Looking for a PCB + Case I can't find

[EZG]

Hey guys,

I've been looking for a while and I can't find what I want so I'm wondering if it even exists or if I'm gonna have to go full custom route. That's why I come here to try to get a confirmation first.
What I'm looking for:

- Less than TKL layout variation but with F-keys
- Per key RGB (or per key white light if no RGB)
- "Caseless design" (I mean the design where it looks like the keys are on a plate, not the typical design where keys are going into a case, I don't know if there's a word for it)
- ISO Compatible

Thanks have a good day

[yui]

yes it does exist, look at the GMMK pro, or similar 75% layout boards, they are not as common as 60% but should not be impossible to find, and i think what you want by your "caseless design" is floating caps, the gmmk is not quite that but it was the only board i could think of the top of my head, this page lists a few options, although my internet connection is rather slow at the moment so doing more research is rather painful (took 6 minutes to load the page, and only half the photos actually loaded)

[EZG]

yes it does exist, look at the GMMK pro, or similar 75% layout boards, they are not as common as 60% but should not be impossible to find, and i think what you want by your "caseless design" is floating caps, the gmmk is not quite that but it was the only board i could think of the top of my head, this page lists a few options, although my internet connection is rather slow at the moment so doing more research is rather painful (took 6 minutes to load the page, and only half the photos actually loaded)

I've seen the GMMK Pro but it doesn't offer the "floating caps" design which is sad.
It seems like my best option is just getting something like the GMMK Pro PCB and building my own case and plate but it's going to be a pain.

[yui]

sorry i failed to post the link https://switchandclick.com/75-mechanical-keyboards/

[EZG]

sorry i failed to post the link https://switchandclick.com/75-mechanical-keyboards/

Thanks, useful link. Sadly none of them have all I'm looking for.
The only thing I can change is dropping per key RGB to have per key white light. In the case the MagicForce looks good. I'm going to see it's it's compatible with an ISO layout, something I forgot to mention in my original post I'm going to try to edit.

[Leopard223]

You might want to look into Chines vendors on AliExpress, while I havn't searched for your specific specs, I have seen quite a bit of floating switches type of keyboards, you might find something interested there.

[EZG]

You might want to look into Chines vendors on AliExpress, while I havn't searched for your specific specs, I have seen quite a bit of floating switches type of keyboards, you might find something interested there.

Thanks for the tip I'm going to look on AliExpress. But I want to build "the" keyboard, the one I'll keep more or less forever and repair if needed. I hope there are solid quality keyboards there.

EDIT: How hard would it be to get a "mainstream" PCB I like, and build my own case with the floating design ? I guess I can order custom cut aluminum pieces but I'm not sure about the design. I ahve to watch videos of teardowns to learn and get ideas

[EZG]

The GMMK Pro offer the exact layout I want. But no floating key design so I'll have to built my own case and plate.
Do you guys know if there is a way to buy the PCB only ? I'm just finding full kits which is sad.
Plus, since I want the ISO version, I'll have to make custom keycaps for one of the 2 caps key, pretty sure there is no place where I can order custom PBT doubleshot keycaps right ? I already have a full PBT doubleshot set somewhere so I'd like the few custom keys I'll have to buy to match the others keys

[Leopard223]

The GMMK Pro offer the exact layout I want. But no floating key design so I'll have to built my own case and plate.
Do you guys know if there is a way to buy the PCB only ? I'm just finding full kits which is sad.
Plus, since I want the ISO version, I'll have to make custom keycaps for one of the 2 caps key, pretty sure there is no place where I can order custom PBT doubleshot keycaps right ? I already have a full PBT doubleshot set somewhere so I'd like the few custom keys I'll have to buy to match the others keys

If they don’t have already to sale, you’d have to contact Glorious to see if they offer PCBs to sale, but don’t expect them to be available soon. 
Alternatively you could design your own but from the little I’ve seen it’s a tremendous amount of learning and work (and mistakes are costly). 
If you don’t mind using TKL the regular GMMK offers a floating design and I’m pretty sure they have ISO layout.

Alternatively the ID80 have a similar layout to the GMMK (minus the rotary wheel), you can try making a case around it as the ID80 have a high profile case. 
Making your own case shouldn’t be hard if you’re familiar with CAD, especially when it’s a floating switches design, you just have to make sure you’re familiar with the PCBs dimensions and the MX dimensions, mistakes with creating a metal case will be VERY costly. 

I’m not familiar with making custom keycaps, you’re far better off getting a new ISO set, or search for similar keycaps (AliExpress have vendors offer ISO specified keycaps).

Overall it’s not going to be easy and quick, I’ve seen some vendors on AE offer creating custom keyboard cases with floating switches design in the thumbnail, you can try asking them if they have already designs for existing PCBs you can get.

[geauxflying]

This Varmilo is TKL but otherwise meets your needs. I don’t love the floating keycaps… they look unfinished and the lights bleeding through at the bottom really make it obvious, but everyone has their thing, that’s why it’s great to have custom keyboard options…

I know the 75% boards are in style but, if you have not used one, and you have a home cluster, you might use it enough to miss it. I ordered a GMMK Pro and it’s still in the box a few weeks later. I’ll get to it eventually. I need to find a good stand-alone numpad before I bother to unbox it.

[EZG]

If they don’t have already to sale, you’d have to contact Glorious to see if they offer PCBs to sale, but don’t expect them to be available soon. 
Alternatively you could design your own but from the little I’ve seen it’s a tremendous amount of learning and work (and mistakes are costly). 

I contacted them, they don't "for now". But it might be never.

If you don’t mind using TKL the regular GMMK offers a floating design and I’m pretty sure they have ISO layout.

I already have a TKL and if I have to invest a lof of money in a main keyboard, I want it to be perfect for me, something like a 75%.
 

Alternatively the ID80 have a similar layout to the GMMK (minus the rotary wheel), you can try making a case around it as the ID80 have a high profile case. 
Making your own case shouldn’t be hard if you’re familiar with CAD, especially when it’s a floating switches design, you just have to make sure you’re familiar with the PCBs dimensions and the MX dimensions, mistakes with creating a metal case will be VERY costly. 

Great model, I like that ID80 even more than the GMMK Pro, the wheel is actually bothering me.

I’m not familiar with making custom keycaps, you’re far better off getting a new ISO set, or search for similar keycaps (AliExpress have vendors offer ISO specified keycaps).

I don't "want" custom keycaps, I need it, sadly. Because when using ISO I'm going to need a non standard right shift key, and probably 2 or 3 "custom row" print screen key and keys like that.

Overall it’s not going to be easy and quick, I’ve seen some vendors on AE offer creating custom keyboard cases with floating switches design in the thumbnail, you can try asking them if they have already designs for existing PCBs you can get.

Yes that's something I have in mind. I'm browsing the Reddit and forum a lot to see what other people have and maybe ask them how they got it. But ISO is kinda niche, even more in 75% floating design.

This Varmilo is TKL but otherwise meets your needs. I don’t love the floating keycaps… they look unfinished and the lights bleeding through at the bottom really make it obvious, but everyone has their thing, that’s why it’s great to have custom keyboard options…

I want less than TKL as it is what I already have. I agree, I hate light bleeding at the bottom, I currently have a floating design TKL RGB and close to no light bleeding at the bottom because keycaps are not "clear" at the bottom. They're half black half clear, which is what I'm going to get for my next keyboard. I also like the floating design because it's way easier to keep clean, and to clean. But I like the design better anyway.

I know the 75% boards are in style but, if you have not used one, and you have a home cluster, you might use it enough to miss it. I ordered a GMMK Pro and it’s still in the box a few weeks later. I’ll get to it eventually. I need to find a good stand-alone numpad before I bother to unbox it.

As I already have a TKL, I don't miss the numpad at all even after using full keyboard at work everyday. Plus, 75% or 60% isn't a matter of style or fashion to me, what I've done is starting from nothing on the website Keyboard Layout Editor, and designed what would be the perfect dream layout for me, and it turned out to be a 60% with F-Keys and one more vertical row at the right of the enter key, which is 75% if I'm not mistaken.






Thanks for all your answers. Good read, and a long time writing for me aha. Have a great day guys

[EZG]

After gathering more informations and more research, I think my best option is to go custom PCB.
The question I can't find an answer for now is, will making my own PCB allow me to get per key RGB LED or SMD LED "programmable" (like assign a color individually on each key, I don't care about RGB effects I just want to be able to select a fixed color for each key).
If yes, is one of the 2 superior in terms of performances between LED and SMD LED ?

[yui]

if you design your own pcb your technical abilities are the limit, so per key RGB is absolutely a possibility, i would recommend going smd addressable as t will only require 1 pin on the controller to drive, while old school 4 or 6 pins RGB will need IO extenders or a controller with enough IO pins for driving a 3*75 LED matrix.
as per light output both will output too much light at full brightness for a keyboard, and use too much current for the USB port.
one thing you could do if you have no experience and are not the type to like learning is ask keyboard PCB designers if they would be willing to help you, like Jae did with the doddle60, if you can find a few others to absorb the prototyping cost with you it could work. and even if you are willing to learn other designers may still be willing to help you out, also there is a pcb design thread here to help https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=48851.0 and a lot of more or less experimented peoples trying to help on the "Making Stuff Together!" section.
hopes this helps and was not too dense of an information dump

[EZG]

if you design your own pcb your technical abilities are the limit, so per key RGB is absolutely a possibility, i would recommend going smd addressable as t will only require 1 pin on the controller to drive, while old school 4 or 6 pins RGB will need IO extenders or a controller with enough IO pins for driving a 3*75 LED matrix.
as per light output both will output too much light at full brightness for a keyboard, and use too much current for the USB port.
one thing you could do if you have no experience and are not the type to like learning is ask keyboard PCB designers if they would be willing to help you, like Jae did with the doddle60, if you can find a few others to absorb the prototyping cost with you it could work. and even if you are willing to learn other designers may still be willing to help you out, also there is a pcb design thread here to help https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=48851.0 and a lot of more or less experimented peoples trying to help on the "Making Stuff Together!" section.
hopes this helps and was not too dense of an information dump

Thanks for all the valuable informations up there.
I will post what has been my though process and what my layout actually looks like when I'll get back from work.
I guess I should start a new thread dedicated to the thinking and building of the board since I've been thinking about building my own keyboard for at least 5 years, and now I have the time, and a big budget I'm willing to throw at it. I like to learn, to build, if I can achieve what I need/want with enough reading and learning, then let's go

[EZG]

Ok so here is more details about my thought process. The original idea is I want less than a TKL, because I have absolutely no use of the "end", "pause", "inser", "home", "end", "pg up" and "pg down" keys. So I might as well shrink a little bit more. I know these key have their own purpose and can be useful, but I never used any of these in the past 33 years.

So I started from nothing with one BIG main constraint that I can't go around so my whole project is based with that in mind. The constraint is that there is only 1 keycaps set available that is double-shot PBT and ISO-FR (AZERTY). A very niche thing...
I know I could settle with double-shot ABS or something else, or that I could could learn ANSI layout, but I don't want to. I absolutely want double-shot PBT ISO-FR.
So I've bought that keycaps set to know the size of each keycap and build around that, because I don't want to order custom keycaps that wouldn't be the exact same material to fill the blanks and give a non-harmonized look to the keyboard.

Here is what I ended up with:



Red: 1.25u keys and 6.25u spacebar.
Blue: 1.25u left ****, that I will buy a 2nd time to use also as right shift because on ISO-FR the default right shift is huge, as long as ANSI left shift I believe.
Green: Standard size and row location for ISO-FR, no changes.
Yellow + purple line: Offset of the arrow keys so the right of the top one is aligned with the right or the enter key. Then moved down by 0.25u so it doesn't look weird
White: Added keys just for aesthetics, because I don't like it if I remove any of them. I will probably use home/end or pgup/pagdown here or use blank caps for macros.

The only modification I can think of right now is moving the print screen key just above the delete key, and add an engraved plated on top or a nob like the GMMK Pro I don't know yet. If you think about any possible upgrade let me know !

I've been looking A LOT for keyboards with that exact layout but I can't find any. Some come close, but with an offset between the arrow keys and the enter key, which looks horrible in my opinion, I can't deal with that (on my screenshot, it's the thing about the purple line).
I've actually found one in a random YouTube video, but I have no info about the name of the model:



EDIT: Found it it's the IC Evolv. But the left shift key is 1.5u so it's not gonna work for me. Sticking a 1.25u key instead is going to look weird with the empty space on the sides.
EDIT2: Actually the Evolv looks sexy... Close to exactly what I want. That right left key thing might be a sacrifice I have to make to dodge the hassle of having to make a PCB. But I can't find that KB anywhere, need to search more aha.

If you guys know any keyboard model with a layout similar to mine that would be perfect. Keep in mind that I can't change the size of any of the shift keys, and I can't for any keys of the bottom row too.

Thanks for reading, have a great day !

[yui]

if you know your layout well enough you could use blanks and even better the wrong language (and trip everyone that try to use your pc )
i am also french but my favorite layout is US-ISO so even though my keyboards are a mix of FR-ISO, PT-ISO, US-ISO and even one in Hebrew i do not look at the legend on the key to type so it does not matter, and it guarantees that no one will touch my pc
otherwise if you are not there yet, or someone else may use the PC, WASD and GMMK both make ISO-FR keysets readily available, FR support also crops up in GB every so often, and there is a thread about AZERTY sets on this forum somewhere, can't find it though...

[EZG]

WASD and GMMK both make ISO-FR keysets readily available

Pretty sure they're not making it in double-shot PBT. Which is what I want. I've been looking everywhere. But anyway that's not the problem, I already have my ISO-FR double-shot PBT keycaps set

if you know your layout well enough you could use blanks and even better the wrong language

Knowing the layout and wanting to have a character on each keys are 2 different things. I know where the key are, I also don't want any blank key, or in a different material.

EDIT: I've been looking around but no success, do you guys think I can find the KiCad model for the PCB or the GMMK Pro / 7v / Satisfaction75 as it would need just a few changes ? Or a "list" of existing similar keyboard's model I can start from ?

[AnonymousPlatypus]

What about the Keychron Q1? They have an ISO version which I'm planning to buy.
Also for FR-ISO keycaps, checkout the ePBT Arctic Emperor!