Alps Appreciation Thread

[Blaise170]

I was thinking about buying an AEK the other day I'd found for $30... $500? Wtf?

[CPTBadAss]

LOL $510? I don't even pay $40 for one hahaha

[njbair]

LOL $510? I don't even pay $40 for one hahaha

I think I bought two for $40 in a GB on here a while back? No more than $50 IIRC.

Can someone contact the buyer and let them know I have a red OG Cherry ESC key I'd like to sell them...

[Moistgun]

LOL $510? I don't even pay $40 for one hahaha

I think I bought two for $40 in a GB on here a while back? No more than $50 IIRC.

Can someone contact the buyer and let them know I have a red OG Cherry ESC key I'd like to sell them...

You might need to open an offshore account

[bocahgundul]

I like orange alps but I hate blue alps am I normal?  )

[chyros]

I like orange alps but I hate blue alps am I normal?  )

No .

But maybe you like lighter switches .

[bocahgundul]

I like orange alps but I hate blue alps am I normal?  )

No .

But maybe you like lighter switches .

Can you tell me what a good converter for this chicony 5161?
it have xt/at cable

I don't know man but the more I type on it it feels better 

[chyros]

I like orange alps but I hate blue alps am I normal?  )

No .

But maybe you like lighter switches .

Can you tell me what a good converter for this chicony 5161?
it have xt/at cable

I don't know man but the more I type on it it feels better 

If you have a PS/2 port a cheap, simple AT-to-PS/2 adapter should work fine, if not you might want to invest in a proper converter, especially if you plan on getting more old boards. Orihalcon's are not cheap, but they're very good.

[CPTBadAss]

That's my setup, just like chyros said. AT -> PS2 adapter. Then PS2 -> USB adapter.

[fohat.digs]

you might want to invest in a proper converter, especially if you plan on getting more old boards.

Or get seriously serious and build yourself one of these:

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=58941.msg1348717#msg1348717

(and while you are in there, hook up the 5th wire from the AT socket to PD7 on the Teensy for the "reset" connection for DC-2014s and the like)

[njbair]

you might want to invest in a proper converter, especially if you plan on getting more old boards.

Or get seriously serious and build yourself one of these:

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=58941.msg1348717#msg1348717

(and while you are in there, hook up the 5th wire from the AT socket to PD7 on the Teensy for the "reset" connection for DC-2014s and the like)

This is still on my to-do list. One day...

[E3E]

I like orange alps but I hate blue alps am I normal?  )

Give your self some time, man! They are the kinds of switches that grow on ya!

If you have a PS/2 port a cheap, simple AT-to-PS/2 adapter should work fine, if not you might want to invest in a proper converter, especially if you plan on getting more old boards. Orihalcon's are not cheap, but they're very good.

Orihalcon's are amazing. I bought one for the expressed purpose of using NKRO with the DC-3014.

I'm not sure if all the steps in the conversion process or what create some sort of delay or if it's just in the polling rate of these vintage keyboards, but none of my vintage keyboards seem as snappily responsive as my modern keyboards. Press a key and there's a tiny fraction of a second delay (noticeable in rhythm games).On my Hammer Alps board for instance, it's more perceivable as instantaneous. :B

I do go straight to USB as I use a DTR laptop so I have no PS/2.

[jbondeson]

I spent a bunch of time this weekend making a number of different franken-alps switches by mixing in parts from newer matias switches (right now only quiet clicks, but I'm tempted to get some clicky switches and mess with those too).

Using the terminology that Platy originated I'm calling the process of mixing in matias qc components as "smoking" (due to the gray color of the slider).

I used Orange, Salmon and Damped Cream switches in two different configurations:

• Partial Smoke - Replace the tactile leaf with a quiet click tactile leaf.
• Full Smoke - Replace the tactile leaf and spring with the quiet click tactile leaf and spring

Additionally I make what I'll refer to as the "complicated quiet click" which swaps the entire guts of a quiet click into a damped cream saving only the complicated switchplate.

Overall I was actually really impressed with the results, with my three favorites being: Partially Smoked Orange, Fully Smoked Salmon, and the Complicated Quiet Click. 

Partially Smoked Orange - The slightly lighter spring along with the older model switchplate in the oranges made for a very nice compliment to the newer and crisper tactile leaf from the quiet click.

Fully Smoked Salmon - This was a super crisp and slightly aggressive switch. The combination of later model complicated switchplate, the quiet click's tactile leaf and the undamped slider makes for a super crisp and crunchy feel. I think in the long term it would actually be easier (and cheaper) to use SKCM Whites as the donor. I'll have to look into it.

Complicated Quiet Click - This and the fully smoked cream were pretty similar, but I prefer the dampeners on the quiet clicks (could be age related). The end result is a slightly less wobbly (the switchplate on a qc has only one touch point on the slider) and more consistent feeling quiet click.

I'm going to build my first Alps Party board with Complicated Quiet Clicks and see how I like it vs. my v60 with quiet clicks.

Action pic!

[CPTBadAss]

Oooo, I like where this is going jbondeson

[mseaworthy]

Very cool hybridization. Charles Darwin would be proud.

[E3E]

I spent a bunch of time this weekend making a number of different franken-alps switches by mixing in parts from newer matias switches (right now only quiet clicks, but I'm tempted to get some clicky switches and mess with those too).

Using the terminology that Platy originated I'm calling the process of mixing in matias qc components as "smoking" (due to the gray color of the slider).

I used Orange, Salmon and Damped Cream switches in two different configurations:

• Partial Smoke - Replace the tactile leaf with a quiet click tactile leaf.
• Full Smoke - Replace the tactile leaf and spring with the quiet click tactile leaf and spring

Additionally I make what I'll refer to as the "complicated quiet click" which swaps the entire guts of a quiet click into a damped cream saving only the complicated switchplate.

Overall I was actually really impressed with the results, with my three favorites being: Partially Smoked Orange, Fully Smoked Salmon, and the Complicated Quiet Click. 

Partially Smoked Orange - The slightly lighter spring along with the older model switchplate in the oranges made for a very nice compliment to the newer and crisper tactile leaf from the quiet click.

Fully Smoked Salmon - This was a super crisp and slightly aggressive switch. The combination of later model complicated switchplate, the quiet click's tactile leaf and the undamped slider makes for a super crisp and crunchy feel. I think in the long term it would actually be easier (and cheaper) to use SKCM Whites as the donor. I'll have to look into it.

Complicated Quiet Click - This and the fully smoked cream were pretty similar, but I prefer the dampeners on the quiet clicks (could be age related). The end result is a slightly less wobbly (the switchplate on a qc has only one touch point on the slider) and more consistent feeling quiet click.

I'm going to build my first Alps Party board with Complicated Quiet Clicks and see how I like it vs. my v60 with quiet clicks.

Action pic!

Show Image

I love your experimentation here. I hate disassembling Alps because I insist on using toothpicks because I do not want to mar the housings, and I don't have any of the larger cocktail sticks that Chyros recommends. I should consider whittling down some chopsticks or something.

Fully smoked salmon sounds both delicious and pretty awesome as do the complicated quiet clicks.

[chyros]

I hate disassembling Alps because I insist on using toothpicks because I do not want to mar the housings, and I don't have any of the larger cocktail sticks that Chyros recommends.

Flatten the ends of some cocktail sticks and you don't need to use the toothpicks (and you don't bend them out as far as you do with normal cocktail sticks - don't worry too much about that though, Alps can definitely take it ). You can just stick them in and pull them out quickly again, takes the top housing with it. You can open switches in half a second like that.

[jbondeson]

I love your experimentation here. I hate disassembling Alps because I insist on using toothpicks because I do not want to mar the housings, and I don't have any of the larger cocktail sticks that Chyros recommends. I should consider whittling down some chopsticks or something.

Fully smoked salmon sounds both delicious and pretty awesome as do the complicated quiet clicks.

I open them all up by hand with my fingernails. After a few hundred it does hurt a little

[njbair]

Awesome mods, jbondeson. Thanks for sharing the info. I agree it would be cheaper to use whites instead of salmon, but "smoked whites" doesn't sound as cool.

For switch opening, it would be cool to have some kind of flat pliers that could simultaneously wedge open the clips and grip on the upper housing to aid in removal. Maybe something made out of a flat piece of spring steel.

[Moistgun]

I love your experimentation here. I hate disassembling Alps because I insist on using toothpicks because I do not want to mar the housings, and I don't have any of the larger cocktail sticks that Chyros recommends. I should consider whittling down some chopsticks or something.

Fully smoked salmon sounds both delicious and pretty awesome as do the complicated quiet clicks.

I open them all up by hand with my fingernails. After a few hundred it does hurt a little

Just use tweezers lol

[E3E]

Awesome mods, jbondeson. Thanks for sharing the info. I agree it would be cheaper to use whites instead of salmon, but "smoked whites" doesn't sound as cool.

For switch opening, it would be cool to have some kind of flat pliers that could simultaneously wedge open the clips and grip on the upper housing to aid in removal. Maybe something made out of a flat piece of spring steel.

Toasted marshmallows!

I hate disassembling Alps because I insist on using toothpicks because I do not want to mar the housings, and I don't have any of the larger cocktail sticks that Chyros recommends.

Flatten the ends of some cocktail sticks and you don't need to use the toothpicks (and you don't bend them out as far as you do with normal cocktail sticks - don't worry too much about that though, Alps can definitely take it ). You can just stick them in and pull them out quickly again, takes the top housing with it. You can open switches in half a second like that.

Yes, I recall seeing this mentioned in another thread, haha. Yeah, I'll have to find an equivalent in using shaved down chopsticks or just go find some cocktail sticks. I've got quite a few chopsticks.

[frogthejam19]

I want a blue alps board that I can harvest for the switches.

[CPTBadAss]

I want a blue alps board that I can harvest for the switches.

Me too

[Moistgun]

I want an alps plate, but cant post to the classifieds, lol.
Mechmarket is a little dry for alps plates.

[jbondeson]

One interesting note (which i would show if I actually had a macro lens ) is that you cannot put a leaf from a complicated switch into a matias housing as the legs are ever so slightly longer on a complicated leaf.

Additionally, the matias switches has a nasty (and very thick) grease applied unevenly through the switches. So if you're going to do any of these frankenalps I'd suggest a very thorough cleaning of both switches and re-lubricating with a more alps-friendly lubricant.

[E3E]

I want a blue alps board that I can harvest for the switches.

Me too

You MONSTERS!

 

[chyros]

I want a blue alps board that I can harvest for the switches.

Me too

You MONSTERS!

 

What have these poor boards ever done to these people? D:

[fohat.digs]

What have these poor boards ever done to these people?

They have frustrated us by attempting to force us to use impossibly annoying layouts while monopolizing precious switches.

[CPTBadAss]

I just want to be in the position of having more Blue SKCM Alps to decide whether or not I cannibalize them

[fohat.digs]

decide whether or not I cannibalize them

I am starting to wonder whether click-modded orange might be as good or better, based on numerous comments.

After taking them apart, where they could be thoroughly examined for top specimens, then cleaned and lubed, I could easily see them being superior to raw blues in a questionable state.

[E3E]

decide whether or not I cannibalize them

I am starting to wonder whether click-modded orange might be as good or better, based on numerous comments.

After taking them apart, where they could be thoroughly examined for top specimens, then cleaned and lubed, I could easily see them being superior to raw blues in a questionable state.

Subjectivity is something that should be taken into consideration. Better is just a matter of perception. This is how hype trains get started.

Also take into account that the likelyhood for people to think positively of click modded oranges is high considering the high prices and scarcity of blues compared to orange Alps.

So it's easy to be biased and say "yep, these are much better! Screw trying to find blue Alps!'

That said, orange alps are quite good.

[njbair]

I love orange Alps. I click modded a couple loose ones during my lunch hour today and, at least loose, they feel pretty similar to blues. It's not really a loud click, just enough to reinforce the tactile bump. I'm convinced enough that I'm probably going to build my Alps Party ANSI board with click-modded oranges.

[nubbinator]

I love orange Alps. I click modded a couple loose ones during my lunch hour today and, at least loose, they feel pretty similar to blues. It's not really a loud click, just enough to reinforce the tactile bump. I'm convinced enough that I'm probably going to build my Alps Party ANSI board with click-modded oranges.

Completely agree.  Blue Alps make a harsher click while click modded Orange Alps have a noticeable but less severe click.  They're almost like a smoother, more tactile, and more consistent MX white.

I've not been impressed with White Alps.  Then again, I don't like clicky switches.

[bocahgundul]

Yep I'm gonna harvest this board and make another board

[jacobolus]

One interesting note (which i would show if I actually had a macro lens ) is that you cannot put a leaf from a complicated switch into a matias housing as the legs are ever so slightly longer on a complicated leaf.

Why would you want to do that? The click/tactile leaves on Matias switches are great. The piece of complicated Alps switches which is unquestionably better than Matias switches is the switchplate, which is much expensive to produce but much more reliable electrically.

[Note, you can swap Matias click/tactile leaves into old Alps switches if you want.]

[jbondeson]

One interesting note (which i would show if I actually had a macro lens ) is that you cannot put a leaf from a complicated switch into a matias housing as the legs are ever so slightly longer on a complicated leaf.

Why would you want to do that? The click/tactile leaves on Matias switches are great.

There was no desire on my part other than at the time having a safe place to have the complicated alp leaf. I just thought it was an interesting difference that I wasn't suspecting.

The piece of complicated Alps switches which is unquestionably better than Matias switches is the switch plate, which is much expensive to produce but much more reliable electrically.

[Note, you can swap Matias click/tactile leaves into old Alps switches if you want.]

Scroll up a few more to my post before that one

[Blaise170]

I'm thoroughly convinced that Blues use some kind of black magic. Swapping the blue slider into a Matias Click feels the same as the original slider, but swapping the Matias into Blue housing does not feel the same. Yet the sliders look identical.

[E3E]

I'm thoroughly convinced that Blues use some kind of black magic. Swapping the blue slider into a Matias Click feels the same as the original slider, but swapping the Matias into Blue housing does not feel the same. Yet the sliders look identical.

Yeah, pretty much confirmed that blue Alps are the work of voodoo priests working at Alps in the mid 80s.

Just don't make em like that anymore!

-

On that note, see if orange or any other Alps-made sliders retain the feel of blue Alps if swapped in. If so, then it's likely just the plastic being different between Matias and Alps, with Alps likely just being higher quality.

[chyros]

I'm thoroughly convinced that Blues use some kind of black magic. Swapping the blue slider into a Matias Click feels the same as the original slider, but swapping the Matias into Blue housing does not feel the same. Yet the sliders look identical.

Yeah, pretty much confirmed that blue Alps are the work of voodoo priests working at Alps in the mid 80s.

Just don't make em like that anymore!

-

On that note, see if orange or any other Alps-made sliders retain the feel of blue Alps if swapped in. If so, then it's likely just the plastic being different between Matias and Alps, with Alps likely just being higher quality.

First-generation Alps switches like Blues and Oranges appear to use a different plastic from all others afterwards. Originally they came lubed but of course that's quite expensive so it appears they moved to a different, low-friction plastic (POM?) for the second generation. As such, it would make sense that clicky Oranges feel much like Blues (except a little lighter) .

[jacobolus]

All the Alps sliders seem like POM to me, though I’m not an expert on plastics. I don’t think there’s any substantial difference in the material or slider quality between blue/salmon/white/orange/brown/green/yellow/etc. sliders. There are subtly different slider shapes between different switch types though.

[chyros]

All the Alps sliders seem like POM to me, though I’m not an expert on plastics. I don’t think there’s any substantial difference in the material or slider quality between blue/salmon/white/orange/brown/green/yellow/etc. sliders. There are subtly different slider shapes between different switch types though.

That could be the case too, in that case they simply didn't bother lubing anymore at some point xD . Wish I had a TGA/DSC xD .

[E3E]

All the Alps sliders seem like POM to me, though I’m not an expert on plastics. I don’t think there’s any substantial difference in the material or slider quality between blue/salmon/white/orange/brown/green/yellow/etc. sliders. There are subtly different slider shapes between different switch types though.

That could be the case too, in that case they simply didn't bother lubing anymore at some point xD . Wish I had a TGA/DSC xD .

Yeah, that dry film lube surely is interesting! My measurements for orange Alps were pretty much around 60g of force for actuation, where blues needed 65g. I've always thought of oranges as blues without the click, which makes them a bit more boring in my eyes. Click-modded ones would be fun for sure. :3

[bocahgundul]

I'm thoroughly convinced that Blues use some kind of black magic. Swapping the blue slider into a Matias Click feels the same as the original slider, but swapping the Matias into Blue housing does not feel the same. Yet the sliders look identical.

Do they use some watermelon and kfc to it? 

[Eugene45]

Do we use dry lube ? Or have someone a special mix ?

[fohat.digs]

Do we use dry lube ? Or have someone a special mix ?

I would like to hear the answer to this, also. I think that I may have to crack open and click mod my baggie of oranges for my next Alps project.

[njbair]

Do we use dry lube ? Or have someone a special mix ?

I would like to hear the answer to this, also. I think that I may have to crack open and click mod my baggie of oranges for my next Alps project.

Well I can tell you first hand that the standard Krytox wet lube we're all used to for MX switches, does not feel very nice on click-modded oranges. It just makes it feel muffled. So it's gonna have to be some kind of dry lube, I just don't know enough about that stuff to weigh in.

[CPTBadAss]

I'm thoroughly convinced that Blues use some kind of black magic. Swapping the blue slider into a Matias Click feels the same as the original slider, but swapping the Matias into Blue housing does not feel the same. Yet the sliders look identical.

Yeah, pretty much confirmed that blue Alps are the work of voodoo priests working at Alps in the mid 80s.

Just don't make em like that anymore!

Definitely magic. And my fingers are happy for said voodoo. I lub SKCM Blues 

[E3E]

Do we use dry lube ? Or have someone a special mix ?

Molybdenum disulfide powder is pretty good. I think a dry-film lube would work well too.

I agree with the notion that Alps switches do not need lubing unless they are scratchy to begin with. Don't fix it if it ain't broken.

That ol' Molly "B" Denim, though. 

[frogthejam19]

seems like everyone is now hoarding their blue alps boards.

[Blaise170]

seems like everyone is now hoarding their blue alps boards.

People have always hoarded them, but now that they are ultra-hyped you have people buying them at ridiculous prices.