Author Topic: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***  (Read 2997 times)

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Offline romevi

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Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 13:09:36 »
Let's talk about it with full-on spoilers.

Saw it last night. Loved it. Apparently a third of the internet hates it, but I don't care. I mean, I did when I walked out of the theater and went online to read reviews and was totally taken aback and how much hate it's gotten. But otherwise I thought it was fantastic and one of my top three favorites already.







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Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 13:14:35 »
I am really hoping it is better than Force Awakens, but going in with no real expectations.

Offline romevi

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 13:32:43 »
but going in with no real expectations.

That's how I went in. Zero expectations; zero fan theories. Love 90% of it.

Offline ArchDill

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 14:15:54 »
I do not think that snoke is dead...

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 14:23:58 »
I have been following the forums, some of which have polls set up. Right now the scores seem to be very evenly distributed between people who love it, people who hate it and people who think it is "just OK".

It has got high scores on Rotten Tomatoes and Metacritic ... but both of these have miscategorised several bad reviews as being positive, so you can't trust those sites. And you really have to read each review to tell what kind of perspective that the reviewer had - and if you do you risk getting spoiled.

Personally, I chose not to see the movie despite having been able to go to the gala premiere a day early like I had done for TFA.
I had already decided after watching TFA that I did not agree what Lucasfilm had done to the Star Wars universe and the direction they had taken with these movies. I prefer the timeline of the books and video games that had been released in the thirty years before -- which Disney/Lucasfilm has totally scrapped in favour of a completely different storyline. In the books Luke, Han and Leia did not totally fail, the Jedi order is renewed and not extinct, and there are several characters that all hardcore Star Wars fans know and love.
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Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #5 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 14:33:04 »
I do not think that snoke is dead...

I really REALLY want his reveal to be he's a short-ass muppet like Yoda but super powerful.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #6 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 14:40:40 »
I do not think that snoke is dead...

He served his purpose and is gone.  No need to cry over spilled Snoke.

Bullet point review:

* Didn't care for the Space Leia bit.  I know she's force sensitive but come the **** on, it's deep space.
* WTF killing Akbar like that?  Should have let him live, made him commander, and let him go down in glory kamikaze style instead of Laura Dern's purple haired random character.
* Boob creature with crazy milk chin Luke was top WTF moment. 
* Island Luke was a little to emo whiny for my taste, blah blah suck it up, you are a damn Jedi, act like it! 
* Rey and Kylo - every scene was ****ing amazing.  Holy **** that co-op finisher in Snoke's chamber gave me an erection.
* Finn and Rose - uh, why not Finn and Poe, bros 4 life?  Poe served no purpose being on the cruiser, should have snuck off with Finn for shenannigans w/ BB-8.
* Code breaker/casino/failed sabatoge mission - 30 minutes of filler the movie didn't need, but at the same time it was refreshing to see that sometimes these off the cuff heroic plans to foil the bad guys just plain fail.
* Luke and Kylo - HHHNNNNNGGGGGG...ok I'm spent get me some new pants.  ****ing brilliant from start to finish.  So many clues as to what's really going on once you know to look for them.
* Hux - shut the **** up *SLAM*
* Phasma - she and Boba Fett need to start a club for bad guys that could have been so much more.  Such a cool character, but end the end she really served no purpose other than to personify Finn's fear of the First Order and his desire to break away from it.  Lame ass death, deserved better.
* Porgs - Chewie should have eaten the damn thing. 
* Yoda - ****ing around, cracking jokes, enjoying the afterlife, and back to the puppet that we all know and love.  Excellent scene.
* Hyperspace kamikaze - ok, so something about that just bothers me.  Like, most hyper-drive systems would probably have collision avoidance built into their systems so you wouldn't smash into **** while blasting your way thru space at ludicrous speed.  And overriding that wouldn't be something as trivial as just point and shoot you ship from the command chair.  And if it's that easy why are they building slow plodding bombers that get picked off by stray tie fighter blasts when they could be building ships loaded with bombs that they simply aim at a Destroyer and rip it a new one at lightspeed?  Anyway, the scene was ****ing gorgeous, and you could hear a pin drop in the theater as everyone held their breath in the silence.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #7 on: Fri, 15 December 2017, 15:25:51 »
i saw the last one, where they all die at the end..  thought that one was a good movie..

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #8 on: Tue, 19 December 2017, 00:30:13 »
It was OK, not great. Better than FA though, I thought. The special effects were incredible maybe the best I've ever seen in a film. The plot was scattered and felt both rushed and laden with filler at the same time with less important scenes of impact. There were a few twists I didn't see coming which were appreciated.
I'd say 6.5/10

Offline romevi

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #9 on: Tue, 19 December 2017, 00:42:45 »
It was OK, not great. Better than FA though, I thought. The special effects were incredible maybe the best I've ever seen in a film. The plot was scattered and felt both rushed and laden with filler at the same time with less important scenes of impact. There were a few twists I didn't see coming which were appreciated.
I'd say 6.5/10

I'm still blown away by Snoke, both in terms of his appearance and fate. He's got to be the most realistic CGI character I've ever seen; he looked real. I even had to lean to my wife, who I knew didn't appreciate the amount of care behind making him seem real, and still said, "He looks real!"

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #10 on: Tue, 19 December 2017, 00:59:19 »
He's got to be the most realistic CGI character I've ever seen

Leia's CGI was maybe the best character CGI I've ever seen. I was in the 2nd row(not by choice) and couldn't even tell when she was CG and when she was real.

Offline HoffmanMyster

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #11 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 15:10:52 »
Bullet point review:

* Didn't care for the Space Leia bit.  I know she's force sensitive but come the **** on, it's deep space.
* WTF killing Akbar like that?  Should have let him live, made him commander, and let him go down in glory kamikaze style instead of Laura Dern's purple haired random character.
* Boob creature with crazy milk chin Luke was top WTF moment. 
* Island Luke was a little to emo whiny for my taste, blah blah suck it up, you are a damn Jedi, act like it! 
* Rey and Kylo - every scene was ****ing amazing.  Holy **** that co-op finisher in Snoke's chamber gave me an erection.
* Finn and Rose - uh, why not Finn and Poe, bros 4 life?  Poe served no purpose being on the cruiser, should have snuck off with Finn for shenannigans w/ BB-8.
* Code breaker/casino/failed sabatoge mission - 30 minutes of filler the movie didn't need, but at the same time it was refreshing to see that sometimes these off the cuff heroic plans to foil the bad guys just plain fail.
* Luke and Kylo - HHHNNNNNGGGGGG...ok I'm spent get me some new pants.  ****ing brilliant from start to finish.  So many clues as to what's really going on once you know to look for them.
* Hux - shut the **** up *SLAM*
* Phasma - she and Boba Fett need to start a club for bad guys that could have been so much more.  Such a cool character, but end the end she really served no purpose other than to personify Finn's fear of the First Order and his desire to break away from it.  Lame ass death, deserved better.
* Porgs - Chewie should have eaten the damn thing. 
* Yoda - ****ing around, cracking jokes, enjoying the afterlife, and back to the puppet that we all know and love.  Excellent scene.
* Hyperspace kamikaze - ok, so something about that just bothers me.  Like, most hyper-drive systems would probably have collision avoidance built into their systems so you wouldn't smash into **** while blasting your way thru space at ludicrous speed.  And overriding that wouldn't be something as trivial as just point and shoot you ship from the command chair.  And if it's that easy why are they building slow plodding bombers that get picked off by stray tie fighter blasts when they could be building ships loaded with bombs that they simply aim at a Destroyer and rip it a new one at lightspeed?  Anyway, the scene was ****ing gorgeous, and you could hear a pin drop in the theater as everyone held their breath in the silence.

I'm in agreement with pretty much all of this (seems to be the main consensus on reddit as well from what I was reading last week). 

I will say though, reading a lot of negative thoughts on the movie kind of tainted my view of it at first.  I saw it a second time this past weekend and really enjoyed it, quite a bit more than the first time.  Sure there are a couple frustrating plot points, but it is a fun movie. 

That said, it is a little strange to me that these new films don't appear to have a single cohesive story writing team.  Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like there are some plot points that develop in one film that are just ignored in the next by the new screenwriter/director. 

Offline dubious

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #12 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 15:53:59 »
Bullet point review:

* Didn't care for the Space Leia bit.  I know she's force sensitive but come the **** on, it's deep space.
* WTF killing Akbar like that?  Should have let him live, made him commander, and let him go down in glory kamikaze style instead of Laura Dern's purple haired random character.
* Boob creature with crazy milk chin Luke was top WTF moment. 
* Island Luke was a little to emo whiny for my taste, blah blah suck it up, you are a damn Jedi, act like it! 
* Rey and Kylo - every scene was ****ing amazing.  Holy **** that co-op finisher in Snoke's chamber gave me an erection.
* Finn and Rose - uh, why not Finn and Poe, bros 4 life?  Poe served no purpose being on the cruiser, should have snuck off with Finn for shenannigans w/ BB-8.
* Code breaker/casino/failed sabatoge mission - 30 minutes of filler the movie didn't need, but at the same time it was refreshing to see that sometimes these off the cuff heroic plans to foil the bad guys just plain fail.
* Luke and Kylo - HHHNNNNNGGGGGG...ok I'm spent get me some new pants.  ****ing brilliant from start to finish.  So many clues as to what's really going on once you know to look for them.
* Hux - shut the **** up *SLAM*
* Phasma - she and Boba Fett need to start a club for bad guys that could have been so much more.  Such a cool character, but end the end she really served no purpose other than to personify Finn's fear of the First Order and his desire to break away from it.  Lame ass death, deserved better.
* Porgs - Chewie should have eaten the damn thing. 
* Yoda - ****ing around, cracking jokes, enjoying the afterlife, and back to the puppet that we all know and love.  Excellent scene.
* Hyperspace kamikaze - ok, so something about that just bothers me.  Like, most hyper-drive systems would probably have collision avoidance built into their systems so you wouldn't smash into **** while blasting your way thru space at ludicrous speed.  And overriding that wouldn't be something as trivial as just point and shoot you ship from the command chair.  And if it's that easy why are they building slow plodding bombers that get picked off by stray tie fighter blasts when they could be building ships loaded with bombs that they simply aim at a Destroyer and rip it a new one at lightspeed?  Anyway, the scene was ****ing gorgeous, and you could hear a pin drop in the theater as everyone held their breath in the silence.

I'm in agreement with pretty much all of this (seems to be the main consensus on reddit as well from what I was reading last week). 

I will say though, reading a lot of negative thoughts on the movie kind of tainted my view of it at first.  I saw it a second time this past weekend and really enjoyed it, quite a bit more than the first time.  Sure there are a couple frustrating plot points, but it is a fun movie. 

That said, it is a little strange to me that these new films don't appear to have a single cohesive story writing team.  Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like there are some plot points that develop in one film that are just ignored in the next by the new screenwriter/director.

This sums up my experience pretty well. I enjoyed it more the second time, but overall it's clunky storyline, wtf moments, and the obvious corporate influence spoiled it for me.  :'(
« Last Edit: Wed, 27 December 2017, 15:56:14 by dubious »

Offline audax989

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 15:57:46 »
I don't think would really have the guts to kill ben.

also finn and rose... plssss this subplot just kills the pacing of the whole movie.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #14 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 16:05:52 »
I am really conflicted about this movie. There were parts I really loved, but damn there was some (understatement) stupid heavy handed garbage robbing us of more time with Rey/Luke/Kylo. planning a second viewing this weekend.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #15 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 16:09:18 »
Loved it.  The Gambling world could have been cut without much of an effect- other than losing Benicio del Toro.  I love his characterizations, and this was no exception.  I did dislike the beginning for Finn coming back awake truth be told, and though his fight with Phasma redeemed him a bit, it wasn't quite enough for Finn nor Phasma.  And that Rose thing came out of left field.  I do like Finn and Poe as just buddies.

And unlike most of the internet, I do like the fact that they are starting over.  People don't get that the extended universe is done and gone, so are characterizing based on their characters in a dead universe that had its own problems.  This was a good way to start over.
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Offline romevi

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #16 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 16:17:47 »
The only thing I didn't like was Luke's interaction with Ren, meaning what forced Ren to go off the deep end. Even if it was just a fleeting moment for him, Luke doesn't seem like someone who easily would've gone for his lightsaber after a few minutes of mind-reading. We don't know yet what Ren will do in the next Episode, but so far it seems a bit stretched for Luke to grab his laser sword and then later on flee after failing him. Sure, Obi-wan and Yoda leave, but not for as long or as isolate as Luke did.

Otherwise, I loved the film. Loved the Snoke part, loved Hamill's performance, loved the Leia space scene, loved the casino bit. I'm still a bit unnerved that Disney wants to start over fresh (i.e., wants to focus on the universe rather than the Skywalkers so they can make $tar War$ films ad nauseam), but it seems a bit harsh with how they're going about it, at least to me. Sure, Star Wars always was about the money and merchandising, but at least give the Skywalkers a bit more dignity with their way out; it started with them, after all, and it wouldn't really feel like Star Wars without them.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #17 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 16:56:58 »
The only thing I didn't like was Luke's interaction with Ren, meaning what forced Ren to go off the deep end. Even if it was just a fleeting moment for him, Luke doesn't seem like someone who easily would've gone for his lightsaber after a few minutes of mind-reading. We don't know yet what Ren will do in the next Episode, but so far it seems a bit stretched for Luke to grab his laser sword and then later on flee after failing him. Sure, Obi-wan and Yoda leave, but not for as long or as isolate as Luke did.

Otherwise, I loved the film. Loved the Snoke part, loved Hamill's performance, loved the Leia space scene, loved the casino bit. I'm still a bit unnerved that Disney wants to start over fresh (i.e., wants to focus on the universe rather than the Skywalkers so they can make $tar War$ films ad nauseam), but it seems a bit harsh with how they're going about it, at least to me. Sure, Star Wars always was about the money and merchandising, but at least give the Skywalkers a bit more dignity with their way out; it started with them, after all, and it wouldn't really feel like Star Wars without them.

My big problem with the Leia space scene was that they didn't plausibly explain it.  People are assuming the force, but show, don't tell.  She hadn't been practicing from what they showed in the films.  My big problem with Luke wasn't what happened.  It was in the fact that he lied.  And my big problem with the casino scene wasn't that it existed... but that it was pointless, and added nothing to the narrative.
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Online ygor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #18 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 17:11:58 »
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #19 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 17:47:18 »
NOBODY WATCHES STAR WARS ANYMORE
« Last Edit: Wed, 27 December 2017, 18:09:24 by HoffmanMyster »
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #20 on: Wed, 27 December 2017, 17:54:56 »
I personally thought the story line to 7 was better than 8, but overall I enjoyed both.

Rouge One I think was better than both 7 and 8.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #21 on: Thu, 28 December 2017, 23:46:22 »
Less Porg and more Krayt dragons please.
   

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #22 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 02:21:54 »
Heh. The crystal planet in TLJ was called Crait, but it was not the home of the Krayt Dragons. Lucasfilm chose to repurpose an old name without checking first. :-ţ
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #23 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 04:32:25 »
I fell asleep in the cinema during Rogue One which I put down to tiredness but it happened with Last Jedi this year as well. This isn't something that I do every time I go to the cinema never happened to me before. The thing that stands out to me is how flat the performances are I really don't like these new actors. Even Domhnall Gleeson who's generally quite good isn't really making much of an impression. The're all acting more wooden than Hayden Christensen.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #24 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 08:59:29 »
More


Mod Edit: Ew
« Last Edit: Fri, 29 December 2017, 12:04:08 by HoffmanMyster »
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #25 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 09:20:17 »
We all saw the Kryat dragon skeleton years ago. Moar Kryat dragons please.
   

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #26 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 10:27:56 »

He served his purpose and is gone.  No need to cry over spilled Snoke.

Bullet point review:

* Didn't care for the Space Leia bit.  I know she's force sensitive but come the **** on, it's deep space.
* WTF killing Akbar like that?  Should have let him live, made him commander, and let him go down in glory kamikaze style instead of Laura Dern's purple haired random character.
* Boob creature with crazy milk chin Luke was top WTF moment. 
* Island Luke was a little to emo whiny for my taste, blah blah suck it up, you are a damn Jedi, act like it! 
* Rey and Kylo - every scene was ****ing amazing.  Holy **** that co-op finisher in Snoke's chamber gave me an erection.
* Finn and Rose - uh, why not Finn and Poe, bros 4 life?  Poe served no purpose being on the cruiser, should have snuck off with Finn for shenannigans w/ BB-8.
* Code breaker/casino/failed sabatoge mission - 30 minutes of filler the movie didn't need, but at the same time it was refreshing to see that sometimes these off the cuff heroic plans to foil the bad guys just plain fail.
* Luke and Kylo - HHHNNNNNGGGGGG...ok I'm spent get me some new pants.  ****ing brilliant from start to finish.  So many clues as to what's really going on once you know to look for them.
* Hux - shut the **** up *SLAM*
* Phasma - she and Boba Fett need to start a club for bad guys that could have been so much more.  Such a cool character, but end the end she really served no purpose other than to personify Finn's fear of the First Order and his desire to break away from it.  Lame ass death, deserved better.
* Porgs - Chewie should have eaten the damn thing. 
* Yoda - ****ing around, cracking jokes, enjoying the afterlife, and back to the puppet that we all know and love.  Excellent scene.
* Hyperspace kamikaze - ok, so something about that just bothers me.  Like, most hyper-drive systems would probably have collision avoidance built into their systems so you wouldn't smash into **** while blasting your way thru space at ludicrous speed.  And overriding that wouldn't be something as trivial as just point and shoot you ship from the command chair.  And if it's that easy why are they building slow plodding bombers that get picked off by stray tie fighter blasts when they could be building ships loaded with bombs that they simply aim at a Destroyer and rip it a new one at lightspeed?  Anyway, the scene was ****ing gorgeous, and you could hear a pin drop in the theater as everyone held their breath in the silence.

As a few others have said, this mostly summarizes my reactions as well. I expected it to be a little more lighthearted than I would want it to be so wasn't too disappointed by it (or the Porgs). Despite not enjoying Holdo's existence (and/or death of Ackbar) at all, the kamikaze scene was excellent and almost canonical - From A New Hope: "Traveling through hyperspace isn't like dusting crops, boy! Without precise calculations we could fly right through a star or bounce too close to a supernova and that'd end your trip real quick, wouldn't it?" -Han
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #27 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 12:22:37 »
I fell asleep in the cinema during Rogue One which I put down to tiredness but it happened with Last Jedi this year as well. This isn't something that I do every time I go to the cinema never happened to me before. The thing that stands out to me is how flat the performances are I really don't like these new actors. Even Domhnall Gleeson who's generally quite good isn't really making much of an impression. The're all acting more wooden than Hayden Christensen.

The performances aren't that bad, damn. Hayden Christensen career is based on appearance on the USA/Canada kids show Goosebumps; He is terrible and to say any of the new trilogy POV actors are that bad is just ridiculous.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #28 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 12:32:49 »
I fell asleep in the cinema during Rogue One which I put down to tiredness but it happened with Last Jedi this year as well. This isn't something that I do every time I go to the cinema never happened to me before. The thing that stands out to me is how flat the performances are I really don't like these new actors. Even Domhnall Gleeson who's generally quite good isn't really making much of an impression. The're all acting more wooden than Hayden Christensen.

The performances aren't that bad, damn. Hayden Christensen career is based on appearance on the USA/Canada kids show Goosebumps; He is terrible and to say any of the new trilogy POV actors are that bad is just ridiculous.

Oscar Isaac is at the top of the **** pile as far as Ster Werz actors go... Then prolly John Boyega, Kelly Tran and Jake Lloyd. Christensen is a close 4th though.
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Online Glod

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #29 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 12:48:01 »
I fell asleep in the cinema during Rogue One which I put down to tiredness but it happened with Last Jedi this year as well. This isn't something that I do every time I go to the cinema never happened to me before. The thing that stands out to me is how flat the performances are I really don't like these new actors. Even Domhnall Gleeson who's generally quite good isn't really making much of an impression. The're all acting more wooden than Hayden Christensen.

The performances aren't that bad, damn. Hayden Christensen career is based on appearance on the USA/Canada kids show Goosebumps; He is terrible and to say any of the new trilogy POV actors are that bad is just ridiculous.

Oscar Isaac is at the top of the **** pile as far as Ster Werz actors go... Then prolly John Boyega, Kelly Tran and Jake Lloyd. Christensen is a close 4th though.

Is this some kind of bizarre other dimension, I re-watched Ep1-7 before seeing 8 and Nothing is worse than Jake Lloyd and Christensen, NOTHING. The performances are modeled off of what I assume are sexual predators and serial killers. I think you are confusing dialogue vs performances.

I keep seeing this "Ep 8 is the worst movie ever, worst actors ever, worst movie of SW, worst movie of 2017, worst year ever" And it is absolute abuse of the word "worst"; you guys know damn well this is worse stuff out there for SW and 2017
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #30 on: Fri, 29 December 2017, 12:57:21 »
I fell asleep in the cinema during Rogue One which I put down to tiredness but it happened with Last Jedi this year as well. This isn't something that I do every time I go to the cinema never happened to me before. The thing that stands out to me is how flat the performances are I really don't like these new actors. Even Domhnall Gleeson who's generally quite good isn't really making much of an impression. The're all acting more wooden than Hayden Christensen.

The performances aren't that bad, damn. Hayden Christensen career is based on appearance on the USA/Canada kids show Goosebumps; He is terrible and to say any of the new trilogy POV actors are that bad is just ridiculous.

Oscar Isaac is at the top of the **** pile as far as Ster Werz actors go... Then prolly John Boyega, Kelly Tran and Jake Lloyd. Christensen is a close 4th though.

Is this some kind of bizarre other dimension, I re-watched Ep1-7 before seeing 8 and Nothing is worse than Jake Lloyd and Christensen, NOTHING. The performances are modeled off of what I assume are sexual predators and serial killers. I think you are confusing dialogue vs performances.

I keep seeing this "Ep 8 is the worst movie ever, worst actors ever, worst movie of SW, worst movie of 2017, worst year ever" And it is absolute abuse of the word "worst"; you guys know damn well this is worse stuff out there for SW and 2017

My bad. I forgot Laura Dern (though she was the bomb in Wild at Heart, yo). She's prolly tied in that list with Lloyd. All the actors in Ep 8 whose sole task it was to brood did an okay job, and I'm not mad at Daisy Ridley's performance. No mistake for me about Oscar Isaac being at the top of the **** list though. Dude is beyond awful.

Edit-
« Last Edit: Fri, 29 December 2017, 13:03:26 by ygor »
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Offline _haru

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #31 on: Mon, 01 January 2018, 18:01:00 »
I pretty much loved it. Didn't really like the Finn and Rose subplot much though.
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Offline Otesanek

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #36 on: Mon, 01 January 2018, 19:48:21 »
I liked it, probably more than Force Awakens.....

Offline Leslieann

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #37 on: Mon, 01 January 2018, 20:09:00 »
It was good, I can even deal with the whole casino thing... the worst element of it all... Space Leia..
Honestly, especially knowing Carrie Fisher died, they had time to make changes for the release, I think they should have let her die then and there. Shocking, yes, but it would have probably made the film better and allow for better continuity. Though I admit, killing her and Akbar would be a bit much but at the same time bad things happen in war. Would it have made you mad? Of course... But the most memorable movies are rarely the ones that left you feeling completely happy at the end.

I'm also a bit conflicted about BB8e, not everything needs an evil counterpart. Admittedly, I may be tainted here as I kind of hate BB8, not as a bot, but simply because after Force Awakens, anytime I see BB8 all I now see is Sesame Street's Elmo in droid form. R2 may not have always been a genius, but he wasn't Elmo level either. Yes, I know marketing blah blah blah... Don't care, Elmo in a droid.
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Offline nugglets

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #38 on: Mon, 01 January 2018, 21:02:15 »
Really, the only thing that bothered me was how often they threw in really forced/corny dialogue. I mean, I get it, the dialogue has always had it's cheeseball moments but these felt particularly bad to me.

Other than that, it was entertaining and I didn't feel like I knew the whole story already like I did with The New Hope Awakens.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #39 on: Mon, 01 January 2018, 21:55:49 »
I went into the movie with very low expectation. It's almost an obligatory thing I have to do, being a SW fan when younger. After being disappointed by the 3 prequels, my hopes are not high. They are not low though, because Rogue One was excellent and The Force Awakens are not too bad. So, when I saw many cringe-worthy scenes, I wasn't mad at all. I have accepted the fact that the new SW is not for me anymore. All is not bad however - I really like Kylo and Rey's co-op fight scene against Snoke's red guard. And I enjoyed the last scene at the salt planet. These two are really well done. If only they have cut away that casino stuff, the Space Leia, it would been perfect for me.
 

Offline romevi

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #40 on: Mon, 01 January 2018, 23:24:01 »
I need to rewatch it. Watched it only once so far.

I haven't seen the movie since last year...

Offline MaNiFeX

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #41 on: Wed, 03 January 2018, 17:33:27 »
I need to rewatch it. Watched it only once so far.

I haven't seen the movie since last year...

I rewatched.  Caught a couple cool things.  Note Skywalker's feet when dealing with Kylo. 

All in all, I enjoyed it.  There were two people I thought could have died, though: Leia and Finn.  Leia, 'cause Carrie can't act in the next film.  Finn, 'cause that would have been a bad-ass way to go and would have made a big boom. 

Offline Mr_BeastQuake

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #42 on: Thu, 04 January 2018, 07:50:14 »
I liked it well enough. The humor was pretty on point. Wasn't a huge fan of Snoke's uneventful death. What with some of the hints in the canon books, I thought he was a bigger deal. People have pointed out that the Emperor originally kind of came out of nowhere and died the next film, so I guess there's some precedence.

I was not a big fan of the, "We're running out of fuel" plot. Seemed videogameesque in plot: here's the problem, run around and gather items, solve the problem. Seemed kind of low-effort.

Felt pretty good on the whole though.

Offline MKULTRA

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #43 on: Thu, 04 January 2018, 07:58:11 »
BB8 is way too OP.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #44 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 03:12:42 »
I liked it well enough. The humor was pretty on point. Wasn't a huge fan of Snoke's uneventful death. What with some of the hints in the canon books, I thought he was a bigger deal. People have pointed out that the Emperor originally kind of came out of nowhere and died the next film, so I guess there's some precedence.
Syth have a pretty high turnover rate due to their Rule of Two, there can be only two masters/lords and each can only have one apprentice, the only way to move up is to kill your master. If that were not enough, Masters are always looking for a more capable apprentice. Your only hope is to get good enough to kill your master before he finds an apprentice with more potential and without tipping him off that you are a danger to him. If you do manage to kill him, you get to go through the same dance with your own apprentice.

Kind of puts Kylo Ren's frustration into a different perspective when you figure that had he had to bring Rey to his master to prove himself worthy, but that doing so also could mean his own death should Rey decide to switch sides.
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Offline CapCollector

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #45 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 08:26:40 »
I feel more complete...
I now know where blue milk comes from.


Offline Findecanor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #46 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 09:11:04 »
The blue milk that Luke drank on Tatooine was from Banthas -- a large hairy mammal.
The creature on Ahch-To (bless you) is a Thala-siren.
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Offline romevi

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #47 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 09:23:03 »
I feel more complete...
I now know where blue milk comes from.

That's not blue milk; it was green milk.

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #48 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 09:36:52 »
Spoiler alert Jack Sparrow dies and Will steals the black pearl

Offline HoffmanMyster

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #49 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 10:15:25 »
Syth have a pretty high turnover rate due to their Rule of Two, there can be only two masters/lords and each can only have one apprentice, the only way to move up is to kill your master. If that were not enough, Masters are always looking for a more capable apprentice. Your only hope is to get good enough to kill your master before he finds an apprentice with more potential and without tipping him off that you are a danger to him. If you do manage to kill him, you get to go through the same dance with your own apprentice.

If I were a Sith Lord, I would probably go about my galaxy-ruling conquests without a murderous sidekick, but that's just me.

Offline Mr_BeastQuake

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #50 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 12:30:31 »
Syth have a pretty high turnover rate due to their Rule of Two, there can be only two masters/lords and each can only have one apprentice, the only way to move up is to kill your master. If that were not enough, Masters are always looking for a more capable apprentice. Your only hope is to get good enough to kill your master before he finds an apprentice with more potential and without tipping him off that you are a danger to him. If you do manage to kill him, you get to go through the same dance with your own apprentice.

Kind of puts Kylo Ren's frustration into a different perspective when you figure that had he had to bring Rey to his master to prove himself worthy, but that doing so also could mean his own death should Rey decide to switch sides.

Ya, is the Rule of Two still canon? I can never tell anymore. I definitely get why they killed Snoke, Ren is more interesting and it's kind of the way of Star Wars to have apprentices kill masters.

In one of the books, I think the Thrawn book, it hints that the Emperor fears something in the wild/unknown regions. Thus, he brings Thrawn on. I suppose I just missed what it was alluding to. Just curious if there is a Rule of Two, where Snoke was when the Emperor and Vader were pwning the galaxy. That is probably the extent of my interest in Snoke. Expect Disney to authorize a Snoke book.

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #51 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 12:45:57 »
In one of the books, I think the Thrawn book, it hints that the Emperor fears something in the wild/unknown regions. Thus, he brings Thrawn on. I suppose I just missed what it was alluding to.
I can't tell which book you are referring to... There was the "Thrawn trilogy", starting with "Heir to the Empire".

The book "Outbound Flight" is a prequel to that, set in the prequel-era... In that one, Jedi Master Sifa-Dyas senses the coming Jedi Purge, so he starts an expedition into the Unknown Regions under a false pretext - to explore - but what he actually wants is to send away a contingent of Jedi so that there will be Jedi that survive.
In that book, Palpatine makes contact with Thrawn for the first time and makes him attack the expedition in the Unknown Regions, but some get away, crash land on a planet and loses contact with civilisation.
« Last Edit: Fri, 05 January 2018, 12:47:42 by Findecanor »
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #52 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 13:19:53 »
I liked it well enough. The humor was pretty on point. Wasn't a huge fan of Snoke's uneventful death. What with some of the hints in the canon books, I thought he was a bigger deal. People have pointed out that the Emperor originally kind of came out of nowhere and died the next film, so I guess there's some precedence.
Syth have a pretty high turnover rate due to their Rule of Two, there can be only two masters/lords and each can only have one apprentice, the only way to move up is to kill your master. If that were not enough, Masters are always looking for a more capable apprentice. Your only hope is to get good enough to kill your master before he finds an apprentice with more potential and without tipping him off that you are a danger to him. If you do manage to kill him, you get to go through the same dance with your own apprentice.

Kind of puts Kylo Ren's frustration into a different perspective when you figure that had he had to bring Rey to his master to prove himself worthy, but that doing so also could mean his own death should Rey decide to switch sides.

Sith, first of all.  And you have the Rule of Two wrong.

Quote
This is the Rule of Two: One Sith must contain all the power of the dark side. One Master must decide how that power should be used.

From Book of Sith: Secrets from the Dark Side

Admittedly the source is from Legends.  But in Canon, there is reference also:

"Always two there are; no more, no less. A master and an apprentice." - Yoda

From Star Wars: Episode I The Phantom Menace

So not sure where "two masters/lords and each can only have one apprentice" comes from.

And the reasoning behind it is because of the Jedi–Sith Wars that were as much internecine as against the Jedi.  It's not attrition as much as it is a prevention of the inevitable conflict between the Sith that almost destroyed them.  The Code of the Sith is the antithesis of cooperation, and Darth Bane recognized this.

Quote
Peace is a lie. There is only Passion.
Through Passion I gain Strength.
Through Strength I gain Power.
Through Power I gain Victory.
Through Victory my chains are Broken.
The Force shall free me.
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Offline 0100010

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #53 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 14:42:32 »
Hated it.  Crap writing.

Luke - Hey, that's my old / fathers lightsaber, let me just throw it over my shoulder.  // Lets see, I was the only person in the universe who saw good in my father before, but I get one inkling of my student / nephew leaning towards the dark side - yeah, I think I'll kill him.  // I failed at running my own training academy, so I came here to die and gave up on the rest of the universe.

Leia - space Mary Poppins.  Give me a break.  Why didn't they have her sacrifice herself in the hyperspace jump instead of admiral gender studies?  Or at least have Ackbar go out with some flair.  Or let her die after getting blasted in space?

Finn / Rose - useless subplot.  Lets release the horses, but leave the slave kids.

Del Toro - While Finn and Rose are looking for the 1 person in the universe who can help them, I randomly show up in the same cell and magically have the same ability to break through first order shields that only that one other guy had.

Poe - Thanks admiral gender studies for not telling me what the plan is, so I have to come up with a way to get most of us killed.

Admiral gender studies - I'm not going to tell my best pilot what the plan is, he is not important enough to know.  I'm also going to wait until most of the transports are destroyed before I take action to destroy the first order fleet.  No comment on the fact that hyperspace in Star Wars was always another dimension, that only gravity could interfere with.

Snoke - I know most of you guys had a lot of questions about who I was after The Force Awakens, like am I really Darth Plagueous, or am I so old that I predate the Jedi order and have just been waiting for the Jedi / Sith and the prophecy to wipe each other out before I return to power?  But - you're not going to find out, I was just killed.

Rey - I learned how to fight with lightsaber in about 5 seconds before, then I got a couple half assed lessons from Luke, but I am one of the most powerful force users in the universe now.  Oh and my parents, guess I was a force child like Anakin since I only saw myself in the mirror.  BTW, you can call me Mary Sue.  I did steal those Whill books though, perhaps I will read them.

Overall, I have no desire to watch the next movie.  Not because of the poor writing of this one, but mostly because I couldn't care less about any of the characters left.  Thanks Disney.  Every other Star Wars Movie, you wanted to see the next one, to see what happened to the people and with the story.  But not with this one.
  Quoting me causes a posting error that you need to ignore.

Online ygor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #54 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 14:58:44 »
Remember when Finn was going to kamikaze and you thought, "Thank ****," but then Rose crashes into him and after some atrocious nonsense dialogue they're inexplicably back inside the base despite being surrounded by AT-ATs in the middle of a flat wasteland with no where to hide?

Great movie.
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Offline HoffmanMyster

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #55 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 15:04:18 »
Hated it.  Crap writing.

Certainly don't disagree with your criticisms, however I feel that I may just be more willing to let most of them go.  I still do appreciate the film for what it is, and enjoyed watching it.  It could have been so much better though, for exactly the reasons you mention.

Luke - Hey, that's my old / fathers lightsaber, let me just throw it over my shoulder.  // Lets see, I was the only person in the universe who saw good in my father before, but I get one inkling of my student / nephew leaning towards the dark side - yeah, I think I'll kill him.  // I failed at running my own training academy, so I came here to die and gave up on the rest of the universe.

Saw a quote from Hamill where he said "I pretty much fundamentally disagree with every choice you’ve made for this character. Now, having said that, I have gotten it off my chest, and my job now is to take what you’ve created and do my best to realize your vision." and that's pretty much how I would respond too.  It's pretty lackluster writing, especially considering it comes from Rian Johnson, whom I adore.  :|

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #56 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 15:08:55 »
Saw a quote from Hamill where he said "I pretty much fundamentally disagree with every choice you’ve made for this character. Now, having said that, I have gotten it off my chest, and my job now is to take what you’ve created and do my best to realize your vision."



Take that ****, Mark. And like it.
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Online ygor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #57 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 15:09:11 »
.
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #58 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 21:10:12 »

So not sure where "two masters/lords and each can only have one apprentice" comes from.
grr I always want to write Sith as Syth.

Wookiepedia has more on the Rule of Two.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Rule_of_Two

What I missed was that the Rule of Two ended with the death of Darth Sidious, so yes, Snoke could have had Rey and Ren as apprentices.
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Offline Mr_BeastQuake

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #59 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 22:41:43 »
I can't tell which book you are referring to... There was the "Thrawn trilogy", starting with "Heir to the Empire".

I hesitate to use any of the older stuff when trying to see what Disney is trying to build, since they essentially banished it all to the mysterious Legends realm. Timothy Zahn wrote a new Thrawn novel that was released very recently:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Thrawn_(novel)

I listened to the Audible narration on a couple of long trips, highly recommend the Audible version. Anyways, this is what I was referencing since Disney canon.

Offline romevi

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #60 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 23:31:10 »
I can't tell which book you are referring to... There was the "Thrawn trilogy", starting with "Heir to the Empire".

I hesitate to use any of the older stuff when trying to see what Disney is trying to build, since they essentially banished it all to the mysterious Legends realm. Timothy Zahn wrote a new Thrawn novel that was released very recently:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Thrawn_(novel)

I listened to the Audible narration on a couple of long trips, highly recommend the Audible version. Anyways, this is what I was referencing since Disney canon.

Adding it to my Audible Wish List. These days I don't have time to read as much but found that audiobooks are the next best thing while having one played in the background at work.

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #61 on: Fri, 05 January 2018, 23:31:44 »
I hesitate to use any of the older stuff when trying to see what Disney is trying to build, since they essentially banished it all to the mysterious Legends realm. Timothy Zahn wrote a new Thrawn novel that was released very recently:
Ah, OK. That went under my radar because I don't care much about the new canon.
Anyway, Sifa-Dyas was mentioned in AOTC, so that character is still canon even if not all stories about it is.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #62 on: Sat, 06 January 2018, 08:21:10 »

So not sure where "two masters/lords and each can only have one apprentice" comes from.
grr I always want to write Sith as Syth.

Wookiepedia has more on the Rule of Two.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Rule_of_Two

What I missed was that the Rule of Two ended with the death of Darth Sidious, so yes, Snoke could have had Rey and Ren as apprentices.

That seems a ... strange conclusion to draw from that.  What you missed was that there would be two masters and two apprentices.  One is the key.

As far as that last part, wookiepedia is edited by fans, so sometimes their conclusions are specious at best.  Snoke was not a Sith.

From JJ Abrams:
Quote
"Kylo Ren is not a Sith. He works under Supreme Leader Snoke, who is a powerful figure on the Dark Side of the Force."

Therefore the Sith have not been seen in either movie.  And to say the Rule of Two ended when Darth Sidious died seems disingenuous at best.  If there were two, and two died, of course it wouldn't be in play.  That's not to say that it ended.  That's to say that the Sith ended.  At least as far as we know.  Sort of like the Sith in TPM was a return of the Sith by the words of the Jedi council.  Which is one of the downfalls of the Rule of Two.  You have to violate it for continuity of the Sith.  If Sidious did not violate it... the Sith are done as both died.
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Offline fohat.digs

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #63 on: Sat, 06 January 2018, 16:33:56 »
Just saw the movie with my son. The visuals were excellent and it was enjoyable to watch, but the story and presentation were desparately lame.

The plot was excruciatingly formulaic - the only time I was surprised and pleased was at the sight of a ship pointing straight at a battle cruiser at short range and warping through it. Almost everything else seemed like an extremely stale retread of a scene from one of the other movies, and, in particular, the entire gambling casino gambit was utterly gratuitous.

Rey has always been a good character, and Ren started to become mildly interesting, but the others were just pasteboard throwaways.

I found more to like in the Phantom Menace than I did here.

 
The Article II clause gave readers some guidance by giving two specific examples of impeachable misconduct: “Treason” and “Bribery”. Both were “high” offenses indeed.
”Treason” – defined elsewhere in the Constitution – meant waging war against America or betraying her to an enemy power. “Bribery” – secretly bending laws to favor the rich and powerful – involved official misconduct of a highly malignant sort, threatening the very soul of a democratic republic committed to equality under law. In the case of a president who did not take bribes but gave them – in effect paying men to vote for him – the bribery would undermine the very legitimacy of the election that brought him to office.
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi ***SPOILERS WELCOME***
« Reply #64 on: Sat, 06 January 2018, 20:34:19 »
If there were two, and two died, of course it wouldn't be in play.  That's not to say that it ended.  That's to say that the Sith ended.  At least as far as we know. 
Personally, I have never liked the idea of it, it's such a flawed idea to begin with.
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