:07
What is the led on the lower right for? Is that a capslock indicator?

just an ambient RGB bar, not indicating anything in particular; think of it as a badge.

Oh okay. Bummer. I really love keyboard size like this one, but I kept wishing a capslock indicator would be a feature cause it's a struggle for me.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Thockologist on Thu, 24 March 2022, 09:34:25
This has to be my new favorite compact layout, I'm really, really excited for this. It looks great and still has the beloved arrow keys at 60% size.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: conternecticus on Fri, 25 March 2022, 11:35:24
Would be cool if the LED bar can be programmed to show current layer, or caps lock is on or off.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: ylothar on Fri, 25 March 2022, 15:48:35
Would be cool if the LED bar can be programmed to show current layer, or caps lock is on or off.

+1 :thumb:
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: ShuggaShane on Fri, 25 March 2022, 16:57:32
Take my money now please and thank you
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: TQuest on Sat, 26 March 2022, 17:11:16
Filled out the IC Form. GLWIC
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Neely_12 on Mon, 28 March 2022, 14:18:04
Please offer more plates. Alu, PC, PP. Any of those
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: conternecticus on Tue, 05 April 2022, 03:05:58
Please offer more plates. Alu, PC, PP. Any of those

Plate file made available after fulfillment is good enough I guess...
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: uwumi on Wed, 06 April 2022, 03:58:17
i really like the look of this case! glwic :D
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: aerosoul on Wed, 06 April 2022, 15:38:18
Been wanting something like this for YEARS til the other day I finally decided to ask (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=116786.0). A good Samaritan pointed me to your thread. What a beautiful thing! Make it happen, pretty please!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: granola bar enthusiast on Wed, 06 April 2022, 16:11:58
don't think i will be able to join the gb but i really love the layout, wonder how 7u spacebar would change out the layout
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works - Proto sound test
Post by: conternecticus on Mon, 09 May 2022, 09:41:14
Here is a build stream of the first prototype: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1478238289

I think the board looks great, hoping to see more exciting case color options.

Soundtest (with 30A tadpoles): https://clips.twitch.tv/CaringSpotlessSangBrainSlug-1Y2EFSQb9bMzMUpL
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works - Proto sound test
Post by: dimsum on Wed, 18 May 2022, 09:49:46
Here is a build stream of the first prototype: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1478238289

I think the board looks great, hoping to see more exciting case color options.

Soundtest (with 30A tadpoles): https://clips.twitch.tv/CaringSpotlessSangBrainSlug-1Y2EFSQb9bMzMUpL

Thank you for clipping that, im putting the link into the UPD post (https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=116569.msg3115503#msg3115503).
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Tsenohebot on Sun, 26 June 2022, 16:23:47
Just wanted to say I love this so muchhh! I'd def buy more than one,, when this comes to GB!!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Akele on Sun, 26 June 2022, 18:50:03
I don't normally have any interest in 60% boards, but this one is very cute. Who needs dedicated page up and page down keys anyway!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Luna on Wed, 06 July 2022, 22:29:12
Subbed.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: phinix on Thu, 07 July 2022, 03:19:05
Nice! This is how ANSI HHKB should be done! :D
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Jho on Fri, 08 July 2022, 18:54:57
Ya know, I already have a 60% I'm pretty dang happy with, but I can't help but be interested in this.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Homiezoned on Sun, 17 July 2022, 23:52:18
The layout is cool, love the design. Never enough 60s :D
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Luna on Mon, 18 July 2022, 00:00:25
Yep, love the layout, I hope this one makes it to GB.
I like the silver and green.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Iciycle on Sat, 23 July 2022, 12:54:25
 I like this.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Luna on Sat, 23 July 2022, 12:55:42
Yep, if this goes up I’ll get me one.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: phinix on Mon, 25 July 2022, 03:02:10
Would it possible to add small "indents" on the sides, so it would be easier to grab it?
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: ReverbSlush on Mon, 25 July 2022, 06:12:20
I hope hotswap layout is split backspace (or has both compatible).  Beautiful looking board!

Looks like the hotswap layout from the discord has this! if that's correct then I'm IN. 

Side note: I wish more hotswap boards did this, even if a switch has to be oriented upsidedown or something to accommodate.  For example - the ikki68 seems to cover all sorts of different layouts while still being hotswap.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: infinitum on Mon, 25 July 2022, 13:05:26
looks amazing, love that you kept right shift. really hoping the led can be used as an indicator light for like caps.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Rilow on Wed, 10 August 2022, 05:50:26
I'm all for it
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Luna on Tue, 16 August 2022, 08:59:06
Actually, strong vote for the green!  :)
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Rilow on Mon, 12 September 2022, 13:22:14
Any news on this?
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: irithyll on Mon, 12 September 2022, 15:47:36
Any news on this?

2nd prototype photos were posted on the discord a few weeks ago. The third proto has been ordered and the pcb is being improved.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Mad_Rhetoric on Fri, 24 March 2023, 12:44:35
Is she dead Jim?
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: chancellorr on Sat, 07 October 2023, 21:04:16
I got to try this board at a meetup today and I have to say I absolutely love it. Hoping this will be able to move forward.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: stomaha on Sun, 08 October 2023, 14:21:53
if bg, i buy
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: SirYeetWilliams on Mon, 09 October 2023, 13:33:16
w e    l i k e     o u r     p a l
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Thumb Key on Mon, 09 October 2023, 21:56:21
This layout looks great! I like 60 with the exploded arrows and don't want to removing the right shift.
nice work! GLWIC!
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: HappyB0T on Tue, 17 October 2023, 00:34:40
got to check this board out in person. It is stunning. Quality of the finish was hands down one of the best I have seen.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: Rilow on Sun, 19 November 2023, 12:14:44
Is this dead?
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: lecorsair on Mon, 20 November 2023, 10:48:55
Is this dead?

No. According to their discord, they received their latest prototype and in process of being photographed(a few weeks ago).
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: takuto on Tue, 21 November 2023, 10:32:05
Is this dead?

Not dead. According to the latest Discord discussion, we're waiting on new proto photos and pricing, hopefully soon.
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: PrizeOcelot5911 on Fri, 24 November 2023, 04:08:13
Really like the layout of this keyboard. :cool:
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: reeeyouuuuu on Fri, 16 February 2024, 08:00:07
need a pal, have no pal...
Title: Re: [IC] PAL by Banana Stand Works
Post by: geec on Mon, 19 February 2024, 09:03:14
I'm in! GLWIC :thumb: